Re: [AFMUG] Notifying customers

[Jesse DuPont]

  
  
We use a Facebook group and avoid posting anything except outages
(planned or otherwise) so they stick on it.
We will also do emails if we have a whole tower own for a planned
outage.

  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
Jesse DuPont
Owner
  / Network
  Architect
  email:
  jesse.dup...@celeritycorp.net
  Celerity
  Networks LLC / Celerity
Broadband LLC
  Like us!
  facebook.com/celeritynetworksllc
Like
  us!
  facebook.com/celeritybroadband
 
  

On 4/12/21 8:39 PM, Steve Jones wrote:


  
  We have an alerts group on facebook customers can
opt into, we ha e Twilio half set up for powercode to message
through, but it seems clunky, otherwise we just update server
plus to handle inbound calls.
  
  
On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 9:31 PM
  Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:


  Wow, Twitter?  I am not a Twitter user.  I
wonder if my customers are?

Sent from my iPhone

  On Apr 12, 2021, at 7:48 PM,
Andrew Haninger 
wrote:

  


  
Email and Twitter.


  On Mon, Apr 12,
2021, 21:40 Chuck McCown via AF 
wrote:
  
  What
is the best way to notify customers of planned
maintenance outages?  Robocalls, text, email?  

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Robert]

Trading can be worse than Gambling...   If you are really good at 
gambling... 
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/sports-bettor-billy-walters-winning-streak-13-01-2011/4/



On 4/12/21 1:10 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
So if you dont trade on margin, you still have to have a margin 
account with 25000? The more im learning and reading the more I 
understand why certain people believe there needs to be more 
regulation. The crazy amount of risk, aside from just putting your 
money up, margin, short sale, etc. I dont have any interest in doing 
much of that, in regular life I try to be a cash guy (though economy 
and paycheck doesnt allow that) but I wouldnt ever consider taking a 
load out to go to the casino.


I see the risk aversion, I switched my paper account balance to the 
actual amount id be willing to risk, and suddenly I wasnt as 
adventuresome, I assume that would amplify when actual money goes in. 
I dont mind my risk on the limited long term stocks, I think theyll 
perform well, Smith and Wesson in particular.


I have my paper account sitting at -1900 for the day with pending 
sells for tomorrow that I think will hit the expectations at 9 
tomorrow. Is that considered day trading since part of the cash was 
from a purchase and sell today?


this webull place says i can day trade with 100 dollars, so if i was 
to toy with that, its just math to extrapolate to real gains or 
losses? Im just finding it hard to believe theres a way to get better 
than casino winnings without committing a crime


On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:55 PM Tyson Burris > wrote:


Steve-

I didn’t read the whole email chain so I maybe blowing smoke here.

Margin is borrowed money based on a set value of a security.  You
cannot Margin trade most penny stocks.

Margin trading is high risk / high reward.  You MUST be careful. 
A stock that is traded on Margin and rapidly decreases its value
you can cause you to be in Margin CALL or even owe the broker if
not careful.  Buying Power tends to be Margin.

According to SEC regulations, a day trader is one who trades /
flips five or more times in a trading period. If you are flagged
as a day trader you must maintain 25K or more.  Holding a security
overnight and not bouncing in and out of it prevents this from
happening.  I believe if your account is flagged, you can wait
60-90 days and request the flag be removed. (assuming you don’t
day trade anymore)

Those who don’t hold a stock for a year or longer will pay a much,
much larger capital gains tax  then those who do.  Short vs. Long
term.

Examples of pros and cons…

I took a 30K+ loss many years ago when earnings came out and the
stock tanked.  I had the stock purchased on Margin.  Had I not,
the loss would have been so much less.  I was forced into a Margin
call and had to take the large LOSS.  This is an example of Margin
trading that caused a large loss.

During Covid, I invested with Margin into a stock I knew would do
well.  At the peak, 3 million was made.  So this became a perfect
case in which Margin trading worked really to my benefit.  I had
to hold this stock for a year or longer to reduce the capital gain
tax.

*Tyson Burris, President**
**Internet Communications Inc.**
**739 Commerce Dr.**
**Franklin, IN 46131**
***
*Office #**317-738-0320 *
*Cell/Direct #**317-412-1540 *
*Online: **www.surfici.net* 

ICI

*What can ICI do for you?*


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Cameras - Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.*
**
*CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the*
*addressee shown. It contains information that is*
*confidential and protected from disclosure. Any review,*
*dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by*
*unauthorized organizations or individuals is strictly*
*prohibited.*

*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> *On Behalf Of * Steve Jones
*Sent:* Monday, April 12, 2021 1:02 PM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

I just dont get it

I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand
buying power, seems like credit.

The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me
what thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson
mailto:cpeter...@portnetworks.com>>
wrote:

It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are
going up an idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up
and up and up for a long long time now.  At some point that
party will end.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson
mailto:cpeter...@portnetworks.com>> wrote:

What is oft

Re: [AFMUG] Notifying customers

[Steve Jones]

We have an alerts group on facebook customers can opt into, we ha e Twilio
half set up for powercode to message through, but it seems clunky,
otherwise we just update server plus to handle inbound calls.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 9:31 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Wow, Twitter?  I am not a Twitter user.  I wonder if my customers are?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Apr 12, 2021, at 7:48 PM, Andrew Haninger  wrote:
>
> 
> Email and Twitter.
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 21:40 Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>
>> What is the best way to notify customers of planned maintenance outages?
>> Robocalls, text, email?
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> --
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>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] Notifying customers

[Adam Moffett]

I like my curmudgeony old email.  Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, and all the 
rest I have no interest in.



On 4/12/2021 10:30 PM, Chuck McCown via AF wrote:

Wow, Twitter?  I am not a Twitter user.  I wonder if my customers are?

Sent from my iPhone


On Apr 12, 2021, at 7:48 PM, Andrew Haninger  wrote:


Email and Twitter.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 21:40 Chuck McCown via AF > wrote:


What is the best way to notify customers of planned maintenance
outages?  Robocalls, text, email?

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [AFMUG] Notifying customers

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Wow, Twitter?  I am not a Twitter user.  I wonder if my customers are?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 12, 2021, at 7:48 PM, Andrew Haninger  wrote:
> 
> 
> Email and Twitter.
> 
>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 21:40 Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:
>> What is the best way to notify customers of planned maintenance outages?  
>> Robocalls, text, email?  
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> -- 
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>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] Notifying customers

[Andrew Haninger]

Email and Twitter.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 21:40 Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> What is the best way to notify customers of planned maintenance outages?
> Robocalls, text, email?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] Notifying customers

[David Coudron]

We typically do email and text.   Text is the best way, but not all customers 
will opt in to text messages.   Customers usually see the text messages.   They 
never check voicemail if they don't know the number.   Email does get a few of 
them to notice, but phone calls seem pretty worthless.   The spammers have 
ruined phone calling forever.   At least that is our experience. 

Regards,

David Coudron


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown via AF
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 8:39 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Cc: Chuck McCown 
Subject: [AFMUG] Notifying customers

What is the best way to notify customers of planned maintenance outages?  
Robocalls, text, email?  

Sent from my iPhone

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[AFMUG] Notifying customers

[Chuck McCown via AF]

What is the best way to notify customers of planned maintenance outages?  
Robocalls, text, email?  

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: wonder if Cisco can apply for PPE loans?

[Jaime Solorza]

Lol...it was at lights in front of me...

