Re: forwarders used in order or based on RTT ?
On Mon, Oct 19, 2020 at 11:26 AM Victoria Risk wrote: > > The ARM was updated in 9.16.6. Sorry it took us so long! > > from https://gitlab.isc.org/isc-projects/bind9/-/issues/2030 > Forwarders are typically used when an administrator does not wish for > all the servers at a given site to interact directly with the rest of > the Internet. For example, a common scenario is when multiple internal > DNS servers are behind an Internet firewall. Servers behind the firewall > forward their requests to the server with external access, which queries > Internet DNS servers on the internal servers' behalf. > > Another scenario (largely now superseded by Response Policy Zones) is to > send queries first to a custom server for RBL processing before > forwarding them to the wider Internet. > > There may be one or more forwarders in a given setup. The order in which > the forwarders are listed in ``named.conf`` does not determine the > sequence in which they are queried; rather, ``named`` uses the response > times from previous queries to select the server that is likely to > respond the most quickly. A server that has not yet been queried is > given an initial small random response time to ensure that it is tried > at least once. Dynamic adjustment of the recorded response times ensures > that all forwarders are queried, even those with slower response times. > This permits changes in behavior based on server responsiveness. Awesome, thank you -- that's clean and easy to understand. W > > Vicky > ___ > Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe > from this list > > ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. > Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. > > > bind-users mailing list > bind-users@lists.isc.org > https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users -- I don't think the execution is relevant when it was obviously a bad idea in the first place. This is like putting rabid weasels in your pants, and later expressing regret at having chosen those particular rabid weasels and that pair of pants. ---maf ___ Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. bind-users mailing list bind-users@lists.isc.org https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users
Re: forwarders used in order or based on RTT ?
The ARM was updated in 9.16.6. Sorry it took us so long! from https://gitlab.isc.org/isc-projects/bind9/-/issues/2030 Forwarders are typically used when an administrator does not wish for all the servers at a given site to interact directly with the rest of the Internet. For example, a common scenario is when multiple internal DNS servers are behind an Internet firewall. Servers behind the firewall forward their requests to the server with external access, which queries Internet DNS servers on the internal servers' behalf. Another scenario (largely now superseded by Response Policy Zones) is to send queries first to a custom server for RBL processing before forwarding them to the wider Internet. There may be one or more forwarders in a given setup. The order in which the forwarders are listed in ``named.conf`` does not determine the sequence in which they are queried; rather, ``named`` uses the response times from previous queries to select the server that is likely to respond the most quickly. A server that has not yet been queried is given an initial small random response time to ensure that it is tried at least once. Dynamic adjustment of the recorded response times ensures that all forwarders are queried, even those with slower response times. This permits changes in behavior based on server responsiveness. Vicky ___ Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. bind-users mailing list bind-users@lists.isc.org https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users
Re: forwarders used in order or based on RTT ?
On Sun, Oct 18, 2020 at 2:32 PM @lbutlr wrote: > > On 16 Oct 2020, at 08:36, Bob Harold wrote: > > That is certainly not obvious. How do I request improving the manual? > > > > "in turn" would seem to imply "in order", and the order would logically be > > the order I listed them.] > > I disagree. In turn means one is tried, then if that fails the next is tried. > There is no implication at all that the order they are tried in is the order > specified. > > It would not hurt anything to say they were tried in turn accords to RTT, but > as it stands the documentation doesn’t say what you think it says. > > Again, "in turn" doesn’t mean "in the order I expect" it simply means one > after another until all are checked (or one succeeds). "In turn" might not strictly mean in the order listed (the definitions converge around 1: "in succession", or 2: a causal step from a previous outcome), but there is *implication* that it is in the order listed. If I said "The carolers visited the houses in turn", the *implication* is that they visited the first house, then the second, then the third, etc and not the first, then the seventeenth, etc. Yes, there is ambiguity - it appears that this usage is that the succession is "in RTT order", and not "in listed order", but the fact that it is ambiguous, and people are unsure what is meant, demonstrates a bug in the documentation. W > > > -- > "Are you pondering what I'm pondering?" > "Wuh, I think so, Brain, but I prefer Space Jelly." > > ___ > Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe > from this list > > ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. > Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. > > > bind-users mailing list > bind-users@lists.isc.org > https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users -- I don't think the execution is relevant when it was obviously a bad idea in the first place. This is like putting rabid weasels in your pants, and later expressing regret at having chosen those particular rabid weasels and that pair of pants. ---maf ___ Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. bind-users mailing list bind-users@lists.isc.org https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users
Re: forwarders used in order or based on RTT ?
On 16 Oct 2020, at 08:36, Bob Harold wrote: > That is certainly not obvious. How do I request improving the manual? > > "in turn" would seem to imply "in order", and the order would logically be > the order I listed them.] I disagree. In turn means one is tried, then if that fails the next is tried. There is no implication at all that the order they are tried in is the order specified. It would not hurt anything to say they were tried in turn accords to RTT, but as it stands the documentation doesn’t say what you think it says. Again, "in turn" doesn’t mean "in the order I expect" it simply means one after another until all are checked (or one succeeds). -- "Are you pondering what I'm pondering?" "Wuh, I think so, Brain, but I prefer Space Jelly." ___ Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. bind-users mailing list bind-users@lists.isc.org https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users
Re: forwarders used in order or based on RTT ?
On Fri, Oct 16, 2020 at 10:22 AM Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: >> On 16.10.20 09:56, Bob Harold wrote: > >The BIND ARM (9.16.2) says: > >"There may be one or more forwarders, and they are queried in turn until > >the list is exhausted or an answer is found." > > > >But [an old mailinglist post] says: > >"Forwarders are selected based on an RTT(round-trip-time)-based algorithm" > > > >So which is correct? > > both are. The ARM does not say they are queried in defined order. > The order is defined by RTT To be fair, the ARM strongly implies in its context that it's the order you put them in the list. The ARM discrepancy has already been noted by ISC, but the first bug report in the long long ago on it was never really fixed.They raised the issue again internally a few months ago and so I would anticipate that the ARM will be fixed in a not too distant release. https://gitlab.isc.org/isc-projects/bind9/-/issues/2030 ___ Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. bind-users mailing list bind-users@lists.isc.org https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users
Re: forwarders used in order or based on RTT ?
That is certainly not obvious. How do I request improving the manual? "in turn" would seem to imply "in order", and the order would logically be the order I listed them. -- Bob Harold DNS and DHCP Hostmaster - UMNet Information and Technology Services (ITS) rharo...@umich.edu 734-512-7038 On Fri, Oct 16, 2020 at 10:21 AM Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote: > On 16.10.20 09:56, Bob Harold wrote: > >The BIND ARM (9.16.2) says: > >"There may be one or more forwarders, and they are queried in turn until > >the list is exhausted > >or an answer is found." > > > >But > >https://lists.isc.org/pipermail/bind-users/2015-August/095544.html > >says: > >"Forwarders are selected based on an RTT(round-trip-time)-based algorithm" > > > >So which is correct? > > both are. The ARM does not say they are queried in defined order. > The order is defined by RTT > > >And did it change at some point? > > -- > Matus UHLAR - fantomas, uh...@fantomas.sk ; http://www.fantomas.sk/ > Warning: I wish NOT to receive e-mail advertising to this address. > Varovanie: na tuto adresu chcem NEDOSTAVAT akukolvek reklamnu postu. > Fucking windows! Bring Bill Gates! (Southpark the movie) > ___ > Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to > unsubscribe from this list > > ISC funds the development of this software with paid support > subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more > information. > > > bind-users mailing list > bind-users@lists.isc.org > https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users > ___ Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. bind-users mailing list bind-users@lists.isc.org https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users
Re: forwarders used in order or based on RTT ?
On 16.10.20 09:56, Bob Harold wrote: The BIND ARM (9.16.2) says: "There may be one or more forwarders, and they are queried in turn until the list is exhausted or an answer is found." But https://lists.isc.org/pipermail/bind-users/2015-August/095544.html says: "Forwarders are selected based on an RTT(round-trip-time)-based algorithm" So which is correct? both are. The ARM does not say they are queried in defined order. The order is defined by RTT And did it change at some point? -- Matus UHLAR - fantomas, uh...@fantomas.sk ; http://www.fantomas.sk/ Warning: I wish NOT to receive e-mail advertising to this address. Varovanie: na tuto adresu chcem NEDOSTAVAT akukolvek reklamnu postu. Fucking windows! Bring Bill Gates! (Southpark the movie) ___ Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information. bind-users mailing list bind-users@lists.isc.org https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users
