Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[David Collins via cctalk]

I clicked on the image in the report and it opened up a high def file which I 
could zoom in on.  For some reason it won't do it now but I snipped the HP 9000 
E55 badge image as a record. Not sure how to post it here.  The terminal badge 
says it's a 700/96 terminal. 

It wasn't a guess!

David Collins


On 4 Apr 2017, at 2:47 pm, Cameron Kaiser via cctalk  
wrote:

>> It's an HP9000 E55. The HP Computer Museum even has one in our collection!
> 
> Interesting. I guess it could be any of the E-class, though: OpenPA has a
> picture of an E35 that looks like a slightly closer match. I'm surprised
> it's recent enough to have a PA-7100; I would have agreed with Zane that it
> was an earlier type system.
> 
> http://www.openpa.net/systems/hp-9000_e25_e35_e45_e55.html
> 
> -- 
>  personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ 
> --
>  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
> -- Use [Microsoft] IE and Passport and you can browse like it's 1984. -- /. 
> ---

Re: More tapes - This time all Tektronix 405x series

[AJ Palmgren via cctalk]

Fascinating...thanks for sharing this!  So the tape drive was integrated
into the chassis hardware.  Now that's proprietary.

I don't even see evidence of a CRC or checksum in the documentation.  Do
you think that each record has one, and they just didn't document it?

Anyway, very interesting, nice work saving these!

-AJ

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[r.stricklin via cctalk]

Not commonly.

ok
bear.

-- 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 3, 2017, at 22:05, Chuck Guzis via cctalk  
> wrote:
>  
>  Did the Apollo ever have a 1/2" tape unit on it?
> 
> --Chuck
> 

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

On 04/03/2017 08:31 PM, Chris Elmquist wrote:

> The OS for the ETA -10 was installed from QIC tape because you put it
> in through an Apollo DN3000 or similar service unit...  pretty sure
> that was THE way to get 'er done on that machine.


Hmmm, on the STAR (CYBER 200), it was loaded from the MCU drum.

But yeah, those stations were expensive, so I can understand using a
commodity workstation.   Did the Apollo ever have a 1/2" tape unit on it?

--Chuck

Re: More tapes - This time all Tektronix 405x series

[Pete Lancashire via cctalk]

http://bitsavers.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/pdf/tektronix/405x/070-2065-00_4051_Service_Vol1_May77.pdf

pages 6-37 to 6-41

The format and drive was all done in house. It was originally done on a
horizontal external GPIB drive, the 4923. Tek was on of the first
users of the cartridge. But for non technical reasons was the format used
on the 4051 even though by then better designs had been
adopted.

Sadly not one of the good things that came out of Tek. But knowing the
history all was not a technical decsision like in many large
companies, and as usual a long story.







On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 9:10 PM, AJ Palmgren  wrote:

> Ah, yes.  I'm fascinated by the stranger formats.
>
> Now I'm even more curious, now that you say it isn't the more common
> QIC-11 or QIC-24 formats.
>
> Do you know what specific hardware (tape drive models, formatter boards,
> etc) that was used to write or read these tapes with this format?
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 5:53 AM, Pete Lancashire 
> wrote:
>
>> I'm going to see if the Tektronix museum is interested. And if so I'm
>> sure they can make the software available for download. As to the format,
>> Tek decided to do it their own way. It is a funky 2 track that has issues
>> of its own. But your method of recovering the raw track data should work as
>> a starting point.
>>
>> -pete
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 2, 2017 at 11:16 PM, AJ Palmgren via cctalk <
>> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Pete,
>>>
>>> These tapes look to be in beautiful condition!  Do you have any plans for
>>> reading or archiving them?
>>>
>>> Do you have any idea what format the data might have been written in?
>>>
>>> If interested, my site for reading/restoring QIC cartridges of this very
>>> vintage is at
>>>
>>> http://QICreader.com
>>>
>>> Let me know if I can be of any assistance.
>>>
>>> -AJ
>>>
>>> 2017-04-02 21:08 GMT-07:00 Pete Lancashire via cctalk <
>>> cctalk@classiccmp.org
>>> >:
>>>
>>> > https://goo.gl/photos/m91e3UPSvN6tHUaS7
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> AJ Palmgren
>>> http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
>>> https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
>>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
> AJ Palmgren
> http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
> https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/
>
>

interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[JAMES FEHLINGER via cctalk]

Ed Sharpe wrote:

> I'm trying to identify the  specific unit. It looks like an early PA-RISC,
> but even the enlargement doesn't show the model number clearly.

The case matches HP-9000 Series 800 (F-class server) -- one of the lower-end
models (807, F10; 817, F20; 837, F30).  All based on PA-7000 32-bit CPU
(PA-RISC version 1.1a, introduced 1991).

http://muuseum.at.mt.ut.ee/kogu/077.html
http://www.openpa.net/systems/hp-9000_series-800_nova.html
http://www.openpa.net/pa-risc_processor_pa-7000.html

PDFs of "Owner’s Guide to the HP 9000 8x7S Family" (1991)
and "CE Handbook Series 9x7 and Model 8x7S Family" (1992)
are downloadable via links at
http://www.openpa.net/systems/hp-9000_series-800_nova.html .

Re: Stuffing boards with pulled QFP chips

[Jon Elson via cctalk]

On 04/02/2017 07:26 AM, David Griffith via cctech wrote:


That's why I put this in the context of PNP robots rather 
than hand-soldering.  My last run of P112 boards was 150 
and I'm thinking of doing another 150 or maybe 200.