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 6:28 PM Chuck McCown via AF  wrote:

> Was there a pee bottle inside?
>
> *From:* Jaime Solorza
> *Sent:* Monday, April 12, 2021 5:29 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: wonder if Cisco can apply for PPE loans?
>
> I know times are hard but
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Would safety wire pliers make it easier to do?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 12, 2021, at 6:28 PM, Nate Burke  wrote:
> 
>  One of our tower owners (who owns many towers) feels that hangers add more 
> wind load than they're worth.  He requires that all cables are attached 
> directly to the tower leg with #14 AWG Black Solid wire holding it to the Leg 
> every 12" and the ends of the #14 pushed back to the tower.  We are required 
> to show pictures after any installation.  Check with the tower owner, they 
> might have their own Specs for mounting cables.   
> 
> On 4/12/2021 6:27 PM, Jason Wilson wrote:
>> All new builds and remodels get hangers and cushions. You'll thank yourself 
>> later. 
>> 
>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 16:26 Jan-GAMs  wrote:
>>> elctric tape doesn't slide down the pole either
>>> 
>>> On 4/12/21 1:13 PM, TJ Trout wrote:
 Electric tape? Lasts a long time 
 
 On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 12:54 PM Jason McKemie 
  wrote:
> I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but 
> have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you 
> guys using for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1 
> cushions / hangers:
> 
> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057
> 
> Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
> -- 
> AF mailing list
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>>> -- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Nate Burke]

One of our tower owners (who owns many towers) feels that hangers add 
more wind load than they're worth.  He requires that all cables are 
attached directly to the tower leg with #14 AWG Black Solid wire holding 
it to the Leg every 12" and the ends of the #14 pushed back to the 
tower.  We are required to show pictures after any installation.  Check 
with the tower owner, they might have their own Specs for mounting cables.


On 4/12/2021 6:27 PM, Jason Wilson wrote:
All new builds and remodels get hangers and cushions. You'll thank 
yourself later.


On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 16:26 Jan-GAMs > wrote:


elctric tape doesn't slide down the pole either

On 4/12/21 1:13 PM, TJ Trout wrote:

Electric tape? Lasts a long time

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 12:54 PM Jason McKemie
mailto:j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com>> wrote:

I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to
towers, but have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some
locations. What are you guys using for this purpose?  I have
considered going with some Sitepro1 cushions / hangers:

https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057

Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: wonder if Cisco can apply for PPE loans?

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Was there a pee bottle inside?

From: Jaime Solorza 
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 5:29 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] OT: wonder if Cisco can apply for PPE loans?

I know times are hard but



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Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Jason Wilson]

All new builds and remodels get hangers and cushions. You'll thank yourself
later.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 16:26 Jan-GAMs  wrote:

> elctric tape doesn't slide down the pole either
> On 4/12/21 1:13 PM, TJ Trout wrote:
>
> Electric tape? Lasts a long time
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 12:54 PM Jason McKemie <
> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>
>> I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but
>> have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you
>> guys using for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1
>> cushions / hangers:
>>
>> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057
>>
>> Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
>> --
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Jan-GAMs]

elctric tape doesn't slide down the pole either

On 4/12/21 1:13 PM, TJ Trout wrote:

Electric tape? Lasts a long time

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 12:54 PM Jason McKemie 
> wrote:


I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to
towers, but have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some
locations. What are you guys using for this purpose?  I have
considered going with some Sitepro1 cushions / hangers:

https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057


Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Forrest Christian (List Account)]

I think your math works ok on the cash account.   The exact timing might be
slightly off from what you said, i.e. I don't remember if you would have to
have 2 days of cash or 3 to day trade every day.  But you have the general
idea.   If you want to day trade every day on cash, you need a lot of
cash.

On the margin account, you're right, you wouldn't have to wait for the
funds to clear.   And yes, technically the two transactions would be on
margin.

On the suicide, I don't remember the exact details and the article I found
was light on them, but when you start trading in a margin account, or
worse, using a margin account to short stocks, certain times of puts,
calls, and futures, and so on, you can quickly end up in a situation where
the brokerage wants funds because you are way outside the amount of credit
they want to extend since it looks like you're going to lose a lot of
money.For example, if you short a stock (sell one you don't have with a
promise to buy it back later) and it goes up instead of down, your
potential losses could be very high, more than what you have invested, and
possibly more than what you have.

I think on the suicide they needed more funds to cover the activity in the
account, but once everything settled it was fine, but by then it was too
late.


On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 3:57 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> See, now it's starting to make more sense. My example today would be a
> violation, i made the two trades that left me at the negative amount today
> with a sell on the stocks for tomorrow. Even though the amount is less than
> I started with, the funds wouldnt have cleared until wednesday,so tomorrows
> sale, and today's second buy would be a violation.
> If I had a funded margin account, I wouldnt have to wait for the funds to
> clear? But technichally the two transactions would be on margin?
>
> Is this funds clearing and all that what caused that kid to kill himself?
> Accounting was just taking place but he thought he was a quarter million in
> the hole?
>
> So effectively if a person wants to make multiple day trades he needs to
> have the number of trades made times the trade amount in his account? For
> ease of math, if a guy wants to buy 1000 dollars worth of stock and sell it
> 4 times in a day, he needs to have 4000 dollars cleared in the account
> ahead of time? And if he wants to do it every day he needs 8000 dollars
> cleared in the account when he starts?
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 4:25 PM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
> li...@packetflux.com> wrote:
>
>> Let me see if I can help:
>>
>> There are two types of accounts.   Margin and Non-Margin.
>>
>> A margin account lets you borrow money to trade.   This one comes with
>> all sorts of odd restrictions.   For example, if you do 5 day trades in a
>> week, they want you to have the $25K in equity in that account.  This is a
>> government rule.
>>
>> A non-margin account is also a cash account.   There are no day-trading
>> restrictions, in that you can day-trade as much as you want.   However,
>> because you don't have credit, you have to pay close attention to your
>> settled balance.  The oversimplification of this is as follows:  When you
>> sell a stock, the funds aren't really available to you for 2 days
>> afterwards, just like when you deposit a check in your bank.   You can
>> generally buy another stock with the funds from this sale, but if you
>> *sell* that second stock before the funds from the first sale clear, you're
>> going to get into trouble.   Fidelity has a good writeup on this.
>> https://www.fidelity.com/learning-center/trading-investing/trading/avoiding-cash-trading-violations
>>
>> I have only one brokerage account with margin enabled.   It's at TD
>> Ameritrade.  I will occasionally do a day trade with thinkorswim where I
>> have a good feeling that the market is going to head in one direction or
>> another.   Sometimes a few days a week.  But usually only a few days a
>> month, if even that often.   I've moved enough stock over there from
>> another brokerage account where I'm over the $25K equity so I don't have to
>> worry about the day trading rules.I like knowing I'm not going to get
>> in trouble for breaking some rule, but I don't like having the ability to
>> invest more than I have (other than to avoid settlement issues).
>>
>> Everything else doesn't have margin enabled.   And I like it that way.
>>
>> A lot of people miss that there is a difference between investing and
>> trading.Investing is what you do when you want to retire at some point
>> in the future.   Generally the best strategy for most people who are doing
>> this is to just buy some index funds.   I like VTI in particular, with some
>> VXUS mixed in.   Or the mutual fund equivalents in my vanguard accounts.
>>
>> Trading is more like poker.   You're buying individual stocks and hoping
>> they win.   Like poker, a good player can do well, but most players are
>> lucky to break even.   So when I trade or day

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Steve Jones]

See, now it's starting to make more sense. My example today would be a
violation, i made the two trades that left me at the negative amount today
with a sell on the stocks for tomorrow. Even though the amount is less than
I started with, the funds wouldnt have cleared until wednesday,so tomorrows
sale, and today's second buy would be a violation.
If I had a funded margin account, I wouldnt have to wait for the funds to
clear? But technichally the two transactions would be on margin?

Is this funds clearing and all that what caused that kid to kill himself?
Accounting was just taking place but he thought he was a quarter million in
the hole?

So effectively if a person wants to make multiple day trades he needs to
have the number of trades made times the trade amount in his account? For
ease of math, if a guy wants to buy 1000 dollars worth of stock and sell it
4 times in a day, he needs to have 4000 dollars cleared in the account
ahead of time? And if he wants to do it every day he needs 8000 dollars
cleared in the account when he starts?

