Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
On 28/4/09 09:59, Ian Wells wrote: Top posting is bad. Bottom posting is bad. Actually, it's mostly the inconsistency that's bad. I'm on several lists that work just fine with top posting. These are the basics of old-fashioned usenet netiquette, of which there are more comprehensive guides elsewhere. But if you take in these two points, all our current problems will end. People coming to open source and email lists from a corporate environment will not be familiar with this, we ought to take more time to educate people on the whys of using the usenet style. It really isn't at all obvious to people used to corporate email. If you want to be helped, you'll get more sympathy from the people with the knowledge you need if you follow these guidelines. Agreed ! If you are offering help, I assume you want to aid the community, and driving people away from the mailing list with petty annoyances is not going to achieve that. Most certainly true. Be liberal in what you accept and strict in what you send. Or as my dear old mother used to say if you can't think of anything nice to say, don't say anything at all :-) S. ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
[Catalyst] Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema?
Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema? Thanks. -- Jack Malloy ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] unexpected behavior of $c-request-secure and $c-request-base
Phil Mitchell wrote: For (a) documentation, I took a stab at writing some. If this looks okay, I'll submit a patch ... Heh, unified diffs are easier to read (at least to me) than scanning for [ADDED]. That said, this looks good, please submit said patch :) Thank you! t0m ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
\o/ Remember in utf8, nobody can see you ;-) O_o On 28/04/2009, at 8:33 PM, Simon Wilcox wrote: On 28/4/09 11:13, J. Shirley wrote: Addendum: Don't drive away prolific responders by responding to single lines uttered as an aside, because you have your own gripes. You mean me, obviously. In response all I'll say is that I picked you up when you had repeatedly complained about top posting. It wasn't in response to a single line but your repeated complaint and in particular you automatically complaining about top posting when the OP hadn't done any such thing in the case to which I responded. But I'm sorry if I caused you any offence, I realise that I was in danger of trolling which wasn't my intention at all. That's why I didn't continue the discussion. You are more helpful on the list that I am, as you know more about Catalyst that I do, so I don't really have a good position from which to criticise. I did consider sending this as a private email but I'll send it back to the list to acknowledge that meta-complaints just don't help. I'll endeavour not to repeat the mistake ! Rgds, ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
From: Simon Wilcox sim...@digitalcraftsmen.net Actually, it's mostly the inconsistency that's bad. I'm on several lists that work just fine with top posting. I fully agree with this. The netiquette's scope is to make everyone happy, but this is not possible. As an example, a blind person can't use Linux as easy as Windows, because Linux is not as accessible as Windows, and it is very hard for a blind person to skip tens of lines in every message, just for beeing able to read a line or 2 with the current message (if bottom-posting is used). I have also tried to find a better email client than Outlook Express, but I couldn't because of accessibility issues. But... The mailing lists are not democracies. They are places where most of the users ask for help, and if some guys that give most of the help, it wouldn't be very helpful for anyone to tell them to follow a standard they don't like, because they might prefer to go away. For this reason, I bottom-post on the mailing lists where most of the users are Linux users and top-post on the other lists. It is not so hard. Octavian ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 7:33 PM, Simon Wilcox sim...@digitalcraftsmen.netwrote: On 28/4/09 11:13, J. Shirley wrote: Addendum: Don't drive away prolific responders by responding to single lines uttered as an aside, because you have your own gripes. You mean me, obviously. In response all I'll say is that I picked you up when you had repeatedly complained about top posting. It wasn't in response to a single line but your repeated complaint and in particular you automatically complaining about top posting when the OP hadn't done any such thing in the case to which I responded. But I'm sorry if I caused you any offence, I realise that I was in danger of trolling which wasn't my intention at all. That's why I didn't continue the discussion. You are more helpful on the list that I am, as you know more about Catalyst that I do, so I don't really have a good position from which to criticise. I did consider sending this as a private email but I'll send it back to the list to acknowledge that meta-complaints just don't help. I'll endeavour not to repeat the mistake ! Rgds, Simon. Your point about it being automated is fairly accurate. When I notice it, I simply start my thread off with a single line pointing it out. It is very little more than that, and I often do not put any additional thought into the matter. He (Akimoto) just basically got the response from 'autopilot' because he relentlessly posts in random and weird formats, making his messages difficult to parse and difficult to respond to. You didn't cause me offense. You caused irritation, and there is a subtle difference. Offense is when you take things personally that you shouldn't. Irritation is when you go, Why do I bother? That's why I'm taking the time to post now, publicly, about how irritating it can be when you devote time and energy into something and people only come in to attack something on the sideline. It's not just mailing lists, it happens frequently in open source contributions. Some people who are more heavily vested don't get phased by it, but others do. Ultimately it is very damaging to any community, and at the core it is all just bike shedding. People lack the confidence to respond to the original point, so they attach to a minor inconsequential detail. This behavior has basically stopped me from contributing to anything beyond the mailing list and blog posts, because I don't have the patience to deal with the bikeshedding and handling signal to noise. Fortunately, in most cases, mailing list posts are seldom afflicted with bikeshedding and when they are I simply mute that thread and move on. Keeps me happy, at least. The message here isn't about me, though. I'm much more meta about it. It is about the people who know the answers, but lack the confidence, and instead contribute to bikeshedding. It's damaging to any aspect of any volunteer based community. Please consider how your words and actions can impact the group. Every time a bikeshedder runs off a contributor, God kills MSTs braincells. Please save MSTs braincells. So, look at that... I still ended up writing my rant. Damnit. Just remember, ask yourself, Is this good for the company? -J ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema?