Phew, I sure wouldn't want to hand solder 150 - 200 boards!  
Been there, done that, never want to do it again!
There are machines that can do reasonable lead pitch spacing 
without vision, using mechanical alignment.
My Philips CSM84 does 0.65mm lead pitch TQFPs quite well.  
One other detail is lead coplanarity.  The leads from the 
manufacturer are formed AFTER plating to all sit on a flat 
surface.  If the leads have varying solder thickness after 
removal, or are bent out of the seating plane by handling, 
that will also affect the ability to reflow solder them 
reliably.


Jon

Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[Cameron Kaiser via cctalk]

> It's an HP9000 E55. The HP Computer Museum even has one in our collection!

Interesting. I guess it could be any of the E-class, though: OpenPA has a
picture of an E35 that looks like a slightly closer match. I'm surprised
it's recent enough to have a PA-7100; I would have agreed with Zane that it
was an earlier type system.

http://www.openpa.net/systems/hp-9000_e25_e35_e45_e55.html

-- 
 personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
-- Use [Microsoft] IE and Passport and you can browse like it's 1984. -- /. ---

Re: More tapes - This time all Tektronix 405x series

[AJ Palmgren via cctalk]

Ah, yes.  I'm fascinated by the stranger formats.

Now I'm even more curious, now that you say it isn't the more common QIC-11
or QIC-24 formats.

Do you know what specific hardware (tape drive models, formatter boards,
etc) that was used to write or read these tapes with this format?




On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 5:53 AM, Pete Lancashire 
wrote:

> I'm going to see if the Tektronix museum is interested. And if so I'm sure
> they can make the software available for download. As to the format, Tek
> decided to do it their own way. It is a funky 2 track that has issues of
> its own. But your method of recovering the raw track data should work as a
> starting point.
>
> -pete
>
> On Sun, Apr 2, 2017 at 11:16 PM, AJ Palmgren via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
>> Pete,
>>
>> These tapes look to be in beautiful condition!  Do you have any plans for
>> reading or archiving them?
>>
>> Do you have any idea what format the data might have been written in?
>>
>> If interested, my site for reading/restoring QIC cartridges of this very
>> vintage is at
>>
>> http://QICreader.com
>>
>> Let me know if I can be of any assistance.
>>
>> -AJ
>>
>> 2017-04-02 21:08 GMT-07:00 Pete Lancashire via cctalk <
>> cctalk@classiccmp.org
>> >:
>>
>> > https://goo.gl/photos/m91e3UPSvN6tHUaS7
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Thanks,
>> AJ Palmgren
>> http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
>> https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/
>>
>>
>


-- 

Thanks,
AJ Palmgren
http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/

Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-d...

[Ed via cctalk]

Awesome David! now I know what to look for!
 
I like things with a story for our museum displays...   the  original one 
always best but next to it is 'one like it'
 
example  We do not have Tim Berners-Lee's NeXT cube... but  we  have one 
like  it!


Ed#  _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org)  
 
 
In a message dated 4/3/2017 8:20:04 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
davidkcolli...@gmail.com writes:

It's an  HP9000 E55. The HP Computer Museum even has one in our  collection!

David Collins
Curator
www.hpmusuem.net

David  Collins
Client Engagement Manager
Dimension Data
Tel: +61 3 9626  0593
Mob: +61 424 785 131
e-mail: david.coll...@dimensiondata.com  

(Sent from out of office)

On 4 Apr 2017, at 9:23 am, Cameron  Kaiser via cctalk 
 wrote:

>>  interesting... hp-9000 in the news!  -  
>>  russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades
> 
> I'm trying to  identify the specific unit. It looks like an early PA-RISC,
> but even  the enlargement doesn't show the model number clearly.
> 
>>  https://www.wired.com/2017/04/russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades/
>  
> -- 
>  personal:  
http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
>  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap  Systems * www.floodgap.com * 
ckai...@floodgap.com
> -- Please dispose of  this message in the usual manner. -- Mission: 
Impossible  -

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Chris Elmquist via cctalk]

On April 3, 2017 1:18:31 PM CDT, Chuck Guzis via cctalk  
wrote:
>On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 9:37 AM, AJ Palmgren via cctech <
>cct...@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi, Plamen & Al,
>> 
>> I'm just catching up on some of these past threads involving QIC 
>> cartridges.  What ever became of these Paragon tapes?  Were you able
>> to read them and archive the contents?
>
>
>I'm probably showing my age (again), but "QIC" and "Supercomputers"
>just
>seems to be about as related as "Chateau Margaux" and "Cheez Whiz".
>
>If one is spending millions on a supercomputer, why would anyone want
>to
>put software for it on a QIC cart?
>
>
>--Chuck

The OS for the ETA -10 was installed from QIC tape because you put it in 
through an Apollo DN3000 or similar service unit...  pretty sure that was THE 
way to get 'er done on that machine.

Chris

-- 
Chris Elmquist

Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[David Collins via cctalk]

It's an HP9000 E55. The HP Computer Museum even has one in our collection!

David Collins
Curator
www.hpmusuem.net

David Collins
Client Engagement Manager
Dimension Data
Tel: +61 3 9626 0593
Mob: +61 424 785 131
e-mail: david.coll...@dimensiondata.com 

(Sent from out of office)

On 4 Apr 2017, at 9:23 am, Cameron Kaiser via cctalk  
wrote:

>> interesting... hp-9000 in the news!  -  
>> russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades
> 
> I'm trying to identify the specific unit. It looks like an early PA-RISC,
> but even the enlargement doesn't show the model number clearly.
> 
>> https://www.wired.com/2017/04/russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades/
> 
> -- 
>  personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ 
> --
>  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
> -- Please dispose of this message in the usual manner. -- Mission: Impossible 
> -

RIP Dr. Kan Yabumoto

[Ali via cctalk]

Hello All:

I am not sure if this is "vintage" enough. However, Dr Kan Yabumoto
(1948-2017) passed away after a long illness on 03-31-17. He was involved in
the computer industry for many years after being a chemical engineer. He
designed and programmed "Mad Planets", one of the "1001 Video Games You Must
Play Before You Die". However, in this group though he may be better known
for his work at his company Pixelab. Pixelab produced DatMan, XXCopy, and
XXClone. I had the good fortune to become friends with Kan while seeking
support for XXCopy. He was an intelligent and caring man and he will be
missed.

-Ali

Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[Zane Healy via cctalk]

> On Apr 3, 2017, at 4:23 PM, Cameron Kaiser via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> I'm trying to identify the specific unit. It looks like an early PA-RISC,
> but even the enlargement doesn't show the model number clearly.

I’m not sure what model it is, but it looks more like an early 90’s PA-RISC.  
The ones we were using in the late 90’s had a “modern” look to them.  That 
looks, to me, to be of a similar vintage to the HP 9000/750.

Zane

Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-d...

[Ed via cctalk]

due to it's infamyI think we need one like it  for the  museums's  
collection!
 
Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.smecc.org)  
 
 
In a message dated 4/3/2017 4:23:47 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
spec...@floodgap.com writes:

>  interesting... hp-9000 in the news!  -  
>  russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

I'm trying to identify the  specific unit. It looks like an early PA-RISC,
but even the enlargement  doesn't show the model number clearly.

>  https://www.wired.com/2017/04/russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades/

--  
 personal:  
http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems *  www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
-- Please dispose of this message  in the usual manner. -- Mission: 
Impossible  -

Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[Cameron Kaiser via cctalk]

> interesting... hp-9000 in the news!  -  
> russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

I'm trying to identify the specific unit. It looks like an early PA-RISC,
but even the enlargement doesn't show the model number clearly.

> https://www.wired.com/2017/04/russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades/

-- 
 personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
-- Please dispose of this message in the usual manner. -- Mission: Impossible -

Re: interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

On 04/03/2017 03:39 PM, Ed via cctalk wrote:
>  
> interesting... hp-9000 in the news!  -  
> russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades
>  
> https://www.wired.com/2017/04/russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades/?mbi
> d=nl_4317_p3=42833909


Indeed this:

“This is a field that’s not understanding its own history,” says Rid.
“It goes without saying that if you want to understand the present or
the future, you have to understand the past.”

--Chuck

interesting... hp-9000 in the news! - russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades

[Ed via cctalk]

 
interesting... hp-9000 in the news!  -  
russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades
 
https://www.wired.com/2017/04/russian-hackers-used-backdoor-two-decades/?mbi
d=nl_4317_p3=42833909
 
enjoy!   Ed#

Re: Intellivision reset switch

[Adrian Graham via cctalk]

On 03/04/2017 22:38, "cctalk"  wrote:

> On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 10:16 AM, Richard Sheppard via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> May depend on the model, but mine has a spring under the plastic reset
>> button in the top of the case and one of those metal domed tactile switches
>> on the PCB.
>> 
> 
> This matches my recollection of the system I had. The type of metal domed
> switch made famous by the Atari 2600 joysticks.

I quickly read that and my brain said 'metal doomed switch', which I guess
was also correct :)

-- 
Adrian/Witchy
Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator
Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer
collection?

Re: Intellivision reset switch

[Geoffrey Oltmans via cctalk]

On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 10:16 AM, Richard Sheppard via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

>
> May depend on the model, but mine has a spring under the plastic reset
> button in the top of the case and one of those metal domed tactile switches
> on the PCB.
>

This matches my recollection of the system I had. The type of metal domed
switch made famous by the Atari 2600 joysticks.

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

On 04/03/2017 01:29 PM, Cameron Kaiser via cctalk wrote:

> I'm almost afraid to see if the one Jim Battle sent me a long time
> ago still works.


This points up to a common misunderstanding among vendors, I think.  I
question the use of QIC for *archival* storage; it certainly was less
expensive than other comparably-sized media to deploy.

For *distribution*, where the cart is essentially a short-term affair
(until it can be copied to archival storage), it does make sense.

--Chuck

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Cameron Kaiser via cctalk]

> > I'm probably showing my age (again), but "QIC" and "Supercomputers" just
> > seems to be about as related as "Chateau Margaux" and "Cheez Whiz".
> >
> > If one is spending millions on a supercomputer, why would anyone want to
> > put software for it on a QIC cart?
> 
> Because it holds more than an Exatron Stringy Floppy?  (the obvious second 
> choice for high reliability storage)

Stringyfloppy shmingyfloppy. You need one of the unobtanium (with good reason)
Texas Instruments CC-40 wafertape disasters, the obvious third choice for
high reliability storage.

I'm almost afraid to see if the one Jim Battle sent me a long time ago still
works.

-- 
 personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
-- Famous, adj.: Conspicuously miserable.  -- Ambrose Bierce --

Re: HISTORY OF COMPUTER DESIGN: THE MOST INNOVATIVE AND UNCONVENTIONAL PCS EVER MADE

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

I'm sure that many (ARD?) are rolling their eyes at THAT concept of 
"computer design".


On Mon, 3 Apr 2017, Liam Proven via cctalk wrote:

This series of articles focuses mainly on physical design, of cases
and so on, but there are some technical details in the articles too.


OK, they link that iMac to "Brionvega Algol Portable TV", but not ADM3a.


I remember when the SONY SMC? came out, being surprised at the use of 
obviously Italian design for the case.  But then thinking that case design 
was an option that was not closely tied to the engineering, and that we 
would be likely to see cubes, pizza boxes, cylinders, etc.

The Cray couch was lovely.

I figured that there would be a lot of success at going after form factor 
of a pad of paper, and screen and keyboard folding together, and much less 
success (for a while longer) at building it into a pen (early attempts 
would be too bulky and taint the idea).  And that someday we would see 
truly insane/innovative/impractical ideas such spheres or as shaping like 
a light bulb, or human head.

But, like telephones or TVs, design has settled into a few specific forms.

I was expecting more modular built into furniture designs.  Without a 
modular form for easy replacement/upgrade, buying a desk with built-in 
computer, or computer with built-in desk would be too much of a lock-in.
Closest that was successful has been desks with a keyboard shelf, and 
printer cabinet.



When will 4x8 drywall substitution TV/monitors be around?  What used to be 
called "mudding" for seamless joining of panels may be a bit more 
difficult.

Howzbout a split keyboard built into the arms of my La-Z-Boy?


--
Grumpy Ol' Fred ci...@xenosoft.com

RE: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Bill Gunshannon via cctalk]

From: cctalk [cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] on behalf of Fred Cisin via cctalk 
[cctalk@classiccmp.org]
Sent: Monday, April 3, 2017 2:23 PM
To: Chuck Guzis; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

On Mon, 3 Apr 2017, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:
> I'm probably showing my age (again), but "QIC" and "Supercomputers" just
> seems to be about as related as "Chateau Margaux" and "Cheez Whiz".
>
> If one is spending millions on a supercomputer, why would anyone want to
> put software for it on a QIC cart?

Because it holds more than an Exatron Stringy Floppy?  (the obvious second
choice for high reliability storage)

__

Don't bite that tongue plunged deeply into your cheek.

The Exatron was at best a joke.  Of course, better than most options of
the time but still anythng but reliable.

bill

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Christian Corti via cctalk]

On Mon, 3 Apr 2017, Chuck Guzis wrote:

I'm probably showing my age (again), but "QIC" and "Supercomputers" just
seems to be about as related as "Chateau Margaux" and "Cheez Whiz".

If one is spending millions on a supercomputer, why would anyone want to
put software for it on a QIC cart?


Well, I have two larger boxes filled with QIC tapes for our former NEC 
SX-4 (the original SW distribution and all patches, updates, etc.).


Christian

Re: HISTORY OF COMPUTER DESIGN: THE MOST INNOVATIVE AND UNCONVENTIONAL PCS EVER MADE

[william degnan via cctalk]

On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 2:50 PM, Adrian Graham via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> On 03/04/2017 11:19, "cctalk"  wrote:
>
> > This series of articles focuses mainly on physical design, of cases
> > and so on, but there are some technical details in the articles too.
> >
> > Note that this is the landing page -- at the bottom of the page are
> > links to other articles in the Inexhibit series, such as the Holborn
> > 9100 and Olivetti Programma 101.
> >
> > https://www.inexhibit.com/specials/history-of-computer-
> design-the-most-innovat
> > ive-and-unconventional-pcs-ever-made/
>
> I just love the design of the Holborn series of machines, first time I saw
> one I didn't believe it was a real machine...
>
>
My vote goes to the Commodore CBM 256-80 (US) / B520 (Europe)

http://vintagecomputer.net/Commodore/CBM_256-80/

Re: HISTORY OF COMPUTER DESIGN: THE MOST INNOVATIVE AND UNCONVENTIONAL PCS EVER MADE

[Adrian Graham via cctalk]

On 03/04/2017 11:19, "cctalk"  wrote:

> This series of articles focuses mainly on physical design, of cases
> and so on, but there are some technical details in the articles too.
> 
> Note that this is the landing page -- at the bottom of the page are
> links to other articles in the Inexhibit series, such as the Holborn
> 9100 and Olivetti Programma 101.
> 
> https://www.inexhibit.com/specials/history-of-computer-design-the-most-innovat
> ive-and-unconventional-pcs-ever-made/

I just love the design of the Holborn series of machines, first time I saw
one I didn't believe it was a real machine...

-- 
Adrian/Witchy
Binary Dinosaurs creator/curator
Www.binarydinosaurs.co.uk - the UK's biggest private home computer
collection?

Re: RIP: Daniel Bobrow

[Stan Sieler via cctalk]

Re:


> From: Tony Aiuto 
> Subject: RIP: Daniel Bobrow
>
> http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/nytimes/obituary.
> aspx?n=daniel-bobrow=184794881


I worked with Danny for about a year, around 1974, sometime after UCSD put
its B6700 onto the ARPAnet (we were something like the 35th computer).

The AI community needed a BBNLISP with more addressing space than a DEC-10
could provide, so they came to the king of virtual addressing: the
Burroughs.
We got the contract to implement BBNLISP, and Danny came to oversee.

I remember him typing on a terminal, linking UCSD to about 10 other
computers
on the ARPANET, finally linked back to us ... sending a message to himself.
He was demonstrating the lag time each computer added :)

IIRC, sometime during the project, BBNLISP was renamed INTERLISP.  I still
have the wonderful manual, with the great artwork on the cover.  Warren
Teitelman (the author) doesn't have his name on the cover.  But, the bottom
portion has a guy is operating a meat grinder, with the input being the
letters of "reference manual" in random order, and the output being
"reference manual".  Danny explained that Warren Teitelman hadn't gotten
the joke :)

Danny was funny, quick witted, friendly ... RIP.

Oh, UCSD LISP?  About a week before we released it, DEC (or BBN?) had a
breakthrough and increased the addressability of their virtual memory,
obviating the need for our version :(

Stan Sieler

>
>

Re: Cleaning RK05 packs (Was: LGP-30 Memory Drum Update)

[Pete Lancashire via cctalk]

>>Ah, oh How should that get between the heads and the platter?

If it can happen it will. It did. I had saved up three or four cartridges
for future repair. I was told such work should be done by
(someone not so expensive) so off they went to one of the manufacturing
repair techs. I was busy a few weeks later and did
not do my usual look inside. Spun up the RK05 and data errors all over the
place. Pulled the cart, did a head inspection and
there was a not the usual black/dark brown streak on the head. Go get the
box of Texwipes, etc and pull out the RK, but the
head just did not feel smooth, if you have done such a cleaning a dozen
times you get to know the feeling when you know
things are flat again.  So time to take the cartridge apart. Its screws
needed very little torque, as in a couple pretty much
fell out. Yep the inside was full of plastic shards. Later found out the
tech used an air screwdriver to put the screws back.

Anyway, I put a DO NOT USE sticker on the door and called DEC, yep .. the
head had to be replaced. For years I kept
it on my desk as a reminder that maybe the department who keep the
compressors, pumps, wirewrap machines etc
running was not a way to save money.

Exact details somewhat fuzzy since this was like 1976

-pete

On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 6:33 AM, Philipp Hachtmann via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

>
>
> Another thing to watch out for is the two halves of some if not all
>> were screwed together with self tapping screws. When you take
>> them apart bit of plastic may come out of the holes or fall off the
>> insides of the screw threads. That plastic if gets between the platter
>> and head will not be to the heads advantage.
>>
> Ah, oh How should that get between the heads and the platter? It's
> nearly impossible to get something of substantial size into that gap.
> Look at the RK05 manual (and pack bag): It's the *really* small stuff that
> gets into the wrong place.
> Normal dust from the paper you used for cleaning (and from your working
> environment) is kicked off the platter by the head. Makes funny sounds.
>
> My procedure: Clean the disk, load it, manually visit the whole surface
> with the heads. If it crashes or clinging does not go away soon, reclean.
> If the disk has become silent and is running nicely, I give the heads a
> "quick brutal cleaning": Towel with IPA, between the heads, load heads onto
> the towel, move towel until heads clean. Must be done carefully...
>
> I once had an RC05 disk crashing. With an awful noise and a white stripe
> on the disk. After cleaning, both heads and disks were fully functional
> again. But I have also seen packs which look perfect but either keep making
> heavy sound or having data errors.
>
> Philipp
>
>

Re: [MicrosDIY-BR] Reparando um Vectrex

[Josenivaldo Benito Junior via cctalk]

Taba,

Apenas como sugestão: https://documentation.onesignal.com/docs/blogger


--
*Josenivaldo Benito Jr.*
*PU2LBD*


2017-03-24 0:06 GMT-03:00 Alexandre Souza :

>
>Oba, post novo no blog! / New post on blog
>
>http://tabajara-labs.blogspot.com.br/2017/03/
> consertando-um-vectrex-com-um-defeito.html
>
> ---
>
>
>
>
> --
> --
>  MicrosDIY-BR 
> Grupo  sobre micro-controladores, programação ou qualquer outro assunto
> técnico relacionado. Informática de PC apenas quando relacionada ao assunto.
> Veja mais em: http://microsdiybr.blogspot.com
>
>> Não são bem vindas conversas de assuntos OFF-TOPIC e muito menos qualquer
>>> ataque pessoal.<<
>>>
>>
> --- Você está recebendo esta mensagem porque se inscreveu no grupo
> "MicrosDIY-BR" dos Grupos do Google.
> Para cancelar inscrição nesse grupo e parar de receber e-mails dele, envie
> um e-mail para microsdiy-br+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> Para obter mais opções, acesse https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[geneb via cctalk]

On Mon, 3 Apr 2017, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:


On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 9:37 AM, AJ Palmgren via cctech <
cct...@classiccmp.org> wrote:


Hi, Plamen & Al,

I'm just catching up on some of these past threads involving QIC
cartridges.  What ever became of these Paragon tapes?  Were you able
to read them and archive the contents?



I'm probably showing my age (again), but "QIC" and "Supercomputers" just
seems to be about as related as "Chateau Margaux" and "Cheez Whiz".


Dammit Chuck, not while I'm drinking coffee! :)

g.

--
Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007
http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind.
http://www.diy-cockpits.org/coll - Go Collimated or Go Home.
Some people collect things for a hobby.  Geeks collect hobbies.

ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment
A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes.
http://scarlet.deltasoft.com - Get it _today_!

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

On Mon, 3 Apr 2017, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:

I'm probably showing my age (again), but "QIC" and "Supercomputers" just
seems to be about as related as "Chateau Margaux" and "Cheez Whiz".

If one is spending millions on a supercomputer, why would anyone want to
put software for it on a QIC cart?


Because it holds more than an Exatron Stringy Floppy?  (the obvious second 
choice for high reliability storage)

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 9:37 AM, AJ Palmgren via cctech <
cct...@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Hi, Plamen & Al,
> 
> I'm just catching up on some of these past threads involving QIC 
> cartridges.  What ever became of these Paragon tapes?  Were you able
> to read them and archive the contents?


I'm probably showing my age (again), but "QIC" and "Supercomputers" just
seems to be about as related as "Chateau Margaux" and "Cheez Whiz".

If one is spending millions on a supercomputer, why would anyone want to
put software for it on a QIC cart?


--Chuck

Got a Sun 2/120, ISO Sun 2/3 monitor, Sun 2 keyboard, Sun 2 mouse

[Ian Finder via cctalk]

Hi folks!

I recently acquired a functional Sun 2/120.

The framebuffer I have is switchable between TTL and ECL, so I can use
either an Sun 2 or Sun 3 monitor, which I am looking for.

I am also looking for a keyboard and mouse.

If anyone on list has any of these items and would be willing to sell them
to me, please contact me. I plan to completely restore the system.

Thanks,

- Ian

-- 
   Ian Finder
   (206) 395-MIPS
   ian.fin...@gmail.com

Re: Test message - what happened NOW to the mail system?

[Philipp Hachtmann via cctalk]

On 04/03/2017 03:48 PM, Philipp Hachtmann via cctalk wrote:

Hi,

I just saw that mails from some people now arrive as desired (real
sender, reply-to list), but some (e.g. myself) are still mangled with
"xxx via cctalk"  - did I miss a setting?

Confused...

Philipp


Wow, posting to cctech behaves differently now?

Sorry for the noise, but I'm still confused.

Re: Intellivision reset switch

[Richard Sheppard via cctalk]

> I'm guessing it was a blob of foam, which has deteriorated, but maybe it 
> was a metal spring, or a piece of u-shaped plastic etc.

May depend on the model, but mine has a spring under the plastic reset button 
in the top of the case and one of those metal domed tactile switches on the PCB.

Richard Sheppard

Re: Intellivision reset switch

[Jules Richardson via cctalk]

On 04/02/2017 08:51 PM, drlegendre . wrote:

If the unit was otherwise working as-found, then it might be safe to say
that whatever +was+ under that button +must+ have either disintegrated or
fallen out of place, yet evidence should remain. In either case, you should
find evidence - crumbled, gunky old foam, or shrapnel of a busted plastic /
rubber spring. Point being, if it hasn't been opened up (to repair) in the
past, everything should still be inside, at least in some form.


Well, it seems that there isn't supposed to be anything! The metal plate is 
dished and is supposed to deform when the reset switch is pressed, making 
contact with the PCB, and then returning to original shape when the case 
switch is released. Except that - which is the case with mine - it seems 
that they have a habit of deforming slightly over time (and also coming 
loose, potentially shorting out various components and causing damage).


Bending the tabs which are supposed to hold it against the PCB at least 
made it secure, but it still wouldn't return to original shape after being 
pressed. So, I figured I could hunt around for a replacement plate from a 
donor console, and *maybe* it would be OK, and *maybe* it would last for a 
few years. But in the end it seemed better to implement a more robust 
solution: it just so happened that a standard miniature microswitch (the 
type with four pins, dpst) would fit nicely onto the PCB, with the pins - 
after a little bending - sliding through the PCB slots which used to retain 
the original metal plate. A couple of short jump wires to nearby PCB pads 
later, and electrically it was perfect.


The downside to this is that I had to shorten the stem on the plastic case 
part of the reset switch by ~ 1/8" to compensate for the increased height 
of the microswitch, and I really don't like "destructive" mods. However, I 
figure the rework will easily last the life of the console, and at least 
there's no risk of things coming apart and damaging the logic now. I 
suppose Mattel would have spent the extra few cents on a real switch anyway 
if the design life of the console had been more than a few years :)


cheers

Jules

Test message - what happened NOW to the mail system?

[Philipp Hachtmann via cctalk]

Hi,

I just saw that mails from some people now arrive as desired (real 
sender, reply-to list), but some (e.g. myself) are still mangled with 
"xxx via cctalk"  - did I miss a setting?


Confused...

Philipp

Re: Cleaning RK05 packs (Was: LGP-30 Memory Drum Update)

[Philipp Hachtmann via cctalk]

On 01/05/2017 02:22 PM, Noel Chiappa wrote:

> From: Klemens Krause

> We clean our RK05 disks in a very robust way: with cheap burning spirit
> and paper towels. ... We rubbed away thick black traces from occasional
> head crashes and we never removed the oxide coating with this torture.

I am about to get a large batch of RK05 packs, so I am interested in the
details of this.

First, what is 'burning spirit'? (I assume this is a straight translation
into English of some German term, but not knowing German... :-) After poking
around with Google for a while (hampered no little by the fact that it's the
name of a band, and also a term in World of Warcraft :-), it seems like it
might be acetone?


In Germany, "burning spirit" is 96% ethanol + something that tastes 
awfully + some water. No other kinds of alcohol involved as far as I 
know. Some people are able to remove the awful taste in the lab.


I usually use 100% IPA to wash my RK05 packs...
I don't let acetone get near my stuff. It probably will remove the 
laquer. Nice prep if you want to apply a new coating to your disk.


I do it like Klemens: Scrub, scrub, scrub. The black spots MUST be 
removed. Important not to lay the disk onto a hard or somehow grain 
contaminated surface while scrubbing.



BTW: The RK05 manual explicitly warns from WATER on the disks. You 
should not spit (i.e. blow!) onto the surfaces as water is said to 
dissolve the coating.


Philipp

Re: More tapes - This time all Tektronix 405x series

[Pete Lancashire via cctalk]

I'm going to see if the Tektronix museum is interested. And if so I'm sure
they can make the software available for download. As to the format, Tek
decided to do it their own way. It is a funky 2 track that has issues of
its own. But your method of recovering the raw track data should work as a
starting point.

-pete

On Sun, Apr 2, 2017 at 11:16 PM, AJ Palmgren via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Pete,
>
> These tapes look to be in beautiful condition!  Do you have any plans for
> reading or archiving them?
>
> Do you have any idea what format the data might have been written in?
>
> If interested, my site for reading/restoring QIC cartridges of this very
> vintage is at
>
> http://QICreader.com
>
> Let me know if I can be of any assistance.
>
> -AJ
>
> 2017-04-02 21:08 GMT-07:00 Pete Lancashire via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org
> >:
>
> > https://goo.gl/photos/m91e3UPSvN6tHUaS7
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
> AJ Palmgren
> http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
> https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/
>
>

Re: Cleaning RK05 packs (Was: LGP-30 Memory Drum Update)

[Philipp Hachtmann via cctalk]

Another thing to watch out for is the two halves of some if not all
were screwed together with self tapping screws. When you take
them apart bit of plastic may come out of the holes or fall off the
insides of the screw threads. That plastic if gets between the platter
and head will not be to the heads advantage.
Ah, oh How should that get between the heads and the platter? It's 
nearly impossible to get something of substantial size into that gap.
Look at the RK05 manual (and pack bag): It's the *really* small stuff 
that gets into the wrong place.
Normal dust from the paper you used for cleaning (and from your working 
environment) is kicked off the platter by the head. Makes funny sounds.


My procedure: Clean the disk, load it, manually visit the whole surface 
with the heads. If it crashes or clinging does not go away soon, 
reclean. If the disk has become silent and is running nicely, I give the 
heads a "quick brutal cleaning": Towel with IPA, between the heads, load 
heads onto the towel, move towel until heads clean. Must be done 
carefully...


I once had an RC05 disk crashing. With an awful noise and a white stripe 
on the disk. After cleaning, both heads and disks were fully functional 
again. But I have also seen packs which look perfect but either keep 
making heavy sound or having data errors.


Philipp

Re: IBM RT PC card.

[Paul Berger via cctalk]

That is the adapter card for connection to a 5080 graphics system.  See 
page 2-47 and 2-48 in manual at 
http://ohlandl.ipv7.net/6152/RT_PC_User_Setup_Guide.pdf


The 5080 system was a high performance graphics processor originally 
hosted by 370 systems but adapters where made to host them on RTs and 
later on RS/6000.


Paul

On 2017-04-03 5:56 AM, Mattis Lind via cctalk wrote:

This card is sitting in a IBM RT PC.

http://i.imgur.com/Adqnxr3.jpg?1

What kind of card is it? The WD1935 seems to be a SDLC chip. I cannot find
any reference to the numbers P/N 6247874 (bottom layer etch) or the number
on the sticker on the backside: 6247871G001

It is connected to an IBM marked dongle which has 4 BNC connectors.

Is it a 3278-3279 emulation board?

/Mattis

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[Plamen Mihaylov via cctalk]

Hello AJ, Al,

It took me a while, but I finally shipped the tapes to Raymond Stricklin.
I also have SunOS 2.0 tapes:
http://afterpeople.com/images/Image%20(30).tif
http://afterpeople.com/images/Image%20(31).tif

Al, check if these have been already images, if not I'll mail them to AJ.

BR,
Plamen



On Mon, Apr 3, 2017 at 9:37 AM, AJ Palmgren via cctech <
cct...@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Hi, Plamen & Al,
>
> I'm just catching up on some of these past threads involving QIC
> cartridges.  What ever became of these Paragon tapes?  Were you able to
> read them and archive the contents?
>
> Thanks all,
> -AJ
> http://QICreader.com
>
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 8:46 AM, Plamen Mihaylov <
> plamens...@afterpeople.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I have some Paragon tapes, which I didn't manage to recover fully:
> > https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/k-ccRPWd1TCIGU5wMKTSff-
> > lZns2BIBIYz2IhZwofwTrteTiFCPsppZLBX7zxxEuH81P4zM7XQ=w1920-h1200-rw-no
> > https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/1wdKJgu8hbkd_
> > 1Se3epo10MZt4hWTjNK6kLifHoV9Z9EUXwtJXurEHEmyuE1xXZ53Jc2bVUfd
> > w=w1920-h1200-rw-no
> > https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/tNanwmBqRs9P7Wm0cs69G0LbQa6CtR
> > p6XMi6xYBmPuZ4l6tltQB1DngzVwrXUe3LmFfzc_aDJQ=w1920-h1200-rw-no
> >
> > On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 5:34 PM, Al Kossow  wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > never mind, that was just for diagnostics
> > >
> > > the srm is described further down. it's a 386 running Sys V
> > >
> > > it is likely to be either one of their 310 series multibus boxes with
> > > a Wyse terminal, like the iPCS-2, which had a 286 or their 386 clone AT
> > > box
> > >
> > > On 11/5/16 8:29 AM, Al Kossow wrote:
> > > > there are no useful pictures in the brochures
> > > >
> > > > it appears the SRM is integrated into the cabinet and controls 16
> nodes
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
> AJ Palmgren
> http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
> https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/
>

