Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
I think this all gets back to eager anticipation of TSM v6 features being expressed about a year ago, when excitement about a DB2 database was countered by experienced cautions to "beware what you wish for". The "classic" ADSM/TSM database was tailored to the product, and contained efficiencies. DB2 is a general database, where you can expect more space utilization in its overall processing. See http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/tsminfo/v6/index.jsp?topic=/com.ibm.itsm.srv.doc/c_archive_log_space.html for some basic information, and IBM document numbers 7015353 and 7015525 for webcast PDF material on the new database. Richard Sims
TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Hi, I have successfully upgraded a customer TSM 5.5.2 to TSM 6.1 with just 18 GB of TSM database. We took backups of about 30nodes and later found the TSM server is stopped because of filesystem full on Linux. I found that both tsm log and archive log file systems were full. In about 5 hours TSM filled the 55 GB space. After moving the logs to a different filesystem, TSM started. Next day same thing happens but this time after moving the logs, tsm database did not come up. TSM 6.1 is now also become a lousy product like other Tivoli Management software. Another pain is the reporting tool. Could anybody explain why TSM generate so many transaction logs? Regards, Sajjad +-- |This was sent by it-ti...@hotmail.com via Backup Central. |Forward SPAM to ab...@backupcentral.com. +--
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Howdy, For the backup processing of the TSM server database, the model as implemented for TSM V6 was done in order to preserve behavior and the automation or scheduling that may already be built around this... The development team is fully aware of the fact that DB Backup using a single session/process model may become less viable as the server database size increases. We expect that TSM will need to deliver enhancements to the database backup processing in order to adequately protect the server in a timely manner... Some of the requirements or enhancement requests that may be considered in this area: 1) Volume stacking - this is a long standing market requirement to allow for incremental database backups to be stacked on the same volume as other incremental backups of the FULL database backup. This way large capacity tape cartridges can be better utilized and such. 2) Parallel database backup streams. Essentially allow the backup to run using multiple inbound sessions to the server and multiple concurrent output volumes. This is the divide and conquer approach basically carving the server database up into more streams so that the time needed to do this backup is reduced. Note that this works against or in competition with #1 above and the volume stacking - as this item will likely require more output volumes to be available for use. 3) Snapshot backup of the server database where appropriate device snapshot capabilities are available and can be exploited for this purpose. TSM certainly has these capabilities and knowledge as we do so already using our Advanced Copy Services and Copy Services products. This is a matter of orchestrating and managing this appropriately from the TSM server. The items listed above are possible solutions or enhancements that would improve or mitigate database backup/restore issues that a large TSM V6 server database may encounter either now or in the future... While this is not a commitment to deliver these items now or in the future the main take away here is that we understand the need for improvements in this area... Thanks, Colin - Colin Dawson TSM Server Development col...@us.ibm.com From: "Strand, Neil B." To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Date: 06/04/2009 06:39 AM Subject:Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Grigori, If deduplication is your driving force, you really need to evaluate if a VTL or NAS appliance may be a better solution for your environment. There are several out there and some have evolved to provide primary storage dedup. I agree that the massive increase in resources is troubling but, compare current hardware with what was available when TSM V4 first came out. TSM is not for small environments - it is an enterprise solution which requires enterprise resources. The evolution to DB2 was desprately needed not only to help contain TSM server sprawl but to also allow more resources to be dedicated to improving TSM functionality rather than maintaining the old TSM database. I currently have 16 AIX TSM servers in 2 locations and am planning to consolidate to between 4 and 8 servers each having a bit more hardware than the current servers. I