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 4:25 PM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
li...@packetflux.com> wrote:

> Let me see if I can help:
>
> There are two types of accounts.   Margin and Non-Margin.
>
> A margin account lets you borrow money to trade.   This one comes with all
> sorts of odd restrictions.   For example, if you do 5 day trades in a week,
> they want you to have the $25K in equity in that account.  This is a
> government rule.
>
> A non-margin account is also a cash account.   There are no day-trading
> restrictions, in that you can day-trade as much as you want.   However,
> because you don't have credit, you have to pay close attention to your
> settled balance.  The oversimplification of this is as follows:  When you
> sell a stock, the funds aren't really available to you for 2 days
> afterwards, just like when you deposit a check in your bank.   You can
> generally buy another stock with the funds from this sale, but if you
> *sell* that second stock before the funds from the first sale clear, you're
> going to get into trouble.   Fidelity has a good writeup on this.
> https://www.fidelity.com/learning-center/trading-investing/trading/avoiding-cash-trading-violations
>
> I have only one brokerage account with margin enabled.   It's at TD
> Ameritrade.  I will occasionally do a day trade with thinkorswim where I
> have a good feeling that the market is going to head in one direction or
> another.   Sometimes a few days a week.  But usually only a few days a
> month, if even that often.   I've moved enough stock over there from
> another brokerage account where I'm over the $25K equity so I don't have to
> worry about the day trading rules.I like knowing I'm not going to get
> in trouble for breaking some rule, but I don't like having the ability to
> invest more than I have (other than to avoid settlement issues).
>
> Everything else doesn't have margin enabled.   And I like it that way.
>
> A lot of people miss that there is a difference between investing and
> trading.Investing is what you do when you want to retire at some point
> in the future.   Generally the best strategy for most people who are doing
> this is to just buy some index funds.   I like VTI in particular, with some
> VXUS mixed in.   Or the mutual fund equivalents in my vanguard accounts.
>
> Trading is more like poker.   You're buying individual stocks and hoping
> they win.   Like poker, a good player can do well, but most players are
> lucky to break even.   So when I trade or day trade, it is with funds I
> never expect to see again... and then am pleasantly surprised if I don't
> lose too much.
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:11 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> So if you dont trade on margin, you still have to have a margin account
>> with 25000? The more im learning and reading the more I understand why
>> certain people believe there needs to be more regulation. The crazy amount
>> of risk, aside from just putting your money up, margin, short sale, etc. I
>> dont have any interest in doing much of that, in regular life I try to be a
>> cash guy (though economy and paycheck doesnt allow that) but I wouldnt ever
>> consider taking a load out to go to the casino.
>>
>> I see the risk aversion, I switched my paper account balance to the
>> actual amount id be willing to risk, and suddenly I wasnt as adventuresome,
>> I assume that would amplify when actual money goes in. I dont mind my risk
>> on the limited long term stocks, I think theyll perform well, Smith and
>> Wesson in particular.
>>
>> I have my paper account sitting at -1900 for the day with pending sells
>> for tomorrow that I think will hit the expectations at 9 tomorrow. Is that
>> considered day trading since part of the cash was from a purchase and sell
>> today?
>>
>> this webull place says i can day trade with 100 dollars, so if i was to
>> toy with that, its just math to extrapolate to real gains or losses? Im
>> just findi

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Best that you can hope for is to die in your sleep.

From: Forrest Christian (List Account) 
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 3:24 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

Let me see if I can help: 

There are two types of accounts.   Margin and Non-Margin.

A margin account lets you borrow money to trade.   This one comes with all 
sorts of odd restrictions.   For example, if you do 5 day trades in a week, 
they want you to have the $25K in equity in that account.  This is a government 
rule.

A non-margin account is also a cash account.   There are no day-trading 
restrictions, in that you can day-trade as much as you want.   However, because 
you don't have credit, you have to pay close attention to your settled balance. 
 The oversimplification of this is as follows:  When you sell a stock, the 
funds aren't really available to you for 2 days afterwards, just like when you 
deposit a check in your bank.   You can generally buy another stock with the 
funds from this sale, but if you *sell* that second stock before the funds from 
the first sale clear, you're going to get into trouble.   Fidelity has a good 
writeup on this.  
https://www.fidelity.com/learning-center/trading-investing/trading/avoiding-cash-trading-violations

I have only one brokerage account with margin enabled.   It's at TD Ameritrade. 
 I will occasionally do a day trade with thinkorswim where I have a good 
feeling that the market is going to head in one direction or another.   
Sometimes a few days a week.  But usually only a few days a month, if even that 
often.   I've moved enough stock over there from another brokerage account 
where I'm over the $25K equity so I don't have to worry about the day trading 
rules.I like knowing I'm not going to get in trouble for breaking some 
rule, but I don't like having the ability to invest more than I have (other 
than to avoid settlement issues).

Everything else doesn't have margin enabled.   And I like it that way.

A lot of people miss that there is a difference between investing and trading.  
  Investing is what you do when you want to retire at some point in the future. 
  Generally the best strategy for most people who are doing this is to just buy 
some index funds.   I like VTI in particular, with some VXUS mixed in.   Or the 
mutual fund equivalents in my vanguard accounts.

Trading is more like poker.   You're buying individual stocks and hoping they 
win.   Like poker, a good player can do well, but most players are lucky to 
break even.   So when I trade or day trade, it is with funds I never expect to 
see again... and then am pleasantly surprised if I don't lose too much.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:11 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

  So if you dont trade on margin, you still have to have a margin account with 
25000? The more im learning and reading the more I understand why certain 
people believe there needs to be more regulation. The crazy amount of risk, 
aside from just putting your money up, margin, short sale, etc. I dont have any 
interest in doing much of that, in regular life I try to be a cash guy (though 
economy and paycheck doesnt allow that) but I wouldnt ever consider taking a 
load out to go to the casino. 

  I see the risk aversion, I switched my paper account balance to the actual 
amount id be willing to risk, and suddenly I wasnt as adventuresome, I assume 
that would amplify when actual money goes in. I dont mind my risk on the 
limited long term stocks, I think theyll perform well, Smith and Wesson in 
particular. 

  I have my paper account sitting at -1900 for the day with pending sells for 
tomorrow that I think will hit the expectations at 9 tomorrow. Is that 
considered day trading since part of the cash was from a purchase and sell 
today?

  this webull place says i can day trade with 100 dollars, so if i was to toy 
with that, its just math to extrapolate to real gains or losses? Im just 
finding it hard to believe theres a way to get better than casino winnings 
without committing a crime

  On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:55 PM Tyson Burris  wrote:

Steve-



I didn’t read the whole email chain so I maybe blowing smoke here.  



Margin is borrowed money based on a set value of a security.  You cannot 
Margin trade most penny stocks.



Margin trading is high risk / high reward.  You MUST be careful.  A stock 
that is traded on Margin and rapidly decreases its value you can cause you to 
be in Margin CALL or even owe the broker if not careful.  Buying Power tends to 
be Margin. 



According to SEC regulations, a day trader is one who trades / flips five 
or more times in a trading period. If you are flagged as a day trader you must 
maintain 25K or more.  Holding a security overnight and not bouncing in and out 
of it prevents this from happening.  I believe if your account is flagged, you 
can wait 60-90 days and request the flag be removed. (assuming you don’t day 
trade anymore)



Those 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Forrest Christian (List Account)]

Let me see if I can help:

There are two types of accounts.   Margin and Non-Margin.

A margin account lets you borrow money to trade.   This one comes with all
sorts of odd restrictions.   For example, if you do 5 day trades in a week,
they want you to have the $25K in equity in that account.  This is a
government rule.

