As attached. -- Jason Cobb
Assessor, Rulekeepor, Stonemason
MESSAGE 729532155532804167 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:00:19.931: 1 MESSAGE 729533293565050892 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:04:51.259: Deleted one MESSAGE 729533330378194967 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:05:00.036: no you deleted 2 MESSAGE 729533539166715925 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:05:49.815: I was rooting for 2 MESSAGE 729533715193135174 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:06:31.783: So, Diplonomic. MESSAGE 729533861272485922 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:07:06.611: We have been given a perfectly normal game of diplomacy and we can change it however we want. MESSAGE 729533941983477880 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:07:25.854: what could possibly go wrong MESSAGE 729533943573119066 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:07:26.233: split all the nations in half and add 7 more players MESSAGE 729533977962217532 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:07:34.432: Proposal: add the rest of the continents MESSAGE 729534281701130321 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:08:46.849: My proposal is to allow team play. MESSAGE 729534306019704942 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:08:52.647: But that's pretty tame. MESSAGE 729534353536712845 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:09:03.976: Extending the map sounds cool. MESSAGE 729534363066302584 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:09:06.248: My proposal is that idj how this game works MESSAGE 729534422281355364 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:09:20.366: proposal: ratify that @captainsisay knows how the game works MESSAGE 729534435627892756 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:09:23.548: We can also add portals if we want to. MESSAGE 729534576472358973 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:09:57.128: not portals MESSAGE 729534589097213981 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:10:00.138: v long bridges MESSAGE 729534855964131409 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:11:03.764: You misspelled elon musk hyperloops MESSAGE 729534970867220522 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:11:31.159: Proposal: nuclear weapons. MESSAGE 729534979964403823 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:11:33.328: ~~I assumed we wanted them to work~~ MESSAGE 729535082980966471 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 03:11:57.889: Lolol MESSAGE 729709289018490970 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 14:44:11.845: planes MESSAGE 729795491218325545 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:26:44.051: That's... not a bad idea. MESSAGE 729795686379552818 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:27:30.581: That is a fun idea MESSAGE 729796309187428392 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:29:59.07: Plane rules: They can go on any province but take up two unit slots. They can maybe also convoy armies? MESSAGE 729796409720569899 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:30:23.039: Very much a draft. MESSAGE 729796454033391709 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:30:33.604: air support -> support actions 2 spaces away (that would be huge) MESSAGE 729796606328832052 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:31:09.914: That *would* be huge. MESSAGE 729796694321135669 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:31:30.893: full stacking: navy with a plane on top with an army on top -> aircraft carrier based paratroops MESSAGE 729796802005696602 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:31:56.567: *raises eyebrows* MESSAGE 729796880950886460 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:32:15.389: But I have an idea for planes based on your model. MESSAGE 729797104167288863 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:33:08.608: They can support two provinces away or one province away. They can share a province with other units of the same nation. They can only be based on land. If their province is taken they are destroyed. MESSAGE 729797315115876432 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:33:58.902: They don't count towards the defense of their own province. MESSAGE 729797327392342138 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:34:01.829: Glass cannon. MESSAGE 729797347667869868 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:34:06.663: counterbalancing suggestion: these are aircraft bases not just planes. Takes extra effort to move (e.g. can turn into an army one turn, move, then turn back to an air base) MESSAGE 729797419654578307 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:34:23.826: agreed on defense MESSAGE 729797684134674442 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:35:26.883: Okay. MESSAGE 729798245768888522 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 20:37:40.787: Given the glass cannon thing they could probably take up only one unit slot? MESSAGE 729820686302052394 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 22:06:51.027: this might be "overengineering" but here's a thought: An Installation can be built or destroyed on a supply center by a unit occupying it (building or destroying is a move that counts as a Hold for other purposes; if the unit is dislodged the action fails). The owner of the Supply Center with an Installation can give it orders as part of eir move. Installation type 1: air bases. MESSAGE 729828276889190521 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 22:37:00.764: Would you make them non-mobile then? MESSAGE 729829629249978449 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 22:42:23.192: yah, that example has them "not count as units" in exchange for being fixed (and capturable). But could go either way. MESSAGE 729832723350421595 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 22:54:40.883: What other installations can we think of? MESSAGE 729832796998205510 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 22:54:58.442: I've got one. MESSAGE 729832844377194567 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 22:55:09.738: Trenches. MESSAGE 729833732722262076 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 22:58:41.536: Which passively add one support to the defensive the province and cause the unit stationed there to be able to continue to support somewhere else unless dislodged. MESSAGE 729834338732081253 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:01:06.02: _looks nervously at these proposed new mechanics while still not knowing the base game_ MESSAGE 729834686955913336 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:02:29.043: I learned from this <https://youtu.be/S-sSWsBdbNI> MESSAGE 729834785513406524 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:02:52.541: don't need to know the rules if you change them fast enough MESSAGE 729834812340174919 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:02:58.937: thanks, I'll give that a look MESSAGE 729836718764720228 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:10:33.464: fun to come up with random ideas but there's something to be said for playing mostly straight for a couple movement rounds... MESSAGE 729836779259166750 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:10:47.887: This tbh MESSAGE 729836790848028672 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:10:50.65: Oh, of course. MESSAGE 729837100282806364 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:12:04.425: I think my team thing should be introduced soon, but that doesn't change game mechanics at all (it's purely at the meta level). MESSAGE 729837581197639770 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:13:59.084: Actual game changes can wait. MESSAGE 729837632770801705 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:14:11.38: It's fun to brainstorm though. MESSAGE 729837691532738600 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:14:25.39: And there's not much else we can do till we have assignments. MESSAGE 729837817596870676 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:14:55.446: otoh, nch is right - a great way to throw off an experienced player is to introduce something that mucks with eir experience/intuition. New players don't know strategies so aren't worse off, but experienced players might be more "I was playing a known strategy and didn't rethink it enough" MESSAGE 729837967035858988 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:15:31.075: Does anyone have any decent strategy primers? MESSAGE 729838677999616081 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:18:20.582: "the gamer's guide to diplomacy" is a classic (published in the 70s, google for pdfs of various qualities) MESSAGE 729838796278857868 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:18:48.782: organized by country so you can just turn to your country's page when you know it MESSAGE 729838928940499080 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:19:20.411: <http://petermc.net/diplomacy/gg2ed.pdf> MESSAGE 729838932329627648 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:19:21.219: honestly as a new player the best way to win a game like diplomacy is to force it into a rare (or since you can change the rules, completely unprecedented) gamestate MESSAGE 729839099057274891 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:20:00.97: solution: ossify diplonomic MESSAGE 729839447633428543 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:21:24.077: First couple moves are a bit like chess, in that each country only has a few good openings, that a strategy guide generally has (unlike chess tho, the different options are pretty easy to figure out from basic principles) MESSAGE 729839540184940556 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:21:46.143: And yah, perturb one of those early on with a rules change and all bets are off MESSAGE 729839627271143516 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:22:06.906: reshuffle players every round MESSAGE 729839687195426889 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:22:21.193: lol MESSAGE 729842564743823400 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:33:47.254: I ossify the contest MESSAGE 729842768217767987 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:34:35.766: sorry, you can't do that because of diplonomic is a nomic MESSAGE 729842824484225124 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-06 AT 23:34:49.181: 👆 MESSAGE 729896468022034442 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 03:07:58.797: One option would to just play relatively traditional diplomacy with relatively few tweaks around the edges. MESSAGE 730144223986319421 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:32:28.422: BTW, @G., how much diplomacy have you played? MESSAGE 730144326746898534 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:32:52.922: why none at all i'm an absolute beginner why do you