Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-18 Thread Gabe
> --- On Sat, 2/14/09, Gabe  wrote:
> 
> > From: Gabe 
> > Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> > To: "Matthew Seaman"
> 
> > Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > Date: Saturday, February 14, 2009, 8:41 PM
> > --- On Sat, 2/14/09, Matthew Seaman
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > > From: Matthew Seaman
> > 
> > > Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> > > To: n...@att.net
> > > Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > > Date: Saturday, February 14, 2009, 8:30 AM
> > > Gabe wrote:
> > > > --- On Mon, 2/9/09, Matthew Seaman
> > >  wrote:
> > > > 
> > > >> From: Matthew Seaman
> > > 
> > > >> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID
> > controllers
> > > >> To: n...@att.net
> > > >> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > > >> Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 3:08 PM
> > > >> Gabe wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>> Now with a gstripe+gmirror setup,
> would
> > it be
> > > possible
> > > >> to fail a
> > > >>> specific drive on purpose? I mean
> fail a
> > > (good) drive,
> > > >> pull it out,
> > > >>> replace it and rebuild(?) it. I know
> I
> > know,
> > > but humor
> > > >> me.
> > > >>
> > > >> Yes.
> > > >>
> > > >>Cheers,
> > > >>
> > > >>Matthew
> > > >>
> > > >> Well, to 'fail' the drive,
> you'ld
> > have
> > > to
> > > >> physically pull the drive
> > > >> from the chassis which will involve a
> power
> > cycle
> > > unless
> > > >> you've got
> > > >> hot-swap drives.  Of course, you should
> > confirm
> > > that your
> > > >> system will
> > > >> boot with the RAID in a degraded state
> and
> > that
> > > rebuilding
> > > >> the RAID will
> > > >> continue even if interrupted by a
> reboot. 
> > > gmirror(8)
> > > >> passes those
> > > >> tests.  You do have to type some
> commands to
> > get a
> > > mirror
> > > >> to rebuild
> > > >> (examples are shown in the man page)
> unlike
> > some
> > > hardware
> > > >> RAIDs where
> > > >> simply inserting an unused disk is
> > sufficient.
> > > >>
> > > >> -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.  
> 
> > 
> > >   7
> > > >> Priory Courtyard
> > > >> 
> 
> >   
> > > Flat 3
> > > >> PGP:
> http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey
> >
> > > Ramsgate
> > > >> 
> 
> >   
> > > Kent, CT11
> > > >> 9PW
> > > > 
> > > > Hello again all,
> > > > 
> > > > So I wanted to test out gmirror on software
> RAID
> > so I
> > > installed a completely vanilla FBSD 7, as base an
> > install as
> > > you can get, it hasn't even been on the
> network.
> > Anyway,
> > > I did the following upon first boot to get
> gmirror
> > going:
> > > > 
> > > > # sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=17
> > > > 
> > > > Then:
> > > > # gmirror label -vb round-robin gm0 /dev/ad0
> > > > 
> > > > Then:
> > > > # gmirror load
> > > > 
> > > > Then:
> > > > # echo
> 'geom_mirror_load="YES"'
> > > >> /boot/loader.conf
> > > > 
> > > > Then I edited /etc/fstab to show:
> > > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1bnoneswapsw
> 
> > 
> > >0   0
> > > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1a/   ufs rw
> 
> > 
> > >1   1
> > > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1e/tmpufs rw
>  0  
> > 0
> > > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1f/usrufs rw
>  2  
> > 2
> > > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1d/varufs rw
> 
> > 
> > >2   2
> > > > 
> > > > I then rebooted the system, once I setup the
> > mirror:
> > > > 
> &g

Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-15 Thread Gabe
--- On Sat, 2/14/09, Gabe  wrote:

