Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 5:16 PM, pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)
 wrote:

> Sounds like the divisions sadly are deeper than I thought.

 it's not "divisions", it's very simple: the EOMA68 Certification Mark
requires that people Certify the products that they intend to
manufacture and sell, for safety reasons.  i am not just blithely
going to let people randomly create hardware, slap an EOMA68 logo on
it and then be sued or imprisoned because somebody was killed in a
lithium battery fire.

 this is *really serious*, and must take absolute precedence over
*any* kind of "freedoms" offered by libre hardware and libre software
licenses.

l.

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Side-Topic: Liberating PocketCHIP

[Isaac David]

Pablo :

 Probably a good idea to use mainline libre-linux, but first want to
 make a diff file comparing their fork with libre to make sure their
 aren't any drivers which are libre that we might need (or any
 bug-fixes).


There is a deblob script used by Parabola Linux to liberate a 
mainline kernel. It is used to

create a libre-linux kernel from mainline.


just chiming in to clarify that Parabola actually uses Linux-libre as
provided by the FSFLA. they're the ones maintaining and running the
deblob script and we just grab their pre-cleaned sources. needless to
say, nothing prevents you or us from applying the script to linux
mainline ourselves.

i'm not familiar with Debian, but i've heard a number of times that
their kernel (and rest of the system indeed) is also equally clean by
default.

--
Isaac David
GPG: 38D33EF29A7691134357648733466E12EC7BA943
Tox: 
0C730E0156E96E6193A1445D413557FF5F277BA969A4EA20AC9352889D3B390E77651E816F0C



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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[Kyle]

According to dumblob:
# I just came across Technoethical (https://tehnoetic.com/  ) and was
# surprised by the range of libre products they sell.

Looking at the laptops, they're all refurbished Thinkpads with Intel 
inside. I would perform a libre installation on such hardware if someone 
already owned it, but I would certainly never consider selling it as 
anything close to libre hardware. It has been said that the software 
makes all the difference, but Intel ucode really is a thing, and the 
stuff they have hidden in their CPU's for years makes libre software 
pretty much moot. Just my 2 Satoshi.

Sent from the end

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

btw what i suspect is that tch is expecting to blithely copy the
entire EOMA68-A20 hardware, with the expectation of spongeing off of
the time and effort put into it.  just like he did by spongeing off of
chris's work with the AR9271 chain of devices.

what he doesn't realise is that it's dangerous to do that (hardware
interoperability)  if he screws it up in even the smallest way it
brings the entire EOMA68 project into disrepute.  you only have to
look at how chinese clones of USB3 cables are screwing up the power
provision and damaging people's devices to know that hardware is not
something you mess about with.

l.

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 3:32 PM, pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)
 wrote:

> Anyway, we two seem to agree that talking to Tehnoetic is worth a try
> when EOMA68-A20 is ready.

mmm no.  i'm not going to initiate any conversations: i know
enough to know that doing so would not be a good idea.  effort which
would centre around trying to disabuse someone of what *appears* on
the face of it to be preconceptions but in fact is a deliberate effort
to rubbish a "competing" product, such that once you had knocked down
one straw man they would simply create a new one... could instead
be focussed on much more productive areas and on much more receptive
people.

 if however they contact _me_, then that would be an indication that
they're ready to listen.

l.

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 2:36 PM, zap  wrote:

> Well, I hope your right, he has been acting odd if you use trisquel
> forums... you will see what I mean...

  i know what to expect - i've seen it happen before.  people get it
into their heads that i'm a threat (or in this case that chris is a
threat), and they will do absolutely anything - twist, evade,
deliberately misunderstand and outright lie - *anything* as long as
they can justify, in their minds, staying away from me or anything
that i'm doing (or in this case what chris does).

 you also have to remember that tct's WIFI products are based on
chris's work (2 years of walking qualcomm through the process of
releasing the atheros 9271 firmware source code).  that will be a
source of embarrassment for him.  luckily, the majority of people who
do business with chris (and e.g. populate the trisquel forums) know
the story.

l.

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[pelzflorian (Florian Pelz)]

On Thu, Jul 06, 2017 at 06:57:32AM -0400, zap wrote:
> On 07/06/2017 06:04 AM, dumblob wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I just came across Technoethical (https://tehnoetic.com/ ) and was
> > surprised by the range of libre products they sell. Technoethical is
> > also RYF (https://ryf.fsf.org/ ) certified.
> >
> > Luke, it might be worth contacting them with EOMA notebooks.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > -- Jan
> Alas, the owner of that company says that eoma68-a20 is not libre
> hardware...
> 
> so I doubt he would be easy to convince... no maybe impossible even...
> 
> meh...
> 

I believe tct’s reasons for saying EOMA68-A20 isn’t libre will no
longer matter once it is released. Please don’t dismiss tct just for
having a different definition of libre.