A non-margin account is also a cash account.   There are no day-trading
restrictions, in that you can day-trade as much as you want.   However,
because you don't have credit, you have to pay close attention to your
settled balance.  The oversimplification of this is as follows:  When you
sell a stock, the funds aren't really available to you for 2 days
afterwards, just like when you deposit a check in your bank.   You can
generally buy another stock with the funds from this sale, but if you
*sell* that second stock before the funds from the first sale clear, you're
going to get into trouble.   Fidelity has a good writeup on this.
https://www.fidelity.com/learning-center/trading-investing/trading/avoiding-cash-trading-violations

I have only one brokerage account with margin enabled.   It's at TD
Ameritrade.  I will occasionally do a day trade with thinkorswim where I
have a good feeling that the market is going to head in one direction or
another.   Sometimes a few days a week.  But usually only a few days a
month, if even that often.   I've moved enough stock over there from
another brokerage account where I'm over the $25K equity so I don't have to
worry about the day trading rules.I like knowing I'm not going to get
in trouble for breaking some rule, but I don't like having the ability to
invest more than I have (other than to avoid settlement issues).

Everything else doesn't have margin enabled.   And I like it that way.

A lot of people miss that there is a difference between investing and
trading.Investing is what you do when you want to retire at some point
in the future.   Generally the best strategy for most people who are doing
this is to just buy some index funds.   I like VTI in particular, with some
VXUS mixed in.   Or the mutual fund equivalents in my vanguard accounts.

Trading is more like poker.   You're buying individual stocks and hoping
they win.   Like poker, a good player can do well, but most players are
lucky to break even.   So when I trade or day trade, it is with funds I
never expect to see again... and then am pleasantly surprised if I don't
lose too much.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:11 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> So if you dont trade on margin, you still have to have a margin account
> with 25000? The more im learning and reading the more I understand why
> certain people believe there needs to be more regulation. The crazy amount
> of risk, aside from just putting your money up, margin, short sale, etc. I
> dont have any interest in doing much of that, in regular life I try to be a
> cash guy (though economy and paycheck doesnt allow that) but I wouldnt ever
> consider taking a load out to go to the casino.
>
> I see the risk aversion, I switched my paper account balance to the actual
> amount id be willing to risk, and suddenly I wasnt as adventuresome, I
> assume that would amplify when actual money goes in. I dont mind my risk on
> the limited long term stocks, I think theyll perform well, Smith and Wesson
> in particular.
>
> I have my paper account sitting at -1900 for the day with pending sells
> for tomorrow that I think will hit the expectations at 9 tomorrow. Is that
> considered day trading since part of the cash was from a purchase and sell
> today?
>
> this webull place says i can day trade with 100 dollars, so if i was to
> toy with that, its just math to extrapolate to real gains or losses? Im
> just finding it hard to believe theres a way to get better than casino
> winnings without committing a crime
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:55 PM Tyson Burris  wrote:
>
>> Steve-
>>
>>
>>
>> I didn’t read the whole email chain so I maybe blowing smoke here.
>>
>>
>>
>> Margin is borrowed money based on a set value of a security.  You cannot
>> Margin trade most penny stocks.
>>
>>
>>
>> Margin trading is high risk / high reward.  You MUST be careful.  A stock
>> that is traded on Margin and rapidly decreases its value you can cause you
>> to be in Margin CALL or even owe the broker if not careful.  Buying Power
>> tends to be Margin.
>>
>>
>>
>> According to SEC regulations, a day trader is one who trades / flips five
>> or more times in a trading period. If you are flagged as a day trader you
>> must maintain 25K or more.  Holding a security overnight and not bouncing
>> in and out of it prevents this from happening.  I believe if your account
>> is flagged, you can wait 60-90 days and request the flag be removed.
>> (assuming you don’t day trade anymore)
>>
>>
>>
>> Those who don’t hold a stock for a year or longer will pay a much, much
>> larger capital gains tax  then those who do.  Short vs. Long term.
>>
>>
>>
>> Examples of pros and cons…
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Jaime Solorza]

Yep on coated copper wire.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 2:16 PM Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi] 
wrote:

> 14AWG solid core wire.  Lasts for decades.
>
>
>
> Jim Bouse
> Owner - Brazos WiFi
> 979-999-7000
> http://www.brazoswifi.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Jason McKemie
> *Sent:* Monday, April 12, 2021 2:48 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment
>
>
>
> I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but
> have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you
> guys using for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1
> cushions / hangers:
>
>
>
> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057
>
>
>
> Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Steve Jones]

thats what ive been using and reset it to 10k today.



On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 3:54 PM Tyson Burris  wrote:

> No, you only need to maintain 25K if you are flagged as a day trader.
>
> As long as you buy one day and sell the next you cannot be flagged.
>
> If you bought and sold 4 times in one day you would be one away from a
> flag that requires 25K.
>
>
>
> If you use Ameritrade you can download think or swim app and trade on the
> fake 100K account and see how it does. This is a way to learn without risk.
>
>
>
> *Tyson Burris, President*
> *Internet Communications Inc.*
> *739 Commerce Dr.*
> *Franklin, IN 46131*
>
> *Office #* *317-738-0320 *
> *Cell/Direct #* *317-412-1540 *
> *Online: **www.surfici.net* 
>
>
>
> [image: ICI]
>
> *What can ICI do for you?*
>
>
> *Broadband Wireless - PtP/PtMP Solutions - Mesh Wifi/Hotzones - IP Cameras
> - Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.*
>
> *CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the*
> *addressee shown. It contains information that is*
> *confidential and protected from disclosure. Any review,*
> *dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by*
> *unauthorized organizations or individuals is strictly*
> *prohibited.*
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, April 12, 2021 4:10 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks
>
>
>
> So if you dont trade on margin, you still have to have a margin account
> with 25000? The more im learning and reading the more I understand why
> certain people believe there needs to be more regulation. The crazy amount
> of risk, aside from just putting your money up, margin, short sale, etc. I
> dont have any interest in doing much of that, in regular life I try to be a
> cash guy (though economy and paycheck doesnt allow that) but I wouldnt ever
> consider taking a load out to go to the casino.
>
>
>
> I see the risk aversion, I switched my paper account balance to the actual
> amount id be willing to risk, and suddenly I wasnt as adventuresome, I
> assume that would amplify when actual money goes in. I dont mind my risk on
> the limited long term stocks, I think theyll perform well, Smith and Wesson
> in particular.
>
>
>
> I have my paper account sitting at -1900 for the day with pending sells
> for tomorrow that I think will hit the expectations at 9 tomorrow. Is that
> considered day trading since part of the cash was from a purchase and sell
> today?
>
>
>
> this webull place says i can day trade with 100 dollars, so if i was to
> toy with that, its just math to extrapolate to real gains or losses? Im
> just finding it hard to believe theres a way to get better than casino
> winnings without committing a crime
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:55 PM Tyson Burris  wrote:
>
> Steve-
>
>
>
> I didn’t read the whole email chain so I maybe blowing smoke here.
>
>
>
> Margin is borrowed money based on a set value of a security.  You cannot
> Margin trade most penny stocks.
>
>
>
> Margin trading is high risk / high reward.  You MUST be careful.  A stock
> that is traded on Margin and rapidly decreases its value you can cause you
> to be in Margin CALL or even owe the broker if not careful.  Buying Power
> tends to be Margin.
>
>
>
> According to SEC regulations, a day trader is one who trades / flips five
> or more times in a trading period. If you are flagged as a day trader you
> must maintain 25K or more.  Holding a security overnight and not bouncing
> in and out of it prevents this from happening.  I believe if your account
> is flagged, you can wait 60-90 days and request the flag be removed.
> (assuming you don’t day trade anymore)
>
>
>
> Those who don’t hold a stock for a year or longer will pay a much, much
> larger capital gains tax  then those who do.  Short vs. Long term.
>
>
>
> Examples of pros and cons…
>
> I took a 30K+ loss many years ago when earnings came out and the stock
> tanked.  I had the stock purchased on Margin.  Had I not, the loss would
> have been so much less.  I was forced into a Margin call and had to take
> the large LOSS.  This is an example of Margin trading that caused a large
> loss.
>
>
>
> During Covid, I invested with Margin into a stock I knew would do well.
> At the peak, 3 million was made.  So this became a perfect case in which
> Margin trading worked really to my benefit.  I had to hold this stock for a
> year or longer to reduce the capital gain tax.
>
>
>
>
>
> *Tyson Burris, President*
> *Internet Communications Inc.*
> *739 Commerce Dr.*
> *Franklin, IN 46131*
>
> *Office #* *317-738-0320 *
> *Cell/Direct #* *317-412-1540 *
> *Online: **www.surfici.net* 
>
>
>
> [image: ICI]
>
> *What can ICI do for you?*
>
>
> *Broadband Wireless - PtP/PtMP Solutions - Mesh Wifi/Hotzones - IP Cameras
> - Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.*
>
> *CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the*
> *addressee shown. It contains information that is*
> *confi

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Tyson Burris]

No, you only need to maintain 25K if you are flagged as a day trader.
As long as you buy one day and sell the next you cannot be flagged.
If you bought and sold 4 times in one day you would be one away from a flag 
that requires 25K.