ask? MESSAGE 730145054739529828 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:35:46.489: Yep. Right. Sure. MESSAGE 730145073655971931 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:35:50.999: real answer: in high school (30 yrs ago) my friends and I encountered it at a game con just when we were getting bored with Risk. So we were into it for a year or so and I read that book. That's why my references are so old I think there's lots of stuff online I don't know. Played 1 or 2 online games since then last time was ages ago (just with friends not tournaments/servers or anything). MESSAGE 730145292363628585 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:36:43.143: And it's easy to burn out on Dip so "playing it for a year" was maybe half a dozen games. MESSAGE 730145387624792247 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:37:05.855: at most MESSAGE 730145462732062731 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:37:23.762: well yeah a single game takes ages MESSAGE 730145534911709244 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:37:40.971: Are your kids meeting in basements to do "the dip"? Learn about this strange new sensation that exposes inpressionable teens to fascism and communism MESSAGE 730146045186801675 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:39:42.63: Oh and that one previous diplonomic game (where the lesson was just "it doesn't take long for proposals to make all your experience useless) and the game was abandoned just when it was getting intereting, anyway. But it was real fun (in part because very random) while it ran, hence my enthusiasm (not so much skill) for this. MESSAGE 730146166548987995 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:40:11.565: Okay, thanks! MESSAGE 730146637837762623 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:42:03.929: Mostly I was asking because I wanted to check whether we had any hyper expirienced players. MESSAGE 730146879496519681 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:43:01.545: At this point I know the rules. But for strategy it's very much, "What's a strategy? Can I eat one?" MESSAGE 730146917136203818 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:43:10.519: same MESSAGE 730146995477413968 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:43:29.197: the strategy is mostly developing a sense for when a supposed ally is posed to attack you MESSAGE 730147002028916796 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:43:30.759: tasty strategy MESSAGE 730147236302028975 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:44:26.614: optimal strategy is to take everything people say at face value MESSAGE 730147442095292497 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:45:15.679: Particularly if we're the ones saying it. MESSAGE 730148240422469713 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:48:26.015: i promise never ever to attack you ever at all nope never MESSAGE 730148294038388818 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:48:38.798: The problem with "strategy" is the game is purposefully so balanced that any pair of allies can do well (and can usually talk through tactics easily enough). So strategy is really "which of these allies is really an ally" which is all social/negotiations MESSAGE 730149381499650111 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:52:58.069: Isn't "any pair" a bit of a stretch? MESSAGE 730149647351283772 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:54:01.453: england and turkey MESSAGE 730149739361861724 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:54:23.39: i guess it could work maybe lol MESSAGE 730149821414899764 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:54:42.953: That's what I was thinking too. MESSAGE 730149849651085354 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:54:49.685: Same example, even. MESSAGE 730150128794468483 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 19:55:56.238: are you kidding? Russia can attack both by Year 3. So it's in either's interest for the other to attack Russia. Turkey and France may be a bigger stretch. MESSAGE 730151294383423578 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:00:34.136: i think we were just thinking strictly in terms of geographical distance on the map MESSAGE 730152054320005170 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:03:35.319: the map is set up so the border squares are really big, on a graph moving around the edge is much faster than the shorter phyiscal map-distance through the center MESSAGE 730154057494298695 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:11:32.913: G., any free advice? MESSAGE 730155295992578219 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:16:28.194: don't lose MESSAGE 730155427396059226 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:16:59.523: You're not G. and I don't think that counts as advice. ;) MESSAGE 730155495507230851 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:17:15.762: win more than the other players MESSAGE 730155979978834033 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:19:11.269: I'm just hoping I don't get Italy. MESSAGE 730156134853509221 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:19:48.194: perche? MESSAGE 730156443554283540 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:21:01.794: Hmm? MESSAGE 730156468120322137 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:21:07.651: it's italian for why MESSAGE 730156618141925437 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:21:43.419: As I understand it it's open to attack from many places. MESSAGE 730157697852243998 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:26:00.842: that just means you have to make allies and attack before being attacked MESSAGE 730157804374982766 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:26:26.239: will come back to this, I now have to close this to be *forced* to pay attention to a meeting that I'm actually leading! MESSAGE 730158700056018964 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:29:59.786: Austria might be harder, I guess? MESSAGE 730160826509688883 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:38:26.772: yeah as long as i dont get austria im cool MESSAGE 730160915512688670 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 20:38:47.992: we should give austria to G. MESSAGE 730183590180290742 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 22:08:54.054: yes pls MESSAGE 730184509802414161 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 22:12:33.309: ~~and all gang up on em~~ MESSAGE 730198748118122548 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:09:07.988: Playing as a team will make this much more fun. MESSAGE 730198815956664362 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:09:24.162: ~~G., want to team up?~~ MESSAGE 730198828820594690 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:09:27.229: I suck at brainstorming without talking things through with someone. MESSAGE 730198868595179642 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:09:36.712: Jason, aren't you a contestant? MESSAGE 730198902283829340 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:09:44.744: yes that's why it's crossed out MESSAGE 730198951814234159 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:09:56.553: lol our fiendish plan almost worked MESSAGE 730198984815280139 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:10:04.421: I'll team up with anyone who wants terrible advice MESSAGE 730199053253476423 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:10:20.738: I'll take that offer since I can only give myself terrible advice anyway MESSAGE 730199170505244722 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:10:48.693: aw I typed too slow MESSAGE 730199189396652142 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:10:53.197: lol MESSAGE 730199377456529519 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:11:38.034: If you're serious I guess I should tell the list MESSAGE 730199534818558052 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:12:15.552: I wasn't planning on paying much attention to the diplonomic game actually, work should be picking up in a couple weeks theoretically MESSAGE 730199820513574986 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:13:23.667: best of luck with that MESSAGE 730203548091941006 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-07 AT 23:28:12.391: cahoots? is that near belgium MESSAGE 730212471062790204 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:03:39.793: Proposal: add a new region called Cahoots MESSAGE 730212519519453226 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:03:51.346: It can be abbreviated "Cah" MESSAGE 730212566906830919 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:04:02.644: idk anything about diplo but is australia in it MESSAGE 730212624616128523 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:04:16.403: no, it's just europe MESSAGE 730212676499669062 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:04:28.773: i demand that australia be in it MESSAGE 730212714139615232 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:04:37.747: make a proposal MESSAGE 730212750885650513 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:04:46.508: i will MESSAGE 730212786549817448 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:04:55.011: when the rules are published and gameplay happens MESSAGE 730213034886168586 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:05:54.219: who needs iceland anyway, i demand that iceland be renamed "australia MESSAGE 730213911844093982 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 00:09:23.302: proposal: 'murica exists MESSAGE 730494815695011882 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 18:45:35.999: https://tenor.com/view/granger-smith-earl-dibbles-america-gif-13831121 MESSAGE 730505655399481487 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 19:28:40.386: When does the Diplonomic start? MESSAGE 730505688488476803 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 19:28:48.275: *paces eagerly* MESSAGE 730505750526558229 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 19:29:03.066: I think there's a reg amendment intent that's not resolvable yet MESSAGE 730505972459765812 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 19:29:55.979: well, it will become resolvable in 10 minutes MESSAGE 730505974875422730 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 19:29:56.555: https://mailman.agoranomic.