[Haskell-cafe] Re: libraries [was GUI haters]
Jean-Denis Koeck wrote: > > Question to the Mac users on the list: do you find that Qt applications > feel "native enough" on your platform ? If not, any tips ? Well, that depends on your definition of "enough". :) The most important thing is probably that cross platform applications always "look buggy", so if you can make sure that everything runs smoothly and there are no drawing bugs or thelike, that's a big plus. Qt applications will always look odd, the relative spacing is all off. But using the appropriate system fonts adds a lot to consistency. Avoid colored buttons and text. Another key feature of "native" for me is that the menu bar is at the top of the screen. Hence, all windows share the same menu. Furthermore, the context menu should not list commands that are not available in the top menu. Not as important, but still unique to native Mac applications is that accept a lot of drag & drop. For instance, to insert a picture into a document, you can just drag & drop it from the Finder program; no need to intricate "open file" dialogs. If you have a list of items that can be rearranged, do so by means of drag & drop instead of strange Up and Down buttons. There's probably more, but that's what I can think of right now off the top of my hat. :) Regards, Heinrich Apfelmus -- http://apfelmus.nfshost.com ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
[Haskell-cafe] Re: libraries [was GUI haters]
aditya siram wrote: > Cocoa is probably the best GUI toolkit (open-source or otherwise) that > I've seen. However it ties your app to the Mac (and the iPhone). And I > don't believe there is a mature Haskell bridge. There is hoc http://code.google.com/p/hoc/ but it's not on hackage and seems a bit dormant. > And Javascript [1] is really not _that_ bad! But it's not Haskell. :'( Regards, Heinrich Apfelmus -- http://apfelmus.nfshost.com ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: libraries [was GUI haters]
I'm building a desktop application using Haskell for the logic and Qt/C++ for the GUI (the haskell source is foreign-exported into a shared library). It's been hard to pull off, but it works quite well when you get past the compilation issues. Question to the Mac users on the list: do you find that Qt applications feel "native enough" on your platform ? If not, any tips ? 2010/4/3 Heinrich Apfelmus > Michael Vanier wrote: > > aditya siram wrote: > >> Yes Haskell is not strong on the GUI end of things but have you > >> considered turning your desktop app into a web app? I've done this > >> for a few things and really enjoyed the process. Haskell's STM is > >> what makes this so nice. > > > > This is a great idea! IMO this is also one of the main ways that > > GUI-based apps are likely to evolve into in the future. Cross-platform > > GUIs are a pain in the butt in _any_ language (possibly excluding full > > language platforms like Java/.NET, and I'll bet even those were a > > nightmare for the original implementors). > > This is a bad idea! :) As a long term Mac user, I have a strong dislike > for web applications that try to be desktop applications. Sagemath is > probably an example in point. Not only are the well-designed standard > GUI elements thrown out of the window (the menu bar, it belongs at the > top), it's also sluggish to navigate between pages, doesn't support drag > & drop from other applications and most importantly, doesn't play nice > with local files. > > >From the programmers point of view, I don't want to code my GUI in > Javascript either, I want to do it in Haskell. > > > Regards, > Heinrich Apfelmus > > -- > http://apfelmus.nfshost.com > > > > > > ___ > Haskell-Cafe mailing list > Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org > http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe > ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
Re: [Haskell-cafe] Re: libraries [was GUI haters]
Cocoa is probably the best GUI toolkit (open-source or otherwise) that I've seen. However it ties your app to the Mac (and the iPhone). And I don't believe there is a mature Haskell bridge. Cross-platform GUI's like GTK don't look as nice but functions pretty well for what they do. Unfortunately they are written in C/C++/. Integration to Haskell is pretty nice but it seems like a bear to install on Windows or Mac and hence there are deployment issues. Until a cross-platform Haskell GUI toolkit is sufficiently mature, that doesn't leave many options and all of them require spending time coding in another language. If natively running code was a major requirement, I'd use a Java Swing app as a client connecting to Haskell server - if not I'd go with a web frontend as previously described. And Javascript [1] is really not _that_ bad! -deech [1] http://www.amazon.com/dp/0596517742 On 4/3/10, Heinrich Apfelmus wrote: > Michael Vanier wrote: >> aditya siram wrote: >>> Yes Haskell is not strong on the GUI end of things but have you >>> considered turning your desktop app into a web app? I've done this >>> for a few things and really enjoyed the process. Haskell's STM is >>> what makes this so nice. >> >> This is a great idea! IMO this is also one of the main ways that >> GUI-based apps are likely to evolve into in the future. Cross-platform >> GUIs are a pain in the butt in _any_ language (possibly excluding full >> language platforms like Java/.NET, and I'll bet even those were a >> nightmare for the original implementors). > > This is a bad idea! :) As a long term Mac user, I have a strong dislike > for web applications that try to be desktop applications. Sagemath is > probably an example in point. Not only are the well-designed standard > GUI elements thrown out of the window (the menu bar, it belongs at the > top), it's also sluggish to navigate between pages, doesn't support drag > & drop from other applications and most importantly, doesn't play nice > with local files. > > >From the programmers point of view, I don't want to code my GUI in > Javascript either, I want to do it in Haskell. > > > Regards, > Heinrich Apfelmus > > -- > http://apfelmus.nfshost.com > > > > > > ___ > Haskell-Cafe mailing list > Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org > http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe > ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
[Haskell-cafe] Re: libraries [was GUI haters]
Michael Vanier wrote: > aditya siram wrote: >> Yes Haskell is not strong on the GUI end of things but have you >> considered turning your desktop app into a web app? I've done this >> for a few things and really enjoyed the process. Haskell's STM is >> what makes this so nice. > > This is a great idea! IMO this is also one of the main ways that > GUI-based apps are likely to evolve into in the future. Cross-platform > GUIs are a pain in the butt in _any_ language (possibly excluding full > language platforms like Java/.NET, and I'll bet even those were a > nightmare for the original implementors). This is a bad idea! :) As a long term Mac user, I have a strong dislike for web applications that try to be desktop applications. Sagemath is probably an example in point. Not only are the well-designed standard GUI elements thrown out of the window (the menu bar, it belongs at the top), it's also sluggish to navigate between pages, doesn't support drag & drop from other applications and most importantly, doesn't play nice with local files. >From the programmers point of view, I don't want to code my GUI in Javascript either, I want to do it in Haskell. Regards, Heinrich Apfelmus -- http://apfelmus.nfshost.com ___ Haskell-Cafe mailing list Haskell-Cafe@haskell.org http://www.haskell.org/mailman/listinfo/haskell-cafe
