[Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
need some help from the group. A few months ago I told everyone about my old ewe Sally who started to refuse to eat. I wormed her with Levasole and she showed great improvement about a day later and began to act like her old self. Appetite good, more active, etc. Then about 2 weeks later she started to backslide. I began drenching her with sheep nutri-drench 1 ounce twice a day. Not much improvement so I gave her the powdered garlic/ molasses drench I posted on the list. Once again she showed great improvement the next day and had a great appetite. Two weeks later she backslides again. So bad this time my husband asked me if I wanted him to put her down. I wasn't ready to give up so I purchased Ivomec sheep drench and gave her 10 cc's.Next day she once again showed great improvement, ate cob and hay and whatever else I could sneak to her. Weight started coming back and all was good for two weeks. This morning she is back to refusing her food. I am at a loss here as to what is going on. Doesn't make sense to me that the wormer would help if she DIDN'T have parasites. Could it be I am under-drenching? Sally weighs 60 lbs. She is a black hawaiian so it's not as easy to judge her gum color but her inner eye isn't super pink, somewhere in the mid range I think. Anyway I am truly at a loss here on what to try next so any suggestions would really help. Dayna Denmark Half Ass Acres ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
Hi Dayna, I can provide some ideas but no guarantees. It sounds like your Sally is under a continual parasite load from her environment. Two weeks after worming is about the time most parasites are beginning to be active in a re-infected sheep. Most sheep would not show symptoms simply because they are in better condition. Your Sally being in frail condition just deteriates quickly. So I would give her a injectable wormer like the Dectomax. The Dectomax lasts in theory 8 weeks against parasites. In reality the Dectomax does last much longer but its effectiveness tapers off considerably after three weeks. Knowing that the Dectomax will not be a perfect solution I would provide a Safeguard drench (different family of wormer) every other week. This should control the parasites and a fecal test by your vet to prove she is free of parasites should be done. Coccidiosis could also be problematic and the fecal test would show if it is present. Follow the directions for "Corid" in the drinking water if they are present. Now that Sally is free of parasites address her environment and nutrition. Get her away from old pastures ASAP. Feed her the best hay and feed possible and within reason all she can eat. The remaining concern is if she is pregnant. If she is as frail as it sounds and pregnant neither the fetus or mother will likely survive. If she does have the lamb and it lives I would immediately turn it into a bottle baby. The focus on Sally is to build her back up into full condition before allowing any new opportunity for parasites (or ram) to act on her. There are other possibilities for Sally's condition such as OPP, Johnes disease, old age, tumors,... so everything above could be of no benefit. And as you mentioned "putting her down" might be the most humane action taken. Such a decision is difficult and requires a total measure of Sally's remaining potential to you. Wishing you luck, Mark Subject: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED need some help from the group. A few months ago I told everyone about my old ewe Sally who started to refuse to eat. I wormed her with Levasole and she showed great improvement about a day later and began to act like her old self. Appetite good, more active, etc. Then about 2 weeks later she started to backslide. I began drenching her with sheep nutri-drench 1 ounce twice a day. Not much improvement so I gave her the powdered garlic/ molasses drench I posted on the list. Once again she showed great improvement the next day and had a great appetite. Two weeks later she backslides again. So bad this time my husband asked me if I wanted him to put her down. I wasn't ready to give up so I purchased Ivomec sheep drench and gave her 10 cc's.Next day she once again showed great improvement, ate cob and hay and whatever else I could sneak to her. Weight started coming back and all was good for two weeks. This morning she is back to refusing her food. I am at a loss here as to what is going on. Doesn't make sense to me that the wormer would help if she DIDN'T have parasites. Could it be I am under-drenching? Sally weighs 60 lbs. She is a black hawaiian so it's not as easy to judge her gum color but her inner eye isn't super pink, somewhere in the mid range I think. Anyway I am truly at a loss here on what to try next so any suggestions would really help. Dayna Denmark Half Ass Acres ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
Just my 2 cents on wormers . I have found safeguard to be as effective as WATER in worming sheep (in other words NOT!). I would suggest, if that is the problem with Sally, that you use Cydectin drench instead of safeguard. I do agree that an injectable is in order and switching between 2 different kinds should be done every 2 weeks until the problem is solved. Moving her to a NEW pasture that has not been grazed by sheep would be ideal. Onalee -Original Message- From: blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info [mailto:blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info] On Behalf Of The Wintermutes Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2009 11:52 PM To: blackbelly@lists.blackbellysheep.info Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED Hi Dayna, I can provide some ideas but no guarantees. It sounds like your Sally is under a continual parasite load from her environment. Two weeks after worming is about the time most parasites are beginning to be active in a re-infected sheep. Most sheep would not show symptoms simply because they are in better condition. Your Sally being in frail condition just deteriates quickly. So I would give her a injectable wormer like the Dectomax. The Dectomax lasts in theory 8 weeks against parasites. In reality the Dectomax does last much longer but its effectiveness tapers off considerably after three weeks. Knowing that the Dectomax will not be a perfect solution I would provide a Safeguard drench (different family of wormer) every other week. This should control the parasites and a fecal test by your vet to prove she is free of parasites should be done. Coccidiosis could also be problematic and the fecal test would show if it is present. Follow the directions for "Corid" in the drinking water if they are present. Now that Sally is free of parasites address her environment and nutrition. Get her away from old pastures ASAP. Feed her the best hay and feed possible and within reason all she can eat. The remaining concern is if she is pregnant. If she is as frail as it sounds and pregnant neither the fetus or mother will likely survive. If she does have the lamb and it lives I would immediately turn it into a bottle baby. The focus on Sally is to build her back up into full condition before allowing any new opportunity for parasites (or ram) to act on her. There are other possibilities for Sally's condition such as OPP, Johnes disease, old age, tumors,... so everything above could be of no benefit. And as you mentioned "putting her down" might be the most humane action taken. Such a decision is difficult and requires a total measure of Sally's remaining potential to you. Wishing you luck, Mark Subject: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED need some help from the group. A few months ago I told everyone about my old ewe Sally who started to refuse to eat. I wormed her with Levasole and she showed great improvement about a day later and began to act like her old self. Appetite good, more active, etc. Then about 2 weeks later she started to backslide. I began drenching her with sheep nutri-drench 1 ounce twice a day. Not much improvement so I gave her the powdered garlic/ molasses drench I posted on the list. Once again she showed great improvement the next day and had a great appetite. Two weeks later she backslides again. So bad this time my husband asked me if I wanted him to put her down. I wasn't ready to give up so I purchased Ivomec sheep drench and gave her 10 cc's.Next day she once again showed great improvement, ate cob and hay and whatever else I could sneak to her. Weight started coming back and all was good for two weeks. This morning she is back to refusing her food. I am at a loss here as to what is going on. Doesn't make sense to me that the wormer would help if she DIDN'T have parasites. Could it be I am under-drenching? Sally weighs 60 lbs. She is a black hawaiian so it's not as easy to judge her gum color but her inner eye isn't super pink, somewhere in the mid range I think. Anyway I am truly at a loss here on what to try next so any suggestions would really help. Dayna Denmark Half Ass Acres ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
If the Safeguard isn't effective then I agree why bother using it. But Safeguard is still effective on many populations of parasites (those that have not developed resistance). The nice thing about Safeguard is it is much safer as the name implies on a weak animal. I know of no other wormer safer to use on an infirm animal. I really like cydectin drench and use it selectively on problem sheep. But I have found that the cydectin drench given to a very weak sheep seems to just speed along death. I have no problem using cydectin drench in a sheep after it has all its feet "out-of-the-grave". Mark Just my 2 cents on wormers . I have found safeguard to be as effective as WATER in worming sheep (in other words NOT!). I would suggest, if that is the problem with Sally, that you use Cydectin drench instead of safeguard. I do agree that an injectable is in order and switching between 2 different kinds should be done every 2 weeks until the problem is solved. Moving her to a NEW pasture that has not been grazed by sheep would be ideal. Onalee Hi Dayna, I can provide some ideas but no guarantees. It sounds like your Sally is under a continual parasite load from her environment. Two weeks after worming is about the time most parasites are beginning to be active in a re-infected sheep. Most sheep would not show symptoms simply because they are in better condition. Your Sally being in frail condition just deteriates quickly. So I would give her a injectable wormer like the Dectomax. The Dectomax lasts in theory 8 weeks against parasites. In reality the Dectomax does last much longer but its effectiveness tapers off considerably after three weeks. Knowing that the Dectomax will not be a perfect solution I would provide a Safeguard drench (different family of wormer) every other week. This should control the parasites and a fecal test by your vet to prove she is free of parasites should be done. Coccidiosis could also be problematic and the fecal test would show if it is present. Follow the directions for "Corid" in the drinking water if they are present. Now that Sally is free of parasites address her environment and nutrition. Get her away from old pastures ASAP. Feed her the best hay and feed possible and within reason all she can eat. The remaining concern is if she is pregnant. If she is as frail as it sounds and pregnant neither the fetus or mother will likely survive. If she does have the lamb and it lives I would immediately turn it into a bottle baby. The focus on Sally is to build her back up into full condition before allowing any new opportunity for parasites (or ram) to act on her. There are other possibilities for Sally's condition such as OPP, Johnes disease, old age, tumors,... so everything above could be of no benefit. And as you mentioned "putting her down" might be the most humane action taken. Such a decision is difficult and requires a total measure of Sally's remaining potential to you. Wishing you luck, Mark Subject: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED need some help from the group. A few months ago I told everyone about my old ewe Sally who started to refuse to eat. I wormed her with Levasole and she showed great improvement about a day later and began to act like her old self. Appetite good, more active, etc. Then about 2 weeks later she started to backslide. I began drenching her with sheep nutri-drench 1 ounce twice a day. Not much improvement so I gave her the powdered garlic/ molasses drench I posted on the list. Once again she showed great improvement the next day and had a great appetite. Two weeks later she backslides again. So bad this time my husband asked me if I wanted him to put her down. I wasn't ready to give up so I purchased Ivomec sheep drench and gave her 10 cc's.Next day she once again showed great improvement, ate cob and hay and whatever else I could sneak to her. Weight started coming back and all was good for two weeks. This morning she is back to refusing her food. I am at a loss here as to what is going on. Doesn't make sense to me that the wormer would help if she DIDN'T have parasites. Could it be I am under-drenching? Sally weighs 60 lbs. She is a black hawaiian so it's not as easy to judge her gum color but her inner eye isn't super pink, somewhere in the mid range I think. Anyway I am truly at a loss here on what to try next so any suggestions would really help. Dayna Denmark Half Ass Acres ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
A little off the subject of poor Sally but has anyone tried the Safeguard mineral block? ($40 here) Someone locally said they tried it on cattle and it wasn't enough. I think I'll get one since it's so hard to segregate each animal and the alfalfa pellets I put the liquid one into. I've tried squirting it into their mouths but they shake it away. I also am in favor of taking the stool to the vet. Ours likes at least a 1/2 a cup to work with and only charges me $12 for the test. (The vet laughed at the small amount I brought in the first time) Aloha a hui hou kaua! (Goodbye until we meet again) Barbara Heavens POB 1869, Kea`au, Hawaii 96749 (808) 968-0814 ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
Just from my experience, I used Safeguard on my sheep at my Vet's suggestion (changing from Ivomec which I had always used before with no problems), shortly after that 3 died. After several trips of the vet to me and me to the vet with other sick sheep, she realized that she failed to tell me that I needed to use the Safeguard AT LEAST 3-4 times the dose on the label for it to do anything. Since she KNEW that I had just wormed the sheep, she did not do any fecals during this time (until she realized that she didn't tell me HOW to use it) and was completely stumped why they were sick. At that point, I had one sheep that a different vet drew blood on and said would not live another day due to anemia. That vet gave it a shot of B-12. When I got home I gave it Cydectin and an ivomec injection that day since I had nothing to lose, forced electrolytes and iron for 5 days until it started eating again and it lived. That sheep is still more susceptible to barber pole worms than the others and I have to watch it carefully and worm it more often, but never again will I use safeguard. Since I had never had a problem with worms before and I KNEW that I had wormed them with what the vet told me to, these sheep dying was a nightmare and no one could tell me why they were dying. We had had an extremely dry spring and the sheep were grazing very low grass, which contributed to the problem. I made arrangements with a neighbor to move them to a different pasture for a while that never had sheep on it and that made a huge difference, too. If Sally is anemic from worms, then you may also want to add an iron supplement to her diet to help her build up her red blood cells and if she's not drinking, she needs electrolytes (I used "JUMP START" which also has sucrose for energy and probiotics) forced down her to keep her organs functioning. You should definitely have your vet do a fecal and do more than one from different samples if you can afford it because I've seen them be wrong. Onalee -Original Message- From: blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info [mailto:blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info] On Behalf Of The Wintermutes Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 11:21 AM To: blackbelly@lists.blackbellysheep.info Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED If the Safeguard isn't effective then I agree why bother using it. But Safeguard is still effective on many populations of parasites (those that have not developed resistance). The nice thing about Safeguard is it is much safer as the name implies on a weak animal. I know of no other wormer safer to use on an infirm animal. I really like cydectin drench and use it selectively on problem sheep. But I have found that the cydectin drench given to a very weak sheep seems to just speed along death. I have no problem using cydectin drench in a sheep after it has all its feet "out-of-the-grave". Mark Just my 2 cents on wormers . I have found safeguard to be as effective as WATER in worming sheep (in other words NOT!). I would suggest, if that is the problem with Sally, that you use Cydectin drench instead of safeguard. I do agree that an injectable is in order and switching between 2 different kinds should be done every 2 weeks until the problem is solved. Moving her to a NEW pasture that has not been grazed by sheep would be ideal. Onalee Hi Dayna, I can provide some ideas but no guarantees. It sounds like your Sally is under a continual parasite load from her environment. Two weeks after worming is about the time most parasites are beginning to be active in a re-infected sheep. Most sheep would not show symptoms simply because they are in better condition. Your Sally being in frail condition just deteriates quickly. So I would give her a injectable wormer like the Dectomax. The Dectomax lasts in theory 8 weeks against parasites. In reality the Dectomax does last much longer but its effectiveness tapers off considerably after three weeks. Knowing that the Dectomax will not be a perfect solution I would provide a Safeguard drench (different family of wormer) every other week. This should control the parasites and a fecal test by your vet to prove she is free of parasites should be done. Coccidiosis could also be problematic and the fecal test would show if it is present. Follow the directions for "Corid" in the drinking water if they are present. Now that Sally is free of parasites address her environment and nutrition. Get her away from old pastures ASAP. Feed her the best hay and feed possible and within reason all she can eat. The remaining concern is if she is pregnant. If she is as frail as it sounds and pregnant neither the fetus or mother will likely survive. If she does have the lamb and it lives I would immediately turn it into a bottle baby. The focus on Sally is to build her back up into full condition before allowing any new opportunity
Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
The problem with these is you don't know which ones are eating it and which aren't - some will not touch these blocks while others may eat it until they pop, so some get some wormer and others get none - that's the same with the safeguard pellets, some will eat them and some won't. Onalee -Original Message- From: blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info [mailto:blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info] On Behalf Of j...@netzero.net Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 12:02 PM To: blackbelly@lists.blackbellysheep.info Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED A little off the subject of poor Sally but has anyone tried the Safeguard mineral block? ($40 here) Someone locally said they tried it on cattle and it wasn't enough. I think I'll get one since it's so hard to segregate each animal and the alfalfa pellets I put the liquid one into. I've tried squirting it into their mouths but they shake it away. I also am in favor of taking the stool to the vet. Ours likes at least a 1/2 a cup to work with and only charges me $12 for the test. (The vet laughed at the small amount I brought in the first time) Aloha a hui hou kaua! (Goodbye until we meet again) Barbara Heavens POB 1869, Kea`au, Hawaii 96749 (808) 968-0814 ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED
I agree. In many parts of the country the worms are all immune to Safeguard. We don't use it at all any more. Bonnie - Original Message - From: "Onalee Israel" To: Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 10:07 AM Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED Just my 2 cents on wormers . I have found safeguard to be as effective as WATER in worming sheep (in other words NOT!). I would suggest, if that is the problem with Sally, that you use Cydectin drench instead of safeguard. I do agree that an injectable is in order and switching between 2 different kinds should be done every 2 weeks until the problem is solved. Moving her to a NEW pasture that has not been grazed by sheep would be ideal. Onalee -Original Message- From: blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info [mailto:blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info] On Behalf Of The Wintermutes Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2009 11:52 PM To: blackbelly@lists.blackbellysheep.info Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED Hi Dayna, I can provide some ideas but no guarantees. It sounds like your Sally is under a continual parasite load from her environment. Two weeks after worming is about the time most parasites are beginning to be active in a re-infected sheep. Most sheep would not show symptoms simply because they are in better condition. Your Sally being in frail condition just deteriates quickly. So I would give her a injectable wormer like the Dectomax. The Dectomax lasts in theory 8 weeks against parasites. In reality the Dectomax does last much longer but its effectiveness tapers off considerably after three weeks. Knowing that the Dectomax will not be a perfect solution I would provide a Safeguard drench (different family of wormer) every other week. This should control the parasites and a fecal test by your vet to prove she is free of parasites should be done. Coccidiosis could also be problematic and the fecal test would show if it is present. Follow the directions for "Corid" in the drinking water if they are present. Now that Sally is free of parasites address her environment and nutrition. Get her away from old pastures ASAP. Feed her the best hay and feed possible and within reason all she can eat. The remaining concern is if she is pregnant. If she is as frail as it sounds and pregnant neither the fetus or mother will likely survive. If she does have the lamb and it lives I would immediately turn it into a bottle baby. The focus on Sally is to build her back up into full condition before allowing any new opportunity for parasites (or ram) to act on her. There are other possibilities for Sally's condition such as OPP, Johnes disease, old age, tumors,... so everything above could be of no benefit. And as you mentioned "putting her down" might be the most humane action taken. Such a decision is difficult and requires a total measure of Sally's remaining potential to you. Wishing you luck, Mark Subject: [Blackbelly] ADVICE NEEDED need some help from the group. A few months ago I told everyone about my old ewe Sally who started to refuse to eat. I wormed her with Levasole and she showed great improvement about a day later and began to act like her old self. Appetite good, more active, etc. Then about 2 weeks later she started to backslide. I began drenching her with sheep nutri-drench 1 ounce twice a day. Not much improvement so I gave her the powdered garlic/ molasses drench I posted on the list. Once again she showed great improvement the next day and had a great appetite. Two weeks later she backslides again. So bad this time my husband asked me if I wanted him to put her down. I wasn't ready to give up so I purchased Ivomec sheep drench and gave her 10 cc's.Next day she once again showed great improvement, ate cob and hay and whatever else I could sneak to her. Weight started coming back and all was good for two weeks. This morning she is back to refusing her food. I am at a loss here as to what is going on. Doesn't make sense to me that the wormer would help if she DIDN'T have parasites. Could it be I am under-drenching? Sally weighs 60 lbs. She is a black hawaiian so it's not as easy to judge her gum color but her inner eye isn't super pink, somewhere in the mid range I think. Anyway I am truly at a loss here on what to try next so any suggestions would really help. Dayna Denmark Half Ass Acres ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.co
