Re: super layout manager help
My only real question would be who is paying for this, and do they support this activity? After all, once your programmers get into Java (unless they are resisting to do even that?), they will probably start using GridBagLayout, and your work will have been wasted. More importantly, the money used to pay you to develop it will have been wasted, also. I disagree that it is worth your time, in the strongest sense. There is a very good description of GridBagLayout and GridBagConstraints in Geary's "Graphic Java", volume one (covers the AWT). Show them that. After a few hours they should have enough knowledge to use it for simple tasks. Or try worked examples that introduce them to each part of GBL and GBC, one by one. If you have to work on something, work on training, rather than some throwaway class. As far as the code goes, looks fine to me.. But then, I haven't implemented by own layout manager, nor would I, unless I needed one to support a custom component. I would suggest using the type-safe enumerator pattern - instead of static final ints - and ask if your EMPTY_* fields should not be final, though. -Original Message- From: Steve Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Monday, April 02, 2001 11:42 Subject: Re: super layout manager help >You are preaching to the choir, there's simply no >substitute for training and a bit of self-motivation.. > >On the other hand if I can make life a bit simpler for >folks it is certainly worth my time. > >I don't know if you had time or the motivation to look >through the code or the example, but if you did did >you see anything obviously wrong? I have fixed >several bugs down in Layout.getCalculatedSize(), and >simplified writing constraints a bit. I added an >interface to support what GridColumn was doing so that >it is now necessary to only pass the prior component. >That eliminated the need to pass the current component >as part of the constraint in GridColumn (that was >ugly). I have also added several more simple >constraints. > >You are the about only one responding so far, so I >will probably just keep on testing (hey, thats what >coffee is for right?). > > > >--- Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Get your 'old programmers' to read up on layout >> managers. >> >> If they are too lazy to do so, I don't see that as >> justification for what is >> effectively reinventing a GridBagLayout. Use of an >> IDE's GUI editor would be >> better, IMO. GridBagLayout is a complex layout >> manager. Complex components >> are just that: complex. If you want nearly (you say >> 95%) all of the >> functionality of a complex component, then you will >> eventually end up with >> something just as complex, and maybe even more >> complex. The JDK developers >> aren't in the habit of designing complex classes for >> the fun of it, you >> know.. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Steve Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; govind >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Date: Monday, April 02, 2001 05:19 >> Subject: Re: super layout manager help >> >> >> >Fair enough. We are porting a legacy DOS >> application >> >and we are finding one of the single biggest >> >impediments to getting our old programmers up to >> speed >> >is the layout managers. Even in an IDE these >> things >> >are difficult to use, they behave differently for >> >different components and each require knowledge of >> a >> >seperate syntax. One of the things my layout >> manager >> >does is allow the coders to use a coordinate system >> >that is familiar, if they want. The coordinate >> system >> >is not absolute positioning though, it just makes a >> >grid where the interstaces are proportional to the >> >container (so only the white space grows, or >> shrinks). >> > Components are not constrained by the grid and can >> >span cells, the grid is just for positioning. The >> >layout manager can also mimic the behavior of many >> >different layout managers without nesting panels, >> >another concept that seems to mess up our newbies. >> My >> >other big goal was to make the layout manager super >> >easy to use. So far all the constraints take >> either a >> >coordinate or a simple reference to another >> component. >> >Even the exceptions just take another component >
Re: super layout manager help
You are preaching to the choir, there's simply no substitute for training and a bit of self-motivation.. On the other hand if I can make life a bit simpler for folks it is certainly worth my time. I don't know if you had time or the motivation to look through the code or the example, but if you did did you see anything obviously wrong? I have fixed several bugs down in Layout.getCalculatedSize(), and simplified writing constraints a bit. I added an interface to support what GridColumn was doing so that it is now necessary to only pass the prior component. That eliminated the need to pass the current component as part of the constraint in GridColumn (that was ugly). I have also added several more simple constraints. You are the about only one responding so far, so I will probably just keep on testing (hey, thats what coffee is for right?). --- Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Get your 'old programmers' to read up on layout > managers. > > If they are too lazy to do so, I don't see that as > justification for what is > effectively reinventing a GridBagLayout. Use of an > IDE's GUI editor would be > better, IMO. GridBagLayout is a complex layout > manager. Complex components > are just that: complex. If you want nearly (you say > 95%) all of the > functionality of a complex component, then you will > eventually end up with > something just as complex, and maybe even more > complex. The JDK developers > aren't in the habit of designing complex classes for > the fun of it, you > know.. > > -Original Message- > From: Steve Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; govind > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Monday, April 02, 2001 05:19 > Subject: Re: super layout manager help > > > >Fair enough. We are porting a legacy DOS > application > >and we are finding one of the single biggest > >impediments to getting our old programmers up to > speed > >is the layout managers. Even in an IDE these > things > >are difficult to use, they behave differently for > >different components and each require knowledge of > a > >seperate syntax. One of the things my layout > manager > >does is allow the coders to use a coordinate system > >that is familiar, if they want. The coordinate > system > >is not absolute positioning though, it just makes a > >grid where the interstaces are proportional to the > >container (so only the white space grows, or > shrinks). > > Components are not constrained by the grid and can > >span cells, the grid is just for positioning. The > >layout manager can also mimic the behavior of many > >different layout managers without nesting panels, > >another concept that seems to mess up our newbies. > My > >other big goal was to make the layout manager super > >easy to use. So far all the constraints take > either a > >coordinate or a simple reference to another > component. > >Even the exceptions just take another component > >reference or another pair of coordinates. I am > hoping > >the similarity in constraint arguments will make it > >easy to master. On the other hand writing a new > >Constraint is tricky, but it can be done on the > fly. > >I am not really trying to succeed GridBagLayout in > >functionality (I'll be happy if get 95% of GBL > >functionality), I do want something with all the > power > >of GBL but much easier to use. > > > >--- Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> What does this layout manager do that > >> java.awt.GridBagLayout does not? > >> > >> Fixed positioning is achieved with a null layout. > >> > >> Why would you want to simulate other layout > >> managers? Just use the layout > >> manager you need, rather than reimplementing it. > >> This seems like a waste of > >> effort to me. > >> > >> -Original Message- > >> From: Steve Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> To: govind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> Date: Sunday, April 01, 2001 08:47 > >> Subject: Re: super layout manager help > >> > >> > >> >Of course, you are right, I need to explain a > bit > >> >more. > >> >Ok, the goal was to have a layout manager that > >> could > >> >do positioning and sizing based on some kind of > >> fixed > >> >coordinates, as well as based on relationships > to > >> >other components. > &g
Re: super layout manager help
Get your 'old programmers' to read up on layout managers. If they are too lazy to do so, I don't see that as justification for what is effectively reinventing a GridBagLayout. Use of an IDE's GUI editor would be better, IMO. GridBagLayout is a complex layout manager. Complex components are just that: complex. If you want nearly (you say 95%) all of the functionality of a complex component, then you will eventually end up with something just as complex, and maybe even more complex. The JDK developers aren't in the habit of designing complex classes for the fun of it, you know.. -Original Message- From: Steve Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; govind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Monday, April 02, 2001 05:19 Subject: Re: super layout manager help >Fair enough. We are porting a legacy DOS application >and we are finding one of the single biggest >impediments to getting our old programmers up to speed >is the layout managers. Even in an IDE these things >are difficult to use, they behave differently for >different components and each require knowledge of a >seperate syntax. One of the things my layout manager >does is allow the coders to use a coordinate system >that is familiar, if they want. The coordinate system >is not absolute positioning though, it just makes a >grid where the interstaces are proportional to the >container (so only the white space grows, or shrinks). > Components are not constrained by the grid and can >span cells, the grid is just for positioning. The >layout manager can also mimic the behavior of many >different layout managers without nesting panels, >another concept that seems to mess up our newbies. My >other big goal was to make the layout manager super >easy to use. So far all the constraints take either a >coordinate or a simple reference to another component. >Even the exceptions just take another component >reference or another pair of coordinates. I am hoping >the similarity in constraint arguments will make it >easy to master. On the other hand writing a new >Constraint is tricky, but it can be done on the fly. >I am not really trying to succeed GridBagLayout in >functionality (I'll be happy if get 95% of GBL >functionality), I do want something with all the power >of GBL but much easier to use. > >--- Greg Munt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> What does this layout manager do that >> java.awt.GridBagLayout does not? >> >> Fixed positioning is achieved with a null layout. >> >> Why would you want to simulate other layout >> managers? Just use the layout >> manager you need, rather than reimplementing it. >> This seems like a waste of >> effort to me. >> >> -----Original Message- >> From: Steve Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: govind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Date: Sunday, April 01, 2001 08:47 >> Subject: Re: super layout manager help >> >> >> >Of course, you are right, I need to explain a bit >> >more. >> >Ok, the goal was to have a layout manager that >> could >> >do positioning and sizing based on some kind of >> fixed >> >coordinates, as well as based on relationships to >> >other components. >> >The examples illustrate using 1) using fixed >> >coordinate positioning 2) relational positioning >> 3) >> >simulating the behavior of other lay out managers. >> >The code has the layout manager Layout, the >> abstract >> >Constraint class, and the 3 non-public Constraint >> >classes written so far. >> >What is important to me is that when the finished >> >product is used, it is simply a matter of adding a >> >component to a container, with a simple one or two >> >parameter constraint. My other goal is that >> >specialized constraints can be added on the fly. >> >I hope this description helps. >> > >> > >> >--- govind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> Hi steve, >> >> >> >> You can give a brief description of what the >> >> example does so that it is >> >> not required for somebody to go thru the code and >> >> know what the test >> >> program does.If i miss something or if i am wrong >> >> please apologize and let >> >> me know. >> >> >> >> Thanks and Regards >> >> govind >> >> At 12:04 AM 4/1/01 -0800, you wrote: >> >> >Attached is source for a layout manager I am