If you use Ameritrade you can download think or swim app and trade on the fake 
100K account and see how it does. This is a way to learn without risk.

Tyson Burris, President
Internet Communications Inc.
739 Commerce Dr.
Franklin, IN 46131

Office # 317-738-0320
Cell/Direct # 317-412-1540
Online: www.surfici.net

[ICI]
What can ICI do for you?

Broadband Wireless - PtP/PtMP Solutions - Mesh Wifi/Hotzones - IP Cameras - 
Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the
addressee shown. It contains information that is
confidential and protected from disclosure. Any review,
dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by
unauthorized organizations or individuals is strictly
prohibited.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 4:10 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

So if you dont trade on margin, you still have to have a margin account with 
25000? The more im learning and reading the more I understand why certain 
people believe there needs to be more regulation. The crazy amount of risk, 
aside from just putting your money up, margin, short sale, etc. I dont have any 
interest in doing much of that, in regular life I try to be a cash guy (though 
economy and paycheck doesnt allow that) but I wouldnt ever consider taking a 
load out to go to the casino.

I see the risk aversion, I switched my paper account balance to the actual 
amount id be willing to risk, and suddenly I wasnt as adventuresome, I assume 
that would amplify when actual money goes in. I dont mind my risk on the 
limited long term stocks, I think theyll perform well, Smith and Wesson in 
particular.

I have my paper account sitting at -1900 for the day with pending sells for 
tomorrow that I think will hit the expectations at 9 tomorrow. Is that 
considered day trading since part of the cash was from a purchase and sell 
today?

this webull place says i can day trade with 100 dollars, so if i was to toy 
with that, its just math to extrapolate to real gains or losses? Im just 
finding it hard to believe theres a way to get better than casino winnings 
without committing a crime

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:55 PM Tyson Burris 
mailto:t...@franklinisp.net>> wrote:
Steve-

I didn’t read the whole email chain so I maybe blowing smoke here.

Margin is borrowed money based on a set value of a security.  You cannot Margin 
trade most penny stocks.

Margin trading is high risk / high reward.  You MUST be careful.  A stock that 
is traded on Margin and rapidly decreases its value you can cause you to be in 
Margin CALL or even owe the broker if not careful.  Buying Power tends to be 
Margin.

According to SEC regulations, a day trader is one who trades / flips five or 
more times in a trading period. If you are flagged as a day trader you must 
maintain 25K or more.  Holding a security overnight and not bouncing in and out 
of it prevents this from happening.  I believe if your account is flagged, you 
can wait 60-90 days and request the flag be removed. (assuming you don’t day 
trade anymore)

Those who don’t hold a stock for a year or longer will pay a much, much larger 
capital gains tax  then those who do.  Short vs. Long term.

Examples of pros and cons…
I took a 30K+ loss many years ago when earnings came out and the stock tanked.  
I had the stock purchased on Margin.  Had I not, the loss would have been so 
much less.  I was forced into a Margin call and had to take the large LOSS.  
This is an example of Margin trading that caused a large loss.

During Covid, I invested with Margin into a stock I knew would do well.  At the 
peak, 3 million was made.  So this became a perfect case in which Margin 
trading worked really to my benefit.  I had to hold this stock for a year or 
longer to reduce the capital gain tax.


Tyson Burris, President
Internet Communications Inc.
739 Commerce Dr.
Franklin, IN 46131

Office # 317-738-0320
Cell/Direct # 317-412-1540
Online: www.surfici.net

[ICI]
What can ICI do for you?

Broadband Wireless - PtP/PtMP Solutions - Mesh Wifi/Hotzones - IP Cameras - 
Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the
addressee shown. It contains information that is
confidential and protected from disclosure. Any review,
dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by
unauthorized organizations or individuals is strictly
prohibited.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Steve Jones
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 1:02 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

I just dont get it
I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Steve Jones]

Our normal ties used to last forever, we got them at our local fastener
shop, but this last year the manufacturer must have changed resins or
something, theyre brittle out of the bag. we got in a bunch from perfect
vision, they seem pretty brittle. I dont know if the plastics industry has
had to make covid changes too.
We used electrical tape for years, I prefer it cause of the siphon effect
on some cable, but we used cheap ACE hardware tape...regrettable. I just
cant justify the cost of super 33 or 88 for techs to lose by the role

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 3:19 PM Carl Peterson 
wrote:

> BT2S-M0 Dome-Top barb ty cable tie 8 inch
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 3:14 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
>> Electric tape? Lasts a long time
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 12:54 PM Jason McKemie <
>> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but
>>> have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you
>>> guys using for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1
>>> cushions / hangers:
>>>
>>> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057
>>>
>>> Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
> --
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Carl Peterson]

BT2S-M0 Dome-Top barb ty cable tie 8 inch

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 3:14 PM TJ Trout  wrote:

> Electric tape? Lasts a long time
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 12:54 PM Jason McKemie <
> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>
>> I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but
>> have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you
>> guys using for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1
>> cushions / hangers:
>>
>> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057
>>
>> Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


--
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi]]

14AWG solid core wire.  Lasts for decades.

Jim Bouse
Owner - Brazos WiFi
979-999-7000
http://www.brazoswifi.com

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jason McKemie
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 2:48 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but have 
noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you guys using 
for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1 cushions / 
hangers:

https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057

Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
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Re: [AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[TJ Trout]

Electric tape? Lasts a long time

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021, 12:54 PM Jason McKemie <
j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:

> I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but
> have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you
> guys using for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1
> cushions / hangers:
>
> https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057
>
> Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Steve Jones]

So if you dont trade on margin, you still have to have a margin account
with 25000? The more im learning and reading the more I understand why
certain people believe there needs to be more regulation. The crazy amount
of risk, aside from just putting your money up, margin, short sale, etc. I
dont have any interest in doing much of that, in regular life I try to be a
cash guy (though economy and paycheck doesnt allow that) but I wouldnt ever
consider taking a load out to go to the casino.

I see the risk aversion, I switched my paper account balance to the actual
amount id be willing to risk, and suddenly I wasnt as adventuresome, I
assume that would amplify when actual money goes in. I dont mind my risk on
the limited long term stocks, I think theyll perform well, Smith and Wesson
in particular.

