Re: [Vo]:LENR, THERMODYNAMICS + ! GRAIN OF SALT
Axil Axil wrote: One of the cornerstone assumptions that underpin the understanding of LENR > is that the fundamental forces of nature are not really fundamental but > emergent from more basic structures of reality. > That is not "the" cornerstone assumption. It is *your* cornerstone assumption. I do not know anyone else who thinks so. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:LENR, THERMODYNAMICS + ! GRAIN OF SALT
Peter Gluck wrote: > First thanks for coming with a new guru's teaching, the former one > (Joe Murray) has inspired you ideas as flow multiplier watermeters, > half empty pipes inside a plant . . . > He did not inspire that. A gravity return pipe of this size carrying only 3 gpm has to be mostly empty. This cannot be more than 3 gpm, because that is the upper limit of the pumps. The pipe at the flow meter is 3". Gravity return capacity for a 3" pipe is 130 gpm, and this is only 3 gpm, so obviously the pipe is mostly empty. See the gravity return column here: https://www.slideshare.net/raju175/water-flow-pipe-sizes The steam goes to the user plant where it is condensed . . . > It is hot water, not steam. Nothing is condensed. > The water goes to the famous flowmeter and on that point it must be at > least at 0.3 bars over atmospheric pressure, you know why!. > No, it has to be 1 atm. It is open to the air. You can see that from a photo. That is also why we know it is gravity return. > The in the reservoir which feeds the pumps of the E-Cats. > You are right that at pressure a bit higher than the atmospheric water > boils at say 104 C. There reverse is true and we have early used pressure > cookers that boils usually at 112C. > The reverse may be true, but this pressure is above 1 atm. The pressure gauge showing 0.0 bar was wrong. Therefore the boiling point was well over 100 deg C, and this was water, not steam. It could not have been 1 atm because the water would not have flowed. > Re the steam pipe, Smith is more generous than Murray who shrinked it to > 40mm, he says it is 4.5inches- the pipe is actually 6 inches. > Penon said it was 1.5". If it were 2 feet in diameter that would make no difference. It was still hot water. Penon is not a reliable source of information so perhaps it was 4.5" or 6". - Jed
Re: [Vo]:LENR, THERMODYNAMICS + ! GRAIN OF SALT
Jed, First thanks for coming with a new guru's teaching, the former one (Joe Murray) has inspired you ideas as flow multiplier watermeters, half empty pipes inside a plant, a 40mm steam pipe and clairvoyant witnesses all informing you to know that the watermeter is qudrupling the flow values. You do not have more luck with this Mr. Smith yes both the steam at outlet and the reservoir are at atmospheric pressure just underway many things and pressures happen. The steam goes to the user plant where it is condensed and, being given that the density of steam is some 0.6 kg/cu.m while water is almost 1000kg/m- a lot of "negative" pressure - the necessaryy pressure difference.appears. The water goes to the famous flowmeter and on that point it must be at least at 0.3 bars over atmospheric pressure, you know why!.The in the reservoir which feeds the pumps of the E-Cats. You are right that at pressure a bit higher than the atmospheric water boils at say 104 C. There reverse is true and we have early used pressure cookers that boils usually at 112C. JUST this has nothing to do with the case, 0 over the atmospheric pressure means OPEN for condensation. Re the steam pipe, Smith is more generous than Murray who shrinked it to 40mm, he says it is 4.5inches- the pipe is actually 6 inches. If you want to read a laudatio of your techno-guru 'perhaps what D.T. wrote tioday at Rossi's JONP would be OK for you. Peter On Fri, Apr 7, 2017 at 11:20 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: > In Gluck's blog, he wrote: > > "A recent example is expert Rick Smith using them in order to demonstrate > that the 1MW plant of Andrea Rossi has circulated water not steam and the > steam - if formed could not be superheated- so he ignored one critical > detail - that the fluid had a temperature of 103-104 C at atmospheric > pressure . . ." > > It cannot be at atmospheric pressure. The reservoir is open to the air, so > it is definitely at atmospheric pressure. The pressure gauge is located > just downstream of the reactors, outside of the customer site. If both > locations are at atmospheric pressure, no steam (or water) can flow from > the reactor back to the reservoir. That is impossible. There *has to be* > a pressure difference, as Smith explained. > > Therefore, the pressure gauge reading of 1 atmosphere must be wrong. (I > assume it was supposed to be 0.0 barg, not bar -- which would be a vacuum. > Either way, it is impossible.) > > The pressure must be higher than 1 atm. When it is just a little higher, > the water will not boil at 103-104°C. > > This is elementary thermodynamics. > > See: > > EXPERT REPORT OF RICK A. SMITH, P.E., Document 235-1 > > SUPPLEMENTAL EXPERT REPORT OF RICK A. SMITH, P.E., Document 235-10 > > The Effects of Pressure on Boiling Point Temperatures > > http://coldfusioncommunity.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/ > 01/0235.01_Exhibit_1.pdf > > http://coldfusioncommunity.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/ > 01/0235.10_Exhibit_10.pdf > > https://durathermfluids.com/pdf/techpapers/pressure-boiling-point.pdf > > - Jed > > -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
