Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
Hi Erik, Thanx for the update. Looks like what I've been calling is a slightly different dance (it may be Seth's variation), but it manages to get all 4 corners in 32 bars: Walpole "Condo?" 3 face 3 Sicilian Circle by Somone TBD -- mostly lifted from Pat Shaw's Walpole Cottage Walpole Dollhouse Erik Hoffman, Sicilian 3x3, (Ric Goldman variation) A1 1-4 Lines F+B 5-8 Opposites DSD A2 1-16Middles dble contra corners (PR ½ , 1st Crnr L 1x, PR ½, 2nd Crnr L 1x, &c) B1 (continued) B2 1-4 Circle 6 L ½ way 5-8 Grps of 3 circle (optional basket sw), end facing next threesome Note: middle does a twizzle from last All L w/ 4 Crnr into Circle L (although some will just end up on the end of the line, creating a new middle and thats ok) Thanx, Ric Goldman Palo Alto, CA and Montreal, QC > -Original Message- > From: callers-boun...@sharedweight.net > [mailto:callers-boun...@sharedweight.net] On Behalf Of Erik Hoffman > Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 10:40 PM > To: Caller's discussion list > Subject: Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 > Corners? > > First of all, I agree with Jim below: be careful of presenting dances > that are a struggle for a large number on the dance floor. > > Second, as mentioned, in the Pat Shaw dance, Walpole Cottage, dancers do > visit all four corners, and the music fits that. In my reduction of > Walpole Cottage, Walpole Dollhouse, active dancers only visit two > couples. It would be possible to modify it so that dancers visit all > four in the minor set by requesting a 40-bar tune, such as Little Billy > Wilson (AABCC), or The Snoring Mrs. Gobiel (AABBC, I think), and > others. Here's the dance and it's modification: > > Walpole Dollhouse > 3 face 3 Sicilian Circle > by Erik Hoffman -- mostly lifted from Pat Shaw's Walpole Cottage > > A1Lines of 3 forward & back (8) > End four right hand star (8) > A2Middle people turn contra corners with two in opposite line > End taking the "shortcut" (beeline) home to (original) lines of 3 > B1Circle six half way > Lines of 3 forward and back > B2Threesomes basket swing, end facing original direction > > To modify it to visit all 4 corners, simply add a part (that 40-bar > tune) and stick the two more corners in the third part: > > A1 Same > A2 Same > B1 Next two contra corners > B2 Circle & F & B > C1 Basket Swing > > This dance is very forgiving, as it doesn't really matter which corner > people go to. And the basket swing at the end is a chance to forgive > all and start again. > > > ~erik hoffman > oakland, ca [snip]
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
First of all, I agree with Jim below: be careful of presenting dances that are a struggle for a large number on the dance floor. Second, as mentioned, in the Pat Shaw dance, Walpole Cottage, dancers do visit all four corners, and the music fits that. In my reduction of Walpole Cottage, Walpole Dollhouse, active dancers only visit two couples. It would be possible to modify it so that dancers visit all four in the minor set by requesting a 40-bar tune, such as Little Billy Wilson (AABCC), or The Snoring Mrs. Gobiel (AABBC, I think), and others. Here's the dance and it's modification: Walpole Dollhouse 3 face 3 Sicilian Circle by Erik Hoffman -- mostly lifted from Pat Shaw's Walpole Cottage A1Lines of 3 forward & back (8) End four right hand star (8) A2Middle people turn contra corners with two in opposite line End taking the "shortcut" (beeline) home to (original) lines of 3 B1Circle six half way Lines of 3 forward and back B2Threesomes basket swing, end facing original direction To modify it to visit all 4 corners, simply add a part (that 40-bar tune) and stick the two more corners in the third part: A1 Same A2 Same B1 Next two contra corners B2 Circle & F & B C1 Basket Swing This dance is very forgiving, as it doesn't really matter which corner people go to. And the basket swing at the end is a chance to forgive all and start again. ~erik hoffman oakland, ca On 5/19/2013 6:19 PM, James Saxe wrote: Aahz Maruch asked re Ron Buchanan's "Contra Corners Canon" (or "Country Corners Canon"--I've seen both spellings and don't know which one Ron prefers): That sounds awfully similar to the Plus-level square dance call "Teacup Chain", do you have a reference so I can check? ... and Yoyo Zhou replied: It's probably similar in timing / phase shift but there are some differences: teacup chain has the inactives at the sides (rather than the corners) teacup chain has the ladies active (rather than the heads) Also, CCC has pairs of "active" dancers always turning in the middle in between turning one corner person and turning the next corner person. In Teacup Chain, the ladies go into the middle after turning head gents but they go directly from the side gents to the head gents without going into the middle first. So CCC is not just TC rotated by 45 degrees and with some of the gender roles changed. I've seen "Country Corners Canon" work well and give a dancers a feeling of accomplishment when presented by a skilled teacher to a suitably skilled and attentive group of dancers, such as might be found at a workshop session at a dance camp. But I strenuously urge against trying to present a square of this complexity to any group of dancers until and unless you (the caller) have a proven track record of calling more moderately challenging squares to similar groups of dancers with good results. On page 59 of his book _Give-and-Take_, Larry Jennings relates an anecdote to which he gives the title "Ambitious Caller Meets Cocky Dancers." The dance sequence in the anecdote is not named, but from the description, I think it's almost certainly "Country Corners Canon." (I suggest that the identity of the caller in the story, if anyone happens to know it, had best be left unstated.) The scene Larry describes is not pretty: A few people found it exciting and rewarding to figure out such a difficult figure ... Others, finding it hopeless ..., just entered into a random walk and appeared to have a good time. However, there was an appreciable number who struggled to understand the figure and, when they could not, took on an air of resignation, and in fact, many of them went home. Unfortunately (in my opinion), when something of this sort occurs in a community where most of the dances are contras and where some of the dancers already have negative feelings about squares, I think many of those dancers are likely to interpret the incident as further indictment against squares in general. On the other hand, if an overly complex contra (say, one with surprising end effects, unusual out-of-minor set interactions etc.) fell apart, those same dancers would think only that that particular dance was too confusing, or that it was a poor choice for the occasion, or that the particular caller had taught and called the dance poorly. --Jim ___ Callers mailing list call...@sharedweight.net http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
Aahz Maruch asked re Ron Buchanan's "Contra Corners Canon" (or "Country Corners Canon"--I've seen both spellings and don't know which one Ron prefers): That sounds awfully similar to the Plus-level square dance call "Teacup Chain", do you have a reference so I can check? ... and Yoyo Zhou replied: It's probably similar in timing / phase shift but there are some differences: teacup chain has the inactives at the sides (rather than the corners) teacup chain has the ladies active (rather than the heads) Also, CCC has pairs of "active" dancers always turning in the middle in between turning one corner person and turning the next corner person. In Teacup Chain, the ladies go into the middle after turning head gents but they go directly from the side gents to the head gents without going into the middle first. So CCC is not just TC rotated by 45 degrees and with some of the gender roles changed. I've seen "Country Corners Canon" work well and give a dancers a feeling of accomplishment when presented by a skilled teacher to a suitably skilled and attentive group of dancers, such as might be found at a workshop session at a dance camp. But I strenuously urge against trying to present a square of this complexity to any group of dancers until and unless you (the caller) have a proven track record of calling more moderately challenging squares to similar groups of dancers with good results. On page 59 of his book _Give-and-Take_, Larry Jennings relates an anecdote to which he gives the title "Ambitious Caller Meets Cocky Dancers." The dance sequence in the anecdote is not named, but from the description, I think it's almost certainly "Country Corners Canon." (I suggest that the identity of the caller in the story, if anyone happens to know it, had best be left unstated.) The scene Larry describes is not pretty: A few people found it exciting and rewarding to figure out such a difficult figure ... Others, finding it hopeless ..., just entered into a random walk and appeared to have a good time. However, there was an appreciable number who struggled to understand the figure and, when they could not, took on an air of resignation, and in fact, many of them went home. Unfortunately (in my opinion), when something of this sort occurs in a community where most of the dances are contras and where some of the dancers already have negative feelings about squares, I think many of those dancers are likely to interpret the incident as further indictment against squares in general. On the other hand, if an overly complex contra (say, one with surprising end effects, unusual out-of-minor set interactions etc.) fell apart, those same dancers would think only that that particular dance was too confusing, or that it was a poor choice for the occasion, or that the particular caller had taught and called the dance poorly. --Jim
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
On Sun, May 19, 2013 at 3:19 PM, Aahz Maruch wrote: > On Sun, May 19, 2013, Yoyo Zhou wrote: >> >> There's a Ron Buchanan square, Contra Corners Canon, that has all 4 >> heads visit all 4 sides as their contra corners. I don't remember the >> details well, but the head ladies are turning each other in the center >> while the head gents turn their corners and vice versa. > > That sounds awfully similar to the Plus-level square dance call "Teacup > Chain", do you have a reference so I can check? (If you don't get it > today, I won't see it for a week ;-) It's probably similar in timing / phase shift but there are some differences: teacup chain has the inactives at the sides (rather than the corners) teacup chain has the ladies active (rather than the heads) Yoyo Zhou
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
On Sun, May 19, 2013, Yoyo Zhou wrote: > > There's a Ron Buchanan square, Contra Corners Canon, that has all 4 > heads visit all 4 sides as their contra corners. I don't remember the > details well, but the head ladies are turning each other in the center > while the head gents turn their corners and vice versa. That sounds awfully similar to the Plus-level square dance call "Teacup Chain", do you have a reference so I can check? (If you don't get it today, I won't see it for a week ;-) -- Hugs and backrubs -- I break Rule 6http://rule6.info/ <*> <*> <*> Help a hearing-impaired person: http://rule6.info/hearing.html
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
There's a Ron Buchanan square, Contra Corners Canon, that has all 4 heads visit all 4 sides as their contra corners. I don't remember the details well, but the head ladies are turning each other in the center while the head gents turn their corners and vice versa. (If anyone has the details, I'd be interested in collecting it!) Yoyo Zhou
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
