NT restore to different hardware revisited......
A few weeks ago I sent an email asking if anyone could give me some directions on how to restore WINNT on different hardware. Thanks to everyone who responded. I was able to accomplish the restore. It is a little tricky but not hard. If anyone else likes to know the process, please send me an email individually. Regards Raminder Braich [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: NT restore to different hardware
Ok, click here: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;Q249694. This MS knowledge base article is called "How to Move a Windows 2000 Installation to Different Hardware". This is the key document that you need for Win2K. Note the following section: If the computer does not restart after restoration because of HAL mismatches, perform an in-place installation to make repairs. To do this: Restart the computer from the installation media. On the "Welcome to Setup" screen, press ENTER as if performing a new installation. When the licensing screen appears, accept the licensing agreement. Setup will then search for previous installations to repair. When the installation that is damaged is found, press R to repair the selected installation. Setup re-enumerates your computer's hardware (including HAL) and performs an in-place upgrade while maintaining your programs and user settings. This also refreshes the %SystemRoot%\Repair folder with accurate information that you can use for typical repairs if they are required in the future. You see the type of motherboard doesn't even matter. Yes, the document talks about migrating and not DR'ing. But when you go through all the steps you will see that YOU CAN restore Win2K and NT4.0 to dissimilar hardware. The trick is knowing how to run repair process on the reboot after the system object restore. I have done it. It does work. Many people are weighing in on this and that is great but if you haven't done it then please don't say it can't be done. Simply say you haven't done it. Kyle -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Nicholas Cassimatis Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 1:00 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware Having DR recovered my share of NT boxes, I'll throw in my $0.02 worth here. The NT/W2K/XP(/Win9x) registry has entries/pointers/references/who-knows-what that refer to all kinds of things on the local machine. Including all installed software, user accounts, and hardware. To BMR a client, the target machine needs to be "Very Similar" to the source. Anything too different and Windows won't come up. Copy the registry, in whole, from a Compaq to a HP server (and do it in a BMR style, without the system up), and see what happens. Try it with AIX (or other Unix) - just reload your mksysb on a different machine, and see if the ODM lets you come up clean. Try a Mac - take the drive from one series machine and drop it in another one - same problem (Try that with an Amiga, if you have one, and it works up to the 4000, but that's a different story...). AIX has a nice trick where you can reload the mksysb, also having the AIX install CD in the drive, and have it go get what it needs to come up, but that's build into the OS. Windows doesn't have anything like that at this point. BMR restore to unlike hardware is hard, but not impossible. You need to be careful what you bring down and apply to the registry, you need to practice your plan, then you need to practice it again, and again, and again. I learn something new on every DR Test I attend, because things are always changing. Nick Cassimatis Today is the tomorrow of yesterday.
Re: NT restore to different hardware
Having DR recovered my share of NT boxes, I'll throw in my $0.02 worth here. The NT/W2K/XP(/Win9x) registry has entries/pointers/references/who-knows-what that refer to all kinds of things on the local machine. Including all installed software, user accounts, and hardware. To BMR a client, the target machine needs to be "Very Similar" to the source. Anything too different and Windows won't come up. Copy the registry, in whole, from a Compaq to a HP server (and do it in a BMR style, without the system up), and see what happens. Try it with AIX (or other Unix) - just reload your mksysb on a different machine, and see if the ODM lets you come up clean. Try a Mac - take the drive from one series machine and drop it in another one - same problem (Try that with an Amiga, if you have one, and it works up to the 4000, but that's a different story...). AIX has a nice trick where you can reload the mksysb, also having the AIX install CD in the drive, and have it go get what it needs to come up, but that's build into the OS. Windows doesn't have anything like that at this point. BMR restore to unlike hardware is hard, but not impossible. You need to be careful what you bring down and apply to the registry, you need to practice your plan, then you need to practice it again, and again, and again. I learn something new on every DR Test I attend, because things are always changing. Nick Cassimatis Today is the tomorrow of yesterday.
Re: NT restore to different hardware
Check out: How to Troubleshoot Windows 2000 Hardware Abstraction Layer Issues,
Microsoft Knowledge Base article 237556, for a better description of the
issues. The biggest issue is the power management of the chip set, in
other words, the motherboard.
Orville L. Lantto
Datatrend Technologies, Inc. (http://www.datatrend.com)
IBM Premier Business Partner
121 Cheshire Lane, Suite 700
Minnetonka, MN 55305
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Kyle Payne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
01/23/2003 04:18 PM
Please respond to payne
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc:
Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware
Sure, it would be best if you had the same or very similar hardware to DR
onto. If you do then the DR process is of course much easier.