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/agora-business/2020-July/043928.html MESSAGE 730521104808018071 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:30:03.812: A bunch of rulers waiting for countries MESSAGE 730521232440688754 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:30:34.242: Indeed. MESSAGE 730521411499589673 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:31:16.933: Let's be peaceful I had the idea to reskin it as a turn-of-century European art game MESSAGE 730521467493548152 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:31:30.283: Hmm? MESSAGE 730521576516354050 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:31:56.276: hmm - it was a random thought, something like: MESSAGE 730522230567731344 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:34:32.214: "It's 1901! Peace has been declared!! To celebrate, the artists of all the countries have taken to tours (boats and carriages) to show off their art and become the dominant country of the art scene. All mechanics are the same, but when an army (artist) "takes over" a supply center, it's really because their shocking traveling ballet show has become the toast of the town and everything else is passe". Then we use fancy art metaphors instead of "ruling country" metaphors MESSAGE 730522313212297288 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:34:51.918: Hmmm. MESSAGE 730522456854626325 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:35:26.165: It was just silly free association really I hadn't thought/typed it out beyond a sentence until that MESSAGE 730522582083960873 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:35:56.022: It's a cool idea, I'm just not feeling it personally. I guess I like the martial component. MESSAGE 730522841551732776 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:36:57.884: nah, when we were talking about the sort of units like planes I just had this image of dance fights, probably not a sustainable joke MESSAGE 730522960326164541 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:37:26.202: Why do I keep typoing? It's very annoying. MESSAGE 730523117784530944 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:38:03.743: But yeah. MESSAGE 730523228736585759 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:38:30.196: I think what's going on here is that I've never played vanilla diplomacy yet and so the original game still feels new and interesting. MESSAGE 730523673383141377 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:40:16.208: ditto after the conversations here I was thinking it had been a long time since playing a vanilla game (thinking back, at least 15 years). that's why my proposal thoughts were more on reskinning than mechanics, but even then, vanilla sounds more fun right now. MESSAGE 730523913515434094 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:41:13.46: though I think I know what my first proposal will be: making proposals anonymous MESSAGE 730523948026167368 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:41:21.688: There are some very minor tweaks that we could make that would still be interesting. MESSAGE 730524070793314390 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:41:50.958: an anonymous proposals proposal would get my vote MESSAGE 730524090170998785 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:41:55.578: Like, currently if two units try to move into each other's provinces, nothing happens. MESSAGE 730524144046702643 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:42:08.423: We could make it so they swap. MESSAGE 730524149541371914 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:42:09.733: it wouldn't get my vote unless the anonymous proposal proposal was itself anonymous MESSAGE 730524227312025700 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:42:28.275: anonymous anonymous proposal proposal MESSAGE 730524381142319285 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:43:04.951: The solution is clear. MESSAGE 730524514324316320 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:43:36.704: A helper proposal to allow the anonymous anonymous proposal proposal to be made anonymously. MESSAGE 730524583484194846 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:43:53.193: That one's an anonymous anonymous proposal proposal proposal. MESSAGE 730524909872349276 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:45:11.01: Will people vote for my team play proposal? MESSAGE 730525031066763285 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:45:39.905: it feels like there are several conversations happening right now MESSAGE 730525149354393631 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:46:08.107: Only two. MESSAGE 730525248767918191 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:46:31.809: We keep bringing in new conversations and dropping old ones. MESSAGE 730525388144640141 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:47:05.039: yeah im fine with team play MESSAGE 730525405437755396 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:47:09.162: i would like a teammate though MESSAGE 730525509108236360 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:47:33.879: but that would mean interacting with other people MESSAGE 730525525168095232 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:47:37.708: _starts hyperventilating_ MESSAGE 730525544319287316 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:47:42.274: gross, people MESSAGE 730525608148467762 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:47:57.492: right? MESSAGE 730525640503328798 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:48:05.206: i'm only interested in people if i can type at them MESSAGE 730525717028274206 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:48:23.451: just take a keyboard wherever you go MESSAGE 730525717984444513 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:48:23.679: *typing intensifies* MESSAGE 730525788885221418 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:48:40.583: Idea: Get rid of all of the people by proposal. MESSAGE 730525841657692200 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:48:53.165: agora doesn't have people MESSAGE 730525850360873122 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:48:55.24: it has persons MESSAGE 730525872649535569 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:49:00.554: "Each person is hereby destroyed." MESSAGE 730526256155721821 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:50:31.989: how to fix the world in one sentence MESSAGE 730526446073806962 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 20:51:17.269: the rules use "persons" 21 times, but "people" only once MESSAGE 730528728878153808 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:00:21.532: ^subscribe to Ruleset Facts MESSAGE 730528871887273996 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:00:55.628: that needs to be a thing MESSAGE 730529020222898257 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:01:30.994: RulesetFacts isn't taken on twitter MESSAGE 730529041186029759 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:01:35.992: getting it now MESSAGE 730529120731267122 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:01:54.957: i might just get a twitter account to follow that MESSAGE 730529150787649580 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:02:02.123: I liked the thing where the Herald had a monthly lesson. MESSAGE 730529330056396832 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:02:44.864: hahaha MESSAGE 730529351660994601 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:02:50.015: that's great MESSAGE 730530851095314432 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:08:47.508: there be happy https://twitter.com/RulesetFacts/status/1280972088124354562?s=20 MESSAGE 730530931940524042 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:09:06.783: i love this so much MESSAGE 730530944322240523 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:09:09.735: i am MESSAGE 730530955974017035 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:09:12.513: i am very happy MESSAGE 730531630325956788 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:11:53.291: clicked on the link and looked in the twitter sidebar and one of the top hashtags is a cancelling movement MESSAGE 730531737062604860 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:12:18.739: man i hate the internet MESSAGE 730531770767900673 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:12:26.775: sigh MESSAGE 730532704294142022 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-08 AT 21:16:09.345: OOOOOH MESSAGE 730589107977453620 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:00:17.031: and the fix has been applied MESSAGE 730589209856966688 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:00:41.321: I guess I should go keep those regulations now MESSAGE 730589247354175509 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:00:50.261: Probably a good idea. MESSAGE 730593008973512874 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:15:47.101: now we can make use of All the Loopholes MESSAGE 730598532712759407 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:37:44.063: oh boy i got russia MESSAGE 730598662186467379 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:38:14.932: Italy! nice MESSAGE 730598733628178442 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:38:31.965: austria-hungary MESSAGE 730598765379190845 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:38:39.535: cool, I know vaguely where that is and about nothing else MESSAGE 730598860358942751 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:39:02.18: excited to ~~wreck everybody with my extra starting army~~ be peaceful and negotiate MESSAGE 730599916895993866 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:43:14.078: and the regulations have been unofficially kept, too MESSAGE 730600049863557141 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:43:45.78: well done MESSAGE 730600115101761557 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:44:01.334: ~~I don't need your approval~~ MESSAGE 730600202251141142 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:44:22.112: (someone had to read them then) MESSAGE 730600289035354142 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:44:42.803: somewhat relevant: I have the FLR-equivalent of the acorn; would people rather that or the current SLR-equivalent? MESSAGE 730600325370740886 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:44:51.466: Good luck, everyone! MESSAGE 730600444669329550 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:45:19.909: England looks forward to working forward to all of you. Trigon and I are new players, so please don't go too hard on us. MESSAGE 730601230216331304 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:48:27.198: i changed my signature to "friendly neighborhood russian notary here :)" MESSAGE 730602888602058874 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 01:55:02.588: since aris and trigon have teamed up and are planning to submit a team proposal, does any non-contestant want to team up with me? MESSAGE 730622071905845318 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 03:11:16.244: ay yo im france MESSAGE 730807163961868378 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:26:45.629: Proposal: let's skip forward a few decades and do model un instead MESSAGE 730811162190413965 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:42:38.881: proposal: let's skip backward a few centuries and do medieval europe instead