will be able to do this because the database will be stable above 500GB. I realize that backups will take a bit of time but hopefully IBM will implement parallel backup processing and I will be able to backup a 1+TB TSM DB in less than 2 hours and restore it in less than 5. Del Hoobler, If you have some input to TSM evolution, please consider a command line switch or server setting which would allow multiple parallel backup and restore processes for the database - similar to what can be done in IBMs Data Warehouse environment. Cheers, Neil Strand Storage Engineer - Legg Mason Baltimore, MD. (410) 580-7491 Whatever you can do or believe you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic. -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of Grigori Solonovitch Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 1:08 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems I have found next disadvantages in TSM 6.1: 1) installation is much more complicated. I think this is coming together with DB2. I was not able to install TSM 6.1 in manual mode. I have used GUI assistant to complete all tasks. In my opinion, it is not good, because I am not a beginner in TSM (10 years!); 2) TSM 6.1 requires much more disk resources. Database is much bigger (not only +40% declared in documentation). Using de-duplication + reclamation produces 2-3 times more logs. In addition, new requirements came for archived logs. Usually archived logs are bigger than logs. There is automatic cleaning procedure for archived logs, which requires 2 or 3 full backups of database. As a result, archived logs are kept at least for 3 days in case of using f
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
On 5 jun 2009, at 23:32, Clark, Robert A wrote: TSM server 6.1 supports Windows server on x32 Intel, Linux on x32 not so much? I just wish the x345 I picked up on CL was 64bit. For some reason, very early in the project support for 32 bit linux has been dropped. I know there was at one time a 32bit linux build, why IBM decided to drop support for 32bit linux beats me. As for TSM on Linux, I've been running it in my home lab since version 5.5.0.0 without any problems. 5.5.0.0 only went down for hardware (vmware) maintenance. I'm ready to go to 6.1 as soon as I'm confident that 6.1 has stabilized (and the virtual volume server has been upgraded to 6.1). I'd think that would be at about 6.1.3 as things are now. To me, I'd choose Linux over Windows any time. It's a pity that Intel still sells 'server' CPU's that can't run 64bit code -- Met vriendelijke groeten, Remco Post r.p...@plcs.nl +31 6 248 21 622
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Sorry for the broken quoting. >> May I infer then that you have no nodes running recent versions of >> windows server? >You may. My TSM servers run on AIX, all the way. I'll include only by reference my long-term antipathy towards MS products. The price advantage is gradually making me (whiningly) approach running on linux. But there'll be a -lot- of whining on the way. :) Yeah, by nodes I meant... well... nodes. As in "query node". And by windows server I meant as in "Windows Server 2003 SE", or "Windows Server 7 (Vista 2)". TSM server 6.1 supports Windows server on x32 Intel, Linux on x32 not so much? I just wish the x345 I picked up on CL was 64bit. >> I realize that it take two to tango, and MS has become prodigious at >> shitting the bed with broken WMI writers, SNP bugs, setting the >> default VSS provider to whatever a third party product installed last >> and providing no way to change it, etc. But I have Windows admins that >> want to mass defect back to the 5.3 client as they have the abiding >> perception that anything later is crap. > Hmm. You're talking clients, here. I've got loads of windows _clients_, (of course). Hard to backup without working clients. Funny that. >> They also complain bitterly of an ASR/BMR restore process that >> Machiavelli, Kafka, or Stanslaw Lem would be proud of, and install >> BESR. >Is that TSM's fault? My sense (as an observer) is that ASR is a huge delicate pile of frozen offal. BMR is hard under the best of circumstances, and MS has no motiviation to make life easy for IBM. As Yoda said, "Do, or do not. There is no 'try'.". I'll stop whinging on. >When folks want BMR, I tell them to go find a product that does BMR. >Back up their ghost server or something. >- Allen S. Rout DISCLAIMER: This message is intended for the sole use of the addressee, and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the addressee you are hereby notified that you may not use, copy, disclose, or distribute to anyone the message or any information contained in the message. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete this message.
