Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
Hi all, As another alternative to Boxee and XBMC, you can always use Plex (http://www.plexapp.com/) and my Plex iPlayer plugin (downloadable from Plex's in-app plugin list). I'm using this on a Mac Mini hooked up to a projector, and it works great. I used to use a hacked AppleTV as a media centre, but its closed approach eventually led to my move over to the Mini. Would probably have stuck with the AppleTV if I'd had Tweed's iPlayer plugin at the time :) Plex gives a lot more plugin flexibility - definitely worth a look if you're considering a Mac-based media centre. Dave. From: Ian Forrester ian.forres...@bbc.co.uk Reply-To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Date: Tue, 9 Feb 2010 13:55:40 - To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: RE: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV Sorry been out at Fosdem, so missed this. Will post it up on backstage, good work Tweed! Still enjoy XBMC with iplayer support but this will make the Apple TV a lot more interesting for friends of mine. Secret[] Private[x] Public[] Ian Forrester Senior Backstage Producer BBC RD North Lab, 1st Floor Office, OB Base, New Broadcasting House, Oxford Road, Manchester, M60 1SJ -Original Message- From: owner-backst...@lists.bbc.co.uk [mailto:owner-backst...@lists.bbc.co.uk] On Behalf Of Jonathan Tweed Sent: 03 February 2010 13:30 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV On 3 Feb 2010, at 13:09, Mo McRoberts wrote: Really really not a fan of Boxee's UI. Nor XMBC's, for that matter. Both seem pretty sluggish on the aTV, especially compared to the native UI. Which is exactly why I made this. I didn't buy an Apple TV to run Boxee. Cheers Jonathan - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Dave Addey listma...@addey.com wrote: As another alternative to Boxee and XBMC, you can always use Plex (http://www.plexapp.com/) and my Plex iPlayer plugin (downloadable from Plex's in-app plugin list). I'm using this on a Mac Mini hooked up to a projector, and it works great. I used to use a hacked AppleTV as a media centre, but its closed approach eventually led to my move over to the Mini. Would probably have stuck with the AppleTV if I'd had Tweed's iPlayer plugin at the time :) Plex gives a lot more plugin flexibility - definitely worth a look if you're considering a Mac-based media centre. Plex/Boxee/XBMC are nicely hackable, that's for sure. And Boxee on the AppleTV is nice to try too, though I found it super sluggish to be honest. But what with http://jonathan.tweed.name/2010/02/09/bbc-iplayer-for-apple-tv-an-update/ ... it seems these kinds of hacks aren't approved of. Jonathan reports in that post that one of the reasons he was asked to take it down was: ... 'The plugin was also playing content rights cleared for PC, but not set top box, usage.' Can anyone shed more light on this distinction? With the likes of Boxee on the rise, it's hard to understand where PCs stop and 'set top boxes' start. So if there are big legal/contractual distinctions defined using these terms that affect future possibilities for iPlayer embedding, it'd be nice to have some sense of where the limits might be. cheers, Dan - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 09:43, Dan Brickley dan...@danbri.org wrote: Can anyone shed more light on this distinction? With the likes of Boxee on the rise, it's hard to understand where PCs stop and 'set top boxes' start. So if there are big legal/contractual distinctions defined using these terms that affect future possibilities for iPlayer embedding, it'd be nice to have some sense of where the limits might be. I'd take a wild guess that it's entirely dependent upon which programmes have entries in mediaselector for PS3/Wii as compared to those which don't. If I didn't know better[0] I'd be tempted to think that rightsholders WANTED people to download stuff illicitly. M. [0] actually, I don't know better; it's entirely possible. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 9:43 AM, Dan Brickley dan...@danbri.org wrote: On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Dave Addey listma...@addey.com wrote: As another alternative to Boxee and XBMC, you can always use Plex (http://www.plexapp.com/) and my Plex iPlayer plugin (downloadable from Plex's in-app plugin list). I'm using this on a Mac Mini hooked up to a projector, and it works great. I used to use a hacked AppleTV as a media centre, but its closed approach eventually led to my move over to the Mini. Would probably have stuck with the AppleTV if I'd had Tweed's iPlayer plugin at the time :) Plex gives a lot more plugin flexibility - definitely worth a look if you're considering a Mac-based media centre. Plex/Boxee/XBMC are nicely hackable, that's for sure. And Boxee on the AppleTV is nice to try too, though I found it super sluggish to be honest. But what with http://jonathan.tweed.name/2010/02/09/bbc-iplayer-for-apple-tv-an-update/ ... it seems these kinds of hacks aren't approved of. Jonathan reports in that post that one of the reasons he was asked to take it down was: ... 'The plugin was also playing content rights cleared for PC, but not set top box, usage.' Can anyone shed more light on this distinction? With the likes of Boxee on the rise, it's hard to understand where PCs stop and 'set top boxes' start. So if there are big legal/contractual distinctions defined using these terms that affect future possibilities for iPlayer embedding, it'd be nice to have some sense of where the limits might be. That seems really arbitrary. I'm running Boxee on a desktop OS but it only acts as a set top box. Is it a set top box because it's attached to my TV or is my TV merely a very large LCD monitor with a (largely unused TV tuner)? Boxee has an iPlayer app and AFAIK it works just by pretending to be one of the various games consoles that iPlayer works with and invoking the games console UI. Presumably this is OK as no one has said anything about that plugin. Even weirder, no one ever told us not to write scripts to download video off iPlayer, even unofficially. I'd have thought that was the first place they'd start if they were going to close down projects. Oh well. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
