Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
> After reading more, I realized the equivalent in OpenStep is to paint > with a color using: Thats a good point - I remember having a lot of trouble finding printers that would actually take NeXT generated output in the early years. > Sort of. It could be a lot better. It doesn't print to a printer, but it > does to a PS file. It should print text and graphics OK, maybe images. I Interesting, I am obviously doing something wrong then as I just get a PS file full of comments. Might go take a look at that if/when I get this bundle problem under FreeBSD sorted out. Until now I had just assumed it was an "unimplemented" part of the system. > want to add CUPS support eventually also... So much to do... ...but a lot already achieved also :-) -bat. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Pete French wrote: OK, now I'm thinking the pattern was just done to make it look good on a gray-scale monitor and perhaps if NeXT was written using the higher resolution monitors of today it would have been solid. That a very inetersting observation though - because it implies that the PostScript being generated when the object is sent a 'print' method is different to that hen it is being drawn to the screen. Whatever happened to WYSIWYG in that case :-) Well perhaps I'm just guessing. setpattern is a level 2 operator which was pretty advanced for many printers at that time. After reading more, I realized the equivalent in OpenStep is to paint with a color using: +[NSColor colorWithPatternImage:] -bat. PS: Does GNUstep actually print ? I saw a lot of PPD files go by in the install which suprised me as all my 'print' messages end up generating a PS file with only comments in it. Sort of. It could be a lot better. It doesn't print to a printer, but it does to a PS file. It should print text and graphics OK, maybe images. I want to add CUPS support eventually also... So much to do... -- Adam Fedor, Digital Optics Corp. | I'm glad I hate spinach, because http://www.doc.com| if I didn't, I'd eat it, and you | know how I hate the stuff. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
> OK, now I'm thinking the pattern was just done to make it look good on a > gray-scale monitor and perhaps if NeXT was written using the higher > resolution monitors of today it would have been solid. That a very inetersting observation though - because it implies that the PostScript being generated when the object is sent a 'print' method is different to that hen it is being drawn to the screen. Whatever happened to WYSIWYG in that case :-) -bat. PS: Does GNUstep actually print ? I saw a lot of PPD files go by in the install which suprised me as all my 'print' messages end up generating a PS file with only comments in it. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Benhur Stein wrote: > Another test: when a window is printed in OPENSTEP, the scroller in the resulting > postscript file is not stippled. OK, now I'm thinking the pattern was just done to make it look good on a gray-scale monitor and perhaps if NeXT was written using the higher resolution monitors of today it would have been solid. -- Adam Fedor, Digital Optics Corp. | I'm glad I hate spinach, because http://www.doc.com| if I didn't, I'd eat it, and you | know how I hate the stuff. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Quoting Adam Fedor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > I booted up my color NeXT and found out it was stippled also. The > interesting thing is that NeXT does this using the setpattern PostScript > operator (which basically tells the DPS engine how to draw a color.). > That's much more complicated than our PostScript "engine" works. The > closest equivalent I could think of is drawing an image, like Nicola > suggested... Another test: when a window is printed in OPENSTEP, the scroller in the resulting postscript file is not stippled. Benhur ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Pascal Bourguignon wrote: >>From: Nicola Pero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 15:07:33 +0100 (BST) >> >> >> >>I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and use >>NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to support >>an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background ought >>to be admissable IMO. > >The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) I'll take your word for it ... I no longer have a NeXTstep system since the hardware I used for it died. It didn't *look* stippled to me as far as I can remember, but I had a lower quality display back then and it could just have looked like a solid grey because of that. >>> >>> It is definitly stippled. If magnify screenshot of the scrollbar(as >>> well as NSSlider) you'll see that. >> >>I think Adam was right in holding the patch until the issue was clear ... >>but yes, looking at screenshots on the web, it seems that NeXTstep did >>indeed used a stippled background for scrollers, so I'd say we want the >>same by default :-) > > > I'm not so sure. For all I know, it could as well have been: > > 0.5 setgray > 0 0 moveto 0 200 rlineto 16 0 rlineto 0 -200 rlineto closepath fill > > It just happen that on a 2bit depth screen, the best way to do 0.5 > gray is to mix dark ).33) gray and light (0.66) gray pixels. > > > The definitive answer to that question would be to look at a color > display that I don't have. > I booted up my color NeXT and found out it was stippled also. The interesting thing is that NeXT does this using the setpattern PostScript operator (which basically tells the DPS engine how to draw a color.). That's much more complicated than our PostScript "engine" works. The closest equivalent I could think of is drawing an image, like Nicola suggested... -- Adam Fedor, Digital Optics Corp. | I'm glad I hate spinach, because http://www.doc.com| if I didn't, I'd eat it, and you | know how I hate the stuff. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
