RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Translation help please..

[Sam Koester]

Roseyln,  Thank you so much for taking the time to help me with this.  Did I
get everything right in the body of the document?  Is the bride's name and
parent's names not listed.

 

Again, thank you so much for your help.  Sam in CA

 

From: azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of
Hughes Roselyn
Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 7:36 PM
To: azores@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Translation help please..

 

Sam, 

Typo:  Vieira

Sorry about that.  Roselyn

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 7:31 PM, Hughes Roselyn 
wrote:

Hi Sam: 

In the bottom half of your attachment, just to the right of where the priest
wrote Isabel in the margin it says:  Isabel is the daughter of Lieutenant
Miguel Vierra and his wife Barbara da Valenca all from Santa Catharina.

Roselyn

 

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 6:08 PM, Sam Koester  wrote:

Can sks tell me if I've translated this correctly AND if I've missed
anything.  I do not make out the name or parents of the bride.  Did I miss
it?  Thanks much for any help, Sam in CA

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Translation help please..

[Hughes Roselyn]

Sam,

Typo:  Vieira

Sorry about that.  Roselyn

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 7:31 PM, Hughes Roselyn wrote:

> Hi Sam:
>
> In the bottom half of your attachment, just to the right of where the
> priest wrote Isabel in the margin it says:  Isabel is the daughter of
> Lieutenant Miguel Vierra and his wife Barbara da Valenca all from Santa
> Catharina.
>
> Roselyn
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 6:08 PM, Sam Koester  wrote:
>
>> Can sks tell me if I’ve translated this correctly AND if I’ve missed
>> anything.  I do not make out the name or parents of the bride.  Did I miss
>> it?  Thanks much for any help, Sam in CA
>>
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>> membership."
>
>

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Translation help please..

[Hughes Roselyn]

Hi Sam:

In the bottom half of your attachment, just to the right of where the
priest wrote Isabel in the margin it says:  Isabel is the daughter of
Lieutenant Miguel Vierra and his wife Barbara da Valenca all from Santa
Catharina.

Roselyn

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 6:08 PM, Sam Koester  wrote:

> Can sks tell me if I’ve translated this correctly AND if I’ve missed
> anything.  I do not make out the name or parents of the bride.  Did I miss
> it?  Thanks much for any help, Sam in CA
>
> --
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> azores+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. Follow the confirmation directions
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> membership."

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

[DAWN JOSEY]

in my case my first ancestor here from portugal seems to have said his name but 
people couldn't understand or pronounce it. we cannot fully be sure of his 
name. manoel jose became manoel jose figurehead on one census. perhaps they 
couldn't understand him or spell his name which some think was figueiredo which 
people mistakingly took to be his occupation of carver of figureheads as one 
story goes. of course we know that names change intentionally and otherwise 
over the years.
much of our family folklore and culture can be traced back to the portuguese 
culture although no one was aware of it until it showed up in research. 
i think in the end "foreigners"  or " people from away"  just wanted to blend 
in and fit into their new environment . to be accepted by neighbors as one of 
them so did many things to accomodate that.
Dawn Josey
 
some summize people thought he might have carved figureheads. his name Jose 
became Josey and the figurehead was lost. 
 