MESSAGE 730813396978630748 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:51:31.696: "Modern diplomacy" is a 10-player variant with 1990s countries/bigger map: http://www.variantbank.org/results/rules/m/modern.gif MESSAGE 730813586913493033 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:52:16.98: oh wow MESSAGE 730814158555185213 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:54:33.27: i kinda want to play it though MESSAGE 730814259008634911 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:54:57.22: it looks wild MESSAGE 730814341594742845 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:55:16.91: i like how they even included england having gibraltar MESSAGE 730814417532354640 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 15:55:35.015: lol that'll be fun to hold MESSAGE 730819757430800494 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 16:16:48.146: Dang that is wild MESSAGE 730841182501994536 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:41:56.281: Everyone, vote! MESSAGE 730841210268418159 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:42:02.901: oh right voting is a thing MESSAGE 730841255155597446 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:42:13.603: Can't lol MESSAGE 730841301788000256 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:42:24.721: actually has the game even started yet? I thought PSS said it started at midnight UTC today MESSAGE 730841361204641885 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:42:38.887: People have been submitting proposals. *shrug* MESSAGE 730841387335155865 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:42:45.117: P.S.S. hasn't complained. MESSAGE 730841472110166086 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:43:05.329: I've been presuming the bit about the start of the game is just for the Diplomacy stuff, not for proposals. MESSAGE 730841689220055108 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:43:57.092: votes can be private of course MESSAGE 730841748498153512 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:44:11.225: they have to be im pretty sure MESSAGE 730841774351843389 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:44:17.389: Yeah. MESSAGE 730841843675299922 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:44:33.917: i voted on the existing proposals MESSAGE 730841851208269888 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:44:35.713: ~~woohoo I can vote down all of Aris's proposals and nobody will know~~ MESSAGE 730841974126673920 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:45:05.019: *looks entreatingly at Jason* MESSAGE 730842288837886052 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:46:20.052: someone should tell falsifian to get on discord MESSAGE 730842377727770636 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:46:41.245: my read is that a proposal lasts indefinitely, right? E.g. if I submit one today and forget about it, it's around for the whole game and if it ever gets 4 FOR votes it goes through? MESSAGE 730842528651280456 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:47:17.228: unless its withdrawn then yeah i think MESSAGE 730842591331090482 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:47:32.172: are the only proposals so far omd's order extension, Aris's team play and voting fixes, and ATMunn's order clarification? MESSAGE 730842677381300335 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:47:52.688: i believe so MESSAGE 730842710470164591 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:48:00.577: great MESSAGE 730842741885501451 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:48:08.067: then I won't need to vote down Aris's proposals yet MESSAGE 730842885611716708 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:48:42.334: the voting method is essentially 'against until a FOR' not voting has same effect as against MESSAGE 730842955459592193 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:48:58.987: Yeah. MESSAGE 730845242408042567 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:58:04.238: would anyone prefer a more turn-based proposal system (i.e. synced to moves) MESSAGE 730845377670152294 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:58:36.487: i'm indifferent honestly MESSAGE 730845403108474882 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:58:42.552: :present: MESSAGE 730845446834225222 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:58:52.977: maybe not worth the bother then MESSAGE 730845555072172112 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:59:18.783: (I think it would tie into diplomacy strategy a little better, but nbd) MESSAGE 730845664975781980 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 17:59:44.986: but if we're going to do anonymous proposals, then it could work well to do it turn-based and have them be submitted along with orders MESSAGE 730845786493157459 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:00:13.958: yeah, maybe do that with anonymous proposals if I'm proposing that anyway MESSAGE 730845814297198623 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:00:20.587: What I think would be worthwhile would be to stipulate that passing proposals are adopted immediately after turns are resolved. MESSAGE 730846078722899998 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:01:23.631: That way we can plan the next set of moves around the proposals that have been adopted, and be sure the rules won't change in the interim. MESSAGE 730846210298085376 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:01:55.001: yeah that was my main reason for syncing MESSAGE 730847232932184125 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:05:58.816: i'm excited to see what the first real game-changing proposal is going to be MESSAGE 730847505536909415 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:07:03.81: tbh I'm kinda dreading the rule changing aspect since I've been reading a ton about regular Diplomacy. MESSAGE 730847545772998697 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:07:13.403: fair enough MESSAGE 730847661871071312 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:07:41.083: i don't think we should do anything too crazy until several years into the game MESSAGE 730848228907417640 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:09:56.275: I think we've got at least 4 or 5 "reluctant to change" on here MESSAGE 730848372860256340 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:10:30.596: I'd be interested in some small changes around the edges. MESSAGE 730848512815792238 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:11:03.964: Maybe allow units to swap places, or allow retreats to be convoyed. MESSAGE 730848559133491241 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:11:15.007: "around the edges" = "England can attack turkey by wrapping around" (but not the other way) MESSAGE 730848561205477417 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:11:15.501: Stuff like that. MESSAGE 730852834047950858 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:28:14.226: i'm having a hard time writing proposals this morning i don't want to deal with all the agoran details for this MESSAGE 730853023122718800 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:28:59.305: it probably doesn't need to be quite as agora-y as agoran proposals MESSAGE 730853591211835503 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:31:14.748: I want to just say "a contestant can submit a single proposal with eir orders, marked as a secret accord. The Gamemaster will publish all the secret accords received right after resolving the move. You can only vote for secret accords in your next set of orders, and the gamemaster will resolve it after the next set of moves." MESSAGE 730853760443613217 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:31:55.096: But then I got into agoran mess of "if you change your orders does that withdraw a secret accord in the previous orders" and that kind of process detail MESSAGE 730853878853140530 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:32:23.327: ah MESSAGE 730853948331917412 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:32:39.892: Seems like the sort of thing the Judge can work out. MESSAGE 730854055638728785 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:33:05.476: I request it not be limited to one though. MESSAGE 730854105991348404 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:33:17.481: probably good enough then? (I'll add the word 'anonymous' in there) MESSAGE 730854144012976150 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:33:26.546: sure. MESSAGE 730856692417560607 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:43:34.133: Oh, G., remember to add a savings clause. MESSAGE 730856778321100830 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:43:54.614: So that existing proposals don't disappear when this is adopted. MESSAGE 730857038480932904 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:44:56.641: @G. ^ MESSAGE 730857692322725978 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:47:32.529: should I be replacing the current method? I was thinking of adding to it. Next draft: A Contestant CAN submit proposals with eir Orders. Such proposals are Secret Accords. As part of resolving orders for a turn, the Gamemaster SHALL publish all Secret Accords received with that turn's orders. The identity of the submitter SHALL NOT be revealed at any point. If a proposal is a secret accord, votes CAN only be submitted with orders for the next turn. The Gamemaster SHALL resolve the voting for all secret accords (pass or fail) immediately after resolving the moves for the next turn. MESSAGE 730858192074178621 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:49:31.679: Hmmm. MESSAGE 730858339533062326 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:50:06.836: I guess there's no reason that votes have to be submitted with orders, it's secret either way. I'll take that bit out. MESSAGE 730858359619846266 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:50:11.625: I would really like all proposals to be adopted at the end of move resolution. MESSAGE 730858445015613596 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:50:31.985: A separate proposal to lock timing of all proposals? MESSAGE 730858477400096899 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:50:39.706: Okay. MESSAGE 730859230923456524 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:53:39.36: I'll write that one up. MESSAGE 730859273864740914 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:53:49.598: If we take the timing element out (and put it elsewhere) it simplifies. MESSAGE 730859336523579503 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 18:54:04.537: A Contestant CAN submit proposals with eir Orders. Such proposals are Secret Accords. Immediately after resolving orders for a turn, the Gamemaster SHALL publish all Secret Accords received with that turn's orders. The identity of the submitter SHALL NOT be revealed at any point, and the Gamemaster