On 28/04/2009, at 7:38 PM, Malloy wrote: Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema? Thanks. Err, they do different things. Use the latter if you want to use DBIx::Class (recommended) or the former if you want to use plain DBI. You can also use both in the same app if you like. ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
I have the feeling that this bashing of top posters or bottom posters or whatever netiquette you have in disregard is often just showing off your status in the community. There are studies showing that practical jokes victims (in traditional work situations) [1] are the less efficient workers than the perpetrators - this is the same online. I don't like it. I don't want to judge it neither and I don't want to request anyone to change this - but perhaps some people here are capable of this self reflection on the true source of their irritation. [1] - http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~content=a738552611~db=all -- Zbigniew Lukasiak http://brudnopis.blogspot.com/ http://perlalchemy.blogspot.com/ ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
On 28/4/09 11:13, J. Shirley wrote: Addendum: Don't drive away prolific responders by responding to single lines uttered as an aside, because you have your own gripes. You mean me, obviously. In response all I'll say is that I picked you up when you had repeatedly complained about top posting. It wasn't in response to a single line but your repeated complaint and in particular you automatically complaining about top posting when the OP hadn't done any such thing in the case to which I responded. But I'm sorry if I caused you any offence, I realise that I was in danger of trolling which wasn't my intention at all. That's why I didn't continue the discussion. You are more helpful on the list that I am, as you know more about Catalyst that I do, so I don't really have a good position from which to criticise. I did consider sending this as a private email but I'll send it back to the list to acknowledge that meta-complaints just don't help. I'll endeavour not to repeat the mistake ! Rgds, Simon. ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 9:00 PM, Zbigniew Lukasiak zzb...@gmail.com wrote: I have the feeling that this bashing of top posters or bottom posters or whatever netiquette you have in disregard is often just showing off your status in the community. There are studies showing that practical jokes victims (in traditional work situations) [1] are the less efficient workers than the perpetrators - this is the same online. I don't like it. I don't want to judge it neither and I don't want to request anyone to change this - but perhaps some people here are capable of this self reflection on the true source of their irritation. [1] - http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~content=a738552611~db=allhttp://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content%7Econtent=a738552611%7Edb=all -- Zbigniew Lukasiak http://brudnopis.blogspot.com/ http://perlalchemy.blogspot.com/ I find this to be a very different situation. It's a spectrum of competence -and- confidence. On the high end you have people with an abundance of competence or confidence, and happily answer questions on the list. On the low end, you have people who have no competence, but the confidence to ask stupid questions -or- people with competence but no knowledge, and confidence enough to know it is ok to not know, and ask well thought out questions. The people in the middle-ground have an honest and genuine desire to help, but lack the confidence or competence to do so. This is why when bikeshedding moments come up, suddenly the pent up desire to help is released and you get a lot of noise (and a lot of very wordy me too responses). In summation, I think that people who bikeshed have very good intentions, but it is a lack of confidence that is the problem. In context of the current thread, I think it is a case of people reading the list and wanting to help in whatever way they can. I'm not going to fault people, but being on the other end I will happily offer my perspective. Additionally, I (very sincerely) regret if anybody thinks this is about bashing anybody. Someone made an off-topic post in response to a single line I rather automatically prepended in my responses. I reacted by pointing out it should be its own thread, and then finally just abandoned that thread because it was approaching Ridiculous. Now we have a dedicated thread, where people can discuss the specific matter. I just viewed the hijacking of the previous thread to be too similar to bikeshedding, and aimed to stop it and more importantly, refrained from personally participating any further. I think that Octavian has nailed the general philosophy: If you are asking for help, abide by the rules and advice of the group helping you. This has digressed to amazing amounts off off-topic discord, and I hope the take away message from all of this is that some of the middle-ground lurkers can gain some confidence to post and respond to technical details. That whole, You miss 100% of the shots you don't take thing has some merit. If your responses are truly awful, someone will gently ask you to stop ;) ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
