Re: DIS: by the way
-- Benu Phoenix On Mon, 8 Aug 2011, Sean Hunt wrote: On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 20:07, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote: What's the Speed currently set to? I was never totally clear on how that all worked out. Fast. Your intent was unambiguously successful. What does that mean? I'm sorta new, and don't understand.
Re: DIS: by the way
On Mon, 8 Aug 2011, Sean Hunt wrote: On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 20:07, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote: What's the Speed currently set to? I was never totally clear on how that all worked out. Fast. Your intent was unambiguously successful. What does that mean? I'm sorta new, and don't understand. PS: Sorry for the garbled previous post. -- Benu Phoenix
Re: DIS: any winning or contests?
On 9 August 2011 03:51, Kerim Aydin ke...@u.washington.edu wrote: Am I right when I say no one has actually won the game recently, not even Walker? Or did I miss a successful victory case or two? Or is the dumb system completely broken. My victory was confirmed on the 19th July, two weeks after the judgement of GLORY on CFJ 3048, but I was never awarded Champion. -- Charles Walker
Re: DIS: by the way
On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 23:52, Benu Phoenix ag...@beowulf.benuphoenix.com wrote: On Mon, 8 Aug 2011, Sean Hunt wrote: Fast. Your intent was unambiguously successful. What does that mean? I'm sorta new, and don't understand. PS: Sorry for the garbled previous post. -- Benu Phoenix Fast refers to the Speed, as Pavitra asked what it was. -scshunt
Re: DIS: any winning or contests?
On 08/09/2011 03:41 AM, Charles Walker wrote: On 9 August 2011 03:51, Kerim Aydin ke...@u.washington.edu wrote: Am I right when I say no one has actually won the game recently, not even Walker? Or did I miss a successful victory case or two? Or is the dumb system completely broken. My victory was confirmed on the 19th July, two weeks after the judgement of GLORY on CFJ 3048, but I was never awarded Champion. I think that you were awarded Champion when the Promise (2011-07-13 G. 1) was cashed, on 26 July.
DIS: testing
i'm testing my email client's configuration to make sure it is compatible with agora. -- Benu Phoenix
Re: DIS: Re: OFF: [CotC] CFJ 3085 assigned to Murphy
On Mon, Aug 8, 2011 at 5:28 PM, Arkady English arkadyenglish+ag...@gmail.com wrote: Does Agora have any jurisdiction over a laptop repair shop? Define jurisdiction. Can we impose any penalty that they're likely to take seriously? Probably not. Can we impose penalties that *we* pretend to take seriously? Sure!
DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 08/09/2011 09:35 AM, Arkady English wrote:
I create a number of copies of the following promise equal to one less
the number of First-Class players of Agora:
Conditions: The casher, on cashing this promise, creates a promise
text: { If I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my
support or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn. }; I have not already withdrawn my
vote/support/objection due to a promise with identical text.
Text: I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my support
or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn.
Unfortunately this won't quite work the way you want. The text is
missing a leading if, and more critically, may not be withdrawn
doesn't work at all.
The condition of a promise is a true/false predicate that is evaluated
at the time of cashing. It's not in general able to impose ongoing
obligations. Similarly, the text of the promise is simply treated as
though the promise's author had sent that text in a public message. It
can only trigger by-announcement actions, and only at the time it's cashed.
For a model of how to accomplish the sort of thing you're trying to get
at, I recommend you look at Vote Issue Series G1 and G1 vote
guarantee. (Note that these two promises go together; they are
collectively one complete example of how to do it.)
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 08/09/2011 09:50 AM, Pavitra wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:35 AM, Arkady English wrote:
I create a number of copies of the following promise equal to one less
the number of First-Class players of Agora:
Conditions: The casher, on cashing this promise, creates a promise
text: { If I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my
support or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn. }; I have not already withdrawn my
vote/support/objection due to a promise with identical text.
Text: I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my support
or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn.
Unfortunately this won't quite work the way you want. The text is
missing a leading if, and more critically, may not be withdrawn
doesn't work at all.
The condition of a promise is a true/false predicate that is evaluated
at the time of cashing. It's not in general able to impose ongoing
obligations. Similarly, the text of the promise is simply treated as
though the promise's author had sent that text in a public message. It
can only trigger by-announcement actions, and only at the time it's cashed.
For a model of how to accomplish the sort of thing you're trying to get
at, I recommend you look at Vote Issue Series G1 and G1 vote
guarantee. (Note that these two promises go together; they are
collectively one complete example of how to do it.)
Actually, on a closer reading, I believe that none of these CAN ever be
cashed. In the absence of capitals, I read may not to mean SHALL
NOT, and since support, objections, and votes always MAY be withdrawn
(though not always CAN), the conditions will always evaluate to false.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 9 August 2011 15:50, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:35 AM, Arkady English wrote:
I create a number of copies of the following promise equal to one less
the number of First-Class players of Agora:
Conditions: The casher, on cashing this promise, creates a promise
text: { If I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my
support or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn. }; I have not already withdrawn my
vote/support/objection due to a promise with identical text.
Text: I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my support
or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn.
Unfortunately this won't quite work the way you want. The text is
missing a leading if, and more critically, may not be withdrawn
doesn't work at all.
The condition of a promise is a true/false predicate that is evaluated
at the time of cashing. It's not in general able to impose ongoing
obligations. Similarly, the text of the promise is simply treated as
though the promise's author had sent that text in a public message. It
can only trigger by-announcement actions, and only at the time it's cashed.
For a model of how to accomplish the sort of thing you're trying to get
at, I recommend you look at Vote Issue Series G1 and G1 vote
guarantee. (Note that these two promises go together; they are
collectively one complete example of how to do it.)
Darn ... I'm not used to the way highlighting works in IE (it always
seems to skip the first word...I've done this a lot). I guess the
promises just about work if they're timed correctly (i.e. right at the
end of the voting period).
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 9 August 2011 15:54, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:50 AM, Pavitra wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:35 AM, Arkady English wrote:
I create a number of copies of the following promise equal to one less
the number of First-Class players of Agora:
Conditions: The casher, on cashing this promise, creates a promise
text: { If I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my
support or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn. }; I have not already withdrawn my
vote/support/objection due to a promise with identical text.
Text: I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my support
or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn.
Unfortunately this won't quite work the way you want. The text is
missing a leading if, and more critically, may not be withdrawn
doesn't work at all.
The condition of a promise is a true/false predicate that is evaluated
at the time of cashing. It's not in general able to impose ongoing
obligations. Similarly, the text of the promise is simply treated as
though the promise's author had sent that text in a public message. It
can only trigger by-announcement actions, and only at the time it's cashed.
For a model of how to accomplish the sort of thing you're trying to get
at, I recommend you look at Vote Issue Series G1 and G1 vote
guarantee. (Note that these two promises go together; they are
collectively one complete example of how to do it.)
Actually, on a closer reading, I believe that none of these CAN ever be
cashed. In the absence of capitals, I read may not to mean SHALL
NOT, and since support, objections, and votes always MAY be withdrawn
(though not always CAN), the conditions will always evaluate to false.
None of the conditions include the words may not, so I think the
conditions are probably alright? Also, how easy is it to correct the
typo of the missing If?
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 08/09/2011 10:03 AM, Arkady English wrote:
On 9 August 2011 15:54, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:50 AM, Pavitra wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:35 AM, Arkady English wrote:
I create a number of copies of the following promise equal to one less
the number of First-Class players of Agora:
Conditions: The casher, on cashing this promise, creates a promise
text: { If I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my
support or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn. }; I have not already withdrawn my
vote/support/objection due to a promise with identical text.
Text: I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my support
or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn.
Unfortunately this won't quite work the way you want. The text is
missing a leading if, and more critically, may not be withdrawn
doesn't work at all.
The condition of a promise is a true/false predicate that is evaluated
at the time of cashing. It's not in general able to impose ongoing
obligations. Similarly, the text of the promise is simply treated as
though the promise's author had sent that text in a public message. It
can only trigger by-announcement actions, and only at the time it's cashed.
For a model of how to accomplish the sort of thing you're trying to get
at, I recommend you look at Vote Issue Series G1 and G1 vote
guarantee. (Note that these two promises go together; they are
collectively one complete example of how to do it.)
