Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
Thanks to everyone on the forum for all your research and advice and kind remarks. So, I almost ordered some formaldehyde, but did not. I thought more about it, and figured, you know, a shot of ethyl alcohol in a cyst would do the same thing, (formaldehyde is 10% alcohol anyway) or iodine or most anything that would kill bacteria. Plus, when I took Marleys' head in to be European mounted, the taxidermist really steered me away from it. (I had no idea it was illegal in California). I just injected the abscess on Lily's face twice with Penn-G. So, update. The main vet at our local place, Tri-County Vet in Gilroy, ca. raises sheep and has had luck simply using penn-G in a high dose for a month on his animals that get Coryne. It's totally off-label, and, not a miracle cure. The regimen is isolate the sick, and give 12ml per 100lb of animal, sub-Q once a day and add a good bit of alfalfa to the otherwise local hay to supplement the nutritional value. So, they not only get some antibiotic help, they get a supplemented diet. On any other year, I have not had to supplement the hay with anything. But in this case, they get a good amount of alfalfa, every day. Bear in mind, the non-symptomatic goats and sheep I have are plump, spry and healthy. They eat only the hay/graze on my property. No supplements, except garden clippings, and green grass from the mower. Occasional treats of grain or peanuts. The other thing I need to mention is: some animals have had visible caseous abscesses and appear plump and healthy. Marley died with no visible skin eruptions, and Lily, just got one, but has been getting skinny for awhile--so she has had it internally for some time. From what I have read, it is not clear how effective their own antibodies are, to preventing further infection. For instance, if an animal simply gets an abscess on the lymph node in the neck first, does that mean it won't get it internally? Not sure. Also, there is a vaccine, which is made from dead bacteria, and helps them develop antibodies, but it's efficacy is not really known either. After 2.5 weeks of single-handedly shooting 2 really sick, 1 maybe sick, 1 with bad lungs and 3 that have had abscesses but otherwise, look great, I got tired of that injection regimen of 7 sheep and have narrowed it down to 3 animals, for the rest of the 1.5 weeks. It will be interesting to discuss these animals on this forum, for posterity. I don't expect a miracle, but let's see what happens. Caseous is also called the "wasting disease", because, seemingly no matter how much they eat, they still tend to wither away. Besides the skinny ribs, the other place to look is their rear, is it sunken, instead of plump? And the tail is like an empty sock. The disease also effects their ability to make a good coat, and winter is coming, so, we will see how they do. Lily the ewe, about 7 years old, on a malnutrition scale of 1-10, with 10 being dead, she looks like a 8 or 9. Marley was a 10--appearance-wise. After her being in a pen with 3 other girls with tons of penicillin and fed a decent amount of alfalfa plus local hay, for 2.5 weeks, she looks about the same--but does not look worse. I don't expect a miracle, but, I am comparing her to the next animal we will discuss. Lily's the one who also had a visible caseous on her neck which drained/popped last week and is drying out now. She obviously has it in her body, since she has that wasting-look. Maybe the abscess was taking a lot out of her system, and if she is continued to be fed better-than usual food, she might gain weight after a month of antibiotics. She is part wool sheep and usually is our "Big Mama", but not right now. We will see how her winter coat shapes up. Verne the ram, also, about 7 years old, started as a solid 9 on the scale, now looks like a 6 or 7! I am surprised. His rear area looks a bit better and his ribs are almost invisible now, which is good. Tail is still too skinny, though. He has never had visible caseous, but, neither did Marley. We will see how his coat shapes up as well. We have had 80-100*F days and barely 60*F evenings, so, no winter coats, yet. Harpo the ram, about 5 years old, has never had visible caseous, but looks a bit skinny in his rear and tail. I normally refer to him as my "rock star:" since his coat is usually amazing. It looks pretty good right now, he's just a 3-4 on the malnutrition scale. He has changed little since the regimen. Maybe I just never noticed he has a skinny rear, and he has not lost weight. Can't see his ribs, because his mane is actually pretty good. The one I mentioned above, with bad lungs, is old Stella, no idea how old she is, but she moves slow (can still run plenty fast, though), and has always been deaf as a post, as I have had her for the last 7 years or so. The vet said her lungs sounded the worst, but she's not skinny at all. She might have simply had real pneumonia. I think 2.5 weeks of 10ml penn G per day should be OK for that. I am d
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
huh I started searching around... where the heck do I get Formaldehyde? Amazon. Of course http://www.amazon.com/Formaldehyde-approx-grade-Pharma-grade-shipped/dp/B00CY4O07Y read the last review bingo. "This product saved one of our oldest goats when she suddenly got CL. We injected it into her abscess multiple times before it could burst, and it dried the abscess out completely! Within a week or so it had completely shriveled up and fallen off! Specific instructions are online, but this is the right product for treating CL in goats!" _Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies. On Sat, Sep 12, 2015 at 9:00 PM, Michael Smith wrote: > they can get large, like the size of a plum cut in half and under the > skin. The are fairly firm. I have lanced one myself, it comes out like > white-grey toothpaste and smells. The vet I have first thought this > one was not Caseous, because it stank. I think it was coincidence, > because it was close to the mouth and may have had some mouth bacteria > in it as well, that helped it stink. I am sure they were all Caseous. > > I've done more searching today and read in more than one place about > people simply injecting the cyst itself with 1ml of formaldehyde > instead of opening them, draining, and cleaning the wound, and > expecting to disinfect everything that hits the ground. That treatment > regimen is in every "Scientific" report you can read on the web. The > more home-spun formaldehyde approach reportedly kills the bacteria in > their protective cyst, causes the cyst itself to dry up (of course), > and eventually just fall off--harmless. Some breeders have reportedly > tried it on many animals. It sounds almost too good to be true, but, > since every other treatment involves exposing the area to tons of live > bacterium--I'll give it a try. I've seen at least 3-4 of these cysts. > One is active now on a ewe and I might try the formaldehyde, the other > two on other ewes, one we treated, one we did not, and one on a ram, > which we got to too late and it had opened up, leaked out, and dried > up by the time we got to it. From my reading, if they are lucky, they > get one on the lower face and develop some form of antibodies for any > future infection. > > I suppose one is lucky if they catch a real obvious cyst on the face > or elsewhere on the skin. Marley never showed any outward symptoms. It > ravaged his body internally. Admittedly, with my new crazy-busy > position I took at my job, I'd been operating on auto-pilot and not > paying as close attention. He's always had strange issues with > shedding too early in the end of winter and having a not-so-marvelous > coat, so I became numb to trying to look for problems on him. > > I've now identified one other ram in imminent danger--normally hearty, > he is also skinny, two more rams that might be in trouble, and two > ewes in serious trouble (one is very old), and two, who have had > cysts, I plan to isolate and treat them all with large doses of Pen-G > for 30 days. > > The antibiotic regimen is a Hail Mary. Besides isolation, the papers > I've look up simply recommend culling for the truly infected. My local > sheep-herding Vet recommends it, because, I guess he has had some luck > with it. The woman vet I usually use-- knows this regimen from him. > She had not heard about the vaccine (efficacy of it is not really > entirely known--again, it causes a small case of it, and the animal > builds up antibodies), but I plan to try it ASAP and use it on any > lambs I have here from now on. It is NOT tested or developed for > goats. There's no vaccine for goats, yet. And I have 3 goats. > > The biggest issue is: leaving a pasture alone for 8 months or more, to > try to let it no longer be infected. My property is too small to try > to do that. There's a central place with the shelter, water, etc, and > if the bacteria is present, it can thrive there. > > -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies > > > On Sat, Sep 12, 2015 at 2:32 PM, Carol Elkins > wrote: >> Michael, I am so sorry you are having to go through this. >> >> Coryne psuedotuberculosis is the bacterium that causes the disease Caseous >> Lymphadenitis (CL) in sheep. There is no cure. See >> http://waddl.vetmed.wsu.edu/animal-disease-faq/caseous-lymphadenitis and >> other sources. >> >> An abscess on a sheep's jaw/throat is commonly the first symptom to appear >> with CL. But it is very easy to confuse with bottle jaw and milk goiter. >> I've read that CL abscesses are hard whereas bottle jaw and milk goiter >> lumps are soft. What do the abscesses on your sheep look and feel like? >> >> Carol >> >> At 02:15 PM 9/12/2015, you wrote: >>> >>> Thanks for everyone's advice. The Vet came and did a necropsy on Marley: >>> >>> Coryne psuedotuberculosis. All through his body. >>> >>> I have had a few of the abscesses on my sheeps neck or jaw before and >>> was aware this was contagious, but was not that aware of how >>> devastating it could be.. Now I am. >> >> >>
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
they can get large, like the size of a plum cut in half and under the skin. The are fairly firm. I have lanced one myself, it comes out like white-grey toothpaste and smells. The vet I have first thought this one was not Caseous, because it stank. I think it was coincidence, because it was close to the mouth and may have had some mouth bacteria in it as well, that helped it stink. I am sure they were all Caseous. I've done more searching today and read in more than one place about people simply injecting the cyst itself with 1ml of formaldehyde instead of opening them, draining, and cleaning the wound, and expecting to disinfect everything that hits the ground. That treatment regimen is in every "Scientific" report you can read on the web. The more home-spun formaldehyde approach reportedly kills the bacteria in their protective cyst, causes the cyst itself to dry up (of course), and eventually just fall off--harmless. Some breeders have reportedly tried it on many animals. It sounds almost too good to be true, but, since every other treatment involves exposing the area to tons of live bacterium--I'll give it a try. I've seen at least 3-4 of these cysts. One is active now on a ewe and I might try the formaldehyde, the other two on other ewes, one we treated, one we did