This mailing list is for helping people. If you want to be helped, you'll get more sympathy from the people with the knowledge you need if you follow these guidelines. If you are offering help, I assume you want to aid the community, and driving people away from the mailing list with petty annoyances is not going to achieve that. Hello, Ian, Well said. Afterall, there's a few generations of programmers around these days. People like myself who only got to use mailing lists heavily say within last year do not know of the netiquette in practice. Thanks for providing a heads up. K. akimoto ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
[Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
People: Top posting is bad. Bottom posting is bad. When quoting a previous message: - Remove as much of the original message as you can. (And if the message you send still has the mailing list footer quoted within it, you're clearly not trying.) - Put replies to points in the message *underneath* the element of the original message that they relate to. These are the basics of old-fashioned usenet netiquette, of which there are more comprehensive guides elsewhere. But if you take in these two points, all our current problems will end. This mailing list is for helping people. If you want to be helped, you'll get more sympathy from the people with the knowledge you need if you follow these guidelines. If you are offering help, I assume you want to aid the community, and driving people away from the mailing list with petty annoyances is not going to achieve that. Thanks, -- Ian. ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
[Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
There's a new edit of the Catalyst press release, which was graciously donated by a copy edit expert mst found for us. mst++ Please take a look: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease.edit Now, there's a lot of changes and it's much shorter. Basically, the editor felt it should be short enough to fit various syndication models, that we should pull out all the opinion stuff and to remove links since that will just pull traffic away. I choose to leave in links to the release homepage, since that's at the bottom of the copy and not likely to distract from the text, but is valuable as it brings people to a good place to start exploring. On the release homepage I tried to reorganize some of the stuff from the earlier PR copy. I think it will work better this way, but I really need people to log into: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements and add their personal advocacy or howto stuff in the, Blogs and third party discussions section, which is looking thin. This edit was done by an expert in these matters. I realize it says less than many of us would prefer, given the excitement and sense of accomplishment we feel. However, I really think this should go out ASAP (before swine flu news drowns out anything else) and filling in the gaps is something we should do with our blogging or through more additions to the wiki. Let's get some last comments and then devise a strategy to get it distributed as far and wide as possible. For the moment, let's try to consider the page 'locked' keep our comments to the ML or IRC chat. I want to set a deadline for comments of 6pm UTC (see http://www.worldtimeserver.com/current_time_in_UTC.aspx) if you need help figuring that out) and then started sending it around. Thanks! jnapiorkowski ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
John Napiorkowski wrote: There's a new edit of the Catalyst press release, which was graciously donated by a copy edit expert mst found for us. mst++ Please take a look: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease.edit No permissions to edit this page ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 10:29 PM, John Napiorkowski jjn1...@yahoo.comwrote: There's a new edit of the Catalyst press release, which was graciously donated by a copy edit expert mst found for us. mst++ Please take a look: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease.edit Now, there's a lot of changes and it's much shorter. Basically, the editor felt it should be short enough to fit various syndication models, that we should pull out all the opinion stuff and to remove links since that will just pull traffic away. I choose to leave in links to the release homepage, since that's at the bottom of the copy and not likely to distract from the text, but is valuable as it brings people to a good place to start exploring. On the release homepage I tried to reorganize some of the stuff from the earlier PR copy. I think it will work better this way, but I really