Re: [9fans] Plan9 Sources Repository

[pmarin]

Plan9 in general doesn't follow the Bazaar model ( the current usual
way of doing things ).



On Sat, Jul 19, 2014 at 11:31 AM, dante  wrote:
> I would like first to thank everyone for the kind replies!
> Each was useful in it's own way.
>
>
> On 18.07.2014 16:36, erik quanstrom wrote:
>>>
>>> Yet: is there a source control system behind it?
>>> Would it be possible to check out directly from there?
>>
>>
>> there is nothing most folks would recognize as a distributed
>> revision control system.
>>
>> the repo is sources itself.  history is through history(1).
>> you can "check out" code with cp(1), tar(1), mkfs(8); you can
>> keep up with the repo with replica(1).
>>
>> patches are submitted via patch(1).
>
>
> I would argument that the Status Quo has the following disadvantages when
> compared to the the current usual way of doing things:
>
> 1. The history is confined to Plan9.
> It is hard to do small fixes (typos, documentation) from another system.
>
> 2. There are no commit comments.
> There is no "blame" command.
> There are no release tags (allowing for unstable work in between).
> There are no branches (allowing for collective work on an unstable
> version). OK, my machine is my branch...
>
> 3. Contrib packages are tied to people; there is no common repository.
> This leads to the situation where you can't update a package of a long
> gone user.
> Please tell me how many Mercurial packages you can find in Contrib!
>
> I maintain my impression that the Status Quo, though good for a small team,
> does not allow the project to grow.
> Were there any efforts to change this?
> Or is it a controversial matter and it stays as it is?
> Or is the team indeed so small (or even loosing members), s.t. that a change
> won't make sense?
>
> Kind Regards,
> Dante
>
>
>>
>>> If there is none, could it be that this contributes to the lack of
>>> popularity and to the fragmentation of Plan9 (9front, 9atom, 9legacy,
>>> PlanB, other plans...)?
>>
>>
>> i would think the "lack of popularity" can be most directly attributed
>> to the closed license in the early 90s, when there was an unfilled niche,
>> and linux was seriously lacking.
>>
>> i starting doing something slightly different when il was pulled from
>> the distribution while i was in no position to stop using it.  it had
>> nothing
>> to do with source control.
>>
>> - erik
>
>

Re: [9fans] Closed nix development is an insult

[pmarin]

I thought all the discussion of how the development process should be
more open ended with the creation of 9front.
For me one of the best things about 9front is that I can follow all
the changes in the code by reading their mailing list.

pmarin

On Sat, Sep 7, 2013 at 6:36 AM, Bruce Ellis  wrote:
> I don't really understand this thread. I thought it was a stupid flame war,
> in which case I can only say that I miss Boyd calling a spade a fucking
> shovel.
>
> I was disturbed by the claim that v10 had been lost because of bullshit, but
> said nothing.
>
> If indeed someone has lost their v10 I can replace it. If you are in
> australia it's easy. Contact me with the details of your import license and
> I will arrange for a copy on TK50 for you. I'm not allowed to
> export/sell/destroy it so I'm stuck with it. Nearly all of cmd is on the web
> anyway!
>
> And a complete rack of plan9 servers is a lot quieter, faster, and uses lest
> power than my Vax.
>
> But I digress, voting nemo Plan9 innovator of the month. Shoot me.
>
> brucee
>
>
> On 7 September 2013 14:06, Devon H. O'Dell  wrote:
>>
>> 2013/9/6 erik quanstrom :
>> >> > I created it I do what I want with it.
>> >>
>> >> I believe the rules are different when the work is research, sponsored
>> >> by public money. People are getting research grants to work on nix.
>> >
>> > who is getting grants to work on nix?
>> >
>> >> > as far as i know, there is no private nix development going on
>> >>
>> >> Who are you kidding. This is the norm around here. I have been
>> >> personally invited in multiple private Plan 9-related projects by some
>> >> of the few proemiment members of this community that still write code.
>> >> This has always been the norm; read 15 year old 9fans posts and find
>> >> that the same attitude (and complaints) prevail.
>> >
>> > i'm not sure if you're complaining or bragging.
>> >
>> > but anyway, we're talking about current nix (which i take to mean
>> > current 64-bit intel/amd development of any sort).
>> >
>> > so have you been invited to participate in private nix development?
>>
>> I've been invited. I'm too busy, and I feel like a dick, because I
>> think it'd be a lot of fun. I'm happy that people are contributing.
>>
>> But I do wish that this list and the software produced by the people
>> on it was more transparent. I'm sure nobody likes bitbucket or github
>> here, but I'm pretty sure everyone would be happy with a 9p mount of
>> ongoing development. It's amazing what commented changesets do for
>> software engineering in organizations (public or private) to quell
>> worries about those projects.
>>
>> --dho
>>
>> > - erik
>> >
>>
>

Re: [9fans] anyone attempted to build ghostscript recently?

[pmarin]

What about mupdf? It has few dependecies [1]

http://mupdf.com/doc/
[1] http://git.ghostscript.com/?p=mupdf.git;a=tree;f=thirdparty;hb=HEAD

pmarin.


On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 7:16 PM, erik quanstrom wrote:

> On Fri May  3 13:15:41 EDT 2013, knapj...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > Is a PS/PDF library something that might benefit from reconstruction in
> Go?
> > Or is it just a spaghetti mess?
>
> go or c, a fresh implementation might be an improvement,
> and given the weight of some of the other options, might be
> more time-efficient than one would think.
>
> - erik
>
>

Re: [9fans] info for manual

[pmarin]

There is no translation of the manual in other  language, sorry but
it's just product of your imagination.

People still don't understand that sarcasm and irony don't work in
Internet, they only produce noise and confusion.

On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 6:36 AM, Francesco Cardi
 wrote:
>> ah ok and it will be possible to have the translation of the manual
>> that is sold on the website? dealt with by the company to do the
>> translation or community volunteers to hell os?
>>
>
>
> ?
>
>
> --
> Cardi Francesco alias Il Parente
> Free Software activist
> CEO/President Movimento Culturale GNU CODICE LIBERO
>
> Diaspora*: https://joindiaspora.com/u/ilparente
> Identi.ca: https://identi.ca/cardifrancesco
> Jabber: ilpare...@jabber.org
>

Re: [9fans] 9atom on Dell Inspiron Mini 9

[pmarin]

See the 9front wiki:
http://code.google.com/p/plan9front/wiki/usbboot
Probably it only works for the 9front version of Plan9

On Thu, Jan 10, 2013 at 6:20 PM, Alexander Shendi (Web.de)
 wrote:
> Hello 9fans,
>
> I'm planning to install Plan 9 on a spare i386 machine, a Dell Inspiron Mini 
> 9 netbook.
>
> I have googled a bit and my best bet seems  to be the 9atom distribution. 
> However
> the netbook doesn't have a CDROM and I would habe to buy an USB-CDROM-Drive.
> Thus my questions:
> * Has anyone tried  Plan 9 on  this or similar hardware?
> * Can Plan 9 boot of an USB-CDROM?
>
> Many thanks in advance for your help.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Alexander
>
> --
> Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Android-Mobiltelefon mit K-9 Mail gesendet.
>

Re: [9fans] unicode fonts in troff

[pmarin]

Can you describe the process or at least where did you get all the
info for doing this thing?

On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 11:38 AM, Pavel Klinkovsky
 wrote:
>> I'd like to use it under plan9 but sadly i don't have the knowhow.
>> Maybe someone smarter will fix it.
>
> To allow the "special" characters (different from latin-1) in Plan9's troff 
> you need to create tables of glyphs and the font metrics.
>
> I have already made such a laborious conversion process when porting TTF 
> containing czech characters to Plan9's troff.
> Now I write the czech documents in Plan9's troff.
>
> Pavel
>

Re: [9fans] Kernel panic when allocating a huge memory

[pmarin]

To be clear, is the swap partition completely useless in Plan9?

pmarin.

On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 9:28 PM, Charles Forsyth
 wrote:
> There's a non-trivial chance that what now goes wrong with paging
> (which did once work, even if it isn't great) is a symptom of a bug
> that afflicts the virtual memory code itself. (For instance, a page unlocked
> during a critical period, a race, and so on.)
>
>
>
> On 2 November 2012 19:18, erik quanstrom  wrote:
>>
>> On Fri Nov  2 15:10:00 EDT 2012, skip.tavakkol...@gmail.com wrote:
>> > it's by design:
>> > http://9fans.net/archive/2006/07/229
>> >
>> > -Skip
>> >
>> > On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Pavel Klinkovsky
>> >  wrote:
>> > >>> It really seems as a problem with swap. :(
>> > >>
>> > >> this is well known, and solutions are available
>> > >> even if you don't care to use them.
>> > >
>> > > Oh, does it mean the official Plan 9 distribution contains non-working
>> > > swap? :O
>> > > It is clear I missed something...
>> > >
>> > > Sorry for the noise.
>>
>> i don't think that's quite fair to the current situation.  there
>> was a swapper, and it's broken.  it should either be fixed or
>> removed.  leaving the thing in in the state it's in (buffalo
>> buffalo?) doesn't make any sense, and is as seperate from
>> the question of whether to page (to disk) or not as, ahem, vm is from
>> paging (to disk).
>>
>> imo, swap needs to go.
>>
>> - erik
>>
>

Re: [9fans] apparently nice summary of small linux pcs

[pmarin]

> do you mind quoting it here?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MShbP3OpASA&feature=youtu.be&t=49m45s

Re: [9fans] formatting the manual from plan9 ports?

[pmarin]

See the example in tr2post(1)

On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 9:03 PM, Aharon Robbins  wrote:
> Is there a simple recipe to use p9p troff to format the manual pages
> from the plan 9 dist?  I.e.:
>
>        Install Plan 9 Ports
>        wget plan9.iso from bell labs
>        mount said iso /some/where
>        9 rc
>        cd /some/where/sys/man
>        # magic stuff here
>
> (Or tar off the dist to regular files where things are writable.)
>
> Thanks!
>
> Arnold
>

Re: [9fans] devdrawserver

[pmarin]

http://summerofdevdraw.blogspot.com.es/2011/10/9p-srv-experimental-devdraw-for-p9p.html

On Tue, Apr 24, 2012 at 7:57 PM, marius a. eriksen  wrote:
> I've found myself in need of running acme on one machine, but devdraw
> on another. Since p9p devdraw isn't a file server, exporting and
> importing the devdraw server isn't something you can do without extra
> help: that's where devdrawserver comes in:
>
>  https://github.com/mariusaeriksen/devdrawserver
>
> it provides a "virtual" devdraw on the remote machine, and the ability
> to attach a real devdraw binary to the stream.
>
> There's a bit of extra code in there, because eventually I might also
> add detach/reattach to this (but I haven't really needed it yet).
>
> marius.
>
> *
>
> mk install, then follow the instructions in the README
>

Re: [9fans] tcl, 9p

[pmarin]

In 15 years Tcl has been improved a lot, like any other  language.

On Sun, Oct 9, 2011 at 7:21 AM, ron minnich  wrote:
> Well, I did 9p clients for testing 15 years ago. It might have been
> the right thing then; I was even making nfs clients in tcl back then.
>
> Would I do it again?
>
> No
>
> ron
>
>

Re: [9fans] 9p hello world

[pmarin]

http://lsub.org/who/nemo/9.intro.pdf

On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 12:56 PM, s s  wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 5:03 AM, yy  wrote:
>>
>> 2011/9/5 s s :
>> > It seems like there might be a hello world example for libixp ...
>> >
>> > http://www.anarchyinthetubes.com/src/hello_libixp
>>
>> I wrote that, but is needing some attention. It is quite old, and
>> although is still valid, I should finish more examples. Extending it
>> to p9p's 9p(3) and Inferno's styxserver(10) is in my TODO list, but it
>> will still be there for a while.
>>
>> If you write a p9p's hello world server, let me know and I can add it
>> to that page.
>>
>> By the way, there probably are more 9p implementations than real
>> programs using them, but they are not very different. What you really
>> need to understand is how the protocol works. It's actually quite
>> simple. Nemo's book includes a very good explanation, which is
>> completed by the man pages. Also, try to find an existing file server
>> which matches what you need as much as possible and go on from there.
>>
>>
>> --
>> - yiyus || JGL .
>
> Compiled and ran "timefs" in the go9p examples.
>
> Wondering now how to do timefs in p9p.
>
> Thought using p9p would be more concise, since it has 9pclient library and
> 9pserve program.
>
> Wondering how to write a timefs in go, that uses 9pclient and 9pserve.
>
> What is Nemo's book?
>
>  - Leonard
>
>
>
>

Re: [9fans] changing acme colors

[pmarin]

For a global color change see
http://plan9.bell-labs.com/sources/contrib/sl/reverse/rio/

To chance the color of the tick go to /src/libframe/frinit.c
in "void frinittick(Frame *f)" look for
/* vertical line */
draw(f->tick, Rect(FRTICKW/2, 0, FRTICKW/2+1, ft->height),
f->display->black, nil, ZP);
and change "f->display-> black" to "f->cols[TEXT]"

Cheers.
pmarin.

On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 4:51 PM, EBo  wrote:
> I'll be gone this weekend so Monday would be more than fine.
>
>  Best regards,
>
>  EBo --
>
> On Fri, 15 Jul 2011 16:46:01 +0200, Peter A. Cejchan wrote:
>>
>> i have it somewhere, if you can wait till Monday,
>> have a look: www.gli.cas.cz/home/cejchan/plan9/Default.htm
>>
>> ++pac
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 4:13 PM, EBo  wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 15 Jul 2011 15:07:06 +0100, Connor Lane Smith wrote:
>>>
>>>> Can anyone suggest how to change the background window color in acme?
>>>>  The
>>>>>
>>>>> yellow is not quite contrasty enough for me, and I would like to
>>>>> lighten
>>>>> it
>>>>> up a bunch.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I think you'll need to change /n/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/**
>>>> acme/acme.c:868
>>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Connor.  I was hoping that there would be a config some place.
>>>  I'll
>>> look at hacking then...
>>>
>>>  EBo --
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>

Re: [9fans] wiki...

[pmarin]

http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Guruplug/index.html
I spend 2 second to find it, but is true that the wiki have search issues.

On Sat, Apr 23, 2011 at 6:43 AM, Ethan Grammatikidis
 wrote:
>
> On 11 Apr 2011, at 2:51 pm, David Leimbach wrote:
>
>> I posted some on the wiki about how I got the guruplug working for me...
>
> How do you find things on the wiki? I came across this today. My first
> thought was to look in the other_hardware page where I found mention of the
> Shevaplug and Guruplug but no links so I looked in the news page and only
> found a link to Nemo's home website... :)
>
> Google simply can't find the word "guruplug" anywhere on
> www.plan9.http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Guruplug/index.htmlbell-labs.com
>  despite there being a clear link chain to a wiki
> page which has it, so that's no use.
>
> I guess I can mount and search the wiki, when it's up. I hope that works. :)
>
> If I can find the pages and edit the wiki I'd make links and maybe fix up
> some obsolete info too. Do I need an account to edit the wiki? I would check
> but sources went down in between my mounting it and cd-ing into it. That's
> the 2nd time that's happened in the last few weeks. I think the other time
> was when I tried to mount the wiki too.
>
>

Re: [9fans] where to get color troff?

[pmarin]

/sys/src/cmd/postscript/mcolor/

On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 10:24 AM, Fernan Bolando
 wrote:
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 3:33 PM, Sape Mullender 
> wrote:
>>
>> > On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 2:38 PM, Peter A. Cejchan 
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >> do you mean 'graph', or 'chart' ?
>> >> ++pac
>> >>
>> >
>> > right now it's mostly charts.
>>
>> I use these macros for generating color:
>>
>> .de CL
>> \\X'PS \\$1 \\$2 \\$3 setrgbcolor'\\c
>> ..
>> .de BK
>> \\X'PS 0 0 0 setrgbcolor'\\c
>> ..
>> .de EM
>> \\$3\\X'PS 1 0 0 setrgbcolor'\\$1\\X'PS 0 0 0 setrgbcolor'\\$2
>> ..
>>
>> They only work if you generate postscript (you can, of course, turn that
>> into pdf as well).
>> .CL r g b
>> sets the color to the rgb values (0 0 0 being black, 1 1 1 being white,
>> 0.5 0.5 0.5 being middle grey)
>> .BK
>> sets the color to black.
>> .EM "string1" "string2" "string3"
>> (emphasis), where strings 2 and 3 are optional prints string3 in the
>> current
>> color, followed by string1 in red and string2 in black (with no space
>> between
>> strings 3, 1 and 2 — they work as .B or .I in the .ms macro package.
>>
>>        Sape
>>
>
> Wow cool it worked. thanks a lot
>
>
>

Re: [9fans] I can't boot Plan 9 after install it with 9atom (the system is rebooted)

[pmarin]

Ok. I have installed Plan9 in an empty hard disk and the bootloader works fine.
have the bootloader got any problems if the Plan9 partition is above
1024 cylinders?

Cheers.
pmarin

On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 7:18 AM, pmarin  wrote:
> I have a problem after installing 9atom in an old HP Optiplex GX110
> (i810e/PIII)
>
> When I start the machine the screen only show
>   PBS2...Plan 9 from Bell Labs
> and after a few second the machine is rebooted.
>
> Can someone tell me what I have to do now?
>
> Some info ( a few Spanglish sorry):
> fdisk -l
>   Disco /dev/hda: 30.0 GB, 30060527616 bytes
>   255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 3654 cylinders
>   Units = cilindros of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
>   Disk identifier: 0x
>
>   Disposit. Inicio    Comienzo      Fin      Bloques  Id  Sistema
>   /dev/hda1               1 1216 9767488+  83  Linux
>   /dev/hda2            1217        1338      979965    f  W95 Ext'd (LBA)
>   /dev/hda3   *        1339        3654    18603270   39  Plan 9
>   /dev/hda5            1217        1338      979933+  82  Linux swap / Solaris
>
> lspci
>   00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation 82810E DC-133 (GMCH)
> Graphics Memory Controller Hub (rev 03)
>   00:01.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82810E DC-133
> (CGC) Chipset Graphics Controller (rev 03)
>   00:1e.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation 82801AA PCI Bridge (rev 02)
>   00:1f.0 ISA bridge: Intel Corporation 82801AA ISA Bridge (LPC) (rev 02)
>   00:1f.1 IDE interface: Intel Corporation 82801AA IDE Controller (rev 02)
>   00:1f.2 USB Controller: Intel Corporation 82801AA USB Controller (rev 02)
>   00:1f.3 SMBus: Intel Corporation 82801AA SMBus Controller (rev 02)
>   00:1f.5 Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corporation 82801AA
> AC'97 Audio Controller (rev 02)
>   01:07.0 USB Controller: NEC Corporation USB (rev 43)
>   01:07.1 USB Controller: NEC Corporation USB (rev 43)
>   01:07.2 USB Controller: NEC Corporation USB 2.0 (rev 04)
>   01:0c.0 Ethernet controller: 3Com Corporation 3c905C-TX/TX-M
> [Tornado] (rev 78)
>

