Hi folks,
maybe this is a very stupid question or just a very naive one, but I
assure you that it is in good faith. Is this decision a surprise for
anybody?
Me, I've been seriously asking myself since september 28, every time I
saw some of the TDF founders posting around with an @openoffice.org
a
In data 17 ottobre 2010 alle ore 16:42:58, M. Fioretti
ha scritto:
I'm not defending sun/oracle. But I'm reading surprised reactions and
I really don't understand how there could have been any surprise. AM I
missing something ?
As far as the attitude of Oracle concerns, I'm not surprised at
Hi Marco, *
M. Fioretti schrieb:
Hi folks,
maybe this is a very stupid question or just a very naive one, but I
assure you that it is in good faith. Is this decision a surprise for
anybody?
Me, I've been seriously asking myself since september 28, every time I
saw some of the TDF founders post
M. Fioretti wrote:
> What TDF did is basically "we can't tolerate what Sun and then Oracle
> did, so we are now finally doing things as they ought to be".
I think that here there is a basic misunderstanding.
We have said that we thank Sun and Oracle for what they did so far, but
we see a brighte
On 17/10/10 16:20, Bernhard Dippold wrote:
Oracle is trademark holder and contributor of the main part of the
code for OpenOffice.org. But if they behave as owner of the community
public reaction will be even more non-ambiguous than now.
So what are the legal implications of all of this then
In data 17 ottobre 2010 alle ore 18:32:33, AG
ha scritto:
So what are the legal implications of all of this then? If Oracle now
own the code base, are we likely to see Oracle enact a version of SCO's
attempt to claim ownership of the GNU/Linux code base [1]
retrospectively, this time di
On Sun, Oct 17, 2010 at 6:21 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote:
...snip...
> It would be nice if our emails - mine was sent on Tuesday in response to
> my "resignment" decided by an Oracle employee - are answered in due time.
>
I think you mentioned the 'resignment' several times, however it is
good to e
Simos Xenitellis wrote:
> I think you mentioned the 'resignment' several times, however it is
> good to explain
> what actually happened. In English you would not use 'resignment'.
>
> 1. Did an Oracle employee 'sack' you? Did they tell you that you are
> now not part of the council anymore?
> 2.
On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 04:48:23 AM +0200, Ramon Sole
(ramon.s...@opscons.com) wrote:
> Both communities will be able to collaborate in tons of things, but
> the project leaders can't share responsabilities in both projects.
> If so, why to have two Communities? You can't fork a open source
> projec
> ... and above all their
> general opinion about what Ramon said and on how to handle the
> OOo/Oracle <-> LibO/TDF relation in the future.
>
Hello Mr. Fioretti,
It is my firm and deep belief that, given my experiences and
interactions, as limited as they may be in some cases, with all of those
On Monday 18 Oct 2010 16:58:40 M. Fioretti wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 04:48:23 AM +0200, Ramon Sole
>
> (ramon.s...@opscons.com) wrote:
> > Both communities will be able to collaborate in tons of things, but
> > the project leaders can't share responsabilities in both projects.
> > If so, why t
Hello all,
thank you for opening this thread. It is not in the intention of anyone
-I don't speak officially for the Foundation in this mail- to sit in
both projects. It would give a very bad signal, I think, a signal that
we either don't believe in LibO and that we want to occupy seats just
for t
On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 12:00:56 PM +0200, Charles-H. Schulz
(charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org) wrote:
> On the other hand, I and others do not tolerate being "fired" by
> Oracle. Resigning is one thing, being kicked out is another one.
> Resigning is a logical consequence of our actions that wi
Hello Marco,
Le Mon, 18 Oct 2010 12:58:14 +0200,
"M. Fioretti" a écrit :
> On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 12:00:56 PM +0200, Charles-H. Schulz
> (charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org) wrote:
>
> > On the other hand, I and others do not tolerate being "fired" by
> > Oracle. Resigning is one thing, being
> we
> don't acknowledge that our community is leaving (and yes, there are and
> will always be exceptions). That, to me, is a failure, it's a community
> "management" failure.
So I guess that puts Louis in a difficult position?
--
Ian
--
E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org for inst
The one thing that has always bugged me is.
How is it any different having LibreOffice and someone being in both
project, and the OracleOffice part. I mean are they not competing
projects. Would Oracle not prefer someone to go with there version of
OpenOffice.org and pay them for support on it.
Le Mon, 18 Oct 2010 12:29:37 +0100 (BST),
ian.ly...@theingots.org a écrit :
> > we
> > don't acknowledge that our community is leaving (and yes, there are
> > and will always be exceptions). That, to me, is a failure, it's a
> > community "management" failure.