On 08/11/12, Lorinda Sevenans  wrote: 
>  I just have to chime in here.
> 
> My grandfather came to California in 1901/02 (I've seen both dates and 
> haven't found a ship). All I know is that his father's last name was Luiz (on 
> my grandfather's death certificate) and that my grandfather was always known 
> as Joseph Souza Lewis, his mother (who immigrated as a widow with 3 
> children), Mary Lewis, his brother Arthur Lewis and his sister is also Mary 
> Lewis. He married a Portuguese woman (her mother was born in Mass., her 
> father in the Azores) named Ida Lucille Vieirra (I've seen several spellings 
> for this).
> 
> My mother and her siblings grew up speaking Portuguese in their home, but I 
> NEVER knew this until I started doing research. In fact, my mother told me 
> they were Irish, which I believed until I met her cousin, Francisco "Sonny" 
> Silva, when I was in my teens. So I always thought that her mother was 
> Portuguese and her father Irish until about 2 years ago when I joined 
> ancestry.com(http://ancestry.com/) and began doing a little research. 
> 
> I think that the first generation born in America just wanted to blend in and 
> not call attention to the differences they had with "Americans." I found a 
> first cousin on Ancestry who grew up in the same town with our grandparents 
> and she told me a lot about the family that my mother never mentioned. I only 
> met my grandparents once when I was 8 years old. I'm not really sure about my 
> mother's relationship with her family, but I know it wasn't very close - 
> unlike most Portuguese families. 
> 
> I'm really sorry she didn't feel the desire to share more about our heritage 
> with me. I've been trying to share with my grown kids and grandchildren. They 
> may not appreciate it now, but I hope they will later.
> 
> Lorinda
> 
>  On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 2:16 PM,  wrote:
>  
> >   Well written Cousin Sam. 
> > I sometimes think some of us from "this era" misunderstand the 
> > "drivers" that led our ancestors to success. They stopped at nothing. They 
> > were survivors ... would do whatever to give their children a better chance 
> > at a more prospective future. That is what I "read" in the various attempts 
> > to "Americanize" themselves (might be viewed as 'anglicized' in the current 
> > day). It was competition in its rawest sense ... your family (farm?) 
> > against the existing (old New England) farmer. You did (as a father or 
> > parent) to see that your children (born in the country that YOU as an 
> > immigrant chose) did whatever you perceived as advantageous to your 
> > children.
> >  
> > In my opinion ... THAT is what drove our ancestors to do as they saw 
> > necessary in the remarkably competitive environment of those times. Would 
> > you do less for your children? ... try to think in their shoes. I admire 
> > their decisions as much as I regret the loss of heritage that such 
> > decisions entailed.
> >  
> > I can recover that lost heritage through study. I could not recover 
> > from death of my immigrant ancestors or their children from poverty driven 
> > in part by a disgusting irreverence for the humans who came to US shores 
> > driven by hope.
> >  
> > Best to you all.
> >   
> >  In a message dated 8/11/2012 3:49:52 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 
> > sam...@surewest.net writes:
> > 
> > >   
> > > I was born in 1946 and am the youngest of 6 children.  Both my parents 
> > > were Portuguese, 1st generation for one a 1st & 2nd for the other. My 
> > > mom’s mother was an immigrant but; her father was born in the U.S.  My 
> > > parents spoke Portuguese to each other but; if one of us children came 
> > > into the room they switched to English.  They definitely wanted us to be 
> > > known as Americans!  Not Americans first, Americans period.  My older 
> > > siblings tell me they experienced prejudice even though there were many 
> > > Portuguese descendents in our town in CA.  I know neither of my 
> > > grandmothers ever spoke to

Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

[Lorinda Sevenans]

I just have to chime in here.

My grandfather came to California in 1901/02 (I've seen both dates and
haven't found a ship). All I know is that his father's last name was Luiz
(on my grandfather's death certificate) and that my grandfather was always
known as Joseph Souza Lewis, his mother (who immigrated as a widow with 3
children), Mary Lewis, his brother Arthur Lewis and his sister is also Mary
Lewis. He married a Portuguese woman (her mother was born in Mass., her
father in the Azores) named Ida Lucille Vieirra (I've seen several
spellings for this).

My mother and her siblings grew up speaking Portuguese in their home, but I
NEVER knew this until I started doing research. In fact, my mother told me
they were Irish, which I believed until I met her cousin, Francisco "Sonny"
Silva, when I was in my teens. So I always thought that her mother was
Portuguese and her father Irish until about 2 years ago when I joined
ancestry.com and began doing a little research.

I think that the first generation born in America just wanted to blend in
and not call attention to the differences they had with "Americans." I
found a first cousin on Ancestry who grew up in the same town with our
grandparents and she told me a lot about the family that my mother never
mentioned. I only met my grandparents once when I was 8 years old. I'm not
really sure about my mother's relationship with her family, but I know it
wasn't very close - unlike most Portuguese families.

I'm really sorry she didn't feel the desire to share more about our
heritage with me. I've been trying to share with my grown kids and
grandchildren. They may not appreciate it now, but I hope they will later.

Lorinda

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 2:16 PM,  wrote:

> **
> Well written Cousin Sam.
> I sometimes think some of us from "this era" misunderstand the
> "drivers" that led our ancestors to success. They stopped at nothing. They
> were survivors ... would do whatever to give their children a better chance
> at a more prospective future. That is what I "read" in the various attempts
> to "Americanize" themselves (might be viewed as 'anglicized' in the current
> day). It was competition in its rawest sense ... *your* family (farm?)
> against the existing (old New England) farmer. You did (as a father or
> parent) to see that *your* children (born in the country that YOU as an
> immigrant chose) did whatever you perceived as *advantageous* to your
> children.
>
> In my opinion ... THAT is what drove our ancestors to do as they saw
> necessary in the remarkably competitive environment of those times. Would
> you do less for your children? ... try to think in their shoes. I admire
> their decisions as much as I regret the loss of heritage that such
> decisions entailed.
>
> I can recover that lost heritage through study. I could not recover
> from death of my immigrant ancestors or their children from poverty driven
> in part by a disgusting irreverence for the humans who came to US shores
> driven by hope.
>
> Best to you all.
>
>  In a message dated 8/11/2012 3:49:52 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> sam...@surewest.net writes:
>
>  I was born in 1946 and am the youngest of 6 children.  Both my parents
> were Portuguese, 1st generation for one a 1st & 2nd for the other. My
> mom’s mother was an immigrant but; her father was born in the U.S.  My
> parents spoke Portuguese to each other but; if one of us children came into
> the room they switched to English.  They definitely wanted us to be known
> as Americans!  Not Americans first, Americans period.  My older siblings
> tell me they experienced prejudice even though there were many Portuguese
> descendents in our town in CA.  I know neither of my grandmothers ever
> spoke to us about where they were from or their early life.  My
> grandfathers were both dead before I was born.  None of my family were
> striving for “upper crust” stations in life.  They were quite happy to be
> successful farmers.  I think prejudice against Portuguese people must have
> been very real for them but; it probably depended on where you lived and
> perhaps, your level of education as well.  Just my two cents worth, Sam in
> CA
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] *On
> Behalf Of *Gayle Machado
> *Sent:* Saturday, August 11, 2012 10:50 AM
> *To:* azores@googlegroups.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names
>
> ** **
>
> Len,
>
> ** **
>
> My grandfather's first wife was Irish. Her family looked down on the
> Portuguese as the N(word)s of Europe.(Sorry, not a word I would use. ) As a
> result, he anglicized his name. His children from that marriage used
> Marshall. His wife died young. When he decided to remarry, my grandmother's
> family were not biased against his heritage (being Portuguese themselves)
> so his second family returned to the Machado surname. 
>
> ** **
>
> However, outside the family, my father would never acknowledge his
> heritage 

Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Anglicization of names

[Gayle Machado]

Cheri,

You make valid points. None of these apply to my grandfather. He was born in 
the U. S. in the 1870s and was fluent in both English and Portuguese. 

Gayle



On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:04 PM, Cheri Mello  wrote:

> Some of the anglicization of names is being a product of the time period.  
> Literacy (even in America) was not  then (1900, say) what it is today.  So 
> Machado sounded close enough to Marshall.  Couple that with going through WWI 
> and WWII in America and America being on the winning side and everyone wants 
> to be American.  I can't quite recall from my college studies, but I think it 
> was more like the 1960s or maybe 1970s when there was more of a push towards 
> multiculturalism.  And literacy was higher by then.
> 
> How many legally changed their name though?  I've met other genealogists and 
> mostly it's just a corruption or anglicization from the past because of 
> literacy.  A couple had the name changed in the naturalization papers, and 
> the most common reason was to make it easier in living here.  (This was a 
> name from Poland?  Lithuania?)  One person had the story that his family 
> changed their name to their in-laws names on purpose because the first 
> syllable was prounced "dumb" in English.  I didn't see the paperwork on that, 
> so I guess that's their family story.
> Cheri Mello
> Listowner, Azores-Gen
> Researching: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, 
> Achada
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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

[AlRose509]

Well written Cousin Sam. 
I sometimes think some of us from "this era"  misunderstand the 
"drivers" that led our ancestors to success. They stopped at  nothing. They 
were 
survivors ... would do whatever to give their children a  better chance at a 
more prospective future. That is what I "read" in the various  attempts to 
"Americanize" themselves (might be viewed as 'anglicized' in the  current 
day). It was competition in its rawest sense ... your family  (farm?) against 
the existing (old New England) farmer. You did (as a father or  parent) to see 
that your children (born in the country that YOU as an  immigrant chose) 
did whatever you perceived as advantageous to your  children.
 
In my opinion ... THAT is what drove our ancestors  to do as they saw 
necessary in the remarkably competitive environment of those  times. Would 
you do less for your children? ... try to think in their shoes. I  admire 
their decisions as much as I regret the loss of heritage that such  decisions 
entailed.
 
I can recover that lost heritage through study. I  could not recover 
from death of my immigrant ancestors or their children from  poverty driven in 
part by a disgusting irreverence for the humans who came  to US shores 
driven by hope.
 
Best to you all.
 
 
In a message dated 8/11/2012 3:49:52 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
sam...@surewest.net writes:

 
I was born in 1946 and am the  youngest of 6 children.  Both my parents 
were Portuguese, 1st  generation for one a 1st & 2nd for the other. My  mom’s 
mother was an immigrant but; her father was born in the U.S.  My  parents 
spoke Portuguese to each other but; if one of us children came into  the room 
they switched to English.  They definitely wanted us to be known  as 
Americans!  Not Americans first, Americans period.  My older  siblings tell me 
they 
experienced prejudice even though there were many  Portuguese descendents in 
our town in CA.  I know neither of my  grandmothers ever spoke to us about 
where they were from or their early  life.  My grandfathers were both dead 
before I was born.  None of my  family were striving for “upper crust” 
stations in life.  They were quite  happy to be successful farmers.  I think 
prejudice against Portuguese  people must have been very real for them but; it 
probably depended on where  you lived and perhaps, your level of education as 
well.  Just my two  cents worth, Sam in CA 
 
 
From:  azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] On Behalf 
Of  Gayle Machado
Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 10:50  AM
To: azores@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re:  [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

 
Len,
 

 
My grandfather's first wife was Irish. Her family looked  down on the 
Portuguese as the N(word)s of Europe.(Sorry, not a word I would  use. ) As a 
result, he anglicized his name. His children from that marriage  used Marshall. 
His wife died young. When he decided to remarry, my  grandmother's family 
were not biased against his heritage (being Portuguese  themselves) so his 
second family returned to the Machado  surname. 
 

 
However, outside the family, my father would never  acknowledge his 
heritage or the fact that he spoke Portuguese fluently.  To my great 
disappointment, he refused to teach my sister or I saying  this was the U. S. 
and English 
was the only language we  needed. 
 

 
Gayle
 

 

 








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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

[TheMOM8682]

I will throw in my two cents worth as well.
 
My grandfather came to the US, specifically Sacramento, CA, in 1905.   They 
did not anglicize their name and the neighborhood they lived in was  
culturally diverse for the time with many Azorean families as well as  Italian 
families and Asian families.  However, I have been told that in  their house 
the children were only to speak English; they were Americans now and  wanted 
to assimilate.  Their father learned English but their mother  reportedly 
never learned to speak English so presumably they only spoke  Portuguese when 
they were speaking directly to their mother.
 
My great great grandfather came to the US (California) about 1854.  He  did 
anglicize his name going by Perry rather than Pereira or Beirao.   
According to the census, he and his wife both spoke English.
 
 
In a message dated 8/11/2012 12:49:52 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
sam...@surewest.net writes:

 
I was born in 1946 and am the  youngest of 6 children.  Both my parents were
 Portuguese, 1st  generation for one a 1st & 2nd for the other. My  mom’s 
mother was an immigrant but; her father was born in the U.S.  My  parents 
spoke Portuguese to each other but; if one of us children came into  the room 
they switched to English.  They definitely wanted us to be known  as 
Americans!  Not Americans first, Americans period.  My older  siblings tell me 
they 
experienced prejudice even though there were many  Portuguese descendents in 
our town in CA.  I know neither of my  grandmothers ever spoke to us about 
where they were from or their early  life.  My grandfathers were both dead 
before I was born.  None of my  family were striving for “upper crust” 
stations in life.  They were quite  happy to be successful farmers.  I think 
prejudice against Portuguese  people must have been very real for them but; it 
probably depended on where  you lived and perhaps, your level of education as 
well.  Just my two  cents worth, Sam in CA 
 
 
From:  azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] On Behalf 
Of  Gayle Machado
Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 10:50  AM
To: azores@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re:  [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

 
Len,
 

 
My grandfather's first wife was Irish. Her family looked  down on the 
Portuguese as the N(word)s of Europe.(Sorry, not a word I would  use. ) As a 
result, he anglicized his name. His children from that marriage  used Marshall. 
His wife died young. When he decided to remarry, my  grandmother's family 
were not biased against his heritage (being Portuguese  themselves) so his 
second family returned to the Machado  surname. 
 

 
However, outside the family, my father would never  acknowledge his 
heritage or the fact that he spoke Portuguese fluently.  To my great 
disappointment, he refused to teach my sister or I saying  this was the U. S. 
and English 
was the only language we  needed. 
 

 
Gayle
 

 

 








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RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

[Sam Koester]

I was born in 1946 and am the youngest of 6 children.  Both my parents were
Portuguese, 1st generation for one a 1st & 2nd for the other. My mom's
mother was an immigrant but; her father was born in the U.S.  My parents
spoke Portuguese to each other but; if one of us children came into the room
they switched to English.  They definitely wanted us to be known as
Americans!  Not Americans first, Americans period.  My older siblings tell
me they experienced prejudice even though there were many Portuguese
descendents in our town in CA.  I know neither of my grandmothers ever spoke
to us about where they were from or their early life.  My grandfathers were
both dead before I was born.  None of my family were striving for "upper
crust" stations in life.  They were quite happy to be successful farmers.  I
think prejudice against Portuguese people must have been very real for them
but; it probably depended on where you lived and perhaps, your level of
education as well.  Just my two cents worth, Sam in CA

 

From: azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of
Gayle Machado
Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 10:50 AM
To: azores@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

 

Len,

 

My grandfather's first wife was Irish. Her family looked down on the
Portuguese as the N(word)s of Europe.(Sorry, not a word I would use. ) As a
result, he anglicized his name. His children from that marriage used
Marshall. His wife died young. When he decided to remarry, my grandmother's
family were not biased against his heritage (being Portuguese themselves) so
his second family returned to the Machado surname. 

 

However, outside the family, my father would never acknowledge his heritage
or the fact that he spoke Portuguese fluently.  To my great disappointment,
he refused to teach my sister or I saying this was the U. S. and English was
the only language we needed. 

 

Gayle

 

 









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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Anglicization of names

[Cheri Mello]

Some of the anglicization of names is being a product of the time period.
Literacy (even in America) was not  then (1900, say) what it is today.  So
Machado sounded close enough to Marshall.  Couple that with going through
WWI and WWII in America and America being on the winning side and everyone
wants to be American.  I can't quite recall from my college studies, but I
think it was more like the 1960s or maybe 1970s when there was more of a
push towards multiculturalism.  And literacy was higher by then.

How many legally changed their name though?  I've met other genealogists
and mostly it's just a corruption or anglicization from the past because of
literacy.  A couple had the name changed in the naturalization papers, and
the most common reason was to make it easier in living here.  (This was a
name from Poland?  Lithuania?)  One person had the story that his family
changed their name to their in-laws names on purpose because the first
syllable was prounced "dumb" in English.  I didn't see the paperwork on
that, so I guess that's their family story.
Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas,
Achada

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[AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Anglicization of names

[Leonard Silva]

Cheri,

I am being intentionally vague here as I have not felt out living family 
members feelings about this.  Personally, I think Uncle may have been over 
sensitive and that there really was no real discrimination.  I have picked 
up that he was perhaps bullied and called a "dumb portagee" in school and 
never got over it.

On Saturday, August 11, 2012 11:28:00 AM UTC-4, Cheri Mello wrote:
>
> Len, 
>
> I would say not that common at all that someone would hide their 
> heritage.  It is rare. 
>
> You said that you talked to family members and found out that this 
> uncle did everything he could to hide his heritage.  What did you 
> find?  Court papers with a name change?  What was this profession?  If 
> he was a Portuguese person in the Bible Belt of the south (in the 
> U.S.) trying to attract dental patients, then maybe it makes sense to 
> be like one of them.  But he was in Providence, which has a really 
> large Portuguese community.  What was his surname before?  After? 
>
> I'd be interesting in hearing what you found documenting that he hid 
> his nationality. 
>
> Cheri Mello 
> Listowner, Azores Genealogy 
>

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

[Gayle Machado]

Len,

My grandfather's first wife was Irish. Her family looked down on the Portuguese 
as the N(word)s of Europe.(Sorry, not a word I would use. ) As a result, he 
anglicized his name. His children from that marriage used Marshall. His wife 
died young. When he decided to remarry, my grandmother's family were not biased 
against his heritage (being Portuguese themselves) so his second family 
returned to the Machado surname. 

However, outside the family, my father would never acknowledge his heritage or 
the fact that he spoke Portuguese fluently.  To my great disappointment, he 
refused to teach my sister or I saying this was the U. S. and English was the 
only language we needed. 

Gayle






On Aug 11, 2012, at 8:20 AM, Cheri Mello  wrote:

> Repost for Len Silva, lensilva at lenstudio.com:
> I ran into a wall in tracing an uncle born in 1898. I had him through the 
> twenties, but then he just seemed to disappear. I finally found that he 
> had so anglicized his name that I could not find him. Later, talking to 
> his family members, I found that he did everything he could to hide his 
> heritage. He was a well respected professional in Providence RI. He felt 
> that he could not be successful in those professional circles with his 
> heritage.
> 
> Growing up in New Bedford, I never felt that in the least, but we were blue 
> collar and not striving for "upper crust" as they say.
> 
> How common was this and have you found it in your own families?
> 
> As an aside, I can remember my first generation grandfather and my father 
> speaking disparagingly of the "dumb greenhorns" that just got off the 
> boat. I guess it's just a human condition.
> 
> Len
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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Anglicization of names

[AlRose509]

If rare, then my 2d generation Portuguese family did all they could to fit  
in and become "American" ... e.g., grandparents discouraged Portuguese 
spoken by  children or grandchildren. ALL reference to family surnames were  
anglicized.
 
da Rosa Semiao to ROSE
Fraga to FRAZER
Machado to MARSHALL
Soares to SEARS
 
Some of this came from a general lack of education among the children. My  
father was the only child of nine to reach the 8th grade. All other males  
stopped at most at grade 7 and females before that.
 
As a result, even in 1980, neither my father nor my living uncles  
understood enough geography to understand where the Azores were ... they had  
some 
notion that their father had come from "an island off Portugal" ... had no  
idea it was more like 900 miles west Portgugal.
 
I must say that I believe this to have been more common among those  
immigrants arriving prior to 1900. After that, I found retention of original  
spellings much more the norm.
 
 
In a message dated 8/11/2012 11:28:02 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
gfsche...@gmail.com writes:

I would  say not that common at all that someone would hide their
heritage.  It  is rare.

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Anglicization of names

[Pam Santos]

Oh and they also had relatives in Fall River, MA and in Rhode Island.

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 8:44 AM, Pam Santos  wrote:

> I have two Silva brothers who changed their last name to Howard because of
> Business in Hawaii.
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 8:28 AM, Cheri Mello  wrote:
>
>> Len,
>>
>> I would say not that common at all that someone would hide their
>> heritage.  It is rare.
>>
>> You said that you talked to family members and found out that this
>> uncle did everything he could to hide his heritage.  What did you
>> find?  Court papers with a name change?  What was this profession?  If
>> he was a Portuguese person in the Bible Belt of the south (in the
>> U.S.) trying to attract dental patients, then maybe it makes sense to
>> be like one of them.  But he was in Providence, which has a really
>> large Portuguese community.  What was his surname before?  After?
>>
>> I'd be interesting in hearing what you found documenting that he hid
>> his nationality.
>>
>> Cheri Mello
>> Listowner, Azores Genealogy
>>
>> --
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>> when they arrive.
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>> right that says "Join this group" and it will take you to "Edit my
>> membership."
>>
>
>

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Anglicization of names

[Pam Santos]

I have two Silva brothers who changed their last name to Howard because of
Business in Hawaii.

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 8:28 AM, Cheri Mello  wrote:

> Len,
>
> I would say not that common at all that someone would hide their
> heritage.  It is rare.
>
> You said that you talked to family members and found out that this
> uncle did everything he could to hide his heritage.  What did you
> find?  Court papers with a name change?  What was this profession?  If
> he was a Portuguese person in the Bible Belt of the south (in the
> U.S.) trying to attract dental patients, then maybe it makes sense to
> be like one of them.  But he was in Providence, which has a really
> large Portuguese community.  What was his surname before?  After?
>
> I'd be interesting in hearing what you found documenting that he hid
> his nationality.
>
> Cheri Mello
> Listowner, Azores Genealogy
>
> --
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> membership."
>

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[AZORES-Genealogy] Re: Anglicization of names

[Cheri Mello]

Len,

I would say not that common at all that someone would hide their
heritage.  It is rare.

You said that you talked to family members and found out that this
uncle did everything he could to hide his heritage.  What did you
find?  Court papers with a name change?  What was this profession?  If
he was a Portuguese person in the Bible Belt of the south (in the
U.S.) trying to attract dental patients, then maybe it makes sense to
be like one of them.  But he was in Providence, which has a really
large Portuguese community.  What was his surname before?  After?

I'd be interesting in hearing what you found documenting that he hid
his nationality.

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores Genealogy

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[AZORES-Genealogy] Anglicization of names

[Cheri Mello]

Repost for Len Silva, lensilva at lenstudio.com:

I ran into a wall in tracing an uncle born in 1898. I had him through the
twenties, but then he just seemed to disappear. I finally found that he
had so anglicized his name that I could not find him. Later, talking to
his family members, I found that he did everything he could to hide his
heritage. He was a well respected professional in Providence RI. He felt
that he could not be successful in those professional circles with his
heritage.

Growing up in New Bedford, I never felt that in the least, but we were blue
collar and not striving for "upper crust" as they say.

How common was this and have you found it in your own families?

As an aside, I can remember my first generation grandfather and my father
speaking disparagingly of the "dumb greenhorns" that just got off the
boat. I guess it's just a human condition.

Len

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Vasconcellos - DNA match

[Cheri Mello]

Bill,

Rick Pimentel, one of the admins for the DNA project gave you the links to
articles on how DNA works.

Now your other question: "How realistic is it to find a link in the 5th
cousin realm?"
True 5th cousins share a common 4th great grandparent.  However, FTDNA did
not state that you and John V. are 5th.  They said you are 5th to remote.
You could be 6th.  Maybe 7th, depending on how much intermarriage may have
happened in your family tree.