I have my paper account sitting at -1900 for the day with pending sells for
tomorrow that I think will hit the expectations at 9 tomorrow. Is that
considered day trading since part of the cash was from a purchase and sell
today?

this webull place says i can day trade with 100 dollars, so if i was to toy
with that, its just math to extrapolate to real gains or losses? Im
just finding it hard to believe theres a way to get better than casino
winnings without committing a crime

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 2:55 PM Tyson Burris  wrote:

> Steve-
>
>
>
> I didn’t read the whole email chain so I maybe blowing smoke here.
>
>
>
> Margin is borrowed money based on a set value of a security.  You cannot
> Margin trade most penny stocks.
>
>
>
> Margin trading is high risk / high reward.  You MUST be careful.  A stock
> that is traded on Margin and rapidly decreases its value you can cause you
> to be in Margin CALL or even owe the broker if not careful.  Buying Power
> tends to be Margin.
>
>
>
> According to SEC regulations, a day trader is one who trades / flips five
> or more times in a trading period. If you are flagged as a day trader you
> must maintain 25K or more.  Holding a security overnight and not bouncing
> in and out of it prevents this from happening.  I believe if your account
> is flagged, you can wait 60-90 days and request the flag be removed.
> (assuming you don’t day trade anymore)
>
>
>
> Those who don’t hold a stock for a year or longer will pay a much, much
> larger capital gains tax  then those who do.  Short vs. Long term.
>
>
>
> Examples of pros and cons…
>
> I took a 30K+ loss many years ago when earnings came out and the stock
> tanked.  I had the stock purchased on Margin.  Had I not, the loss would
> have been so much less.  I was forced into a Margin call and had to take
> the large LOSS.  This is an example of Margin trading that caused a large
> loss.
>
>
>
> During Covid, I invested with Margin into a stock I knew would do well.
> At the peak, 3 million was made.  So this became a perfect case in which
> Margin trading worked really to my benefit.  I had to hold this stock for a
> year or longer to reduce the capital gain tax.
>
>
>
>
>
> *Tyson Burris, President*
> *Internet Communications Inc.*
> *739 Commerce Dr.*
> *Franklin, IN 46131*
>
> *Office #* *317-738-0320 *
> *Cell/Direct #* *317-412-1540 *
> *Online: **www.surfici.net* 
>
>
>
> [image: ICI]
>
> *What can ICI do for you?*
>
>
> *Broadband Wireless - PtP/PtMP Solutions - Mesh Wifi/Hotzones - IP Cameras
> - Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.*
>
> *CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the*
> *addressee shown. It contains information that is*
> *confidential and protected from disclosure. Any review,*
> *dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by*
> *unauthorized organizations or individuals is strictly*
> *prohibited.*
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, April 12, 2021 1:02 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks
>
>
>
> I just dont get it
>
> I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand buying
> power, seems like credit.
>
> The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me what
> thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
> It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up an
> idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a long
> long time now.  At some point that party will end.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
> What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They
> generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price"
> is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not
> for VWAGY.  Often not when trending $rando penny stock.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
> im simply not grasping this
>
> on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was playing
> with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing a

[AFMUG] Tower Cable Attachment

[Jason McKemie]

I have been using T&B UV resistant Ty-Raps for attaching to towers, but
have noticed them getting a bit brittle in some locations. What are you
guys using for this purpose?  I have considered going with some Sitepro1
cushions / hangers:

https://www.sitepro1.com/store/cart.php?m=product_list&c=2057

Seems like a bit overkill though. Thoughts?
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Tyson Burris]

Steve-

I didn’t read the whole email chain so I maybe blowing smoke here.

Margin is borrowed money based on a set value of a security.  You cannot Margin 
trade most penny stocks.

Margin trading is high risk / high reward.  You MUST be careful.  A stock that 
is traded on Margin and rapidly decreases its value you can cause you to be in 
Margin CALL or even owe the broker if not careful.  Buying Power tends to be 
Margin.

According to SEC regulations, a day trader is one who trades / flips five or 
more times in a trading period. If you are flagged as a day trader you must 
maintain 25K or more.  Holding a security overnight and not bouncing in and out 
of it prevents this from happening.  I believe if your account is flagged, you 
can wait 60-90 days and request the flag be removed. (assuming you don’t day 
trade anymore)

Those who don’t hold a stock for a year or longer will pay a much, much larger 
capital gains tax  then those who do.  Short vs. Long term.

Examples of pros and cons…
I took a 30K+ loss many years ago when earnings came out and the stock tanked.  
I had the stock purchased on Margin.  Had I not, the loss would have been so 
much less.  I was forced into a Margin call and had to take the large LOSS.  
This is an example of Margin trading that caused a large loss.

During Covid, I invested with Margin into a stock I knew would do well.  At the 
peak, 3 million was made.  So this became a perfect case in which Margin 
trading worked really to my benefit.  I had to hold this stock for a year or 
longer to reduce the capital gain tax.


Tyson Burris, President
Internet Communications Inc.
739 Commerce Dr.
Franklin, IN 46131

Office # 317-738-0320
Cell/Direct # 317-412-1540
Online: www.surfici.net

[ICI]
What can ICI do for you?

Broadband Wireless - PtP/PtMP Solutions - Mesh Wifi/Hotzones - IP Cameras - 
Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the
addressee shown. It contains information that is
confidential and protected from disclosure. Any review,
dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by
unauthorized organizations or individuals is strictly
prohibited.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 1:02 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

I just dont get it
I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand buying power, 
seems like credit.
The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me what 
thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson 
mailto:cpeter...@portnetworks.com>> wrote:
It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up an idiot 
on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a long long time 
now.  At some point that party will end.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson 
mailto:cpeter...@portnetworks.com>> wrote:
What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They generally 
assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price" is.   If you are 
trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not for VWAGY.  Often not 
when trending $rando penny stock.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>> wrote:
im simply not grasping this
on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was playing 
with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with essentially 10,000 
up front. There has to be more to this.
i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a week i 
get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account or i get a 
margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin, it would be 
cash.

assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I really have 
profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math mistakes made, I 
made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that the increased price 
lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but technically the sale 
would have put enough in to cover the difference)

On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
mailto:cknauer.li...@gmail.com>> wrote:
It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
all be wolf of wallstreet.

On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones 
mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5 shares per 
> stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
>
> I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed cryptocurrency, I 
> watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed the same trend for its 
> couple months existence.
>
> So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another penny stock. 
> Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money. It made 4k in 2 
> rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000 shares that 
> add

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Matt Hoppes]

Don't do penny stocks swing / day trade the S&P 500 and DJIA.   They 
always go up.


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Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Chuck McCown via AF]

Yep and I tend to cash out when I get lucky enough to double my money.  That 
was a stupid mistake for TSLA last year...  I made a very large sum of money 
from them but it could have been so much more.  I get jumpy.  Bird in the hand 
and all that.  Drives me crazy.  I prefer a good index fund and let it ride.  

From: Bill Prince 
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 11:51 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

Don't forget, that when you're playing with toy money, you have no skin in the 
game. As soon as yuor real money gets involved, you can't be certain you'd make 
the same kind of decisions.



bp
On 4/12/2021 10:01 AM, Steve Jones wrote:

  I just dont get it 
  I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand buying power, 
seems like credit.
  The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me what 
thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow

  On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson  
wrote:

It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up an 
idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a long 
long time now.  At some point that party will end.  

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson  
wrote:

  What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They 
generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price" is.   
If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not for VWAGY.  
Often not when trending $rando penny stock.  

  On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones  
wrote:

im simply not grasping this 
on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was 
playing with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with essentially 
10,000 up front. There has to be more to this. 
i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a 
week i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account or i 
get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin, it 
would be cash.

assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I 
really have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math 
mistakes made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that the 
increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but 
technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference) 

On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer  
wrote:

  It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
  all be wolf of wallstreet.

  On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones 
 wrote:
  >
  > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5 
shares per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
  >
  > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed 
cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed the 
same trend for its couple months existence.
  >
  > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another 
penny stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money. It 
made 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000 
shares that adds up.
  >
  > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something and 
play with real money.
  >
  > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some 
limits on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday morning.
  >
  > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that 
simple, everybody would be doing it.
  >
  > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you 
tried that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I assume the 
catch is pretty straight forward.
  >
  > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But 
just taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading day, that 
would be another 27k annually.
  >
  > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits I 
dont see it has a lot of impact.
  >
  > What's to stop a guy from spending an hour or 2 every morning with 
a relatively small amount in the big scheme of things like 10k trading to 1 
percent or better and then going to work? 100 bucks a day or more doesnt seem 
terrible for an hour.
  >
  >
  > --
  > AF mailing list
  > AF@af.afmug.com
  > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Carl Peterson]

Just open a trading account with $500 or 1K and play with it pretending it
is fake money.
On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 12:53 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> this is a nothing company that got a pancreatic cancer drug, so i guess
> its speculation. Probably wont see a whole lot with that much growth. But
> even the other ones a penny is a lot of percentage.
>
> Im still trying to grasp how this actually works and you actually get the
> money
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 12:35 PM Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
>> I think that's probably just a matter of lucky timing. If you can make
>> $10 in a day based on nothing more than a lucky guess, you can just as
>> easily lose $10k in a day based on an unlucky guess.
>>
>> The only major difference I can see with using real money is that when
>> you're dealing with penny stocks, a relatively small trade could
>> theoretically affect the price... fake trades obviously won't.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 12:03 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I just dont get it
>>> I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand buying
>>> power, seems like credit.
>>> The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me what
>>> thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson <
>>> cpeter...@portnetworks.com> wrote:
>>>
 It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up
 an idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a
 long long time now.  At some point that party will end.

