Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
Howdy, I wrote an article for my local computer users group on customizing Ubuntu to make it more pleasant to use. Some of these changes, such as fixing the global menu really make a huge difference. If there is a tweak program in place, I could add some of my fixes(my term), if the maintainer was receptive. Does anyone know how receptive they would be? Ralph ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
Why not provide some levels of abstraction before including tweaking tools in 12.04 so that people who really know, go and change things with appropriate restrictions and warnings :) and let people who dont care or dont know what to do use the highest level of abstraction? that will settle doubts of people ending up with a broken system as well as provide the required customisations. -joy ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
Ok, I just meant take one of this Tools and integrate some parts of it in the system settings, like transparency or icon size... ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
If Ubuntu-Tweak is broken in that manner, then why don't we fix it and include it. I still don't see how your arguments against inclusion are truly valid. For one thing, we can disable the Computer Janitor plugin by default. Furthermore, IIRC, it does not work the same way as the previous one that cause so much confusion and damage for users. Secondly, as for scrolling on items, while that is a valid (if unlikely) problem, the solution is simply to put a button next to options that can scroll that will cause for the option to be reset. That's a super simple fix (it's the same thing you get in CCSM, which IMO should also be included by default after getting some love to make it look better; and should just simply be invisible to users in the menu by default). If you ask me, the only reason why they are not being included is because of the previous problems with space on the CD, which is now a joke because we've switched to DVDs and USBs. I don't think it's particularly true that, Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything. Ubuntu Tweak still offers computer janitor which has been known to confuse many end users, and even further if you hover the mouse pointer in the wrong area in some tweak areas and scroll you can easily change things with no obvious way to restore defaults. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool. I love using it to play with themes in Gnome 3, regardless of DE, but it's far from mature enough to be included in the repos. --- On *Wed, 12/14/11, Roland Taylor /rolandi...@gmail.com/* wrote: From: Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Wednesday, December 14, 2011, 10:17 PM I respectfully disagree. The options that can be tweaked from Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything, and for the most part can be changed on the fly (without restarting that is). There is no reason not to include such a tool by default. On 12/14/2011 05:00 PM, Ian Santopietro wrote: I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana https://launchpad.net/%7Eayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net /mc/compose?to=ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana https://launchpad.net/%7Eayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana https://launchpad.net/%7Eayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net /mc/compose?to=ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana https://launchpad.net/%7Eayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana https://launchpad.net/%7Eayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net /mc/compose?to=ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana https://launchpad.net/%7Eayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
What exactly did you do to make compiz freeze like that? Ubuntu-Tweak itself only changes options that exist with Compiz (as would changing the options via gconf-editor). If compiz froze, it is a problem with Compiz, not with Ubuntu-Tweak. Again, we can simply fix it where it is broken, instead of complaining that it is broken (same argument everyone brings in the case of things like GNOME Shell yes?). As for your last line - I'm lost as to what you mean. On 12/15/2011 01:42 AM, Jo-Erlend Schinstad wrote: Den 14. des. 2011 21:27, skrev Christian Rupp: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? Ubuntu Tweak deserves the attention it is getting, but I hardly think it's ready to even be considered as a default app. Playing with it for less than two minutes, Compiz became completely unresponsive. Of course, I only had to switch to another console and kill it for it to be restarted, but most users would've had to resort to a brutal poweroff. That's not the apps fault, but the result is the same. The GUI needs a fair amount of work. It isn't all bad, but it needs improvements in several areas. For instance each tab uses two different displays, and there is no hint that this is so. This is also not a normal way of doing things. Many of the things in Admins has nothing to do with administration. The Tweaks part does contain several administration things. I also don't really understand what removing old thumbnails has to do with tweaking a system. In my view, the app is promising, but is still a little confused and needs to mature and get a more defined sense of direction. I think the project is quite interesting, and it's possible I'll have something to contribute to it. But I don't see it as a candidate to be a default application. In any case, it'd have to be accepted into Ubuntu first, I think. I don't think these types of settings is for everyone. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
The Gnome 3 (Oneiric and Precise) version of Ubuntu Tweak is alpha 0.6 isn't it? With Precise being LTS almost nothing will be included unless it's either stable (meaning well tested) or very much needed to add stability. Besides that I'd point to you saying, why don't we fix it and include it. Who is we? Canonical? Ubuntu Tweak is not a Canonical project so why would you expect their devs to invest time in improving something that's not part of the Unity project? SABDFL made it clear as far back as introducing 'notify-osd' that GUI modification was not only undesirable, but NOT where the project was headed. But, in keeping with FOSS principles, he has no objection to others doing as they wish with Ubuntu's code ;^) Hence the ease of adding many apps via PPA's supported through Launchpad which is made available only due to the generosity of SABDFL. What's the problem? --- On Sat, 12/17/11, Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com wrote: From: Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak To: Lance lbsol...@yahoo.com Cc: ayatana ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Saturday, December 17, 2011, 2:16 PM If Ubuntu-Tweak is broken in that manner, then why don't we fix it and include it. I still don't see how your arguments against inclusion are truly valid. For one thing, we can disable the Computer Janitor plugin by default. Furthermore, IIRC, it does not work the same way as the previous one that cause so much confusion and damage for users. Secondly, as for scrolling on items, while that is a valid (if unlikely) problem, the solution is simply to put a button next to options that can scroll that will cause for the option to be reset. That's a super simple fix (it's the same thing you get in CCSM, which IMO should also be included by default after getting some love to make it look better; and should just simply be invisible to users in the menu by default). If you ask me, the only reason why they are not being included is because of the previous problems with space on the CD, which is now a joke because we've switched to DVDs and USBs. I don't think it's particularly true that, Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything. Ubuntu Tweak still offers computer janitor which has been known to confuse many end users, and even further if you hover the mouse pointer in the wrong area in some tweak areas and scroll you can easily change things with no obvious way to restore defaults. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool. I love using it to play with themes in Gnome 3, regardless of DE, but it's far from mature enough to be included in the repos. --- On Wed, 12/14/11, Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com wrote: From: Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Wednesday, December 14, 2011, 10:17 PM I respectfully disagree. The options that can be tweaked from Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything, and for the most part can be changed on the fly (without restarting that is). There is no reason not to include such a tool by default. On 12/14/2011 05:00 PM, Ian Santopietro wrote: I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
I think myUnity would be more appropriate than ubuntu-tweak. http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/12/unity-tweak-tool-myunity-gets-new-look-coming-to-ubuntu-software-centre/ Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2011 16:16:24 -0400 From: rolandi...@gmail.com To: lbsol...@yahoo.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak If Ubuntu-Tweak is broken in that manner, then why don't we fix it and include it. I still don't see how your arguments against inclusion are truly valid. For one thing, we can disable the Computer Janitor plugin by default. Furthermore, IIRC, it does not work the same way as the previous one that cause so much confusion and damage for users. Secondly, as for scrolling on items, while that is a valid (if unlikely) problem, the solution is simply to put a button next to options that can scroll that will cause for the option to be reset. That's a super simple fix (it's the same thing you get in CCSM, which IMO should also be included by default after getting some love to make it look better; and should just simply be invisible to users in the menu by default). If you ask me, the only reason why they are not being included is because of the previous problems with space on the CD, which is now a joke because we've switched to DVDs and USBs. I don't think it's particularly true that, Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything. Ubuntu Tweak still offers computer janitor which has been known to confuse many end users, and even further if you hover the mouse pointer in the wrong area in some tweak areas and scroll you can easily change things with no obvious way to restore defaults. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool. I love using it to play with themes in Gnome 3, regardless of DE, but it's far from mature enough to be included in the repos. --- On Wed, 12/14/11, Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com wrote: From: Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Wednesday, December 14, 2011, 10:17 PM I respectfully disagree. The options that can be tweaked from Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything, and for the most part can be changed on the fly (without restarting that is). There is no reason not to include such a tool by default. On 12/14/2011 05:00 PM, Ian Santopietro wrote: I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
I don't think it's particularly true that, Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything. Ubuntu Tweak still offers computer janitor which has been known to confuse many end users, and even further if you hover the mouse pointer in the wrong area in some tweak areas and scroll you can easily change things with no obvious way to restore defaults. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool. I love using it to play with themes in Gnome 3, regardless of DE, but it's far from mature enough to be included in the repos. --- On Wed, 12/14/11, Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com wrote: From: Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Wednesday, December 14, 2011, 10:17 PM I respectfully disagree. The options that can be tweaked from Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything, and for the most part can be changed on the fly (without restarting that is). There is no reason not to include such a tool by default. On 12/14/2011 05:00 PM, Ian Santopietro wrote: I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
On top of that, we will have MyUnity included in the repos for 12.04, so it will be easy to install a Unity tweak tool, and for users who don't know what they're doing, there is no possibility of getting confused or breaking something. On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 03:51, Lance lbsol...@yahoo.com wrote: I don't think it's particularly true that, Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything. Ubuntu Tweak still offers computer janitor which has been known to confuse many end users, and even further if you hover the mouse pointer in the wrong area in some tweak areas and scroll you can easily change things with no obvious way to restore defaults. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool. I love using it to play with themes in Gnome 3, regardless of DE, but it's far from mature enough to be included in the repos. --- On *Wed, 12/14/11, Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com* wrote: From: Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Wednesday, December 14, 2011, 10:17 PM I respectfully disagree. The options that can be tweaked from Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything, and for the most part can be changed on the fly (without restarting that is). There is no reason not to include such a tool by default. On 12/14/2011 05:00 PM, Ian Santopietro wrote: I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.nethttp://mc/compose?to=ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.nethttp://mc/compose?to=ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.nethttp://mc/compose?to=ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- Ian Santopietro *Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html* Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
I respectfully disagree. The options that can be tweaked from Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything, and for the most part can be changed on the fly (without restarting that is). There is no reason not to include such a tool by default. On 12/14/2011 05:00 PM, Ian Santopietro wrote: I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
Den 14. des. 2011 21:27, skrev Christian Rupp: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? Ubuntu Tweak deserves the attention it is getting, but I hardly think it's ready to even be considered as a default app. Playing with it for less than two minutes, Compiz became completely unresponsive. Of course, I only had to switch to another console and kill it for it to be restarted, but most users would've had to resort to a brutal poweroff. That's not the apps fault, but the result is the same. The GUI needs a fair amount of work. It isn't all bad, but it needs improvements in several areas. For instance each tab uses two different displays, and there is no hint that this is so. This is also not a normal way of doing things. Many of the things in Admins has nothing to do with administration. The Tweaks part does contain several administration things. I also don't really understand what removing old thumbnails has to do with tweaking a system. In my view, the app is promising, but is still a little confused and needs to mature and get a more defined sense of direction. I think the project is quite interesting, and it's possible I'll have something to contribute to it. But I don't see it as a candidate to be a default application. In any case, it'd have to be accepted into Ubuntu first, I think. I don't think these types of settings is for everyone. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
