Re: [9fans] Fwd: Does sam have browse command
.,.+20p I checked the upe, and also the document of GNU ed. It seems that the `b' command is really a new feature. Then, when such a browse command was not here yet, how conveniently did users browse in page to page manner in ed or sam -d? Thanks.
Re: [9fans] Fwd: Does sam have browse command
Well, for what b provides this is probably good enough. You can use .+,.+20p for disjoined chunks, or .+-,.+20p for what b does in ed. It's all in the man page, though. * Hongzheng Wang ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Hi, Thanks. But it seems that this instruction only works in ed. With sam, however, the printed area will be increasely expanded each time rather than be disjoined ones. On Thu, Feb 28, 2008 at 4:58 PM, Martin Neubauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: .,.+20p I checked the upe, and also the document of GNU ed. It seems that the `b' command is really a new feature. Then, when such a browse command was not here yet, how conveniently did users browse in page to page manner in ed or sam -d? Thanks. -- HZ
Re: [9fans] awk, not utf aware...
Awk is one of the few programs in the ditribution that is maintained
externally (by Brian Kernighan) and is pulled in via ape and pcc (it might
actually be the only one - I didn't bother to check.) A quick glimpse at
lex.c suggests that awk scans input one char at a time. In hindsight I'm a
bit surprised that I haven't got bitten by this, but I probably didn't split
within multibyte sequences. It's probably not too hard to change awk to read
runes for the price of creating ``the other one true awk.''
Martin
* Gorka Guardiola ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
I think this has come up before, but I didn't found reply.
If I do in awk something like:
split($0, c, );
c should be an array of Runes internally, UTF externally, but apparently,
it is not. Is it just broken?, is there a replacement?, is it just the
builtins or
is the whole awk broken?.
Example, freqpair
--
#!/bin/awk -f
{
n = split($0, c , );
for(i=1; in; i++){
pair=c[i] c[i+1]
f[pair]++;
}
}
END{
for(h in f)
printf(%d %s\n, f[h], h);
}
--
% echo abcd|freqpair
1 ab
1 cd
1 bc
% echo aícd|freqpair
1 cd
1 �c
1 í
1 a�
where the ? is a Peter face...
Thanks.
--
- curiosity sKilled the cat
Re: [9fans] troff -man prints poorly
The problem most likely is the missing font informations. If you just use ``dpost -f'' (or the equivalent aux/download ... mentioned earlier) you should get just what you want. The reason the page display looks good is that you have access to the fonts as long as you don't leak the postscript outside a Plan 9 system. Martin * [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I've been writing a man page and wanted to see how it looks when formatted with troff and printed, so I tried: troff -man file | dpost | lp only to find that the printout was extremely ugly. Words seem to have run together in some very strange ways; if I had a scanner handy I could show what I mean. Anyway, the same thing happens when I do: troff -man /sys/man/1/cat | dpost | lp but not when I do: troff -ms /sys/doc/asm.ms | dpost | lp Am I missing something simple and fundamental, or is troff/dpost just broken? John
Re: [9fans] New to plan 9: what next?
* Pietro Gagliardi ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: First off, finish learning to use rc, rio, and acme. You'll need both of them :-) For large values of two, two equals three, for small values of three. Seriously, it's probobly easiest to understand how Plan 9 works and why it is the way it is by reading what you find in /sys/doc. Start with 9.ps and work yourself through the rest. A few things aren't really necessary to get started, but reading the titles and abstracts helps to sort things. The wiki is nice and contains quite a few descriptions of getting things done but provides little reasoning about design (notable exceptions are the pages on the colour scheme and the mouse vs. keyboard debate - there's really no need to carry this one back to the list.) Oh, and the man pages are great for reference.
Re: [9fans] How to move to rc from sh/bash
* Uriel ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: It is more likely that the information you want is not even in the man page, gnu man pages are severely crippled, and if you want the real documentation you have to travel to info hell which is likely to contain ten times as much (mis)information and be ten times harder to browse. And there you have the greatest innovation GNU has ever brought to unix, in gnu systems I rarely even bother checking the docs, because even random trial and error usually takes much less effort than navigating the fetid info swamp. uriel Damn, I was just going to ignore that mess.
Re: [9fans] How to move to rc from sh/bash
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: i would think that the reason to do this would be for consistency. i don't know that that's a compelling argument. but i can see the attraction of all or nothing; it would be nice if either none of the scripts used getflags or all of them did. - erik That's actually quite compelling to me. I'd be just in favour of some kind of `lazy evaluation' (if some script needs to be changed, put in getflags; ditto for new ones.) And I admit that if one is really tght pressed on space (which might still happen nowadays, if not nearly as often than a couple of years ago) it won't really matter havin to put in some effort to customise what's in /bin/rc. I'm still amused by the argument that getflags is faster, though. Martin
Re: [9fans] Hello Assembly
* Eris Discordia ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: That is probably because assembly was never intended for moving from one platform to another all the time, but for squeezing the most out of a given platform whose nooks and crannies you ken well. Nah, that's only what the intel assembler is for. Originally, assembly language was devised for not having to type in machine opcodes directly. With the advent of high level programming laguages its main merit became the ability to write those bits of operating system code that just cannot be written in a high level language. (Research) Unix was influential in that regard and showed that those parts are really small (and should be). Martin
Re: [9fans] How to move to rc from sh/bash
* Pietro Gagliardi ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
- The seq statement is standard
for (i in `{seq 1 10}) echo $i
Nope, seq is an external program (subject to the environment). On the other
hand, as Byron's rc is rather extinct by now, chances are if rc is available,
so is seq.
- aux/getflags is faster than while getopt (no loop involved)
My next plan is to rewrite all of /rc/bin to use aux/getflags. Any
objections?
Well, that isn't so much about rc's advantages. Keep in mind though that
this would force getflags to be present whenever you need a shell script.
For most installations this isn't an issue, but for those running Plan 9
embedded it is. And with space constraints providing some of /rc/bin might
be reasonable, providing aux/getflags might not. Besides, if a script
doesn't use more than two or three different options getflags doesn't reduce
much complexity (if you aren't writing a new script). And concerning speed,
if command line parsing dominates the execution time I honestly wouldn't
bother.
And what I dislike:
- [2=] is not the same as [2]/dev/null (some programs crash with
the former
I don't think it should be the same. Both are special cases for two
different operations.
But what's really great about rc:
% man bash | wc -l
4898
% man rc | wc -l
398
If I'd want to check the bash man page for some specific information,
chances are that I'm sound asleep before anything interesting comes up.
Martin
Re: [9fans] managing windows in rio
* Eris Discordia ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I have had similar questions about ways to streamline my Plan 9 experience since like... a week ago (that is when I began using it). Plan 9 interfaces I have seen (rio itself, the window to rc, acme) are too mousy, and I used to (and still do) curse Windows (and adore *BSD) for just that reason. The line editor, ed, on the other hand makes good use of the keyboard, but I really preferred the vi (vim, actually) way; I know, vi was originally built around ed. Well, the general attitude around here is that mouse interfaces aren't necessarily bad (and the Plan 9 ones are particularly effeicient once you get a grip on them). Also, the main applications (rio, acme, sam...) not configurable except by hacking the code is a design feature to encourage consistent behaviour across sites. That way I can sit down at about any Plan 9 machine and don't have to guess how the environment behaves. I'll still tackle a few of you specific questions: 1. to change the focus except by mouse? 2. to change acme's chording behavior? See above; chording is especially carefully crafted. It's probably more gratifying in the long run to just learn the standard chording methods. 3. to change acme's focus model from point-to-type to click-to-type? That's a tricky one. It would certainly be possible to change the focus behaviour, but that would cripple acme to a more conventional user interface. One of the things that make working with acme so pleasant is the fact that you don't have to click too much. Also, it could lead to inconsistencies (for example right click on a file name to open it: should the focus move to the new editing window because you'll likely want to edit the file content or should it stay on the drectory view (or whereever you have been) because you clicked there?) This might be a trivial case that could be easily decided on, but you'd inadvertently get less obvious corner cases. 4. to recall commands typed in an rc session without resorting to the middle mouse button (snarf+paste)? Erik Quanstrom(?) has a modified rc with basic readline behaviour in his contrib directory. 5. to make rc auto-scroll for programs that output many pages of text, e. g. a du on a deep directory tree, and to not block them after a single page? Rc doesn't block (cf. p(1) ); rio windows do, though. Rio(1) explains how you can handle this (and more). 6. to make rc auto-complete with the [tab] key, instead of the [ins] key? 7. to make rc auto-complete commands and not only file/directory names? That, too, is a feature of rio, not rc. The effect is that auto-completion isn't restricted to the shell, but there really isn't a sensible way to decide whether to complete file names or commands. And it's actually quite convenient to be able to juste type tab characters. You can use ctrl+f, though. 8. to make the [del] key delete the character at the caret as it does in many other environments? Del actually is the traditional interrupt key. I think Berkeley changed it to ctrl+c, but in the Plan 9 lineage leading back to 1st ed Unix it's been del all the time. Plus, you already have bs, and I'd conjecture that you are mor likely to delete what you have already typed than what you are going to type. 9. to search a manual page while reading it, and not by piping it through grep? You could just open the man page in acme. The usual search options are available then. Plus, you can then open related man pages with a single click. Hope I could help a bit, Martin
Re: [9fans] A newbie question...
* Anant Narayanan ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: The fact that the late-adopters, myself included, have had previous development and/or everyday use experiences with GNU stuff and that they ask of similarities and differences, unawares of whatever animosity towards the GNU thing has been brewing in your mind through the years, should not have anything to do with their need/ want to learn about Plan 9. They do not need your smart-alecky quoting of Rob Pike. What they need is some guidance in their transition, regardless of their purpose or previous experiences. If you are not kind enough to help, you can at least stand by while others do that. It helps to search the archives before posting. The issues concerning GNU or C++ have already been discussed several times before - rekindling the flames can only bring the old-timers to respond as they have. Cheers, Anant Another issue is the implicit assumption that a new environment which doesn't provide all the familiar things one is grown accustomed to is automatically defective. It's actually not that hard to just get to know things for a few weeks (Plan 9 really is pretty accessible) and then attempt to tackle usability issues that have arisen rather than trying to recreate a linux environment (particularly as there already is a perfectly adequate linux environment out there - it's called linux.) Perhaps Andrzej Rosłanowski put it best (speaking about set theory, though): ``If you want to read mathematics, first learn its language, get educated, don't complain about your willies.'' Martin
Re: [9fans] Serious Problem Running Plan 9 on Virtual PC
* Eris Discordia ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: The ISO image is the semi-official snapshot of the latest (or close to latest, depending on where you download the image from) Plan 9 4th Edition, which is not much of a release. Uhh, that's the way Plan 9 is released. It's been this way for quite a few years now. Just as official as you'll get.
Re: [9fans] A newbie question...
* Uriel ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Autotools badness is way beyond most peoples wildest imagination... Unfortunately, you don't have to imagine.
Re: [9fans] A newbie question...
* Pietro Gagliardi ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Autotools increases portability by 57%, but then decreases Actually, they increase the _impression_ of portability by 57%. The other effects are real, though.
Re: [9fans] Re: Building GCC
* Douglas A. Gwyn ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Note that you still need the #ifdef PLAN9 ... #endif, since that isn't standard C. Or you compile it with plan9port. Or you steal the ``#define USED...'' from p9p and put it into a compatibility header. Or...
Re: [9fans] Inferno /sys/doc: PDFs are actually PS?
* Wes Kussmaul ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: OpenOffice Writer can output to pdf. But can it input from ps (or troff output?) Martin
Re: [9fans] opera under linuxemu
For one, I think opera-static doesn't mean it's a static binary but qt is linked in statically. On the other hand, until just a couple years ago static linking in linux was no problem at all. But around the time linux 2.6 came out, the glibc guys apparently decided nobody used static linking anyway and merrily bollocksed it up. Great, now I'm depressed. * Federico G. Benavento ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: hola, getting real static binaries in linux is a bit tricky and no one seems to be doing so, they always need ld-linux.so, libnss and others. cinap creates some kind of bundles that create a fake ns in /tmp/$lbun with this (http://9hal.ath.cx/usr/cinap_lenrek/lbun/mklbun) or something like, but I know he got opera running in Plan 9. http://9hal.ath.cx/usr/cinap_lenrek/plan9opera.png
Re: [9fans] bungetc error
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I think after bgetc returns Beof, bungetc should change the state, but not decrement bp-icount. I don't think so. Bungetc ungets the last character read, not Beof.
Re: [9fans] portuguese - european keymap support
* Paulo ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Hello, I'd apreciate if someone is willing to help add support for the Portuguese - European keymap. What must be done? Thanks. In principle it's actually quite simple. First have a look at kbmap(1) and kbmap(3), then put a new mapping together. You might want to start with one already in /sys/lib/kbmap/ and work from there. (I don't know exactly, but the spanish map might make for a good starting point.) Altogether not too complicated, but still some gruntwork. And when you're done, don't forget the patch.
Re: [9fans] Compressed filesystem
venti?
Re: [9fans] 8c padding problem
Not exactly answering your question, but I'm not sure 8c gives meaning to #pragma pack. (I'm not starting to argue about exploiting the memory layout of structs...) Martin
Re: [9fans] rc: token buffer too short
Apparrently in quoted strings each character (rune, actually) constitutes one token. The lexical scanner only holds NTOK (==8192) tokens at a time and sam and wc convince me you have a 8555 byte string you pass to awk. You should probably put the awk stuff into a separate file eg.awk and just do `awk -f eg.awk $*' in eg (cf. chem(1) ). You might have to fiddle with where you put things, but that seems to be the easiest way out. Martin * Pietro Gagliardi ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Run /n/sources/contrib/pietro/eg (a work-in-progress troff preprocessor for graphs of equations). You get the error described above on a line that contains simply else. What happened?
Re: [9fans] p9p mk issue
I think what Russ meant was to put all complicated stuff that uses rc syntax into a separate file with MKSHELL=rc on top and include that in yor mkfiles (cf. mkone/mkmany on Plan 9). Martin
Re: [9fans] troff ignoring .eo/.ec after first time
ms(6) says: Many nroff and troff requests are unsafe in conjunction with this package, but the following requests may be used with impunity after the first .PP: `.bp', `.br', `.sp', `.ls', `.na'. Maybe this helps, Martin * Pietro Gagliardi ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Hello. Try this: tbl /n/sources/contrib/pietro/plan9prog.ms | troff -ms | page On about the third page, some code begins, but at the print() statement at the end there is some strangeness. If you look inside the .ms file, there are some .eo and .ec requests. .eo turns off \x and .ec turns it back on. But why is it ignored after that first page, which works correctly?
Re: [9fans] late to the party - Here docs
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
but it doesn't work if you use curly braces
Of course it does; the syntax is somewhat unexpected, though:
for(i in 1 2 3){
cat !
}
fu
!
fu
fu
fu
Martin
Re: [9fans] late to the party - Here docs
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
so if i wanted
for(i in 1 2 3){
cat !
fu
!
echo give me a break
}
what contortions do i need?
- erik
That would be
for(i in 1 2 3){
cat !
echo give me a break
}
fu
!
Martin
Re: [9fans] Font
http://mirtchovski.com/p9/freetype/ has some hints on that topic.
Re: [9fans] A few installation questions...
* Poly-poly man ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Firstly, from what I've seen in the docs, there'll be no problem using that and not touching anything else, right? If you wipe my Gentoo, I wipe your face! The more important problem is booting. I have grub installed in the mbr (from my gentoo installation), and would really like to keep grub. Assuming I install plan 9 in hda4 (or whatever you call it ;) ), what steps would I have to take to get it to be able to boot plan9? Installing in a dedicated partition next to some already installed system should be no problem. I have done this before without any trouble. As usual, check before writing a new partition table. At the end of the installation you will be asked about the boot method. Just leave the mbr alone and only write the plan 9 boot sector on the plan 9 partition. Then grub can use chainloading. 2. I live in America, where the government was stupid enough to change what day Daylight Savings Time changes fall on. Unfortunately, release 4 was released back in 2002 - before the new law came into play. What will I have to do to fix the daylight savings time rules? This is a particular problem, because I am planning on installing within the week (and this week is the week that should have been an hour back already, but is not yet under the new laws... stupid country ;) ). Nothing to worry about. You'd be hard pressed to get installation discs dating back from '02, so the time zone rules should be quite current. If not, just submit a patch.
Re: [9fans] detecting spam
* Pietro Gagliardi ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: How? When I put path=(/bin . /usr/pietro/bin) at the end of my /usr/pietro/profile, rc resets it. You probably shouldn't do this too much towards the end. In the standard lib/profile there is the line exec rio Whatever comes afterwards is irrelevant. Martin
Re: [9fans] drawterm authentication failure
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I did specify the authserver (it's the same machine). Nat shouldn't be a problem, because all machines in question are connected through a single hub. It's just that cpu works, drawterm from the system next to it doesn't. Conversely, drawterm to mordor, which lies behind a NAT'ing router, gives no trouble. sounds like a name resolution problem. - erik I'm not sure that's the issue. The host names are mutually known (as of last night, admittedly) and cpu with mutually unknown host names succeeds. I might be missing something obvious, though. Martin
[9fans] drawterm authentication failure
I've set up a new auth/cpu/fossil server via maht's make_cpuauth warlock. Things went smoothly for the most part, but if I try to connect to it drawterm does nothing for quite some time and finally prints: cpu: can't authenticate: plan9host: auth_proxy rpc: p9any client get tickets: p9sk1: gettickets: Operation timed out I don't quite have a clue what's going on (or, rather, not going on), but as I can boot terminals off the system and cpu in from other plan 9 hosts it seems that drawterm expects some network service cpu doesn't. Also, I dont think my drawterm is broken. I can connect to mordor just fine, for example. Baffled, Martin
Re: [9fans] here document
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: But for me the memory vs. temp file argument is largely irrelevant, due to ramfs. what does that mean? surely you're not running ramfs from your profile. No, but if you want here documents in memory you don't have to bother with implementing that in the rc binary. Just starting ramfs before running the script in question is enough. That takes care of almost all cases where that might be useful. If someone uses here documents in the profile that are so so big that those not being held in memory is a performance issue, there's probably so much wrong going on that I wouldn't bother anyway. And I agree, the rc quoting makes generating input quite painless. Personally, I usually feel the need for here documents when writing shell scripts on systems where no rc is available. Martin
Re: [9fans] here document
I think it is considerably easier to create here documents on the fly (eg. awk output) than correctly quoted strings. But for me the memory vs. temp file argument is largely irrelevant, due to ramfs. Martin * erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: the main argument i can see for having here documents at all is that they can be arbitrarily long. if you put the whole thing in memory, they would loose there reason for being. why not just use quotes? - erik
Re: [9fans] troff ps output vs. double quotes
Did you download the unicode postscript fonts? The invocation of aux/download is somewhat intricate, but in the list archives is a message from Russ(?) showing how it's done. I've got bitten before because of these German umlauts we're using here. * erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: when i try using this “ 201cleft double quotation mark ” 201dright double quotation mark the postscript looks fine on plan 9 but not elsewhere. if i used `` and '' instead and use /sys/doc/cleanup, the postscript doesn't look right either. what's the secret? - erik
Re: [9fans] Page problems
As I said, it is weekend and I've got a little time at my hands to look into this. The problem is indeed with the cacheing. A quick fix is this change to /sys/src/cmd/page/view.c: 136,138c136 if(im == nil) wexits(0); if(resizing) --- if(im resizing) I'm about to submit a patch with that for the powers that be. I haven't extensively tested the diff, but it is as unobtrusive as I could wish for. Martin
Re: [9fans] Page problems
I haven't read the mail properly. The diff is only aimed at my problem. I didn't experience Greg's symptoms, but I doubt I affected those. Martin
[9fans] page and plumbing
Hello, After a pull two days ago I noticed that plumbing images to page does not work any more. Page still starts but exits immediately before displaying anything. Starting page manually works as expected. As postscript and pdf files as well as other plumbing targets are unaffected led me to to suspect the new image handling code somehow interfers with plumbing. If nobody has a fix ready or some deeper insights, I might have some spare time to look into this a little further during the weekend. Martin
Re: [9fans] bind and namespace
* Antonin Vecera ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: In my home profile is bind -a $home/bin/rc /bin . Why is not in my namespace line bind -a /bin /bin ? What is different between bind -a $home/bin/rc /bin and bind -a $home/man/4 /sys/man/4 ? Antonin Essentially because before there is something like bind $cputype/bin /bin That assures that that there already is something $home/bin/rc can be unioned to. Martin
Re: [9fans] Re: everything is a directory
* jsnx ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I don't see how to architect the system I discussed without attributes. It's not hard to conceive a system that requires _any- set of features. Not impressed.
Re: [9fans] Is there `cp -r fdir/ tdir/` equivalent?
* Alexandre Vassalotti ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: The only thing that slightly bothers me, is that the standard Unix tools I am used to are relatively minimal. Why not using the standard Plan 9 tools instead? Anyway, all that to ask if there is an equivalent of `cp -r fdir/ tdir/` for making a copy of a directory. If not then it is not a problem, I will just add the recursive option to cp(1) myself. More seriously, the normal approach would be using tar. This and some more can be found in the 9fans archives or at http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/UNIX_to_Plan_9_command_translation/index.html . Martin
Re: [9fans] Announce: standalone libixp
* Enrico Weigelt ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I don't see the parallels between communistic society and the concept of dynamic linking, neither on the absolute power of multi level council goverment, nor an stricly top-down (or V-model based) economy controlling. Perhaps, because there are none? (At least not at the level you are assuming them to be.) Perhaps you should study literature a little before turning casual analogies into political manifestos. And yes, I grew up in East Germany, so I know what I'm talking about. If you take the same shallow approach to programming, I'll take Roman's point more serious any day.
Re: [9fans] a quick and simple minded study of configure.
* David Leimbach ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: it's not short, if you count the class implementation. it doesn't convey the idea - the solution is not understood unless you understand each piece. I disagree, to the extent that it really is short, in that it's one line :-) So is word_count(text); And a much simpler one at that.
Re: [9fans] booting... which video modes will be accepted?
Try different monitor settings. For example the documentation of my laptop claims it to have a xga display. However, I have to set monitor=versalx to have correct graphics. Xga should be the right setting for lcd displays though. In my experience colour depth never was an issue (impacts on performance of bitmap-heavy programs, notablysome in bin/games, aside). Martin
Re: [9fans] booting... which video modes will be accepted?
Reading the original mail again, it looks like the graphics card is not recognised. Have a look at http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Installation_troubleshooting/index.html (and submit a patch when you have found the right setting for your card). Martin
Re: [9fans] Broken auth after replica/pull
* Paul Lalonde ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] password. I've been unable to find this string anywhere in my config files anymore, and have rebooted the cpu server and restarted the drawterm. Could this (instead of [EMAIL PROTECTED]) be the source of my grief? Is there a way to fix it? Do you have a p9p factotum running on the machine you run drawterm on?
Re: [9fans] replica/pull -s / -v /dist/replica/network and rc error
* Federico G. Benavento ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: diskparts (which is run by termrc) needs that /dev/sysname to be set and because it isn't you get that error. I don't think that is quite correct. The error is indeed caused by an empty sysname, but happens in termrc after diskparts is run. It probably bails at the line if(test -e /cfg/$sysname/termrc) add sys=yourmachine ether=yournickmacaddr to your /lib/ndb/local to find out yourmacaddr cat /net/ether0/addr. Federico G. Benavento
Re: [9fans] replica/pull -s / -v /dist/replica/network and rc error
* Federico Benavento ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
exactly, because diskparts does
sysname='{cat /dev/sysname}
I see. I didn't think about this, as that line happens to be in termrc, too.
(And before subsequent uses of sysname.) But after all the error is
independent of diskparts. But you're right, I should check my facts
sometimes.
Martin
Re: [9fans] Error booting from latest plan9.iso download
* Wes ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: hmm, echoing machinename to /dev/sysname doesn't seem to be persistent across reboots and adding it to termrc also doesn't seem to take. Will I have to do this every bootup? The ``right'' solution would be to specify your network configuration in /lib/ndb/local. If you have only a single plan9 machine you can get away with ``echo hostname /dev/sysname'' in termrc (or, rather, termrc.local). Martin
Re: [9fans] bind error after today pull update
* David JEANNOT ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: init: starting /bin/rc bind: #k: unknown device in # filename This shouldn't be serious at all. The new diskparts script tries to bind the fs device, whis isn't compiled into the standard terminal kernel, into the namespace. I thought about making a patch to silence the bind, but it's probably a good idea to have the error messages if you are using the fs device. rc: null list in concatenation init: rc exit status: rc 23: error I'd like to make a wild guess here. Did you set up your network manually in your old termrc? What does `echo $sysname' say? `cat /dev/sysname' ? Martin
Re: [9fans] bell-labs website and plan9
* Devon H. O'Dell ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: The scenario being, I want to test my hypothetical replica/applylog action parser / diff generator. I run pull, which grabs stuff, but I've made changes to xyz.c and that file doesn't get modified because of local changes. So I want to roll back my log so I can run pull again with -s /sys/src/cmd/xyz.c This wouldn't be an issue if we added a '*' option to replica/pull for the -c and -s flags. But I'll send a patch for that shortly and see if that gets committed. --dho I'm not sure how serious that really is. You can always run ``pull -n'' (actually, I regularly do); and if you positively want to replace every locally modified file you can pipe the output through some trivial awk. Martin
Re: [9fans] Update on Fossil+Venti Stuff
* Devon H. O'Dell ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: 10.0.0.10# con -l /srv/fscons prompt: fsys main snaptime snaptime -a 0500 -s 60 -t 2880 I should note that I've manually modified this to happen a few times a day. Each time, my usage goes down a couple gigs. Why doesn't it just go ahead and sync everything? It does sync everything active. There are probably still some intermediate snapshots there that are not written to venti. Those stay there until they expire after 2 days (2880 minutes). You can always do an explicit snapclean or try lowering the time snapshots are kept. Martin
Re: [9fans] Update on Fossil+Venti Stuff
* Devon H. O'Dell ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: 2007/3/23, Martin Neubauer [EMAIL PROTECTED]: * Devon H. O'Dell ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: 10.0.0.10# con -l /srv/fscons prompt: fsys main snaptime snaptime -a 0500 -s 60 -t 2880 I should note that I've manually modified this to happen a few times a day. Each time, my usage goes down a couple gigs. Why doesn't it just go ahead and sync everything? It does sync everything active. There are probably still some intermediate snapshots there that are not written to venti. Those stay there until they expire after 2 days (2880 minutes). You can always do an explicit snapclean or try lowering the time snapshots are kept. I'm not disagreeing that this is supposed to happen, and I hate saying it's wrong, but it's not what I'm seeing, and I don't see anything invalid in my configuration. I can snap -a, and it won't go to venti. I ran snapclean and nothing went down. After that, I changed the snaptime so that it would run a Venti dump in 5 minutes. 10 minutes later, I see no difference. For snaptime, -a means ``time when to take archival dump.'' So you probably just made fossil dump 5 minutes after midnight. -s sets the interval (in minutes) between intermediate snapshots, -t the time (in minutes) after which old snapshots are discarded. If a snapshot of a file is referenced as the current version but isn't yet written to venti it is kept until the next dump. So I'm either missing something fundamental here, something's really broken, or I'm just dumb. I'm willing to concede the latter of the 3, but it would be really nice to be enlightened. Is there anything I can show you guys to help diagnose the issue further? If it helps, it took some time for me to get a grasp of the workings, too. (And I'm sure there are still plenty of pitfalls for me to run into...) Martin
Re: [9fans] Update on Fossil+Venti Stuff
Fossil is more like a write _buffer_ for venti. The interaction with venti takes place during the nightly dumps (at 5am for a default install; can be configured according to your needs). Fossil also regularly takes snapshots that aren't archived to venti. (Again, for a default setup snapshots every hour, kept for 8 days; can be configured otherwise.) The snapshots are taken for files that changed since the last snaptime; dumps are taken from files where the current epoch is greater than the last written to venti. Those procedures are quite well documented. The problems seem to arise when you write lots of new data between dumps (more than the fossil size; can be less when taking into account intermediate snapshots). I've been thinking about ways to cope with that lately, but wasn't too eager to post here until I'd actually have time to really delve into it (next month, or so). At the moment those are little more than some elaborations of possibilities already mentioned in the archives. I could do a write-up of what I could think of so far later tonight when I'm back home if there is wider interest in exploring possible enhancements (I'm not thinking of those asfixes) to fossil. I think it could be worthwhile, though. Martin P.S. I'm sure one could describe the current workings in more detail, but I'm too much in a hurry now.
Re: [9fans] How can I shift a variable other than ?
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: and more to the point, there have been no ideas yet that would break older rc scripts nor change the grammer or lexemes. even list assignment would be a matter of handling a case that currently gives an error. the grammer supports it. Specifically, there are two arguments supporting the change. First, it isn't really a new feature -- it just makes one already present more general (with a striking resemblance to the for loop.) Second, it doesn't break scripts in a harmful way (old scripts still run, new scripts run in an old rc abort -- if a correctly written script runs successfully it does what was intended in either case.) Martin
[9fans] sources/contrib problem
There seems to be a problem with the sources file server. When trying to access a directory below contrib/user/ I get venti i/o error block hash value Regular files don't seem to be affected. Martin
Re: [9fans] interesting potential targets for plan 9 and/or inferno
Perhaps one should rephrase it as `you are most comfortable with what you've already learned.' The main obstacle seems to be to acknowledge that your current environment might not be the universally best. But it seems that trend isn't really new, just increasing. It amazes me to no end that those linux gnus continuously emphasise that one has to spend some amount of time to grow comfortable with the command line, keyboard navigation in window managers and editors, and whatever else their current pet peeve may be, yet they aren't too willing to to the same about an environment they're not accustomed themselves. Martin
Re: [9fans] interesting potential targets for plan 9 and/or inferno
* ron minnich ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: The isses of Python and gcc are not simply academic. They're part of the DOE meal ticket. I happen to have lost what respect was left for gcc a couple of weeks ago when I tried to compile drawterm on a 64bit linux box. Gcc barfed on a malformed typedef in stddef.h. It might be the right thing nowadays, but a compiler not accepting a standard header (installed in a directory not only specific to said compiler but also to the compiler version) certainly is a bit gross. To be fair, the problem probably was the result of the combination of a 64bit (intel) architecture, the organisation of that specific distro, and the installed compiler, but I'm not sure it's even an excuse. (Testing, anyone?) So, while having a gcc port could be helpful for getting new users, the gcc folks should get their act together, rather then churning out ever new optimisation switches. Martin P.S. The problem with drawterm was trivially fixed by commenting out the offending line as none of the drawterm code was using it.
Re: [9fans] interesting potential targets for plan 9 and/or inferno
* ron minnich ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I prefer to go optimistic. I'm looking at Qt to see what it would take to have it drive libdraw on linux, just out of curiosity. If Qt can work on libdraw, I wonder if it could ever be native to Plan 9. Hey, if we got Qt on Plan 9, we might actually have a GUI that people don't hate right away ... then we can slowly, gradually suck them into the system ... slowly ... gradually ... until they're running rio without noticing ... ron One problem could be that Qt is C++ based. (Well, sort of, it uses an own preprocessor which parses the source code and apparently hasn't been updated to recognise some of the newer language features of the last twelve years or so.) The reason I know this is that I have to wade through this kind of things at work. A Plan 9 or Inferno based phone would really be neat, though. Martin
Re: [9fans] interesting potential targets for plan 9 and/or inferno
* ron minnich ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: opensource.motorola.com http://www.trolltech.com/products/qtopia/greenphone ron Interesting prospects. Especially as I've lost my cell phone recently. Martin
Re: [9fans] acme executing |command from a guide file
* Russ Cox ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: You can't put the |command in a guide file, but you can put it in the column tag (the one that reads New Cut Paste Snarf ...) or in the top tag (the one that reads Newcol Kill Putall Dump) and execute it when the desired window is current (is the last one you clicked on in that column or in the whole display, respectively). Wouldn't it be possible to put the ``|command etc...'' in a guide file, with a subsequent 2-1 chord on the Edit command in the tag line? It seems more like what was asked (though, personally, I usually use the tagline myself). Martin
Re: [9fans] Pull?
* Aki Nyrhinen ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: i just killed my system by doing a pull. pull does not work. Did you interrupt the pull? I tried it and it looked suspiciously like a problem that happened a few month ago - first about everything gets nuked and then the whole thing gets repopulated. I recall that Geoff had quite some work to get it fixed then. The fact that this time it happened just before both the weekend and christmas certainly isn't helping much.
Re: [9fans] /Library/LauchAgents/9pfs.plist
* ron minnich ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: of course , the gmail ads show this: http://www.xml.com/pub/a/2002/07/10/kip.html at which point my brain starts to hurt. No wonder. The first paragraph states ``This month we will continue in that vein''. 'Nuff said. Martin
Re: [9fans] system wide profile for rc(1)
Hello, I'm not quite sure what you want to achieve there (well, maybe I'm just slow). The net gain I see is two extra lines in rcmain and one additional file (actually two files) doing more or less the same as before. The two main usage scenarios I can think of would be a system used mainly by a single person and a system (or network of systems) used by a potentially large and diverse group of users. For a singleuser system that separation is more or less useless. For a multiuser system it might look like a good idea at first, but I value the convenience of having all settings I might want to customise in one place (especially as I get it via newuser anyway). The newuser script arguably is simpler, but the change really hasn't got anything to do with a system-wide profile and as a downside makes it no longer self-contained. All in all it's a little exercise in establishing a system policy for those who want it. Speaking for myself, it would certainly make me sad to see the rise of the POSIX-rc... Martin
Re: [9fans] system wide profile for rc(1)
* Russ Cox ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: One could also simply . /rc/lib/profile at the top of the user's lib/profile if conformance was desired. Russ I also thought about that after posting. Has the additional advantage of not forcing the view of the site admin on you. Martin
Re: [9fans] termrc changes
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: only two orders' magnitude difference. we've got to work on that. should be three. - erik I'm not sure we have to. It will be anyway before too long... Martin
Re: [9fans] Samterm up down key patch
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: isn't that a bit of an overreaction? readline is tens of kloc. but it has it's benefits. how else would a linux user learn how to reboot a cpu server. ??? I'm just inherently pessimistic... Martin
Re: [9fans] Samterm up down key patch
* ron minnich ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: this is a goofy argument. i haven't seen we've always done it this way trotted out as an argument. perhaps i missed it. If you change sam this way, it's inconsistent with rio and acme. reads to me like But it's always worked this way. I'm just questioning _gratuitious_ changes. One way to prevent those is to kick loose a discussion about them. (Side effects may include complete loss of focus on the subject at hand.) Martin
Re: [9fans] Samterm up down key patch
* ron minnich ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On 11/14/06, Martin Neubauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, I'm not quite convinced of the merit of that behaviour. The most direct consequence is that it makes sam inconsistent with acme and rio windows. But maybe rio and acme are wrong. Then so is sam (the standard one). I guess we can worry about internal consistency in plan 9, but fact is, in the rest of the known universe, uparrow goes up a line, downarrow goes down, they move the cursor. Don't I know it. Admittedly, it took me a while to get used to the way it is, but the fact is I _like_ it that way. The last thing I want to start is a cursor war. (I try to keep in mind I'm still considering my computer ideology-free.) We've got page up and page down; we could always use them. It was bad enough when right arrow and left arrow did what they did If we're halfway to readline, well, then, maybe people want it, and we should have it, and not having it was a mistake all along. You should be different if it makes sense; otherwise, don't. But the worst thing we can do is fall into the 'it's always worked this way' mantra. At that point, you might as well be a Fortran programmer. There isn't much to do than to agree with that. Perhaps I should work on not getting around as too harsh. I didn't want to dismiss the change per se, but just state my current opinion (which is liable to change any time without prior notice). Martin
Re: [9fans] Samterm up down key patch
Hello, I'm not quite convinced of the merit of that behaviour. The most direct consequence is that it makes sam inconsistent with acme and rio windows. While acme could be altered analogously, as soon as you've arrived at rio, you're halfway to readline. I'm not sure anybody would want that. Besides, personally I feel quit comfortable with sam as it is. If I want a line-based editor there still is ed. But by no means feel discouraged. After all, it's only my opinion. And even though I don't think it's the way to for the general distribution, there may be enough people using Plan 9 and sam who would appreciate your patch. Martin
Re: [9fans] scuzz doesn't like CD-RW?
* Pawe?? Lasek ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On 10/10/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Depending on the drive, you may also need to write multiples of 2048 bytes, padded if necessary. tar writes multiples of 512 bytes, so using dd to pad it might be necessary. Even then, if you write directly to /dev/sdD0/data, you'll need to fixate (close) the disc. Typical drives accept only 2048 bytes/sector (or variations for certain types of recording where you write not only data but also have to supply all that additional data which makes CD a 700 MB instead of full 1 GB :). IIRC 2048 b/s is standard sector size for data in CD-ROM standard Actually, the sector size is 2352 bytes, 2048 of which is data. The rest is mainly for error correction (which is vital for data and not needed for audio).
Re: [9fans] Binit and Bterm
* Joel âcheskyâ Salomon ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I'm actually leaving the Bterm in the code for clarity; I was just making a joke about leaving brittle code about so it can't be copied without understanding it. It will anyway. Martin
Re: [9fans] linux il/ip
* erik quanstrom ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: from what i can tell, SCTP combines the limitations of il with the complexity of tcp. i think porting il to linux would be more useful. - erik Is there then a chance to get il extended ti ipv6? Martin
Re: Importing mailboxes (Was re: [9fans] Accounts)
* Joel Salomon ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: ??? Can I be more specific when importing /net? I ususlly get away with just ``import /net/tcp'' Martin
Re: [9fans] APE fork()
* Ronald G Minnich (rminnich@lanl.gov) wrote: erik quanstrom wrote: it shaves several seconds off a build of libc on a 200MHz PPro. and then they use gcc. kind of defeats the purpose, doesn't it? yes, but think about it. It's so important! Why, a few seconds on a 200mhz machine is ... maybe .3 seconds on that kernel build on a new machine. If you add up those .3 seconds enough, it could be a year of your life. ron Yes, makes you forget the decade sacrificed to gcc... Martin
Re: [9fans] Environment variable
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
Thanks Martin,
Then, how to bring up an environment variable a to a shell variable b?
command
b=`{cat /env/a}
does not work all the time.
Hello,
I haven't tried, but
b=`{ifs='' cat /env/a}
might do the Right Thing.
Re: [9fans] Environment variable
* Martin Neubauer ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
On 2006/08/09, at 20:39, Martin Neubauer wrote:
Well, now I have tried. It doesn't do the trick.
b=`{cat /env/a}^''
gives a warning if a is an empty string but works otherwise.
b=$`{basename /env/a}
is the cleanest solution, I think.
The solution is same as
b=$a
this works if a is already a shell variable.
Try
c=''# null string
a=()
b=()
cp /env/c /env/a
then exec
b=$`{basename /env/a}
I see what you are trying to accomplish. Probably
b=$`{cat /env/a}
will do.
And iterating a bit further, I found this doesn't work with out a
temp:
tmp=`{cat /env/a}
b=$tmp
Re: [9fans] Environment variable
I was more thinking about this:
term% a=()
term% c=''
term% cp /env/c /env/a
term% xd -c /env/a
000 00
001
term% t=`{cat /env/a}
term% xd -c /env/t
000
000
term% b=$t
term% xd -c /env/b
000 00
001
term%
Re: [9fans] Status of 3C589D driver (and BCM57XX)
* Lyndon Nerenberg ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Are there any known issues with the 3C589 driver? I've been trying to get a 589D PCMCIA card working on my laptop, with limited success. The card probes and net/ether0 appears, but I don't see any data coming in. The stats counters do show data being received, so I'm a bit puzzled. I actually had the same trouble with a 589E. I solved it by putting the card into the second PCMCIA slot... Now the only thing is that the link indicator stays off, but I couldn't care less. Good luck, Martin