SHALL NOT reveal Secret Accords before resolving that turn's orders. MESSAGE 730862434717401168 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:06:23.204: Current proto (sorry for the lousy formatting): Proposal Timing Amend Rule 8 by replacing: "When a Proposal has received a number of non-withdrawn votes in favor greater than half the number of Contestants, the Judge SHALL, in a timely fashion, and CAN enact the proposal by publishing the new text of the rules and the number of votes in favor and against. The Judge SHALL NOT reveal the votes of specific Contestants." with "If a Proposal has received a number of non-withdrawn votes in favor greater than half the number of Contestants, the Judge CAN enact the proposal by publishing the new text of the rules and the number of votes in favor and against, and SHALL do so immediately after resolving orders the next time e does so. As an exception, if a proposal was designated as urgent in the message in which it was submitted, the Judge MAY enact the proposal sooner, and SHOULD do so as soon as possible. The Judge SHALL NOT reveal the votes of specific Contestants." MESSAGE 730865320142831616 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:17:51.143: do we need urgent? MESSAGE 730865498358677514 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:18:33.633: Strictly speaking no, but the use case for it is things like my proposal fixes proposal. MESSAGE 730866114179104800 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:21:00.456: yeah but in Diplomacy terms, if 4 people see someone's gonna win, rushing through a "e doesn't win" proposal is obvious thing to do... MESSAGE 730866280298447009 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:21:40.062: Hmm. MESSAGE 730866309713363095 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:21:47.075: That sounds like cheating. MESSAGE 730866443108745316 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:22:18.879: well, nothing in proposals is cheating that gets 4 votes MESSAGE 730866650882244616 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:23:08.416: How about leaving it to the gamemaster, e can make a proposal urgent but SHOULD only do so if it's a bugfix MESSAGE 730866948946133034 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:24:19.48: I'd like everyone to know as soon as it's submitted. MESSAGE 730867090780586004 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:24:53.296: How about I say that the gamemaster SHOULD resolve it early iif it's a bugfix? MESSAGE 730867148632752150 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:25:07.089: well the submitter could say "please make this urgent" but doesn't get the final choice? MESSAGE 730867325452156950 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:25:49.246: Does the giving the gamemaster an out re early resolution work for you? MESSAGE 730867578536460298 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:26:49.586: actually anything to suggest that it's to be used for fixes not game play votes (even if just SHOULDs) would be fine. MESSAGE 730867650955182202 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 19:27:06.852: Okay, will do. MESSAGE 730927049870671962 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-09 AT 23:23:08.657: I will vote against all proposals except those that restore back to correct diplo rules MESSAGE 730939488385368164 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 00:12:34.23: more like diploNOTmic dab MESSAGE 730939996563046568 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 00:14:35.389: sigh MESSAGE 731257888852672603 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:17:46.817: lol why give "timely fashion" speed to the judge enacting Dip proposals, that's several turns... MESSAGE 731258004657143910 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:18:14.427: Wait, what? MESSAGE 731258067240615936 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:18:29.348: Who suggested that? MESSAGE 731259331227418635 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:23:30.706: "voting fixes" by Aris: the Judge SHALL, in a timely fashion, and CAN enact the proposal by MESSAGE 731259436953370645 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:23:55.913: Oh. MESSAGE 731259464010825778 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:24:02.364: That was already there. MESSAGE 731259611415314511 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:24:37.508: It wasn't a bug, so I didn't fix it in the bug fix proposal. MESSAGE 731259750792298563 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:25:10.738: I moved the timely fashion around, but it was already in the rule, I'm pretty sure. MESSAGE 731259861580513375 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:25:37.152: no worries, I didn't really notice it until I was thinking about when to submit moves in this cycle MESSAGE 731260957048963103 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-10 AT 21:29:58.332: TBH, the reason I was so confused is that somehow the first time you said that I confused "timely fashion" and "with notice". MESSAGE 731524296228339762 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-11 AT 14:56:23.285: current map of europe This message has attachments https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/729518399851331605/731524296014430238/unknown.png MESSAGE 731632989313957899 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-11 AT 22:08:17.736: @ATMunn Do you suppose you could publish a map of the movements as well? Does this program support that MESSAGE 731666157714800710 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 00:20:05.699: well for this round you can tell the movements MESSAGE 731666227042320464 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 00:20:22.228: they all went from the square supply centres to where they ow are MESSAGE 731676939521228840 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 01:02:56.282: look at omd's. eirs is better :P (but yes, it does support that) MESSAGE 731720486500827187 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 03:55:58.691: Everyone vote against omds dumb proposal MESSAGE 731725759588073552 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 04:16:55.893: this tbh MESSAGE 731725870317830186 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 04:17:22.293: I'm going to propose giving the judge a veto. MESSAGE 731741560093278298 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:19:43.027: so i found this lightweight png map generator that seems pretty hackable MESSAGE 731741592586813503 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:19:50.774: https://github.com/ericl/diplomacy-mapper MESSAGE 731741887085543425 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:21:00.988: i might toss my hat into the mapmaking ring MESSAGE 731751213837844550 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:58:04.659: quick update: it works but looks kinda ugly and also is a bit inconvenient to use MESSAGE 731751276882427908 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:58:19.69: I like omd's one the best. MESSAGE 731751300810932276 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:58:25.395: i also shouldn't be surprised about this but it's really hacky MESSAGE 731751368863252521 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:58:41.62: here's what it spit out This message has attachments https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/729518399851331605/731751368787886120/out.png MESSAGE 731751602385584209 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 05:59:37.296: i thought this would be worth it because i could change the code when we change the game but it just doesn't look good so i might not bother :P MESSAGE 731752866003550259 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:04:38.566: jDip is open source too. MESSAGE 731752933003362375 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:04:54.54: but java :( MESSAGE 731752970827464824 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:05:03.558: Yeah. MESSAGE 731753910364012624 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:08:47.561: still vote against omds awful proposal MESSAGE 731754028987449417 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:09:15.843: not only is it not fun, it's actually anti-fun. like it does nothing in any way to improve this game experience, unless you like random rigging MESSAGE 731754078178115675 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:09:27.571: Oh, it's terrible. MESSAGE 731754099577716837 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:09:32.673: yeah MESSAGE 731754110633639997 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:09:35.309: No offense to omd though. MESSAGE 731754164245495888 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:09:48.091: all offense to em >:3 MESSAGE 731754203294466152 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:09:57.401: I think e's pointing out a problem that will be more relevant later. MESSAGE 731754318926970911 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:10:24.97: G.'s whole scenario with a "X power does not win" rule. MESSAGE 731754451697795093 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:10:56.625: There are situations in which our involvement in the game may easily prevent us for making rules that are in the common good. MESSAGE 731754483562053684 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:11:04.222: My proposal is to give P.S.S. a veto. MESSAGE 731754682988363916 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:11:51.769: once again i am voting against all proposals that dont clarify or restore original diplo rules MESSAGE 731754758238634016 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:12:09.71: Fair enough. MESSAGE 731762282790518847 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:42:03.703: Here's my map I don't think I learned much but had fun making it This message has attachments https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/729518399851331605/731762282643587092/Dip.png MESSAGE 731762439737311263 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:42:41.122: oooh, i was wondering what a diplomacy map would look like as a graph MESSAGE 731762803718881322 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 06:44:07.902: suddenly everyone has an interest in cartography MESSAGE 731859165516922900 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 13:07:02.345: wouldn't omd's proposal also require the judge to reveal ballots, which e is prohibited from doing? MESSAGE 731875148491128853 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 14:10:32.983: oh yeah it would MESSAGE 731893867879596092 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:24:56.033: Here I added pieces for extra usefulness This message has attachments https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/729518399851331605/731893867627937822/Dipcrop.png MESSAGE 731893987165732976 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:25:24.473: ugh blurry conversion MESSAGE 731894024553889854 