Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
OK, this thread is getting really out of hand, so I'll condense my answers into one big stupid message: 1) 911 service. Yes, that is one of three reasons to keep your PSTN line. The other two reasons are: Inbound calls from local callers still should work on a POTS line, for now. You can't find VOIP providers in most area codes, so you'll most likely need to have a local number that finds it's way to you for local tasks. Secondly, the Internet is not as reliable as the phone system. Sorry, folks, it just works that way right now despite what your network engineer might tell you. That's not to say it's unreliable, but those last two nines are very expensive... Besides, any good network engineer will tell you that you should have multiple paths for your IP connectivity. With few exceptions, most homes do not have multipath connectivity. (note: businesses may in fact have better uptime on their IP network than their phone network, if they have competent engineers and a reasonable budget.) 1.5) There are reasonable technical solutions to this problem, but for the life of me I can't figure out why the 911 centers haven't gotten their act together and solved this. There are two halves to this problem: What PSAP do I call? (and what phone number) and How do I get my location data to the PSAP once I call them? C'mon, this is not difficult. The first question can be answered trivially: there _must_ be a database of address-to-PSAP mappings. Any PBX administrator (or SIP phone owner, for that matter) should be able to figure out their address. Methods for associating the PSAP number with the phone are numerous, and trivially implemented - if people don't keep their address information updated, they're SOL (though you can remind them in an automated fashion to keep it updated - just forbid them from using the service unless they verify the address every month or so.) The second question is more difficult, but certainly 2) Networks of Asterisk servers, offering dialtone to each other in different places. YES, this is a good idea, but setting dialplans up for least-cost-routing via static routes is a pretty rotten task. See my conversations on why someone should implement TRIP in Asterisk (hey, I'm still looking for a programmer... anyone want some money?) http://lists.digium.com/pipermail/asterisk-dev/2003-July/001172.html 3) Well, I forget what 3 was. Time to get some sleep. JT ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
On Thu, 21 Aug 2003, John Todd wrote: 1) 911 service. Yes, that is one of three reasons to keep your PSTN line. The other two reasons are: Inbound calls from local callers still should work on a POTS line, for now. You can't find VOIP providers in most area codes Packet8 looks like it has locals in 47 of the lower 48 with local access coming to Hawaii at some point in the near future. I checked - in some states like Ohio they only hit the big cities - on the other hand, out here in California I can even get a number local to my house because they have Victorville exchanges (and while there is a relatively large population here, we're still mostly rural and we are in the middle of the Mojave Desert :) trivially: there _must_ be a database of address-to-PSAP mappings. Any PBX administrator (or SIP phone owner, for that matter) should be able to figure out their address. Methods for associating the PSAP number with the phone are numerous, and trivially implemented Yeahbut what if I am connected to my VOIP account from my house, and then I go on vacation and take my phone with me? I don't think the 911 obstacle is impossible to overcome, but there are some issues that still need to be addressed. -- JustThe.net Internet Multimedia Services 22674 Motnocab Road * Apple Valley, CA 92307-1950 Steve Sobol, Proprietor 888.480.4NET (4638) * 248.724.4NET * [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Mike Ciholas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. ... Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com From http://www.vonage.com/area_codes.php: 812 Bloomington 812 Columbus 812 Evansville /a ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Oh, and let's not forget that the traditional carriers are not ignorant of what is happening with VoIP or customer interest. There is no doubt that they are aware that if they don't find a way to deliver this service, someone else will. No, if they don't find a way to deliver the service, they'll have taxes/laws/regulations passed that restrain other people from doing it. ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Nufone won't answer their phones. I am very interested in finding out pricing from them as Jeremy stated they are very good with their rates. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam Roach Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 10:23 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? I think Jeff Pulver (pulver.com) was trying to do this with his Free World Dialup program at one point. Haven't been paying that much attention, though. You might poke around http://www.pulver.com/ to see if there's something there that interests you. /a -Original Message- From: Dan Austin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 22:07 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? This idea has been floating around in my head. I don't think the needed 'critical mass' has been reached, but I suspect at some point a co-op style arrangement could be reached. disclaimer: I have played with *, and am deploying Cisco Call Manager. I don't see any technical reason why the following would not work, but it is open for abuse, so there may be enough socio-political reasons to not even try. Ingredients: 1. A * server 2. A friend with an * server in another city/state/country 3. A way to locate like minded individuals/orginizations 4. Moderately over-built local PSTN connectivity Mix it together with a gentlemans agreement, or strongly worded contract. Co-ordinate or advertise local number ranges. Problems: People looking to save ~$30 per line won't be thrilled to order T1(s) to share with the co-op. Keeping a structured dial-plan to provide for reasonable overlap without massive meltdowns. There are many businesses springing up to fill this void, and they will be better suited to manage and grow the infrastructure. I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. And I suspect that a number of the smaller/newer VoIP carriers might be entertaining partnerships with their competitors whose footprint compliments their own. Oh, and let's not forget that the traditional carriers are not ignorant of what is happening with VoIP or customer interest. There is no doubt that they are aware that if they don't find a way to deliver this service, someone else will. Dan (who, if he had a decent PSTN connected * box, would be willing to share) -Original Message- From: Mike Ciholas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:42 PM To: Ernest W. Lessenger Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Ernest W. Lessenger wrote: At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. This sounds so suboptimal, you have to provision *two* systems, one for inbound (local CO) and one for outbound (VoIP provider). Of course, the outbound can be just your internet connection, but this still seems annoying because most of the money is in the local CO service. Hmm, perhaps *all* incoming calls can be toll free? I would maintain the one local CO POTS line for 911 out bound, and then only use my toll free number for inbound. For the money I would save on local CO lines I can buy a *lot* of toll free minutes! Then the VoIP dial tone provider can route my toll free number to me over the internet. Presumably, then, there is no real limit on the number of lines coming in. It isn't hard coded like the CO lines are. This all seems pretty fanciful at the moment... -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Steve, I pay 2.9 cents a min inbound 800 and outbound. Email [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think he is being overloaded with requests for information. It takes him all over 30 seconds to set someone up. bkw On Thu, 21 Aug 2003, Steve Lane wrote: Nufone won't answer their phones. I am very interested in finding out pricing from them as Jeremy stated they are very good with their rates. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam Roach Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 10:23 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? I think Jeff Pulver (pulver.com) was trying to do this with his Free World Dialup program at one point. Haven't been paying that much attention, though. You might poke around http://www.pulver.com/ to see if there's something there that interests you. /a -Original Message- From: Dan Austin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 22:07 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? This idea has been floating around in my head. I don't think the needed 'critical mass' has been reached, but I suspect at some point a co-op style arrangement could be reached. disclaimer: I have played with *, and am deploying Cisco Call Manager. I don't see any technical reason why the following would not work, but it is open for abuse, so there may be enough socio-political reasons to not even try. Ingredients: 1. A * server 2. A friend with an * server in another city/state/country 3. A way to locate like minded individuals/orginizations 4. Moderately over-built local PSTN connectivity Mix it together with a gentlemans agreement, or strongly worded contract. Co-ordinate or advertise local number ranges. Problems: People looking to save ~$30 per line won't be thrilled to order T1(s) to share with the co-op. Keeping a structured dial-plan to provide for reasonable overlap without massive meltdowns. There are many businesses springing up to fill this void, and they will be better suited to manage and grow the infrastructure. I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. And I suspect that a number of the smaller/newer VoIP carriers might be entertaining partnerships with their competitors whose footprint compliments their own. Oh, and let's not forget that the traditional carriers are not ignorant of what is happening with VoIP or customer interest. There is no doubt that they are aware that if they don't find a way to deliver this service, someone else will. Dan (who, if he had a decent PSTN connected * box, would be willing to