Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
On Thu, Jul 14, 2011 at 09:59:44PM +0200, Janek Warchoł wrote: > I attach the patch, feel free to push it (i cannot). Thanks, pushed. Cheers, - Graham ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
2011/7/14 : > This has had its countdown; please push and close. I attach the patch, feel free to push it (i cannot). cheers, Janek From 55ac6f7e56bcd42a6464a35378f02046aee4d2f7 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Janek Warchol Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2011 21:39:28 +0200 Subject: [PATCH] an example of minimal example for some people it's not clear enough how tiny a tiny example should be. So i used a recently discussed example to illustrate it, and also changed some wording and style. --- Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css |1 + Documentation/web/community.itexi | 63 ++-- 2 files changed, 52 insertions(+), 12 deletions(-) diff --git a/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css b/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css index a6f6f9b..e5bf192 100644 --- a/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css +++ b/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css @@ -894,6 +894,7 @@ div.color4 h3 { .example { position: relative; left: -2.5em; + text-align: left; } .h-scroll-auto { diff --git a/Documentation/web/community.itexi b/Documentation/web/community.itexi index d6918d1..a5d4784 100644 --- a/Documentation/web/community.itexi +++ b/Documentation/web/community.itexi @@ -270,7 +270,7 @@ guidelines for @ref{Bug reports}.} @divClass{column-center-top} @subheading What are @qq{Tiny examples}? -A tiny example is an example from which nothing can be removed. +A tiny example is an example from which @strong{nothing} can be removed. @divEnd @divClass{column-left-bottom} @@ -284,12 +284,12 @@ The simpler the example is, the quicker potential helpers can understand it and help you. @item -A simple example demonstrates that you have put effort towards +A tiny example demonstrates that you have put effort towards solving the problem yourself. When people send huge portions of -input, it looks like they don't care how if we help them or not. +input, it looks like they don't care if we help them or not. @item -Creating a tiny example forces you to understand what is +Creating a tiny example helps you to understand what is happening. Many false problem reports can be avoided by attempting to create a tiny example; if you cannot replicate a @qq{bug} in a tiny example, then the problem was probably an @@ -302,39 +302,78 @@ insufficient understanding of LilyPond, not an actual bug! @divClass{column-right-bottom} -@subheading How do I create them? +@subheading How to create them? @divClass{keep-bullets} @itemize @item -Include the \version number. +Include the @code{\version} number. @item Make it small! Examples about spacing or page layout might require many bars of music, but most issues can be reproduced -using only a single measure. +using less than a single measure. @item When trying to create an example, try commenting out @w{(@code{%} -or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file. If you can -comment something while still demonstrating the main idea, then -remove the commented-material! +or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file. If you +can comment something while still demonstrating the main idea, +then remove the commented-material. @item -Avoid using complicated notes, keys, or time signatures, unless +Avoid using complicated notes, keys or time signatures, unless the bug is about the behavior of those items. @item Do not use @code{\override} or @code{\set} commands unless the bug -is about those particular commands. +is about those specific commands. + +@item +Optionally, attach an image showing the desired graphical output. @end itemize @divEnd @divEnd +@divClass{column-center-bottom} +@subheading How tiny should they be? + +Is the code below a minimal example? + +@example +\version "2.14.1" +\include "english.ly" + +\score @{ + \new Staff @{ +\key d \major +\numericTimeSignature +\time 2/4 +16 8. +%% Here: the tie on the D's looks funny +%% Too tall? Left-hand endpoint is not aligned with the B tie? +~ +8 [ ] + @} +@} +@end example +Well, it is not very big, but a truly minimal example is here: + +@example +\version "2.14.1" +@{ + % middle tie looks funny here: + 8. ~ 8 +@} +@end example + +Very few tiny examples exceed 10 lines of code - +quite often 4 lines are enough to demonstrate the problem! + +@divEnd @node Bug reports -- 1.7.0.4 ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
This has had its countdown; please push and close. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
LGTM http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
New patch set uploaded. I think that everything works now. cheers, Janek http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10003/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css File Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10003/Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css#newcode897 Documentation/css/lilypond-website.css:897: text-align: left; I've also pondered at adding width: 96%; padding: 1em; border: solid #b1d281; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 5px; to make these similar to code examples in manuals, but i decided it would change too much. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
