Re: Resurrection of Christ
"why don't the resurrection narratives have the disciples going deaf and blind
after Jesus died and then receiving sight and hearing? Shouldn't there be some
consistency? Also, why aren't there any stories of the disciples being deaf
and blind initially?"
I suggest that these are the verses being referred to.
After the crucifixion, Mary Magdalene went to the garden and "saw Jesus
standing, and knew not that it was Jesus." (John 20:14) She thought Him to be
the gardener. That is, she "saw" Him but did not "recognize" Him. Then in John
20:16 and 20:18 Mary recognizes her Lord and realizes He is eternal in being.
She returns and tells the disciples, and they "see" Him (John 20:20).
Also after the crucifixion, two believers were walking on the road to Emmaus;
suddenly Jesus was walking with them, but they did not "recognize" Him. Then
they ate "bread" and their eyes were opened and they "recognized" Him:
"And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus
himself drew near, and went with them. But their eyes were held that they
should not know him And it came to pass, as he sat at meat with them, he
took bread, and blessed it, and brake, and gave to them. And their eyes were
opened, and they knew him..." Luke 24:13-31
Also in Luke Chapter 24 verses 39-44, the disciples "eat" "bread" with Jesus
and believe in Him.
Likewise during the days of Joseph there was a "famine" in the land of Canaan
and the brothers of Joseph came to Him for food (Genesis 42:5). "And Joseph
saw his brethren, and he knew them, but made himself strange unto them, and
spake roughly unto them; and he said unto them, 'Whence came ye?' And they
said, 'From the land of Canaan to buy food.' And Joseph knew his brethren, but
they knew not him." Joseph then gave them bread, and revealed Himself to His
brothers, saying "There will I nourish thee... And, behold, your eyes see."
(Genesis 45:11-12).
I have some notes on this at:
http://bahai-library.com/?file=poirier_iqan_unsealing_bible that you may find
useful. Use them as you wish.
Brent
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Smoking
I hope I can get away with one off-topic question which I'd like the answer to. My question is why governments (like US for example) haven't banned the sale of cigarettes. If they care about the health and well-being of society it would be a good idea. Why is it that many less problematic drugs are banned from sale by the FDA but the government allows cigarettes to be sold? I understand that cigarettes are not a product the FDA rules on. Am I not mistaken that if evaluated by FDA standards cigarettes would be banned? The FDA bans products that do good if risks of bad effects are high enough. Smoking does no good and has high risks.
DavidNeed more speed? Get Xtra Broadband!
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Re: Resurrection of Christ
Dear Susan and David,
I recently was presented with this topic while on a
boyscout campout a fellow parent inquired "what church
I went to". His interest in the Bahai Faith soon waned
when it became clear that I was not interested in
leaving my church to join his where "we worship a
risen Christ".
I live in a small town with a church on every corner
and I expressed not only our belief in the unity of
religions but stated that our Writings state its
purpose is to bring together, and that if it did not
serve that purpose it was better to be without it. I
expressed my bewilderment at so many churches all
claiming to be Christian. This risen Christ issue was
very big to him, I suppose in contrast to images of
Catholic crucufixes.
I could not help but think of Mary, who as I recall,
was the catalyst to calming the diciples afterward, in
that she recognized He indeed lived on in the faith
imbued in them. It has always been my thought that the
visions of Him were not physical events but spiritual
insights.
I shared with this parent that miracles in themselves
were not proof of divinity, which he readily agreed
to. The real proof of the Reality of Christ was that
his followers were able to receive his message of
"love one another".
As one who has had the "born again experience" and
grew from there to recognize the Faith, I was able to
be compassionate to his myopic view and yet firm and
unwavering in a real sense that I was not offending
the Holy Spirit as it manifested, but rather honoring
that Spirit in the recognition of Baha'u'llah. Our
Writings, as I remember/comprehend, say that to
distinguish one above another is error.
No one has the corner on the God market.
The beauty of this conversation, which I never would
have initiated on my own, was that a fellow boyscout
asked me about the main beliefs of the Baha'i
Faith...which I led into with the personal
responsiblity to investigate the truth.
warmly,
karen
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Dear David,
>
> Although Abdu'l-Baha does not say so explicitly, my
> reading of the
> early Christian sources, combined with Abdu'l-Baha's
> interpretation
> lead me to think that there were 'ressurrection'
> appearances of Jesus
> after the crucifixtion. They just weren't physical.
