Re: [Aus-soaring] ADS-B for RC models?
On 29/11/2010 1:07 PM, DMcD wrote: But Bernard is right; if sailplanes have to fit ADS-B then so do large scale RC aircraft and UAVs… as well as kites, kitesails, helium party balloons... I recall a GFA AGM at Bacchus Marsh last century (probably around the 1980's) when there was a hint of a rumour that we might be required to fit transponders to all gliders. Bill Riley, who was there for the afternoon and appeared to be somewhat disinterested in proceedings (and who could blame him), jumped to his feet and declared with considerable emphasis and enthusiasm - as only he could - and with a characteristic dismissive wave of his arm: "They'll have to fit them to the bloody birds as well!!" The meeting broke up, and that closed the matter for the day - and possibly for quite a few years. I could make a suggestion about the appropriate squawk code for transiting parrots but I won't . Regards, TN ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] NSW State Comps
Have just finished launching the fleet on task. Detailed report follows Ian Downes (C.D.) Manager LKSC - Original Message - From: Mal Bruce To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Sent: Monday, November 29, 2010 8:33 AM Subject: [Aus-soaring] NSW State Comps No Fly day yesterday. Today the same!? http://www.bom.gov.au/products/national_radar_sat.loop.shtml http://www.bom.gov.au/products/IDG00074.shtml -- ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] NSW State Comps
Flying today at keepit (MON) all in air OK and only a few relights - 2.5hrs club and 2hrs the rest but seems a bit better than forcast Ian McPhee On 29 November 2010 08:33, Mal Bruce wrote: > No Fly day yesterday. > > Today the same!? > > http://www.bom.gov.au/products/national_radar_sat.loop.shtml > > http://www.bom.gov.au/products/IDG00074.shtml > > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] ADS-B for RC models?
I can think of a lot of reasons for flying some of these large scale RC gliders but perhaps the vintage ones are the nicest and most easy to justify. http://www.letmodel.cz/gallery-habicht.htm There's even a 1:2 scale Cobra trailer. I have some French friends who may come to Oz in January (if it dries out) to fly 1:1, but they were also bringing a "container" with their toy RC planes. But Bernard is right; if sailplanes have to fit ADS-B then so do large scale RC aircraft and UAVs… as well as kites, kitesails, helium party balloons... D ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Grand Prix (Chile) on OneHD
did anyone record this program??? would love to see it Ben On 06/11/2010, at 7:17 PM, Christopher Mc Donnell wrote: > Damn! Was 3.30 to 4.30 in SA. > - Original Message - > From: Tom Wilksch > To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia. > Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2010 6:02 PM > Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Grand Prix (Chile) on OneHD > > I only caught the second half, but it was a very well put together, > informative and impressive looking program. I will record the fill thing on > tuesday morning. I would recommend it! > > Tom > - Original Message - > From: Bernie Baer > To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2010 8:28 AM > Subject: [Aus-soaring] Grand Prix (Chile) on OneHD > > The Wednesday and Friday editions of Sports Unlimited on OneHD feaured about > 30 minutes of the Chilean Grand Prix, some great air to air footage and > interviews with Sebestian Kawa and others. The show repeats today at 4 PM, > and Tuesday at 3:15 AM, and the gliding starts about 10 minutes or so into > the show. > > Saturday, 6 November 2010 > Sports Unlimited (rpt) > 4pm-5pm | One Digital (12) > 4pm-5pm | One HD (1) > > > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.864 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3238 - Release Date: 11/05/10 > 06:04:00 > > > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] ADS-B for R/C models and other air traffic
At 09:08 AM 29/11/2010, you wrote: These are good points Mike. I continue to have one concern. The specs for this device indicate a power output of 130 watts, and this all happens in the 1,000 Mhz region.I continue to be worried about the effects of even a pulsed transmission of this level at that frequency on nearby humans. EMR is a pretty topical subject these day and perhaps with good reason. I don't want to buy into a debate on this at all but Where would you envisage putting the antenna for such an installation on a GRP aircraft, and are you confident that such an installation will meet the requirements for limits of EMR exposure to the occupant(s)? Would you be totally comfortable with it yourself? Thanks, Terry Terry, I agree that this issue should be addressed. I don't think it is a problem in metal or carbon fuselages. In a glass glider I'd put the transponder antenna as far from me as I could and I'd shield the seatpan, seat back and headrest with aluminium foil. Tinfoil hats are optional! Then again some people seem quite happy putting several watts at nearly a Gig or two right next to their heads for hours a day with their cellphones! 130 watts at 2 meters away vs say 1.3 watts at .02 meters away? Inverse square law gives me the equivalent of 130/(100 x 100) watts at 0.02M or 0.013 watts. I hope I did that right. Maybe we don't have problem after all. Mike Borgelt Instruments - manufacturers of quality soaring instruments since 1978 phone Int'l + 61 746 355784 fax Int'l + 61 746 358796 cellphone Int'l + 61 428 355784 email: mborg...@borgeltinstruments.com website: www.borgeltinstruments.com ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] ADS-B for R/C models and other air traffic