Re: [Vo]:LENR, THERMODYNAMICS + ! GRAIN OF SALT
One of the cornerstone assumptions that underpin the understanding of LENR is that the fundamental forces of nature are not really fundamental but emergent from more basic structures of reality. Because the strong and the weak force depend on other more fundamental aspects of reality, if those more basic aspects change, so can the way that these forces of nature that depend on these aspects can be made to change. This realization that the forces of nature can change when the causation changes is what understanding LENR is all about. If one of these forces is shown to emerge from the basic structure of the universe, then the other forces are also likely to emerge in the same way. In this light, the work of Erik Verlinde explains in a new video, his alternative theory about gravity. Verlinde presents gravity as an emergent phenomenon. This means that at the very smallest scale gravity does not exist. It is a consequence of the distribution of information in the universe, which manifests at a larger scale. Abstract by Erik Verlinde: Logically speaking the observed deviations from the laws of gravity of Newton and Einstein in galaxies and clusters can be either due to the presence of unseen dark matter particles or due to a change in the way gravity works in these situations. Until recently there appeared to be no reason to doubt that general relativity correctly describes gravity in all circumstances. In the last few year insights from black hole physics and string theory have led to important theoretical advances in our understanding of gravity. A new theoretical framework is being developed in which the gravitational laws are derived as emerging from changes in the quantum entanglement of the microscopic information that is underlying space-time. I will make clear that this new theory of emergent gravity provides a conceptual explanation for why general relativity receives modifications in galaxies and clusters. I will present a quantitative estimate of these modifications and show that these agree with the observed phenomena currently attributed to dark matter. In like fashion, the strong and the weak force might also be derived as emerging from changes in the quantum entanglement of the microscopic information that is underlying space-time. For more information, see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25IyrYltPPI On Fri, Apr 7, 2017 at 2:41 PM, Peter Gluck wrote: > http://egooutpeters.blogspot.ro/2017/04/apr-7-2017-lenr- > and-thermodynamics-1.html > > > peter > -- > Dr. Peter Gluck > Cluj, Romania > http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com >
Re: [Vo]:LENR, THERMODYNAMICS + ! GRAIN OF SALT
In Gluck's blog, he wrote: "A recent example is expert Rick Smith using them in order to demonstrate that the 1MW plant of Andrea Rossi has circulated water not steam and the steam - if formed could not be superheated- so he ignored one critical detail - that the fluid had a temperature of 103-104 C at atmospheric pressure . . ." It cannot be at atmospheric pressure. The reservoir is open to the air, so it is definitely at atmospheric pressure. The pressure gauge is located just downstream of the reactors, outside of the customer site. If both locations are at atmospheric pressure, no steam (or water) can flow from the reactor back to the reservoir. That is impossible. There *has to be* a pressure difference, as Smith explained. Therefore, the pressure gauge reading of 1 atmosphere must be wrong. (I assume it was supposed to be 0.0 barg, not bar -- which would be a vacuum. Either way, it is impossible.) The pressure must be higher than 1 atm. When it is just a little higher, the water will not boil at 103-104°C. This is elementary thermodynamics. See: EXPERT REPORT OF RICK A. SMITH, P.E., Document 235-1 SUPPLEMENTAL EXPERT REPORT OF RICK A. SMITH, P.E., Document 235-10 The Effects of Pressure on Boiling Point Temperatures http://coldfusioncommunity.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/0235.01_Exhibit_1.pdf http://coldfusioncommunity.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/0235.10_Exhibit_10.pdf https://durathermfluids.com/pdf/techpapers/pressure-boiling-point.pdf - Jed
[Vo]:LENR, THERMODYNAMICS + ! GRAIN OF SALT
http://egooutpeters.blogspot.ro/2017/04/apr-7-2017-lenr-and-thermodynamics-1.html peter -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com