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
>> On Fri, 5 Jun 2009 13:20:24 -0700, "Clark, Robert A" >> said: > May I infer then that you have no nodes running recent versions of > windows server? You may. My TSM servers run on AIX, all the way. I'll include only by reference my long-term antipathy towards MS products. The price advantage is gradually making me (whiningly) approach running on linux. But there'll be a -lot- of whining on the way. :) > I realize that it take two to tango, and MS has become prodigious at > shitting the bed with broken WMI writers, SNP bugs, setting the > default VSS provider to whatever a third party product installed > last and providing no way to change it, etc. But I have Windows > admins that want to mass defect back to the 5.3 client as they have > the abiding perception that anything later is crap. Hmm. You're talking clients, here. I've got loads of windows _clients_, (of course). > They also complain bitterly of an ASR/BMR restore process that > Machiavelli, Kafka, or Stanslaw Lem would be proud of, and install > BESR. Is that TSM's fault? My sense (as an observer) is that ASR is a huge delicate pile of frozen offal. BMR is hard under the best of circumstances, and MS has no motiviation to make life easy for IBM. When folks want BMR, I tell them to go find a product that does BMR. Back up their ghost server or something. - Allen S. Rout
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
May I infer then that you have no nodes running recent versions of windows server? I realize that it take two to tango, and MS has become prodigious at shitting the bed with broken WMI writers, SNP bugs, setting the default VSS provider to whatever a third party product installed last and providing no way to change it, etc. But I have Windows admins that want to mass defect back to the 5.3 client as they have the abiding perception that anything later is crap. They also complain bitterly of an ASR/BMR restore process that Machiavelli, Kafka, or Stanslaw Lem would be proud of, and install BESR. In fairness to Tivoli, things have been getting better lately. The brand new algorithm in the 5.5.2.0 client that doesn't take 5 hours to figure out which SYSTEMSTATE objects to expire is a nice touch. I'm a fan of TSM, and would fight to keep something like Avamar out. But there are days when I wouldn't fight very hard. DB2, Notes, and TSM can be administered on ISC. What a trifecta. [RC] -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of Allen S. Rout Sent: Friday, June 05, 2009 7:09 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems >> On Thu, 4 Jun 2009 15:12:03 -0700, "Clark, Robert A" said: > It seems that many of us have a parental relationship with the > product. In any other case, we would likely have severed the > connection some time ago. going up, audits? You think you're a domestic US car maker?> The marketing nonsense is certainly ridiculous, but I don't think I've seen the code quality particularly go down. I'm another one of the 2.1 veterans, and the stability and lack of errors I see in TSM is an important point in its favor. Where we see the flighty, erratic behavior is in the layers folks are trying to paint on top of the product. The much-maligned ISC, for example. Websphere is a joke, so that makes AC on ISC on WS a triple-decker joke, foisted on us by some Vice President in Tivoli who has a Vision of Unified Management. - Allen S. Rout DISCLAIMER: This message is intended for the sole use of the addressee, and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the addressee you are hereby notified that you may not use, copy, disclose, or distribute to anyone the message or any information contained in the message. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete this message.
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
>> On Thu, 4 Jun 2009 15:12:03 -0700, "Clark, Robert A" >> said: > It seems that many of us have a parental relationship with the > product. In any other case, we would likely have severed the > connection some time ago. going up, audits? You think you're a domestic US car maker?> The marketing nonsense is certainly ridiculous, but I don't think I've seen the code quality particularly go down. I'm another one of the 2.1 veterans, and the stability and lack of errors I see in TSM is an important point in its favor. Where we see the flighty, erratic behavior is in the layers folks are trying to paint on top of the product. The much-maligned ISC, for example. Websphere is a joke, so that makes AC on ISC on WS a triple-decker joke, foisted on us by some Vice President in Tivoli who has a Vision of Unified Management. - Allen S. Rout
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
I was told by an IBM insider that ISC was written by someone who's daddy at IBM didn't have anything better for him to do. Buddy Howeth Computer Operations Specialist Information Systems Pacific Coast Producers Corporate Offices 631 N. Cluff Ave Lodi, CA 95240-0756 (209) 367-8800 - Main# (209) 367-6288 - Computer Room (209) 366-6240 - Alpha Pager "Allen S. Rout" Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" 06/05/2009 07:08 AM Please respond to "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" To ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU cc Subject Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems >> On Thu, 4 Jun 2009 15:12:03 -0700, "Clark, Robert A" said: > It seems that many of us have a parental relationship with the > product. In any other case, we would likely have severed the > connection some time ago. going up, audits? You think you're a domestic US car maker?> The marketing nonsense is certainly ridiculous, but I don't think I've seen the code quality particularly go down. I'm another one of the 2.1 veterans, and the stability and lack of errors I see in TSM is an important point in its favor. Where we see the flighty, erratic behavior is in the layers folks are trying to paint on top of the product. The much-maligned ISC, for example. Websphere is a joke, so that makes AC on ISC on WS a triple-decker joke, foisted on us by some Vice President in Tivoli who has a Vision of Unified Management. - Allen S. Rout _ Scanned by IBM Email Security Management Services powered by MessageLabs. For more information please visit http://www.ers.ibm.com _