On 29/11/2010 8:56 AM, Mike Borgelt wrote: snip - In the meantime if you are going to fit a transponder make sure it is a Mode S/ADSB capable one. For now the Mode A/C will ensure your visibility to regional airliners on their TCAS. It would only take one accident or near miss between a Jetstar A320, Virgin 737 or a Rex Saab 340 (fitted with ADSB OUT and IN) and a glider without these for all hell to break loose. The power drain argument is nonsense as is the weight. A Trig TT21 weighs less than 500 grams including internal altitude encoder and a suitable battery to run it for 9 hours is 550 grams.(3A-H NiMH) All you need for ADSB OUT is a suitable GPS receiver. If PowerFlarm uses a TSO'd GPS that's all you then need for ADSB OUT and ADSB IN. The mickey mouse low power, licence free band Flarm rf link can be left out too. You'll be able to see traffic out to the horizon. Snip These are good points Mike. I continue to have one concern. The specs for this device indicate a power output of 130 watts, and this all happens in the 1,000 Mhz region.I continue to be worried about the effects of even a pulsed transmission of this level at that frequency on nearby humans. EMR is a pretty topical subject these day and perhaps with good reason. I don't want to buy into a debate on this at all but Where would you envisage putting the antenna for such an installation on a GRP aircraft, and are you confident that such an installation will meet the requirements for limits of EMR exposure to the occupant(s)? Would you be totally comfortable with it yourself? Thanks, Terry ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] ADS-B for R/C models and other air traffic
Yes indeed, large R/C models might have ADSB fitted. As will UAVs. There is a strong push to operate UAV's in Class G airspace and a collision avoidance system will be necessary. This is currently difficult to do with uncooperative targets(ones not fitted with ADSB OUT) but several different approaches are being worked on. Obviously UAV operators will be in favour of universal ADSB OUT fitment. I did find a group in Northern California who were operating large autonomous sailplane models and flying them cross country. I think they were doing up to 50 mile out and returns a couple of years ago. Just for fun, but this could also extend the range and loiter time of a UAV. The rest of the R/C models are flown within line of sight of an operator on the ground. Being limited to an area say within 2NM and a couple of thousand feet is no great hardship for them and wouldn't be a problem for other airspace users, most of whom would have ADSB IN as well as OUT as the area would show up on the traffic display. Those opposing ADSB for sailplanes may like to ask themselves if they want their activity confined to reservations. I agree that ADSB is a gold plated solution for recreational aircraft with capability orders of magnitude more than is required however it isn't all that expensive and the full implementation date is 2020. Looking at Keep Soaring I'd say not many of us will have to worry about this. In the meantime if you are going to fit a transponder make sure it is a Mode S/ADSB capable one. For now the Mode A/C will ensure your visibility to regional airliners on their TCAS. It would only take one accident or near miss between a Jetstar A320, Virgin 737 or a Rex Saab 340 (fitted with ADSB OUT and IN) and a glider without these for all hell to break loose. The power drain argument is nonsense as is the weight. A Trig TT21 weighs less than 500 grams including internal altitude encoder and a suitable battery to run it for 9 hours is 550 grams.(3A-H NiMH) All you need for ADSB OUT is a suitable GPS receiver. If PowerFlarm uses a TSO'd GPS that's all you then need for ADSB OUT and ADSB IN. The mickey mouse low power, licence free band Flarm rf link can be left out too. You'll be able to see traffic out to the horizon. The power drain thing has been demonstrated to be nonsense in New Zealand of course where gliders are fitted with transponders. Pretty dumb making this argument at high official levels when you can be shown to be wrong by demonstration. As glider pilots seem happy to operate with traffic warning systems, even mandatory ones, it is hypocritical to oppose them for essentially all traffic. CASA knows what we are on this, we're just haggling about the price. There's one other benefit of ADSB OUT - real time tracking in contests and even for fun racing on weekends. Another might be that we could argue for reduced volume of airspace requiring 3rd party intervention (ATC) or clearances. You might even argue that we could legally climb up inside a fat cumulus and pop out a few thousand feet above cloudbase now and again or even be legally able to climb to cloudbase. If you decide to reply to CASA on this issue you might like to take all this into account. Mike Borgelt Instruments - manufacturers of quality soaring instruments since 1978 phone Int'l + 61 746 355784 fax Int'l + 61 746 358796 cellphone Int'l + 61 428 355784 email: mborg...@borgeltinstruments.com website: www.borgeltinstruments.com ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] ADS-B for RC models?