>
> So I guess that puts Louis in a
On 2010-10-17 10:48 PM, Ramon Sole wrote:
> Both communities will be able to collaborate in tons of things, but the
> project leaders can't share responsabilities in both projects. If so,
> why to have two Communities?
I don't think this this is correct in the case of OOo - while it is of
course f
Ramon Sole wrote:
> I'm not talking about Charles, but i.e in the Spanish Communitiy the
> Project Leader has closed the subscription to the OOo spanish mailing
> lists with the label "Migrating lists to TDF", and you can only easily
> subscribe to the TDF lists. What would you do if you were in c
todd rme wrote:
> I agree we shouldn't do this, but who is doing so? There is no
> mention of "bad guys" in the mailing list, and a google search for
> "oracle bad guys" only returns some information about a movie and a
> page on comic books.
This clearly shows that we are acting properly, and t
Op 18-10-2010 14:09, James Walker schreef:
The one thing that has always bugged me is.
How is it any different having LibreOffice and someone being in both
project, and the OracleOffice part. I mean are they not competing
projects. Would Oracle not prefer someone to go with there version of
O
On 10/18/2010 01:52 PM, Italo Vignoli wrote:
This clearly shows that we are acting properly, and the people assuming
that we are calling or considering them "Oracle bad guys" are wrong.
I think it's a challenge for people not in the inner circle of the OOo
community (most of us) to differenti
+1. Right, there are other colors than black and white in the world.
Nevertheless, sometimes it's necessary to force a bit, to reach the targets.
And thanks, for all those have been working and work in the back/front
to push OOo ahead.
Miguel Ángel Ríos
On 18/10/10 21:32, Ramon Sole wrote:
> Hel
> On 18/10/10 21:32, Ramon Sole wrote:
>> Hello *,
>>
>> I'm not talking about Charles, but i.e in the Spanish Communitiy the
>> Project Leader has closed the subscription to the OOo spanish mailing
>> lists with the label "Migrating lists to TDF", and you can only easily
>> subscribe to the TDF
On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 13:27:55 PM +0200, Charles-H. Schulz
(charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org) wrote:
> "M. Fioretti" a écrit :
>
> > On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 12:00:56 PM +0200, Charles-H. Schulz
> > (charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org) wrote:
> >
> > > On the other hand, I and others do not
Hi Marco,
M. Fioretti wrote (20-10-10 05:46)
[...]
The real question was "why didn't the TDF founders who have/had
official roles in OOo publicly resign from those roles on Sept 28th,
one second BEFORE announcing the birth of TDF? Would'nt it have been
much more proper, considering that creating
> Hi Marco,
>
> M. Fioretti wrote (20-10-10 05:46)
>> [...]
>> The real question was "why didn't the TDF founders who have/had
>> official roles in OOo publicly resign from those roles on Sept 28th,
>> one second BEFORE announcing the birth of TDF? Would'nt it have been
>> much more proper, conside
>> The real question was "why didn't the TDF founders who have/had
>> official roles in OOo publicly resign from those roles on Sept 28th,
>> one second BEFORE announcing the birth of TDF? Would'nt it have been
>> much more proper, considering that creating TDF is basically saying in
>> public "th
Marco,
Le Wed, 20 Oct 2010 05:46:22 +0200,
"M. Fioretti" a écrit :
> On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 13:27:55 PM +0200, Charles-H. Schulz
> (charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org) wrote:
>
> > "M. Fioretti" a écrit :
> >
> > > On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 12:00:56 PM +0200, Charles-H. Schulz
> > > (charles.sch.
Il 20/10/2010 5.46, M. Fioretti ha scritto:
The real question was "why didn't the TDF founders who have/had
official roles in OOo publicly resign from those roles on Sept 28th,
one second BEFORE announcing the birth of TDF? Would'nt it have been
much more proper, considering that creating TDF is
On Wed, 2010-10-20 at 10:31 +0200, Gianluca Turconi wrote:
> Il 20/10/2010 5.46, M. Fioretti ha scritto:
> > The real question was "why didn't the TDF founders who have/had
> > official roles in OOo publicly resign from those roles on Sept 28th,
> > one second BEFORE announcing the birth of TDF? Wo
- Original Message
> From: Gianluca Turconi
> Il 20/10/2010 5.46, M. Fioretti ha scritto:
> > The real question was "why didn't the TDF founders who have/had
> > official roles in OOo publicly resign from those roles on Sept 28th,
> > one second BEFORE announcing the birth of TDF? Wou
Hi,
>
> Perhaps there is another issue at play here.
> Yes, Oracle was invited to contribute to TDF; but the current discussion
> on TDF
> membership and documents on-line seem to forbid organizations.
At first, we are just discussing at the moment - everyone who wants
to have her points to be
On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 4:14 PM, BRM wrote:
> Oracle just spent several billion dollars buying Sun - at least part of which
> would have been for OOo and
> all its assets.
