[Wikimediauk-l] UK press corps - do we have editors on hand?

[David Gerard]

I suspect we need to build up the UK press corps again. The call comes
maybe every 1-2 years, but when it happens we need people. So if you see an
email come by, you can *SPRING* into action and represent editors on the
BBC ...

Last night's Newsnight didnt happen, because the Daily Mail bottled it.
Possibly because Alastair Campbell offered to speak up on our behalf, ahem.
I'm regretting I couldn't make it now ...

So! Who thinks they could do well off the cuff about the view of Wikipedia
editors? I think Lucy would like all your names :-)


- d.
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[Wikimediauk-l] The Chaterhouse.

[Gordon Joly]

FYI,

http://www.thecharterhouse.org/

A new museum in London. In partnership with the Museum of London.

Gordo

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] BBC Newsnight want to do Daily Mail vs WP:RS tonight - editor on hand?

[Chris Keating]

Wait, what? Until 2014 the Mail was including material that was solely
sourced to Wikipedia??

Seriously???

On Fri, Feb 10, 2017 at 9:53 AM, Gordon Joly  wrote:

>
>
>
> **
> A spokesman for Mail Newspapers said: “It is hard to know whether to
> laugh or cry at this move by Wikipedia. For the record the Daily Mail
> banned all its journalists from using Wikipedia as a sole source in 2014
> because of its unreliability.
>
> **
>
> Source: Guardian Online.
>
> https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/08/
> wikipedia-bans-daily-mail-as-unreliable-source-for-website
>
> Gordo
>
>
>
>
> ___
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Wikimediauk-l Digest, Vol 139, Issue 17

[Jon Davies]

cy Crompton-Reid 
> To: UK Wikimedia mailing list 
> Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] BBC Newsnight want to do Daily Mail vs
> WP:RS tonight - editor on hand?
> Message-ID:
>  zvuxwayrv...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Well they certainly weren't laughing when they spoke to me...although I was
> nearly crying by the end of the call!
>
> On 10 February 2017 at 09:53, Gordon Joly  wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >
> > **
> > A spokesman for Mail Newspapers said: “It is hard to know whether to
> > laugh or cry at this move by Wikipedia. For the record the Daily Mail
> > banned all its journalists from using Wikipedia as a sole source in 2014
> > because of its unreliability.
> >
> > **
> >
> > Source: Guardian Online.
> >
> > https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/08/
> > wikipedia-bans-daily-mail-as-unreliable-source-for-website
> >
> > Gordo
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Wikimedia UK mailing list
> > wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
> > WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Lucy Crompton-Reid
>
> Chief Executive
>
> Wikimedia UK
>
> +44 (0) 207 065 0991
>
>
>
> Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
> Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
> Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
>
> Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia movement. The
> Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who operate
> Wikipedia, amongst other projects). *Wikimedia UK is an independent
> non-profit charity with no legal control over Wikipedia nor responsibility
> for its contents.*
> -- next part --
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimediauk-l/
> attachments/20170210/92756314/attachment-0001.html>
>
> --
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2017 10:06:23 +
> From: John Lubbock 
> To: UK Wikimedia mailing list 
> Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Digitisaton of East India Company/ India
> Office  records
> Message-ID:
>  tatwauxnntu...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hello WhereDevilsDare! I would love to discuss this with you and any other
> Wikimedians in the UK who might be interested.
>
> Regards,
>
> John Lubbock
> Communications Coordinator
> Wikimedia UK
>
> On 9 February 2017 at 04:17, Where Devels Dare <
> wheredevelsd...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I am an inactive volunteer (at present and been so for a while now),
> > chanced upon this thread. In the past one of the projects I worked upon
> and
> > was hoping would see light of day, some day, was release of thousands of
> > India related images by the British Library under a free license. These
> > images are part of our Indian national heritage and are of educational
> and
> > cultural importance. They are from the 17th to the 20th century and
> include
> > oil paintings, murals, portraits, photographs etc.
> >
> >
> > In 2014 I was in London for Wikimania, with the help of Jon Davies (then
> > ED), Jonathan Cardy and Andrew Gray we had a meeting at BL and there was
> a
> > serious effort to make this a reality but it was just about the time
> other
> > things took precedence in personally for me and Wikimedia went on the
> > back-burner. I attempted to revive talks on my visit to London last
> summer,
> > in vein.
> >
> >
> > If anyone is willing to take this up, I would be most happy to share all
> > the correspondence and minutes of meetings from the past (offlist) as
> well
> > as try to put them in touch with BL (though WMUK might be better at the
> > latter) and try to help out where possible, though I have severe time
> > constraints which would prevent me from playing an active part in such an
> > attempt.
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> > --
> > *From:* Wikimediauk-l  on
> > behalf of John Lubbock 
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 8, 2017 1:57:12 PM
> > *To:* Charles Matthews; UK Wikimedia mailing list
> > *Subject:* Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Digitisaton of East India Company/ India
> > Office records
> >
> > If you have ideas Charles, I'm very happy 