need people to log into: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements and add their personal advocacy or howto stuff in the, Blogs and third party discussions section, which is looking thin. This edit was done by an expert in these matters. I realize it says less than many of us would prefer, given the excitement and sense of accomplishment we feel. However, I really think this should go out ASAP (before swine flu news drowns out anything else) and filling in the gaps is something we should do with our blogging or through more additions to the wiki. Let's get some last comments and then devise a strategy to get it distributed as far and wide as possible. For the moment, let's try to consider the page 'locked' keep our comments to the ML or IRC chat. I want to set a deadline for comments of 6pm UTC (see http://www.worldtimeserver.com/current_time_in_UTC.aspx) if you need help figuring that out) and then started sending it around. The non-edit link: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease Also, typo (should be Developers?): Developer, managers and any Perl enthusiast will love the new features, continued stability and highly adaptable framework. I think the .. in the It's fast and easy to get started.. should be an ellipsis or a simple period. I really like the tenor and short brevity of this revision, though. I think some of the segue ways between points can use some enhancement, but it is very good! -J ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
On 28 Apr 2009, at 14:32, Ben Vinnerd wrote: John Napiorkowski wrote: There's a new edit of the Catalyst press release, which was graciously donated by a copy edit expert mst found for us. mst++ Please take a look: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease.edit No permissions to edit this page So get rid of the .edit and it works.. http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease for the hard of thinking. /joel ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 06:29:06AM -0700, John Napiorkowski wrote: This edit was done by an expert in these matters. I realize it says less than many of us would prefer, given the excitement and sense of accomplishment we feel. However, I really think this should go out ASAP (before swine flu news drowns out anything else) and filling in the gaps is something we should do with our blogging or through more additions to the wiki. Let's get some last comments and then devise a strategy to get it distributed as far and wide as possible. For the moment, let's try to consider the page 'locked' keep our comments to the ML or IRC chat. I want to set a deadline for comments of 6pm UTC (see http://www.worldtimeserver.com/current_time_in_UTC.aspx) if you need help figuring that out) and then started sending it around. I made some minor edits just to remove the sentence fragments and stylistic problems. On the whole, I'm not really thrilled with this revision. I appreciate the potential need to be punchy and short, and perhaps the details of what's new in 5.8 are irrelevant to getting people to try it out for the first time, but after reading this I hardly have any idea of what Catalyst is and why I should use it. It is also not well written. I'm blocked from IRC at my present location, unfortunately, as I'd like to be involved in any discussion of revisions Jesse ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
On 28 Apr 2009, at 14:48, Ben Vinnerd wrote: Joel Bernstein wrote: On 28 Apr 2009, at 14:32, Ben Vinnerd wrote: John Napiorkowski wrote: There's a new edit of the Catalyst press release, which was graciously donated by a copy edit expert mst found for us. mst++ Please take a look: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease.edit No permissions to edit this page So get rid of the .edit and it works.. http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/releaseannouncements/58pressrelease for the hard of thinking. Cheers Joel, couldn't have done it without you! What a star. My sarcasm meter just went off the scale. Sorry if you were offended. /joel ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
I like that press release - it is short enough to get read and sufficiently light on detail not to make people feel that the learning curve will be too steep. 2009/4/28 John Napiorkowski jjn1...@yahoo.com: and add their personal advocacy or howto stuff in the, Blogs and third party discussions section, which is looking thin. At the risk of showing my age I've always been a fan of the Be.com press releases: http://web.archive.org/web/20010106174100/www2.be.com/aboutbe/pressinfo.html Those pages are from 2001 - the company subsequently folded. Anyhoo - I think that they set a good example of haw to do press. I especially like that at the end of each press release they had a 'About Be' section that set the scene. Perhaps we should add something similar to our press releases: - About Catalyst Catalyst is a framework for building web applications of all sizes. It allows clean separation of all the components and embodies most current best practices. Developed and maintained by a worldwide group of enthusiasts and professionals it is continually evolving. Written in Perl it is easy to work with and extend using code available on CPAN. It is stable and widely used in business critical applications. It is open source and free to use. Enjoy. - tweak at will :) Cheers, Edmund. -- e...@ecclestoad.co.uk - http://ecclestoad.co.uk Help Perl newbies: http://www.send-a-newbie.com/ ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
