Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Periodic Reminder: List Conduct

[Michele Neylon - Blacknight]

Brian and the other co-chairs have never claimed to be the internet police, 
however they are the co-chairs of this group.

I don’t agree with every bit of legislation, but that does not mean that the 
laws are not binding on me

Arguing that simply because you do not agree with a rule that it shouldn’t 
apply to you is farcical.

Put more simply, if you want to participate in RIPE Community discussions you 
need to abide by the rules. If you don’t want to respect the rules then you 
can’t participate.


--
Mr Michele Neylon
Blacknight Solutions
Hosting, Colocation & Domains
https://www.blacknight.com
https://blacknight.blog /
http://ceo.hosting/
Intl. +353 (0) 59  9183072
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Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow, R93 X265
,Ireland  Company No.: 370845

From: anti-abuse-wg  on behalf of Fi Shing 

Date: Saturday 18 January 2020 at 07:23
To: "anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net" 
Subject: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Periodic Reminder: List Conduct

It appears you missed the point of my email.

How can you say rules apply to this list, but not RIPE itself?

Given the logic of many on this list:


  1.  You are not the internet police,
  2.  Some people may not agree with a rule, so therefore there are no rules at 
all,
  3.  you, as an administrator enforcing this rule of "no personal attacks" 
would require you to open your emails, which is too much to ask of you as an 
administrator.


- Original Message -
Subject: RE: [anti-abuse-wg] Periodic Reminder: List Conduct
From: "Brian Nisbet" 
Date: 1/17/20 10:42 pm
To: "Fi Shing" , "anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net" 



Honestly, you can disagree all you want, but there are rules of conduct in the 
RIPE community and on this list. My email served as a polite reminder of those 
rules. If a member of the list chooses not to follow them, then steps will be 
taken in regards to direct communication, then moderation of postings if it is 
felt necessary and on from there.

The Co-Chairs would greatly prefer not to have to deal with any of this, nor 
impose any restrictions on engagement with the working group, but if we must, 
we must, because such attacks do not help the list discussion nor the policy 
development process.

Thanks,

Brian
Co-Chair, RIPE AA-WG

Brian Nisbet
Service Operations Manager
HEAnet CLG, Ireland's National Education and Research Network
1st Floor, 5 George's Dock, IFSC, Dublin D01 X8N7, Ireland
+35316609040 brian.nis...@heanet.ie www.heanet.ie
Registered in Ireland, No. 275301. CRA No. 20036270

From: anti-abuse-wg  On Behalf Of Fi Shing
Sent: Friday 17 January 2020 11:33
To: anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net
Subject: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Periodic Reminder: List Conduct

>> but we can tell you not to do it here, so please don't.

Well... no, i disagree.

Brian Nisbet, i would like to remind you, that ... You are not the Internet 
Police.

In fact, what you consider to be a rule, might not be something that every 
single person on this planet also considers to be a rule, and so therefore, we 
have no rules at all, nor is there any basis for you to impose any rules on 
this list such as that which you have said.

To enforce this rule of "no personal attacks", would require you to open you 
email and read it once every year. That is too much for RIPE to envisage. It's 
too much resources. It's something that no administrator such as you SHOULD 
HAVE TO DO.

So therefore, let us discuss, in meaningless circular fashion, similar to what 
you find inside an insane asylum, this idea of yours.



SOUND FAMILIAR, ANYONE?



- Original Message -
Subject: [anti-abuse-wg] Periodic Reminder: List Conduct
From: "Brian Nisbet" mailto:brian.nis...@heanet.ie>>
Date: 1/17/20 8:23 pm
To: "anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net" 
mailto:anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net>>

Colleagues,

It seems that at some point in every large list discussion I am compelled to 
send a mail of this type. This is not in response to any single mail, rather it 
is a reminder to all.

Please remember to conduct yourselves well on this list, to discuss the matter 
at hand and not to attack the person writing the email. Most of the list 
discussion takes place in the appropriate manner, but I realise that when we're 
discussing matters about which any of us are passionate we can forget this.

Ad hominem attacks, general slights, unfounded accusations, and many other 
things do not contribute to the list discussion. The Co-Chairs can't tell you 
not to send them by private mail (albeit we'd greatly prefer you didn't) nor to 
act in this manner in other for a (albeit we'd prefer if you didn't do that 
either), but we can tell you not to do it here, so please don't.

Thank you all for your interest and passion for this subject.

Brian
Co-Chair, RIPE AA-WG

Brian Nisbet
Service Operations Manager
HEAnet CLG, Ireland's National Education and Research Network
1st Floor, 5 

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Periodic Reminder: List Conduct

[Chriztoffer Hansen]

On Sat, 18 Jan 2020 at 08:21, Fi Shing  wrote:
> Some people may not agree with a rule, so therefore there are no rules at all,

Even if your friend/employer told you not to smoke on *their*
premises...(?) Whenever you particpate in a community, or are with
friends and/or family. There will always exists, at bare minimum, an
unwritten code-of-conduct. Certain behaviour/words will, not always,
be accept. Never forget that(!) (Similar to how you signed an
agreement, when the state you live in issued you a password in your
own name.) Even if rules are not acknowledged by EVERYONE. If you
participate in the "community" (as defined within the scope of RIPE
NCC, and amongst others, the mailing lists hosted by them), you SHOULD
always behave in a way that is accepted as the consencus
code-of-conduct by the majority. Or accept whatever repurcussions will
follow, if the displayed behaviour is not accepted by the majority in
any/the community.

Chriztoffer