For those of you who want to know if this is a requirement, it simply
isn't.
Here are the requirements.
1) If NT4.0 enterprise was on the original server then NT4.0 enterprise
must
be used for the DR. You can't take something that was backed up on Win2K
and restore it to a server using Win2K Advanced Server or NT4.0.
2) You must also use the same patch level that means SP and any hotfixes.
Ok, some hotfixes may not matter but most do.
3) If you had a Multiprocessor system then you must DR to a multiprocessor
system because MS has a different kernel for single -vs.- multiprocessor
systems.
That's it.
If you have a different NIC, HBA, or SCSCI card in the DR system then you
will of course have to install new for the new cards. However, those
things
will not stop a DR/BR. You don't even have to have the same server
manufacturer.
Some customers need to get some of their servers up and running on
machines
that are as fast or faster than they were in production, I don't doubt
this.
However, in some cases that isn't necessary and not economically feasible
which is why I am posting this.
You CAN DR both NT4.0 and Win2K onto different hardware so long as you
follow the requirements I listed above.
Kyle Payne
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
William SO Ng
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 11:30 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware
First of all, TSM is only an application that runs on OS. It is not a
super software that can work for all types of machines for all ages of OS.
It must work with OS to call file system to read/write files. Therefore,
a
disaster recovery plan must have a COMPATIBLE machines at DR site. If a
production site is running W2K on P4 with UTP 10BaseT Ethernet card and I
don't believe DR site will use a 286 machine with BNC card. Not only W2K
may not work not a 286, one may not be able to find a network driver for
this machine. I believe the basic requirement for a DR is to have
COMPATIBLE machine that can boot up with the same OS version, same type of
tape drive and sufficient disk space to restore data. I wouldn't expect
my
Window XP server running on P4 to be able to start up on IBM AT with
640MB,
right ? So the planning of DR is to have compatible machines, not
identical machines.
The way to set up DR for TSM is to have a compatible machine with the same
OS version, patch level, same type of tape drive. Install TSM on it. If
anything happened on TSM at production site, just restore TSM database and
it will be fine. It is not necessary to have identical machine, but you
have ensure that you have the same OS version, patch level, same TSM
version and already configure the tape drive/library. For example, you
can
have a RAID disk for TSM server at production site but non-RAID disk as
TSM
server for DR site. TSM does not carry about RAID because it is OS level,
NOT TSM level. So can have different machine in this sense.
Thanks & Regards
William
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Re: NT restore to different hardware
Sure, it would be best if you had the same or very similar hardware to DR onto. If you do then the DR process is of course much easier. For those of you who want to know if this is a requirement, it simply isn't. Here are the requirements. 1) If NT4.0 enterprise was on the original server then NT4.0 enterprise must be used for the DR. You can't take something that was backed up on Win2K and restore it to a server using Win2K Advanced Server or NT4.0. 2) You must also use the same patch level that means SP and any hotfixes. Ok, some hotfixes may not matter but most do. 3) If you had a Multiprocessor system then you must DR to a multiprocessor system because MS has a different kernel for single -vs.- multiprocessor systems. That's it. If you have a different NIC, HBA, or SCSCI card in the DR system then you will of course have to install new for the new cards. However, those things will not stop a DR/BR. You don't even have to have the same server manufacturer. Some customers need to get some of their servers up and running on machines that are as fast or faster than they were in production, I don't doubt this. However, in some cases that isn't necessary and not economically feasible which is why I am posting this. You CAN DR both NT4.0 and Win2K onto different hardware so long as you follow the requirements I listed above. Kyle Payne [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of William SO Ng Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 11:30 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware First of all, TSM is only an application that runs on OS. It is not a super software that can work for all types of machines for all ages of OS. It must work with OS to call file system to read/write files. Therefore, a disaster recovery plan must have a COMPATIBLE machines at DR site. If a production site is running W2K on P4 with UTP 10BaseT Ethernet card and I don't believe DR site will use a 286 machine with BNC card. Not only W2K may not work not a 286, one may not be able to find a network driver for this machine. I believe the basic requirement for a DR is to have COMPATIBLE machine that can boot up with the same OS version, same type of tape drive and sufficient disk space to restore data. I wouldn't expect my Window XP server running on P4 to be able to start up on IBM AT with 640MB, right ? So the planning of DR is to have compatible machines, not identical machines. The way to set up DR for TSM is to have a compatible machine with the same OS version, patch level, same type of tape drive. Install TSM on it. If anything happened on TSM at production site, just restore TSM database and it will be fine. It is not necessary to have