Re: [Callers] alternate formations

[Donald Perley]

On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 5:12 PM, Richard Mckeever  wrote:

> I would be interesting to hear how other callers incorporate other formations 
> in their programs and how they and the dancer feel about it



Consider the size of your crowd:

1) For dances where the actives ARE active (compared to 2's and maybe
3's) you ought to run the dance long enough for everyone to have a run
at being active.  That makes for a pretty long dance if the lines are
long.

2) If you have a pretty full house of contra lines, you won't have
room for circles.

3) Opposite problem for 4 facing 4's.  If you don't have enough it
doesn't take much time to run through the line.

4) Squares: up to 3 couples won't be able to dance.  That may not be
too bad as some will be on the edge of whether they want to sit one
out and will accommodate to fill out the last square.

[Callers] alternate formations

[Richard Mckeever]

Here is a new topic...

Recently I have noticed that many of the programs presented have consisted 
solely of duple improper contras with a couple Becket dances thrown in for 
variety.

I would be interesting to hear how other callers incorporate other formations 
in their programs and how they and the dancer feel about it

This would include - but not be limited to:

circles dances
Sicilian circles
Squares
4 facing 4
triple minors
scatter mixers
other??

Comments by formation would be interesting as would regional variations in 
programming

Mac McKeever
St Louis

Re: [Callers] unwelcome behavior

[Martha Edwards]

Here, it's easy. We don't allow lifting people off the floor.

We have one person with a very mild mental illness who wasn't judging very
well when to do it and when not, and wasn't always doing it safely, so we
just made it a rule, not to be broken, that no one does it, to make it
easier for him to remember.

We also have a board member who loves doing aerials, does them with safety
and with permission and all other good stuff, but he can't do it at our
dances either, just because the hard-and-fast rule is the only way we can
keep the rest of us from being cut off at the knees when the other guy was
swinging new dancers off their feet and their legs cut a six-foot circle
sweep.

I also saw a caller in Kansas City stop a dance once and tell a particularly
aggressive dancer to stop lifting people off the ground. "I have liability
here, and I'm not going to continue calling if you keep doing that."  I
think the dancers applauded.

I had the pleasure of meeting Frankie Manning, who invented the aerial in
swing dancing in 1935, and was particularly impressed with the amount of
practice he and his partner did before they ever tried it on a dance floor -
with mattresses covering the floor of his living room while they learned
how.

M
E

On Sat, Jul 9, 2011 at 10:22 AM, Greg McKenzie  wrote:

>
>
> I would love to hear how other dance communities have dealt with this
> issue.
>
> - Greg McKenzie
> ___
> Callers mailing list
> call...@sharedweight.net
> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>

Re: [Callers] mental health and dance calling

[Bree Kalb]

Amy wrote: But have I truly called
them out on it? No. And neither have any of my peers.

I have.
Now that I'm older, it doesn't happen as often, but still does occasionally.
I've put my left palm against a man's shoulder and pushed him back, saying: 
"I don't want to dance that close.' Or: "I don't sleaze dance." The next 
time they've asked me to dance,  I've said "I'll only dance with you again 
if you don't (do that particular thing again.)" They've always agreed and 
behaved themselves, for that dance. When I come to them in the line, I 
automatically push them back a little. But I know I'm an exception; the 
younger, shyer women don't feel comfortable setting limits. Even someone 
like Amy (who I surmise is not particularly shy) is uneasy being so bold. 
So it's important that the organizers pay attention and act. Our board 
actually banned a guy from dancing because he was preying on teenage girls; 
other dance organizers in the area followed suit.


Bree Kalb
Carrboro 

Re: [Callers] mental health and dance calling

[Amy Cann]

It's funny, I'm listening to all of these stories and thinking about the
creepers I've run into over the years, and I'm thinking to myself:

"Well, it's really quite simple, isn't it? Ladies, if a gent is being
inappropriate, walk away!

Just wait until you're out at the top or bottom, turn to him and say 'I am
uncomfortable with what you are doing and am not going to finish this dance
with you' -- and then do it. Walk off. And if he's really offensive, don't
wait until the end, bail out right then and there. The world won't end if a
line of dancers has to cope with a hole. What's more important, ten more
minutes of perfect dancing for that line, at that dance, or a really good
behavior-modification moment that will actually improve the dance community
more in the long run?"