 On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson <
 cpeter...@portnetworks.com> wrote:

> What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They
> generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price"
> is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not
> for VWAGY.  Often not when trending $rando penny stock.
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones <
> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> im simply not grasping this
>> on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was
>> playing with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with
>> essentially 10,000 up front. There has to be more to this.
>> i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a
>> week i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account 
>> or
>> i get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on 
>> margin,
>> it would be cash.
>>
>> assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I
>> really have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math
>> mistakes made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that 
>> the
>> increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but
>> technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference)
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then
>>> we'd
>>> all be wolf of wallstreet.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones <
>>> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5
>>> shares per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
>>> >
>>> > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed
>>> cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed 
>>> the
>>> same trend for its couple months existence.
>>> >
>>> > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another
>>> penny stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play 
>>> money.
>>> It made 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at
>>> 500,000 shares that adds up.
>>> >
>>> > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something
>>> and play with real money.
>>> >
>>> > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some
>>> limits on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday 
>>> morning.
>>> >
>>> > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that
>>> simple, everybody would be doing it.
>>> >
>>> > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you
>>> tried that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I 
>>> assume
>>> the catch is pretty straight forward.
>>> >
>>> > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But
>>> just taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading 
>>> day,
>>> that would be another 27k annually.
>>> >
>>> > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits
>>> I dont see it has a lot of impact.
>>> >
>>> 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Steve Jones]

this is a nothing company that got a pancreatic cancer drug, so i guess its
speculation. Probably wont see a whole lot with that much growth. But even
the other ones a penny is a lot of percentage.

Im still trying to grasp how this actually works and you actually get the
money

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 12:35 PM Mathew Howard  wrote:

> I think that's probably just a matter of lucky timing. If you can make $10
> in a day based on nothing more than a lucky guess, you can just as easily
> lose $10k in a day based on an unlucky guess.
>
> The only major difference I can see with using real money is that when
> you're dealing with penny stocks, a relatively small trade could
> theoretically affect the price... fake trades obviously won't.
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 12:03 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> I just dont get it
>> I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand buying
>> power, seems like credit.
>> The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me what
>> thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson <
>> cpeter...@portnetworks.com> wrote:
>>
>>> It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up
>>> an idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a
>>> long long time now.  At some point that party will end.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson <
>>> cpeter...@portnetworks.com> wrote:
>>>
 What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They
 generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price"
 is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not
 for VWAGY.  Often not when trending $rando penny stock.

 On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
 wrote:

> im simply not grasping this
> on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was
> playing with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with
> essentially 10,000 up front. There has to be more to this.
> i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a
> week i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account 
> or
> i get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin,
> it would be cash.
>
> assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I
> really have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math
> mistakes made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that 
> the
> increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but
> technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference)
>
> On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
> wrote:
>
>> It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
>> all be wolf of wallstreet.
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones <
>> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5
>> shares per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
>> >
>> > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed
>> cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed 
>> the
>> same trend for its couple months existence.
>> >
>> > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another
>> penny stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money.
>> It made 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at
>> 500,000 shares that adds up.
>> >
>> > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something and
>> play with real money.
>> >
>> > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some
>> limits on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday 
>> morning.
>> >
>> > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that
>> simple, everybody would be doing it.
>> >
>> > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you
>> tried that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I 
>> assume
>> the catch is pretty straight forward.
>> >
>> > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But
>> just taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading day,
>> that would be another 27k annually.
>> >
>> > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits I
>> dont see it has a lot of impact.
>> >
>> > What's to stop a guy from spending an hour or 2 every morning with
>> a relatively small amount in the big scheme of things like 10k trading 
>> to 1
>> percent or better and then going to work? 100 bucks a day or more doesnt
>> seem terrible for an hour.
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > AF mail

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Don't forget, that when you're playing with toy money, you have
  no skin in the game. As soon as yuor real money gets involved, you
  can't be certain you'd make the same kind of decisions.


bp

On 4/12/2021 10:01 AM, Steve Jones
  wrote:


  
  I just dont get it
I reset my account to specific cash amount. I
  dont understand buying power, seems like credit.
The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and
  tell me what thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world
  wouldnt allow
  
  
  
On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47
  AM Carl Peterson 
  wrote:


  
It is also pretty easy to look like a genius
  when markets are going up an idiot on the way down. 
  Markets have been going up and up and up for a long long
  time now.  At some point that party will end.  


  On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at
11:44 AM Carl Peterson 
wrote:
  
  

  What is often missing from play
accounts is often liquidity.  They generally assume
you can make any trade at wherever the current
"price" is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might
generally be true.  Perhaps not for VWAGY.  Often
not when trending $rando penny stock.  
  
  
On Mon, Apr 12,
  2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
  wrote:


  im simply not grasping this
on the paper trading site, ive made 7500
  this morning on 10k i was playing with. thats
  11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around
  with essentially 10,000 up front. There has to
  be more to this. 
i see on my schwab account if i make more
  than 4 same day trades in a week i get flagged
  as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my
  account or i get a margin call. I dont know
  what that means, im not buying on margin, it
  would be cash.


assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in
  my real account, would I really have profited
  11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some
  math mistakes made, I made the same size
  purchase each time, forgetting that the
  increased price lowered the number of stocks i
  could get for 10k, but technically the sale
  would have put enough in to cover the
  difference) 
  
  
  
On Sat, Apr
  10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
  wrote:

It works
  great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that
  easy then we'd
  all be wolf of wallstreet.
  
  On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones
  
  wrote:
  >
  > So I've been dicking around with the
  market, trivial amount, 5 shares per stock. If
  I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me
  well.
  >
  > I have 100 shares of this penny stock,
  it's a gold backed cryptocurrency, I watch it
  bounce a lot throug the day and its followed
  the same trend for its couple months
  existence.
  >
  > So I set up a paper account and was
  dicking today with another penny stock. Set
  buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the
  play money. It made 4k in 2 rounds. It's just
  a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000
  shares that adds up.
  >
  > I told the wife and of course she wants
   

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Mathew Howard]

I think that's probably just a matter of lucky timing. If you can make $10
in a day based on nothing more than a lucky guess, you can just as easily
lose $10k in a day based on an unlucky guess.

The only major difference I can see with using real money is that when
you're dealing with penny stocks, a relatively small trade could
theoretically affect the price... fake trades obviously won't.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 12:03 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> I just dont get it
> I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand buying
> power, seems like credit.
> The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me what
> thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
>> It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up an
>> idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a long
>> long time now.  At some point that party will end.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson <
>> cpeter...@portnetworks.com> wrote:
>>
>>> What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They
>>> generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price"
>>> is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not
>>> for VWAGY.  Often not when trending $rando penny stock.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 im simply not grasping this
 on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was
 playing with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with
 essentially 10,000 up front. There has to be more to this.
 i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a
 week i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account or
 i get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin,
 it would be cash.

 assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I
 really have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math
 mistakes made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that the
 increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but
 technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference)

 On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
 wrote:

> It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
> all be wolf of wallstreet.
>
> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
> >
> > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5
> shares per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
> >
> > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed
> cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed 
> the
> same trend for its couple months existence.
> >
> > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another penny
> stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money. It 
> made
> 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000
> shares that adds up.
> >
> > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something and
> play with real money.
> >
> > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some
> limits on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday 
> morning.
> >
> > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that
> simple, everybody would be doing it.
> >
> > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you
> tried that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I assume
> the catch is pretty straight forward.
> >
> > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But
> just taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading day,
> that would be another 27k annually.
> >
> > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits I
> dont see it has a lot of impact.
> >
> > What's to stop a guy from spending an hour or 2 every morning with a
> relatively small amount in the big scheme of things like 10k trading to 1
> percent or better and then going to work? 100 bucks a day or more doesnt
> seem terrible for an hour.
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listi

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Steve Jones]

I just dont get it
I reset my account to specific cash amount. I dont understand buying power,
seems like credit.
The one im toying with is RGBP, if someone can look and tell me what
thinkorswim is letting me do that the real world wouldnt allow

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:47 AM Carl Peterson 
wrote:

> It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up an
> idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a long
> long time now.  At some point that party will end.
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
>> What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They
>> generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price"
>> is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not
>> for VWAGY.  Often not when trending $rando penny stock.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> im simply not grasping this
>>> on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was
>>> playing with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with
>>> essentially 10,000 up front. There has to be more to this.
>>> i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a
>>> week i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account or
>>> i get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin,
>>> it would be cash.
>>>
>>> assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I
>>> really have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math
>>> mistakes made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that the
>>> increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but
>>> technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference)
>>>
>>> On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
 all be wolf of wallstreet.

 On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones 
 wrote:
 >
 > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5 shares
 per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
 >
 > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed
 cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed the
 same trend for its couple months existence.
 >
 > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another penny
 stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money. It made
 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000
 shares that adds up.
 >
 > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something and
 play with real money.
 >
 > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some
 limits on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday morning.
 >
 > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that
 simple, everybody would be doing it.
 >
 > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you tried
 that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I assume the
 catch is pretty straight forward.
 >
 > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But
 just taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading day,
 that would be another 27k annually.
 >
 > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits I
 dont see it has a lot of impact.
 >
 > What's to stop a guy from spending an hour or 2 every morning with a
 relatively small amount in the big scheme of things like 10k trading to 1
 percent or better and then going to work? 100 bucks a day or more doesnt
 seem terrible for an hour.
 >
 >
 > --
 > AF mailing list
 > AF@af.afmug.com
 > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Carl Peterson]

It is also pretty easy to look like a genius when markets are going up an
idiot on the way down.  Markets have been going up and up and up for a long
long time now.  At some point that party will end.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:44 AM Carl Peterson 
wrote:

> What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They
> generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price"
> is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not
> for VWAGY.  Often not when trending $rando penny stock.
>
> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> im simply not grasping this
>> on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was
>> playing with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with
>> essentially 10,000 up front. There has to be more to this.
>> i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a
>> week i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account or
>> i get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin,
>> it would be cash.
>>
>> assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I
>> really have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math
>> mistakes made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that the
>> increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but
>> technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference)
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
>>> all be wolf of wallstreet.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5 shares
>>> per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
>>> >
>>> > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed
>>> cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed the
>>> same trend for its couple months existence.
>>> >
>>> > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another penny
>>> stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money. It made
>>> 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000
>>> shares that adds up.
>>> >
>>> > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something and
>>> play with real money.
>>> >
>>> > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some
>>> limits on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday morning.
>>> >
>>> > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that simple,
>>> everybody would be doing it.
>>> >
>>> > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you tried
>>> that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I assume the
>>> catch is pretty straight forward.
>>> >
>>> > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But just
>>> taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading day, that
>>> would be another 27k annually.
>>> >
>>> > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits I
>>> dont see it has a lot of impact.
>>> >
>>> > What's to stop a guy from spending an hour or 2 every morning with a
>>> relatively small amount in the big scheme of things like 10k trading to 1
>>> percent or better and then going to work? 100 bucks a day or more doesnt
>>> seem terrible for an hour.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > AF mailing list
>>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Carl Peterson]

What is often missing from play accounts is often liquidity.  They
generally assume you can make any trade at wherever the current "price"
is.   If you are trading VWAPY that might generally be true.  Perhaps not
for VWAGY.  Often not when trending $rando penny stock.

On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 11:12 AM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> im simply not grasping this
> on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was playing
> with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with essentially
> 10,000 up front. There has to be more to this.
> i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a week
> i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account or i
> get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin, it
> would be cash.
>
> assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I really
> have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math mistakes
> made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that the
> increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but
> technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference)
>
> On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
> wrote:
>
>> It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
>> all be wolf of wallstreet.
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5 shares
>> per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
>> >
>> > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed
>> cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed the
>> same trend for its couple months existence.
>> >
>> > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another penny
>> stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money. It made
>> 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000
>> shares that adds up.
>> >
>> > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something and
>> play with real money.
>> >
>> > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some
>> limits on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday morning.
>> >
>> > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that simple,
>> everybody would be doing it.
>> >
>> > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you tried
>> that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I assume the
>> catch is pretty straight forward.
>> >
>> > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But just
>> taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading day, that
>> would be another 27k annually.
>> >
>> > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits I
>> dont see it has a lot of impact.
>> >
>> > What's to stop a guy from spending an hour or 2 every morning with a
>> relatively small amount in the big scheme of things like 10k trading to 1
>> percent or better and then going to work? 100 bucks a day or more doesnt
>> seem terrible for an hour.
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > AF mailing list
>> > AF@af.afmug.com
>> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] OT: penny stocks

[Steve Jones]

im simply not grasping this
on the paper trading site, ive made 7500 this morning on 10k i was playing
with. thats 11,000 dollars in 2 days of playing around with essentially
10,000 up front. There has to be more to this.
i see on my schwab account if i make more than 4 same day trades in a week
i get flagged as a day trader and need to have 25,000 in my account or i
get a margin call. I dont know what that means, im not buying on margin, it
would be cash.

assuming that I had actually had 10,000 in my real account, would I really
have profited 11,000 in 2 days on 5 trades? (there was some math mistakes
made, I made the same size purchase each time, forgetting that the
increased price lowered the number of stocks i could get for 10k, but
technically the sale would have put enough in to cover the difference)

On Sat, Apr 10, 2021 at 4:08 PM Caleb Knauer 
wrote:

> It works great, right until it doesn't.  If it was that easy then we'd
> all be wolf of wallstreet.
>
> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 10:13 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
> >
> > So I've been dicking around with the market, trivial amount, 5 shares
> per stock. If I had put a lot in Tesco would have done me well.
> >
> > I have 100 shares of this penny stock, it's a gold backed
> cryptocurrency, I watch it bounce a lot throug the day and its followed the
> same trend for its couple months existence.
> >
> > So I set up a paper account and was dicking today with another penny
> stock. Set buy and sell limits with about 10,000 in the play money. It made
> 4k in 2 rounds. It's just a couple pennies it fluctuates but at 500,000
> shares that adds up.
> >
> > I told the wife and of course she wants me to cash in something and play
> with real money.
> >
> > I'm more inclined to see how the play money performs, I have some limits
> on the crypto stock that we will see what happens on monday morning.
> >
> > I'm thinking to myself there has to be a catch. If it was that simple,
> everybody would be doing it.
> >
> > You guys who mess around probably went through a time where you tried
> that kind of trading, and none of you talk about it now, so I assume the
> catch is pretty straight forward.
> >
> > I was looking at my IRA, it's done pretty good at 17 percent. But just
> taking 10k of it and playing with this at 1 percent per trading day, that
> would be another 27k annually.
> >
> > I do see why day traders need low latency though, but with limits I dont
> see it has a lot of impact.
> >
> > What's to stop a guy from spending an hour or 2 every morning with a
> relatively small amount in the big scheme of things like 10k trading to 1
> percent or better and then going to work? 100 bucks a day or more doesnt
> seem terrible for an hour.
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com