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Hey you kids, get off my yard! It seems that many of us have a parental relationship with the product. In any other case, we would likely have severed the connection some time ago. Clearly the product is facing a challenge with its peers and up and comers, and needs to show ongoing improvement and increased value. Or to put it another way "we choose to " ... rebuild TSM on DB2 ... " in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too." Short of unbundling an NSM, this is easily the biggest challenge I've seen TSM admins (myself included)face. Sometimes I have hope that the nascent third-party helper applications will offer some help, but some of them aren't even ready for the transition to 6.x. This list makes a positive impact, by surfacing obscure tecnical knowledge, and disabusing people of their preconceived notions. It may be time for Tivoli/IBM to put some liasons in place, and offer people a hand as they make this difficult transition. [RC] -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of Richard Sims Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 5:18 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems On Jun 4, 2009, at 7:21 AM, Hans Christian Riksheim wrote: > ... > Frankly, I am a bit worried. I look at the bloat at Passport > Advantage(4GB download for reporting? Seriuos?) and it seems that > every piece of s**t software that IBM has produced now is forced upon > us. > Already TSM in itself has a steep learning curve with a lot of > different "strange" concepts, but IBM obviously doesn't seem to think > this is enough in their ongoing effort to scare off potential > customers. An installation of 6.1 with reporting and administration on > a small site with for example a 2 drive, 40 slot library will require > how many servers? 3? One for TSM, one for admin and one for reporting? > ... Indeed. I've been with the product since ADSM v.2, and have seen it grow enormously. Even having been part of that evolution, the growing amount of complexity can be overwhelming. We see customers writing in having difficulty with even basic functionality in the product: Having to additionally cope with LAN-Free, Library Manager/Client, encryption key management, Fibre Channel fabric and other technologies to make things work has to be daunting. (And don't overlook inscrutable licensing regimens.) This certainly creates opportunities for competitors offering streamlined, straightforward solutions to data assurance needs. Realization of this may be why IBM acquired the targeted B/R product Fastback from FilesX last year. The TSM product is obviously trying to accommodate all the latest technologies out there so as to meet all needs. The difficulty in trying to do that is that the result can be a huge monolith of a product with such intertwined development requirements that implementing seemingly simple new features can entail an inordinate amount of time and coordination. The danger in that approach is in ending up with a massive composite like Microsoft did with Windows, with its Longhorn/Vista development debacle. I'd instead go for a more modular approach, where customers can acquire and plug in what they really need, toward more efficient, focused solutions to their needs. This would make for more streamlined, timely development, and new releases that customers eagerly embrace rather than recoil from in fear. Richard Sims DISCLAIMER: This message is intended for the sole use of the addressee, and may contain information that is privileged, confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the addressee you are hereby notified that you may not use, copy, disclose, or distribute to anyone the message or any information contained in the message. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete this message.
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Grigori, If deduplication is your driving force, you really need to evaluate if a VTL or NAS appliance may be a better solution for your environment. There are several out there and some have evolved to provide primary storage dedup. I agree that the massive increase in resources is troubling but, compare current hardware with what was available when TSM V4 first came out. TSM is not for small environments - it is an enterprise solution which requires enterprise resources. The evolution to DB2 was desprately needed not only to help contain TSM server sprawl but to also allow more resources to be dedicated to improving TSM functionality rather than maintaining the old TSM database. I currently have 16 AIX TSM servers in 2 locations and am planning to consolidate to between 4 and 8 servers each having a bit more hardware than the current servers. I will be able to do this because the database will be stable above 500GB. I realize that backups will take a bit of time but hopefully IBM will implement parallel backup processing and I will be able to backup a 1+TB TSM DB in less than 2 hours and restore it in less than 5. Del Hoobler, If you have some input to TSM evolution, please consider a command line switch or server setting which would allow multiple parallel backup and restore processes for the database - similar to what can be done in IBMs Data Warehouse environment. Cheers, Neil Strand Storage Engineer - Legg Mason Baltimore, MD. (410) 580-7491 Whatever you can do or believe you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic. -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of Grigori Solonovitch Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 1:08 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems I have found next disadvantages in TSM 6.1: 1) installation is much more complicated. I think this is coming together with DB2. I was not able to install TSM 6.1 in manual mode. I have used GUI assistant to complete all tasks. In my opinion, it is not good, because I am not a beginner in TSM (10 years!); 2) TSM 6.1 requires much more disk resources. Database is much bigger (not only +40% declared in documentation). Using de-duplication + reclamation produces 2-3 times more logs. In addition, new requirements came for archived logs. Usually archived logs are bigger than logs. There is automatic cleaning procedure for archived logs, which requires 2 or 3 full backups of database. As a result, archived logs are kept at least for 3 days in case of using full backup for database every day. Just imagine if you are using weekly full backup for database!!!???. Note I did not use mirroring for logs and archived logs. With mirroring it will be full crash at all from disk space requirements; 3) TSM 6.1 requires much more CPU and memory resources than TSM 5.5 and not only for de-duplication. During testing I am running backups and copies without de-duplication (numpr=0) and than de-duplication + reclamation after completion of backups and copies. In addition to dsmserv process there is db2sync process which is usually much heavier than dsmserv; 4) I have found very strange TSM behavior during some commands like "delete volume ... discarddata=yes". Command reports successful completion, but process is still running with heavy load from db2sync. I am not sure, but it can be a bug. I hope this information will be interesting for TSM admins. I will deeply appreciate any kind of information (good or bad) about TSM 6.1.X. It looks, we need to implement TSM 6.1 because of de-duplication Grigori G. Solonovitch Senior Technical Architect Information Technology Bank of Kuwait and Middle East http://www.bkme.com Phone: (+965) 2231-2274 Mobile: (+965) 99798073 E-Mail: g.solonovi...@bkme.com Please consider the environment before printing this Email -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of Zoltan Forray/AC/VCU Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:59 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Definitely wait for 6.1.2 or a possible 6.1.1.1 release I have been "promised" to address a problem that was possibly introduced in 6.1.1. I agree - way too unstable for production. Watch out for the hidden storage/disk requirements plus the need for 3-FULL DB backups before it purges archived transaction logs! From: Grigori Solonovitch To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Date: 06/03/2009 09:47 AM Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" You are completely right. It is much more difficult to install TSM 6.1 in comparison with any previous version. Upgrade is going to be very painful and long as well. I have installed TSM 6.1 under AIX 5.3 - it is very unstable. I have upgraded to TSM 6.1.1 - it looks a little bit better. I am testing 6.1.1 now, but I am going to wait for TSM 6
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
On Jun 4, 2009, at 7:21 AM, Hans Christian Riksheim wrote: ... Frankly, I am a bit worried. I look at the bloat at Passport Advantage(4GB download for reporting? Seriuos?) and it seems that every piece of s**t software that IBM has produced now is forced upon us. Already TSM in itself has a steep learning curve with a lot of different "strange" concepts, but IBM obviously doesn't seem to think this is enough in their ongoing effort to scare off potential customers. An installation of 6.1 with reporting and administration on a small site with for example a 2 drive, 40 slot library will require how many servers? 3? One for TSM, one for admin and one for reporting? ... Indeed. I've been with the product since ADSM v.2, and have seen it grow enormously. Even having been part of that evolution, the growing amount of complexity can be overwhelming. We see customers writing in having difficulty with even basic functionality in the product: Having to additionally cope with LAN-Free, Library Manager/Client, encryption key management, Fibre Channel fabric and other technologies to make things work has to be daunting. (And don't overlook inscrutable licensing regimens.) This certainly creates opportunities for competitors offering streamlined, straightforward solutions to data assurance needs. Realization of this may be why IBM acquired the targeted B/R product Fastback from FilesX last year. The TSM product is obviously trying to accommodate all the latest technologies out there so as to meet all needs. The difficulty in trying to do that is that the result can be a huge monolith of a product with such intertwined development requirements that implementing seemingly simple new features can entail an inordinate amount of time and coordination. The danger in that approach is in ending up with a massive composite like Microsoft did with Windows, with its Longhorn/Vista development debacle. I'd instead go for a more modular approach, where customers can acquire and plug in what they really need, toward more efficient, focused solutions to their needs. This would make for more streamlined, timely development, and new releases that customers eagerly embrace rather than recoil from in fear. Richard Sims