And yet it isn't that simple, is it? We don't do it. We have these halls
just filled with women who are about as uniformly
modern/educated/self-actuated/socially conscious/feminist as it gets, who
spend our days running businesses or doing high end IT/research --  or
teaching children or counseling teens or lobbying to pass laws on issues
just like this -- and not once in my experience have I ever known a woman to
say "Nope, enough, not going to let you do this."

Heck, I've marched eighth grade boys (and girls) off the playground for
inappropriate behavior without a flinch, but at a dance, when it's *me? *I've
been groped and dipped and clenched a few times over the years and the most
overt thing I've ever done is reached back, grabbed his hand, moved it up
about six inches to the small of my back, and said "works much better for me
if you keep your hand *there". *The other times, I've simply become ice
cold/distant and stopped making eye contact - which can be quite the putdown
if you really work it, smile and nod at all of your neighbors but shut down
completely every time you return to your partner. But have I truly called
them out on it? No. And neither have any of my peers.

Food for thought.

Re: [Callers] unwelcome behavior

[barb kirchner]

this is a good policy, very relevant to both new and experienced dancers.
 
i especially liked the "john does this well - get some pointers" part, and 
COMMUNICATE.
 
here's my personal story, as a relatively new dancer doing something wrong 
without realizing it:
 
i was at one of my first dance weekends, pilgrim's progress, i think, and at 
the point where i thought i knew everything and was cool on the dance floor.  
 
moving down the line during a dance, one of my neighbors, during the swing, 
murmured something like "see how much easier this is if you put your hand 
here".  i'm guessing i had my hand someplace where i wasn't supporting myself 
at all and it hurt his arm.  within the hour, i had three people tell me they 
liked the way i swung.  so...thanks, william watson, for saying that one 
inconspicuous little sentence to me at the right time and in the right way.
 
polite, positive, and timely comments can fix a lot of things.  
 
barb 

 

> Date: Sat, 9 Jul 2011 08:20:48 -0400
> From: jola...@gmail.com
> To: call...@sharedweight.net
> Subject: [Callers] unwelcome behavior
> 
> In regards to unwelcome behavior at a dance, our community has a middle-aged
> man who zeros in on the (very thin) young women (we're a college town), and
> lifts them off the floor, swings them around, drops their heads towards the
> floor, etc. I watched him drop a first-time dancer, TWICE in one night. I
> saw her go to the restroom and followed her. She was unhurt but badly
> shaken and in tears.
> As a member of the organizing committee, I had a talk with him and he denied
> vehemently everything I saw, saying that she "fell." I told him someone
> cannot "fall" if their feet are in the air to start with. As lead, his job
> is to take care of his partner. On his behalf, let me say that many of the
> young women enjoy his moves, but many do not.
> Because of this dancer, another local community passed a policy that
> requires dancers to keep one foot on the floor at all times. I felt that
> policy was a message to young people that they didn't want young people
> coming to their dances as dips and aerials (done carefully and well) are how
> they like to dance.
> After much discussion our Board passed a policy that clearly outlines our
> requirements regarding moves which lift someone off the floor, but the thing
> I like best is that it outlines behavior for ALL dancers to follow. It is a
> personal peeve of mine when women (and sometimes men) complain about a
> dancer behind his back but will not tell the dancer what he is doing
> inappropriate. That sometimes makes it hard to confront the person because
> he will say, "I've never had any complaints."
> Our rambunctious dancer has been following these guidelines very well for
> several months now.
> Here is a link to the full policy:
> http://godsdance.org/GODS/New_to_Contra_files/safe%20dancing%20policy.pdf
> 
> JoLaine
> ___
> Callers mailing list
> call...@sharedweight.net
> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
  

[Callers] unwelcome behavior

[JoLaine Jones-Pokorney]

