Re: [Ayatana] mail indicator not consistency

2010-07-06 Thread Philipp Wendler 
Hi,

Am 06.07.2010 08:41, schrieb Mark Shuttleworth:
> Interesting questions. My gut feel would be:
> 
>  - incoming IM notifications would be suppressed
>  - incoming calls would be displayed

Why the latter? When I put my cellphone in DND (or silence) mode,
nothing is signaled: no calls, no SMS, no VoIP calls, no IM. I think a
PC should behave similarly.

Greetings, Philipp

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Re: [Ayatana] Unity launcher - will an autohide option be available?

2010-07-06 Thread Diego Moya 
On 5 July 2010 19:03, Liam Wilson wrote:
> Now, I know that the titlebar and menu items will be located in the panel in 
> the future, which does save a lot of vertical screen space, but horizontal 
> screen space in important too, and one major annoyance of mine is that 
> Websites now don't fit horizontally on a 1024x600 resolution without having 
> to scroll, and I feel that having a auto-hide option, at least, that 
> re-appears when the mouse cursor is placed on the left hand edge of the 
> screen (like MeeGo), would solve this.

I agree with the auto-hide to save screen space, but having it
reappear on proximity would be a pain - it shares space with most web
pages navigation bar, so it would often get in the middle of browsing.

A better option for a hidden bar is the one supported by Firefox
Mobile ("Fennec"). The button bar is placed just outside the visible
screen, and it is shown by dragging the screen to the right. This
could be implemented in Unity with a finger gesture in multi-touch
screens, or by dragging the panel in mouse or single-touch interfaces.

But alas, the design of the Unity launcher seems to be based on an
always visible bar. If this is true, it doesn't take the problem of
1024px-wide webpages into account.

http://design.canonical.com/2010/06/introduction-to-unity-launcher/

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Re: [Ayatana] Unity launcher - will an autohide option be available?

2010-07-06 Thread Anzan Hoshin Roshi 
OpenOffice is also unusable due to the launcher on the 7 inch original Eee.

On 6 July 2010 04:51, Diego Moya  wrote:

> On 5 July 2010 19:03, Liam Wilson wrote:
> > Now, I know that the titlebar and menu items will be located in the panel
> in the future, which does save a lot of vertical screen space, but
> horizontal screen space in important too, and one major annoyance of mine is
> that Websites now don't fit horizontally on a 1024x600 resolution without
> having to scroll, and I feel that having a auto-hide option, at least, that
> re-appears when the mouse cursor is placed on the left hand edge of the
> screen (like MeeGo), would solve this.
>
> I agree with the auto-hide to save screen space, but having it
> reappear on proximity would be a pain - it shares space with most web
> pages navigation bar, so it would often get in the middle of browsing.
>
> A better option for a hidden bar is the one supported by Firefox
> Mobile ("Fennec"). The button bar is placed just outside the visible
> screen, and it is shown by dragging the screen to the right. This
> could be implemented in Unity with a finger gesture in multi-touch
> screens, or by dragging the panel in mouse or single-touch interfaces.
>
> But alas, the design of the Unity launcher seems to be based on an
> always visible bar. If this is true, it doesn't take the problem of
> 1024px-wide webpages into account.
>
> http://design.canonical.com/2010/06/introduction-to-unity-launcher/
>
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-- 
With palm to palm,
Roshi
Latitude, Longitude: 45.4288631, -75.6814395

sudo wakeup -rf
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Re: [Ayatana] Unity launcher - will an autohide option be available?

2010-07-06 Thread David Siegel 
We will certainly have an option to automatically hide the Launcher in
11.04, but for 10.10 I recommend using full screen mode while browsing the
web on smaller netbook screens if you need the extra horizontal space.

David

On Tue, Jul 6, 2010 at 9:51 AM, Diego Moya  wrote:

> On 5 July 2010 19:03, Liam Wilson wrote:
> > Now, I know that the titlebar and menu items will be located in the panel
> in the future, which does save a lot of vertical screen space, but
> horizontal screen space in important too, and one major annoyance of mine is
> that Websites now don't fit horizontally on a 1024x600 resolution without
> having to scroll, and I feel that having a auto-hide option, at least, that
> re-appears when the mouse cursor is placed on the left hand edge of the
> screen (like MeeGo), would solve this.
>
> I agree with the auto-hide to save screen space, but having it
> reappear on proximity would be a pain - it shares space with most web
> pages navigation bar, so it would often get in the middle of browsing.
>
> A better option for a hidden bar is the one supported by Firefox
> Mobile ("Fennec"). The button bar is placed just outside the visible
> screen, and it is shown by dragging the screen to the right. This
> could be implemented in Unity with a finger gesture in multi-touch
> screens, or by dragging the panel in mouse or single-touch interfaces.
>
> But alas, the design of the Unity launcher seems to be based on an
> always visible bar. If this is true, it doesn't take the problem of
> 1024px-wide webpages into account.
>
> http://design.canonical.com/2010/06/introduction-to-unity-launcher/
>
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[Ayatana] Arguments for and against top-placement of tabs in Firefox

2010-07-06 Thread David Siegel 
In response to a brooding religious war among contributors over tab
positions in Firefox, Firefox designer Alex Faaborg posts arguments
supporting and challenging the decision to place Firefox tabs on top by
default:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmgtW2Iw-kE

Contributors who are active in the Mozilla community will know that this
debate literally goes back for years. So in some respects this video will
serve as quick summary of all of the different arguments both for an against
the change. But the more interesting part isn't about looking back, it's
about looking forward. Recently modern browsers have been transitioning to
placing tops on top, and that decision isn't arbitrary, it isn't about
fashion. The change to placing tabs on top isn't about one browser versus
another browser, it's about the evolution of the Web as a platform.

It would behoove us to justify contentious design decisions in a similar
fashion.

David
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Re: [Ayatana] Unity launcher - will an autohide option be available?

2010-07-06 Thread Diego Moya 
On 6 July 2010 11:41, David Siegel wrote:

> We will certainly have an option to automatically hide the Launcher in
> 11.04, but for 10.10 I recommend using full screen mode while browsing the
> web on smaller netbook screens if you need the extra horizontal space.
>
> David
>
>
 That's fine and good; it wasn't clear from the "Introduction to Unity
Launcher" article that it would have a hide option nor which would be the
mechanism to show it again.

My previous post was not to criticize the Launcher design, just to
discourage mouse proximity as the method to show the hidden panel, since it
has several drawbacks.
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Re: [Ayatana] Unity launcher - will an autohide option be available?

2010-07-06 Thread Conscious User 

> I agree with the auto-hide to save screen space, but having it
> reappear on proximity would be a pain - it shares space with most web
> pages navigation bar, so it would often get in the middle of browsing.
> 
> A better option for a hidden bar is the one supported by Firefox
> Mobile ("Fennec"). The button bar is placed just outside the visible
> screen, and it is shown by dragging the screen to the right. This
> could be implemented in Unity with a finger gesture in multi-touch
> screens, or by dragging the panel in mouse or single-touch interfaces.

There is another option, which seems to be getting popularity with
upstream Gnome in the moment: momentum-based autohide. Basically,
detecting if the mouse was "thrown" or simply "touched" the edged
based on its acceleration.



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Re: [Ayatana] Unity launcher - will an autohide option be available?

2010-07-06 Thread David Siegel 
Yes, we certainly don't want to use a naive edge proximity criterion to
determine when to show the Launcher once auto-hiding is available. You go to
place your cursor on a portion of a web page near the side of your screen
and BAM the Launcher is in your way!

I like this GNOME suggestion of using momentum, we are already using
similarly nuanced concepts to determine the locus of unfolding before the
cursor intersects the folded Launcher so that the target entry remains under
the cursor even as the Launcher unfolds.

David

On Tue, Jul 6, 2010 at 4:51 PM, Conscious User wrote:

>
> > I agree with the auto-hide to save screen space, but having it
> > reappear on proximity would be a pain - it shares space with most web
> > pages navigation bar, so it would often get in the middle of browsing.
> >
> > A better option for a hidden bar is the one supported by Firefox
> > Mobile ("Fennec"). The button bar is placed just outside the visible
> > screen, and it is shown by dragging the screen to the right. This
> > could be implemented in Unity with a finger gesture in multi-touch
> > screens, or by dragging the panel in mouse or single-touch interfaces.
>
> There is another option, which seems to be getting popularity with
> upstream Gnome in the moment: momentum-based autohide. Basically,
> detecting if the mouse was "thrown" or simply "touched" the edged
> based on its acceleration.
>
>
>
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Re: [Ayatana] Yet another discussion on window resizing - where does the problem lie?

2010-07-06 Thread Bob Hazard 
> I like how Windows 7 allows placing a vertical rectangle size for
> reading documents by dragging the window to a border, although it
> doesn't always find the best fit.
>

I think the new version of Compiz 0.9 that was released the other day
has preliminary support for this. Although it is still a developer
version because they have completely rewritten Compiz in C++

> Say I'm reading a webpage and I want the window to show exactly the
> article text, but not the navigation and advertisement bars.

I use Instapaper for this.  I have a bookmarklet in Chromium in which
works a bit like Readability and strips out everything except the meat
of the article and formats it to my preference.

http://www.instapaper.com/text

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Re: [Ayatana] CSD and the pressure to innovate

2010-07-06 Thread Apoorva Sharma 
Since tabs in firefox and nautilus are just ways of combining multiple windows 
into one, why not have the window manager handle tabs for all apps? Maybe apps 
like firefox or nautilus etc could tell the window manager that they want 
tabbed windows, and it could be done for them. This would make tabbed 
interfaces consistent and more easily read for integration with the taskbar 
(like win7). 

Just a thought.

On Jul 5, 2010, at 2:07 AM, Mark Shuttleworth  wrote:

> On 04/07/10 11:54, Sense Hofstede wrote:
>> The mock-ups for Firefox 4 seem also to be using CSD. That's the only
>> way I can think of to get that menu up there in the title bar.
>> 
>> 
> 
> Indeed. Again, if we have a consistent solution for the things they are
> trying to address, we can reasonably expect them to adopt it if they
> want to be a default option on Ubuntu.
> 
> Mark
> 
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Re: [Ayatana] CSD and the pressure to innovate

2010-07-06 Thread Philipp Wendler 
Hello,

Am 07.07.2010 04:52, schrieb Apoorva Sharma:
> Since tabs in firefox and nautilus are just ways of combining
> multiple windows into one, why not have the window manager handle
> tabs for all apps? Maybe apps like firefox or nautilus etc could tell
> the window manager that they want tabbed windows, and it could be
> done for them. This would make tabbed interfaces consistent and more
> easily read for integration with the taskbar (like win7).

How would you handle the advanced application-specific features related
to tabs? In Firefox for example, there are quite a few actions when you
right-click on the tab bar:
- reload tab
- make tab into a bookmark
- undo tab closing

Also there are a lot of extension that would not be possible to use
anymore. I use ChromaTabs (colors the background of the tab button in
the tab bar according to the favicon to make it easier to locate the
tab) and PermaTabs (prevents accidental closing of certain marked tabs).
And when you look on addons.mozilla.org for addons in the category tabs,
there are 433 of them. I doubt that it will be possible to implement
them if the window manager manages the tabs.

Greetings, Philipp

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