not, and one on a ram, which we got to too late and it had opened up, leaked out, and dried up by the time we got to it. From my reading, if they are lucky, they get one on the lower face and develop some form of antibodies for any future infection. I suppose one is lucky if they catch a real obvious cyst on the face or elsewhere on the skin. Marley never showed any outward symptoms. It ravaged his body internally. Admittedly, with my new crazy-busy position I took at my job, I'd been operating on auto-pilot and not paying as close attention. He's always had strange issues with shedding too early in the end of winter and having a not-so-marvelous coat, so I became numb to trying to look for problems on him. I've now identified one other ram in imminent danger--normally hearty, he is also skinny, two more rams that might be in trouble, and two ewes in serious trouble (one is very old), and two, who have had cysts, I plan to isolate and treat them all with large doses of Pen-G for 30 days. The antibiotic regimen is a Hail Mary. Besides isolation, the papers I've look up simply recommend culling for the truly infected. My local sheep-herding Vet recommends it, because, I guess he has had some luck with it. The woman vet I usually use-- knows this regimen from him. She had not heard about the vaccine (efficacy of it is not really entirely known--again, it causes a small case of it, and the animal builds up antibodies), but I plan to try it ASAP and use it on any lambs I have here from now on. It is NOT tested or developed for goats. There's no vaccine for goats, yet. And I have 3 goats. The biggest issue is: leaving a pasture alone for 8 months or more, to try to let it no longer be infected. My property is too small to try to do that. There's a central place with the shelter, water, etc, and if the bacteria is present, it can thrive there. -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies On Sat, Sep 12, 2015 at 2:32 PM, Carol Elkins wrote: > Michael, I am so sorry you are having to go through this. > > Coryne psuedotuberculosis is the bacterium that causes the disease Caseous > Lymphadenitis (CL) in sheep. There is no cure. See > http://waddl.vetmed.wsu.edu/animal-disease-faq/caseous-lymphadenitis and > other sources. > > An abscess on a sheep's jaw/throat is commonly the first symptom to appear > with CL. But it is very easy to confuse with bottle jaw and milk goiter. > I've read that CL abscesses are hard whereas bottle jaw and milk goiter > lumps are soft. What do the abscesses on your sheep look and feel like? > > Carol > > At 02:15 PM 9/12/2015, you wrote: >> >> Thanks for everyone's advice. The Vet came and did a necropsy on Marley: >> >> Coryne psuedotuberculosis. All through his body. >> >> I have had a few of the abscesses on my sheeps neck or jaw before and >> was aware this was contagious, but was not that aware of how >> devastating it could be.. Now I am. > > > ___ > This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list > Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
Glad you were able to get a diagnosis. I should have stated Ovine Progressive Pneumonia... not Pulmonary. Wish I could send you some rain. We went from drought to more than needed rainfall here. Mark -Original Message- From: Blackbelly [mailto:blackbelly-boun...@lists.blackbellysheep.info] On Behalf Of Michael Smith Sent: Friday, September 11, 2015 9:35 AM To: blackbelly Subject: Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia he was 8 years old. A few of the other sheep do have snotty noses as well. I'll call the vet. _Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 4:10 AM, Mark Wintermute wrote: > You did not mention how old Marley was. I suspect he did have some > age to him. OPP (Ovine Pulmonary Pneumonia) could be involved. There > is no cure for OPP and it is contagious. Your vet can assist you on > testing. If it is OPP you will want to test the rest of your flock. > OPP is not rare here in the United States. Rest in peace Marley. > > Mark > > > > > Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too > late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a > vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny > noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. > > in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case > before so, sorry for the graphic questions. > > When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light > brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both > nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his > head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably > another half pint in there for sure. > > I am thinking pneumonia? > > If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the > still living? > > Thanks in advance for your help in this. > > I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back > on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. > > > ___ > This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's > homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2015.0.6086 / Virus Database: 4419/10623 - Release Date: 09/11/15 ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
Michael, I am so sorry you are having to go through this. Coryne psuedotuberculosis is the bacterium that causes the disease Caseous Lymphadenitis (CL) in sheep. There is no cure. See http://waddl.vetmed.wsu.edu/animal-disease-faq/caseous-lymphadenitis and other sources. An abscess on a sheep's jaw/throat is commonly the first symptom to appear with CL. But it is very easy to confuse with bottle jaw and milk goiter. I've read that CL abscesses are hard whereas bottle jaw and milk goiter lumps are soft. What do the abscesses on your sheep look and feel like? Carol At 02:15 PM 9/12/2015, you wrote: Thanks for everyone's advice. The Vet came and did a necropsy on Marley: Coryne psuedotuberculosis. All through his body. I have had a few of the abscesses on my sheeps neck or jaw before and was aware this was contagious, but was not that aware of how devastating it could be.. Now I am. ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
Thanks for everyone's advice. The Vet came and did a necropsy on Marley: Coryne psuedotuberculosis. All through his body. I have had a few of the abscesses on my sheeps neck or jaw before and was aware this was contagious, but was not that aware of how devastating it could be.. Now I am. The symptomatic ones will be separated and given antibiotics (for a month) and also, better feed. The animals that are not symptomatic look real good and seem to be thriving on the local hay, as they have, year after year. The sheep that are effected are skinny. The Dr's opinion is: because they are fighting an infection, they are not getting enough nutrition. I am separating them from the wethered pygmy goats and upping their alfalfa intake along with hay. Can't give the alfalfa to the male wethered goats. Everyone has a clear-snot runny nose, the Dr. thinks it is from the dust. She says OPP is not common in California. _Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies. On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 8:25 AM, Tiana Franklin wrote: > I had a problem with an ewe that had green snotty nose, congested breathing > and skinny. Checked her eye lids and she was anemic so I dosed her with > Safeguard and started her on a 5 day round of Pen G. At day 10 there was no > improvement so I dosed again with Safeguard and 5 day round of LA200 and > Pen G. By the 5th day her snotty nose and congested breathing was cleared > up but she was still very pale in the eye lids so I watched for another 5 > days without any improvement to the color in her eyes so on day 20 I dosed > her with Ivomec and she immediately improved, got color back to her eye > lids and started gaining weight. Also, I'm in California as well (North bay > area) and this happened about a month ago when we got hit with really hot > weather as well and my girl is about 10 years old. Some of my other ewe had > snotty noses but it wasn't green so I did not treat them. > > Tiana > > On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 8:00 AM, Cecil R Bearden > wrote: > >> Extreme hot weather will cause Pneumonia as quickly as cold. I think the >> problem is dust in the air. It probably is dust Pneumonia. Makes no >> difference what we call it, it has to be treated aggressively. I would not >> wait on the vet, I would start giving Combiotic ( Long acting Penicillin ) >> ASAP. Also, Safeguard liquid wormer will stop the increase in infestation >> that will occur when the animal is stressed. If you are in a drought, then >> your animals have been trying to graze on very short to no grass and will >> readily pick up a worm load . I had a young ewe that was down a few >> years back, she had rapid onset pneumonia, and I gave her Combiotic, >> Baytril, and liquid Safeguard at 10am. Vet got there at 12noon and >> started an IV. at 2pm she had diarrhea and was passing dead worms. At 4pm >> she was up and walking some. Next morning she was in good shape. Rest of >> flock got Safeguard pellets and another dose 2 weeks later. Ivomec will >> not work as fast as Safeguard. >> >> Cecil in OKla >> >> >> >> On 9/11/2015 9:34 AM, Michael Smith wrote: >> >>> he was 8 years old. A few of the other sheep do have snotty noses as >>> well. I'll call the vet. >>> >>> _Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies >>> >>> On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 4:10 AM, Mark Wintermute >>> wrote: >>> You did not mention how old Marley was. I suspect he did have some age to him. OPP (Ovine Pulmonary Pneumonia) could be involved. There is no cure for OPP and it is contagious. Your vet can assist you on testing. If it is OPP you will want to test the rest of your flock. OPP is not rare here in the United States. Rest in peace Marley. Mark Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case before so, sorry for the graphic questions. When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in there for sure. I am thinking pneumonia? If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still living? Thanks in advance for your help in this. I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
I had a problem with an ewe that had green snotty nose, congested breathing and skinny. Checked her eye lids and she was anemic so I dosed her with Safeguard and started her on a 5 day round of Pen G. At day 10 there was no improvement so I dosed again with Safeguard and 5 day round of LA200 and Pen G. By the 5th day her snotty nose and congested breathing was cleared up but she was still very pale in the eye lids so I watched for another 5 days without any improvement to the color in her eyes so on day 20 I dosed her with Ivomec and she immediately improved, got color back to her eye lids and started gaining weight. Also, I'm in California as well (North bay area) and this happened about a month ago when we got hit with really hot weather as well and my girl is about 10 years old. Some of my other ewe had snotty noses but it wasn't green so I did not treat them. Tiana On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 8:00 AM, Cecil R Bearden wrote: > Extreme hot weather will cause Pneumonia as quickly as cold. I think the > problem is dust in the air. It probably is dust Pneumonia. Makes no > difference what we call it, it has to be treated aggressively. I would not > wait on the vet, I would start giving Combiotic ( Long acting Penicillin ) > ASAP. Also, Safeguard liquid wormer will stop the increase in infestation > that will occur when the animal is stressed. If you are in a drought, then > your animals have been trying to graze on very short to no grass and will > readily pick up a worm load . I had a young ewe that was down a few > years back, she had rapid onset pneumonia, and I gave her Combiotic, > Baytril, and liquid Safeguard at 10am. Vet got there at 12noon and > started an IV. at 2pm she had diarrhea and was passing dead worms. At 4pm > she was up and walking some. Next morning she was in good shape. Rest of > flock got Safeguard pellets and another dose 2 weeks later. Ivomec will > not work as fast as Safeguard. > > Cecil in OKla > > > > On 9/11/2015 9:34 AM, Michael Smith wrote: > >> he was 8 years old. A few of the other sheep do have snotty noses as >> well. I'll call the vet. >> >> _Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies >> >> On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 4:10 AM, Mark Wintermute >> wrote: >> >>> You did not mention how old Marley was. I suspect he did have some age >>> to >>> him. OPP (Ovine Pulmonary Pneumonia) could be involved. There is no >>> cure >>> for OPP and it is contagious. Your vet can assist you on testing. If >>> it is >>> OPP you will want to test the rest of your flock. OPP is not rare here >>> in >>> the United States. Rest in peace Marley. >>> >>> Mark >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. >>> He >>> also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out >>> and >>> see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always >>> get >>> over it, and they look strong. >>> >>> in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case >>> before so, sorry for the graphic questions. >>> >>> When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light >>> brown, >>> very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. >>> It >>> smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am >>> sure >>> I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in >>> there for sure. >>> >>> I am thinking pneumonia? >>> >>> If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still >>> living? >>> >>> Thanks in advance for your help in this. >>> >>> I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back >>> on, so >>> I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list >>> Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info >>> >> ___ >> This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list >> Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info >> > > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > ___ > This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list > Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info > -- Tiana Franklin ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
Sorry to hear it. That might be worth a necropsy. On Thursday, September 10, 2015 10:15 PM, Michael Smith wrote: Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case before so, sorry for the graphic questions. When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in there for sure. I am thinking pneumonia? If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still living? Thanks in advance for your help in this. I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. Marley in the center, with his ram-mates https://mwsmith.smugmug.com/Animals/RamsFeb2014/i-q3qfFTz/A -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
Extreme hot weather will cause Pneumonia as quickly as cold. I think the problem is dust in the air. It probably is dust Pneumonia. Makes no difference what we call it, it has to be treated aggressively. I would not wait on the vet, I would start giving Combiotic ( Long acting Penicillin ) ASAP. Also, Safeguard liquid wormer will stop the increase in infestation that will occur when the animal is stressed. If you are in a drought, then your animals have been trying to graze on very short to no grass and will readily pick up a worm load . I had a young ewe that was down a few years back, she had rapid onset pneumonia, and I gave her Combiotic, Baytril, and liquid Safeguard at 10am. Vet got there at 12noon and started an IV. at 2pm she had diarrhea and was passing dead worms. At 4pm she was up and walking some. Next morning she was in good shape. Rest of flock got Safeguard pellets and another dose 2 weeks later. Ivomec will not work as fast as Safeguard. Cecil in OKla On 9/11/2015 9:34 AM, Michael Smith wrote: he was 8 years old. A few of the other sheep do have snotty noses as well. I'll call the vet. _Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 4:10 AM, Mark Wintermute wrote: You did not mention how old Marley was. I suspect he did have some age to him. OPP (Ovine Pulmonary Pneumonia) could be involved. There is no cure for OPP and it is contagious. Your vet can assist you on testing. If it is OPP you will want to test the rest of your flock. OPP is not rare here in the United States. Rest in peace Marley. Mark Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case before so, sorry for the graphic questions. When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in there for sure. I am thinking pneumonia? If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still living? Thanks in advance for your help in this. I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
he was 8 years old. A few of the other sheep do have snotty noses as well. I'll call the vet. _Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 4:10 AM, Mark Wintermute wrote: > You did not mention how old Marley was. I suspect he did have some age to > him. OPP (Ovine Pulmonary Pneumonia) could be involved. There is no cure > for OPP and it is contagious. Your vet can assist you on testing. If it is > OPP you will want to test the rest of your flock. OPP is not rare here in > the United States. Rest in peace Marley. > > Mark > > > > > Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. He > also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out and > see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always get > over it, and they look strong. > > in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case > before so, sorry for the graphic questions. > > When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light brown, > very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. It > smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am sure > I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in > there for sure. > > I am thinking pneumonia? > > If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still > living? > > Thanks in advance for your help in this. > > I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back on, so > I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. > > > ___ > This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list > Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
You did not mention how old Marley was. I suspect he did have some age to him. OPP (Ovine Pulmonary Pneumonia) could be involved. There is no cure for OPP and it is contagious. Your vet can assist you on testing. If it is OPP you will want to test the rest of your flock. OPP is not rare here in the United States. Rest in peace Marley. Mark Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case before so, sorry for the graphic questions. When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in there for sure. I am thinking pneumonia? If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still living? Thanks in advance for your help in this. I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
I would be giving Penicillin and Baytril cocktails all around, in addition to a new dose of Safeguard. Cecil in OKla On 9/10/2015 9:28 PM, Michael Smith wrote: forgot to mention, to make matters worse, northern California has had 100*F weather, all this weekend and week. The animals all have automatic water. But the heat, I am sure, did not help him. -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 7:15 PM, Michael Smith wrote: Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case before so, sorry for the graphic questions. When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in there for sure. I am thinking pneumonia? If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still living? Thanks in advance for your help in this. I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. Marley in the center, with his ram-mates https://mwsmith.smugmug.com/Animals/RamsFeb2014/i-q3qfFTz/A -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
Re: [Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
forgot to mention, to make matters worse, northern California has had 100*F weather, all this weekend and week. The animals all have automatic water. But the heat, I am sure, did not help him. -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 7:15 PM, Michael Smith wrote: > Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too > late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a > vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny > noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. > > in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case > before so, sorry for the graphic questions. > > When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light > brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both > nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his > head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably > another half pint in there for sure. > > I am thinking pneumonia? > > If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the > still living? > > Thanks in advance for your help in this. > > I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back > on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. > > Marley in the center, with his ram-mates > > https://mwsmith.smugmug.com/Animals/RamsFeb2014/i-q3qfFTz/A > > -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
[Blackbelly] Marley the AB ram died, I suspect pneumonia
Marley had gotten skinny lately, and I de-wormed him, probably too late. He also had a runny nose. I had not taken the time to have a vet come out and see him, since a few other sheep also have runny noses, and they always get over it, and they look strong. in any case, he died today. I've never dealt with this particular case before so, sorry for the graphic questions. When I tried to pick up his head to move him, a large amount of light brown, very watery liquid came pouring and I mean "pouring" from both nostrils. It smells. Not super strong, but not pleasant. I tilted his head and I am sure I got about half a pint. I am sure there's probably another half pint in there for sure. I am thinking pneumonia? If so, I imagine I should get the vet out to hear some lungs on the still living? Thanks in advance for your help in this. I plan to have his skull preserved and glue that broken horn tip back on, so I can have a nice reminder of him. His rack was magnificent. Marley in the center, with his ram-mates https://mwsmith.smugmug.com/Animals/RamsFeb2014/i-q3qfFTz/A -Michael, Perino Ranch Blackbellies ___ This message is from the Blackbelly mailing list Visit the list's homepage at %http://www.blackbellysheep.info