Actually, on a closer reading, I believe that none of these CAN ever be
cashed. In the absence of capitals, I read may not to mean SHALL
NOT, and since support, objections, and votes always MAY be withdrawn
(though not always CAN), the conditions will always evaluate to false.
None of the conditions include the words may not, so I think the
conditions are probably alright? Also, how easy is it to correct the
typo of the missing If?
*rereads*
Right, I'm with you again now.
Okay, I agree that it's cashable. But there's a catastrophic bug in it
that I think I'd rather exploit than explain.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 08/09/2011 10:03 AM, Arkady English wrote: Also, how easy is it to correct the typo of the missing If? Right, forgot to answer this. There's no mechanism for amending promises. You'd have to issue a new set of promises, and maybe try to get the old ones destroyed.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On 9 August 2011 16:11, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote:
On 08/09/2011 10:03 AM, Arkady English wrote:
On 9 August 2011 15:54, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:50 AM, Pavitra wrote:
On 08/09/2011 09:35 AM, Arkady English wrote:
I create a number of copies of the following promise equal to one less
the number of First-Class players of Agora:
Conditions: The casher, on cashing this promise, creates a promise
text: { If I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my
support or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn. }; I have not already withdrawn my
vote/support/objection due to a promise with identical text.
Text: I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my support
or objection for an action. I support or object the action as
specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn.
OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use
all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may
not be withdrawn.
Unfortunately this won't quite work the way you want. The text is
missing a leading if, and more critically, may not be withdrawn
doesn't work at all.
The condition of a promise is a true/false predicate that is evaluated
at the time of cashing. It's not in general able to impose ongoing
obligations. Similarly, the text of the promise is simply treated as
though the promise's author had sent that text in a public message. It
can only trigger by-announcement actions, and only at the time it's cashed.
For a model of how to accomplish the sort of thing you're trying to get
at, I recommend you look at Vote Issue Series G1 and G1 vote
guarantee. (Note that these two promises go together; they are
collectively one complete example of how to do it.)
Actually, on a closer reading, I believe that none of these CAN ever be
cashed. In the absence of capitals, I read may not to mean SHALL
NOT, and since support, objections, and votes always MAY be withdrawn
(though not always CAN), the conditions will always evaluate to false.
None of the conditions include the words may not, so I think the
conditions are probably alright? Also, how easy is it to correct the
typo of the missing If?
*rereads*
Right, I'm with you again now.
Okay, I agree that it's cashable. But there's a catastrophic bug in it
that I think I'd rather exploit than explain.
I think this sums up my comments:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lytZ7fYOlgU (5 second video)
DIS: Re: OFF: [IADoP] Herald Deputisation and Election
On Tue, 9 Aug 2011, Charles Walker wrote: I deputise on behalf of the Herald to award myself the patent title Champion. I initiate an election for the Herald office, nominating Pavitra. For anyone taking over, the only changes I'm aware of since last Herald's Report were walker's award of Champion, and awarding of Coming of Age by proposal 7094 (needs cross-ref with Registrar records). Also, it looks like while I have to be a Player to BECOME a contestmaster, I don't STOP being contestmaster by ceasing to be a player (at least, if I don't specifically resign). Unless there's a counterargument I'm going to try to continue the Delving contest such as it is (may raise some questions on whether I can perform dependent actions defined in contract, etc). -G.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: (With apologies to the Horton) Vote-swap scheme.
On Tue, Aug 9, 2011 at 08:11, Pavitra celestialcognit...@gmail.com wrote: *rereads* Right, I'm with you again now. Okay, I agree that it's cashable. But there's a catastrophic bug in it that I think I'd rather exploit than explain. I'd love to exploit it too, except I think the promise is effectively unusable. When the promise is cashed, Arkady sends a message with the text I have supported or objected to an action, I retract my support or objection for an action. I support or object the action as specified by the casher. This support/objection may not be withdrawn. OR I withdraw any votes I have made on a specified proposal, and use all my votes in the manner specified by the casher. These votes may not be withdrawn. The OR makes it hopelessly ambiguous at best. -scshunt