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Thanks for the pioneer work with 6.1! Myself and other free riders are in deep gratitude to those contributing to making version 6 stable and useful. When the dust settles in a year or so I too may choose to upgrade knowing that others have taken the risk of losing their data and personal sanity in making version 6 a success. Frankly, I am a bit worried. I look at the bloat at Passport Advantage(4GB download for reporting? Seriuos?) and it seems that every piece of s**t software that IBM has produced now is forced upon us. Already TSM in itself has a steep learning curve with a lot of different "strange" concepts, but IBM obviously doesn't seem to think this is enough in their ongoing effort to scare off potential customers. An installation of 6.1 with reporting and administration on a small site with for example a 2 drive, 40 slot library will require how many servers? 3? One for TSM, one for admin and one for reporting? Hope TSM don't end up as DB2, a database in use by IBM only shops. I apologize in advance for the negativity expressed above. Hans Chr. -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of Zoltan Forray/AC/VCU Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 7:05 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems I could write a book. I have personally opened 4-apars and have tripped upon numerous other issues. As for the DB backups required to clear the transaction archive logs: http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/tsminfo/v6/topic/com.ibm.itsm.s rv.doc/c_archive_log_space.html This one caught me off guard. I was testing 6.1 by ex/importing a large node (which I am going to eventually move, in reality). With 40M objects to move, it blew out 350GB of my 450GB disk, in transaction archive logs. I was unaware (yeah, yeah.RTFM..) of the requirement for 3-FULL DB backups (I now schedule 3-FULL DB backups every day) per the document linked to, above. Speaking of the DB backups, currently, the majority of them end up with a timestamp of 2047/11/30, thus making a standard "del volhist" worthless (keep having to use FORCE to delete them). See IC61173. From: "Allen S. Rout" To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Date: 06/03/2009 12:05 PM Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" >> On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 09:58:50 -0400, Zoltan Forray/AC/VCU said: > I agree - way too unstable for production. Watch out for the hidden > storage/disk requirements plus the need for 3-FULL DB backups before > it purges archived transaction logs! More details, Zoltan? - Allen S. Rout This email originates from Steria AS, Biskop Gunnerus' gate 14a, N-0051 OSLO, http://www.steria.no. This email and any attachments may contain confidential/intellectual property/copyright information and is only for the use of the addressee(s). You are prohibited from copying, forwarding, disclosing, saving or otherwise using it in any way if you are not the addressee(s) or responsible for delivery. If you receive this email by mistake, please advise the sender and cancel it immediately. Steria may monitor the content of emails within its network to ensure compliance with its policies and procedures. Any email is susceptible to alteration and its integrity cannot be assured. Steria shall not be liable if the message is altered, modified, falsified, or even edited.
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
I have found next disadvantages in TSM 6.1: 1) installation is much more complicated. I think this is coming together with DB2. I was not able to install TSM 6.1 in manual mode. I have used GUI assistant to complete all tasks. In my opinion, it is not good, because I am not a beginner in TSM (10 years!); 2) TSM 6.1 requires much more disk resources. Database is much bigger (not only +40% declared in documentation). Using de-duplication + reclamation produces 2-3 times more logs. In addition, new requirements came for archived logs. Usually archived logs are bigger than logs. There is automatic cleaning procedure for archived logs, which requires 2 or 3 full backups of database. As a result, archived logs are kept at least for 3 days in case of using full backup for database every day. Just imagine if you are using weekly full backup for database!!!???. Note I did not use mirroring for logs and archived logs. With mirroring it will be full crash at all from disk space requirements; 3) TSM 6.1 requires much more CPU and memory resources than TSM 5.5 and not only for de-duplication. During testing I am running backups and copies without de-duplication (numpr=0) and than de-duplication + reclamation after completion of backups and copies. In addition to dsmserv process there is db2sync process which is usually much heavier than dsmserv; 4) I have found very strange TSM behavior during some commands like "delete volume ... discarddata=yes". Command reports successful completion, but process is still running with heavy load from db2sync. I am not sure, but it can be a bug. I hope this information will be interesting for TSM admins. I will deeply appreciate any kind of information (good or bad) about TSM 6.1.X. It looks, we need to implement TSM 6.1 because of de-duplication Grigori G. Solonovitch Senior Technical Architect Information Technology Bank of Kuwait and Middle East http://www.bkme.com Phone: (+965) 2231-2274 Mobile: (+965) 99798073 E-Mail: g.solonovi...@bkme.com Please consider the environment before printing this Email -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of Zoltan Forray/AC/VCU Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:59 PM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Definitely wait for 6.1.2 or a possible 6.1.1.1 release I have been "promised" to address a problem that was possibly introduced in 6.1.1. I agree - way too unstable for production. Watch out for the hidden storage/disk requirements plus the need for 3-FULL DB backups before it purges archived transaction logs! From: Grigori Solonovitch To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Date: 06/03/2009 09:47 AM Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" You are completely right. It is much more difficult to install TSM 6.1 in comparison with any previous version. Upgrade is going to be very painful and long as well. I have installed TSM 6.1 under AIX 5.3 - it is very unstable. I have upgraded to TSM 6.1.1 - it looks a little bit better. I am testing 6.1.1 now, but I am going to wait for TSM 6.1.2 before production upgrade. Mike wrote: " The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release?" Grigori G. Solonovitch Senior Technical Architect Information Technology Bank of Kuwait and Middle East http://www.bkme.com Phone: (+965) 2231-2274 Mobile: (+965) 99798073 E-Mail: g.solonovi...