Is it buying the software, or the community, or the market?
Ok, well surly it bought the rights to the patents, and the deve
Il 20/10/2010 12.53, Drew Jensen ha scritto:
I suppose the key part of the sentence there is the missing 'if', if you
had to make the decision. Being in the seat that did have to make the
decision is a totally different perspective from offering advice.
No doubt Charles and the others received a
- Original Message
> From: Andre Schnabel
> > Perhaps there is another issue at play here.
> > Yes, Oracle was invited to contribute to TDF; but the current discussion
> > on TDF
> > membership and documents on-line seem to forbid organizations.
>
> At first, we are just discussing
On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 5:25 PM, BRM wrote:
> Again, I'm just trying to point out that there may be another aspect in how
> TDF
> was put together that may be making Oracle feel shunned even though they were
> invited.
>
> It's kind of like forking Android, inviting Google to join, and then sayin
Le 2010-10-20 11:25, BRM a écrit :
Someone said:
Second - the current idea is that organizsations could join indirectly
through their member's (staff) contributions. This idea works quite well
for e.g. Gnome foundation. There are other models and we need to find
something to make organizati
Hi Drew,
Am Wed, 20 Oct 2010 13:44:32 -0400
schrieb Drew Jensen :
> On Tue, 2010-10-19 at 11:18 +0200, Andre Schnabel wrote:
> > I've been asked at the German Lists (Oracle developers discussed
> > heavily
> > on this list within the last two weeks)
>
> Hi just so I'm clear - you mean an Oracl
On Wed, 2010-10-20 at 22:21 +0200, Sigrid Carrera wrote:
> Hi Drew,
>
> Am Wed, 20 Oct 2010 13:44:32 -0400
> schrieb Drew Jensen :
>
> > On Tue, 2010-10-19 at 11:18 +0200, Andre Schnabel wrote:
> > > I've been asked at the German Lists (Oracle developers discussed
> > > heavily
> > > on this lis
Hi *,
I feel same people can't be ruling OOo and TDF. And I see a
clear Conflict of Interest for people who has responsibilities in OOo
and chose to have responsabilities in the TDF.
Both communities will be able to collaborate in tons of things, but the
project leaders can't share responsabiliti
Hello *,
maybe the problem is OOo has the fear that TDF people with
responsabilities in OOo use the OOo resources in favor of TDF?
I'm not talking about Charles, but i.e in the Spanish Communitiy the
Project Leader has closed the subscription to the OOo spanish mailing
lists with the label "Migra
On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 3:32 PM, Ramon Sole wrote:
> And please, guys, let's stop calling the people that didn't decide to
> move to TDF the "Oracle bad guys". There's a lot of people in OOo that
> doesn't work for Oracle. And I met some of the "Oracle bad guys" during
> those years and they're ni
Jean-Christophe Helary wrote:
>> On 18/10/10 21:32, Ramon Sole wrote:
>>> Hello *,
>>>
>>> I'm not talking about Charles, but i.e in the Spanish Communitiy the
>>> Project Leader has closed the subscription to the OOo spanish mailing
>>> lists with the label "Migrating lists to TDF", and you can on
Hi Ramon, *
> Von: Ramon Sole
> >
> > I would seriously reconsider the way I deal with my volunteer
> communities.
>
> Agree. And that's they're doing exactly. They're asking TDF involved
> people to resign from their OOo responsabilities. Nobody asked to nobody
> to leave the Ooo Community. T
On Tue, Oct 19, 2010 at 3:56 AM, Ramon Sole wrote:
> Jean-Christophe Helary wrote:
> >> On 18/10/10 21:32, Ramon Sole wrote:
> >>> Hello *,
> >>>
> >>> I'm not talking about Charles, but i.e in the Spanish Communitiy the
> >>> Project Leader has closed the subscription to the OOo spanish mailing
On Tue, 2010-10-19 at 11:18 +0200, Andre Schnabel wrote:
> I've been asked at the German Lists (Oracle developers discussed
> heavily
> on this list within the last two weeks)
Hi just so I'm clear - you mean an Oracle developer is discussing things
on the German lists, yes?
--
E-mail to disc
Hi Todd,
Sure, now try in Google again looking up for "irony".
:-)
Best Greetings,
Ra
todd rme wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 3:32 PM, Ramon Sole wrote:
>> And please, guys, let's stop calling the people that didn't decide to
>> move to TDF the "Oracle bad guys". There's a lot of people in O
Hello Andre, *
I think my point is simple, agree or disagree:
- if you try to change things from inside and you're inside, fair play
- if you fork a project becasuse you don't want/feel able to change
things form inside and you leave, fair play
- if you fork a project becasuse you don't want/feel
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