On Sun, 19 May 2013 15:16:26 -0400, r...@rochester.rr.com wrote: > Yes, Sags, Bob is asking about dances where each of the actives > visits all four contra corners. David Millstone called such a > dance during the Puttin' on the Dance organizers conference. Alas, > I don't know the name. It was a 3 facing 3 Sicilian circle > formation, and it moved quickly. I bet that was Walpole Cottage, which has already been mentioned. Colin Hume
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
On 5/19/2013 12:16 PM, r...@rochester.rr.com wrote: Yes, Sags, Bob is asking about dances where each of the actives visits all four contra corners. David Millstone called such a dance during the Puttin' on the Dance organizers conference. Alas, I don't know the name. It was a 3 facing 3 Sicilian circle formation, and it moved quickly. Rich It's certainly not the dance you're thinking of, but Chris Sackett's "Pony Express" uses this pattern. You can find it in his and Brooke Friendly's book Impropriety vol 3. It's a dance for 3 couples in a ring, arranged with each person across the set from their partner. Kalia
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
Yes, Sags, Bob is asking about dances where each of the actives visits all four contra corners. David Millstone called such a dance during the Puttin' on the Dance organizers conference. Alas, I don't know the name. It was a 3 facing 3 Sicilian circle formation, and it moved quickly. Rich - Reply message - From: "Aahz Maruch" To: "Caller's discussion list" Subject: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners? Date: Sun, May 19, 2013 3:00 pm On Sat, May 18, 2013, bob...@aol.com wrote: > > I was talking with an older member of our dance community and he said > it had been "a thousand years" since he danced a dance that had Contra > Corners where the actives visited 4 corners. He could not remember the > name. I promised him I would ask. I'm confused, don't the actives visit the four corners in a normal contra corners? Or do you mean *each* active visits all four corners? -- Hugs and backrubs -- I break Rule 6http://rule6.info/ <*> <*> <*> Help a hearing-impaired person: http://rule6.info/hearing.html ___ Callers mailing list call...@sharedweight.net http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
On Sat, May 18, 2013, bob...@aol.com wrote: > > I was talking with an older member of our dance community and he said > it had been "a thousand years" since he danced a dance that had Contra > Corners where the actives visited 4 corners. He could not remember the > name. I promised him I would ask. I'm confused, don't the actives visit the four corners in a normal contra corners? Or do you mean *each* active visits all four corners? -- Hugs and backrubs -- I break Rule 6http://rule6.info/ <*> <*> <*> Help a hearing-impaired person: http://rule6.info/hearing.html
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
And then there are Sackett's Harbor and the 3-facing-3 version of Mason's Apron... Hanny
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
This was a very popular dance in Ann Arbor well into the mid 80s. Our Morris side used to improvise a bit. A favorite variation was to change direction at the end. John B. Freeman, SFTPOCTJ
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
Thanks to Keith Holmes, we just danced Walpole Cottage last night! Excellent fun. Dorcas Hand Houston, Texas -Original Message- From: callers-boun...@sharedweight.net [mailto:callers-boun...@sharedweight.net] On Behalf Of Alan Winston Sent: Saturday, May 18, 2013 7:27 PM To: call...@sharedweight.net Subject: Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners? Pat Shaw's three-face-three dance "Walpole Cottage" has a contra-corners with all four corners; I think both Erik Hoffman and Seth Tepfer have made simpler versions of it. -- Alan On 5/18/2013 5:10 PM, bob...@aol.com wrote: > I was talking with an older member of our dance community and he > said it had been "a thousand years" since he danced a dance that had Contra > Corners where the actives visited 4 corners. He could not remember the name. > I promised him I would ask. > > > > bob...@aol.com > > > > ___ > Callers mailing list > call...@sharedweight.net > http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers ___ Callers mailing list call...@sharedweight.net http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
Pat Shaw's three-face-three dance "Walpole Cottage" has a contra-corners with all four corners; I think both Erik Hoffman and Seth Tepfer have made simpler versions of it. -- Alan On 5/18/2013 5:10 PM, bob...@aol.com wrote: I was talking with an older member of our dance community and he said it had been "a thousand years" since he danced a dance that had Contra Corners where the actives visited 4 corners. He could not remember the name. I promised him I would ask. bob...@aol.com ___ Callers mailing list call...@sharedweight.net http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers
Re: [Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
"Box the Compass" by Tony Saletan appears in Zesty Contras. A nice dance, but a bit unequal. One of these days I want to call "Double Trouble" by Peter Foster, a more modern take on that idea. -Chris Page San Diego On Saturday, May 18, 2013, wrote: > > I was talking with an older member of our dance community and he said it > had been "a thousand years" since > he danced a dance that had Contra Corners where the actives visited 4 > corners. He could not remember the name. > I promised him I would ask. > > > > bob...@aol.com > > > > ___ > Callers mailing list > call...@sharedweight.net > http://www.sharedweight.net/mailman/listinfo/callers >
[Callers] Anyone know a dance that has Contra Corners with 4 Corners?
I was talking with an older member of our dance community and he said it had been "a thousand years" since he danced a dance that had Contra Corners where the actives visited 4 corners. He could not remember the name. I promised him I would ask. bob...@aol.com