identical machine, but you have ensure that you have the same OS version, patch level, same TSM version and already configure the tape drive/library. For example, you can have a RAID disk for TSM server at production site but non-RAID disk as TSM server for DR site. TSM does not carry about RAID because it is OS level, NOT TSM level. So can have different machine in this sense. Thanks & Regards William |-+> | | Salak Juraj | | | <[EMAIL PROTECTED]| | | T> | | | Sent by: "ADSM: | | | Dist Stor| | | Manager" | | | <[EMAIL PROTECTED]| | | .EDU>| | || | || | | 23/01/2003 22:34 | | | Please respond to| | | "ADSM: Dist Stor | | | Manager" | | || |-+> >--- -| | | | To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | cc: | | Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware | | | | | >--- -| Hello Raminder, It is not that simple. Do not get confused with reasons for this problem - this is definitely an operating system related issue, and not one of backup software. Some procedures for disaster recovery on different hardware are described on microsoft web site but are NOT supported. Their limitations are almost independant on backup software. It is even not sure if you will be able to perform installation of today´s operating system on a computer from 2008, so why would you expect it from a backup software? Basically you complain about only one particular dependen
Re: NT restore to different hardware
-First of all, TSM is only an application that runs on OS. It is not a super software that can work for all types of machines for all ages of OS. It must work with OS to call file system to read/write files. It may not run on all OS's but according to this http://www.tivoli.com/products/index/storage-mgr/platforms.html link it says Win NT 4.0 SP 6a is a supported platform. To me supported means that all the components of the application work for that platform. Now does supported platform mean that TSM works only for backups on NT and not for restores? If that is what supported platform means then I am SOL. -Therefore, a disaster recovery plan must have a COMPATIBLE machines at DR site. If a production site is running W2K on P4 with UTP 10BaseT Ethernet card and I don't believe DR site will use a 286 machine with BNC card. Not only W2K may not work not a 286, one may not be able to find a network driver for this machine. How do you define compatibility? Would a Compaq server be compatible with a dell or an IBM server. All of them can run many versions of windows. Does it mean they are compatible. If they are, how about their network cards and video cards? Every manufacturer uses different cards. Even if you take the same manufacturer IBM 7000 M10 vs. IBM eserver x360 are they compatible? Well, they are not at least to WIN NT. -I believe the basic requirement for a DR is to have COMPATIBLE machine that can boot up with the same OS version, same type of tape drive and sufficient disk space to restore data. I wouldn't expect my Window XP server running on P4 to be able to start up on IBM AT with 640MB, right ? So the planning of DR is to have compatible machines, not identical machines. I highly doubt if you just need compatible hardware. Were it so simple, how come there is no documentation for the restore procedure? As others have said the restore process is not even supported by MS. No you may not be able to start Windows XP server running on P4 on IBM AT but you sure can run it on a pc with 300Mhz with 128MB. The way to set up DR for TSM is to have a compatible machine with the same OS version, patch level, same type of tape drive. Install TSM on it. If anything happened on TSM at production site, just restore TSM database and it will be fine. It is not necessary to have identical machine, but you have ensure that you have the same OS version, patch level, same TSM version and already configure the tape drive/library. For example, you can have a RAID disk for TSM server at production site but non-RAID disk as TSM server for DR site. TSM does not carry about RAID because it is OS level, NOT TSM level. So can have different machine in this sense. Thanks & Regards William |-+> | | Salak Juraj | | | <[EMAIL PROTECTED]| | | T> | | | Sent by: "ADSM: | | | Dist Stor| | | Manager" | | | <[EMAIL PROTECTED]| | | .EDU>| | || | || | | 23/01/2003 22:34 | | | Please respond to| | | "ADSM: Dist Stor | | | Manager" | | || |-+> >--- -| | | | To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | cc: | | Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware | | | | | >--- -| Hello Raminder, It is not that simple. Do not get confused with reasons for this problem - this is definitely an operating system related issue, and not one of backup software. Some procedures for disaster recovery on different hardware are described on microsoft web site but are NOT supported. Their limitations are almost independant on backup software. It is even not sure if you will be able to perform installation of today´s operating system on a computer from 2008, so why would you expect it from a backup software? Basically you complain about only one particular dependency among many others: - your data depends now as well as in 5 years on all of:know-how, application, organisational issues (passwords!) - applications depends on know-how and on operating system - operating system depends on know-how and on hardware - not to speak about cross-dependencies with other applications, network, legal regulations.. No backup software will ever be able to backup all of it, you only can create your backup for your particular con
Re: NT restore to different hardware
First of all, TSM is only an application that runs on OS. It is not a
super software that can work for all types of machines for all ages of OS.
It must work with OS to call file system to read/write files. Therefore, a
disaster recovery plan must have a COMPATIBLE machines at DR site. If a
production site is running W2K on P4 with UTP 10BaseT Ethernet card and I
don't believe DR site will use a 286 machine with BNC card. Not only W2K
may not work not a 286, one may not be able to find a network driver for
this machine. I believe the basic requirement for a DR is to have
COMPATIBLE machine that can boot up with the same OS version, same type of
tape drive and sufficient disk space to restore data. I wouldn't expect my
Window XP server running on P4 to be able to start up on IBM AT with 640MB,
right ? So the planning of DR is to have compatible machines, not
identical machines.
The way to set up DR for TSM is to have a compatible machine with the same
OS version, patch level, same type of tape drive. Install TSM on it. If
anything happened on TSM at production site, just restore TSM database and
it will be fine. It is not necessary to have identical machine, but you
have ensure that you have the same OS version, patch level, same TSM
version and already configure the tape drive/library. For example, you can
have a RAID disk for TSM server at production site but non-RAID disk as TSM
server for DR site. TSM does not carry about RAID because it is OS level,
NOT TSM level. So can have different machine in this sense.
Thanks & Regards
William
|-+>
| | Salak Juraj |
| | <[EMAIL PROTECTED]|
| | T> |
| | Sent by: "ADSM: |
| | Dist Stor|
| | Manager" |
| | <[EMAIL PROTECTED]|
| | .EDU>|
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| | 23/01/2003 22:34 |
| | Please respond to|
| | "ADSM: Dist Stor |
| | Manager" |
| ||
|-+>
>|
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| To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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| cc:
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| Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware
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Hello Raminder,
It is not that simple.
Do not get confused with reasons for
this problem - this is definitely an operating system related issue,
and not one of backup software.
Some procedures for disaster recovery on different hardware
are described on microsoft web site but are NOT supported.
Their limitations are almost independant on backup software.
It is even not sure if you will be able to perform
installation of today´s operating system
on a computer from 2008,
so why would you expect it from a backup software?
Basically you complain about only one particular dependency among many
others:
- your data depends now as well as in 5 years on all of:know-how,
application, organisational issues (passwords!)
- applications depends on know-how and on operating system
- operating system depends on know-how and on hardware
- not to speak about cross-dependencies with other applications, network,
legal regulations..
No backup software will ever be able to backup all of it,
you only can create your backup for your particular configuration.
maximalistic solution:
if this problem is important enough,
keep copy of all dependant parts,
likedata,
manuals, passwords, access lists,
SW installation media,
SW installation and configuration description,
a n d quite naturally a copy of hardware as well.
best regards ;)
juraj Salak
> -Original Message-
> Fr
Re: NT restore to different hardware
You can restore both NT4.0 and Win2K to different hardware. We have developed the procedures to do both and have done it many times. What made the research hard was the lack of 1 place to go to find the information needed. In the end I had to use rebooks, TSM Manuals and MS knowledge base articles. In addition a lot of testing. If someone was in a critical situation then I would be happy to work with them offline to help them get this done. However, do to the investment made in the procedures I can't post them to the list. Sorry. If you want further information please contact me directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Kyle -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Braich, Raminder Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 8:00 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware Looks like there is no easy way to do a restore to different hardware. What happens if there is a disaster and you cannot get your 5 year old server from anywhere. How is TSM going to restore to that server! To me it looks like TSM is very good at taking backups and managing them but in the restore department I have serious doubts. How are other people doing their disaster recovery exercises? Do you keep identical hardware at DR site also? What happens if you need a faster server? There have been references to Redbook SG24-4880, however, this redbook tells you how to do a restore on identical hardware only. All comments are welcome.. Thanks Raminder Braich SAP/Oracle DBA The Davey Tree Expert Company Kent, OH, 44240.