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:25:33.387: looks fine to me MESSAGE 731894171249541191 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:26:08.362: oh ok it was displaying weird for a sec, looks fine now MESSAGE 731894798994112512 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:28:38.028: out of curiosity, what did you use to make that? MESSAGE 731894918561136640 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:29:06.535: That is disgusting and gross and unreadable MESSAGE 731894938219839529 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:29:11.222: lol - powerpoint. just by hand MESSAGE 731894966938501151 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:29:18.069: oh lol MESSAGE 731895068331606056 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:29:42.243: hey this is more interesting than most powerpoint presentations so MESSAGE 731895145829629952 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:30:00.72: (there was a version on the web that was even a bit uglier, I didn't count all the links myself, just traced over that one and reaaranged a bunch) MESSAGE 731895486155456542 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:31:21.86: it's definitely pretty unreadable. Putting it together I think I learned one or two things about how things are were connected but as a straight non-interactive visual - nah MESSAGE 731895797159034910 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 15:32:36.009: Like, in this arrangement you really see the diagonal grey line (upper right to lower left) of non-supply center territories, that's a classic "stalemate line" and hard to cross from either direction. MESSAGE 731974032190079096 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 20:43:28.694: ok, *this* is getting closer to what I was aiming for This message has attachments https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/729518399851331605/731974031846277183/DipDark.png MESSAGE 731974977859092572 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 20:47:14.159: ooh nice MESSAGE 731975298199060480 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 20:48:30.534: wow MESSAGE 731985878360260685 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-12 AT 21:30:33.041: i like that MESSAGE 732053850634190889 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 02:00:38.894: lmao @ATMunn masterful moves MESSAGE 732057950289395793 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 02:16:56.328: i looked up opening strategy on the internet for my first moves but now i have 0 idea what 2 do MESSAGE 732059095334649917 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 02:21:29.328: when does the turn end MESSAGE 732061272652120115 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 02:30:08.441: 9 or 10 hours from now MESSAGE 732236003145940994 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 14:04:27.437: > lmao @ATMunn masterful moves @nix telling everyone your moves is the new meta don't you know MESSAGE 732236470949249048 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 14:06:18.97: it was a triple-fake (or is it quadruple) MESSAGE 732237061737676930 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 14:08:39.825: in my local boardgame playgroup one guy sometimes plays games with hidden info as if they were open hand MESSAGE 732237090305343609 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 14:08:46.636: really messes with people sometimes MESSAGE 732237484234113024 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 14:10:20.556: I wonder if PSS is actually obligated to accept moves to a-b or a-d, even though the rules only say orders can be submitted "privately" MESSAGE 732239353564102688 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 14:17:46.239: I think there's an old precedent (or custom) that "privately" doesn't count a-d at least because even if e posts there, there's no expectation that anyone has to read that (which makes sense, I skip over a-d stuff when I'm behind). MESSAGE 732310416730095749 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 19:00:09.018: @comex Could you make the nice maps again? I really liked those. MESSAGE 732313983436062756 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 19:14:19.387: someone should stick the move lists and maps on an Agoranomic place... MESSAGE 732315748654907512 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 19:21:20.248: imo the j-dip maps are nice but it's really hard to tell units apart. i just have my own backstabbr sandbox for diplonomic MESSAGE 732320449614315532 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-13 AT 19:40:01.044: I know, ATMunn, but they're so nice it's worth it IMO. MESSAGE 732753387312906301 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:20:21.435: so who's winning? MESSAGE 732753469902946385 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:20:41.126: It's too early to know, I think. MESSAGE 732753555286392933 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:21:01.483: PSS is winning MESSAGE 732753701642436668 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:21:36.377: who's losing? MESSAGE 732753823537430588 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:22:05.439: the only true losers are the friends we lost along the way MESSAGE 732753843779272881 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:22:10.265: 😔 MESSAGE 732756373951086602 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:32:13.505: technically if you go by number of centers alone, i am winning, but russia also starts with an extra MESSAGE 732756420713250917 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 00:32:24.654: so it is still too early to say MESSAGE 732767382380085269 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:15:58.119: here, you tell me who's winning... This message has attachments https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/729518399851331605/732767382468297086/DipDark_02.png MESSAGE 732769346438561922 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:23:46.387: Green is winning MESSAGE 732769439258247209 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:24:08.517: Look at all those expansion opportunities MESSAGE 732769632976371805 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:24:54.703: heh - it's a massively misleading map - all of those have no supply centers so don't count. But some of the other locations have much more. MESSAGE 732769827193880739 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:25:41.008: So another way to read that is "green is losing because e's got the longest way to go to get anywhere" MESSAGE 732769970983010346 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:26:15.29: Long journeys are the best, so green is winning by my standards MESSAGE 732774404995678320 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:43:52.441: I now know who is playing which country MESSAGE 732774748228026377 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:45:14.274: Proto: the winner is the country with the longest continuous route through provinces (not going through the same province twice) when the new millennium begins. MESSAGE 732774825445163089 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:45:32.684: proposal: trains MESSAGE 732775225552404482 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:47:08.077: proposal: it's muliplayer snake MESSAGE 732775259618672742 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:47:16.199: ~~tron~~ MESSAGE 732775492209475674 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:48:11.653: Proto: The Agoran rules are subordinate to the tournament rules, anything in the Agoran rules to the contrary notwithstanding. The Agoran rules can be changed by tournament proposal, in addition to any method they specify. MESSAGE 732775588548444231 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:48:34.622: only if we include a definition of 'statute' MESSAGE 732775680214958171 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:48:56.477: proposal: Agora declares independence from the tyrannical reign of diplonomic MESSAGE 732775747655303189 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 01:49:12.556: proposal: Vote yes. MESSAGE 733110255684288604 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 23:58:25.485: I declare eternal war on england MESSAGE 733110319156691138 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 23:58:40.618: May they be destroyes FOREVER MESSAGE 733110357413068862 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 23:58:49.739: so - you're announcing yourself to be French then MESSAGE 733110444918833214 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-15 AT 23:59:10.602: Diplonomic is at war with all other nomics. Diplonomic is not at war with Agora because they are a generally boring lot. MESSAGE 733122075937734686 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 00:45:23.653: Why would you declare eternal war on us? MESSAGE 733122132455850015 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 00:45:37.128: All we did was borrow Brest. MESSAGE 733132105676095548 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 01:25:14.929: everybody loves a good old england vs france fight MESSAGE 733269747654983791 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 10:32:11.334: Tangentially relevant, I'm playing Diplomacy over on Blognomic's Slack and I'm very new MESSAGE 733269784598151170 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 10:32:20.142: I'm Germany MESSAGE 733269838138703952 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 10:32:32.907: If anyone would be generous enough to help me out, please DM me MESSAGE 733269903670378578 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 10:32:48.531: did both nomics decide to do the same thing at the same tike MESSAGE 733269948494774392 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 10:32:59.218: yes MESSAGE 733269963133157487 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 10:33:02.708: LMAO MESSAGE 733270045769072652 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-16 AT 10:33:22.41: Although this is informal and not nomic-motivated MESSAGE 733666732048121897 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-17 AT 12:49:39.789: yea im just dead here MESSAGE 733666757591433277 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-17 AT 12:49:45.879: might as well concede really MESSAGE 734214173386473472 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:04:59.975: Eat the rich MESSAGE 734214197021245510 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:05:05.61: Eat them MESSAGE 734214218651533442 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:05:10.767: No u MESSAGE 734214285202423890 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:05:26.634: actually I've already eaten MESSAGE 734214347726782470 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:05:41.541: I mean metaphorically MESSAGE 734214417809408060 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:05:58.25: Eat their units after my proposal comes up MESSAGE 734214630284460053 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:06:48.908: yeah i'm rich by your definition so i'd really rather not MESSAGE 734214809616252949 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 01:07:31.664: Overthrow this guy and his unitocracy MESSAGE 734442859800821840 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:13:43.065: @comex kids these days have it easy with their fancy "reply to the wrong message" fake order leaks, in the old days we had to leave our fake orders lying around on pads of paper and hope our opponents tried to peek... MESSAGE 734445479286407258 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:24:07.599: That turn did not go as I thought it would MESSAGE 734449040590241872 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:38:16.68: oh did someone else leak orders? lol MESSAGE 734449152540540992 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:38:43.371: Yeah but they were totally fake MESSAGE 734449199017361469 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:38:54.452: fair enough MESSAGE 734449320459501638 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:39:23.406: could've worked if they'd looked *slightly* fake (like guessing between two units to defend but not totally switching opponents)... MESSAGE 734449465225904319 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:39:57.921: smh e should have sent them to a-o so they looked more official MESSAGE 734449468304392315 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:39:58.655: yeah mine were actually accidental, i ended up changing one of the things anyways (its so far past it happening that it really doesn't matter for me to say that) MESSAGE 734449817433931857 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-19 AT 16:41:21.894: i will say though, i like omd's way of doing retreat orders, i wasn't quite sure how to do them but i think i'll steal eir method MESSAGE 737355361606172713 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:06:57.607: so that English piece in Edi was shown as an A in PSS's moves last turn and a F on omd's map, and now PSS has it as an A swimming in the NTH - obviously I don't know what conditional builds were supposed to happen for Edi but something to correct? MESSAGE 737359852850118666 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:24:48.403: Our order was always supposed to be F MESSAGE 737360058354237442 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:25:37.399: I can check our email to see if we misordered but the intention was to have a Fleet there, not an army. MESSAGE 737360416040288316 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:27:02.678: It's nested deep in a conditional that I don't want to reveal, but it does say F Edi MESSAGE 737361819043364864 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:32:37.18: yah I see now that the build was listed as F, so just a data entry error (looks like PSS corrected) MESSAGE 737362202767392818 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:34:08.667: Proposal: self-ratification MESSAGE 737362316760318028 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:34:35.845: proposal: ratify England out of existence MESSAGE 737362387971342376 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:34:52.823: The judge's word on where everything is is final, even if it makes no sense MESSAGE 737362671149777107 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:36:00.338: Come now Jason, we're not even your biggest threat MESSAGE 737362810467516496 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-27 AT 17:36:33.554: that's probably true, but I want the irony of ratifying away the proposer of self-ratification MESSAGE 737493106747899974 FROM Gaelan IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-28 AT 02:14:18.608: hypothetially, if anyone wanted to propose shoehorning me into diplonomic… MESSAGE 737495965900210192 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-28 AT 02:25:40.283: Just add another continent MESSAGE 737496244544339989 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-28 AT 02:26:46.717: I mean, we only have afro-eurasia right now, so another one wouldn't be too bad MESSAGE 737670864740548608 FROM ATMunn (friendly neighboorhood notary) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-28 AT 14:00:39.416: i think we're far enough into the game for america to join now MESSAGE 737673716095254580 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-28 AT 14:11:59.232: that "everyone gets a free piece" proposal was courtesy of american arms dealers, right? MESSAGE 738119194616528997 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 19:42:09.588: I'm now wondering if I could get a paradox by ordering a unit to disrupt itself MESSAGE 738121155403055174 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 19:49:57.076: stupid hecking superpower rules MESSAGE 738121218791571538 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 19:50:12.189: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ MESSAGE 738121230015791175 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 19:50:14.865: I voted against MESSAGE 738124283624161314 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:02:22.902: me too actually MESSAGE 738124335105179798 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:02:35.176: seriously? MESSAGE 738124358718980137 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:02:40.806: who the heck was voting for then? MESSAGE 738124394072768683 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:02:49.235: turkey presumably MESSAGE 738124405527281814 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:02:51.966: so the two people who voted against are the only people who used them, heh MESSAGE 738124435399114812 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:02:59.088: lee said e wanted a normal ruleset MESSAGE 738124475706376204 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:03:08.698: I think lee was out by that time? MESSAGE 738124541825646675 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:03:24.462: no e was just hanging on MESSAGE 738124544748945478 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:03:25.159: no, eir vote counted, e was eliminated right after that MESSAGE 738124554416947251 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:03:27.464: one turn away MESSAGE 738125086770331669 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:05:34.387: It passed 4-2, so if Aus and Italy voted against... one abstention and everyone else for? MESSAGE 738125256530591816 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:06:14.861: I thought France was the abstention because e'd tuned out mostly, but maybe not MESSAGE 738125335035379773 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:06:33.578: we voted against as well MESSAGE 738125402328793088 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:06:49.622: well one of us is lying or PSS counted wrong then... MESSAGE 738125418670063777 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:06:53.518: hmm MESSAGE 738126540877070357 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:11:21.073: > With 4 votes FOR and 2 votes AGAINST, I enact "Superpowers": MESSAGE 738126568328790087 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:11:27.618: one of us is indeed lying MESSAGE 738126637467435080 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:11:44.102: https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-business@agoranomic.org/msg37764.html MESSAGE 738126659877863445 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:11:49.445: official vote count MESSAGE 738126676655079436 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:11:53.445: yah I saw that. MESSAGE 738126775988781087 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:12:17.128: ```Italy Fall 04 I vote AGAINST all current proposals. Moves Italy F MAO - Por``` MESSAGE 738126861988790312 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:12:37.632: (I mean any of us could dummy that but... just checked) MESSAGE 738127133368647823 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:13:42.334: ``` === Votes === FOR "for added confusion" AGAINST "Superpowers" ``` MESSAGE 738127171339419679 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:13:51.387: This message consists only of attachments: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/729518399851331605/738127170987229265/Screenshot_20200729-160845.png MESSAGE 738127227782299650 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:14:04.844: well alright then MESSAGE 738127346304811038 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:14:33.102: we should talk to PSS about this MESSAGE 738127506283954257 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:15:11.244: go for it (hopefully there were 4 Fors and it doesn't matter, would hate a gamemaster error like that to clean up after) MESSAGE 738127545123209268 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:15:20.504: true MESSAGE 738127693383467049 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:15:55.852: maybe someone typoed it as AGAINT and PSS ignored the precedent... MESSAGE 738128030114775142 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:17:16.135: I'm hoping e didn't notice something like my "all current proposals" and called it an abstention MESSAGE 738130897739579494 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:28:39.83: e says e just didn't see one of our AGAINST votes MESSAGE 738131044259069963 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:29:14.763: vote counting should be correct otherwise MESSAGE 738132519802634330 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-07-29 AT 20:35:06.56: phew MESSAGE 738938790952829049 FROM Gaelan IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-01 AT 01:58:56.582: I’m not quite sure what’s going on but I’m pretty sure I would be correct in saying “oh shit” MESSAGE 738938885232394362 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-01 AT 01:59:19.06: I'd say that's apt MESSAGE 739539561558048850 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 17:46:11.456: 3 way win? MESSAGE 739539574811918437 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 17:46:14.616: Thanks guys, really appreciate all the love for England MESSAGE 739545855173984259 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 18:11:11.971: I was kinda advocating to keep going, but the win conditions of this version (elimination not majority of Centers) + proposals meant it was to risky (because if one more person was eliminated, a 2/1 vote could end it no matter who was "ahead" at that time) MESSAGE 739547247980707852 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 18:16:44.042: very agoran but also very anticlimatic way to win MESSAGE 739547492286332989 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 18:17:42.289: yeah, I was going to post some notes. The combo of "most people wanting to play straight Dip" (and not making unusual new dynamics early on) but a non-Dip win condition made a very staid end. MESSAGE 739547710138613852 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 18:18:34.229: The first few years were good classic Diplomacy but once a win condition looked achievable it became clear that would be really hard (and come down to "vote for who wins" no matter how it was sliced) MESSAGE 739547816388460695 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 18:18:59.561: proposal for a similar game in the future: instead of requiring a proposal to democratically pass, the most popular proposal every round passes regardless of if it would democratically MESSAGE 739548046727053314 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 18:19:54.478: I think either a classic Dip win condition, or people who wanted at the start to propose new game dynamics (airplanes, fortresses, spies, etc. were all talked about) would have helped. MESSAGE 739548401091477544 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 18:21:18.965: was really fun to play straight Dip in the first few years though!! MESSAGE 739561870578417805 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 19:14:50.341: I'd be down for another one of these in another year or two maybe. MESSAGE 739565440442826823 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 19:29:01.463: yah an outside agora one (where the reward for winning is just that you won) - someday... MESSAGE 739565547372412979 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 19:29:26.957: Nah, I meant another tournament. MESSAGE 739567279741599795 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 19:36:19.986: do y' think you would you go for straight dip or more chaotic "let's make a bunch of changes"? MESSAGE 739573143265345657 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 19:59:37.959: It was fun to watch this, hopefully next year's tournament is more players and/or slower pace. MESSAGE 739574305083490351 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:04:14.958: I thought the pace was pretty much ideal MESSAGE 739574412746948718 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:04:40.627: There's a 10-player Dip map out there... MESSAGE 739574455222927420 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:04:50.754: Any slower and I would have gotten disengaged between turns MESSAGE 739574559245729913 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:05:15.555: There's not any real way I can participate with anything that requires daily interaction for a sustained period with my schedule/habits MESSAGE 739574783821479956 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:06:09.098: It felt about right while in the moment, but it was time-intensive wouldn't do that more than once a year. MESSAGE 739575716844142652 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:09:51.548: Maybe one with fewer powers but with teamwork encourage MESSAGE 739576199239565332 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:11:46.56: Playing on a team was so much fun MESSAGE 739576348086894673 FROM bookofportals (Aris) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:12:22.048: Yeah! You were a great teammate. MESSAGE 739576597576810607 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:13:21.531: I personally very much enjoyed tiredly arguing strategy with Aris and I would recommend the experience to anyone. MESSAGE 739576694775480351 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:13:44.705: lol MESSAGE 739576797145858209 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:14:09.112: there *were* several times when it was "too tired can't think have to submit some stupid moves" MESSAGE 739577152365789374 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:15:33.803: Same for us but at least we could argue about which stupid moves MESSAGE 739577488216424509 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:16:53.876: It was very helpful for me to be able to bounce moves off of G. to make sure I wasn't being a complete idiot MESSAGE 739577732878434324 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:17:52.208: Next year we'll all be better MESSAGE 739577901527072858 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:18:32.417: honestly I think I preferred FRC; the deadlines were somewhat stressful MESSAGE 739577932141559848 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:18:39.716: though this was definitely fun MESSAGE 739578070272573643 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:19:12.649: FRC was indeed very fun MESSAGE 739582587269283904 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:37:09.585: Interesting to see where all these proposals came from MESSAGE 739582944167067698 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:38:34.676: do we have an archive of all the birthday tournaments? might be nice for if/when we want to play a game again or a variant of an old one MESSAGE 739582975905366107 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:38:42.243: like, their initial rulesets MESSAGE 739583025230381116 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 20:38:54.003: that sounds like a use for that old library repo on github MESSAGE 739588912439361547 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:02:17.623: The 3 that were really memorable rulesets were FRC, diplonomic, and XX Agora blitz nomic. MESSAGE 739593255104151583 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:19:32.995: What's Agora blitz MESSAGE 739595214225670205 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:27:20.086: Agora's 20th birthday, it was a stripped down initial Nomic ruleset with 24 hour voting cycles (and I think a gamemaster who couldn't win who handled cfj's quickly?), created with the expressed intent "we want someone to win by points and the game to end within a few weeks not for this to turn into a typical ongoing nomic". MESSAGE 739595412243087440 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:28:07.297: Oooh MESSAGE 739595459844374608 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:28:18.646: That does sound interesting MESSAGE 739595477447737496 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:28:22.843: did that end up being brutally cruel lol MESSAGE 739595620473504425 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:28:56.943: "me and this majority of players can vote, this remaining minority cant" MESSAGE 739595625141633044 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:28:58.056: A bunch of 1993-era players actually joined (Orjan, Steve, Michael, Chuck, Blob) MESSAGE 739595782138757273 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:29:35.487: Noice MESSAGE 739595782776291399 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:29:35.639: Actually the old dudes got together and said "let's teach the whippersnappers a lesson" and won (it wasn't instant so there was some good fun to get there) MESSAGE 739595819162009693 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:29:44.314: oh nice MESSAGE 739595878171541675 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:29:58.383: how did they win MESSAGE 739595909821890611 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:30:05.929: what was the play MESSAGE 739596000754139187 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:30:27.609: https://tenor.com/view/baseball-sports-matrix-gif-3457660 MESSAGE 739596007138000967 FROM G. (G., The Final Judge) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:30:29.131: I really don't remember - I remember it being clever sneak proposal of some kind MESSAGE 739596046971437168 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:30:38.628: oh nice MESSAGE 739597464847384697 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:16.676: Congrats MESSAGE 739597483919015978 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:21.223: Last message MESSAGE 739597497915146301 FROM Gaelan IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:24.56: No MESSAGE 739597516361695253 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:28.958: is that so? MESSAGE 739597520828629005 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:30.023: Yes MESSAGE 739597544178450584 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:35.59: It is indeed so MESSAGE 739597584187785307 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:45.129: I shall ensure it MESSAGE 739597591754571907 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:46.933: I beg to differ MESSAGE 739597601816576061 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:49.332: No MESSAGE 739597612419907595 FROM Gaelan IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:51.86: rwo this is last message MESSAGE 739597622314270741 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:54.219: Beg MESSAGE 739597638642696293 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:36:58.112: I object MESSAGE 739597676865126532 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:07.225: rwo gaelan can't send messages MESSAGE 739597701175574550 FROM Gaelan IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:13.021: Object MESSAGE 739597710822473758 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:15.321: that's a bit rude MESSAGE 739597735866400798 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:21.292: proposal: Agora sux MESSAGE 739597750261514330 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:24.724: :against: MESSAGE 739597777612308480 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:31.245: :for: MESSAGE 739597824651559024 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:42.46: :present: MESSAGE 739597825914175599 FROM Gaelan IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:42.761: AGAINT MESSAGE 739597846705209425 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:47.718: I buy strength 3 times MESSAGE 739597859745169469 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:50.827: FR MESSAGE 739597863994261556 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:51.84: with my nonexistent EVs MESSAGE 739597891752165509 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:58.458: sorry we only accept votes by emoji in this server MESSAGE 739597894599966721 FROM Cuddlebeam (humble agoran farmer) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:37:59.137: i like orange soda MESSAGE 739597933393084550 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:38:08.386: That's a rule I decided just now with the authority of me MESSAGE 739597991102513173 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:38:22.145: Last message MESSAGE 739598004855767060 FROM Random Internet Cat (Jason) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:38:25.424: As speaker, I object and veto MESSAGE 739598017816035338 FROM nix IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:38:28.514: no u MESSAGE 739598044080635945 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:38:34.776: Alright fine MESSAGE 739598066042011728 FROM CodeTriangle (finance triangle) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:38:40.012: Penultimate message MESSAGE 739598123608965190 FROM captainsisay (R. Lee) IN #diplonomic ON 2020-08-02 AT 21:38:53.737: Bye