> From: Gabe 
> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> To: "Matthew Seaman" 
> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Date: Saturday, February 14, 2009, 8:41 PM
> --- On Sat, 2/14/09, Matthew Seaman
>  wrote:
> 
> > From: Matthew Seaman
> 
> > Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> > To: n...@att.net
> > Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > Date: Saturday, February 14, 2009, 8:30 AM
> > Gabe wrote:
> > > --- On Mon, 2/9/09, Matthew Seaman
> >  wrote:
> > > 
> > >> From: Matthew Seaman
> > 
> > >> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID
> controllers
> > >> To: n...@att.net
> > >> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > >> Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 3:08 PM
> > >> Gabe wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Now with a gstripe+gmirror setup, would
> it be
> > possible
> > >> to fail a
> > >>> specific drive on purpose? I mean fail a
> > (good) drive,
> > >> pull it out,
> > >>> replace it and rebuild(?) it. I know I
> know,
> > but humor
> > >> me.
> > >>
> > >> Yes.
> > >>
> > >>  Cheers,
> > >>
> > >>  Matthew
> > >>
> > >> Well, to 'fail' the drive, you'ld
> have
> > to
> > >> physically pull the drive
> > >> from the chassis which will involve a power
> cycle
> > unless
> > >> you've got
> > >> hot-swap drives.  Of course, you should
> confirm
> > that your
> > >> system will
> > >> boot with the RAID in a degraded state and
> that
> > rebuilding
> > >> the RAID will
> > >> continue even if interrupted by a reboot. 
> > gmirror(8)
> > >> passes those
> > >> tests.  You do have to type some commands to
> get a
> > mirror
> > >> to rebuild
> > >> (examples are shown in the man page) unlike
> some
> > hardware
> > >> RAIDs where
> > >> simply inserting an unused disk is
> sufficient.
> > >>
> > >> -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   
> 
> >   7
> > >> Priory Courtyard
> > >>  
>   
> > Flat 3
> > >> PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey
>
> > Ramsgate
> > >>  
>   
> > Kent, CT11
> > >> 9PW
> > > 
> > > Hello again all,
> > > 
> > > So I wanted to test out gmirror on software RAID
> so I
> > installed a completely vanilla FBSD 7, as base an
> install as
> > you can get, it hasn't even been on the network.
> Anyway,
> > I did the following upon first boot to get gmirror
> going:
> > > 
> > > # sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=17
> > > 
> > > Then:
> > > # gmirror label -vb round-robin gm0 /dev/ad0
> > > 
> > > Then:
> > > # gmirror load
> > > 
> > > Then:
> > > # echo 'geom_mirror_load="YES"'
> > >> /boot/loader.conf
> > > 
> > > Then I edited /etc/fstab to show:
> > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1bnoneswapsw 
> 
> >0   0
> > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1a/   ufs rw 
> 
> >1   1
> > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1e/tmpufs rw  0  
> 0
> > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1f/usrufs rw  2  
> 2
> > > /dev/mirror/gm0s1d/varufs rw 
> 
> >2   2
> > > 
> > > I then rebooted the system, once I setup the
> mirror:
> > > 
> > > # gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1
> > > # gmirror status
> > > 
> > > and it shows as COMPLETE. Okay, here comes the
> > annoying part, I've got hot-swappable bays and I
> went
> > ahead and pulled the drive. I then tried to write to
> the
> > disk so that it realizes the disk is no longer there:
> > > 
> > > # touch file
> > > 
> > > once I do that and execute: gmirror status it
> shows as
> > degraded. All fine and dandy. However when it comes
> time to
> > pop the drive back in the drive is not recognized at
> all. I
> > mean, the green light on the bay comes on so it
> definitely
> > makes a connection but then thats it, atacontrol list
> > doesn't list it an

Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-14 Thread Gabe
--- On Sat, 2/14/09, Matthew Seaman  wrote:

> From: Matthew Seaman 
> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> To: n...@att.net
> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Date: Saturday, February 14, 2009, 8:30 AM
> Gabe wrote:
> > --- On Mon, 2/9/09, Matthew Seaman
>  wrote:
> > 
> >> From: Matthew Seaman
> 
> >> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> >> To: n...@att.net
> >> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> >> Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 3:08 PM
> >> Gabe wrote:
> >>
> >>> Now with a gstripe+gmirror setup, would it be
> possible
> >> to fail a
> >>> specific drive on purpose? I mean fail a
> (good) drive,
> >> pull it out,
> >>> replace it and rebuild(?) it. I know I know,
> but humor
> >> me.
> >>
> >> Yes.
> >>
> >>Cheers,
> >>
> >>Matthew
> >>
> >> Well, to 'fail' the drive, you'ld have
> to
> >> physically pull the drive
> >> from the chassis which will involve a power cycle
> unless
> >> you've got
> >> hot-swap drives.  Of course, you should confirm
> that your
> >> system will
> >> boot with the RAID in a degraded state and that
> rebuilding
> >> the RAID will
> >> continue even if interrupted by a reboot. 
> gmirror(8)
> >> passes those
> >> tests.  You do have to type some commands to get a
> mirror
> >> to rebuild
> >> (examples are shown in the man page) unlike some
> hardware
> >> RAIDs where
> >> simply inserting an unused disk is sufficient.
> >>
> >> -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.
>   7
> >> Priory Courtyard
> >> 
> Flat 3
> >> PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey
> Ramsgate
> >> 
> Kent, CT11
> >> 9PW
> > 
> > Hello again all,
> > 
> > So I wanted to test out gmirror on software RAID so I
> installed a completely vanilla FBSD 7, as base an install as
> you can get, it hasn't even been on the network. Anyway,
> I did the following upon first boot to get gmirror going:
> > 
> > # sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=17
> > 
> > Then:
> > # gmirror label -vb round-robin gm0 /dev/ad0
> > 
> > Then:
> > # gmirror load
> > 
> > Then:
> > # echo 'geom_mirror_load="YES"'
> >> /boot/loader.conf
> > 
> > Then I edited /etc/fstab to show:
> > /dev/mirror/gm0s1bnoneswapsw  
>0   0
> > /dev/mirror/gm0s1a/   ufs rw  
>1   1
> > /dev/mirror/gm0s1e/tmpufs rw  0   0
> > /dev/mirror/gm0s1f/usrufs rw  2   2
> > /dev/mirror/gm0s1d/varufs rw  
>2   2
> > 
> > I then rebooted the system, once I setup the mirror:
> > 
> > # gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1
> > # gmirror status
> > 
> > and it shows as COMPLETE. Okay, here comes the
> annoying part, I've got hot-swappable bays and I went
> ahead and pulled the drive. I then tried to write to the
> disk so that it realizes the disk is no longer there:
> > 
> > # touch file
> > 
> > once I do that and execute: gmirror status it shows as
> degraded. All fine and dandy. However when it comes time to
> pop the drive back in the drive is not recognized at all. I
> mean, the green light on the bay comes on so it definitely
> makes a connection but then thats it, atacontrol list
> doesn't list it and gmirror status still shows the same,
> degraded.
> > 
> > What gives? I wonder if this is hardware related? Bios
> related even? Any clues?
> 
> See atacontrol(8)
> 
># atacontrol list
> 
> shows what your system knows is there
> 
># atacontrol attach X
> 
> where X is the channel number, probes and attaches any
> devices on that
> channel in exactly the same way it is done at system boot.
> 
> See camcontrol(8) if you've got SCSI drives.
> 
>   Cheers,
> 
>   Matthew
> 
> -- 
> Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7 Priory
> Courtyard
>   Flat 3
> PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
>   Kent,
> CT11 9PW

They're SATA drives. The two drives are on the same channel when using 
atacontrol list. I'm unsure that atacontrol attach ata0 would work but I'll 
give it a shot, hopefully that works. I'll report back.

Thanks again
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Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-14 Thread Matthew Seaman

Gabe wrote:

--- On Mon, 2/9/09, Matthew Seaman  wrote:


From: Matthew Seaman 
Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
To: n...@att.net
Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 3:08 PM
Gabe wrote:


Now with a gstripe+gmirror setup, would it be possible

to fail a

specific drive on purpose? I mean fail a (good) drive,

pull it out,

replace it and rebuild(?) it. I know I know, but humor

me.

Yes.

Cheers,

Matthew

Well, to 'fail' the drive, you'ld have to
physically pull the drive
from the chassis which will involve a power cycle unless
you've got
hot-swap drives.  Of course, you should confirm that your
system will
boot with the RAID in a degraded state and that rebuilding
the RAID will
continue even if interrupted by a reboot.  gmirror(8)
passes those
tests.  You do have to type some commands to get a mirror
to rebuild
(examples are shown in the man page) unlike some hardware
RAIDs where
simply inserting an unused disk is sufficient.

-- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7
Priory Courtyard
 Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
 Kent, CT11
9PW


Hello again all,

So I wanted to test out gmirror on software RAID so I installed a completely 
vanilla FBSD 7, as base an install as you can get, it hasn't even been on the 
network. Anyway, I did the following upon first boot to get gmirror going:

# sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=17

Then:
# gmirror label -vb round-robin gm0 /dev/ad0

Then:
# gmirror load

Then:
# echo 'geom_mirror_load="YES"' >> /boot/loader.conf

Then I edited /etc/fstab to show:
/dev/mirror/gm0s1bnoneswapsw  0   0
/dev/mirror/gm0s1a/   ufs rw  1   1
/dev/mirror/gm0s1e/tmpufs rw  0   0
/dev/mirror/gm0s1f/usrufs rw  2   2
/dev/mirror/gm0s1d/varufs rw  2   2

I then rebooted the system, once I setup the mirror:

# gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1
# gmirror status

and it shows as COMPLETE. Okay, here comes the annoying part, I've got 
hot-swappable bays and I went ahead and pulled the drive. I then tried to write 
to the disk so that it realizes the disk is no longer there:

# touch file

once I do that and execute: gmirror status it shows as degraded. All fine and 
dandy. However when it comes time to pop the drive back in the drive is not 
recognized at all. I mean, the green light on the bay comes on so it definitely 
makes a connection but then thats it, atacontrol list doesn't list it and 
gmirror status still shows the same, degraded.

What gives? I wonder if this is hardware related? Bios related even? Any clues?


See atacontrol(8)

  # atacontrol list

shows what your system knows is there

  # atacontrol attach X

where X is the channel number, probes and attaches any devices on that
channel in exactly the same way it is done at system boot.

See camcontrol(8) if you've got SCSI drives.

Cheers,

Matthew

--
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7 Priory Courtyard
 Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
 Kent, CT11 9PW



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Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-14 Thread Gabe
--- On Mon, 2/9/09, Matthew Seaman  wrote:

> From: Matthew Seaman 
> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> To: n...@att.net
> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 3:08 PM
> Gabe wrote:
> 
> > Now with a gstripe+gmirror setup, would it be possible
> to fail a
> > specific drive on purpose? I mean fail a (good) drive,
> pull it out,
> > replace it and rebuild(?) it. I know I know, but humor
> me.
> 
> Yes.
> 
>   Cheers,
> 
>   Matthew
> 
> Well, to 'fail' the drive, you'ld have to
> physically pull the drive
> from the chassis which will involve a power cycle unless
> you've got
> hot-swap drives.  Of course, you should confirm that your
> system will
> boot with the RAID in a degraded state and that rebuilding
> the RAID will
> continue even if interrupted by a reboot.  gmirror(8)
> passes those
> tests.  You do have to type some commands to get a mirror
> to rebuild
> (examples are shown in the man page) unlike some hardware
> RAIDs where
> simply inserting an unused disk is sufficient.
> 
> -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7
> Priory Courtyard
>  Flat 3
> PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
>  Kent, CT11
> 9PW

Hello again all,

So I wanted to test out gmirror on software RAID so I installed a completely 
vanilla FBSD 7, as base an install as you can get, it hasn't even been on the 
network. Anyway, I did the following upon first boot to get gmirror going:

# sysctl kern.geom.debugflags=17

Then:
# gmirror label -vb round-robin gm0 /dev/ad0

Then:
# gmirror load

Then:
# echo 'geom_mirror_load="YES"' >> /boot/loader.conf

Then I edited /etc/fstab to show:
/dev/mirror/gm0s1bnoneswapsw  0   0
/dev/mirror/gm0s1a/   ufs rw  1   1
/dev/mirror/gm0s1e/tmpufs rw  0   0
/dev/mirror/gm0s1f/usrufs rw  2   2
/dev/mirror/gm0s1d/varufs rw  2   2

I then rebooted the system, once I setup the mirror:

# gmirror insert gm0 /dev/ad1
# gmirror status

and it shows as COMPLETE. Okay, here comes the annoying part, I've got 
hot-swappable bays and I went ahead and pulled the drive. I then tried to write 
to the disk so that it realizes the disk is no longer there:

# touch file

once I do that and execute: gmirror status it shows as degraded. All fine and 
dandy. However when it comes time to pop the drive back in the drive is not 
recognized at all. I mean, the green light on the bay comes on so it definitely 
makes a connection but then thats it, atacontrol list doesn't list it and 
gmirror status still shows the same, degraded.