Re: NT restore to different hardware
Hello Raminder, It is not that simple. Do not get confused with reasons for this problem - this is definitely an operating system related issue, and not one of backup software. Some procedures for disaster recovery on different hardware are described on microsoft web site but are NOT supported. Their limitations are almost independant on backup software. It is even not sure if you will be able to perform installation of today´s operating system on a computer from 2008, so why would you expect it from a backup software? Basically you complain about only one particular dependency among many others: - your data depends now as well as in 5 years on all of:know-how, application, organisational issues (passwords!) - applications depends on know-how and on operating system - operating system depends on know-how and on hardware - not to speak about cross-dependencies with other applications, network, legal regulations.. No backup software will ever be able to backup all of it, you only can create your backup for your particular configuration. maximalistic solution: if this problem is important enough, keep copy of all dependant parts, likedata, manuals, passwords, access lists, SW installation media, SW installation and configuration description, a n d quite naturally a copy of hardware as well. best regards ;) juraj Salak > -Original Message- > From: Braich, Raminder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 3:00 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: NT restore to different hardware > > > Looks like there is no easy way to do a restore to different > hardware. What > happens if there is a disaster and you cannot get your 5 year > old server > from anywhere. How is TSM going to restore to that server! To > me it looks > like TSM is very good at taking backups and managing them but > in the restore > department I have serious doubts. > How are other people doing their disaster recovery exercises? > Do you keep > identical hardware at DR site also? What happens if you need a faster > server? > There have been references to Redbook SG24-4880, however, > this redbook tells > you how to do a restore on identical hardware only. > > All comments are welcome.. > > Thanks > Raminder Braich > SAP/Oracle DBA > The Davey Tree Expert Company > Kent, OH, 44240. >
Antwort: Re: NT restore to different hardware
Hi, just 2 cents worth, wenn you restore a W2k server to different HW you have to install W2k first using the drivers for your HW. -The server is not in a Domain, but has the same name and IP address, -you restore the registry, then you restore the remainder of the files, you reboot. -when the server starts you press F6 and start up in savemode, if that is possible ( SCSI controller). - you add all your driver software for the new HW and boot in normal mode. - if W2k won't boot at all boot to the recovery console and and copy the driver files needed to the system etc directory. Generally speaking it has always worked, when we tested it, but so far, out of a lot of servers we only ever had to restore the data partitions of the servers. For DB servers we won't have that problem because they never last 5 years anyway, everyone always starts to complain that they are too slow, which means new HW in a matter of 2 years. Just a thought Best Regards Markus Veit An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Kopie: Thema: Re: NT restore to different hardware [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received : 23.01.2003 15:00 Bitte antworten an "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" Looks like there is no easy way to do a restore to different hardware. What happens if there is a disaster and you cannot get your 5 year old server from anywhere. How is TSM going to restore to that server! To me it looks like TSM is very good at taking backups and managing them but in the restore department I have serious doubts. How are other people doing their disaster recovery exercises? Do you keep identical hardware at DR site also? What happens if you need a faster server? There have been references to Redbook SG24-4880, however, this redbook tells you how to do a restore on identical hardware only. All comments are welcome.. Thanks Raminder Braich SAP/Oracle DBA The Davey Tree Expert Company Kent, OH, 44240.
Re: NT restore to different hardware
Looks like there is no easy way to do a restore to different hardware. What happens if there is a disaster and you cannot get your 5 year old server from anywhere. How is TSM going to restore to that server! To me it looks like TSM is very good at taking backups and managing them but in the restore department I have serious doubts. How are other people doing their disaster recovery exercises? Do you keep identical hardware at DR site also? What happens if you need a faster server? There have been references to Redbook SG24-4880, however, this redbook tells you how to do a restore on identical hardware only. All comments are welcome.. Thanks Raminder Braich SAP/Oracle DBA The Davey Tree Expert Company Kent, OH, 44240.
Re: NT restore to different hardware
This can be a tricky proposition due to "HAL" differences. There is some
guidance in the Microsoft Knowledge Base, but such Restores are not
supported by Microsoft.
The easiest, and most sure strategy is to reload the OS and applications
onto the new box and restore the data. If you insist on trying to do a
"Bare Metal Restore" onto new hardware, the basic strategy is to install a
temporary OS and TSM client into a different directory (Not WinNT
directory), restore everything from TSM, and then use the Win 2K recovery
console, or the NT 4 repair procedure, to fix the HAL components.
I advise my clients to go the "Just Restore the Data Route", because it is
has less risks and I feel results in a cleaner and more reliable server.
Orville L. Lantto
Datatrend Technologies, Inc. (http://www.datatrend.com)
IBM Premier Business Partner
121 Cheshire Lane, Suite 700
Minnetonka, MN 55305
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments, is
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distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please
contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original
message.
"Braich, Raminder" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
01/22/2003 12:53 PM
Please respond to "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager"
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc:
Subject:NT restore to different hardware
Hello,
Can anyone please provide me detailed instructions or point me towards
them to restore NT to different hardware. We are in the process of
upgrading
our servers and I cannot find any information to restore the OS,
particularly Windows NT, to a different hardware.
Any and all help is appreciated.
Thanks
Raminder Braich
NT restore to different hardware
Hello, Can anyone please provide me detailed instructions or point me towards them to restore NT to different hardware. We are in the process of upgrading our servers and I cannot find any information to restore the OS, particularly Windows NT, to a different hardware. Any and all help is appreciated. Thanks Raminder Braich