> From: Nicola Pero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 15:07:33 +0100 (BST) > > > > > >> I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and use > > > >> NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to support > > > >> an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background ought > > > >> to be admissable IMO. > > > > > > > > The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) > > > > > > I'll take your word for it ... I no longer have a NeXTstep system > > > since the > > > hardware I used for it died. It didn't *look* stippled to me as far > > > as I can > > > remember, but I had a lower quality display back then and it could > > > just have > > > looked like a solid grey because of that. > > > > It is definitly stippled. If magnify screenshot of the scrollbar(as > > well as NSSlider) you'll see that. > > I think Adam was right in holding the patch until the issue was clear ... > but yes, looking at screenshots on the web, it seems that NeXTstep did > indeed used a stippled background for scrollers, so I'd say we want the > same by default :-) I'm not so sure. For all I know, it could as well have been: 0.5 setgray 0 0 moveto 0 200 rlineto 16 0 rlineto 0 -200 rlineto closepath fill It just happen that on a 2bit depth screen, the best way to do 0.5 gray is to mix dark ).33) gray and light (0.66) gray pixels. The definitive answer to that question would be to look at a color display that I don't have. Note that the scroll bars in WPref.app of WindowMaker are plain 0.5 gray, not stippled. It seems correct to me. > However, I'd personally feel that the stippled background would be better > implemented by tiling a simple image (that is, drawing the image many > times, repeateadly, to cover the area), rather than by drawing a net of > dashed bezier paths. > > It feels faster to me (but I've got no objective benchmarks, and I'm happy > to know that it's not that way) and it would have the important advantage > that by replacing the image with a different one, people should be able to > customize the scroller background more easily. -- __Pascal_Bourguignon__ http://www.informatimago.com/ -- The name is Baud,.. James Baud. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
> > >> I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and use > > >> NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to support > > >> an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background ought > > >> to be admissable IMO. > > > > > > The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) > > > > I'll take your word for it ... I no longer have a NeXTstep system > > since the > > hardware I used for it died. It didn't *look* stippled to me as far > > as I can > > remember, but I had a lower quality display back then and it could > > just have > > looked like a solid grey because of that. > > It is definitly stippled. If magnify screenshot of the scrollbar(as > well as NSSlider) you'll see that. I think Adam was right in holding the patch until the issue was clear ... but yes, looking at screenshots on the web, it seems that NeXTstep did indeed used a stippled background for scrollers, so I'd say we want the same by default :-) However, I'd personally feel that the stippled background would be better implemented by tiling a simple image (that is, drawing the image many times, repeateadly, to cover the area), rather than by drawing a net of dashed bezier paths. It feels faster to me (but I've got no objective benchmarks, and I'm happy to know that it's not that way) and it would have the important advantage that by replacing the image with a different one, people should be able to customize the scroller background more easily. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Hi Jeff, > Richard Frith-Macdonald wrote: > > On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 12:48 pm, Jeff Teunissen wrote: > > > Richard Frith-Macdonald wrote: > > >> On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 10:30 am, Serg Stoyan wrote: > > >>> Hi Adam, > > [snip] > > > I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the > > >solid>>> background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does > > >anyone>>> else have a preference? > > >>> > > >>> Tastes differ... I like OPENSTEP look of NSScroller. > > >> > > >> I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... > > >and> use NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a > > >patch to> support an interface style which gives a stippled > > >scroller background> ought to be admissable IMO. > > > > > > The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) > > > > I'll take your word for it ... I no longer have a NeXTstep system > > since the hardware I used for it died. It didn't *look* stippled to > > me as far as I can remember, but I had a lower quality display back > > then and it could just have looked like a solid grey because of > > that. > > On my (24bpp, so it's not a color depth thing) OPENSTEP 4.2/Intel > machine, the scroller well is filled with a checkerboard pattern > composed of single pixels that alternate between 1/3 and 2/3 intensity > (AKA darkGrayColor and lightGrayColor), starting with 2/3 intensity at > the top left, with a lightGrayColor 1-pixel interior border. > > It's not a thoroughly big deal, but that's the way it's drawn. :) > > It looks like the attached shot (selection captured with Grab and > scaled up by a factor of six). This is what my patch does. -- Serg Stoyan ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Hi Richard, > On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 12:48 pm, Jeff Teunissen wrote: > > > Richard Frith-Macdonald wrote: > > > >> On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 10:30 am, Serg Stoyan wrote: > >> > >>> Hi Adam, > >>> > Serg Stoyan wrote: > > Hi everybody, > > > > Here is another improvement in appearance: NSScroller. > > Fist patch changes drawing of knob slot of NSScroller (stiplled > > instead of solid). Second one is updates NSBrowser according to > > NSScroller's changes. > > I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the > >solid>>> background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does > >anyone else>>> have a preference? > >>> > >>> Tastes differ... I like OPENSTEP look of NSScroller. > >> > >> I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and > > > >> use > >> NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to > >> support > >> an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background ought > >to> be admissable IMO. > > > > The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) > > I'll take your word for it ... I no longer have a NeXTstep system > since the > hardware I used for it died. It didn't *look* stippled to me as far > as I can > remember, but I had a lower quality display back then and it could > just have > looked like a solid grey because of that. It is definitly stippled. If magnify screenshot of the scrollbar(as well as NSSlider) you'll see that. -- Serg Stoyan ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Richard Frith-Macdonald wrote: > On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 12:48 pm, Jeff Teunissen wrote: > > > Richard Frith-Macdonald wrote: > > > >> On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 10:30 am, Serg Stoyan wrote: > >> > >>> Hi Adam, [snip] > I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the solid > background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does anyone > else have a preference? > >>> > >>> Tastes differ... I like OPENSTEP look of NSScroller. > >> > >> I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and > >> use NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to > >> support an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background > >> ought to be admissable IMO. > > > > The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) > > I'll take your word for it ... I no longer have a NeXTstep system since > the hardware I used for it died. It didn't *look* stippled to me as far > as I can remember, but I had a lower quality display back then and it > could just have looked like a solid grey because of that. On my (24bpp, so it's not a color depth thing) OPENSTEP 4.2/Intel machine, the scroller well is filled with a checkerboard pattern composed of single pixels that alternate between 1/3 and 2/3 intensity (AKA darkGrayColor and lightGrayColor), starting with 2/3 intensity at the top left, with a lightGrayColor 1-pixel interior border. It's not a thoroughly big deal, but that's the way it's drawn. :) It looks like the attached shot (selection captured with Grab and scaled up by a factor of six). -- | Jeff Teunissen -=- Pres., Dusk To Dawn Computing -=- deek @ d2dc.net | GPG: 1024D/9840105A 7102 808A 7733 C2F3 097B 161B 9222 DAB8 9840 105A | Core developer, The QuakeForge Projecthttp://www.quakeforge.net/ | Specializing in Debian GNU/Linux http://www.d2dc.net/~deek/
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 12:48 pm, Jeff Teunissen wrote: > Richard Frith-Macdonald wrote: > >> On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 10:30 am, Serg Stoyan wrote: >> >>> Hi Adam, >>> Serg Stoyan wrote: > Hi everybody, > > Here is another improvement in appearance: NSScroller. > Fist patch changes drawing of knob slot of NSScroller (stiplled > instead of solid). Second one is updates NSBrowser according to > NSScroller's changes. I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the solid background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does anyone else have a preference? >>> >>> Tastes differ... I like OPENSTEP look of NSScroller. >> >> I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and >> use >> NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to >> support >> an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background ought to >> be admissable IMO. > > The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) I'll take your word for it ... I no longer have a NeXTstep system since the hardware I used for it died. It didn't *look* stippled to me as far as I can remember, but I had a lower quality display back then and it could just have looked like a solid grey because of that. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Richard Frith-Macdonald wrote: > On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 10:30 am, Serg Stoyan wrote: > > > Hi Adam, > > > >> Serg Stoyan wrote: > >>> Hi everybody, > >>> > >>> Here is another improvement in appearance: NSScroller. > >>> Fist patch changes drawing of knob slot of NSScroller (stiplled > >>> instead of solid). Second one is updates NSBrowser according to > >>> NSScroller's changes. > >> > >> I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the solid > >> background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does anyone else > >> have a preference? > > > > Tastes differ... I like OPENSTEP look of NSScroller. > > I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and use > NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to support > an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background ought to > be admissable IMO. The NeXTstep look _is_ stippled. :) -- | Jeff Teunissen -=- Pres., Dusk To Dawn Computing -=- deek @ d2dc.net | GPG: 1024D/9840105A 7102 808A 7733 C2F3 097B 161B 9222 DAB8 9840 105A | Core developer, The QuakeForge Projecthttp://www.quakeforge.net/ | Specializing in Debian GNU/Linux http://www.d2dc.net/~deek/ ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
On Thursday, October 10, 2002, at 10:30 am, Serg Stoyan wrote: > Hi Adam, > >> Serg Stoyan wrote: >>> Hi everybody, >>> >>> Here is another improvement in appearance: NSScroller. >>> Fist patch changes drawing of knob slot of NSScroller (stiplled >>> instead of solid). Second one is updates NSBrowser according to >>> NSScroller's changes. >> >> I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the solid >> background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does anyone else >> have a preference? > > Tastes differ... I like OPENSTEP look of NSScroller. I think we should stick to policy of having a NeXTstep look ... and use NSInterfaceStyle where people want alternatives. So a patch to support an interface style which gives a stippled scroller background ought to be admissable IMO. >>> Working on NSScroller, I've noticed that coordinate system of the >>> gnustep-gui and gnustep-back is not the same. NSScroller's knob slot >>> is drawing with number of rectangles using: >> >> Isn't it because the scroller is a flipped view? > > Yes, thanks. But I didn't quite understand why it is flipped... To be compatible with OPENSTEP ... where this class is flipped. I remember this from *way* back ... and just checked up that it is still flipped in MacOS-X. Really I think that this should be documented in the source code. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Hi Adam, > Serg Stoyan wrote: > > Hi everybody, > > > > Here is another improvement in appearance: NSScroller. > > Fist patch changes drawing of knob slot of NSScroller (stiplled > > instead of solid). Second one is updates NSBrowser according to > > NSScroller's changes. > > I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the solid > background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does anyone else > have a preference? Tastes differ... I like OPENSTEP look of NSScroller. > > Working on NSScroller, I've noticed that coordinate system of the > > gnustep-gui and gnustep-back is not the same. NSScroller's knob slot > > is drawing with number of rectangles using: > > Isn't it because the scroller is a flipped view? Yes, thanks. But I didn't quite understand why it is flipped... > > > > gray, @"scrollBarColor", > > to > > darkGray, @"scrollBarColor", > > in NSColor.m has no effect. I can't figured out what the problem > > is... > > I think you need to remove the file > ~/GNUstep/Library/Colors/System.clr for it to take effect. Thanks. -- Serg Stoyan ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Serg Stoyan wrote: > Hi, > > Here is the minor changes, cleanups to NSBrowser against the latest CVS > (distance between columns and horizontal scroller was 1 pixel, I applied this. Thanks. -- Adam Fedor, Digital Optics Corp. | I'm glad I hate spinach, because http://www.doc.com| if I didn't, I'd eat it, and you | know how I hate the stuff. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Serg Stoyan wrote: > Hi everybody, > > Here is another improvement in appearance: NSScroller. > Fist patch changes drawing of knob slot of NSScroller (stiplled > instead of solid). Second one is updates NSBrowser according to NSScroller's changes. > I didn't apply this patch, mostly because I kind of like the solid background, although I could be convined otherwise. Does anyone else have a preference? > Working on NSScroller, I've noticed that coordinate system of the > gnustep-gui and gnustep-back is not the same. NSScroller's knob slot is drawing with >number of rectangles using: > Isn't it because the scroller is a flipped view? > > gray, @"scrollBarColor", > > to > > darkGray, @"scrollBarColor", > > in NSColor.m has no effect. I can't figured out what the problem is... > I think you need to remove the file ~/GNUstep/Library/Colors/System.clr for it to take effect. -- Adam Fedor, Digital Optics Corp. | I'm glad I hate spinach, because http://www.doc.com| if I didn't, I'd eat it, and you | know how I hate the stuff. ___ Bug-gnustep mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnustep
Re: NSScroller, NSBrowser and some issues
Hi, Here is the minor changes, cleanups to NSBrowser against the latest CVS (distance between columns and horizontal scroller was 1 pixel, should be 2 pixels) and NSScroller patch (same as previuos, just for case). sorry for pedantry, -- Serg Stoyan NSBrowser.m.patch Description: Binary data NSScroller.m.patch Description: Binary data