@bkme.com Please consider the environment before printing this Email -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of mfrank Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 11:58 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release? Mike +-- |This was sent by michael.fr...@data-protector.com via Backup Central. |Forward SPAM to ab...@backupcentral.com. +-- Please consider the environment before printing this Email. "This email message and any attachments transmitted with it may contain confidential and proprietary information, intended only for the named recipient(s). If you have received this message in error, or if you are not the named recipient(s), please delete this email after notifying the sender immediately. BKME cannot guarantee the integrity of this communication and accepts no liability for any damage caused by this email or its attachments due to viruses, any other defects, interception or unauthorized modification. The information, views, opinions and comments of thi
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
can you share this please or is it clasified ? ;-) On Wed, Jun 3, 2009 at 11:33 AM, Remco Post wrote: > My upgrade-plan for > production environments is long! ;) >
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
I could write a book. I have personally opened 4-apars and have tripped upon numerous other issues. As for the DB backups required to clear the transaction archive logs: http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/tsminfo/v6/topic/com.ibm.itsm.srv.doc/c_archive_log_space.html This one caught me off guard. I was testing 6.1 by ex/importing a large node (which I am going to eventually move, in reality). With 40M objects to move, it blew out 350GB of my 450GB disk, in transaction archive logs. I was unaware (yeah, yeah.RTFM..) of the requirement for 3-FULL DB backups (I now schedule 3-FULL DB backups every day) per the document linked to, above. Speaking of the DB backups, currently, the majority of them end up with a timestamp of 2047/11/30, thus making a standard "del volhist" worthless (keep having to use FORCE to delete them). See IC61173. From: "Allen S. Rout" To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Date: 06/03/2009 12:05 PM Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" >> On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 09:58:50 -0400, Zoltan Forray/AC/VCU said: > I agree - way too unstable for production. Watch out for the hidden > storage/disk requirements plus the need for 3-FULL DB backups before it > purges archived transaction logs! More details, Zoltan? - Allen S. Rout
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
>> On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 09:58:50 -0400, Zoltan Forray/AC/VCU >> said: > I agree - way too unstable for production. Watch out for the hidden > storage/disk requirements plus the need for 3-FULL DB backups before it > purges archived transaction logs! More details, Zoltan? - Allen S. Rout
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Definitely wait for 6.1.2 or a possible 6.1.1.1 release I have been "promised" to address a problem that was possibly introduced in 6.1.1. I agree - way too unstable for production. Watch out for the hidden storage/disk requirements plus the need for 3-FULL DB backups before it purges archived transaction logs! From: Grigori Solonovitch To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Date: 06/03/2009 09:47 AM Subject: Re: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems Sent by: "ADSM: Dist Stor Manager" You are completely right. It is much more difficult to install TSM 6.1 in comparison with any previous version. Upgrade is going to be very painful and long as well. I have installed TSM 6.1 under AIX 5.3 - it is very unstable. I have upgraded to TSM 6.1.1 - it looks a little bit better. I am testing 6.1.1 now, but I am going to wait for TSM 6.1.2 before production upgrade. Mike wrote: " The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release?" Grigori G. Solonovitch Senior Technical Architect Information Technology Bank of Kuwait and Middle East http://www.bkme.com Phone: (+965) 2231-2274 Mobile: (+965) 99798073 E-Mail: g.solonovi...@bkme.com Please consider the environment before printing this Email -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of mfrank Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 11:58 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release? Mike +-- |This was sent by michael.fr...@data-protector.com via Backup Central. |Forward SPAM to ab...@backupcentral.com. +-- Please consider the environment before printing this Email. "This email message and any attachments transmitted with it may contain confidential and proprietary information, intended only for the named recipient(s). If you have received this message in error, or if you are not the named recipient(s), please delete this email after notifying the sender immediately. BKME cannot guarantee the integrity of this communication and accepts no liability for any damage caused by this email or its attachments due to viruses, any other defects, interception or unauthorized modification. The information, views, opinions and comments of this message are those of the individual and not necessarily endorsed by BKME."