share) -Original Message- From: Mike Ciholas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:42 PM To: Ernest W. Lessenger Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Ernest W. Lessenger wrote: At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. This sounds so suboptimal, you have to provision *two* systems, one for inbound (local CO) and one for outbound (VoIP provider). Of course, the outbound can be just your internet connection, but this still seems annoying because most of the money is in the local CO service. Hmm, perhaps *all* incoming calls can be toll free? I would maintain the one local CO POTS line for 911 out bound, and then only use my toll free number for inbound. For the money I would save on local CO lines I can buy a *lot* of toll free minutes! Then the VoIP dial tone provider can route my toll free number to me over the internet. Presumably, then, there is no real limit on the number of lines coming in. It isn't hard coded like the CO lines are. This all seems pretty fanciful at the moment... -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Our phones have been working perfectly fine all day. I've personally supported quite a few new users over the phone today and even set a couple up. Jeremy McNamara Steve Lane wrote: Nufone won't answer their phones. I am very interested in finding out pricing from them as Jeremy stated they are very good with their rates. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam Roach Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 10:23 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? I think Jeff Pulver (pulver.com) was trying to do this with his Free World Dialup program at one point. Haven't been paying that much attention, though. You might poke around http://www.pulver.com/ to see if there's something there that interests you. /a -Original Message- From: Dan Austin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 22:07 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? This idea has been floating around in my head. I don't think the needed 'critical mass' has been reached, but I suspect at some point a co-op style arrangement could be reached. disclaimer: I have played with *, and am deploying Cisco Call Manager. I don't see any technical reason why the following would not work, but it is open for abuse, so there may be enough socio-political reasons to not even try. Ingredients: 1. A * server 2. A friend with an * server in another city/state/country 3. A way to locate like minded individuals/orginizations 4. Moderately over-built local PSTN connectivity Mix it together with a gentlemans agreement, or strongly worded contract. Co-ordinate or advertise local number ranges. Problems: People looking to save ~$30 per line won't be thrilled to order T1(s) to share with the co-op. Keeping a structured dial-plan to provide for reasonable overlap without massive meltdowns. There are many businesses springing up to fill this void, and they will be better suited to manage and grow the infrastructure. I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. And I suspect that a number of the smaller/newer VoIP carriers might be entertaining partnerships with their competitors whose footprint compliments their own. Oh, and let's not forget that the traditional carriers are not ignorant of what is happening with VoIP or customer interest. There is no doubt that they are aware that if they don't find a way to deliver this service, someone else will. Dan (who, if he had a decent PSTN connected * box, would be willing to share) -Original Message- From: Mike Ciholas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:42 PM To: Ernest W. Lessenger Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Ernest W. Lessenger wrote: At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. This sounds so suboptimal, you have to provision *two* systems, one for inbound (local CO) and one for outbound (VoIP provider). Of course, the outbound can be just your internet connection, but this still seems annoying because most of the money is in the local CO service. Hmm, perhaps *all* incoming calls can be toll free? I would maintain the one local CO POTS line for 911 out bound, and then only use my toll free number for inbound. For the money I would save on local CO lines I can buy a *lot* of toll free minutes! Then the VoIP dial tone provider can route my toll free number to me over the internet. Presumably, then, there is no real limit on the number of lines coming in. It isn't hard coded like the CO lines are. This all seems pretty fanciful at the moment... -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users ___ Asterisk-Users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
