Re: [Ayatana] Fwd: Proposal of new UI element for windows in Ubuntu: Esfera
This is certainly an interesting set of ideas worth thinking about. I'm not sure mouse-based gestures would work well, however: I suspect they would be very cumbersome compared to direct button clicks. Nevertheless, I think this concept can be further developed as a touch-centric UI element. (Obviously gestures work very well on touch screens.) One of the huge UI challenges is intermediate-sized devices with touchscreens (e.g. tablets, large phones and netbooks with touchscreens). While the iPhone software and Android have done well to design touch-oriented UIs that work well in phones and for simple tasks like web-browsing on a larger device, I think devices that have more desktop-like functionality will be very difficult to interact with using such a UI. On the other hand, pure desktop UIs are not suited to finger-interaction. I think an important opportunity for Ubuntu lies in developing form factor-agnostic UI concepts that allows variations of a single look and feel to work on a variety of device shapes and sizes (much like UNE differs from the standard Ubuntu experience, but still seems familiar to an Ubuntu user). (Note, I also think a speech-to-text engine and framework built into the standard Ubuntu would be huge strength on smaller devices. I don't know whether Google's work on Android is part of the open source project, but if it is, it might be worth while looking at it.) Sorry about my long and possibly uninteresting rant. Eduard On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 06:18 +, Mark Shuttleworth wrote: > Hi folks > > Got this interesting proposal from Pablo, and thought it should be > sent to the list rather than handled in private correspondence. It > reminds me of something David Siegel was sketching out, also inspired > by the challenge of "how we can make the most of the new space". > > Pablo, if you're not subscribed to Ayatana, it's the best place to > sketch out a proposal like this. > > I appreciate both the detail in the proposal and the relaxed way it's > pitched! > > Mark > > Original Message > Subject: > Proposal of new UI element for > windows in Ubuntu: Esfera > Date: > Fri, 26 Mar 2010 00:42:45 +0100 > From: > Pablo Quirós >To: > m...@ubuntu.com > > > > > Hello Mark, I've got a proposal on the buttons' subject. It is a new > element to be placed in the free space on the top-right of the > windows. > > > At first I wasn't very convinced on the UI change, and we exchanged a > couple of messages on the matter in the related bug report, but I've > thought about it and I agree with you that this could bring > interesting possibilities. > > > I've designed a concept called Esfera, which I think could be a huge > step forward to the user experience, while bringing innovation to the > Ubuntu desktop. The idea is explained in the attached PDF; I hope you > can take the time to read it or at least send it to the Canonical > Design team. Sorry for the mockup; I'm a disaster using GIMP, but I > hope it illustrates the idea. > > > I'd be very pleased to answer any question you may have about it. I'd > just request that if you implement the idea, I appear somewhere as the > author of the concept, and I've be glad if you kept the name I've > chosen. > > > Of course, there are lots of ideas that go nowhere, so I'd perfectly > understand if you consider it useless -- just thought it was good and > wanted to share it with you. > > > Regards, > > > Pablo Quirós > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] "Less is more" a look at evolution
How do people feel about Thunderbird's message tabs? On a small screen I very much prefer to switch off the preview pane and have messages open in new tabs, and I think so would many other users. Also, things like the search and filter dropdowns in evolution taking up a whole whack of vertical space (together with a useless indicator of which folder you're in above the folder tree) waste a tremendous amount of space. Very much agree that evolution can do with some attention -- looks extremely dated. On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 16:13 +, Shane Fagan wrote: > Hi all, > > I thought id look at evolution after reading Mark's post. Oh and id like > to make a quick notes, > > 1. I hate most menu structures, a lot of the programs in Gnome tend to > repeat either what is in the main UI or in the preferences dialogues. > > 2. I love how google chrome and how most of the Windows desktop has > moved away from the menu bar approach to strip out the UI cruft. > > 3. I think Evolution is one of the worst UIs in the the free desktop > because there is so much wasted space, grey useless space and repeated > functionality in the main UI and the Menus. > > > Ok so the easy removal first, the status bar is a lot of wasted space > and could be either moved or removed to save space for small screens. > > > Now the menu structure > File: > New [makes sense] > New window [doesnt make much sense for most users] > Send Receive [is easier to use in the main UI] > Backup settings [should be in the preferences dialog] > Restore settings [should be only in the accounts setup dialog] > Save message [makes some sense but could be done somewhere else] > Subscribe to other users folder [doesnt make much sense for most users] > Permissions [Ive never used this id like to know what people use it for > but it shouldnt be a main menu item] > Import [Ive never used it but I dont mind keeping it there if people use > it] > Page setup [could be done in preferences] > Print preview [could be combined with the print dialog anyway] > Print [is the norm so it should be there] > Empty trash [maybe should be a button in the main UI rather than here] > Download messages for offline usage [If you use pop it does this anyway] > Forget passwords [should be done in the preferences dialog] > Close window [doesnt make too much sense because evolution doesnt work > in the backround like gwibber aggregating and displaying a notification > when a message comes in so it doesnt make sense anyway] > Quit [ok] > > > Edit: > Copy [why do we need 3 different ways to copy something?] > Select all text [this is the only program that uses this menu item and > ctrl+a is a lot easier] > Delete message [isnt that what the del key on the keyboard is for? Its > in the main UI too and its an option when the user right clicks] > Undelete [this is an insane one IMO] > Find in message [thats what the search box is for] > Sync options [Who has a palm pilot? I dont and thats all this menu item > is for] > Message filters [has its uses but something isnt right about it] > Search folders [thats what the search box is for] > Plugins [Hm has its uses but they are all enabled by default anyway > but its fine where it is] > Preferences [ok] > > > View: [There is a lot here that should be done in preferences] > > > Folder: [A lot of this menu is already in the main UI] > > > Message: [A lot of whats here appears in the main UI and in file>add and > if you right click] > > > Search: [Thats what the search box is for] > > > Help: [ok] > > > > Its very clear that Evolution is aimed at enterprises and not the bog > standard user on the street. Its interface is clunky and repeats itself > a lot so is quite bad if your using it on a netbook. I use it myself but > after looking at Windows mail client in Windows 7 and Thunderbird 3, > Evolution looks like it was designed in 1998. If you look at all the > white space in the UI its quite ridiculous. We should really give it a > serious design look for 10.10 > > Anyone else any thoughts on Evolution? > > > Regards, > Shane Fagan > -- > Software development student > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Ayatana] Restart required indicator
Hi, I really like that the power icon goes red when a restart is required - good job! A further refinement would be to make the "Restart required..." text in the menu red as well, to tie the meaning of the icon colour to the menu action... Cheers, Dave. -- http://www.witchesband.com/ ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Restart required indicator
On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 20:19 +0100, David Balch wrote: > A further refinement would be to make the "Restart required..." text > in the menu red as well, to tie the meaning of the icon colour to the > menu action... The current theming system makes that unrealistic. The application can provide icon names, so that the icons match the theme, but we can't provide text color names. So if we changed the text color to red it could be placed on something like a red background and be invisible. --Ted signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Restart required indicator
On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 20:19 +0100, David Balch wrote: > Hi, > > I really like that the power icon goes red when a restart is required > - good job! > > A further refinement would be to make the "Restart required..." text > in the menu red as well, to tie the meaning of the icon colour to the > menu action... You beat me too it. I was also going too add, that shutdown would also be acceptable, so maybe it should be highlighted as well? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Restart required indicator
Could you not use red arrows like the blue ones in the messaging indicator? On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 14:41 -0500, Ted Gould wrote: > On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 20:19 +0100, David Balch wrote: > > A further refinement would be to make the "Restart required..." text > > in the menu red as well, to tie the meaning of the icon colour to the > > menu action... > > The current theming system makes that unrealistic. The application can > provide icon names, so that the icons match the theme, but we can't > provide text color names. So if we changed the text color to red it > could be placed on something like a red background and be invisible. > > --Ted > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Restart required indicator
On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 8:19 PM, David Balch wrote: > Hi, > > I really like that the power icon goes red when a restart is required > - good job! > > A further refinement would be to make the "Restart required..." text > in the menu red as well, to tie the meaning of the icon colour to the > menu action... > > Cheers, > Dave. > > -- > http://www.witchesband.com/ I was wanting to discuss this as well. Right now we have this beautifully consistent way of saying an indicator wants attention. However, once you open a lit up indicator, it is not apparent why it is lit up. For example, when the volume applet turns red while muted (an excellent little touch!), it isn't actually clear why it is red. One can click it and sees the same information he always sees. If he has explicitly asked to play sound it'll make sense, but otherwise not so much. The thing that immediately occurs to me (but could be a terrible idea) is to have a note at the top of the menu, or some kind of tooltip (of a magic new variety that appears below the widget as soon as one puts the mouse over it or selects it) saying "[application_name] is trying to play sound". For 10.10, I think it would be worth exploring a standard way for the indicators to say what that urgent bit of news is. It would be nice if a solution to that problem could be consistent with the message indicator (which currently does not highlight new messages in a particularly obvious fashion). Another thing to ponder, consistency-wise, is the Me menu where we have a selected radio button icon for the current status (which directly relates to the indicator's icon), and the Rhythmbox status indicator which, when music is playing, says what is playing via a disabled menu item at the top of its menu. Bye! Dylan ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Restart required indicator
On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 16:17 -0400, Jim Rorie wrote: > Could you not use red arrows like the blue ones in the messaging > indicator? I was going to ask about those arrows. I found them confusing at first, because often a horizontal arrow of that shape implies that there is a rolled up menu under it. Would it not be better to have dots indicating activity? > > > On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 14:41 -0500, Ted Gould wrote: > > On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 20:19 +0100, David Balch wrote: > > > A further refinement would be to make the "Restart required..." text > > > in the menu red as well, to tie the meaning of the icon colour to the > > > menu action... > > > > The current theming system makes that unrealistic. The application can > > provide icon names, so that the icons match the theme, but we can't > > provide text color names. So if we changed the text color to red it > > could be placed on something like a red background and be invisible. > > > > --Ted > > > > ___ > > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > > Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net > > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > > > ___ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Restart required indicator
On 29/03/10 22:21, Dylan McCall wrote: > For example, when the volume applet turns red while muted (an > excellent little touch!), it isn't actually clear why it is red. For the record, it should only glow red when music starts playing and it's muted, then it should go back to the default, pared-back look. Being muted is not an alert. Having music start playing while muted, is. > For 10.10, I think it would be worth exploring a standard way for the > indicators to say what that urgent bit of news is. > This is tricky. We're trying to find an appropriate icon, but an icon won't always fit in the menu (there may already be an icon there). Mark signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Ayatana] [Concept suggestion] About the new possibilities for the top right window buttons on the new Ubuntu visual
Hallo guys, I just saw a great work from a FOSS community designer exploring the new possibilities for the top right window buttons on the new Ubuntu visual, and wanted to share the info with Ayatana team, since I think the concept is really interesting and a really good idea, and it explore very well the idea that Mr. Shuttleworth talked about on his blog post. w w w . design-by-izo . com/2010/03/29/workflow-and-upload-two-new-button-concepts-for-lucid/ izobalax . deviantart . com/journal/31172874/ And some of my own suggestion based on his (Izo) concept: "I would even go beyond: With the upload button, we could be able to upload to any place on the computer (path), and, to any machine on the local network too. Give not only function to online upload, but local too, would save a lot of time and improve productivity. And imagine the workflow improvement for a design team working with the same files for example, what do you think? Everything customizable by the user, which places he/she preffer, etc." -- kernel_script ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Restart required indicator
On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 16:17 -0400, Jim Rorie wrote: > Could you not use red arrows like the blue ones in the messaging > indicator? Yes, icons would be fine. We should probably come up with something more holistic as was mentioned in another fork of this thread. I'm not sure that "Application Running" and "Restart Required" are really similar enough to warrant the same graphic. I guess you could look at it as "Attention Required" but that's not really the point of the ones in the messaging menu today. --Ted signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] [Concept suggestion] About the new possibilities for the top right window buttons on the new Ubuntu visual
Hallo menschen ! :) I *love* your proposal... I'm not kidding you, I really love it, you know : it's a brand new feature, a perfect mix between innovation and performance, able to enhance usability whatever the task that is realized, hence the workflow that has to be followed. The only thing is : why do we move the window control buttons to do this ? This kind of new control could be added beside the control buttons, even located on the right side of the bar. Or added on the left side of the bar. Especially in Lucid, where the "freed up space" is not used yet... :/ Bye, Yann kernel_script a écrit : > Hallo guys, > > I just saw a great work from a FOSS community designer exploring the new > possibilities for the top right window buttons on the new Ubuntu visual, > and wanted to share the info with Ayatana team, since I think the > concept is really interesting and a really good idea, and it explore > very well the idea that Mr. Shuttleworth talked about on his blog post. > > w w w . design-by-izo . > com/2010/03/29/workflow-and-upload-two-new-button-concepts-for-lucid/ > > izobalax . deviantart . com/journal/31172874/ > > And some of my own suggestion based on his (Izo) concept: > > "I would even go beyond: With the upload button, we could be able to > upload to any place on the computer (path), and, to any machine on the > local network too. Give not only function to online upload, but local > too, would save a lot of time and improve productivity. And imagine the > workflow improvement for a design team working with the same files for > example, what do you think? Everything customizable by the user, which > places he/she preffer, etc." > ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