>
> warmest, Susan
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Re: Resurrection of Christ
Dear David,
Although Abdu'l-Baha does not say so explicitly, my reading of the
early Christian sources, combined with Abdu'l-Baha's interpretation
lead me to think that there were 'ressurrection' appearances of Jesus
after the crucifixtion. They just weren't physical.
warmest, Susan
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Re: Resurrection of Christ
Metaphor and analogy are great illuminators. They bring understanding in great gulps of light. However, when one examines them too closely, in most cases the bulb burns out. Sorry for the metaphor. Regards, ScottDavid Friedman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: There's another issue. 'Abdu'l-Baha refers to alleged miracles in the Gospels, saying that receiving sight and hearing referred to a spiritual awakening. If the writers used this to refer to a spiritual awakening as 'Abdu'l-Baha says then why don't the resurrection narratives have the disciples going deaf and blind after Jesus died and then receiving sight and hearing? Shouldn't there be some consistency? Also, why
aren't there any stories of the disciples being deaf and blind initially? DavidLooking for love? Check out XtraMSN Personals The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto ("e-mail") is sent by the Johnson County Community College ("JCCC") and is intended to be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please immediately notify JCCC
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As human beings, we are endowed with freedom of choice, and we cannot shuffle off our responsibility upon the shoulders of God or nature. We must shoulder it ourselves. It is our responsibility. Arnold J. Toynbee
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Re: Resurrection of Christ
Quite right. ScottGilberto Simpson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 10/11/06, David Friedman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:>> There's another issue. 'Abdu'l-Baha refers to alleged miracles in the> Gospels, saying that receiving sight and hearing referred to a spiritual> awakening. If the writers used this to refer to a spiritual awakening as> 'Abdu'l-Baha says then why don't the resurrection narratives have the> disciples going deaf and blind after Jesus died and then receiving sight and> hearing? Shouldn't there be some consistency? Also, why aren't there any> stories of the disciples being deaf and blind initially?>If you count Paul as a disciple the NT describes him being struckblind and then healed although not in
the exact way that you describe.In terms of consistency, I don't think metaphors are necessarily aboutconsistency. If it were too consistent it would just be some kind ofcode, not really a metaphor.The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto ("e-mail") is sent by the Johnson County Community College ("JCCC") and is intended to be confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and disclosures acts or other legal rules. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that retention, dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please immediately notify JCCC by email reply and immediately and permanently delete this e-mail message and any attachments thereto. Thank
you.__You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Unsubscribe: send a blank email to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subscribe: http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-stBaha'i Studies is available through the following:Mail - mailto:bahai-st@list.jccc.eduWeb - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-stNews - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-stPublic - http://www.escribe.com/religion/bahaistOld Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.netNew Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/bahai-st@list.jccc.edu
As human beings, we are endowed with freedom of choice, and we cannot shuffle off our responsibility upon the shoulders of God or nature. We must shoulder it ourselves. It is our responsibility. Arnold J. Toynbee
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Re: Is it okay? . . . .
Dean Betts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Is "One" the name of a character in this book? Good question. In a word no, but a word doesn't suffice. So . . . . I had to invent a pronoun usage for a creature that is made up of two entities in close union. "I", "You", "He", "She", "We and Us" didn't work. Collectively they are "The Ahnal" Ahnal being the name they share. The male and the female have separate names, but not separate identities, in a way. The race is the only non-human race in full partnership in the Alliance. Other races not being so technologically advanced on first contact. Sophont species, however, are very rare. "One" as a pronoun was set up
earlier in the book, but far enough before that quote that it wouldn't make sense to go back that far. Speculative fiction seems to need speculation. They have the ability to create chords in speech and speak in a kind of musical glyph that cannot be imitated by a human being's larynx, though with great study a person might learn to understand some of the language as it is spoken. It's necessary to use an electronic device as a translator. I am sorry for the long-winded explanation.
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As human beings, we are endowed with freedom of choice, and we cannot shuffle off our responsibility upon the shoulders of God or nature. We must shoulder it ourselves. It is our responsibility. Arnold J. Toynbee
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Re: Resurrection of Christ
On 10/11/06, David Friedman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
There's another issue. 'Abdu'l-Baha refers to alleged miracles in the
Gospels, saying that receiving sight and hearing referred to a spiritual
awakening. If the writers used this to refer to a spiritual awakening as
'Abdu'l-Baha says then why don't the resurrection narratives have the
disciples going deaf and blind after Jesus died and then receiving sight and
hearing? Shouldn't there be some consistency? Also, why aren't there any
stories of the disciples being deaf and blind initially?
If you count Paul as a disciple the NT describes him being struck
blind and then healed although not in the exact way that you describe.
In terms of consistency, I don't think metaphors are necessarily about
consistency. If it were too consistent it would just be some kind of
code, not really a metaphor.
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