NUFONE R0X! Took him 30 seconds or so to set me up when I got services with him! :P bkw On Thu, 21 Aug 2003, Jeremy McNamara wrote: Our phones have been working perfectly fine all day. I've personally supported quite a few new users over the phone today and even set a couple up. Jeremy McNamara Steve Lane wrote: Nufone won't answer their phones. I am very interested in finding out pricing from them as Jeremy stated they are very good with their rates. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam Roach Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 10:23 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? I think Jeff Pulver (pulver.com) was trying to do this with his Free World Dialup program at one point. Haven't been paying that much attention, though. You might poke around http://www.pulver.com/ to see if there's something there that interests you. /a -Original Message- From: Dan Austin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 22:07 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? This idea has been floating around in my head. I don't think the needed 'critical mass' has been reached, but I suspect at some point a co-op style arrangement could be reached. disclaimer: I have played with *, and am deploying Cisco Call Manager. I don't see any technical reason why the following would not work, but it is open for abuse, so there may be enough socio-political reasons to not even try. Ingredients: 1. A * server 2. A friend with an * server in another city/state/country 3. A way to locate like minded individuals/orginizations 4. Moderately over-built local PSTN connectivity Mix it together with a gentlemans agreement, or strongly worded contract. Co-ordinate or advertise local number ranges. Problems: People looking to save ~$30 per line won't be thrilled to order T1(s) to share with the co-op. Keeping a structured dial-plan to provide for reasonable overlap without massive meltdowns. There are many businesses springing up to fill this void, and they will be better suited to manage and grow the infrastructure. I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. And I suspect that a number of the smaller/newer VoIP carriers might be entertaining partnerships with their competitors whose footprint compliments their own. Oh, and let's not forget that the traditional carriers are not ignorant of what is happening with VoIP or customer interest. There is no doubt that they are aware that if they don't find a way to deliver this service, someone else will. Dan (who, if he had a decent PSTN connected * box, would be willing to share) -Original Message- From: Mike Ciholas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:42 PM To: Ernest W. Lessenger Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Ernest W. Lessenger wrote: At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. This sounds so suboptimal, you have to provision *two* systems, one for inbound (local CO) and one for outbound (VoIP provider). Of course, the outbound can be just your internet connection, but this still seems annoying because most of the money is in the local CO service. Hmm, perhaps *all* incoming calls can be toll free? I would maintain the one local CO POTS line for 911 out bound, and then only use my toll free number for inbound. For the money I would save on local CO lines I can buy a *lot* of toll free minutes! Then the VoIP dial tone provider can route my toll free number to me over the internet. Presumably, then, there is no real limit on the number of lines coming in. It isn't hard coded like the CO lines are. This all seems pretty fanciful at the moment... -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
As far as people are thinking of sharing their telephony, we could let people start exposing them through iaxtel. If anyone has areacodes prefixes they want to make available, e-mail me and I can set you up on iaxtel. Mark On Thu, 21 Aug 2003, Brian West wrote: NUFONE R0X! Took him 30 seconds or so to set me up when I got services with him! :P bkw On Thu, 21 Aug 2003, Jeremy McNamara wrote: Our phones have been working perfectly fine all day. I've personally supported quite a few new users over the phone today and even set a couple up. Jeremy McNamara Steve Lane wrote: Nufone won't answer their phones. I am very interested in finding out pricing from them as Jeremy stated they are very good with their rates. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam Roach Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 10:23 AM To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? I think Jeff Pulver (pulver.com) was trying to do this with his Free World Dialup program at one point. Haven't been paying that much attention, though. You might poke around http://www.pulver.com/ to see if there's something there that interests you. /a -Original Message- From: Dan Austin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 22:07 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? This idea has been floating around in my head. I don't think the needed 'critical mass' has been reached, but I suspect at some point a co-op style arrangement could be reached. disclaimer: I have played with *, and am deploying Cisco Call Manager. I don't see any technical reason why the following would not work, but it is open for abuse, so there may be enough socio-political reasons to not even try. Ingredients: 1. A * server 2. A friend with an * server in another city/state/country 3. A way to locate like minded individuals/orginizations 4. Moderately over-built local PSTN connectivity Mix it together with a gentlemans agreement, or strongly worded contract. Co-ordinate or advertise local number ranges. Problems: People looking to save ~$30 per line won't be thrilled to order T1(s) to share with the co-op. Keeping