[9fans] I can't boot Plan 9 after install it with 9atom (the system is rebooted)

[pmarin]

I have a problem after installing 9atom in an old HP Optiplex GX110
(i810e/PIII)

When I start the machine the screen only show
   PBS2...Plan 9 from Bell Labs
and after a few second the machine is rebooted.

Can someone tell me what I have to do now?

Some info ( a few Spanglish sorry):
fdisk -l
   Disco /dev/hda: 30.0 GB, 30060527616 bytes
   255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 3654 cylinders
   Units = cilindros of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
   Disk identifier: 0x

   Disposit. InicioComienzo  Fin  Bloques  Id  Sistema
   /dev/hda1   11216 9767488+  83  Linux
   /dev/hda212171338  979965f  W95 Ext'd (LBA)
   /dev/hda3   *1339365418603270   39  Plan 9
   /dev/hda512171338  979933+  82  Linux swap / Solaris

lspci
   00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation 82810E DC-133 (GMCH)
Graphics Memory Controller Hub (rev 03)
   00:01.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82810E DC-133
(CGC) Chipset Graphics Controller (rev 03)
   00:1e.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation 82801AA PCI Bridge (rev 02)
   00:1f.0 ISA bridge: Intel Corporation 82801AA ISA Bridge (LPC) (rev 02)
   00:1f.1 IDE interface: Intel Corporation 82801AA IDE Controller (rev 02)
   00:1f.2 USB Controller: Intel Corporation 82801AA USB Controller (rev 02)
   00:1f.3 SMBus: Intel Corporation 82801AA SMBus Controller (rev 02)
   00:1f.5 Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corporation 82801AA
AC'97 Audio Controller (rev 02)
   01:07.0 USB Controller: NEC Corporation USB (rev 43)
   01:07.1 USB Controller: NEC Corporation USB (rev 43)
   01:07.2 USB Controller: NEC Corporation USB 2.0 (rev 04)
   01:0c.0 Ethernet controller: 3Com Corporation 3c905C-TX/TX-M
[Tornado] (rev 78)

Re: [9fans] Making read(1) an rc(1) builtin?

[pmarin]

Write some real world  tests using bash/GNU tools, rc (with static
linked versions of p9p)  and tell us what happend.
Maybe you will be surprised.

[1] http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/tpop/

On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 12:30 AM,   wrote:
> I'm in the process of writing some filters in rc(1).  One thing that has
> come to concern me about rc(1) is that read(1) is not a "builtin"
> command.  For example, with a loop like:
>
>    while(message=`{read})
>      switch($message) {
>      case foo
>        dofoo
>      case bar
>        dobar
>      case *
>        dodefault
>      }
>
> Each line that's read by the script causes it to fork a new process,
> /bin/read, whose sole purpose is to read a single line and die.  That
> means at least one fork for each line read and, if your input has many
> lines, that means spawning many processes.  I wonder if it wouldn't make
> sense to move read(1) into rc(1) and make it a "builtin" command.  A
> wrapper script could then be created, at /bin/read, to call "rc -c 'eval
> read $*'" with the appropriate arguments (or sed $n^q, etc.), for any
> program that requires an actual /bin/read to exist.
>
> A similar line of thought holds for /bin/test.  The string and numeric
> tests (-n, -z, =, !=, <, >, -lt, -eq, -ne, etc.) can be very frequently
> used, and can lead to spawning unnecessarily many processes.  For the
> file test parameters (-e, -f, -d, -r, -x, -A, -L, -T, etc.), however,
> this argument isn't as strong.  Since the file tests have to stat(2) a
> path, they already require a call to the underlying file system, and an
> additional fork wouldn't be that much more expensive.  I could see the
> string and numeric tests being moved into rc(1) as a "test" builtin,
> with the file tests residing at "/bin/ftest" (note the "f").  The "test"
> builtin could scan its arguments and call "ftest" if needed.  A wrapper
> script at /bin/test could provide compatibility for existing programs
> which expect an executable named /bin/test to exist.
>
> I understand the Unix/Plan 9 philosophy of connecting tools that do one
> job and do it well.  But I don't think /bin/read and /bin/test are
> places where that philosophy is practical (i.e., efficient).  After all,
> reading input lines really is the perogative of any program that
> processes line-oriented data (like rc(1) does).  In addition, /bin/read
> represents a simple and fairly stable interface that's not likely to
> change appreciably in the future.  Comparison of numeric and string
> values is also a fairly stable operation that's not likely to change,
> and is not likely to be needed outside of rc(1).  Most programming
> languages (C, awk, etc.) have their own mechanisms for integer and
> string comparison.  I suspect moving these operations into rc(1) (with
> appropriate replacement scripts to ensure compatibility) could
> appreciably increase the performance of shell scripts, with very little
> cost in modularity or compatibility.
>
> Any thoughts on this?
>
> I'm also a bit stumped by the fact that rc(1) doesn't have anything
> analogous to bash(1)'s string parsing operations: ${foo#bar},
> ${foo##bar}, ${foo%bar}, ${foo%%bar}, or ${foo/bar/baz}.  Is there any
> way to extract substrings (or single characters) from a string in rc(1)
> without having to fork a dd, awk, or sed?  I've tried setting ifs='' and
> using foo=($"bar), but rc(1) always splits bar on spaces.  Perhaps, if
> rc(1) used the first character of $ifs to split $"bar, $bar could be
> split into individual characters when ifs=''.  Then, the characters of
> $bar could be addressed without resort to dd and friends.
>
> (As a side note, if anyone goes into rc(1)'s source to implement any of
> this, please add a "--" option (or similar) to the "echo" builtin while
> you're there.  Having to wrap echo in:
>
>    # make 'myecho $foo' work even when $foo starts with '-n'
>    fn myecho {
>      if(~ $1 --) {
>        shift
>        if(~ $1 -n) {
>          shift
>          echo -n -n $*
>          echo
>        }
>        if not echo $*
>      }
>      if not echo $*
>    }
>
> can be rather inconvenient.)
>
> --
> +---+
> |E-Mail: smi...@zenzebra.mv.com             PGP key ID: BC549F8B|
> |Fingerprint: 9329 DB4A 30F5 6EDA D2BA  3489 DAB7 555A BC54 9F8B|
> +---+
>
>