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[zap]

On 07/06/2017 07:29 AM, Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 11:57 AM, zap  wrote:
>
>
>> Alas, the owner of that company says that eoma68-a20 is not libre
>> hardware...
>  this does not surprise me.  if he has been talking to the guy known
> as "francis", who is best known for selling thinkpad x200 libre
> laptops, but is less well-known for causing a hell of a lot of
> problems, then yes he will be badly misled and misinformed.
>
>  it happens.
>
Actually no, he is now known as Leah. Your thinking of tct from trisquel
forums...

Francis who is known as Leah now, owns minifree not tehnoetic...

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[zap]

On 07/06/2017 06:57 AM, zap wrote:
>
> On 07/06/2017 06:04 AM, dumblob wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I just came across Technoethical (https://tehnoetic.com/ ) and was
>> surprised by the range of libre products they sell. Technoethical is
>> also RYF (https://ryf.fsf.org/ ) certified.
>>
>> Luke, it might be worth contacting them with EOMA notebooks.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> -- Jan
> Alas, the owner of that company says that eoma68-a20 is not libre
> hardware...
>
> so I doubt he would be easy to convince... no maybe impossible even...
>
> meh...
Sorry if this sounds pessimistic, but he, tct, has been acting a bit odd
of late... I wish tct well but, even more so for Luke for being so much
more reasonable and chris from thinkpenguin for sponsoring Luke.

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Re: [Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[zap]

On 07/06/2017 06:04 AM, dumblob wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I just came across Technoethical (https://tehnoetic.com/ ) and was
> surprised by the range of libre products they sell. Technoethical is
> also RYF (https://ryf.fsf.org/ ) certified.
>
> Luke, it might be worth contacting them with EOMA notebooks.
>
> Cheers,
>
> -- Jan
Alas, the owner of that company says that eoma68-a20 is not libre
hardware...

so I doubt he would be easy to convince... no maybe impossible even...

meh...

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[Arm-netbook] Technoethical - a good-looking seller of HW with Libre SW & firmware (Technoethical holds RYF certification)

[dumblob]

Hi,

I just came across Technoethical (https://tehnoetic.com/ ) and was
surprised by the range of libre products they sell. Technoethical is
also RYF (https://ryf.fsf.org/ ) certified.

Luke, it might be worth contacting them with EOMA notebooks.

Cheers,

-- Jan

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Re: [Arm-netbook] severe systemd bugs (two of them)

[Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton]

On Wed, Jul 5, 2017 at 6:49 PM, Philip Hands  wrote:

> The program that ran most of OpenMoko was written on the assumption that
> it would be very soon replaced by separate components that would all
> pass messages around via d-bus

 ah!  12+ years i'm glad someone remembers.  i got the trolltech
greenphone, not an openmoko

> The result being that if one got an incoming call, it would provoke a
> cascade of (IIRC 7) d-bus interactions that were all being answered by
> call-backs in the single program that was doing everything.  Each one
> went via a kernel context switch (or two?), dumping the cache, and that
> meant that it would take at least 5 seconds for the ringer to start
> ringing after a call came in, a few more seconds to show you the screen
> with the answer button,

 ... which was painted with x11 so that meant many more more
context-switches and cache-dumps because x11 is a client-server
architecture...

> a second or two for your mad tapping to be
> noticed, during which the accelerometer would realise that it needed to
> swap portrait for landscape (repainting the "cancel" button where the
> "answer" used to be) and then finally it would process your demented
> attempts to answer the sodding thing as a call rejection.  Marvelous.

 ... didn't you have call-forwarding such that there wasn't enough
time to actually answer the call anyway? :)

> Enrico Zini worked all that out, and then knocked up a very short script
> that waited for calls, made the ringer ring, and looked out for a button
> press on the physical button -- that allowed it to behave quite like a
> phone with no fuss.

dang.  *sigh* nokia's low-cost mobile phone OS (symbian?) at least was
well-designed (or, designed for purpose).

> If anyone wants an OpenMoko, I have one going cheap  :-/

 ah that would be good to use for the GTA04 motherboard replacement oh
wait damnit that didn't go so well, they used a package-on-package TI
SoC and DDR sandwich, where the processor was only designed for very
specialist mass-volume manufacturing, was made too thin (to save cost)
and warps under standard PCB assembly (ovens)... they got something
like a SEVENTY SEVEN PERCENT failure rate during a pre-production
manufacturing run.

http://laforge.gnumonks.org/blog/20170306-gta04-omap3_pop_soldering/

l.

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