Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] I am really getting sick of this. Goodbye

[David Hedlund]

"bug-gnuzilla list run by lduros at gnu.org" - 
https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnuzilla


Please continue this discussion with the admin if you are unsatisfied.


On 2017-03-19 01:18, Julie Marchant wrote:


Libre software is about freedom to control your computing, not freedom 
to choose a proprietary OS. The FSF supports compiling for Windows 
because it helps users to transition to libre software.


Attacking users for making a bad decision (Windows) is unproductive 
and hurtful, but not directly at odds with libre software principles 
as you suggest.


--
Julie Marchant
https://onpon4.github.io

On Mar 18, 2017 8:08 PM, The Canadian Bacon  wrote:

It's​ funny, GNU is about freedom of choice, yet just about every
message I read has people trampling over others choice of
operating system.

It's appalling to read almost every day these arguments. Yes,
sometimes it's hard to support different platforms. I'm a software
engineer myself, so I know the complexities of supporting
different systems, if the maintainer doesn't want to support said
platform I'm not going to argue, but if others are going to bash
people for their choices, it's basically like reading poison. Just
stop with it, it gets us no where and it goes against the very
principal of GNU.

I'm at the point where I just want to unsubscribe to the mailing
list, it's that bad.

On Mar 18, 2017 2:32 PM, "Julie Marchant" mailto:onp...@riseup.net>> wrote:

On 03/18/2017 01:37 PM, awake...@tutanota.de
 wrote:
> I sense deep treachery however.

What you "sense" is a conspiracy theory, and it's ridiculous.
IceCat is
not important in the grand scheme of things for anyone who
isn't a libre
software supporter, so there is no cause for a conspiracy.
Further,
there is no evidence for a conspiracy. What you are seeing is
nothing
more than user dissatisfaction. It's not just here, either;
similar
dissatisfaction has been expressed on the Trisquel forum.

Personally, I think it would be great if both of these
projects could be
handed off to someone else. After all, Ruben is clearly
overworked.
However, this is an imperfect world and there don't seem to be
any takers.

Also, even the FSF supports building software for Windows.

Anyway, please stop flooding my inbox with screeching about your
conspiracy theories. That is not what I am subscribed to this
mailing
list for.

--
Julie Marchant
https://onpon4.github.io

Protect your emails with GnuPG:
https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org



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Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] Forum rules (ban threats and personal attacks)

[awakeyet]

is this some kind of sick threat? I haven't been spamming and I have not 
personally attacked anyone. attack is a very harsh word and you are threatening 
to get me banned? I'm replying publicly so that others can see what you wrote 
to me. I'm shocked at how quickly you went from being friendly to hostile. I 
make sure to always post with honesty and I value the freedom to be honest, 
while being polite of course. this is very sad but I will continue to make 
valuable posts to the GNU community as long as my posts are valued by said 
community.

19. Mar 2017 04:20 by pub...@beloved.name:


> It's important that you from now on do not keep spamming the mailing-list or 
> personally attacking people as repeated behaviour most likely will get you 
> banned.
>
> I'm just trying to be helpful and warn you before the admins might take 
> actions.
>
> I hope you understand.
>
>
> Best regards.--
http://gnuzilla.gnu.org

Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] I am really getting sick of this. Goodbye

[awakeyet]

I'm sorry if you perceive pointing out logical fallacies as attacking users, 
but I'm not sorry for any of the very intelligent and well thought out comments 
I made. I know it's difficult to discern the tone of a text message on a screen 
on the internet, but as a certain bear we all know says, "ONLY YOU- can choose 
to be offended" or something like that. peace and love, and most of all, 
critical thinking skills never wasted.

18. Mar 2017 20:18 by onp...@riseup.net:


>
> Libre software is about freedom to control your computing, not freedom to 
> choose a proprietary OS. The FSF supports compiling for Windows because it 
> helps users to transition to libre software.
>
> Attacking users for making a bad decision (Windows) is unproductive and 
> hurtful, but not directly at odds with libre software principles as you 
> suggest.
>
> --
> Julie Marchant
> https://onpon4.github.io
> On Mar 18, 2017 8:08 PM, The Canadian Bacon <> wowzama...@gmail.com> > wrote:
>
>> It's​ funny, GNU is about freedom of choice, yet just about every message I 
>> read has people trampling over others choice of operating system.
>> It's appalling to read almost every day these arguments. Yes, sometimes it's 
>> hard to support different platforms. I'm a software engineer myself, so I 
>> know the complexities of supporting different systems, if the maintainer 
>> doesn't want to support said platform I'm not going to argue, but if others 
>> are going to bash people for their choices, it's basically like reading 
>> poison. Just stop with it, it gets us no where and it goes against the very 
>> principal of GNU.
>> I'm at the point where I just want to unsubscribe to the mailing list, it's 
>> that bad.
>> On Mar 18, 2017 2:32 PM, "Julie Marchant" <>> onp...@riseup.net>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 03/18/2017 01:37 PM, >>> awake...@tutanota.de>>>  wrote:
>>> > I sense deep treachery however.
>>>
>>> What you "sense" is a conspiracy theory, and it's ridiculous. IceCat is
>>> not important in the grand scheme of things for anyone who isn't a libre
>>> software supporter, so there is no cause for a conspiracy. Further,
>>> there is no evidence for a conspiracy. What you are seeing is nothing
>>> more than user dissatisfaction. It's not just here, either; similar
>>> dissatisfaction has been expressed on the Trisquel forum.
>>>
>>> Personally, I think it would be great if both of these projects could be
>>> handed off to someone else. After all, Ruben is clearly overworked.
>>> However, this is an imperfect world and there don't seem to be any takers.
>>>
>>> Also, even the FSF supports building software for Windows.
>>>
>>> Anyway, please stop flooding my inbox with screeching about your
>>> conspiracy theories. That is not what I am subscribed to this mailing
>>> list for.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Julie Marchant
>>> https://onpon4.github.io
>>>
>>> Protect your emails with GnuPG:
>>> https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> http://gnuzilla.gnu.org
>>>
>>>--
http://gnuzilla.gnu.org

Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] I am really getting sick of this. Goodbye

[awakeyet]

"What you "sense" is a conspiracy theory, and it's ridiculous. IceCat is
not important in the grand scheme of things for anyone who isn't a libre
software supporter, so there is no cause for a conspiracy. Further,
there is no evidence for a conspiracy."

If IceCat isn't important in the grande scheme of things, then what browser may 
you suggest other security and privacy conscious users use in the place of 
IceCat, god forbid it wasn't a choice anymore? understand what I mean? there 
aren't many other actual good choices out there. there are very bad people in 
shadow groups who seek to end IceCat and the clues and hints are everywhere. I 
value critical thinking and feel rather unsurprised that the first thing that 
comes to your mind is "conspiracy theorist" which is the same name that was 
given to certain people pre-Edward Snowden. the truth is always right around 
the corner.


 "What you are seeing is nothing
more than user dissatisfaction. It's not just here, either; similar
dissatisfaction has been expressed on the Trisquel forum."

Well that's funny you should say that. the only dissatisfied users I see 
complaining about or "Leaving" IceCat or Trisquel are the only people who were 
not actually using it in the first place. 
I personally love and adore IceCat and Trisquel and I hope to see them improve 
while resisting these absolutely credible "dissatisfied users" who feel the 
need to join mailing lists and complain and harass other users and then 
threaten to leave when they don't even consistently use it simply because their 
exacting demands are not met by the creators of the software, who they view as 
slaves.
 It seems to me that the users who are dissatisfied with Trisquel and IceCat 
are the same ones who found it and decided that they were the grand authority 
on the Operating System or internet browser and became offended when they 
realized that No, in fact, they can not force the creators to change these 
things or give random 
strangers control of their project.
What a shock this must have been to these poor spoiled individuals who I will 
not give the shame of naming, because they threw huge temper tantrums before 
announcing they were leaving. I have experienced this many times before and I'm 
sure I will experience it again because these types of people will sadly never 
learn.

"Personally, I think it would be great if both of these projects could be
handed off to someone else. After all, Ruben is clearly overworked.
However, this is an imperfect world and there don't seem to be any takers."

what a convenient coincidence that you should say something like that.

"Also, even the FSF supports building software for Windows."

yes yes and linux has systemd. truly imperfect world we live in.

"Anyway, please stop flooding my inbox with screeching about your
conspiracy theories. That is not what I am subscribed to this mailing
list for."
you're free to personally mark emails that come from me as spam if you so 
choose. I could say the same thing about your emails but I try to be a nice 
person.

have a good afternoon and try to stay frosty.






18. Mar 2017 14:32 by onp...@riseup.net:


> On 03/18/2017 01:37 PM, > awake...@tutanota.de>  wrote:
>> I sense deep treachery however.
>
> What you "sense" is a conspiracy theory, and it's ridiculous. IceCat is
> not important in the grand scheme of things for anyone who isn't a libre
> software supporter, so there is no cause for a conspiracy. Further,
> there is no evidence for a conspiracy. What you are seeing is nothing
> more than user dissatisfaction. It's not just here, either; similar
> dissatisfaction has been expressed on the Trisquel forum.
>
> Personally, I think it would be great if both of these projects could be
> handed off to someone else. After all, Ruben is clearly overworked.
> However, this is an imperfect world and there don't seem to be any takers.
>
> Also, even the FSF supports building software for Windows.
>
> Anyway, please stop flooding my inbox with screeching about your
> conspiracy theories. That is not what I am subscribed to this mailing
> list for.
>
> -- 
> Julie Marchant
> https://onpon4.github.io
>
> Protect your emails with GnuPG:
> https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org--
http://gnuzilla.gnu.org

Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] I am really getting sick of this. Goodbye

[Julie Marchant]

On 03/19/2017 02:34 PM, awake...@tutanota.de wrote:
> If IceCat isn't important in the grande scheme of things, then what
> browser may you suggest other security and privacy conscious users use
> in the place of IceCat, god forbid it wasn't a choice anymore?

I was talking about people who *don't* care about these issues, and
proprietary software developers. As in, IceCat is *tiny* compared to
e.g. Google Chrome or Safari. As in, it's ridiculous to think that any
of those companies would have any interest in spending money to... how
did you put it? "[G]ive them more work because they want them to fail."

> there aren't many other actual good choices out
> there.

For privacy and security? IceCat isn't even the best browser for that.
That would be the Tor Browser Bundle. Which, incidentally, probably has
a larger user base than IceCat.

> I value critical thinking

And yet you are not applying it. There is no reason anyone would be
motivated to make IceCat fail.

> I could say the same thing about your emails but I try to be
> a nice person.

No, you couldn't, at least not honestly. You sent *eight* emails in *one
hour*, without anyone replying, all on the same topic. This is spam. I
sent *one* email in response. This is not spam.

-- 
Julie Marchant
https://onpon4.github.io

Protect your emails with GnuPG:
https://emailselfdefense.fsf.org



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Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] I am really getting sick of this. Goodbye

[Ivan Zaigralin]

On Sunday, March 19, 2017 19:34:28 awake...@tutanota.de wrote:
>> "Also, even the FSF supports building software for Windows." 
> yes yes and linux has systemd. truly imperfect world we live in.

awake...@tutanota.de, julie is making a pertinent point: no one was arguing 
with you in this forum for like 4 days now. You remark, on the other hand, is 
a classic troll. Also your reference to gamergate. This list is, ostensibly, 
for discussing issues with gnuzilla, such as bugs. A lot of the things you've 
been saying in the last few days are completely, factually offtopic.


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Re: [Bug-gnuzilla] I am really getting sick of this. Goodbye

[Gary]

On Mar 19, 2017, at 11:34 AM, awakeyet wrote:
> 
> what browser may you suggest other security and privacy conscious users use 
> in the place of IceCat

there is a project that is even more privacy conscious...

"Tor Browser lets you use Tor on Windows, Mac OS X, or Linux without needing to 
install any software. It can run off a USB flash drive, comes with a 
pre-configured web browser to protect your anonymity, and is self-contained 
(portable)."

"It prevents somebody watching your Internet connection from learning what 
sites you visit, it prevents the sites you visit from learning your physical 
location, and it lets you access sites which are blocked."
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