[snip...] Perhaps we should add something similar to our press releases: - About Catalyst Catalyst is a framework for building web applications of all sizes. It allows clean separation of all the components and embodies most current best practices. Developed and maintained by a worldwide group of enthusiasts and professionals it is continually evolving. Written in Perl it is easy to work with and extend using code available on CPAN. It is stable and widely used in business critical applications. It is open source and free to use. Enjoy. - tweak at will :) Cheers, Edmund. I like the idea of having a simple, and generic text blurb. I added your bit to: http://dev.catalystframework.org/wiki/resources/marketingresources And suggested people go there and add more ideas. Thanks! jnapiorkowski ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 10:59 AM, Ian Wells i...@cack.org.uk wrote: People: Top posting is bad. Bottom posting is bad. I'm on gmail, like some people here. It handles top, bottom and interwoven posting just fine in its conversations (I think that's what google calls it). It folds useless quotes too. I'm not hailing gmail, but aren't there more email readers that can do such tricks? I think it all comes down to finding a mail client that can handle long conversations well. -rodrigo ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
Am Dienstag, den 28.04.2009, 17:44 +0200 schrieb Edmund von der Burg: I like that press release - it is short enough to get read and sufficiently light on detail not to make people feel that the learning curve will be too steep. 2009/4/28 John Napiorkowski jjn1...@yahoo.com: and add their personal advocacy or howto stuff in the, Blogs and third party discussions section, which is looking thin. At the risk of showing my age I've always been a fan of the Be.com press releases: http://web.archive.org/web/20010106174100/www2.be.com/aboutbe/pressinfo.html Those pages are from 2001 - the company subsequently folded. Anyhoo - I think that they set a good example of haw to do press. I especially like that at the end of each press release they had a 'About Be' section that set the scene. Perhaps we should add something similar to our press releases: - About Catalyst Catalyst is a framework for building web applications of all sizes. It allows clean separation of all the components and embodies most current best practices. Developed and maintained by a worldwide group of enthusiasts and professionals it is continually evolving. Written in Perl it is easy to work with and extend using code available on CPAN. It is stable and widely used in business critical applications. It is open source and free to use. Enjoy. - That paragraph is awesome! I vote for including it! Cheers, Alex tweak at will :) Cheers, Edmund. *** T-Systems Austria GesmbH Rennweg 97-99, 1030 Wien Handelsgericht Wien, FN 79340b *** Notice: This e-mail contains information that is confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender and then delete this e-mail immediately. *** ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
* On Tue, Apr 28 2009, Zbigniew Lukasiak wrote: I have the feeling that this bashing of top posters or bottom posters ... is often just showing off your status in the community. +1. That's all it is. People get wayyy too bent out of shape over the formatting of emails. It's not 1990 anymore, using email doesn't make you cool. ;) Regards, Jonathan Rockway -- print just = another = perl = hacker = if $,=$ ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Final RFC for Press Release!
2009/4/28 Alexander Hartmaier alexander.hartma...@t-systems.at: That paragraph is awesome! I vote for including it! Seconded. Although I've tweaked the wording slightly on the wiki, mainly to remove the weasel word 'most'. ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
[Catalyst] Relations 1:M
Welcome,
I have got a problem with relation has_many.
I have got 2 tables:
CREATE TABLE podmioty (
lpp integer not null primary key autoincrement,
nazwa varchar(100),
nip varchar(20),
regon varchar(20),
adres varchar(100),
osoba varchar(50),
uwagi varchar(200)
);
sqlite .schema umowy
CREATE TABLE umowy (
lpu integer not null primary key autoincrement,
nrumowy varchar(50),
datazawarcia date,
datakonca date,
dane varchar(100),
opis varchar(100),
uwagi varchar(200),
podmiot integer references podmioty(lpp),
powiazanie integer default 0
);
podmiot has many umowy. I use FormFu this way:
1 ---
2 languages: ['pl']
3 indicator: submit
4 auto_fieldset: { legend: 'Lista umów' }
5
6 elements:
7
8 - type: Text
9 name: nrumowy
10 label: Nr umowy
11 container_attributes:
12 title: Nr umowy
13 constraints:
14 - Required
15
16 - type: Block
17 content_xml: br /
18
19 - type: Date
20 name: datazawarcia
21 label: Data zawarcia
22 day:
23 prefix: - Dzień -
24 month:
25 prefix: - Miesiąc -
26 year:
27 prefix: - Rok -
28 less: 20
29 plus: 20
30 auto_inflate: 1
31 container_attributes:
32 title: Data zawarcia
33
34 - type: Block
35 content_xml: br /
36
37 - type: Date
38 name: datakonca
39 label: Data końca
40 day:
41 prefix: - Dzień -
42 month:
43 prefix: - Miesiąc -
44 year:
45 prefix: - Rok -
46 less: 20
47 plus: 20
48 auto_inflate: 1
49 container_attributes:
50 title: Data końca
51
52 - type: Text
53 name: dane
54 label: Dane
55 container_attributes:
56 title: Dane
57
58 - type: Text
59 name: opis
60 label: Opis
61 container_attributes:
62 title: Opis
63
64 - type: Text
65 name: uwagi
66 label: Uwagi
67 container_attributes:
68 title: Uwagi
69
70 - type: Block
71 content_xml: br /
72
73 # - type: Select
74 # name: podmioty
75 # label: Podmioty
76 # model_config:
77 # resultset: TableClass
78 # - type: Repeatable
79 # nested_name: podmioty
80 # model_config:
81 # new_empty_row: podmiot
82 # elements:
83 # - type: Hidden
84 # name: lpp
85 # - type: Text
86 # name: nazwa
87
88 - type: Select
89 name: podmioty
90 label: Podmioty
91 model_config:
92 model: 'hubeDB::Podmioty'
93 resultset: 'hubeDB::Umowy'
94 id_column: lpp
95
96 - type: Submit
97 name: submit
98 value: Zapisz
99
100 - type: Submit
101 name: cancel
102 value: Anuluj
When I run edit umowy I have got good form with select from podmioty (
with lpp in values and name in select ) :
select name=podmioty
option value=3HERBI/option
option value=4Asseco/option
option value=8LiNiO Company/option
...
but in controller edytuj I have got this:
50 sub edytuj : Local FormConfig {
51 my ($self,$c,$nr) = @_;
52
53 $nr ($nr=~/\d/);
54 if(my $grupa=$c-model('hubeDB::Umowy')-find_or_new({lpu=$nr})) {
55 my $form=$c-stash-{form};
56 if($form-submitted_and_valid) {
57eval { my $wynik=$form-save_to_model($grupa); };
58$c-response-redirect($c-uri_for('/umowy/lista'));
59 }
60 else {
61$form-defaults_from_model($grupa);
62 }
63 }
64 else {
65 $c-response-redirect($c-uri_for('/umowy/lista'));
66 }
67 #my $form=$c-stash-{form};
68
69 }
My problem is: it doesn't work... I try find definition relationships in formfu, but nothing...
Would you like to help me with this? Links, examples etc. I paused my adventure with catalyst by this
Thx!
jacek ch. (neila)
/select
___
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Re: [Catalyst] Relations 1:M
I have found my mistake in line 89. It should name: podmiot and it works! I have got a question : id_column is ok, but how can I choose option name in model_config? thx! 88 - type: Select 89 name: podmioty 90 label: Podmioty 91 model_config: 92 model: 'hubeDB::Podmioty' 93 resultset: 'hubeDB::Umowy' 94 id_column: lpp 95 96 - type: Submit 97 name: submit 98 value: Zapisz 99 100 - type: Submit 101 name: cancel 102 value: Anuluj ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Migrating mod_perl app to Catalyst
On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 01:54:12PM -0500, Michael Reddick wrote: Does anyone have any advice for migrating a large mod_perl app that has no tests to catalyst? I already know of Catalyst::Controller::WrapCGI which seems to be a good start. Assuming your app doesn't use apache specific stuff. What I tend to recommend in such cases is to start writing new functionality in Catalyst as FastCGI and just map chunks of the URI space across to the new stuff. When you need to significantly alter the old code, port it first. Eventually you'll just have a Catalyst+FastCGI codebase, and you'll have had working code at every stage. -- Matt S Trout Catalyst and DBIx::Class consultancy with a clue: Technical Directorhttp://www.shadowcat.co.uk/catalyst/ Shadowcat Systems Ltd. Any questions? Mail mst at shadowcat.co.uk My blog: http://www.shadowcat.co.uk/blog/matt-s-trout/ (warning: profanity) ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Catalyst error from CPAN
On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 08:18:33PM +0100, gor...@gorste.plus.com wrote: Dear List I have just installed catalyst from CPAN. I seam to get this error : Can't call method can without a package or object reference at /usr/local/share/perl/5.8.8/Catalyst/Plugin/Authentication/Store/DBIC.pm line 101 If you've only just installed, why are you even using that? Catalyst::Authentication::Store::DBIx::Class obsoleted it some time ago. -- Matt S Trout Catalyst and DBIx::Class consultancy with a clue: Technical Directorhttp://www.shadowcat.co.uk/catalyst/ Shadowcat Systems Ltd. Any questions? Mail mst at shadowcat.co.uk My blog: http://www.shadowcat.co.uk/blog/matt-s-trout/ (warning: profanity) ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Relations 1:M
