Re: [android-developers] Re: Request to Google's Android SDK team
For the development cost, you could just wait till September and get the new Archos tablethttp://www.archos.com/products/gen9/index.html?country=uslang=en that starts at $270. It looks like it should be the fastest available tablet. On Sat, Jul 23, 2011 at 12:49 PM, Mark Murphy mmur...@commonsware.comwrote: On Sat, Jul 23, 2011 at 3:15 PM, Jimen Ching jimen.ch...@gmail.com wrote: If you do not agree a VirtualBox solution is a more convenient and efficient solution, then I don't think there's anything I can say to convince you otherwise. If it would work, it might be. However, I doubt that it will work, since it does not solve the graphics acceleration problem. The mere fact that VirtualBox might expose hardware graphics acceleration capabilities does not mean that Honeycomb will be able to exploit them without significant work. I would expect that performance of a Honeycomb VirtualBox to perhaps be incrementally better than a Honeycomb qemu. Or, to put it another way, I would expect the ratio of pain between 2.3 and 3.0 to be roughly the same on qemu and VirtualBox. Furthermore, I recall suggesting this very solution to Xav at Google I|O and being told that it did not help. There is also the minor issue that VirtualBox is owned by Oracle. :-) Personally, I wish that the Honeycomb source code had been released, specifically so that the community could work on this sort of thing and see if we can come up with something. Are you speaking for Google? Nope. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy) http://commonsware.com | http://github.com/commonsguy http://commonsware.com/blog | http://twitter.com/commonsguy Android App Developer Books: http://commonsware.com/books -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Request to Google's Android SDK team
If my users were inconvenienced, I would try to give them a temporary solution to hold them over until I have a good solution. But that's just me. It's a difference in engineering philosophy. Your innocence is touching :D Google doesn't have users, it has beta-testers. I know it's going to hurt the engineer in you but Google expects you to work the way they do : Launch bêta-4 crashes out of 5 launch-no graphic design-not usability-tested app and simply add a way to monitor the crashes and beta-testers(users:) feedback. It worked well for them. But to be fair they just copied Microsoft recipe :D Beside, you have 600 000 new potential customer every day, so if the 600 000 of today are upset, well you'll do better tomorrow :D It's called the Google Way :D Yahel. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Request to Google's Android SDK team
All your suggestions are valid and I've already used some of them. E.g. I've finished with the 2.2 testing. I want to now test with as many other devices as possible (without having to mortgage my home). The issue isn't whether there are work-arounds, we're all engineers, our jobs are to find solutions to hard problems. The issue is CONVENIENCE and EFFICIENCY. If you do not agree a VirtualBox solution is a more convenient and efficient solution, then I don't think there's anything I can say to convince you otherwise. Google is already working on a Honeycomb emulator. I'm not asking them to stop. I'm just asking for an intermediate solution while they improve on their final product. If my users were inconvenienced, I would try to give them a temporary solution to hold them over until I have a good solution. But that's just me. It's a difference in engineering philosophy. Are you speaking for Google? Is this Google's final word on the matter? If Google isn't even going to consider this issue, there's no point in continuing this discussion. --jc -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Request to Google's Android SDK team
On Sat, Jul 23, 2011 at 3:15 PM, Jimen Ching jimen.ch...@gmail.com wrote: If you do not agree a VirtualBox solution is a more convenient and efficient solution, then I don't think there's anything I can say to convince you otherwise. If it would work, it might be. However, I doubt that it will work, since it does not solve the graphics acceleration problem. The mere fact that VirtualBox might expose hardware graphics acceleration capabilities does not mean that Honeycomb will be able to exploit them without significant work. I would expect that performance of a Honeycomb VirtualBox to perhaps be incrementally better than a Honeycomb qemu. Or, to put it another way, I would expect the ratio of pain between 2.3 and 3.0 to be roughly the same on qemu and VirtualBox. Furthermore, I recall suggesting this very solution to Xav at Google I|O and being told that it did not help. There is also the minor issue that VirtualBox is owned by Oracle. :-) Personally, I wish that the Honeycomb source code had been released, specifically so that the community could work on this sort of thing and see if we can come up with something. Are you speaking for Google? Nope. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy) http://commonsware.com | http://github.com/commonsguy http://commonsware.com/blog | http://twitter.com/commonsguy Android App Developer Books: http://commonsware.com/books -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Request to Google's Android SDK team
Sooner or later you will have to test against a real device anyhow. it might be a financial burden but it is inevitable. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
[android-developers] Re: Request to Google's Android SDK team
I don't deny that real hardware is needed sooner or later. But I hope Google isn't restricting their developer ecosystem to multi-million dollar software houses only. I am developing applications for multiple Android API levels, multiple screen resolutions and screen sizes. Is Google saying every developer should buy real hardware for each of these hardware configurations? Considering just API level versions only, you're talking about at least 4 configurations: 2.2, 2.3.X, 3.1, and the latest/greatest. Of course, you could always try downgrading and upgrading as needed. But I also need to consider convenience and efficiency. For those developers who haven't gotten their million dollar investments yet, we need to still do the necessary testing, but on a very low budget. For us single developer houses, there's a very big difference between spending $500 and $5000. I need to think about the total cost, and not just the cost of the tablet. e.g. if my application needs to use peripherals, that will also add to the cost. If I had a choice, I would rather spend that $5000 on the peripherals than on another tablet or phone. Google makes billions of dollars net profit every year. It can afford to buy hardware for each developer. But I'm just starting out, and I'm just asking for a little consideration. --jc -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
Re: [android-developers] Re: Request to Google's Android SDK team
The 2.2 and 2.3 emulators work fine on decent hardware (e.g., dual-core 2GHz+, ample RAM). It is only the Honeycomb series of emulators that is an issue. Given the low penetration of Honeycomb devices to date, it is perfectly reasonable for you to say oh, never mind for now and focus on Android 2.x, using compatible-screens, other manifest settings, or the Android Market distribution rules to keep you off of tablets. Nobody has a gun pointed at your head, forcing you to work on tablets until you can afford to. On Fri, Jul 22, 2011 at 5:48 PM, Jimen Ching jimen.ch...@gmail.com wrote: I don't deny that real hardware is needed sooner or later. But I hope Google isn't restricting their developer ecosystem to multi-million dollar software houses only. I am developing applications for multiple Android API levels, multiple screen resolutions and screen sizes. Is Google saying every developer should buy real hardware for each of these hardware configurations? You need enough hardware to be confident in your product quality. How much hardware that is only you can decide. Google makes billions of dollars net profit every year. It can afford to buy hardware for each developer. You are welcome to attend Google I|O in 2012. Just be quick on the registration page. You are also welcome to use DeviceAnywhere, developer labs (e.g., the one I arranged at AnDevCon earlier this year), borrowed devices via a Meetup/GTUG/other form of user group, Samsung's virtual device access solution, etc. Or, as I mentioned, simply hold off on tablets until you can afford to. The sun will still rise in the east tomorrow, continuing to bake my part of the US to a crisp. -- Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy) http://commonsware.com | http://github.com/commonsguy http://commonsware.com/blog | http://twitter.com/commonsguy _The Busy Coder's Guide to *Advanced* Android Development_ Version 2.0 Available! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Android Developers group. To post to this group, send email to android-developers@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to android-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers?hl=en