a structured dial-plan to provide for reasonable overlap without massive meltdowns. There are many businesses springing up to fill this void, and they will be better suited to manage and grow the infrastructure. I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. And I suspect that a number of the smaller/newer VoIP carriers might be entertaining partnerships with their competitors whose footprint compliments their own. Oh, and let's not forget that the traditional carriers are not ignorant of what is happening with VoIP or customer interest. There is no doubt that they are aware that if they don't find a way to deliver this service, someone else will. Dan (who, if he had a decent PSTN connected * box, would be willing to share) -Original Message- From: Mike Ciholas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:42 PM To: Ernest W. Lessenger Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Ernest W. Lessenger wrote: At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. This sounds so suboptimal, you have to provision *two* systems, one for inbound (local CO) and one for outbound (VoIP provider). Of course, the outbound can be just your internet connection, but this still seems annoying because most of the money is in the local CO service. Hmm, perhaps *all* incoming calls can be toll free? I would maintain the one local CO POTS line for 911 out bound, and then only use my toll free number for inbound. For the money I would save on local CO lines I can buy a *lot* of toll free minutes! Then the VoIP dial tone provider can route my toll free number to me over the internet. Presumably, then, there is no real limit
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Does http://www.voicepulse.com/ work with *? On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, John Todd wrote: At 3:20 PM -0500 8/20/03, Mike Ciholas wrote: Hi all, While pondering my choices for local dial tone service via a bunch of POTS lines or a T1, I began to wonder if perhaps there is another way. Are there VoIP dialtone providers? That is, could I use only my internet connection for voice calls and not have a separate T1/POTS bank for that? I guess I am imagining a company that gateways between the PTSN and the internet backbone. Calls come in and get VoIP'ed and sent to me as packets, perhaps IAX, perhaps something else? First question: Does such a thing exist? Where? Yes. http://www.iconnecthere.com/ http://www.packet8.net/ http://www.nufone.net/ http://www.coloco.com/ (not obviously visible on the home page, but exists) http://www.voicepulse.com/ ...many others. Use your favorite search engine to look up SIP long distance providers. Some of the above (notably NuFone and Coloco) will provide IAX/IAX2 termination. Second question: Does it work? How well? Works great. I haven't made a long distance call on my PSTN line in months, and I spend pretty much all day on LD calls. Third question: Would you want it? Why? Yes. Cheap, portable, failure-tolerant. Note that your phone service suddenly becomes as (un)reliable as your Internet connectivity, so ensure that you have those bases covered through the normal methods such as multihoming, facility redundancy, MPLS, etc. I would also suggest you have multiple outbound VoIP providers, with automatic failover configured in your Asterisk server. This is easily done. Fourth question: How much $$$? As little as $.01 a minute anywhere in the US, and great international rates, depending on providers. Remember you can get multiple accounts, and send your calls to different providers based on static tables of who you think is cheapest for that dial prefix. To address your previous question of is it ready for prime time the answer is: For basic features, absolutely. I have several customers whose systems I have configured for their offices... and I haven't heard from them in MONTHS. The systems have had 100% uptime, handling calls from POTS and VoIP lines. For exotic features: maybe. There is a HUGE list of niggly little features that everyone is in love with in their particular PBX. Some of those features, Asterisk does exceedingly well, and others that are less frequently used, it does not. However, this situation is no different with Asterisk than with any other PBX system that you might evaluate, so all things being equal I'd say Asterisk is a LOT better than a proprietary solution since you can get under the hood yourself and fix things that might need to be updated. JT -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, John Todd wrote: At 3:20 PM -0500 8/20/03, Mike Ciholas wrote: Are there VoIP dialtone providers? That is, could I use only my internet connection for voice calls and not have a separate T1/POTS bank for that? First question: Does such a thing exist? Where? Yes. Second question: Does it work? How well? Works great. I haven't made a long distance call on my PSTN line in months, and I spend pretty much all day on LD calls. I guess my question was a little deeper than that. Can I simply ditch the PTSN? I see that toll free inbound and LD outbound can be handled, can they handle inbound and local, too? Seems like we are very close to cutting the local phone company out of the loop! That would be so nice as trying to talk them about provisioning the lines is quite a chore. -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Are there VoIP dialtone providers? That is, could I use only my internet connection for voice calls and not have a separate T1/POTS bank for that? I guess I am imagining a company that gateways between the PTSN and the internet backbone. Calls come in and get VoIP'ed and sent to me as packets, perhaps IAX, perhaps something else? First question: Does such a thing exist? Where? Yes; Delta 3, Vonage, and a bunch of other companies that I can't rememeber off the top of my head do exactly this. /a ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Brian West wrote: I think NuFone can do what you need contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have inbound 800 service and outbound ld service with them.. works great. And for local service, you do what? -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
I guess my question was a little deeper than that. Can I simply ditch the PTSN? 911 is the sticking point. Most commercial VoIP services come with the disclaimer that they are *not* a primary line replacement, precisely because of the liability issues associated with providing emergency services. For example, a typical configuration would be to not care where the caller is from, and simply route calls according to the country and city code, as appropriate. If you dump 911 into such a system, it has no way to route you to an appropriate operator. Sitting around in Indiana talking to a 911 operator in Los Angeles generally does you very little good. That said, in controlled environments, some services are now offering VoIP primary line replacements. The only service I currently know that is doing so is Vonage (http://www.vonage.com/), and it is doing so only in very specific markets at the moment. Further, the handling of 911 in their system is sub-optimal[1], in as much as it doesn't dump you into the normal 911 queue, and the PSAP will not have any information about your location. In, say, a medical emergency, I would far prefer to be talking about the emergency itself than trying to spell the name of my street. Until this tiny, possibly life-or-death detail gets sorted out, I'm probably going to have at least one traditional phone line at all times. /a [1] See http://www.vonage.com/small_business/features_911.php ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
pipe my local CO line into my * box with an X100P bkw On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Mike Ciholas wrote: On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Brian West wrote: I think NuFone can do what you need contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have inbound 800 service and outbound ld service with them.. works great. And for local service, you do what? -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Adam Roach wrote: I guess my question was a little deeper than that. Can I simply ditch the PTSN? 911 is the sticking point. Ah. Until this tiny, possibly life-or-death detail gets sorted out, I'm probably going to have at least one traditional phone line at all times. Hmm, okay, so would it be possible to maintain *one* POTS line that is used if anyone dials 911 on their desk phone (set this up in * dial plan), then it connects to emergency services properly, and then use a VoIP dial tone provider for *everything* else? This assumes we are having only one emergency at a time! Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Hmm, okay, so would it be possible to maintain *one* POTS line that is used if anyone dials 911 on their desk phone (set this up in * dial plan), then it connects to emergency services properly, and then use a VoIP dial tone provider for *everything* else? This assumes we are having only one emergency at a time! Yes, that would work fine. Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. --Ernest ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Ernest W. Lessenger wrote: At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. This sounds so suboptimal, you have to provision *two* systems, one for inbound (local CO) and one for outbound (VoIP provider). Of course, the outbound can be just your internet connection, but this still seems annoying because most of the money is in the local CO service. Hmm, perhaps *all* incoming calls can be toll free? I would maintain the one local CO POTS line for 911 out bound, and then only use my toll free number for inbound. For the money I would save on local CO lines I can buy a *lot* of toll free minutes! Then the VoIP dial tone provider can route my toll free number to me over the internet. Presumably, then, there is no real limit on the number of lines coming in. It isn't hard coded like the CO lines are. This all seems pretty fanciful at the moment... -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
This idea has been floating around in my head. I don't think the needed 'critical mass' has been reached, but I suspect at some point a co-op style arrangement could be reached. disclaimer: I have played with *, and am deploying Cisco Call Manager. I don't see any technical reason why the following would not work, but it is open for abuse, so there may be enough socio-political reasons to not even try. Ingredients: 1. A * server 2. A friend with an * server in another city/state/country 3. A way to locate like minded individuals/orginizations 4. Moderately over-built local PSTN connectivity Mix it together with a gentlemans agreement, or strongly worded contract. Co-ordinate or advertise local number ranges. Problems: People looking to save ~$30 per line won't be thrilled to order T1(s) to share with the co-op. Keeping a structured dial-plan to provide for reasonable overlap without massive meltdowns. There are many businesses springing up to fill this void, and they will be better suited to manage and grow the infrastructure. I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. And I suspect that a number of the smaller/newer VoIP carriers might be entertaining partnerships with their competitors whose footprint compliments their own. Oh, and let's not forget that the traditional carriers are not ignorant of what is happening with VoIP or customer interest. There is no doubt that they are aware that if they don't find a way to deliver this service, someone else will. Dan (who, if he had a decent PSTN connected * box, would be willing to share) -Original Message- From: Mike Ciholas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 3:42 PM To: Ernest W. Lessenger Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Ernest W. Lessenger wrote: At 04:48 PM 8/20/2003 -0500, you wrote: Now, if that is possible, how does the VoIP dial tone provider get my inbound local and toll calls? I would want my local phone number to work, of course. You would need to redirect your local number to them. This ALWAYS assumes that the VoIP provider has a switch in your local CO or an agreement with someone who does. Vonage and Voicepulse, for example, do not have a presence in my area. I intend to maintain several POTS lines for incoming calls, and use a VoIP provider for all outgoing calls. Oh well. I'm would expect no one would have presence here. This sounds so suboptimal, you have to provision *two* systems, one for inbound (local CO) and one for outbound (VoIP provider). Of course, the outbound can be just your internet connection, but this still seems annoying because most of the money is in the local CO service. Hmm, perhaps *all* incoming calls can be toll free? I would maintain the one local CO POTS line for 911 out bound, and then only use my toll free number for inbound. For the money I would save on local CO lines I can buy a *lot* of toll free minutes! Then the VoIP dial tone provider can route my toll free number to me over the internet. Presumably, then, there is no real limit on the number of lines coming in. It isn't hard coded like the CO lines are. This all seems pretty fanciful at the moment... -- Mike Ciholas(812) 476-2721 voice CIHOLAS Enterprises (812) 476-2881 fax 2626 Kotter Ave, Unit D [EMAIL PROTECTED] Evansville, IN 47715http://www.ciholas.com ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Dan Austin wrote: I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. NuFone doesn't restrict any number of simultaneous channels and we do have a wholesale platform we ~can~ offer. Jeremy McNamara ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Jeremy, That is one of the reasons I have went with nufone and the company I work for is going to be going with nufone. No need having idle channels when someone could be putting them to use! :P (and you make $$) Everyone's happy. bkw On Wed, 20 Aug 2003, Jeremy McNamara wrote: Dan Austin wrote: I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. NuFone doesn't restrict any number of simultaneous channels and we do have a wholesale platform we ~can~ offer. Jeremy McNamara ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
RE: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
Hit me up off-line Jeremy. I want to know what your wholesale rates are. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeremy McNamara Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 10:32 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone? Dan Austin wrote: I've watched the discussions about IAX/SIP service providers, and most seem to be geared exclusively to the single user/line household. I know a number of small businesses that would jump to a VoIP carrier that allowed concurrent calls, heck my family has one. NuFone doesn't restrict any number of simultaneous channels and we do have a wholesale platform we ~can~ offer. Jeremy McNamara ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
Re: [Asterisk-Users] VoIP dialtone?
If that list isn't enough, here's a sitefull http://voipproviders.com/ Steve Meyers wrote: On Wed, 2003-08-20 at 14:20, Mike Ciholas wrote: Are there VoIP dialtone providers? That is, could I use only my internet connection for voice calls and not have a separate T1/POTS bank for that? packet8.com nufone.com iconnecthere.com I haven't tried any of them yet. I'm considering setting up a site to review SIP phones, channel banks (and other FXO/FXS), VoIP providers, etc. I haven't been able to find a single resource that describes well what the pros/cons are of each, or even just what the options are. Steve ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users ___ Asterisk-Users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