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 08:02:49PM +0200, neila wrote: Welcome, I have got a problem with relation has_many. If you just hit reply to a random post you're replying to that thread, not starting a new one - you need to start a new message to: catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Additionally, since this is a DBIx::Class question, it would be better asked on the DBIx::Class list, so please subscribe to that (also at http://lists.scsys.co.uk/ ) and ask your question there, starting by creating a new message to: dbix-cl...@lists.scsys.co.uk -- Matt S Trout Catalyst and DBIx::Class consultancy with a clue: Technical Directorhttp://www.shadowcat.co.uk/catalyst/ Shadowcat Systems Ltd. Any questions? Mail mst at shadowcat.co.uk My blog: http://www.shadowcat.co.uk/blog/matt-s-trout/ (warning: profanity) ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 10:59:56AM +0200, Ian Wells wrote: Top posting is bad. Bottom posting is bad. When quoting a previous message: - Remove as much of the original message as you can. I could not agree more. But secretly since getting an iPhone I kind of like the top posting and hate the lack of trimming even more. Beats the endless scrolling. Oh, and the HTML email on the iPhone... well don't get me started. All will be fine once a native Mutt app for the iPhone comes out. -- Bill Moseley. mose...@hank.org Sent from my iMutt ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema?
On Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 05:38:57PM +0800, Malloy wrote: Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema? If you're asking, you should probably be using DBIC::Schema since it's most popular so the best integrated and easy to get help with. -- Matt S Trout Catalyst and DBIx::Class consultancy with a clue: Technical Directorhttp://www.shadowcat.co.uk/catalyst/ Shadowcat Systems Ltd. Any questions? Mail mst at shadowcat.co.uk My blog: http://www.shadowcat.co.uk/blog/matt-s-trout/ (warning: profanity) ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
[Catalyst] Catalyst IPv6 support?
Hello, I was wondering if Catalyst supports IPv6? I search the archive/google but couldn't find anything useful. If it's not support, is it planed? chiel ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema?
Which model is better, DBI or DBIC::Schema? When I started using DBIC, I managed to keep using DBI for tasks I couldn't implement in DBIC but then with time totally moved to DBIC which is simpler and much fun to do tasks with ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] Migrating mod_perl app to Catalyst
On Wed, Apr 29, 2009 at 4:58 AM, Matt S Trout dbix-cl...@trout.me.ukwrote: On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 01:54:12PM -0500, Michael Reddick wrote: Does anyone have any advice for migrating a large mod_perl app that has no tests to catalyst? I already know of Catalyst::Controller::WrapCGI which seems to be a good start. Assuming your app doesn't use apache specific stuff. What I tend to recommend in such cases is to start writing new functionality in Catalyst as FastCGI and just map chunks of the URI space across to the new stuff. When you need to significantly alter the old code, port it first. Eventually you'll just have a Catalyst+FastCGI codebase, and you'll have had working code at every stage. I've done similar things, and my new method is to have a two tiered application where my Cat app sits in front of legacy, and on unhandled URLs throws a 404. The front-end proxy (Varnish, in my case) then restarts the request against the next backend, which is the mod_perl system. Then, when I put in new features in Catalyst if the URL is changed I can simply put in a permanent redirect and everything just works. This is roughly a new technique, and lacking some fine tuning points, but so far I'm very happy with it. I wrote up a posting about my implementation (which has some other nits): http://our.coldhardcode.com/jshirley/2009/04/varnish-and-movabletype-for-co.html -J ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
Re: [Catalyst] The Netiquette thread (OT)
Good afternoon, On 28/04/09 at 1:09 PM -0700, Bill Moseley mose...@hank.org wrote: All will be fine once a native Mutt app for the iPhone comes out. You could always ssh back to your main machine and use Mutt there. ;-) (Control key is a bugger to use though.) Charlie -- Charlie Garrison garri...@zeta.org.au PO Box 141, Windsor, NSW 2756, Australia O ascii ribbon campaign - stop html mail - www.asciiribbon.org http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1855.txt ___ List: Catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk Listinfo: http://lists.scsys.co.uk/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/catalyst Searchable archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/catalyst@lists.scsys.co.uk/ Dev site: http://dev.catalyst.perl.org/