It takes work.  You are going to have to get all your Portuguese lines back
to the 4th great level at least.  And then you are going to have to take it
from there.  You may need to wait as more people test Family Finder.  As
you get more cousin matches, it'll become more clear how you match John V.
or anyone else on the 5th to remote cousin level.  Kind of like the kids'
card game "Memory" or "Concentration" (I think that's what it's called).
All the cards are face down and you have to find a matching pair.  The game
is hard in the beginning, but much easier as you progress through the
game.  You will find the same thing with Family Finder.

I've had much better luck with my dad's Family Finder than my mom's.  I
think the reasons with that are he has a better documented tree and that
he's half Portuguese. Makes it easier for me to see if I'm working his
paternal side of the family or the maternal.  My mom's is tougher since she
is British Isles type ancestry.  And she has a lot of dead ends in her tree
with burned out courthouses and things like that.  But I'm finally starting
to figure a few matches with her Family Finder.  It takes time though to
figure it all out.
Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas,
Achada

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Re: [AZORES-Genealogy] Who posted "Pico Ancestors" as an attachment a couple of weeks ago?

[Pat McCoy]

I've saved many of the e-mails that came through and when I did a
search for "Pico Ancestors", several popped up with attachments.  One
of the e-mails mentioned the "MELLO" surname.  I hope this helps.

Pat McCoy
==
On 8/10/12, seekg...@aol.com  wrote:
> I accidentally deleted your posting but printed your attachment.  Are  all
> of these people your ancestors?  If so, I have I believe that I  have found
>
> some connections to some of them.
>
> Marie Pleasant
>
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RE: [AZORES-Genealogy] Vasconcellos - DNA match

[Richard Francis Pimentel]

Hi Bill, 

 

Below are links to a series of articles on getting started in genetic
genealogy parts 1-3. Part 4 of this series is due out this coming week.
These will give you a better understanding of DNA testing. 

 

 

http://blog.eogn.com/eastmans_online_genealogy/2012/07/getting-started-in-ge
netic-genealogy.html 

 

 

http://www.geni.com/blog/dna-testing-for-genealogy-getting-started-part-two-
376163.html 

 

 

http://www.geni.com/blog/dna-testing-for-genealogy-getting-started-part-thre
e-376261.html

 

As far as finding a 5th cousin I would say it depends on the group you are
comparing to. If you are comparing with the Azores DNA group then it is
fairly common to find a 5th cousin. Consider if a generation has 5 children
who marry and have five children each after 6 generations you will have over
78,000 descendants with some of the DNA from the original couple. The hard
part is proving the lines when you have a match. The science tells us there
is a match but we are not done until the paperwork is finished.

 

When I start comparing the GEDCOM of a match with my own tree I run into
dead ends because the person I am comparing has not completed their tree. It
is hard to tell if Jose Furtado with no known village or island is the same
Jose Furtado in your line that is from NS Estrella, Ribeira Grande. On the
other side the person you are matching may decide to look in Ribeira Grande
and finely find the person there.

 

Rick

Family Tree DNA Co-Administrator
Azores DNA Project

 

Spring, Texas

 

Researching Sao Miguel Azores, Riberinha, Riberia Grande, Bretanha, Achada
Grande, Bretanha, Ponta  Delgada, Sao Miguel, Acores.

 

From: azores@googlegroups.com [mailto:azores@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of
want2beunique
Sent: Saturday, August 11, 2012 12:29 AM
To: azores@googlegroups.com
Subject: [AZORES-Genealogy] Vasconcellos - DNA match

 

Got my FamilyTreeDNA results tonight.  One 2nd Cousin from the Hickman side
of the family.  Looks like they may live close too.  Also got a 5th cousin
hit on John Vasconcellos.  Now I need to read up on how this DNA stuff works
;-)  How realistic is it to find a link in the 5th cousin realm?

Bill

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