but why not? On 29/11/2010 8:10 AM, Mark Fisher wrote: but why? On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:12 AM, Future Aviation mailto:ec...@internode.on.net>> wrote: Good morning all I can't help but admire the bloke who built this model! It has got a wingspan of 13.4 meter - about the same span as the "World Class" glider. Kind regards to all! Bernard ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] ADS-B for RC models?
but why? On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:12 AM, Future Aviation wrote: > Good morning all > > I can't help but admire the bloke who built this model! > It has got a wingspan of 13.4 meter - about the same span as the "World > Class" glider. > > Kind regards to all! > > Bernard > > ___ > Aus-soaring mailing list > Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net > To check or change subscription details, visit: > http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring > -- Mark Fisher Managing Director Swift Performance Equipment PO Box 726, Lismore, NSW Australia Ph: +61 2 66221666 Fax: +61 2 66221633 www.spe.com.au ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
[Aus-soaring] NSW State Comps
No Fly day yesterday. Today the same!? http://www.bom.gov.au/products/national_radar_sat.loop.shtml http://www.bom.gov.au/products/IDG00074.shtml___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] 2010 grand prix concept.
Yes, a nice video...good visuals. I shall have to expand my 'spin awareness' training patter though. Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2010 13:13:08 +1000 From: pb2...@gmail.com To: m...@mca.nu; aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] 2010 grand prix concept. Nice video, but the alas the Earth is unlikely to be saved. I do not think that there is enough of those "very clever people, typically airline captains" to make difference :). Cheers Paul On 28 November 2010 13:00, mart wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KU5q1Nry6Y ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
Re: [Aus-soaring] Something a bit different
Shouldn't he have steered right, therefore passing on each others left side? Tom Of course the Pelicans don't know that [esp the new chicks from Lake Eyre!] --- On Sun, 28/11/10, Kevin Rodda wrote: From: Kevin Rodda Subject: [Aus-soaring] Something a bit different To: aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net Received: Sunday, 28 November, 2010, 1:31 PM An email from "Speedy" to the Caboolture Club's email list re flying yesterday (Saturday) ... an interesting occurrence as well as a reminder of the need to maintain good lookout for all types of "tradffic" that could be sharing our playground at any time! Kevin Rodda -- Forwarded message -- From: Bernard Gonsalves Date: Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 9:00 AM Subject: [cgclist] Something a bit different To: CGC list Well the conditions were good for soaring yesterday at Caboolture with good clouds and as the wind was moderate there was a cloud street running east / west over Morayfield for most of the day. This enabled a lot of straight line flying in good lift from the bay to Mount Mee. The interesting thing is that while heading west at a good pace in moderate lift, there very quickly appeared three dots closing toward me from the opposite direction. I had not seen these till they were not far away. It turned out to be three Pelicans that had the same idea. A cloud street really is a highway for soaring traffic be it birds or gliders. I will be keeping an extra lookout in this situation in the future. At least this confirmed that I was flying in the right line and as we all passed to the right side of each other, the PFA ( Pelican Federation of Australia ) and the GFA both have agreed to the same air rules. It was a good day at Caboolture on Saturday. Cheers, Speedy -Inline Attachment Follows- ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring ___ Aus-soaring mailing list Aus-soaring@lists.internode.on.net To check or change subscription details, visit: http://lists.internode.on.net/mailman/listinfo/aus-soaring
