Re: [OSM-talk] [Tagging] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Simone Saviolo wrote : 2010/4/30 Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com: [...] consider bicycle=yes. [...] I sense a long and unproductive discussion approaching. ;-) Simone I'm agree, there's other things about the tag who need to be fixed, like the name and the way to tag (between tag the shop or the trolleys parkings). The *=yes is good and used as the same way for many tags. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC -(Trolley)
Alex S. wrote : Since it's been brought up, how about a tag/sub-tag for handbaskets? It would be just as nice to know if the local bodega/mini-mart/c-store have them before leaving the house. I suggest a separate tag, but it's a good idea, if this was not proposed or adopted why not =) And this tag could have may subtags like handbasket=number, tag with a node the emplacement, etc. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Liz wrote : What about airport trolleys/carts/trundlers? Mapping the location of those would be useful. Yes, good idea. At first I don't think about airports but there's equelly trolleys. But in this case, the tag become more general and the proposition for the name shop:cart is unadapted... So for the names, there's now the choice between trolley, cart, or maybe trundler. But trundler seems to be specific at Australia, and trolley specific to England, so the more adapted name may be cart=yes/no, I think. What do you think about it ? And an other thing needed to be discuted : what is better between : -Tag the shop/airport/building where there's cart -Or tag the emplacement of the carts parking -Get the choice when tagging between the methods (the first may be used when the emplacement is unknow by the user and the second when when he knows) ? The 2 methods have been proposed on the wiki but there's no comments about it. What do you think ? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
John Smith wrote : On 28 April 2010 22:14, Adrien Pavie dr...@laposte.net wrote: Yes, good idea. At first I don't think about airports but there's equelly trolleys. But in this case, the tag become more general and the proposition for the name shop:cart is unadapted... So for the names, there's now the choice between trolley, cart, or maybe trundler. But trundler seems to be specific at Australia, and trolley specific to England, so the more adapted name may be cart=yes/no, I think. What do you think about it ? Try New Zealand, we call them trolleys or carts in Australia... Oops, sorry I confused the country ^^' ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Pieren wrote : Besides the question of tagging such things, OSM has a long tradition of using the english words for the tags, not the US. This is because the project has been founded there. I don't see why we should change now because you read one complain from Australia and two from US... It may be a tradition, but it's not a reason for reject directly the proposed name, it could be discuted before ^^ Btw amenity=shopping_trolley is not so bad. This tag may be used for the trolleys parking, not as a tag in complement for shops or airports. And i think shopping_ is not adapted for be use with an airport, but why not amenity=trolley. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
John F. Eldredge wrote : Speaking as an American, I think that amenity=shopping_trolley would be sufficient to tell people that we aren't talking about trolley cars (street railways), and it wouldn't be hard to learn the meaning of shopping trolley. So, a tag like shop:trolley=yes/no could be good for all ? An english word, with shop: to not be confused, and not too long, it may be good ^^' Or there's always simply cart=yes/no, cart is short, english and american I think, and adapted for airports, shops and other places where may have trolley/shopping carts. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [Tagging] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC -(Trolley)
John F. Eldredge wrote: Well, we could always use handcart, rather than cart, so as to specify that we don't mean the horse-drawn variety. When it's not tramways or electric trains, it's horses x) I see in my dictionnary french-english (I didn't have an english dictionnary with definitions) and handcart seems to be more like wheelbarrow than trolley. Richard wrote : And then I suggest we go to hell in it[1]. [...] [1] otherwise known as the tagging@ list Why in hell with the tagging list ? Oo ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [Tagging] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC -(Trolley)
John F. Eldredge wrote : English has a proverbial expression, going to hell in a handbasket, meaning that things are going wrong at a rapid pace. Hmm... =/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Claudius wrote : And by the way: I suggest using yes/no as values instead of the computer science lingo true/false. Yes/no was what I choose when i create the wiki page, but yes/no is already used by access tag for the restrictions on roads.. and I've looked somewhere in the wiki it's preferred use true/false. But it's not false this is a term more for computers, an idea for change true/false ? Lulu-ann says in the discussion page it's better use yes/no equally. I think a mini-vote to choose between yes/no or true/false on the discussion page could resolve this choice. Gregory wrote : A lot of supermarkets have a system to stop you taking trolleys/carts home (sometimes instead of a charge) so they have a sign like No carts beyond this line, cart will stop suddenly. I never see this system in France, we just have to put a coin to detach the cart from the others. You could use the fee tag. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:fee http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:feebut on the shop=* node that seems strange (an entry fee to a shop?) so I would suggest shop:cart:fee=yes/no (or cart:fee=yes/no) and link to the fee page. I would like to know what coin I need for the trolleys, and I think the fee tag is supposed to allow this with something like fee=0.50 (assumes local currency!), and I think we can assume you usually have just one coin needed. Use shop:cart:fee instead of shop:cart_coin ? Good idea, but can we use it for this because the trolley return the coin when you park it. Kev js1982 wrote : With regards to the fee how would you tag the majority of uk supermarkets where the trolleys accept both £1 and €1 coins? This seams to be pretty standard on all trolleys introduced since approx 1998. I think there's a way to set a default value when the tag is not precised, the standard is 1€ or 1£ (I don't in America), and when the value is different we precise it. Ken wrote : Perhaps then I can expand on my script (and someone can update openstreetbrowser) to filter stores by what denomination of coin is required for using their trolleys? It could be interessant do it ^^ But we have to wait before the vote =s Liz wrote : I have a token which can used in a trolley/cart instead of real cash Yes, i think a lot of persons use tokens instead of money, i use it equally ^^ But the trolleys are originaly made for a sort of coin and precise it could be interessant when it's not the standard value. There's a lot of responses, and I want to thanks all users for the comments =) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Alex S. : Why would shops have light-rail trains? Yes, it's for shopping cart or caddie, trains in a shop could be strange ^^'. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Aun Johnsen wrote : 1) I do not see the point in this tag, 99% of supermarkets and grocery stores world wide have some form of carts available for its customers, the few exemptions I have seen are shops that are too small, or shops where you ask for the groceries directly over the counter. I'm agree for groceries and supermarkets, a lot of them have shopping carts, but it's interessant to know the type (a proposition in the discussion page in the wiki) and if they need coins. But others type of shops like do-it- yourself or sports shops... have sometimes trolleys and sometimes haven't. 2) shop:cart=yes/no is a more sane tag in my opinion It's more short and more explicit, I think it's a good idea, because with this there's less language problems between English US and English UK. John Smith wrote : If they don't speak a lot of English they won't care if it's shopping_trolley or shopping_cart, although if it's attached to a place that shopping usually takes place then then the shopping_ bit is probably redundant. In any case, localised preset naming makes the issue irrelevant... Also trams aren't called trolley's the world over, although OSM refers to it as light rail to avoid the confusion I suppose. It's the same idea, shop:cart=yes/no is more short but the shop: could be also redondant with shop=*... But I think just cart=yes/no is too short. It's not easy find the good tag ^^ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Don't forget that we already use the scheme vehicle=yes/no/designated/maybe/... to express access restrictions for modes of transport - so cart=no actually means no shopping cart riding allowed in here ;-) -Martin Ok, I will change it in the wiki, shop:cart=true/false and the other tags/propositions. But it could be funny create a roadsign No shopping carts =P ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (Trolley)
Hello, I send a proposal Trolley (in part shop) and I send this RFC to get opinions about this. This is a direct link : http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Trolley The tag is for know if a shop has trolleys. All the details are in the wiki. Thanks in advance for comments. Adrien Pavie (alias Dri60) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