Re: [Wikimediauk-l] BBC Newsnight want to do Daily Mail vs WP:RS tonight - editor on hand?

[John Lubbock]

The irony is that the Mail fails to understand that they are in line with
Wikipedia's own policy, which states that it does not use other Wikipedia
pages as a source:

‘Wikipedia articles (and Wikipedia mirrors) are not reliable sources for
any purpose (except as sources on themselves per WP:SELFSOURCE
). Because Wikipedia
forbids original research, there is nothing reliable in it that is not
citable with something else.’

So yeah, we don't use Wikipedia as a 'sole source' either, because it's not
a primary or secondary source.

John

On 10 February 2017 at 09:58, Lucy Crompton-Reid <
lucy.crompton-r...@wikimedia.org.uk> wrote:

> Well they certainly weren't laughing when they spoke to me...although I
> was nearly crying by the end of the call!
>
> On 10 February 2017 at 09:53, Gordon Joly  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> **
>> A spokesman for Mail Newspapers said: “It is hard to know whether to
>> laugh or cry at this move by Wikipedia. For the record the Daily Mail
>> banned all its journalists from using Wikipedia as a sole source in 2014
>> because of its unreliability.
>>
>> **
>>
>> Source: Guardian Online.
>>
>> https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/08/wikipedia
>> -bans-daily-mail-as-unreliable-source-for-website
>>
>> Gordo
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Wikimedia UK mailing list
>> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
>> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Lucy Crompton-Reid
>
> Chief Executive
>
> Wikimedia UK
>
> +44 (0) 207 065 0991
>
>
>
> Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
> Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
> Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
>
> Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia movement. The
> Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who operate
> Wikipedia, amongst other projects). *Wikimedia UK is an independent
> non-profit charity with no legal control over Wikipedia nor responsibility
> for its contents.*
>
> ___
> Wikimedia UK mailing list
> wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
> WMUK: https://wikimedia.org.uk
>
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Digitisaton of East India Company/ India Office records

[John Lubbock]

Hello WhereDevilsDare! I would love to discuss this with you and any other
Wikimedians in the UK who might be interested.

Regards,

John Lubbock
Communications Coordinator
Wikimedia UK

On 9 February 2017 at 04:17, Where Devels Dare 
wrote:

> I am an inactive volunteer (at present and been so for a while now),
> chanced upon this thread. In the past one of the projects I worked upon and
> was hoping would see light of day, some day, was release of thousands of
> India related images by the British Library under a free license. These
> images are part of our Indian national heritage and are of educational and
> cultural importance. They are from the 17th to the 20th century and include
> oil paintings, murals, portraits, photographs etc.
>
>
> In 2014 I was in London for Wikimania, with the help of Jon Davies (then
> ED), Jonathan Cardy and Andrew Gray we had a meeting at BL and there was a
> serious effort to make this a reality but it was just about the time other
> things took precedence in personally for me and Wikimedia went on the
> back-burner. I attempted to revive talks on my visit to London last summer,
> in vein.
>
>
> If anyone is willing to take this up, I would be most happy to share all
> the correspondence and minutes of meetings from the past (offlist) as well
> as try to put them in touch with BL (though WMUK might be better at the
> latter) and try to help out where possible, though I have severe time
> constraints which would prevent me from playing an active part in such an
> attempt.
>
>
> Regards,
> --
> *From:* Wikimediauk-l  on
> behalf of John Lubbock 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 8, 2017 1:57:12 PM
> *To:* Charles Matthews; UK Wikimedia mailing list
> *Subject:* Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Digitisaton of East India Company/ India
> Office records
>
> If you have ideas Charles, I'm very happy to hear them. I just don't know
> what our connections with the Indian diaspora in the UK are right now and
> whether they'd be interested in doing something on these records, rather
> than preferring something on their own culture. You're welcome to propose
> ideas and to suggest people we might work with. I'm all ears. :)
>
> John
>
> On 8 February 2017 at 13:52, Charles Matthews <
> charles.r.matth...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> On 08 February 2017 at 12:46 John Lubbock 
>> wrote:
>>
>> There's quite a lot of interest in this subject also because of the BBC
>> series Taboo, which paints the East India Company in a pretty bad light
>> that is quite believable given what is known about them
>>
>> I think Taboo is great, at a graphic novel sort of level. People should
>> know, though, that the East India Company was run by a board of 25
>> directors, rather than Jonathan Pryce doing a lot of swearing.
>>
>> Among interesting employees were John Stuart Mill, and Thomas Love
>> Peacock.
>>
>> If anybody wants a somewhat long but illuminating read on them, I'd very
>> much suggest the historian William Dalrymple's piece in the Graun
>> 
>> from a couple of years ago.
>>
>> I don't know that Dalrymple is taken seriously as a historian. I recently
>> enjoyed In the Footsteps of Stamford Raffles, by Nigel Barley, which
>> complements Taboo in its own way.
>>
>>
>> Personally, I do think that if possible we should look at the possibility
>> of bringing this collection onto Wikimedia projects, but I don't think it
>> would be an appropriate project for trying to work with the Indian
>> Wikimedia chapter or with the Indian diaspora here. I do think we should
>> look at how we could do that in future with subject matter which is less
>> contentious though.
>>
>> For heavens sake, WP has the mechanisms for dealing with contentious
>> subjects. Communications being what they were, until the invention of the
>> telegraph, there was a big disjunction between what the Company could get
>> done from London; and what actually went on in South and East Asia. And
>> what UCL are working on for the West Indies, someone should attempt for the
>> East Indies.
>>
>> Charles
>>
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>>
>
>
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] BBC Newsnight want to do Daily Mail vs WP:RS tonight - editor on hand?

[Lucy Crompton-Reid]

Well they certainly weren't laughing when they spoke to me...although I was
nearly crying by the end of the call!

On 10 February 2017 at 09:53, Gordon Joly  wrote:

>
>
>
> **
> A spokesman for Mail Newspapers said: “It is hard to know whether to
> laugh or cry at this move by Wikipedia. For the record the Daily Mail
> banned all its journalists from using Wikipedia as a sole source in 2014
> because of its unreliability.
>
> **
>
> Source: Guardian Online.
>
> https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/08/
> wikipedia-bans-daily-mail-as-unreliable-source-for-website
>
> Gordo
>
>
>
>
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-- 

Lucy Crompton-Reid

Chief Executive

Wikimedia UK

+44 (0) 207 065 0991



Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.

Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia movement. The
Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who operate
Wikipedia, amongst other projects). *Wikimedia UK is an independent
non-profit charity with no legal control over Wikipedia nor responsibility
for its contents.*
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] BBC Newsnight want to do Daily Mail vs WP:RS tonight - editor on hand?

[Gordon Joly]

**
A spokesman for Mail Newspapers said: “It is hard to know whether to
laugh or cry at this move by Wikipedia. For the record the Daily Mail
banned all its journalists from using Wikipedia as a sole source in 2014
because of its unreliability.

**

Source: Guardian Online.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/08/wikipedia-bans-daily-mail-as-unreliable-source-for-website

Gordo




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