What gives? I wonder if this is hardware related? Bios related even? Any clues?

Thanks!
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Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-09 Thread Matthew Seaman

Gabe wrote:


Now with a gstripe+gmirror setup, would it be possible to fail a
specific drive on purpose? I mean fail a (good) drive, pull it out,
replace it and rebuild(?) it. I know I know, but humor me.


Yes.

Cheers,

Matthew

Well, to 'fail' the drive, you'ld have to physically pull the drive
from the chassis which will involve a power cycle unless you've got
hot-swap drives.  Of course, you should confirm that your system will
boot with the RAID in a degraded state and that rebuilding the RAID will
continue even if interrupted by a reboot.  gmirror(8) passes those
tests.  You do have to type some commands to get a mirror to rebuild
(examples are shown in the man page) unlike some hardware RAIDs where
simply inserting an unused disk is sufficient.

--
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7 Priory Courtyard
 Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
 Kent, CT11 9PW



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Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-09 Thread Gabe
--- On Sun, 2/8/09, Matthew Seaman  wrote:
> From: Matthew Seaman 
> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> To: n...@att.net
> Cc: "Wojciech Puchar" , 
> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Date: Sunday, February 8, 2009, 11:55 AM
> Gabe wrote:
> > --- On Sun, 2/8/09, Wojciech Puchar
>  wrote:
> > 
> >> From: Wojciech Puchar
> 
> 
> >>> I have to build a file server that will need
> to run a
> >> RAID 0+1 config
> 
> If you want reliability, then use RAID10, not RAID0+1.  For
> RAID10,
> you first create mirrored pairs of drives, then you stripe
> across all
> the mirrors.  This is superior to RAID0+1 where you divide
> your
> drives into two equal pools, create a stripe across all the
> drives in
> each pool, and then mirror the stripes.
> 
> Raw to usable space ratio is the same, performance
> characteristics
> are similar and good either way (some workloads,
> particularly those
> involving lots of small random IOs are particularly
> favourable on
> RAID10 (eg like the usage pattern of most RDBMses) whereas
> sequentially  streaming large single files is happiest on
> RAID0+1
> (eg. recording or playing video streams)). However imagine
> a RAID
> consisting of 2N drives.  If one drive fails, then in
> RAID10, *one*
> of your N mirrors is degraded, and the rest work normally.
> In
> RAID0+1, it's one of the 2 *stripes* that is degraded
> -- effectively
> taking out half of your drives.  Or to put it another way:
> given
> one drive has already died and the RAID is degraded, in
> either
> scenario, just one more disk death can take the RAID out
> completely.
> However with RAID10 there's exactly 1 drive whose death
> could have
> that effect -- failure of any of the other 2N-2 drives will
> degrade
> the RAID further, but it will still keep working.  With
> RAID0+1 if
> the second disk to fail is any of the N drives from the
> other stripe,
> it will kill the whole RAID array.
> 
> >> the best is gmirror+gstripe. of course for those
> who want
> >> to pay there are a lot of "hardware"
> solutions.
> 
> > Hey I'm all for saving money, but I'm unsure
> of the reliability of a
> > 'software' solution vs a hardware one. Not to
> mention my biggest
> > concern which is the failure of the Boot drive and how
> to recover
> > from that using software raid.
> 
> Software striping and mirroring is extremely reliable --
> probably more
> so than using a hardware RAID card as there's simply
> less to go wrong.
> On the other hand hardware RAID offers some big performance
> advantages
> by being able to cache data in battery backed RAM[*] on the
> card, instead
> of requiring you to wait until it's been written to
> persistent storage on
> the drives themselves. 
> While you can certaily boot from a gmirror RAID1, I
> don't believe it's
> possible to boot from a gstripe -- but because this all
> works via the
> geom framework, you can create stripes / mirrors at the
> filesystem level
> -- so you can have a small separate RAID1 to boot from and
> to hold the
> OS (either a dedicated pair of disks, or a pair of equal
> sized partitions,
> and then create a RAID10 over the rest of the disks to hold
> your data.
> I believe there is no requirement for the component parts
> of a gstripe
> to all be the same size 
>   Cheers,
> 
>   Matthew
> 
> [*] For mirroring and striping, the only real justification
> for using
> hardware RAID is the performance benefit from the Battery
> Backup Unit on
> the RAID card.  For RAID5 while a BBU is a *really good
> idea* it can
> justify itself by offloading parity calculations from the
> main CPU.
> 
> -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7
> Priory Courtyard
>  Flat 3
> PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
>  Kent, CT11
> 9PW

Thank you, this is a very well-written response and I appreciate the time you 
took to type it all up.

Now with a gstripe+gmirror setup, would it be possible to fail a specific drive 
on purpose? I mean fail a (good) drive, pull it out, replace it and rebuild(?) 
it. I know I know, but humor me.
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Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-08 Thread Matthew Seaman

Gabe wrote:

--- On Sun, 2/8/09, Wojciech Puchar  wrote:


From: Wojciech Puchar 



I have to build a file server that will need to run a

RAID 0+1 config


If you want reliability, then use RAID10, not RAID0+1.  For RAID10,
you first create mirrored pairs of drives, then you stripe across all
the mirrors.  This is superior to RAID0+1 where you divide your
drives into two equal pools, create a stripe across all the drives in
each pool, and then mirror the stripes.

Raw to usable space ratio is the same, performance characteristics
are similar and good either way (some workloads, particularly those
involving lots of small random IOs are particularly favourable on
RAID10 (eg like the usage pattern of most RDBMses) whereas
sequentially  streaming large single files is happiest on RAID0+1
(eg. recording or playing video streams)). However imagine a RAID
consisting of 2N drives.  If one drive fails, then in RAID10, *one*
of your N mirrors is degraded, and the rest work normally. In
RAID0+1, it's one of the 2 *stripes* that is degraded -- effectively
taking out half of your drives.  Or to put it another way: given
one drive has already died and the RAID is degraded, in either
scenario, just one more disk death can take the RAID out completely.
However with RAID10 there's exactly 1 drive whose death could have
that effect -- failure of any of the other 2N-2 drives will degrade
the RAID further, but it will still keep working.  With RAID0+1 if
the second disk to fail is any of the N drives from the other stripe,
it will kill the whole RAID array.


the best is gmirror+gstripe. of course for those who want
to pay there are a lot of "hardware" solutions.



Hey I'm all for saving money, but I'm unsure of the reliability of a
'software' solution vs a hardware one. Not to mention my biggest
concern which is the failure of the Boot drive and how to recover
from that using software raid.


Software striping and mirroring is extremely reliable -- probably more
so than using a hardware RAID card as there's simply less to go wrong.
On the other hand hardware RAID offers some big performance advantages
by being able to cache data in battery backed RAM[*] on the card, instead
of requiring you to wait until it's been written to persistent storage on
the drives themselves. 


While you can certaily boot from a gmirror RAID1, I don't believe it's
possible to boot from a gstripe -- but because this all works via the
geom framework, you can create stripes / mirrors at the filesystem level
-- so you can have a small separate RAID1 to boot from and to hold the
OS (either a dedicated pair of disks, or a pair of equal sized partitions,
and then create a RAID10 over the rest of the disks to hold your data.
I believe there is no requirement for the component parts of a gstripe
to all be the same size 


Cheers,

Matthew

[*] For mirroring and striping, the only real justification for using
hardware RAID is the performance benefit from the Battery Backup Unit on
the RAID card.  For RAID5 while a BBU is a *really good idea* it can
justify itself by offloading parity calculations from the main CPU.

--
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   7 Priory Courtyard
 Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
 Kent, CT11 9PW



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Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-08 Thread Gabe
--- On Sun, 2/8/09, Wojciech Puchar  wrote:

> From: Wojciech Puchar 
> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers
> To: "Gabe" 
> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> Date: Sunday, February 8, 2009, 4:45 AM
> > I have to build a file server that will need to run a
> RAID 0+1 config
> 
> the best is gmirror+gstripe. of course for those who want
> to pay there are a lot of "hardware" solutions.
> ___

Hey I'm all for saving money, but I'm unsure of the reliability of a 'software' 
solution vs a hardware one. Not to mention my biggest concern which is the 
failure of the Boot drive and how to recover from that using software raid.

Thanks
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Re: FreeBSD Preferred RAID controllers

2009-02-08 Thread Wojciech Puchar

I have to build a file server that will need to run a RAID 0+1 config


the best is gmirror+gstripe. of course for those who want to pay there are 
a lot of "hardware" solutions.

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