Re: [Ayatana] Mosaic Snap feature for Natty

[Marco Biscaro]

Actually, this is easily configurable on ccsm (grid plugin). Maybe the
*default* behaviour could be discussed here, but the feature is already
implemented.

On Dom, 2011-03-13 at 19:42 -0300, klevi...@gmail.com wrote:
> You know, Snap (or Aero Snap) is a great feature and very useful
> indeed, but it's too Windows 7-like and I think we can make it
> better. 
> 
> If we are implementing (say, copying) a feature, we can't make it the
> same way they did. That's why I think there are some features to be
> included.
> 
> 
> There are windows that doesn't need to be maximized, nor need to take
> a half of the screen (say, like an update-manager "downloading"
> dialog). 
> 
> Let's say you have three windows that need your attention: A game
> you're playing with a gamepad (so that you can play it with other
> window focused), an IM chat and the IM online list. 
> 
> Then you move the game to the very edge of the screen and it will
> resize to only take a quarter of the screen, move the instant
> messaging window to the other edge of the screen, so that the two
> first windows take only half of the screen and the last one you move
> to the left-side of the screen, it should take the other half of the
> screen."
> The final result should look like this:
> 
> 
> Mockup.png
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Re: [Ayatana] Redundant information on window "bar"?

[Marco Biscaro]

If you are talking about the text on title bar, it is there by design
(because when you are working with non-maximized windows, you need to
know where and what are each of them).

On Dom, 2011-03-13 at 22:48 -0600, Ian Santopietro wrote:
> I do agree somewhat, though it is useful for finding the identity of
> non-focused windows. 
> 
> On Mar 13, 2011 10:35 PM, "Jarlath Reidy" 
> wrote:
> > After using Unity for the last week or so, the cleanliness and focus
> of the
> > desktop makes an eyesore of anything unnecessary or out of place.
> > Subjective, I know - but in the screenshot below, should the window
> bar not
> > be textless?
> 
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Re: [Ayatana] Animation Speeds in Unity.

[Marco Biscaro]

Well, the animation time of Expo (workspace zooming) is 0.3 seconds by
default. The animation time of minimizing is 0.22 seconds. I don't think
that this makes difference in pratice.

Although I don't realize any slow effect, the animation times can be
configured using ccsm (but I think that the current values are good to
be the default ones).

On Dom, 2011-03-13 at 21:44 -0400, Saleel Velankar wrote:
> I just jumped on unity//natty alpha3. And one of my current painpoints
> is the animation speeds. While the animations themselves are nice and
> smooth several of them take rather too long. This is complexed by the
> problem that several of the animations are on things that have to be
> accessed repeatedly.
> 
> Ex: workspaces zooming in and out. I use workspaces a lot. no, a ton. 
> >sidebar: there is a lot of screenspace being wasted on the background
> as well, whats with the fat black background//borders?
> 
> Ex: Multiple windows expose
> >sidebar: this double click action took me some time to discover, and
> was really frustrating, when swtiching between 2 windows of the same
> application.
> 
> In my opinion these animations need to be as fast as the one where the
> window becomes maximized/unmaximized.
> 
> -- 
> Saleel 
> 
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Re: [Ayatana] Unity Dash Mockup

[Marco Biscaro]

The mockups look like good. It's a suggestion for dash navigation (that
does not exist yet). It's similar to USC navigation, and doing it this
way is really nice for consistency.

However, it's too late for Natty. The dash navigation will be designed
and implemented only for Natty+1.

On Seg, 2011-03-14 at 09:00 +, Muhammad Nabil wrote:
> View the mockups here:
> 
> http://i.imgur.com/MoBCJ.png
> http://i.imgur.com/HBW9k.png
> http://i.imgur.com/xo8TT.png
> 
> Just my 25 cents!



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Re: [Ayatana] Double side springboard! The video.

[Marco Biscaro]

It looks like nice. Very nice. Very, very nice! This could be included
as an extra for Unity (the feature could be enabled or disabled via
ccsm, for example).

On Ter, 2011-03-15 at 16:18 +0100, andrea azzarone wrote:
> Maybe this is batter than a simple mockup:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RudBG7pfzg&feature=player_embedded
> 
> 
> I have used ubuntu logo as Shortcuts dash, because I just wanted
> to make the idea!
> 
> 
> I hope you like it!
> 
> 
> Andrea Azzarone
> 
> http://www.ubuntusecrets.it
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Re: [Ayatana] Sound theme

[Marco Biscaro]

I think that the initial discussion was about a *sound* theme, wasn't
it?

On Ter, 2011-03-15 at 11:46 -0500, S. Christian Collins wrote:
> On 03/15/2011 09:55 AM, M. Adnan Quaium wrote:
> > We need a new unique set of lucrative cool icon set as well. Neither 
> > the humanity nor a modified version of humanity any more. We need 
> > completely new set of unique icon, which must be way cooler than 
> > FAENZA. Does anybody know anything about new icon project or is there 
> > any work going on?
> 
> I disagree that Ubuntu needs a new icon set; the current one looks 
> unique and high-quality.  I think a new sound theme is more important; 
> the old sound theme doesn't really seem to fit with the new visual style.
> 
> -~Chris
> 
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Re: [Ayatana] Sound theme

[Marco Biscaro]

I think that these sounds are better than the default Ubuntu's theme.
Some comments:

1. At moment, they are consistent. We must ensure that the theme will
keep consistent, as long as new sounds are added.

2. The sounds are not normalized. Imagine: the user logs in and the
login sound is too loud. He decreases the system's sound and opens the
instant messenger. Now, he can't hear the notification sounds.

3. The logout sound is much long. When a user click on 'Log out', he
wants that this happens instantly (and not wait 7 seconds until the
sound stops playing).

4. The suggested name is great! CommUnity +1.

On Ter, 2011-03-15 at 15:17 -0500, S. Christian Collins wrote:
> On 03/15/2011 01:24 PM, S. Christian Collins wrote: 
> > Having listened to all of the sound theme submissions (and submitted
> > one myself), I'm not sure that any one submission is a perfect sound
> > set, and unfortunately, some are not very professional.  I think
> > OisinLunny's startup sounds are absolutely wonderful, and really
> > carry the affect of "light".  If the job were up to me, and I had to
> > use only sounds that were part of the current submissions, I would
> > do the following:
> > ...
> > Give me an hour and I can put this together.
> Here it is: http://www.mediafire.com/?mnnlem3iio715ok
> 
> Based on the works of multiple submissions, this sound theme is truly
> a community effort, which is why I gave it the name "CommUnity".  Of
> course, the capitalized "Unity" references the new Ubuntu desktop
> interface by the same name :)
> 
> What do you guys think?  Is this not better than the current Ubuntu
> soundset?
> -~Chris
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Re: [Ayatana] Indicator-sound and highlighting the track on mouseover

[Marco Biscaro]

Nice idea about the notify bubble! +1

At moment, this functionality is really impossible to discover...

On Dom, 2011-03-27 at 15:54 -0600, Ian Santopietro wrote:
> A perfect example: I had no idea that existed. Thanks, by the way.
> 
> What about aiding discoverability? We could add a notify OSD bubble
> with something like, "Current track information copied to clipboard." 
> 
> On Mar 27, 2011 2:15 PM, "Conscious User" 
> wrote:
> > 
> > It is interactive: when you click on it, the track information is
> > copied to the clipboard and you can paste it somewhere else.
> > 
> > Whether this is useful, specially considering discoverability, is
> > a different discussion. In my personal opinion... well, no.
> > 
> > 
> > Le samedi 26 mars 2011 à 15:32 -0400, Brett Cornwall a écrit :
> >> Hello, I have been wondering for some time - is there a particular 
> >> reason for having the "now playing" text fields in the sound
> indicator 
> >> highlighted on mouseover? It gives the impression that it's an 
> >> interactive item but it's merely there for displaying information.
> Would 
> >> it not make more sense to have no mouseover highlight?
> >> 
> >> screenshot: http://ubuntuone.com/p/jax/
> >> 
> >> If yes, should I report a bug? I wanted to check to make sure
> there's no 
> >> design decision including this behavior first.
> >> 
> >> Thank you.
> >> 
> > 
> > 
> > 
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Re: [Ayatana] Is the Minimize window-button really needed?

[Marco Biscaro]

On Sex, 2011-04-01 at 09:31 -0400, nick rundy wrote:

> After all, the user can simply click the Launcher Icon to "minimize"
> that window, right? So the user isn't losing this capability.


When minimizing, you "say" to the window: get out my face, I need to do
something else and do not want you disturbing. And this can be done with
one click: the minimize button. It's always on window decoration, a
place that is easy to find and access.

Imagine the following situation: a big screen, with launcher auto
hiding. If I want to minimize a windows, all I have to do is click on
minimize button. But, if using your proposed solution, I'll need:


 1. Move the cursor to top-left edge of screen
 2. Find the icon that represents the window I want to minimize
 3. Click on it


Beside this, how to lead with multiple windows of the same program,
since there is just one launcher? Will the user need to focus the window
and click on launcher icon? But if he clicks on the icon again before
one window is minimized? What should happens?


  * The window should restore?
  * Another window of the same program should be shown?
  * Expose should start?
  * None of the above?


So, answering your question:

How do you guys feel about the idea of omitting the Minimize
window-button?

I didn't like the idea. My vote is to keep it where it is now.
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Re: [Ayatana] New style of Minimize button for Natty

[Marco Biscaro]

Really nice idea. +1

Some questions:
But and about the classic desktop edition? It'll use the same button
than Unity? Or we won't change the metacity theme, but hack Unity to use
the new button?

All themes will use the new icon or just [Amb|Rad]iance?

On Sáb, 2011-04-02 at 11:39 +0200, Ingo Gerth wrote:

> I rarely post here, but I applaud to that one! Cheers!
> 
> 
> On Sat, Apr 2, 2011 at 11:10 AM, James Gifford
>  wrote:
> 
> I love it. +1. 
> 
> 
> Cheers, 
> James Gifford
> http://jamesrgifford.com
> 
> 
> On Apr 2, 2011, at 5:01, "M. Adnan Quaium"
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> > +1
> > 
> > I liked the idea too :)
> > 
> > 
> > On 2 April 2011 10:22, Luke Benstead 
> > wrote:
> > 
> > On 2 April 2011 09:17, Muhammad Nabil
> >  wrote:
> > > SInce the applications window minimize to the
> > launcher (which on the
> > > left) in Natty Narwhal, how about change the
> > current style of Minimize
> > > button to this :
> > >
> > > http://i.imgur.com/AxKxD.png
> > >
> > > What do you think?
> > > --
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Genius. +1
> > 
> > Luke.
> > 
> > 
> > 
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> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > M. Adnan Quaium
> > 
> > MSc Student
> > Faculty of Electrical Engineering Mathematics and Computer
> > Science
> > Technical University of Delft
> > Mekelweg 4
> > Delft
> > The Netherlands
> > 
> > URL: http://adnan.quaium.com
> > 
> > 
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> 
> 
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> 
> 
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Re: [Ayatana] [Unity Launcher] Mouse hover, click, and active visual states

[Marco Biscaro]

On Seg, 2011-04-11 at 10:43 +0800, Allan Caeg wrote:

> Keyboard-focus has a nice selection highlight, which can be used for
> other purposes like mouse hover. They're very similar anyway. However,
> keyboard-focus could also use the tooltip that tells the user the name
> of the app he's currently focusing on. Maybe, both hover and
> keyboard-focus can use the combination of highlight and tooltip.

I think that it's a good idea. It will provide a better feedback of what
is happening (and about the tooltip on keyboard navigation, it will help
on accessibility). About the home button, the pressed state is already
implemented, but is waiting approval from design team (see
https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/748676).


> There are also missing button states like when an app icon is clicked
> and when doing "Scale" for one app. On OS X, clicking an app icon on
> the dock will make the icon dark and "Scale" for one app will make all
> other app icons dark. We don't have to do it the way OS X does it, but
> there should be visual representations of these states.
> 

I think this is less important than the first point, but it's another
thing to consider. Maybe the first problem can be solved to natty, but
the scale toggle, for example, can be targeted only for oneiric.

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Re: [Ayatana] Fwd: [Bug 733349] Re: Natty: Unity launcher buttons should allow to minimize apps, not just launch/restore

[Marco Biscaro]

Ian, I think you're right.

applications != windows

An application can have zero or more windows. I think the question here
is consistency:

If your application has just one window, when you click on the launcher
icon, this window will minimize. But if you have 3 opened windows to
that application? What should happen when you click the launcher icon
if:

1. All windows are visible?
2. Two windows are visible and one is already minimized?
3. One window is visible and two are already minimized?
4. All windows are minimized?

Considering that there is just one icon per application, I think the
best way to minimize a window is to click the minimize button of that
window. If I'm not mistaken, this why clicking on launcher icons doesn't
minimize windows.

Besides this, If you want to organize your windows, you can use the
workspaces to arrange them. And use +D to show desktop if needed.

On Ter, 2011-04-19 at 07:30 -0600, Ian Santopietro wrote:

> It was my understanding that the launcher  icons only represent apps,
> and since an app can't really be minimized (only windows of that app),
> they don't do it.  It works with Gnome 2 because the list was a list
> of windows. It would be clicking on a Gnome 2 shortcut and having the
> windows of that app minimize.
> 
> I might be wrong here though.
> 
> 
> On Apr 19, 2011 7:19 AM, "Bazon"  wrote:
> >  Original Message 
> > Subject: [Bug 733349] Re: Natty: Unity launcher buttons should allow
> to 
> > minimize apps, not just launch/restore
> > Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 07:45:08 -
> > From: Michael <733...@bugs.launchpad.net>
> > Reply-To: Bug 733349 <733...@bugs.launchpad.net>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > > I'm sure that if you ask on the Ayatana mailing list they will be
> happy
> > 
> >> to explain, and perhaps to discuss, the reasoning.
> > 
> > 
> > OK, so here we go:
> > Why isn't it possible any more to minimize windows when clicking a
> further time on the button which represents the application?
> > That was possible with the Gnome Panel Window Switcher, it is
> possible in the XFCE taskbar, it is possible in Cairo-Dock, it is
> possible with the MS Windows taskbar and probably many more.
> > 
> > So why break users expectations?
> > You leave the experienced user in frustration while the
> inexperienced user will not be mocked by minimizing on an extra click
> he probably never makes.
> > (Showing and hiding a window quick by clicking two times on the
> icon/switcher is a very common practice.)
> > 
> > I believe it's generally not a good idea that clicking on an
> interactive element of your screen leads to NOTHING.
> > 
> > Some users will wonder whether their system is responding slow,
> experienced users who are used to the minimize behaviour will miss it.
> > (and you know, many of them are already frustrated enough losing
> Gnome 2 features.)
> > 
> > 
> > So please reconsider allowing minimizing windows by clicking on the
> launcher.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >>
> > -- 
> >>
> >>
> > You received this bug notification because you are a direct
> subscriber
> > of the bug.
> > https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/733349
> > 
> > Title:
> > Natty: Unity launcher buttons should allow to minimize apps, not
> just
> > launch/restore
> > 
> > To unsubscribe from this bug, go to:
> > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-design/+bug/733349/+subscribe
> > 
> > 
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Re: [Ayatana] [Bug 733349] Unity launcher buttons should allow to minimize apps

[Marco Biscaro]

I think this is not implemented beacuse the lack of consistency.

Most users will have just one window of each application opened at same
time. So, they will conclude that a click on launcher will minimize the
window. When they open two windows of the same application and click the
icon, the window(s) will not be minimized (so, a lot of bugs will be
reported - something like: 'sometimes the minimize does not work!!!').

IMO, this will just confuse users...

On Ter, 2011-04-19 at 16:45 +0200, Xavier Guillot wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> IMHO, I'd like that if only 1 windows of an application is opened and
> visible, click on the dock icon minimizes it, too.
> 
> When more than 1 window is open, whether are they all visible or not,
> click on the icon should display the miniatures of all windows, like
> it does now, but put on the right side / bottom the current window,
> and show on the top left the other ones - if we want to switch to
> another window, the best is to have less mouse movement to do, so
> having the other one(s) very close to the dock, for the moment it is
> not the case...
> 
> Xavier.
> 
> On 19/04/2011 16:15, Marco Biscaro wrote: 
> 
> > Ian, I think you're right.
> > 
> > applications != windows
> > 
> > An application can have zero or more windows. I think the question
> > here is consistency:
> > 
> > If your application has just one window, when you click on the
> > launcher icon, this window will minimize. But if you have 3 opened
> > windows to that application? What should happen when you click the
> > launcher icon if:
> > 
> > 1. All windows are visible?
> > 2. Two windows are visible and one is already minimized?
> > 3. One window is visible and two are already minimized?
> > 4. All windows are minimized?
> > 
> > Considering that there is just one icon per application, I think the
> > best way to minimize a window is to click the minimize button of
> > that window. If I'm not mistaken, this why clicking on launcher
> > icons doesn't minimize windows.
> > 
> > Besides this, If you want to organize your windows, you can use the
> > workspaces to arrange them. And use +D to show desktop if
> > needed.
> > 
> > On Ter, 2011-04-19 at 07:30 -0600, Ian Santopietro wrote:
> > 
> > > It was my understanding that the launcher  icons only represent
> > > apps, and since an app can't really be minimized (only windows of
> > > that app), they don't do it.  It works with Gnome 2 because the
> > > list was a list of windows. It would be clicking on a Gnome 2
> > > shortcut and having the windows of that app minimize.
> > > 
> > > I might be wrong here though.
> > > 
> > > On Apr 19, 2011 7:19 AM, "Bazon"  wrote:
> > > >  Original Message 
> > > > Subject: [Bug 733349] Re: Natty: Unity launcher buttons should
> > > allow to 
> > > > minimize apps, not just launch/restore
> > > > Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 07:45:08 -
> > > > From: Michael <733...@bugs.launchpad.net>
> > > > Reply-To: Bug 733349 <733...@bugs.launchpad.net>
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > > I'm sure that if you ask on the Ayatana mailing list they will
> > > be happy
> > > > 
> > > >> to explain, and perhaps to discuss, the reasoning.
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > OK, so here we go:
> > > > Why isn't it possible any more to minimize windows when clicking
> > > a further time on the button which represents the application?
> > > > That was possible with the Gnome Panel Window Switcher, it is
> > > possible in the XFCE taskbar, it is possible in Cairo-Dock, it is
> > > possible with the MS Windows taskbar and probably many more.
> > > > 
> > > > So why break users expectations?
> > > > You leave the experienced user in frustration while the
> > > inexperienced user will not be mocked by minimizing on an extra
> > > click he probably never makes.
> > > > (Showing and hiding a window quick by clicking two times on the
> > > icon/switcher is a very common practice.)
> > > > 
> > > > I believe it's generally not a good idea that clicking on an
> > > interactive element of your screen leads to NOTHING.
> > > > 
> > > > Some users will wonder whether their system is responding slow,
> > > experienced users who are used to the minimize behaviour will miss
> > > it.
> > > > (and you know, many of them are already frustrated enough losing
> > > Gnome 2 features.)
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > So please reconsider allowing minimizing windows by clicking on
> > > the launcher.
> 
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Re: [Ayatana] Fwd: [Bug 733349] Re: Natty: Unity launcher buttons should allow to minimize apps, not just launch/restore

[Marco Biscaro]

> Ah, don't talk about workspaces, I loved them and suffer still from
> breaking their usability enough already
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/689733 and
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-design/+bug/683170
> And "show desktop" deserves its own button IMHO   ...(just as
> before)
> 

If this problem is solved, workspaces can help a lot (and I think it's
easy to solve). About the show desktop button: completly agree.
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Re: [Ayatana] Fwd: [Bug 733349] Re: Natty: Unity launcher buttons should allow to minimize apps, not just launch/restore

[Marco Biscaro]

On Ter, 2011-04-19 at 21:17 +0100, Jorge Ortega wrote:

> Still more: all the indicators on the top right corner. You click one
> and it shows, click again and it hides. And this is how it should be.
> 
> 
> On 19 April 2011 21:12, Bazon  wrote:
> 
> Additionally, the Dash works exactly that way: 
> First click: show
> Next click: hide
> 
> This works for all Dashes, the Ubuntu-Logo-Dash, the
> Applications-Dash and the Files-and-Folders-Dash - why not for
> the other symbols on the launcher?
> 
> So much for consistency.
> 
> 

It's very simple: there is one dash to one launcher icon. The same for
indicators: one menu for each indicator.

Again, the problem with launcher icons is: each application can have
zero or more windows.

On GNOME desktop and on Windows, a click on the panel/taskbar minimize
the window because each window has an "button" on panel/taskbar.

Instead of just criticize the current design, why don't you write a
specification and mockups to propose changes? They can be discussed
here, on the mailing list, and implemented for Oneiric (it's too late to
changes for Natty).

All kind of improvements are welcome, but we need something concrete and
well defined. :-)

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Re: [Ayatana] the launcher should integrate it self with the color of the top panel

[Marco Biscaro]

There is a bug reported for this: 
https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/711982


On 25-05-2011 08:57, cyrildz wrote:

Hi all
  I love more and more Radiance, but what bugs me is the launcher.  
its color doesn't go well with the top panel ones.


for more integration it would be good if the launcher's color could 
align itself with the top panel  color.



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Re: [Ayatana] Modal Dialog: Background

[Marco Biscaro]

> Why don't we go with blur instead?

I think that it's because blur is *slow* in a lot of hardwares. If I
enable static blur effect for dash, it tooks about 3 or 4 seconds to
open.

With a maximized window, I think the delay will be noticeable too.

Anyway, I agree that this white overlay is ugly...


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Re: [Ayatana] New Alt-Tab

[Marco Biscaro]

Sure, nice idea. +1

2011/7/28 Alex Launi 

> I love this. It really just makes alt-tab a keybinding for features we
> already have. Very clean, very simple, and enhances the idioms we've already
> started developing.
>
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Re: [Ayatana] What about the Dash on Oneiric Ocelot ?

[Marco Biscaro]

I think they have plans to change, at least, the home screen: 
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/785840


This bug report is targeted to oneiric. Maybe we get some other changes 
too...


Em 03-08-2011 17:32, seb...@free.fr escreveu:

Thanks for your response guys. It's very interesting. :)

My last question still on the air :
Have Canonical a plan to modify the current Dash ? ( i supose yes but what ? 
when ? How ? ). ;)

Thanks,
Sebastien Lemarinel
- Mail original -
De: "Carl Ansell"
À: anthropor...@gmail.com
Cc:
Envoyé: Mercredi 3 Août 2011 21:04:15
Objet: Re: [Ayatana] What about the Dash on Oneiric Ocelot ?



I would think that there is no need for a frequent apps section at all. The 
apps I use most are on the launcher anyway, so it is wasted space at the top of 
the dash.


It definitely needs to be more configurable, and surely the 'find files' and 
'more applications' could be replaced as they can be found in the launcher? I 
would think 'games' would be a good thing to put there, it would make it clear 
to potential new users that you can play games on a Linux system, which is 
often believed to not be the case.



Something that is needed badly is the ability to edit dash entries with the 
menu editor style application you mentioned. System applications that run in 
the background do not need to be in the dash, and some applications install an 
entry for sudo and non sudo operation. There also needs to be a way of 
customising the dash on a per-user basis.



Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2011 12:17:51 -0400
From: anthropor...@gmail.com
To: holyknightjos...@gmail.com
CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net
Subject: Re: [Ayatana] What about the Dash on Oneiric Ocelot ?

I strongly support your mockup, or something similar. At a minimum I'd appreciate the ability to separate out 
what the system determines is " frequent " and what I explicitly " pin ". Moreover, as 
for "frequent" apps, places, or files, Zeitgeist also seems to have a short memory span (maybe a 
week?).

Another core feature I would to see in Unity is the fundamental ability to 
toggle between a desktop/laptop mode , and a tablet/netbook mode . I will never 
ever use the latter or any touch-oriented features, so I don't need huge icons 
anywhere in the interface. Really, I don't even need any touch-oriented stuff 
even loaded into memory at boot, so if this could be akin to recompiling your 
kernel more than toggling between different things always resident in memory, 
that'd be great.

Really, if I could just assign every app a short nickname in the Main Menu 
editor, I don't need to see the Icon and the name, so I'd like to be able to 
customize the desktop/laptop mode to restore as much screen real estate as 
possible, by choosing to see either icons, nicknames (not lengthy full names), 
or both, just as toolbars in many apps currently do.

(To restore some screen real estate I'm currently using a compact Nautilus drop-down 
indicator for places and the Cardapio menu for "pinned" apps. Prior to that I'd 
hacked a static Quicklist to have my pinned apps, with the least possible amount of 
screen real estate used for each text-only entry in the list. I just need something my 
pointer can hit, which doesn't require much space at all.)

Another point of contention: if I could get all of the Springboard 
functionality into the Dash AND disable the Springboard altogether, that would 
be perfect. I don't use the apps and places lenses, I don't pin launchers to 
this dock, and the current window -switching functionality of launchers is not 
intuitive. The window (not app or workspace) switching capability of both the 
Gnome 2 Talika applet (you had to get this through a PPA) and Windows 7 is more 
intuitive to me, but I suppose hovering over a launcher to pop out a 
mini-window showing all current windows of a given app clashes with Quicklists? 
In any event, I'd rather have all switching stuff (windows, apps, and 
workspaces) moved to separate pages of the Dash, docks are just clutter.

Alas, before that happens, it would be nice if bug #807141 was fixed, since 
Ubuntu now relies so heavily on Unity and Compiz. Currently my Dash 
intermittenly stacks behind other windows, making it useless. The Compiz 
maintainer states that stacking issues are near impossible to triage. If that 
is the case, it's unfortunate that Canonical hitched their wagon so readily to 
such a window manager. If you can't see a core piece of the user interface, 
that is pretty much a showstopper, especially in an LTS release.

I'd love for the Dash to A) be the center of attention, B) be configurable and 
C) work without issue though, as I think it's a good paradigm in general if its 
design potential is fully realized and the bugs are resolved.




On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Josh Strawbridge<  holyknightjos...@gmail.com>  
wrote:


i had a lot of the same thoughts a few weeks ago and i drew up a mock up of 
what i thought dash should be.



dash is very keyboard friendly

Re: [Ayatana] Two dimensional launcher?

[Marco Biscaro]

Do you mean something like Mac OS' Stacks? 
http://toastytech.com/guis/osx15stacksfan.png


Em 17-11-2011 06:15, Simon C(opi escreveu:
There is not a lot of place to launch applications from launcher. I 
don't like that movable (scrolling) launcher to much. And searching 
for an application is also time consuming. For me is better to have a 
tool (an application icon) on a fixed, memorized position. Not at an 
movable scrolling place. If your wife move your hammer 1 meter away 
from place you  you've left it, how many time you need to find it (if 
you have a lot of tools on a table)?


How about to make 2 dimensional launcher like:

B
B
*B B B B B B B* (configurable second dimension)
B
B
B
B
B
B

(B is button, application icon)

That means to add special button(s) and configure it (drag drop?) to 
show desired buttons in a row. So we can launch more applications 
without scroll or search. All desired icons can be 1 move (to show 
launcher and activate second dimension with just move over special 
button) + 1 click away.  Row is invisible unless it is activated, only 
special button is visible. So launcher it could be scrollable as it 
is, plus 2 dimensional.


So the point is that i would like to find a tool on a place where i 
left it.


I hope it is understandable what i wrote. I am far from perfect in 
this language.


Simon




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Re: [Ayatana] Closer Unity

[Marco Biscaro]

Em 27-11-2011 10:19, Davor escreveu:

Any position
 - Double center click - something very usefull like - opens (and 
closes) custom dash(keep reading) or launcher

 - Hold center click + left click - opens (and closes) window switcher
 - Hold center click + right click - opens (and closes) workspace 
switcher
 - Hold center click + mouse move left then down - minimize all 
windows (show desktop)

 - Hold center click + mouse move right then up - restore all windows

Window area
 - Center click + move up - maximize window
 - Center click + move down - minimize window
 - Center click + move right - next window
 - Center click + move left - previous window

All shortcuts that includes center click are hard to use on a device 
that has no mouse (notebooks, netbooks and touch devices).


I think it needs more serious look.

Colored background is good to show that is active icon (mouse over or 
currently opened application).

Other icons backgrounds should have the SAME color.

Maybe when mouse is not over launcher, it could be dimmed or little 
more transparent.



Agree. See this bug report: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/753969

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Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom

[Marco Biscaro]

Em 29-11-2011 15:45, Swapnil Bhartiya escreveu:

On 11/29/2011 05:55 PM, Christian Rupp wrote:
I know it was discussed several times, but a plug-in finally got it 
working:

http://www.webupd8.org/2011/11/install-ubuntu-unity-bottom-launcher.html

Should we include it in one of ubuntu next releases as a easy to
activate option


On second thoughts I believe, it's a good idea (gives some 
customisation to users). Once at the bottom it will be just like Apple 
Mac's dock. A good thing may be the option to place the launcher 
anywhere you want - left/right or bottom.


swapnil
I've looked the code and seen that it's another plugin for compiz. This 
means two completly distinct code paths (the official unityshell and the 
unityshell-rotated).


It would be very hard to maintain two distinct plugins in code base. If 
this were an option to the official plugin, the chances of being 
approved in the codebase would be greater. However, I don't know how 
complex it would be to convert this to an option.


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Re: [Ayatana] Unity and Menus

[Marco Biscaro]

GNOME programs (gedit, nautilus) and some Ubuntu programs 
(software-center) follow this approach: menu bar with all options and a 
toolbar with most used actions (in gedit, common edit operations and in 
nautilus/software-center, navigation and search). Those applications are 
single windowed (there are some dialogs, like preferences, but not 
multiple windows).


ubuntuone-control-panel doesn't follow this guidelines. There is no 
menubar, neither toolbar: only a tabbed window. Anyway, this is a 
different kind of application.


Em 22-01-2012 14:06, Ian Santopietro escreveu:


Building on that, it was my understanding that every action should be 
placed in the menu, but that frequently used actions should be echoed 
in a button/toolbar.


On Jan 22, 2012 8:37 AM, "Christian Rupp" > wrote:


Am 21.01.2012 00:39, schrieb Jonathan Meek:

In my spare time, I'm working on creating a traditional windowed
application that will have a menubar. I find it important to
integrate with Unity, leading me to an important question: What
behavior is the best to adopt?

As I see it, there are three options:

 1. I can have windows each have their own specific menubar as
needed and let Unity take it out and put it in the top as is
usual now.
 2. I can push the application to use only one window so that the
menubar becomes a non-issue.
 3. I can work on an application-wide menu.

And for the issues I see with these approaches:

 1. This creates inconsistencies with the launcher being
per-application in its design. The launcher is based on the
application, not on its constituent windows.
 2. Not all applications can force their system into a single
window interface with the limitations of current GTK
technology. (At least to my own satisfaction given the
different models needed for different aspects of the
application.)
 3. The way that Unity currently grabs the menubar from
applications is on a per-window basis. More or less literally
ripping the menubar from the application. This makes any
application-wide menu feel like a hack personally.

I feel like it's obvious which approach I'd prefer, but I'm
interested in feedback in which scenario is the one most in line
with Ubuntu's future. I know that one of the ultimate goals
stated my MPT was to be able to provide a default set of menus
for every application. Then again, we have one of the default
applications forgoing menus altogether (Ubuntu One Control Panel).

So which approach is condoned?

Additional question: What should the nomenclature of menus be?
Are we to adopt the inherited behavior for classic GNOME
applications where the first menu name should be relevant to the
application? (I.E. Rhythmbox's first menu being named "Music", or
Empathy's "Chat")

Or the adopt the newer GNOME behavior that will appear when using
an application on OS X? (I.E. The name of the application being
the first menu [in my opinion alleviating some of the global menu
design issues] found in this link
 from
another recent Ayatana posting.)

Thanks for your time.


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I think this is one of the main problems in the unity design. If
you want to be shure you'll have to wait for the HIG for Ubuntu.
Problem: They won't be finished or partly available in the next
few months.

What I would do:
It depends on the app you are planning...
But I would try to use one window and maybe some small windows for
settings. If you want to be really great you can look up morphing
windows, but I don't have any idea how thei are working, just like
the idea behind them
Also you have to reduce clutter.
If I have understand the idea behind the design of ubuntu: Every
action which is performed regullary should get a button, things
like settings or very rarely used actions should be put in the
menu, but as I said: it depends on the app and on its complexity

Sorry was in a hurry

Christian Rupp

/**/

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Re: [Ayatana] complaints

[Marco Biscaro]

Em 31-01-2012 16:09, Christian Rupp escreveu:


Just currently everybody is waiting for developers who write some 
addons. Case Example: 
http://www.webupd8.org/2011/11/install-ubuntu-unity-bottom-launcher.html

This is not an addon. It's a fork.
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Re: [Ayatana] complaints

[Marco Biscaro]

Em 31-01-2012 17:34, Christian Rupp escreveu:

Yeah but it was written as an add-on in the first version


No, it was a fork too. The difference is that it was distributed as a 
compiled .so file (which replaced the original libunityshell.so).


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