RE: Structured FM Roundtripping
Marsha, I have done some testing (using FM 7.2, but table handling did not change from 7.1 to 7.2) with several variations of the model you describe. As I suspected, the problem seems to involve use of the element names from the CALS table model. In particular, the CALS table model is a five level hierarchy. A CALS table consists of: 1. The Table element 2. One or more Tgroup elements, each of which is a block of adjacent rows. Successive Tgroups may have different numbers of columns and columns of different widths. Even within one Tgroup, however, a particular entry can span or straddle multiple rows or columns. 3. THead, TBody, TFoot elements within each Tgroup 4. Rows within each THead, TBody, TFoot 5. Entries within the rows In contrast, the FrameMaker table model has four levels: 1. The table 2. Heading, body, and footing parts 3. Rows within the heading, body, and footing 4. Cells within the rows In both models, any table title (or caption)is a child of the root table element. FrameMaker supports two ways of mapping between this two models, and it uses the names "table" and "tgroup" to determine when the mapping is needed. One variation is to preserve all five levels of the CALS model. Here the outermost level, the element named Table is a FrameMaker container, any title is a container that is a child of that element, and each Tgroup is a FrameMaker table without a title. The advantage of this approach is that it keeps the CALS model; the primary disadvantage is that the table title is a container rather than a table title and hence does not repeat on every page of a multipage table. A second disadvantage is that in most applications tables never have more than one Tgroup and hence users may wonder why the extra element is needed. The second variation of the CALS table model assumes there is always exactly one Tgroup per Table. In this case the Tgroup element exists only in XML, the Table element is a FrameMaker table and any title is a FrameMaker table title. Your application seems to be using the five-level model in FrameMaker, but using a FrameMaker table title. Without a custom plug-in, FrameMaker cannot move the table title from the Tgroup to the containing Table as called for in CALS, so it drops it. Even if your DTD defines the TCaption element as a child of the TGroup, FrameMaker tries to force your data to the CALS model. Various simple modifications allow you to export your data. For example, you can change the name of Tgroup to something else (I used TgroupX). By the way, recognition of the name "tgroup" is case-insensitive. You can get rid of the wrapper Table element. You can move the caption to a container preceding the Tgroup. --Lynne At 10:31 AM 12/12/2006, Lofthouse Marsha-PT1816 wrote: Hi Lynne, I have tried both of these in the r/w rules to no avail: element "TCaption" is fm table title element; and element "TCaption" is fm table title element "TCaption"; I also have r/w rules for table copied from Appendix B of the Structure Application Developer's Guide: element "table" { is fm element; attributes blah blah blah } element "tgroup" { is fm table element; attributes blah blah blah } Yes, the TCaption element is declared in the DTD and defined in the EDD as (Table Title). How does the CALS model deal with table captions? I haven't found that in the Structure Application Developer's Guide, but I'll keep looking, both there and on the net. Lynne A. Price Text Structure Consulting, Inc. Specializing in structured FrameMaker consulting, application development, and training [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.txstruct.com voice/fax: (510) 583-1505 cell phone: (510) 421-2284 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Structured FM Roundtripping
Marsha, I have done some testing (using FM 7.2, but table handling did not change from 7.1 to 7.2) with several variations of the model you describe. As I suspected, the problem seems to involve use of the element names from the CALS table model. In particular, the CALS table model is a five level hierarchy. A CALS table consists of: 1. The Table element 2. One or more Tgroup elements, each of which is a block of adjacent rows. Successive Tgroups may have different numbers of columns and columns of different widths. Even within one Tgroup, however, a particular entry can span or straddle multiple rows or columns. 3. THead, TBody, TFoot elements within each Tgroup 4. Rows within each THead, TBody, TFoot 5. Entries within the rows In contrast, the FrameMaker table model has four levels: 1. The table 2. Heading, body, and footing parts 3. Rows within the heading, body, and footing 4. Cells within the rows In both models, any table title (or caption)is a child of the root table element. FrameMaker supports two ways of mapping between this two models, and it uses the names "table" and "tgroup" to determine when the mapping is needed. One variation is to preserve all five levels of the CALS model. Here the outermost level, the element named Table is a FrameMaker container, any title is a container that is a child of that element, and each Tgroup is a FrameMaker table without a title. The advantage of this approach is that it keeps the CALS model; the primary disadvantage is that the table title is a container rather than a table title and hence does not repeat on every page of a multipage table. A second disadvantage is that in most applications tables never have more than one Tgroup and hence users may wonder why the extra element is needed. The second variation of the CALS table model assumes there is always exactly one Tgroup per Table. In this case the Tgroup element exists only in XML, the Table element is a FrameMaker table and any title is a FrameMaker table title. Your application seems to be using the five-level model in FrameMaker, but using a FrameMaker table title. Without a custom plug-in, FrameMaker cannot move the table title from the Tgroup to the containing Table as called for in CALS, so it drops it. Even if your DTD defines the TCaption element as a child of the TGroup, FrameMaker tries to force your data to the CALS model. Various simple modifications allow you to export your data. For example, you can change the name of Tgroup to something else (I used TgroupX). By the way, recognition of the name "tgroup" is case-insensitive. You can get rid of the wrapper Table element. You can move the caption to a container preceding the Tgroup. --Lynne At 10:31 AM 12/12/2006, Lofthouse Marsha-PT1816 wrote: >Hi Lynne, > >I have tried both of these in the r/w rules to no avail: >element "TCaption" is fm table title element; >and >element "TCaption" is fm table title element "TCaption"; > >I also have r/w rules for table copied from Appendix B of the Structure >Application Developer's Guide: >element "table" >{ > is fm element; > attributes blah blah blah >} > >element "tgroup" >{ > is fm table element; > attributes blah blah blah >} > >Yes, the TCaption element is declared in the DTD and defined in the EDD >as (Table Title). > >How does the CALS model deal with table captions? I haven't found that >in the Structure Application Developer's Guide, but I'll keep looking, >both there and on the net. Lynne A. Price Text Structure Consulting, Inc. Specializing in structured FrameMaker consulting, application development, and training lprice at txstruct.comhttp://www.txstruct.com voice/fax: (510) 583-1505 cell phone: (510) 421-2284
Re: Structured FM Roundtripping
Marsha, Do you have a r/w write rule that maps the tgroup element to a table? Is the TCaption element declared in your DTD and defined in the EDD to a FrameMaker table title? FM does treat an element named "tgroup" specially; it tries to interpret it in light of the CALS table model, and your definition is not quite the standard one. --Lynne At 05:45 PM 12/11/2006, Lofthouse Marsha-PT1816 wrote: I can now open them in FrameMaker with no errors and the structure is exactly as I defined it. However, when I save the XML file, my TCaption element disappears. Definitions: The TCaption element (and it's contents) is there when I open the file. There are no errors showing in the Structure View. When I save the XML file from FrameMaker, I get an error indicating an ID attribute was referenced but never declared. That is because the ID attribute in question is declared in TCaption. I've been staring at this way too long today. If you need more information, let me know. Thanks in advance for any clues you might be able to give me. Marsha Lofthouse Motorola, Inc., Public Safety Applications North America Government & Commercial Markets Division Boulder Design Center [EMAIL PROTECTED] 303.527.4178 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/lprice%40txstruct.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. Lynne A. Price Text Structure Consulting, Inc. Specializing in structured FrameMaker consulting, application development, and training [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.txstruct.com voice/fax: (510) 583-1505 cell phone: (510) 421-2284 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Structured FM Roundtripping
Marsha, Do you have a r/w write rule that maps the tgroup element to a table? Is the TCaption element declared in your DTD and defined in the EDD to a FrameMaker table title? FM does treat an element named "tgroup" specially; it tries to interpret it in light of the CALS table model, and your definition is not quite the standard one. --Lynne At 05:45 PM 12/11/2006, Lofthouse Marsha-PT1816 wrote: >I can now open them in FrameMaker with no errors and the structure is >exactly as I defined it. However, when I save the XML file, my TCaption >element disappears. > >Definitions: > > > > > >The TCaption element (and it's contents) is there when I open the file. >There are no errors showing in the Structure View. > >When I save the XML file from FrameMaker, I get an error indicating an >ID attribute was referenced but never declared. That is because the ID >attribute in question is declared in TCaption. > >I've been staring at this way too long today. > >If you need more information, let me know. > >Thanks in advance for any clues you might be able to give me. > >Marsha Lofthouse >Motorola, Inc., Public Safety Applications >North America Government & Commercial Markets Division >Boulder Design Center >Marsha.Lofthouse at motorola.com >303.527.4178 > >___ > > >You are currently subscribed to Framers as lprice at txstruct.com. > >Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > >To unsubscribe send a blank email to >framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com >or visit >http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/lprice%40txstruct.com > >Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit >http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. Lynne A. Price Text Structure Consulting, Inc. Specializing in structured FrameMaker consulting, application development, and training lprice at txstruct.comhttp://www.txstruct.com voice/fax: (510) 583-1505 cell phone: (510) 421-2284
Structured FM Roundtripping
I'm working on converting some files that were created with DTD "A" to DTD "B". I have **almost** everything working. The XML files were not originally created with FrameMaker. I can now open them in FrameMaker with no errors and the structure is exactly as I defined it. However, when I save the XML file, my TCaption element disappears. Definitions: The TCaption element (and it's contents) is there when I open the file. There are no errors showing in the Structure View. When I save the XML file from FrameMaker, I get an error indicating an ID attribute was referenced but never declared. That is because the ID attribute in question is declared in TCaption. I've been staring at this way too long today. If you need more information, let me know. Thanks in advance for any clues you might be able to give me. Marsha Lofthouse Motorola, Inc., Public Safety Applications North America Government & Commercial Markets Division Boulder Design Center Marsha.Lofthouse at motorola.com 303.527.4178
Structured FM Roundtripping
I'm working on converting some files that were created with DTD "A" to DTD "B". I have **almost** everything working. The XML files were not originally created with FrameMaker. I can now open them in FrameMaker with no errors and the structure is exactly as I defined it. However, when I save the XML file, my TCaption element disappears. Definitions: The TCaption element (and it's contents) is there when I open the file. There are no errors showing in the Structure View. When I save the XML file from FrameMaker, I get an error indicating an ID attribute was referenced but never declared. That is because the ID attribute in question is declared in TCaption. I've been staring at this way too long today. If you need more information, let me know. Thanks in advance for any clues you might be able to give me. Marsha Lofthouse Motorola, Inc., Public Safety Applications North America Government & Commercial Markets Division Boulder Design Center [EMAIL PROTECTED] 303.527.4178 ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send list messages to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.