Re: super layout manager help
What does this layout manager do that java.awt.GridBagLayout does not? Fixed positioning is achieved with a null layout. Why would you want to simulate other layout managers? Just use the layout manager you need, rather than reimplementing it. This seems like a waste of effort to me. -Original Message- From: Steve Barrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: govind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Sunday, April 01, 2001 08:47 Subject: Re: super layout manager help >Of course, you are right, I need to explain a bit >more. >Ok, the goal was to have a layout manager that could >do positioning and sizing based on some kind of fixed >coordinates, as well as based on relationships to >other components. >The examples illustrate using 1) using fixed >coordinate positioning 2) relational positioning 3) >simulating the behavior of other lay out managers. >The code has the layout manager Layout, the abstract >Constraint class, and the 3 non-public Constraint >classes written so far. >What is important to me is that when the finished >product is used, it is simply a matter of adding a >component to a container, with a simple one or two >parameter constraint. My other goal is that >specialized constraints can be added on the fly. >I hope this description helps. > > >--- govind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Hi steve, >> >> You can give a brief description of what the >> example does so that it is >> not required for somebody to go thru the code and >> know what the test >> program does.If i miss something or if i am wrong >> please apologize and let >> me know. >> >> Thanks and Regards >> govind >> At 12:04 AM 4/1/01 -0800, you wrote: >> >Attached is source for a layout manager I am >> working >> >on. Its intended to be fairly simply to use and >> very >> >extensible. My approach was to write a layout >> manager >> >than can handle all kinds of customized constraint >> >objects. I want to provide a useful set of >> constraint >> >objects to go with it. I've only written three so >> >far. >> >It's not even beta, but I would appreciate testing, >> >suggestions, etc. >> >SO any help would be appreciated. >> >Thanks in advance, Steve Barrett >> > >> >__ >> >Do You Yahoo!? >> >Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. >> >http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text >> > > > >__ >Do You Yahoo!? >Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. >http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text >___ >Advanced-swing mailing list >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >http://eos.dk/mailman/listinfo/advanced-swing ___ Advanced-swing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://eos.dk/mailman/listinfo/advanced-swing
Re: super layout manager help
Of course, you are right, I need to explain a bit more. Ok, the goal was to have a layout manager that could do positioning and sizing based on some kind of fixed coordinates, as well as based on relationships to other components. The examples illustrate using 1) using fixed coordinate positioning 2) relational positioning 3) simulating the behavior of other lay out managers. The code has the layout manager Layout, the abstract Constraint class, and the 3 non-public Constraint classes written so far. What is important to me is that when the finished product is used, it is simply a matter of adding a component to a container, with a simple one or two parameter constraint. My other goal is that specialized constraints can be added on the fly. I hope this description helps. --- govind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi steve, > > You can give a brief description of what the > example does so that it is > not required for somebody to go thru the code and > know what the test > program does.If i miss something or if i am wrong > please apologize and let > me know. > > Thanks and Regards > govind > At 12:04 AM 4/1/01 -0800, you wrote: > >Attached is source for a layout manager I am > working > >on. Its intended to be fairly simply to use and > very > >extensible. My approach was to write a layout > manager > >than can handle all kinds of customized constraint > >objects. I want to provide a useful set of > constraint > >objects to go with it. I've only written three so > >far. > >It's not even beta, but I would appreciate testing, > >suggestions, etc. > >SO any help would be appreciated. > >Thanks in advance, Steve Barrett > > > >__ > >Do You Yahoo!? > >Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > >http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text > > __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text ___ Advanced-swing mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://eos.dk/mailman/listinfo/advanced-swing
super layout manager help
Attached is source for a layout manager I am working on. Its intended to be fairly simply to use and very extensible. My approach was to write a layout manager than can handle all kinds of customized constraint objects. I want to provide a useful set of constraint objects to go with it. I've only written three so far. It's not even beta, but I would appreciate testing, suggestions, etc. SO any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Steve Barrett __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text test.zip