On Sat, Jul 09, 2011 at 12:33:04PM +0200, David Kastrup wrote: > Graham Percival writes: > > > Graphical samples are a royal people for people like me to create. ^ pain. > Oh. I would have thought you a commoner. No, actually -- I was born on January 6, as the third of 3 boys born in that hospital. Apparently the nurses joked that we were the "three kings". ... and no, that hasn't gone to my head at all. :) Cheers, - Graham ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
Graham Percival writes: > On Sat, Jul 09, 2011 at 07:58:52AM +, > lemniskata.bernoull...@gmail.com wrote: >> >Optionally, attach an image showing the desired graphical output. >> >> "desired graphical output" is very nice and elegant, but i wouldn't >> change "if possible" to "optionally". IMO graphical samples are *very* >> useful and make answering a lot easier and faster, so we should >> encourage them as much as possible. > > Graphical samples are a royal people for people like me to create. Oh. I would have thought you a commoner. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
On Sat, Jul 09, 2011 at 07:58:52AM +, lemniskata.bernoull...@gmail.com wrote: > >Optionally, attach an image showing the desired graphical output. > > "desired graphical output" is very nice and elegant, but i wouldn't > change "if possible" to "optionally". IMO graphical samples are *very* > useful and make answering a lot easier and faster, so we should > encourage them as much as possible. Graphical samples are a royal people for people like me to create. I began using lilypond precisely because I don't have / don't want graphical programs! I'm fine with encouraging them, as with my suggested sentence. I'm not fine with encouraging them "as much as possible". > On 2011/07/09 07:51:13, Graham Percival wrote: > >This needs to be flush left, not centered. > > Yes. As i wrote > "I have a problem with the box at the bottom: code examples are > center-aligned, not left-aligned. I didn't found any example of how > it's done in our manuals; i searched texinfo documentation and found > @flushleft, but it didn't work... How should i do this?" texi2html produces html and css. Take a look at the css, take a look at the html, take a look at the @divClass commands in the .itexi files in that directory. Cheers, - Graham ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
New patch set uploaded. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode320 Documentation/web/community.itexi:320: or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file first. If you On 2011/07/09 07:51:13, Graham Percival wrote: remove the word "first". It doesn't really add anything to the sentence. Hmm, ok. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode322 Documentation/web/community.itexi:322: then remove the commented-material completely. On 2011/07/09 07:51:13, Graham Percival wrote: What does the word "completely" add to this sentence? I mean, how do we expect users to remove commented-material partly? Done. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode333 Documentation/web/community.itexi:333: If possible, attach an image showing what do you want to achieve On 2011/07/09 07:51:13, Graham Percival wrote: Change this: Optionally, attach an image showing the desired graphical output. "desired graphical output" is very nice and elegant, but i wouldn't change "if possible" to "optionally". IMO graphical samples are *very* useful and make answering a lot easier and faster, so we should encourage them as much as possible. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode346 Documentation/web/community.itexi:346: @example On 2011/07/09 07:51:13, Graham Percival wrote: This needs to be flush left, not centered. Yes. As i wrote "I have a problem with the box at the bottom: code examples are center-aligned, not left-aligned. I didn't found any example of how it's done in our manuals; i searched texinfo documentation and found @flushleft, but it didn't work... How should i do this?" http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode320 Documentation/web/community.itexi:320: or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file first. If you remove the word "first". It doesn't really add anything to the sentence. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode322 Documentation/web/community.itexi:322: then remove the commented-material completely. What does the word "completely" add to this sentence? I mean, how do we expect users to remove commented-material partly? http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode333 Documentation/web/community.itexi:333: If possible, attach an image showing what do you want to achieve Change this: Optionally, attach an image showing the desired graphical output. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/13003/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode346 Documentation/web/community.itexi:346: @example This needs to be flush left, not centered. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
Reverted sentence about \version. Ready to go? http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode311 Documentation/web/community.itexi:311: Specify which release of LilyPond you are using with a On 2011/07/07 10:26:39, Graham Percival wrote: On 2011/07/06 17:44:37, Janek Warchol wrote: > Hmm, what about "Specify which "code{\version} of LilyPond you are using."? hmm, that's better, but it still feels a bit wordy. I'm not feeling enthusiastic about this change. Do we have any evidence that "include the \version number" is misunderstood? If you can point to 3 emails to bug-lilypond where people misunderstood this, then I'm fine with a more wordy explanation. No, i don't have any proofs, it was just a guess. Scrap it then. (that said, adding the @code{} around \version is still a good change) Done. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode311 Documentation/web/community.itexi:311: Specify which release of LilyPond you are using with a On 2011/07/06 17:44:37, Janek Warchol wrote: Hmm, what about "Specify which "code{\version} of LilyPond you are using."? hmm, that's better, but it still feels a bit wordy. I'm not feeling enthusiastic about this change. Do we have any evidence that "include the \version number" is misunderstood? If you can point to 3 emails to bug-lilypond where people misunderstood this, then I'm fine with a more wordy explanation. (that said, adding the @code{} around \version is still a good change) http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode311 Documentation/web/community.itexi:311: Specify which release of LilyPond you are using with a On 2011/07/06 14:36:39, Graham Percival wrote: too wordy. What was the problem with the original 4-word sentnce? (ok, adding @code{} would be good) As i wrote to James, i thought it should be made clear that what matters is the version of the actual binary, not what \version statement you are using in your files. If someone was using 2.13.40 for some time, wrote a file (with \version specified) for it, then installed 2.13.47 and something broke, he may forgot to change version statement in his bug report. (i don't update \version numbers in my files quite often myself). But i don't insist on this change. Hmm, what about "Specify which "code{\version} of LilyPond you are using."? http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
I'm in a boring presentation. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/4002/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode311 Documentation/web/community.itexi:311: Specify which release of LilyPond you are using with a too wordy. What was the problem with the original 4-word sentnce? (ok, adding @code{} would be good) http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
New patch set uploaded. I have a problem with the box at the bottom: code examples are center-aligned, not left-aligned. I didn't found any example of how it's done in our manuals; i searched texinfo documentation and found @flushleft, but it didn't work... How should i do this? http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode283 Documentation/web/community.itexi:283: The simpler the example is, the quicker potential helpers can On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: The tinier the example, the simpler it is and therefore, the quicker... I'm not sure if this is straightforward enough. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode287 Documentation/web/community.itexi:287: A simple example demonstrates that you have put effort towards On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: A tiny example also demonstrates to others on the email lists that some kind of effort has been taken to... Too wordy imo. [PS Are we talking 'simpler' or 'tinier' here? While I can see that both work, they are two different ideas and you are already moving away from 'tiny'. Can we stick to tiny?] Umm, i didn't touch anything here. I've only added that example part. However, i agree that 'tiny' sounds better at the beginning of this sentence. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode289 Documentation/web/community.itexi:289: input, it looks like they don't care how if we help them or not. "don't care how if we help them or not." Should 'how' be there? Looks wrong to me... http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode289 Documentation/web/community.itexi:289: input, it looks like they don't care how if we help them or not. On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: solving the problem yourself. Whereas overly complex, large or unedited examples look like no effort has been made to try to attempt to solve the problem yourself and can discourage others from helping. I think it's too wordy, and the repetition about solving the problem yourself is not necessary. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode292 Documentation/web/community.itexi:292: Creating a tiny example forces you to understand what is On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: A tiny example can also help you to ... I agree about the 'helping' part, but i wouldn't remove word 'creating'. It's creating the tiny example that helps in understanding, not merely having it. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode296 Documentation/web/community.itexi:296: insufficient understanding of LilyPond, not an actual bug! On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: ...then the problem is usually due to a lack of understanding of how the LilyPond syntax works. I prefer the original, it's grammatically simpler. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode305 Documentation/web/community.itexi:305: @subheading How do I create them? On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: How to create them. [we try to not personalise the text or talk in first/second person] Good point, i agree. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode311 Documentation/web/community.itexi:311: Include the \version number. On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: Include the LilyPond @code{\version} number you are using. I changed it so that it should be plain that the version of the actual binary matters, not what \version statement you are using in your files (i don't update \version numbers in my files quite often myself). http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode314 Documentation/web/community.itexi:314: Make it small! Examples about spacing or page layout might On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: Keep it tiny! Examples about... I'd leave word 'make' because creating a tiny ex is a process of removing material. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode320 Documentation/web/community.itexi:320: or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file. If you can On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: ..or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file first. If you can... Done. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode321 Documentation/web/community.itexi:321: comment something while still demonstrating the main idea, then On 2011/07/05 00:14:30, J_lowe wrote: comment something out while ... sounds awkward to me. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode322 Documentation/web/community.itexi:322: remo
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
2011/7/5 Graham Percival > > On Mon, Jul 04, 2011 at 11:46:30PM +0200, Janek Warchoł wrote: > > 2011/7/4 : > > > On 2011/07/04 21:01:44, Janek Warchol wrote: > > >> Umm.. is it right now? > > > > > > why the mao are you asking me? Cut&paste this and tell me yourself: > > > cd build/ > > > make website > > > > > > It either compiles, or it doesn't. > > > > Ooops, sorry... I didn't know that it's possible to compile website > > separately from all other documentation (which takes a lot of time, > > according to CG, and i've never done it). > > I did this, and it compiled. > > ??? > unless I clicked on the wrong draft by mistake, you still had a {, > which shouldn't compile. Ah, i see now. I should've changed all { to @{ and } to @}. I understood what you meant when i saw the code of example bug report. Done. > > However, when i opened > > build/out-website/index.html, a black-and white text only page > > apperared. Does it mean i should do things described in CG 6.3? > > look at: > build/out-website/website/index.html > instead. It's almost like our website - only misses graphics and shading on menu bars. But i don't suppose it's because of anything i did. Thanks! Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
- Original Message - From: "Janek Warchoł" To: ; ; ; ; ; Sent: Monday, July 04, 2011 10:46 PM Subject: Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082) 2011/7/4 : On 2011/07/04 21:01:44, Janek Warchol wrote: Umm.. is it right now? why the mao are you asking me? Cut&paste this and tell me yourself: cd build/ make website It either compiles, or it doesn't. Ooops, sorry... I didn't know that it's possible to compile website separately from all other documentation (which takes a lot of time, according to CG, and i've never done it). I did this, and it compiled. However, when i opened build/out-website/index.html, a black-and white text only page apperared. Does it mean i should do things described in CG 6.3? That's what I get as well. Providing it's compiled and looks approximately like you want it, you should be OK. -- Phil Holmes ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
Hello, my comments inline. James http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode283 Documentation/web/community.itexi:283: The simpler the example is, the quicker potential helpers can The tinier the example, the simpler it is and therefore, the quicker... http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode287 Documentation/web/community.itexi:287: A simple example demonstrates that you have put effort towards A tiny example also demonstrates to others on the email lists that some kind of effort has been taken to... [PS Are we talking 'simpler' or 'tinier' here? While I can see that both work, they are two different ideas and you are already moving away from 'tiny'. Can we stick to tiny?] http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode289 Documentation/web/community.itexi:289: input, it looks like they don't care how if we help them or not. solving the problem yourself. Whereas overly complex, large or unedited examples look like no effort has been made to try to attempt to solve the problem yourself and can discourage others from helping. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode292 Documentation/web/community.itexi:292: Creating a tiny example forces you to understand what is A tiny example can also help you to ... http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode296 Documentation/web/community.itexi:296: insufficient understanding of LilyPond, not an actual bug! ...then the problem is usually due to a lack of understanding of how the LilyPond syntax works. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode305 Documentation/web/community.itexi:305: @subheading How do I create them? How to create them. [we try to not personalise the text or talk in first/second person] http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode311 Documentation/web/community.itexi:311: Include the \version number. Include the LilyPond @code{\version} number you are using. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode314 Documentation/web/community.itexi:314: Make it small! Examples about spacing or page layout might Keep it tiny! Examples about... http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode320 Documentation/web/community.itexi:320: or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file. If you can ..or @code{%@{ @dots{} %@}})} sections of your file first. If you can... http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode321 Documentation/web/community.itexi:321: comment something while still demonstrating the main idea, then comment something out while ... http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode322 Documentation/web/community.itexi:322: remove the commented-material! remove the commented material completely from your example. [no need for all the exclamations] http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode325 Documentation/web/community.itexi:325: Avoid using complicated notes, keys, or time signatures, unless ..notes, keys or time signatures, unless... [remove comma] http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode330 Documentation/web/community.itexi:330: is about those particular commands. [I'd use the word 'specific' instead of 'particular' here] http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode334 Documentation/web/community.itexi:334: (how the correct output should look like). If possible, attach a small image file of what you want the correct output to look like as this will help us clarify exactly what the problem is. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/10001/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode375 Documentation/web/community.itexi:375: quite often 4 lines are enough to demonstrate the problem! [we've already said this above - "Examples about spacing or page layout might require many bars of music, but most issues can be reproduced using less than a single measure" why repeat it (and differently)?] http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
On Mon, Jul 04, 2011 at 11:46:30PM +0200, Janek Warchoł wrote: > 2011/7/4 : > > On 2011/07/04 21:01:44, Janek Warchol wrote: > >> Umm.. is it right now? > > > > why the mao are you asking me? Cut&paste this and tell me yourself: > > cd build/ > > make website > > > > It either compiles, or it doesn't. > > Ooops, sorry... I didn't know that it's possible to compile website > separately from all other documentation (which takes a lot of time, > according to CG, and i've never done it). > I did this, and it compiled. ??? unless I clicked on the wrong draft by mistake, you still had a {, which shouldn't compile. hmm, maybe texi2html can handle it -- but if you try a simple "make", I expect that it will fail. > However, when i opened > build/out-website/index.html, a black-and white text only page > apperared. Does it mean i should do things described in CG 6.3? look at: build/out-website/website/index.html instead. Cheers, - Graham ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
2011/7/4 : > On 2011/07/04 21:01:44, Janek Warchol wrote: >> Umm.. is it right now? > > why the mao are you asking me? Cut&paste this and tell me yourself: > cd build/ > make website > > It either compiles, or it doesn't. Ooops, sorry... I didn't know that it's possible to compile website separately from all other documentation (which takes a lot of time, according to CG, and i've never done it). I did this, and it compiled. However, when i opened build/out-website/index.html, a black-and white text only page apperared. Does it mean i should do things described in CG 6.3? >> Umm, James' original example was exactly one measure, >> and we condemned it as being too long. > > It was too long in terms of lines of text, not in terms of duration. Or > to put it another way: it was too complicated. It had scary stuff like > \useNumericTimeSignature. ok, i admit this was more non-tinish than the additional notes alone. cheers, Janek ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
On 2011/07/04 21:01:44, Janek Warchol wrote: 2011/7/4 : > this won't compile; it would have to be @example instead, and that will require > @{ @} escapes. Umm.. is it right now? why the mao are you asking me? Cut&paste this and tell me yourself: cd build/ make website It either compiles, or it doesn't. Umm, James' original example was exactly one measure, and we condemned it as being too long. It was too long in terms of lines of text, not in terms of duration. Or to put it another way: it was too complicated. It had scary stuff like \useNumericTimeSignature. Cheers, - Graham http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