Re: [9fans] GSoC Widget library

[pmarin]

While browsing in 9fans today I discovered that  some people actually
have written cool user interfaces in Plan9:
http://marc.info/?l=9fans&m=111558827311549&w=2
http://basalt.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp/plan9/Tyrrhena.gif
http://basalt.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp/plan9/Tyrrhena2.gif


On Sat, Apr 2, 2011 at 4:12 AM, erik quanstrom  wrote:
>> Hello, I am participating in Google Summer of Code.
>> After searching your ideas page, I was interested in widget library. Have
>> you heard anything of IMGUI ? I
>> personally think it is a very beautiful way of expressing user interfaces.
>> What do you think of making Plan 9 widget library an implementetion of IMGUI
>> philosophy?
>
> in general, i'm all for ui development.  it's not a solved problem
> in plan 9 at all.  i think the question is, what can you do in a
> summer?
>
> by the way, take a look at nemo's octopus http://lsub.org/ls/octopus.html
>
> - erik
>
>

Re: [9fans] GSoC Widget library

[pmarin]

Which one? Acme/Abaco  style or TK/limbo or panel library...

On Sat, Apr 2, 2011 at 1:00 AM, Jacob Todd  wrote:
> Plan 9 already has a widget philosophy, it just needs to be applied to a
> library (supposedly).

Re: [9fans] plan9 ms .if h test

[pmarin]

I found it.

from htmlroff(1):


"Conditional input

To make it easier to write input files that can be formatted by both
troff and htmlroff, htmlroff adds a new condition h which evaluates
true in .if and .ie requests. The t condition continues to evaluate
true, to accomodate input files trying to distinguish between troff
and nroff. To write a conditional matching troff alone, use ‘.if !h
.if t’."

http://swtch.com/plan9port/man/man7/htmlroff.html

Cheers.
pmarin.


On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 7:12 PM, pmarin  wrote:
> Never mind: ".if c" is only using for built-ins.
>
> On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 6:55 PM, pmarin  wrote:
>> I searched where the register h is defined:
>>
>> % 9 grep -n '.nr h ' tmac.*
>>
>> tmac.cs:103: .nr h 6
>> tmac.cs:477: .  nr h \\ne \}
>> tmac.mcs:208: .nr h 6
>> tmac.mcs:840: .nr h \\ne
>>
>> where h has the same meaning:
>> '''\"   h - cover sheet basic distribution length
>>
>> Both tmac.cs and tmac.mcs load tmac.s in their inicialization so
>> probably h  only have sense when tmac.cs or tmac.mcs are used.
>>
>> I think that if you are only using the ms macros then h is not
>> important because is not defined.
>>
>> Cheers.
>> pmarin.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 4:21 PM, Rudolf Sykora  
>> wrote:
>>> Hello 9fans,
>>>
>>> in the troff ms-definition file (in plan 9, p9p)
>>> /sys/lib/tmac/tmac.s
>>> I can find this structures
>>> .if h ...
>>> or
>>> .ie h ...
>>>
>>> I really can't find what this test means (the 'h'), I only know the
>>> o,e,t,n built-ins.
>>> Please, can anybody tell?
>>>
>>> [
>>> In p9p, it's e.g. on
>>> /opt/plan9/tmac/tmac.s:329 you have
>>> .ie h .ll \\n(LLu
>>> .el \{\
>>> ...
>>> ]
>>>
>>> Thank you very much!
>>> Ruda
>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: [9fans] plan9 ms .if h test

[pmarin]

Never mind: ".if c" is only using for built-ins.

On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 6:55 PM, pmarin  wrote:
> I searched where the register h is defined:
>
> % 9 grep -n '.nr h ' tmac.*
>
> tmac.cs:103: .nr h 6
> tmac.cs:477: .  nr h \\ne \}
> tmac.mcs:208: .nr h 6
> tmac.mcs:840: .nr h \\ne
>
> where h has the same meaning:
> '''\"   h - cover sheet basic distribution length
>
> Both tmac.cs and tmac.mcs load tmac.s in their inicialization so
> probably h  only have sense when tmac.cs or tmac.mcs are used.
>
> I think that if you are only using the ms macros then h is not
> important because is not defined.
>
> Cheers.
> pmarin.
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 4:21 PM, Rudolf Sykora  
> wrote:
>> Hello 9fans,
>>
>> in the troff ms-definition file (in plan 9, p9p)
>> /sys/lib/tmac/tmac.s
>> I can find this structures
>> .if h ...
>> or
>> .ie h ...
>>
>> I really can't find what this test means (the 'h'), I only know the
>> o,e,t,n built-ins.
>> Please, can anybody tell?
>>
>> [
>> In p9p, it's e.g. on
>> /opt/plan9/tmac/tmac.s:329 you have
>> .ie h .ll \\n(LLu
>> .el \{\
>> ...
>> ]
>>
>> Thank you very much!
>> Ruda
>>
>>
>

Re: [9fans] plan9 ms .if h test

[pmarin]

I searched where the register h is defined:

% 9 grep -n '.nr h ' tmac.*

tmac.cs:103: .nr h 6
tmac.cs:477: .  nr h \\ne \}
tmac.mcs:208: .nr h 6
tmac.mcs:840: .nr h \\ne

where h has the same meaning:
'''\"   h - cover sheet basic distribution length

Both tmac.cs and tmac.mcs load tmac.s in their inicialization so
probably h  only have sense when tmac.cs or tmac.mcs are used.

I think that if you are only using the ms macros then h is not
important because is not defined.

Cheers.
pmarin.




On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 4:21 PM, Rudolf Sykora  wrote:
> Hello 9fans,
>
> in the troff ms-definition file (in plan 9, p9p)
> /sys/lib/tmac/tmac.s
> I can find this structures
> .if h ...
> or
> .ie h ...
>
> I really can't find what this test means (the 'h'), I only know the
> o,e,t,n built-ins.
> Please, can anybody tell?
>
> [
> In p9p, it's e.g. on
> /opt/plan9/tmac/tmac.s:329 you have
> .ie h .ll \\n(LLu
> .el \{\
> ...
> ]
>
> Thank you very much!
> Ruda
>
>

Re: [9fans] troff macro II

[pmarin]

Also to pay attention to the command .wh  in my example:

.wh -1i NP \" When you reach the final of the page less 1 inch call
the command .NP

On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 2:02 AM, pmarin  wrote:
> Becouse "The backslash character \ is used to introduce troff commands
> and special characters *within* a line of text" (from the Troff
> tutorial)
>
> Try:
> .\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
> .mk
> .tl '\v'-10.5i'a'b'c\v'+10.5i''
> .rt
> ..
>
> On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 1:10 AM, Rudolf Sykora  
> wrote:
>> On 25 March 2011 22:52, pmarin  wrote:
>>> DONE!
>>> Try the attached code. I am not using the ms macros. You will to
>>> change the ms macros to get something similar.
>>>
>>> troff test.ms | tr2post | psfonts > test.ps
>>>
>>> Cheers.
>>> pmarin
>>
>> Yes. This works. Actually, my problem has always only been: how to get
>> back to the top of a page; to have a correct string prepared to put
>> there has been easy for me. Note what I wrote in my 1st post of this
>> thread:
>> .
>> .\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
>> .mk
>> \v'|0.5i'
>> .tl 'a'b'c'
>> .rt
>> ..
>>
>> and it comes in a modified .BT macro (which is somewhat equivalent to
>> your .NP; ms actually sets [as far as I know] 3 traps on a page, 1 at
>> the top [.NP] and 2 at the bottom [.FO a .BT]). If I had written just
>> .
>> .\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
>> .tl '\v'-10.5i'a'b'c\v'+10.5i''
>> ..
>>
>> as you have, it would have basically done what I want. So now the
>> question is why
>> .tl '\v'-10.5i'a'b'c\v'+10.5i''
>> moves back and does the work, whilst
>> .mk
>> \v'|0.5i'
>> .tl 'a'b'c'
>> .rt
>> does not.
>> Nor does this, for instance:
>> \v'-10.5i'
>> .tl 'a'b'c'
>> \v'+10.5i'
>>
>> Thanks for your help
>> Ruda
>>
>>
>

Re: [9fans] troff macro II

[pmarin]

Becouse "The backslash character \ is used to introduce troff commands
and special characters *within* a line of text" (from the Troff
tutorial)

Try:
.\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
.mk
.tl '\v'-10.5i'a'b'c\v'+10.5i''
.rt
..

On Sat, Mar 26, 2011 at 1:10 AM, Rudolf Sykora  wrote:
> On 25 March 2011 22:52, pmarin  wrote:
>> DONE!
>> Try the attached code. I am not using the ms macros. You will to
>> change the ms macros to get something similar.
>>
>> troff test.ms | tr2post | psfonts > test.ps
>>
>> Cheers.
>> pmarin
>
> Yes. This works. Actually, my problem has always only been: how to get
> back to the top of a page; to have a correct string prepared to put
> there has been easy for me. Note what I wrote in my 1st post of this
> thread:
> .
> .\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
> .mk
> \v'|0.5i'
> .tl 'a'b'c'
> .rt
> ..
>
> and it comes in a modified .BT macro (which is somewhat equivalent to
> your .NP; ms actually sets [as far as I know] 3 traps on a page, 1 at
> the top [.NP] and 2 at the bottom [.FO a .BT]). If I had written just
> .
> .\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
> .tl '\v'-10.5i'a'b'c\v'+10.5i''
> ..
>
> as you have, it would have basically done what I want. So now the
> question is why
> .tl '\v'-10.5i'a'b'c\v'+10.5i''
> moves back and does the work, whilst
> .mk
> \v'|0.5i'
> .tl 'a'b'c'
> .rt
> does not.
> Nor does this, for instance:
> \v'-10.5i'
> .tl 'a'b'c'
> \v'+10.5i'
>
> Thanks for your help
> Ruda
>
>

Re: [9fans] troff macro II

[pmarin]

DONE!
Try the attached code. I am not using the ms macros. You will to
change the ms macros to get something similar.

troff test.ms | tr2post | psfonts > test.ps

Cheers.
pmarin


On Thu, Mar 24, 2011 at 5:54 PM, Rudolf Sykora  wrote:
> Hello 9fans,
>
> since in the previous thread started by me ('troff macros for
> typesetting books/longer texts') nobody touched my question about
> producing wanted headings, I started experimenting, but so far has not
> been quite successful.
>
> Since text to appear in my headings is to mirror section names, like
> '1.2', and a beginning of such a section appears somewhere lower on a
> page---definitely below the page heading---, I must create a page
> heading just after the very page is filled, i.e., as I feel, the
> heading could actually be produced when the ms .BT macro (usually used
> to typeset footings) is called. So I naively tried to redefine the .BT
> macro, actually, by just appending 4 extra lines:
>
> .de BT
> .nr PX \\n(.s
> .nr PF \\n(.f
> .ft 1
> .ps \\n(PS
> 'lt \\n(LTu
> .po \\n(POu
> .if \\n%>0 .tl \(ts\\*(LF\(ts\\*(CF\(ts\\*(RF\(ts
> .ft \\n(PF
> .ps \\n(PX
> .\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
> .mk
> \v'|0.5i'
> .tl 'a'b'c'
> .rt
> ..
>
> Please consider this just as an experiment (no point-size changes,...).
> This for some reason doesn't work.
> Since some of you probably have experience, could sb. tell what is wrong?
>
> Thank you
> Ruda
>
>


test.ms
Description: Troff MS-macros document

Re: [9fans] troff macro II

[pmarin]

Read carefully the section 9, 10 and 11 of "A TROFF Tutorial"[1]. I
think is exactly what you are looking for.

[1] http://www.kohala.com/start/troff/v7man/trofftut/trofftut.ps



On Thu, Mar 24, 2011 at 5:54 PM, Rudolf Sykora  wrote:
> Hello 9fans,
>
> since in the previous thread started by me ('troff macros for
> typesetting books/longer texts') nobody touched my question about
> producing wanted headings, I started experimenting, but so far has not
> been quite successful.
>
> Since text to appear in my headings is to mirror section names, like
> '1.2', and a beginning of such a section appears somewhere lower on a
> page---definitely below the page heading---, I must create a page
> heading just after the very page is filled, i.e., as I feel, the
> heading could actually be produced when the ms .BT macro (usually used
> to typeset footings) is called. So I naively tried to redefine the .BT
> macro, actually, by just appending 4 extra lines:
>
> .de BT
> .nr PX \\n(.s
> .nr PF \\n(.f
> .ft 1
> .ps \\n(PS
> 'lt \\n(LTu
> .po \\n(POu
> .if \\n%>0 .tl \(ts\\*(LF\(ts\\*(CF\(ts\\*(RF\(ts
> .ft \\n(PF
> .ps \\n(PX
> .\"  ABOVE IS THE ORIGINAL, BELOW MY APPENDIX
> .mk
> \v'|0.5i'
> .tl 'a'b'c'
> .rt
> ..
>
> Please consider this just as an experiment (no point-size changes,...).
> This for some reason doesn't work.
> Since some of you probably have experience, could sb. tell what is wrong?
>
> Thank you
> Ruda
>
>

Re: [9fans] troff macros for typesetting books/longer texts

[pmarin]

My theory is that GNU tools were so bloated by design that they
realized that they  couldn't write a decent man page for their tools
so they invented the  info pages and the --help flag.

On Fri, Mar 25, 2011 at 1:25 PM, erik quanstrom  wrote:
> On Fri Mar 25 07:52:10 EDT 2011, arn...@skeeve.com wrote:
>> I really like the GNU project's Texinfo markup language, which
>> sets on top of TeX, but you don't have to know TeX. (I've been using
>> Texinfo for > 20 years, but don't know any TeX.)
>>
>> I've written books in troff, Docbook/XML, and Texinfo, and Texinfo is
>> by far the easiest.
>
> i never could get past the fact that texbook reeks of hubris
> and nih, nor forgive gnu for using info as an excuse for not
> having man pages.  that, and the fact that it's at least 100x
> slower than troff, and the reader requires cursor addressing.
>
> - erik
>
>

Re: [9fans] troff macros for typesetting books/longer texts

[pmarin]

A very gentle introduction about  Troff macros is
"A TROFF Tutorial" by Kernighan. (http://www.kohala.com/start/troff/troff.html)

A great and complete book with macros like you are looking for is
"Unix Text Processing". You can download it from
http://oreilly.com/openbook/utp/


On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 6:10 PM, Rudolf Sykora  wrote:
> Hello everyone,
>
> please, does somebody know of any troff macros that were used to typeset 
> books?
> Can one get hold of e.g. macros used to typeset e.g. "The AWK
> Programming Language" by Aho, Kernighan and Weinberger, or “The Unix
> Programming Environment” by Kernighan and Pike?
>
> I want to particularly know how headings were programmed. I.e., how
> the name of a chapter that is only to appear on a page gets to its
> heading. I feel that either the file must be processed twice, or one
> must write a heading of a page only when the page is about to be
> completed (one would then back up to the heading position, write it,
> and only then continue).
>
> Thanks
> Ruda
>
>

Re: [9fans] mia

[pmarin]

Hi Mark!

On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 11:15 AM, Bruce Ellis  wrote:
> that sounds rugged. still trying to get someone in china to make
> kevlar boxer shorts with da space bunny on the butt. they'll make
> everything else.
>
> On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 4:37 PM, Graham Gallagher
>  wrote:
>>> well not really we are going kashmir.
>>
>> i thought kashmir was an alcohol free zone 'till i discovered led zeppelin
>>
>>> i've fortified the CDM but what i need is a smallish rugged and bunny
>>> compliant box with a 250/320 disk in it, It\
>>
>>  Toshiba 256GB solid state drive $500
>>
>>
>
>

Re: [9fans] Fix for using Plan9 compose sequences with Spanish keyboards in X

[pmarin]

Sorry I forgot the diaeresis:
quotedbl → dead_diaeresis

Reattached the awk script.

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:26 PM, pmarin  wrote:
> Spanish keyboards use different keysyms which are generated by the
> following dead keys:
>
> asciitilde →  dead_tilde
> grave  → dead_grave
> asciicircum → dead_circumflex
> apostrophe → dead_acute
>
> The attached awk script can be used to fix the output of 'mklatinkbd -x':
>
>  mklatinkbd -x $PLAN9/lib/keyboard | awk -f spkeys.awk >$HOME/.XCompose
>
> Cheers.
> Pmarin
>


spkeys.awk
Description: Binary data

[9fans] Fwd: Fix for using Plan9 compose sequences with Spanish keyboards in X

[pmarin]

Spanish keyboards use different keysyms which are generated by the
following dead keys:

asciitilde →  dead_tilde
grave  → dead_grave
asciicircum → dead_circumflex
apostrophe → dead_acute

The attached awk script can be used to fix the output of 'mklatinkbd -x':

 mklatinkbd -x $PLAN9/lib/keyboard | awk -f spkeys.awk >$HOME/.XCompose

Cheers.
Pmarin


spkeys.awk
Description: Binary data

Re: [9fans] plan 9 compose sequences under X

[pmarin]

On Sun, Jan 2, 2011 at 9:41 PM, Russ Cox  wrote:

> Based on information from Anthony Martin, Tony Lainson, and
> Kris Maglione (thanks all!), I have added a -x flag to mklatinkbd,
> so that you can get the same compose sequences in GTK and QT
> programs that you can in Plan 9 programs.  Quoting the updated keyboard(7):

It works also in other x clients like xterm and tcl/tk.
Thank you Russ.

Cheers.
pmarin

Re: [9fans] Non-VESA video card

[pmarin]

The some of the raedon X1xxx series still use the PCI slot. Plan9
drivers is another story.
http://www.visiontek.com/1000-series-cards/radeon-x1300/radeon-x1300-256mb-pci.html

On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 7:21 AM, Ethan Grammatikidis
 wrote:
>
> On 27 Oct 2010, at 6:12 pm, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>
>> Can anyone recommend a current-production PCI (not -express) video card
>> that will run in native (NOT VESA) mode? I'm not too fussy about VGA vs.
>> DVI, but it would be nice if the driver supported both.
>
> Are there any in production at all? I tried to get one back in the AGP era
> and found it almost impossible; I eventually got a 1MB card second-hand
> which the shop staff had almost forgotten they had. I heard the situation
> improved a little bit after that (but still in the AGP era) because people
> wanted second cards, but PCI cards were significantly more expensive than
> AGP.
>
> With PCI-e allowing for at least 2 regular graphics cards in most machines
> and PCI-e 1x graphics cards filling the niche PCI cards filled in AGP
> machines, I'd be surprised if anyone's making PCI cards at all. I'm really
> curious what machine this is for.
>
>

Re: [9fans] Character CR in Plan9?

[pmarin]

I wanted to remove this character from some files. I tried to do it with
the p9p tr(1) and I noticed that It does not support '\r'.

[9fans] Character CR in Plan9?

[pmarin]

Hi all.

I notice that in Plan9 (p9p) the character CR is not represented with
'\r'. What I have to use instead?

Cheers.
pmarin

Re: [9fans] Where can i get teh code of the Paln 9

[pmarin]

http://www.plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/plan_9_wiki/
http://github.com/ericvh/plan-9/

On Mon, Nov 23, 2009 at 11:17 AM, vsong  wrote:
> Hi,
> I want to learn about the Plan 9 OS, and I want to read its source
> code and compile it.Where can i check out it?
>
> thx
>
>

Re: [9fans] Practical issue on using rc shell

[pmarin]

fortunately,  in unix you can run go :).


On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Nick LaForge  wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 12:46 PM, pmarin  wrote:
>> Fortu
>>
>> fortunately, the unix world is less radical, you can use rlfe
>> http://per.bothner.com/software/
>>
>> pmarin
>
> fortunately, plan9 includes a c compiler
>
> Nick
>
>

Re: [9fans] Practical issue on using rc shell

[pmarin]

Fortu

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 8:02 PM, David Leimbach  wrote:
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:54 AM, Tim Newsham  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I'm new to plan9 from user space. I've started using rc shell for
>>> scripts and, for daily use, I would like to solve a problem.
>>>
>>> I see that rc isn't built with readline or similar. So, do you use
>>> some alternative? Or do you think I can live without it?
>>
>> For scripting it shouldn't be an issue. For interactive use
>> it can be a pain if you are using a normal terminal environment.
>> In plan9 you'd usually run rc in a rio window or in acme where
>> the environment lets you edit and reuse commands from the scrollback.
>>
>
> If you've already got plan9 from user space, try using rc with 9term, or
> inside an Acme "win" session.
> Plan 9 is very mouse driven and you should use a terminal window that lets
> you take advantage of that interactivity.
> Dave
>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Maurício
>>
>> Tim Newsham | www.thenewsh.com/~newsham | thenewsh.blogspot.com
>

fortunately, the unix world is less radical, you can use rlfe
http://per.bothner.com/software/

pmarin

Re: [9fans] An excerpt from Syllable's description

[pmarin]

I wonder if is possible that underground operating systems like Haiku,
Aros or Plan9 should share some kind of knowledge database (not only
the source code) about drivers implementation and don't try to
reinvent the wheel. Haiku seems to do a great job, for example their
network drivers are taken from Freebsd, the sound drivers from OSS4,
etc.

On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 6:09 PM, John Floren wrote:
> Why do we have to care about every self-righteous pronouncement from
> every minor project out there? Why should we have to put everything
> into a "Plan 9 context"?
>
> If you want to relate Plan 9 to Syllable, look at their forums--it
> seems to have the same sort of problems as Plan 9. Lacking in drivers
> (a quick look showed that they don't have PCMCIA, WLAN, or PPP
> support), new users coming in expecting it to be like other operating
> systems (I'm looking at you, Balwinder) or trolls calling it dead, and
> in general an apparent lack of people writing programs for it.
> Syllable looks to be POSIX-compliant (I think) which is probably how
> they have Quake most of the other ported programs.
>
> John
>
> On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 2:13 AM, Balwinder S
> Dheeman wrote:
>> Computer scientists will tell you that their operating systems and tools
>> are fine, because they like them to be complex. Companies will tell you
>> that their machines or devices are fine, because they like to control
>> them by hiding requisite device specifications and, or applications
>> notes, even though you own them. Yet, some people remember a few
>> machines from decades ago that were different. They got run over in the
>> gold rush, but they proved that it is possible to build much more
>> helpful machines. And if it was possible then, it is certainly possible
>> now, because the hardware that computers are built from has become much
>> more powerful. It's the software that is often not working in the
>> interest of the owner. In the /Syllable/ project, we are using this
>> power to help the owner instead of the scientists and the big companies.
>>
>> Please comment the above in a Plan 9 context.
>> --
>> Balwinder S "bdheeman" Dheeman        Registered Linux User: #229709
>> Anu'z li...@home (Unix Shoppe)        Machines: #168573, 170593, 259192
>> Chandigarh, UT, 160062, India         Plan9, T2, Arch/Debian/FreeBSD/XP
>> Home: http://werc.homelinux.net/      Visit: http://counter.li.org/
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> "Object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing" -- Rob Pike
>
>

[9fans] [newbie] Some 9vx questions

[pmarin]

Hi all.
I am using 9vx compiled from the source code and using the full tree
(http://pdos.csail.mit.edu/~rsc/plan9.tar.bz2). When I start 9vx I have to press
the enter key twice:

->9vx -r plan9/ -u glenda
->256 memory: 0M kernel data, 256M user, 256M swap

->init: starting /bin/rc
->[ I press enter twice]
->[rio appears]

1- Which could be the problem?

when I try to update the system with  the pull script all the output is like:

! **/**/**: locally modified; will not update [ * ->  **]
2- What is happening?

3- which is the right way to go out from 9vx?
I currently use fshalt and them kill the 9vx window with de window manager.

4- Can I use drawterm to 9vx? which is the cpuserver?

Cheers