In regards to unwelcome behavior at a dance, our community has a middle-aged
man who zeros in on the (very thin) young women (we're a college town), and
lifts them off the floor, swings them around, drops their heads towards the
floor, etc.  I watched him drop a first-time dancer, TWICE in one night.  I
saw her go to the restroom and followed her.  She was unhurt but badly
shaken and in tears.
As a member of the organizing committee, I had a talk with him and he denied
vehemently everything I saw, saying that she "fell." I told him someone
cannot "fall" if their feet are in the air to start with. As lead, his job
is to take care of his partner.  On his behalf, let me say that many of the
young women enjoy his moves, but many do not.
Because of this dancer, another local community passed a policy that
requires dancers to keep one foot on the floor at all times.  I felt that
policy was a message to young people that they didn't want young people
coming to their dances as dips and aerials (done carefully and well) are how
they like to dance.
After much discussion our Board passed a policy that clearly outlines our
requirements regarding moves which lift someone off the floor, but the thing
I like best is that it outlines behavior for ALL dancers to follow. It is a
personal peeve of mine when women (and sometimes men) complain about a
dancer behind his back but will not tell the dancer what he is doing
inappropriate.  That sometimes makes it hard to confront the person because
he will say, "I've never had any complaints."
Our rambunctious dancer has been following these guidelines very well for
several months now.
Here is a link to the full policy:
http://godsdance.org/GODS/New_to_Contra_files/safe%20dancing%20policy.pdf

JoLaine

Re: [Callers] mental health and dance calling

[Martha Edwards]

So true that the person has to change the behavior! I just don't make the
person admit to the behavior - but I do suggest that they must be doing
SOMETHING that makes people uncomfortable. And I also say "As long as I
don't get any more complaints, we'll consider this over!" Since they don't
know who complained, it means that I don't have to be there to make them
behave better.

Sometimes I say "Look, don't tell me, but if in your heart of hearts you
actually are trying to get away with inappropriate behavior, please stop. If
you really really aren't, and this is all a big misunderstanding, please
figure out what you are doing that people find offensive, and do something
different."  If the complaint was specific "He touched my breasts." "He/she
grabbed my ass." "He held me way too close." "He flashed his thong." (No
kidding. This happened.) I will do the person the favor of telling them
exactly what it was they are said to have done that was offensive - again,
still giving them the right to save face. But I make it clear I don't want
to hear about it again.

What would I do if I heard about it again?  I wouldn't be quite so nice.

But I do want to 1) let people change and 2) avoid accusing an innocent but
awkward person.

Also: I'm doing this as a member of the board, not as a caller.

Frankly, I want the dance to be a safe place. A safe place to flirt, for
example. So no actual extra-marital affairs at the dance. No pursuing people
who haven't explicitly said the feeling is mutual. Friendly. Affectionate.
Caring. Loving even. But no unwanted intimacy, ever.

M
E

On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 9:04 PM, Greg McKenzie  wrote:

> Martha Wrote:
> " In all cases, the person continued to try to convince me
> no harm was meant (while I'm thinking 'milord doth protest too much...'),"
>
> I had a similar experience with a guy who a number of women complained
> about
> his creepy violations of personal space.  I spoke with him and he assured
> me
> that he had no such intentions.  I let it drop and wished later that I had
> been more firm.  I think it is important to clarify that, "I'm not talking
> about your intentions or what you *meant*.  I'm talking about your
> behavior.  It is your behavior that is offending people, not your
> intentions.  You need to change your *behavior*."
>
> This individual has mitigated his behavior only to the extent that he
> avoids
> creepy behavior when I am in the vicinity.
>
> - Greg
> ___
> Callers mailing list
> call...@sharedweight.net
> http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
>

Re: [Callers] mental health and dance calling

[Laur]

I agree, Donald.  The caller certainly should bring this to the organizer/ 
board member attention, and esp note if you have seen this as a pattern.  I see 
it as a community issue, one which may already be noted, or in process of being 
handled.

We have similar glomb issues here.  Because our local dancers 
frequent several other communities its nice sometimes to take a more 
global stand.

Laurie
 ~
When I dance, I cannot judge, I cannot hate, I cannot separate myself from 
life. I can only be joyful and whole, that is why I dance.  ~Hans Bos~
~



From: Donald Perley donper...@gmail.com
To: Callers discussion list call...@sharedweight.net
Sent: Friday, July 8, 2011 6:27 PM
Subject: Re: [Callers] mental health and dance calling

On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Chip Hedler ch...@rumney.org wrote:

 When he showed up at a public dance I was calling and started his 
routine,
 at the first break I asked him to come outside for a private chat.

That seems like something the organizers should handle, since they are
there every dance and the caller generally isnt.
___
Callers mailing list
call...@sharedweight.net
http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers