Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
2008/8/22 Matthew Revell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 2008/8/18 Matthew Revell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > What information do you think is most important for new translators to > > know before they get started? > > Thanks everyone for your insightful contributions. I'm pleased to say > that, with your help, I've written a new page on the help wiki: > > https://help.launchpad.net/Translations/StartingToTranslate > > We're planning to link to that from the UI. However, this is just the > beginning: I'd love your help with: > > * refining the help wiki document > * refining the text in the Translations UI itself > * coming up with parts of the Translations UI that require further > explanation and could benefit from some pop-up help in the UI itself. > > The help wiki document arises from bug number 7 > (https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad-documentation/+bug/7), just in > case you're interested :) > > Thanks again! > > Very nice work indeed. I think you have found a very good way of incoorporating the information about the intricacies of the upstream/downstream system (which I think is really important) without it becoming to dominant. I few comments, both in the section about "Dealing with unusual characters" You mention "closing a tag", I think that if coding experience is not a prerequisute, then both 'tag' and 'closing them' should be breifly explained. Maybe something like this: *Formatting:* you may see HTML entities, such as , used to format text in a string, these are known as tags. Copy these tags exactly as you find them and apply them to the relevant part of the text. Most tags exist as pairs, like this, where the tag with the '/' is the closing tag. It is very important to remember to close the tags in the same way as in the original string. You may also see other tags, such as XML, and should treat them the same way. Furthermore, something like context entities (like "Noun|Load" "Verb|Load", where everything up to an including the '|' is stripped), might be worth a mention too. Even though with the support of special contest fields in gettext, hopefully we will soon be rid of these kind of constructs. Regards Kenneth Nielsen -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
Hi,
Il giorno ven, 22/08/2008 alle 17.10 +0100, Matthew Revell ha scritto:
> Thanks everyone for your insightful contributions. I'm pleased to say
> that, with your help, I've written a new page on the help wiki:
>
> https://help.launchpad.net/Translations/StartingToTranslate
Wonderful work!
Just some quick notes:
- The description of the second screenshot ("Russian translation
progress of Ubuntu packages") is wrong... the screenshot says
"Esperanto"
- There's a sentence before the "Dealing with unusual characters"
setion that looks truncated:
"If you find a string that hasn't been translated or that you are
certain has been translated incorrectly, you should "
- Is it possibile to add, at the beginnig when explaining how to find
the team to speak to, that, if a project does not have a translation
group associated, it's always good to keep in touch with Ubuntu's
translation groups, that most of the time act as a counterpart of the
upstream translation groups? (And maybe link to the groups page [1] in
LP.)
- Typos for "shortcut", in two places there's written "shorcut"
> We're planning to link to that from the UI. However, this is just the
> beginning: I'd love your help with:
>
> * refining the help wiki document
> * refining the text in the Translations UI itself
> * coming up with parts of the Translations UI that require further
> explanation and could benefit from some pop-up help in the UI itself.
Not part of the UI itself, but probably useful to talk about: how
launchpad handle thinks like new-lines (\n), tabs and the "blue-points"
representation for spaces and what you're supposed to do (it's written
in the UI, but better say it twice...).
Cheers.
PS: BTW, there's a really nice feature in moinmoin 1.7 for notes,
warnings and so on: http://moinmo.in/HelpOnAdmonitions
[1] https://translations.launchpad.net/+groups/ubuntu-translators
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Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
2008/8/18 Matthew Revell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > What information do you think is most important for new translators to > know before they get started? Thanks everyone for your insightful contributions. I'm pleased to say that, with your help, I've written a new page on the help wiki: https://help.launchpad.net/Translations/StartingToTranslate We're planning to link to that from the UI. However, this is just the beginning: I'd love your help with: * refining the help wiki document * refining the text in the Translations UI itself * coming up with parts of the Translations UI that require further explanation and could benefit from some pop-up help in the UI itself. The help wiki document arises from bug number 7 (https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad-documentation/+bug/7), just in case you're interested :) Thanks again! -- Matthew Revell - Launchpad.net - free software collaboration and project hosting -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
Hi, Il giorno mar, 19/08/2008 alle 07.43 -0400, Og Maciel ha scritto: > One could > argue that those who figure out how to get past this "barrier" are the > "type" of volunteers you'd want in your team (i.e. they've shown the > motivation and perseverance, etc), but I feel that this information > should be made easier to get to somehow. I agree with you, but it's not that easy. I think that information inside h.l.n should be as general as possibile, all the processes of the loco-translators-team should be kept within the resources of the locoteam. h.l.n should probably give newcomers a page with links to launchpad pages of the translator groups where, hopefully, the team should have set up some more specific information, and h.l.n should suggest getting involved with the team and to follow their guidelines. As for the Italian team we too have information scattered here and there, but this is necessary as there are many places people can look into, coming from different paths. We have pages in our local wiki, links in the launchpad page and even a page "Contribuire" [1] (that's translated as "Contribute") in www.ubuntu-it.org with links and instructions on how to get in touch with the team (and also all other Italian teams). We have a local IRC channel for translators; a direct email to keep in touch with the team without having to subscribe to the mailing list, but we decided not to have a board in our forum (as it's a time consuming work keeping the board up and clean and it would have been another thing to look after). As for the "process" to accept new translators, it's more ore less similar to what you've described for your team. We should use more the IRC channel for new translators (and this is something that I'm starting doing in this period). For the actual work, we don't really assign a package/translation to one translator... as Launchpad is collaborative, we try to keep it as free as possibile. The only thing we ask is, "if you want to translate for Kubuntu, please, don't translate even for Ubuntu as KDE and GNOME, in Italy, have different conventions". In this case we really would appreciate the "grouping translations by environment". > It would be nice to hear from other teams leads what they do outside > of Rosetta to ensure that their teams run smoothly, so that we could > reach a common denominator and see if some of these "special" bits of > information can then be added to the UI somehow? Actually I don't know what kind of information could be added to the UI, and even if it's possible to add something without "breaking" the UI... this is something we should really start discussing here. Cheers! :) [1] http://www.ubuntu-it.org/index.php?page=contribuire -- Milo Casagrande <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> signature.asc Description: Questa è una parte del messaggio firmata digitalmente -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
Hi there, I have just read the entire thread (was away for the weekend) and I believe that the points brought up so far are very valid. However, there is another facet of the translation process via Rosetta that I also believe to be important to highlight. >From my own experience, it seems that during the course of translating Ubuntu's packages, different teams eventually come up with their own protocols and processes to ensure that the entire team is working towards the same goal without duplicating their efforts. The Brazilian team, for instance, made a special point of telling new volunteers about the process for being accepted into the team, which envolves an introductory email to the mailing list, and a buddy system where a more "seasoned" translator "adopts" a new volunteer and shows him the ropes. There is also information about standard vocabulary to use as well as a list of who's doing what. Unfortunately for many, this information can only be obtained if the volunteer takes the time to dig through the documentation in the wiki page we've built. One could argue that those who figure out how to get past this "barrier" are the "type" of volunteers you'd want in your team (i.e. they've shown the motivation and perseverance, etc), but I feel that this information should be made easier to get to somehow. It would be nice to hear from other teams leads what they do outside of Rosetta to ensure that their teams run smoothly, so that we could reach a common denominator and see if some of these "special" bits of information can then be added to the UI somehow? Cheers, -- Og B. Maciel [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG Keys: D5CFC202 http://www.ogmaciel.com (en_US) http://blog.ogmaciel.com (pt_BR) -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
Il giorno lun, 18/08/2008 alle 23.23 +0200, Kenneth Nielsen ha scritto: > Upstream/downstrean problematics. It is imperative to make new > translators aware that the packages the are interested in, perhaps are > mainly translated somewhere else and give them some hint about how to > find where. There's already something in h.l.n: https://help.launchpad.net/Translations/ almost at the end of the page. Anyway, I think that, if the document is as general as possibile, and not related to translation groups, but to new people approaching Launchpad for freely translate, this is not imperative: this is something that the translation groups must be aware of and they have to tell new people entering the group. The upstream/downstream thing is more related to the translation groups, if a project is freely translatable in Launchpad it does not apply that much. I'm completely with you when you say that they should be aware of the distinction, but this is something that, for me, has to be done mainly within the translation groups (in the Italian team I probably stress a lot about this and I always try to convince people going upstream and help there too). Bye! :) -- Milo Casagrande <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> signature.asc Description: Questa è una parte del messaggio firmata digitalmente -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
2008/8/18 Matthew Revell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Hello, > > I work on the Launchpad team looking after communications. I want to > add a page to the Launchpad help wiki (help.launchpad.net) that tells > novice translators what they need to do in order to start translating > in Launchpad. > > What information do you think is most important for new translators to > know before they get started? > > I'm hoping this will make life easier both for translation teams and > new translators. > > Cheers :) > Upstream/downstrean problematics. It is imperative to make new translators aware that the packages the are interested in, perhaps are mainly translated somewhere else and give them some hint about how to find where. Regards Kenneth Nielsen -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
Hi Matthew, Il giorno lun, 18/08/2008 alle 18.18 +0100, Matthew Revell ha scritto: > Hello, > > I work on the Launchpad team looking after communications. I want to > add a page to the Launchpad help wiki (help.launchpad.net) that tells > novice translators what they need to do in order to start translating > in Launchpad. > > What information do you think is most important for new translators to > know before they get started? As Rubén said, some basic information are needed, but for me, it depends where in the actual flow of the documentation the new page will be located. I think it would be useful also to have some sort of explanation about all the UI elements that you a translator can use like the drop-down list with all the viewing options (translated items, items with new suggestions...), what the "Located in..." string means and so on... It is important to talk about the format operator (%) and how you're supposed to change its position inside a string; the text "formatting" tags like , , saying that the text *inside* a tag must not be translated; the "accelerators"... For newcomers it will be useful to remember them about already existing translation groups and (how) to keep in touch with them. Probably talking about gettext is too advanced for new translators, as Launchpad tries to hide gettext magic from translators, but maybe there should be room for an "Advanced" section in this document or a document for advanced users where you can talk about: - gettext - po and mo file formats - how to upload a file, what it means "User upload" or "Published upload" and what happen when you select one or the other... Just some starting ideas... Bye! -- Milo Casagrande <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> signature.asc Description: Questa è una parte del messaggio firmata digitalmente -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
Hi, I think explanations about the HTML entities like & and XML tags found in translation strings are pretty important. Eyal. On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 20:31, Rubén Díaz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello, > > Luckily, Launchpad has one easy interface for the accomplishment of > the translations, so there is no much that to explain. So I think in > this *very basic* scheme: > > -> The obvious step: how to get an account, links to another article > talking about, etc. > > -> Information about Rosetta: not advanced but not short information. > What Rosetta does? What gettext means? It's free? Can I use it? And > important: the type of permissions. Next point... > > -> Start translating: localize the project url in Launchpad, and check > if the translation is being done by someone. As I mentioned before, we > need to explain about permissions and check if the project allow us to > provide "free translation" or we need something (join in a group, for > example). Obviously, we need to say also that the user need to select > the languages where he has knowledge. We remember him also the strings > that need review are important. > > -> Ways to stay in touch with the rest: mailing lists, IRC, etc. > > Okay, probably I forgot something but can be something for start the > page. I hope this helps. > > Cheers, > Rubén > > On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 7:18 PM, Matthew Revell > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hello, > > > > I work on the Launchpad team looking after communications. I want to > > add a page to the Launchpad help wiki (help.launchpad.net) that tells > > novice translators what they need to do in order to start translating > > in Launchpad. > > > > What information do you think is most important for new translators to > > know before they get started? > > > > I'm hoping this will make life easier both for translation teams and > > new translators. > > > > Cheers :) > > > > -- > > Matthew Revell - Launchpad.net - free software collaboration and project > hosting > > > > -- > > ubuntu-translators mailing list > > ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com > > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators > > > > > > -- > Rubén Díaz > GPG id 2354DA5F > http://diazr.com > > -- > ubuntu-translators mailing list > ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators > -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Re: Launchpad: Help for new translators
Hello, Luckily, Launchpad has one easy interface for the accomplishment of the translations, so there is no much that to explain. So I think in this *very basic* scheme: -> The obvious step: how to get an account, links to another article talking about, etc. -> Information about Rosetta: not advanced but not short information. What Rosetta does? What gettext means? It's free? Can I use it? And important: the type of permissions. Next point... -> Start translating: localize the project url in Launchpad, and check if the translation is being done by someone. As I mentioned before, we need to explain about permissions and check if the project allow us to provide "free translation" or we need something (join in a group, for example). Obviously, we need to say also that the user need to select the languages where he has knowledge. We remember him also the strings that need review are important. -> Ways to stay in touch with the rest: mailing lists, IRC, etc. Okay, probably I forgot something but can be something for start the page. I hope this helps. Cheers, Rubén On Mon, Aug 18, 2008 at 7:18 PM, Matthew Revell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello, > > I work on the Launchpad team looking after communications. I want to > add a page to the Launchpad help wiki (help.launchpad.net) that tells > novice translators what they need to do in order to start translating > in Launchpad. > > What information do you think is most important for new translators to > know before they get started? > > I'm hoping this will make life easier both for translation teams and > new translators. > > Cheers :) > > -- > Matthew Revell - Launchpad.net - free software collaboration and project > hosting > > -- > ubuntu-translators mailing list > ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators > -- Rubén Díaz GPG id 2354DA5F http://diazr.com -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
Launchpad: Help for new translators
Hello, I work on the Launchpad team looking after communications. I want to add a page to the Launchpad help wiki (help.launchpad.net) that tells novice translators what they need to do in order to start translating in Launchpad. What information do you think is most important for new translators to know before they get started? I'm hoping this will make life easier both for translation teams and new translators. Cheers :) -- Matthew Revell - Launchpad.net - free software collaboration and project hosting -- ubuntu-translators mailing list ubuntu-translators@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators
