DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections

[Edward Murphy via agora-discussion]

snail wrote:


I vote as follows in the prime minister election: [snail]


This vote was ineffective, as voting was not yet open.

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[VJ Rada]

reminder that there's also an election for regkeepor, with only 1 vote
on it (and PSS's VP=0 vote).

also fact: if the elections were resolved now, G would be the herald,
I would be the PM, o. would be the ADoP, and 天火狐 would be the
reportor.

On Fri, Sep 8, 2017 at 1:21 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>
> On Sep 7, 2017, at 11:19 PM, Aris Merchant 
>  wrote:
>
>> On Sep 6, 2017, at 2:51 AM, V.J Rada  wrote:
>
>>
>>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Reportor. The vote
>>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>>
>> I vote for [天火狐]. I strongly encourage others to do the same, as e has
>> a good vision for the office, something that's hard to come by these
>> days.
>
> I change my vote on this election to endorse Aris.
>
> -o
>



-- 
>From V.J Rada

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[Publius Scribonius Scholasticus]

I know, it is more a meaningful vote that an actually effective vote.

Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
p.scribonius.scholasti...@gmail.com



> On Sep 7, 2017, at 2:35 AM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Sep 6, 2017, at 8:46 PM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I endorse G. on the elections for Reportor and Herald.
> 
> Your voting strength is zero for another eight days, but you have time before 
> the end of the election to remedy that.
> 
> -o
> 



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DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[V.J Rada]

"I vote for whoever has the most votes for each currently open office election"

FYI I'm not resolving this.

On Thu, Sep 7, 2017 at 4:02 PM, V.J Rada  wrote:
> I announce that I am a candidate for Prime Minister and ADoP. Y'all
> should vote for me, folks.
>
> On Thu, Sep 7, 2017 at 3:05 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>>
>>> On Sep 6, 2017, at 2:51 AM, V.J Rada  wrote:
>>>
>>> As the ADoP, I initiate elections for the positions of Prime Minister,
>>> Herald, ADoP. and Reportor.
>>>
>>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Herald. The vote
>>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>>
>> I vote for G., followed by each player other than G. to unambiguously stand 
>> for this office, followed by the incumbent.
>>
>>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Prime Minister.
>>> The vote collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid
>>> options are the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>>
>> I endorse the incumbent.
>>
>>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new ADoP. The vote
>>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>>
>> I stand for this office. It’s largely message-by-message administrivia and 
>> reporting, which I appear to be pretty good at, and I don’t mind the 
>> additional labour.
>>
>> I vote for myself, followed by each player other than myself to 
>> unambiguously stand for this office, followed by the incumbent.
>>
>>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Reportor. The vote
>>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>>
>> I vote for G., followed by each player other than G. to unambiguously stand 
>> for this office, followed by the incumbent.
>>
>> -o
>>
>
>
>
> --
> From V.J Rada



-- 
>From V.J Rada

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[V.J Rada]

I announce that I am a candidate for Prime Minister and ADoP. Y'all
should vote for me, folks.

On Thu, Sep 7, 2017 at 3:05 PM, Owen Jacobson  wrote:
>
>> On Sep 6, 2017, at 2:51 AM, V.J Rada  wrote:
>>
>> As the ADoP, I initiate elections for the positions of Prime Minister,
>> Herald, ADoP. and Reportor.
>>
>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Herald. The vote
>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>
> I vote for G., followed by each player other than G. to unambiguously stand 
> for this office, followed by the incumbent.
>
>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Prime Minister.
>> The vote collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid
>> options are the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>
> I endorse the incumbent.
>
>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new ADoP. The vote
>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>
> I stand for this office. It’s largely message-by-message administrivia and 
> reporting, which I appear to be pretty good at, and I don’t mind the 
> additional labour.
>
> I vote for myself, followed by each player other than myself to unambiguously 
> stand for this office, followed by the incumbent.
>
>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Reportor. The vote
>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>
> I vote for G., followed by each player other than G. to unambiguously stand 
> for this office, followed by the incumbent.
>
> -o
>



-- 
>From V.J Rada

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[Kerim Aydin]

On Thu, 7 Sep 2017, Alex Smith wrote:
> On Thu, 2017-09-07 at 03:15 +0200, Cuddle Beam wrote:
> > Hrm. This is interesting. (If they're different) Would the verdict be what
> > I intended the message to mean or the consensus on the interpretation of
> > what I've written?
> 
> It'd be pretty bad for the game if a person's actual intentions (which
> can be guessed at but never known for certain or proven) had an effect
> on the platonic gamestate. Self-ratification might be able to stem the
> issues slightly but it's better to avoid them altogether.
> 
> Conditionals are evaluated based on what they actually say. If that's
> ambiguous or there's no single clear meaning, the action typically
> fails altogether (assuming it's an action by announcement, and most
> actions are; see the last paragraph of rule 478).

Votes aren't.  You "submit a ballot ... by publishing a notice".

Otherwise you really *would* have to say "I vote as follows" for every
vote.

As to CuddleBeam's question, I think I remember a special case of an
"ambiguous" precedent somewhere, something like:  "if an action might have
been performed through more than one mechanism due to ambiguity (e.g.
statement could be either conditional or nonconditional vote), and the
mechanism chosen makes a game difference (e.g. the time of evaluation),
then it fails altogether through ambiguity."

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[Alex Smith]

On Thu, 2017-09-07 at 03:15 +0200, Cuddle Beam wrote:
> Hrm. This is interesting. (If they're different) Would the verdict be what
> I intended the message to mean or the consensus on the interpretation of
> what I've written?

It'd be pretty bad for the game if a person's actual intentions (which
can be guessed at but never known for certain or proven) had an effect
on the platonic gamestate. Self-ratification might be able to stem the
issues slightly but it's better to avoid them altogether.

Conditionals are evaluated based on what they actually say. If that's
ambiguous or there's no single clear meaning, the action typically
fails altogether (assuming it's an action by announcement, and most
actions are; see the last paragraph of rule 478).

-- 
ais523

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[Cuddle Beam]

Hrm. This is interesting. (If they're different) Would the verdict be what
I intended the message to mean or the consensus on the interpretation of
what I've written?

On Thu, Sep 7, 2017 at 3:07 AM, Kerim Aydin  wrote:

>
>
> It's unclear to me if this is a statement of fact (whomever has the most
> votes
> *now*) or a conditional vote (whomever has the most votes at the end of the
> voting period).  If I had to guess, I'd go with the first one.
>
> On Thu, 7 Sep 2017, Cuddle Beam wrote:
> > I vote for whoever has the most votes for each currently open office
> election.
> >
> > On Thu, Sep 7, 2017 at 2:46 AM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus <
> p.scribonius.scholasti...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >   I endorse G. on the elections for Reportor and Herald.
> >   
> >   Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
> >   p.scribonius.scholasti...@gmail.com
> >
> >
> >
> >   > On Sep 6, 2017, at 5:38 PM, Kerim Aydin 
> wrote:
> >   >
> >   >
> >   >
> >   > On Wed, 6 Sep 2017, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus wrote:
> >   >> For Reportor, I vote [PSS], followed by the list of people
> provided by the incumbent.
> >   >
> >   > I retract my recent vote for myself for Reportor, and cast a
> >   > conditional vote:
> >   >
> >   > If PSS publishes a proto newspaper during the voting period,
> [PSS];
> >   >
> >   > otherwise, I vote for the list of players who publish a
> proto-newspaper
> >   > during the voting period, in the order of publication [ie.
> earliest
> >   > publisher first on list].
> >   >
> >   >
> >   >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[Kerim Aydin]

It's unclear to me if this is a statement of fact (whomever has the most votes
*now*) or a conditional vote (whomever has the most votes at the end of the
voting period).  If I had to guess, I'd go with the first one.

On Thu, 7 Sep 2017, Cuddle Beam wrote:
> I vote for whoever has the most votes for each currently open office election.
> 
> On Thu, Sep 7, 2017 at 2:46 AM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus 
>  wrote:
>   I endorse G. on the elections for Reportor and Herald.
>   
>   Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
>   p.scribonius.scholasti...@gmail.com
> 
> 
> 
>   > On Sep 6, 2017, at 5:38 PM, Kerim Aydin  
> wrote:
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > On Wed, 6 Sep 2017, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus wrote:
>   >> For Reportor, I vote [PSS], followed by the list of people provided 
> by the incumbent.
>   >
>   > I retract my recent vote for myself for Reportor, and cast a
>   > conditional vote:
>   >
>   > If PSS publishes a proto newspaper during the voting period, [PSS];
>   >
>   > otherwise, I vote for the list of players who publish a 
> proto-newspaper
>   > during the voting period, in the order of publication [ie. earliest
>   > publisher first on list].
>   >
>   >
>   >
> 
> 
> 
>

Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[Cuddle Beam]

Could work as a good place for ads too.

On Thu, Sep 7, 2017 at 1:03 AM, Josh T  wrote:

> I intend to also make news sections freelance-able, to be included if
> deemed worthy and author paid if used. Should I win and contracts pass, I
> intend to make a contract which allows me to pay people for articles if
> they wish to submit them and I choose to include them.
>
> Please find a proto-newspaper below:
>
> {{{
> 
> ===
>  News of Agora
> 
> ==vol.
> 0===
>
>Elections Sweep Agora, Citizens Turn to Polls
>
> In a recent flurry of activity where different offices are vacated and
> claimed
> by upstanding Agorans, elections for Prime Minister, Herald, ADoP, and
> Reportor
> have been initiated. Citizens head towards the polls as they cast their
> ballots
> and await the results with bated breath. In addition, the Agoran Decision
> for
> Silver Quill 2016 is also underway, taking advantage of the activity to
> try and
> be done. As of publication, the polls have yet to close, so one may still
> cast
> their votes if they wish to be heard.
>  —天火狐
>
> An Editorial Piece
>
>
> Wherein the author of the piece pontificates about recent happenings in
> Agora.
>
> —Hypothetical Author
>
> News about Estates
>
> Wherein I exercise my writing writing fiction about our Estates which has
> no
> intended bearing on the game state whatsoever and is provided for
> entertainment
> purposes only
>  —天火狐
>
> }}}
>
> 天火狐
>
>
>
>
> On 6 September 2017 at 17:38, Kerim Aydin  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, 6 Sep 2017, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus wrote:
>> > For Reportor, I vote [PSS], followed by the list of people provided by
>> the incumbent.
>>
>> I retract my recent vote for myself for Reportor, and cast a
>> conditional vote:
>>
>> If PSS publishes a proto newspaper during the voting period, [PSS];
>>
>> otherwise, I vote for the list of players who publish a proto-newspaper
>> during the voting period, in the order of publication [ie. earliest
>> publisher first on list].
>>
>>
>>
>>
>

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[Josh T]

I intend to also make news sections freelance-able, to be included if
deemed worthy and author paid if used. Should I win and contracts pass, I
intend to make a contract which allows me to pay people for articles if
they wish to submit them and I choose to include them.

Please find a proto-newspaper below:

{{{

===
 News of Agora

==vol.
0===

   Elections Sweep Agora, Citizens Turn to Polls

In a recent flurry of activity where different offices are vacated and
claimed
by upstanding Agorans, elections for Prime Minister, Herald, ADoP, and
Reportor
have been initiated. Citizens head towards the polls as they cast their
ballots
and await the results with bated breath. In addition, the Agoran Decision
for
Silver Quill 2016 is also underway, taking advantage of the activity to try
and
be done. As of publication, the polls have yet to close, so one may still
cast
their votes if they wish to be heard.
 —天火狐

An Editorial Piece


Wherein the author of the piece pontificates about recent happenings in
Agora.

  —Hypothetical Author

News about Estates

Wherein I exercise my writing writing fiction about our Estates which has no
intended bearing on the game state whatsoever and is provided for
entertainment
purposes only
 —天火狐

}}}

天火狐




On 6 September 2017 at 17:38, Kerim Aydin  wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, 6 Sep 2017, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus wrote:
> > For Reportor, I vote [PSS], followed by the list of people provided by
> the incumbent.
>
> I retract my recent vote for myself for Reportor, and cast a
> conditional vote:
>
> If PSS publishes a proto newspaper during the voting period, [PSS];
>
> otherwise, I vote for the list of players who publish a proto-newspaper
> during the voting period, in the order of publication [ie. earliest
> publisher first on list].
>
>
>
>

DIS: Re: BUS: Re: OFF: Initiating elections.

[V.J Rada]

you can take reportor

On Wed, Sep 6, 2017 at 5:02 PM, Kerim Aydin  wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, 6 Sep 2017, V.J Rada wrote:
>> As the ADoP, I initiate elections for the positions of Prime Minister,
>> Herald, ADoP. and Reportor.
>>
>> I initiate the Agoran decision to determine the new Herald. The vote
>> collector is the ADoP, the quorum is 3.0, and the valid options are
>> the players (PRESENT is a valid vote).
>
> I need a job.  I vote for myself for Herald.
>
> -G.
>
>
>
>



-- 
>From V.J Rada