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Hi Mike, I've tried to do an update of our TSM database on a test server (60Gb DB, AIX) and everything works fine until the DSMSERV LOADFORMAT stage where it hangs (I can't see any I/O activity on the server nor files are created). Even a manual loadformat fails. Does anyone experienced the same issue?? Best Regards, Oscar -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of mfrank Sent: 03 June 2009 09:58 To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release? Mike +-- |This was sent by michael.fr...@data-protector.com via Backup Central. |Forward SPAM to ab...@backupcentral.com. +-- This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by an antivirus scanner for the presence of computer viruses. ING Direct NV is a limited liability company incorporated in The Netherlands. Registered in England & Wales, Branch Ref BR7357, 410 Thames Valley Park Drive, Reading, Berkshire, RG6 1RH. --- ATTENTION: The information in this electronic mail message is private and confidential, and only intended for the addressee. Should you receive this message by mistake, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, reproduction, distribution or use of this message is strictly prohibited. Please inform the sender by reply transmission and delete the message without copying or opening it. Messages and attachments are scanned for all viruses known. If this message contains password-protected or encrypted attachments, the files have NOT been scanned for viruses by the ING mail domain. Always scan attachments before opening them. ING Direct NV is limited liability company incorporated in The Netherlands. Registered in England & Wales, Branch Ref BR7357, 410 Thames Valley Park Drive, Reading, Berkshire, RG6 1RH. ---
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
Hi, On 3 jun 2009, at 10:57, mfrank wrote: The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. I have installed TSM 6.1 on various platforms (AIX, Linux (OpenSUSE and Debian) and windows 2k3) several times. It takes some getting used to, but is actually not that much harder than 5.5 Upgrading the database does take some time, but it appears to be much faster than an audit ;-) I've just done a test conversion of my 5.5 database (about 1 GB... test) to 6.1.1 without much problems. Having said that, it's all in the preparation. My upgrade-plan for production environments is long! ;) Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release? Mike -- Met vriendelijke groeten/Kind regards, Remco Post
Re: TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
You are completely right. It is much more difficult to install TSM 6.1 in comparison with any previous version. Upgrade is going to be very painful and long as well. I have installed TSM 6.1 under AIX 5.3 - it is very unstable. I have upgraded to TSM 6.1.1 - it looks a little bit better. I am testing 6.1.1 now, but I am going to wait for TSM 6.1.2 before production upgrade. Mike wrote: " The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release?" Grigori G. Solonovitch Senior Technical Architect Information Technology Bank of Kuwait and Middle East http://www.bkme.com Phone: (+965) 2231-2274 Mobile: (+965) 99798073 E-Mail: g.solonovi...@bkme.com Please consider the environment before printing this Email -Original Message- From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ads...@vm.marist.edu] On Behalf Of mfrank Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 11:58 AM To: ADSM-L@VM.MARIST.EDU Subject: [ADSM-L] TSM 6.1 Installation Problems The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release? Mike +-- |This was sent by michael.fr...@data-protector.com via Backup Central. |Forward SPAM to ab...@backupcentral.com. +-- Please consider the environment before printing this Email. "This email message and any attachments transmitted with it may contain confidential and proprietary information, intended only for the named recipient(s). If you have received this message in error, or if you are not the named recipient(s), please delete this email after notifying the sender immediately. BKME cannot guarantee the integrity of this communication and accepts no liability for any damage caused by this email or its attachments due to viruses, any other defects, interception or unauthorized modification. The information, views, opinions and comments of this message are those of the individual and not necessarily endorsed by BKME."
TSM 6.1 Installation Problems
The installation of TSM 6.1 is very time-consuming and it makes me insecure if thinking about an 5.5 update. Has anybody else installed or updated the newest release? Mike +-- |This was sent by michael.fr...@data-protector.com via Backup Central. |Forward SPAM to ab...@backupcentral.com. +--