New patch set uploaded. 2011/7/4 : I'm glad that you're working on it! I'm just warning you that there will be many nitpicks. No problem. If they aren't about code style, i can handle them :) http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode275 Documentation/web/community.itexi:275: Is the code below a minimal example? On 2011/07/04 20:24:56, Graham Percival wrote: This is way too long. I spent a lot of time and effort making the website as minimal as possible to increase readability I had this feeling too. Hmm... I'd be ok with it if you put it in a box at the bottom of the page. I actually can't believe that we don't have any examples on the Tiny examples page -- the only place to find something is on the Bug reports page! Done (at least i hope that it's written correctly). http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode277 Documentation/web/community.itexi:277: @lilypond On 2011/07/04 20:24:56, Graham Percival wrote: this won't compile; it would have to be @example instead, and that will require @{ @} escapes. Umm.. is it right now? http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode346 Documentation/web/community.itexi:346: using less than a single measure. On 2011/07/04 20:24:56, Graham Percival wrote: I prefer "only". If somebody gets it down to 1 measure, we're not going to quibble about 2 beats vs. 4 beats. Umm, James' original example was exactly one measure, and we condemned it as being too long. 2011/7/4 James Harkins wrote: To me, one bar is tiny. And after all, this wording doesn't force people to make examples less then one measure at all costs. It only suggests things. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode353 Documentation/web/community.itexi:353: 2 lines of code, and few exceed 10 lines. On 2011/07/04 20:24:56, Graham Percival wrote: Hmm. I'm worried that this (combined with the next item) would make the page too wordy. Leave it in there for the next draft, but I may complain about it later. I moved it to the bottom box, how do you like it? http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
On 2011/07/04 20:02:59, Carl wrote: I like this, but I think it should have a little bit more information. I don't think that the changes in the comments affect whether it is minimal or not -- perhaps the comments should be the same in both cases. Imo it's more readable when the comment is briefer. Also the way in wchich it divides the music is distracting for me. thanks, Janek http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
We need to be careful about adding stuff to the webpage; perfection is when there's nothing left to remove, not when there's nothing left to add. I'm glad that you're working on it! I'm just warning you that there will be many nitpicks. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi File Documentation/web/community.itexi (right): http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode273 Documentation/web/community.itexi:273: A tiny example is an example from which @strong{nothing} can be removed. I'm happy with this change. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode275 Documentation/web/community.itexi:275: Is the code below a minimal example? This is way too long. I spent a lot of time and effort making the website as minimal as possible to increase readability Hmm... I'd be ok with it if you put it in a box at the bottom of the page. I actually can't believe that we don't have any examples on the Tiny examples page -- the only place to find something is on the Bug reports page! http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode277 Documentation/web/community.itexi:277: @lilypond this won't compile; it would have to be @example instead, and that will require @{ @} escapes. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode346 Documentation/web/community.itexi:346: using less than a single measure. I prefer "only". If somebody gets it down to 1 measure, we're not going to quibble about 2 beats vs. 4 beats. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/diff/3/Documentation/web/community.itexi#newcode353 Documentation/web/community.itexi:353: 2 lines of code, and few exceed 10 lines. Hmm. I'm worried that this (combined with the next item) would make the page too wordy. Leave it in there for the next draft, but I may complain about it later. http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel
Re: an example of minimal example (issue4636082)
I like this, but I think it should have a little bit more information. I don't think that the changes in the comments affect whether it is minimal or not -- perhaps the comments should be the same in both cases. What we wanted to get rid of is any unnecessary LilyPond input. In this case that means \score, \newStaff, \key d \major, \numericTimeSignature, and \time 2/4. We also got rid of unnecessary notes. Since we were focusing on the ties, we only needed the tied notes. HTH, Carl http://codereview.appspot.com/4636082/ ___ lilypond-devel mailing list lilypond-devel@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-devel