Re[2]: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
Hello Lori, Friday, July 28, 2006, 6:50:55 PM, you wrote: >>> Right now I have such configurations and have been using smpatch >>> without any problems so far. >> >> I thought I read somewhere (zones guide?) that putting the zone root fs >> on zfs was unsupported. LA> You've missed the earlier part of this thread. Yes, it's LA> unsupported, but the question was asked "Does it work anyway?" LA> and the short answer is "yes, it mostly does, but there LA> are enough complications and known problems with the LA> patching and upgrade of this configuration that it LA> is currently unsupported." Not that much problems actually. If you are not going to use Live Upgrade and you put only zone's root-fs on a ZFS and do not create another ZFS filesystems for zone's /var, /opt, /usr, etc. then you shouldn't be affected. In such a config smpatch/updatemanager just work. -- Best regards, Robertmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://milek.blogspot.com ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
Right now I have such configurations and have been using smpatch without any problems so far. I thought I read somewhere (zones guide?) that putting the zone root fs on zfs was unsupported. You've missed the earlier part of this thread. Yes, it's unsupported, but the question was asked "Does it work anyway?" and the short answer is "yes, it mostly does, but there are enough complications and known problems with the patching and upgrade of this configuration that it is currently unsupported." Lori ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: Re[2]: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
On July 28, 2006 11:42:28 AM +0200 Robert Milkowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hello Matty, Thursday, July 27, 2006, 7:53:34 PM, you wrote: M> Are there any known issues with patching zones that are installed on a ZFS M> file system? Does smpatch and company work ok with this configuration? Right now I have such configurations and have been using smpatch without any problems so far. I thought I read somewhere (zones guide?) that putting the zone root fs on zfs was unsupported. -frank ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re[2]: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
Hello Matty, Thursday, July 27, 2006, 7:53:34 PM, you wrote: M> Are there any known issues with patching zones that are installed on a ZFS M> file system? Does smpatch and company work ok with this configuration? Right now I have such configurations and have been using smpatch without any problems so far. -- Best regards, Robertmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://milek.blogspot.com ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
Eric Schrock wrote: Upon closer inspection, we found that this scenario should work with the current upgrade solution. What will definitely not work is to delegate a ZFS dataset to a local zone, and then place system software (i.e. Solaris package contents) within such a filesystem. This should work if the mountpoint is set to 'legacy', however. Actually, if you try that, I think this bug will break you when you try to patch or upgrade. 6412875 zoneadm mount does not mount filesystems in vfstab Jerry ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
Matty wrote: On Thu, 27 Jul 2006, Eric Schrock wrote: The original reasoning was that we didn't have enough time to validate the behavior of the zone upgrade tools with ZFS as the root filesystem, particularly as these tools (Ashanti, Zulu) are a moving target. Upon closer inspection, we found that this scenario should work with the current upgrade solution. What will definitely not work is to delegate a ZFS dataset to a local zone, and then place system software (i.e. Solaris package contents) within such a filesystem. This should work if the mountpoint is set to 'legacy', however. Basically, rather than trying to explain the ins and out of the current situation (which aren't entirely understood in the context of future zones upgrade solutions), we opted to declare this as 'unsupported'. In reality, putting zone roots on ZFS datasets should be perfectly safe (modulo the caveat above). However, we reserve the right to break upgrade in the face of such zones. We are working on integrating ZFS more closely with the whole install and live upgrade experience. Part of this work will include making zones upgrade behave well regardless of ZFS configuration. The current install/upgrade process has a long history of preconceived notions that don't apply in the ZFS work (such as a 1-1 relationship between devices and filesystems, /etc/vfstab, legacy mountpoints, etc), so this is no small task. Are there any known issues with patching zones that are installed on a ZFS file system? Does smpatch and company work ok with this configuration? They might work, but as Eric said, the configuration isn't supported at this time because there hasn't been adequate testing and we know that there can be complications with delegated datasets. Also, even leaving aside the issue of delegated datasets, the install code (which include patchadd and pkgadd) has assumptions that can cause patch problems with zone roots under some circumstances. The main one that I know about is the matter of space checking. The install code currently doesn't understand pooled storage. If you have ten datasets in a pool with 10 GB of available space, a "df" on each dataset will report 10 GB of available space (yes, there are ways to modify this with reservations and quotas, but let's leave that aside for now). But you can't allocate 10 GB in EACH dataset. The install code will assume that 10 additional GB of contents can be allocated in each dataset because it doesn't understand that the free space is coming out of a common pool. So the install/patching code might think there's adequate space for an upgrade when there really isn't. So until the install code is made zfs-aware (which is related to the issue of bootable zfs, but not limited to it), zone roots in zfs datasets is an unsupported configuration. It's tantalizing, however, because it would often work quite well. Maybe it's worth some kind of solution short of full zfs boot support. Something to consider However, given the timing of full zones upgrade support (independent of zfs), it may all have to come out at the same time anyway. Lori ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
On Thu, 27 Jul 2006, Eric Schrock wrote: The original reasoning was that we didn't have enough time to validate the behavior of the zone upgrade tools with ZFS as the root filesystem, particularly as these tools (Ashanti, Zulu) are a moving target. Upon closer inspection, we found that this scenario should work with the current upgrade solution. What will definitely not work is to delegate a ZFS dataset to a local zone, and then place system software (i.e. Solaris package contents) within such a filesystem. This should work if the mountpoint is set to 'legacy', however. Basically, rather than trying to explain the ins and out of the current situation (which aren't entirely understood in the context of future zones upgrade solutions), we opted to declare this as 'unsupported'. In reality, putting zone roots on ZFS datasets should be perfectly safe (modulo the caveat above). However, we reserve the right to break upgrade in the face of such zones. We are working on integrating ZFS more closely with the whole install and live upgrade experience. Part of this work will include making zones upgrade behave well regardless of ZFS configuration. The current install/upgrade process has a long history of preconceived notions that don't apply in the ZFS work (such as a 1-1 relationship between devices and filesystems, /etc/vfstab, legacy mountpoints, etc), so this is no small task. Are there any known issues with patching zones that are installed on a ZFS file system? Does smpatch and company work ok with this configuration? Thanks, - Ryan -- UNIX Administrator http://prefetch.net ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
The original reasoning was that we didn't have enough time to validate the behavior of the zone upgrade tools with ZFS as the root filesystem, particularly as these tools (Ashanti, Zulu) are a moving target. Upon closer inspection, we found that this scenario should work with the current upgrade solution. What will definitely not work is to delegate a ZFS dataset to a local zone, and then place system software (i.e. Solaris package contents) within such a filesystem. This should work if the mountpoint is set to 'legacy', however. Basically, rather than trying to explain the ins and out of the current situation (which aren't entirely understood in the context of future zones upgrade solutions), we opted to declare this as 'unsupported'. In reality, putting zone roots on ZFS datasets should be perfectly safe (modulo the caveat above). However, we reserve the right to break upgrade in the face of such zones. We are working on integrating ZFS more closely with the whole install and live upgrade experience. Part of this work will include making zones upgrade behave well regardless of ZFS configuration. The current install/upgrade process has a long history of preconceived notions that don't apply in the ZFS work (such as a 1-1 relationship between devices and filesystems, /etc/vfstab, legacy mountpoints, etc), so this is no small task. Hope that helps, - Eric On Thu, Jul 27, 2006 at 10:05:53AM -0700, Rich Teer wrote: > I saw this question over in zones-discuss and thought the ZFS > team could add something useful. If I read the caution right, > I'll have to re-think my disk allocation strategy... > > -- > Rich Teer, SCNA, SCSA, OpenSolaris CAB member > > President, > Rite Online Inc. > > Voice: +1 (250) 979-1638 > URL: http://www.rite-group.com/rich > > -- Forwarded message -- > Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 16:31:04 +0200 > From: Detlef Drewanz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: zones-discuss@opensolaris.org > Subject: [zones-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? > > In > http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-1592/6mhahuous?a=view > > is this statement: > Solaris 10 6/06: Do Not Place the Root File System of a > Non-Global Zone on ZFS > > The zonepath of a non-global zone should not reside on ZFS > for this release. This action might result in patching > problems and possibly prevent the system from being upgraded > to a later Solaris 10 update release. > > > Does anyone know the background for this ? > > Thanks > -- > Detlef Drewanz OS Ambassador > Sun Microsystems GmbH Phone: (+49 30) 747096 856 > Komturstrasse 18a Fax: (+49 30) 747096 878 > D-12099 Berlin mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://blogs.sun.com/solarium > ___ > zones-discuss mailing list > zones-discuss@opensolaris.org > ___ > zfs-discuss mailing list > zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org > http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss -- Eric Schrock, Solaris Kernel Development http://blogs.sun.com/eschrock ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
[zfs-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? (fwd)
I saw this question over in zones-discuss and thought the ZFS team could add something useful. If I read the caution right, I'll have to re-think my disk allocation strategy... -- Rich Teer, SCNA, SCSA, OpenSolaris CAB member President, Rite Online Inc. Voice: +1 (250) 979-1638 URL: http://www.rite-group.com/rich -- Forwarded message -- Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 16:31:04 +0200 From: Detlef Drewanz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: zones-discuss@opensolaris.org Subject: [zones-discuss] Zones root-fs in ZFS ? In http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/817-1592/6mhahuous?a=view is this statement: Solaris 10 6/06: Do Not Place the Root File System of a Non-Global Zone on ZFS The zonepath of a non-global zone should not reside on ZFS for this release. This action might result in patching problems and possibly prevent the system from being upgraded to a later Solaris 10 update release. Does anyone know the background for this ? Thanks -- Detlef Drewanz OS Ambassador Sun Microsystems GmbH Phone: (+49 30) 747096 856 Komturstrasse 18a Fax: (+49 30) 747096 878 D-12099 Berlin mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://blogs.sun.com/solarium ___ zones-discuss mailing list zones-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