RE: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
Well I think this is the issue, in a nutshell. I can't, won't talk for the rest of the BBC but it seems if your streaming iplayer content inside the UK on to your PC device, that's fine. However if you download the files your on the wrong side of a line. If it was that simple that would be great but if your streaming to a consumer device/appliance then your also on the wrong side of the imaginary line. This gets very tricky when you create a plugin for something like XBMC,Boxee,Plex which can be both a PC and appliance. The notions of device, appliance and PC are very blured but it sounds like deals have been done based on there differences. Generally if you take the p*** I'll get shouted at and I'll ask you nicely to close the service/script/prototype :) of course breaking the backstage licence will you a heavy knock at the door :) That seems really arbitrary. I'm running Boxee on a desktop OS but it only acts as a set top box. Is it a set top box because it's attached to my TV or is my TV merely a very large LCD monitor with a (largely unused TV tuner)? Boxee has an iPlayer app and AFAIK it works just by pretending to be one of the various games consoles that iPlayer works with and invoking the games console UI. Presumably this is OK as no one has said anything about that plugin. Even weirder, no one ever told us not to write scripts to download video off iPlayer, even unofficially. I'd have thought that was the first place they'd start if they were going to close down projects. Oh well. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 16:54, Ian Forrester ian.forres...@bbc.co.uk wrote: Well I think this is the issue, in a nutshell. I can't, won't talk for the rest of the BBC but it seems if your streaming iplayer content inside the UK on to your PC device, that's fine. However if you download the files your on the wrong side of a line. If it was that simple that would be great but if your streaming to a consumer device/appliance then your also on the wrong side of the imaginary line. Why, though? Why is an 'appliance' somehow different? In fact, why is ANY of this different to me recording a copy with a PVR[0] (a copy which, incidentally, I can keep pretty much indefinitely and in a format which is convenient)? The whole thing is a very effective mechanism for driving even the most fledgling of tech-savvy consumers to $P2P_SITE_OF_CHOICE, and frustrating the rest. Honestly, I understand that some rights-holders erroneously believe that these kinds of distinctions and restrictions prevent anybody from doing they shouldn't be while not preventing anybody from doing anything they ought to be able to when the only available evidence points to the exact opposite being the case, but I still don't understand why the BBC perpetuates this myth to the detriment of both the license and consumer experience. The BBC, collectively, _does_ know better, yet is toeing the party line. What happened to informing educating and the public purpose? M. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 17:37, Mo McRoberts m...@nevali.net wrote: In fact, why is ANY of this different to me recording a copy with a PVR[0] (a copy which, incidentally, I can keep pretty much indefinitely and in a format which is convenient)? the belated footnote: [0] be it entirely hardware/firmware, or a USB/PCI tuner with PVR software, or whatever. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] BBC iPlayer for Apple TV
On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 5:54 PM, Ian Forrester ian.forres...@bbc.co.uk wrote: Well I think this is the issue, in a nutshell. I can't, won't talk for the rest of the BBC but it seems if your streaming iplayer content inside the UK on to your PC device, that's fine. However if you download the files your on the wrong side of a line. If it was that simple that would be great but if your streaming to a consumer device/appliance then your also on the wrong side of the imaginary line. If so, this really makes things difficult for those advocating for 'consumer devices' to better support Web standards, because the distinction seems essentially to be a requirement that Webby stuff be hard to use. If it works nicely 'out of the box' without being a complicated computer-y experience, then it goes in the 'consumer appliance' pile? This gets very tricky when you create a plugin for something like XBMC,Boxee,Plex which can be both a PC and appliance. The notions of device, appliance and PC are very blured but it sounds like deals have been done based on there differences. Rather than us speculate about the potential structure of possible deals, could someone wearing a BBC hat investigate the possibility of sharing some of these definitions? Generally if you take the p*** I'll get shouted at and I'll ask you nicely to close the service/script/prototype :) of course breaking the backstage licence will you a heavy knock at the door :) Publishing some definitions might help :) Dan - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