HISTORY OF COMPUTER DESIGN: THE MOST INNOVATIVE AND UNCONVENTIONAL PCS EVER MADE

[Liam Proven via cctalk]

This series of articles focuses mainly on physical design, of cases
and so on, but there are some technical details in the articles too.

Note that this is the landing page -- at the bottom of the page are
links to other articles in the Inexhibit series, such as the Holborn
9100 and Olivetti Programma 101.

https://www.inexhibit.com/specials/history-of-computer-design-the-most-innovative-and-unconventional-pcs-ever-made/

-- 
Liam Proven • Profile: https://about.me/liamproven
Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • Google Mail/Talk/Plus: lpro...@gmail.com
Twitter/Facebook/Flickr: lproven • Skype/LinkedIn/AIM/Yahoo: liamproven
UK: +44 7939-087884 • ČR/WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal: +420 702 829 053

Re: IBM RT PC card.

[jim stephens via cctalk]

On 4/3/2017 1:56 AM, Mattis Lind via cctalk wrote:

This card is sitting in a IBM RT PC.

http://i.imgur.com/Adqnxr3.jpg?1
Possibly an RTIC card, with the 68000 on it.  Might be a controller.  
The 3278 is the same as the PC/AT one.  The 3278 doesn't use anything 
like a 68000 co-processor.

thanks
Jim

What kind of card is it? The WD1935 seems to be a SDLC chip. I cannot find
any reference to the numbers P/N 6247874 (bottom layer etch) or the number
on the sticker on the backside: 6247871G001

It is connected to an IBM marked dongle which has 4 BNC connectors.

Is it a 3278-3279 emulation board?

/Mattis

Re: Supercomputers, fishing for information

[AJ Palmgren via cctalk]

Hi, Plamen & Al,

I'm just catching up on some of these past threads involving QIC
cartridges.  What ever became of these Paragon tapes?  Were you able to
read them and archive the contents?

Thanks all,
-AJ
http://QICreader.com



On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 8:46 AM, Plamen Mihaylov 
wrote:

> I have some Paragon tapes, which I didn't manage to recover fully:
> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/k-ccRPWd1TCIGU5wMKTSff-
> lZns2BIBIYz2IhZwofwTrteTiFCPsppZLBX7zxxEuH81P4zM7XQ=w1920-h1200-rw-no
> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/1wdKJgu8hbkd_
> 1Se3epo10MZt4hWTjNK6kLifHoV9Z9EUXwtJXurEHEmyuE1xXZ53Jc2bVUfd
> w=w1920-h1200-rw-no
> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/tNanwmBqRs9P7Wm0cs69G0LbQa6CtR
> p6XMi6xYBmPuZ4l6tltQB1DngzVwrXUe3LmFfzc_aDJQ=w1920-h1200-rw-no
>
> On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 5:34 PM, Al Kossow  wrote:
>
> >
> > never mind, that was just for diagnostics
> >
> > the srm is described further down. it's a 386 running Sys V
> >
> > it is likely to be either one of their 310 series multibus boxes with
> > a Wyse terminal, like the iPCS-2, which had a 286 or their 386 clone AT
> > box
> >
> > On 11/5/16 8:29 AM, Al Kossow wrote:
> > > there are no useful pictures in the brochures
> > >
> > > it appears the SRM is integrated into the cabinet and controls 16 nodes
> > >
> >
> >
>



-- 

Thanks,
AJ Palmgren
http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/

Re: New HP42s clone almost available

[Ed via cctalk]

Good  hear it stood the  test of  time! As an HP  PC  dealer in the 80s 
into early 90s   we ha a calculator   contract with HP also and...
we  sold the heck out of them!
 
Is it the only  one of the 10  series  calcs that stayed in  production?
 
I have a set of the  special demo versions that were mounted on a  
descriptive plaque 
that had been in the PHX HP Corp demo center... when they redid that   they 
knew I
Hoarded stuff and   sent them over.  For  some of the  10 series that were 
still being used
we had them on the  display  floor  the others went into the  the suites 
next to the business
in the historical display.
 
Ed#
 
 
In a message dated 4/2/2017 8:50:16 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes:

On Sun,  2 Apr 2017, Ed via cctalk wrote:

> That is an undertaking  indeed!  I had not seen this   Ed#
> Someone   said the 12c was still being made?

The 12c never went out of  production.  It has been continuously updated. 
A lot of bankers,  insurance people, etc still rely on them.


-- 
David  Griffith
d...@661.org

A: Because it fouls the order in which people  normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A:  Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing in  e-mail?

Re: More tapes - This time all Tektronix 405x series

[AJ Palmgren via cctalk]

Pete,

These tapes look to be in beautiful condition!  Do you have any plans for
reading or archiving them?

Do you have any idea what format the data might have been written in?

If interested, my site for reading/restoring QIC cartridges of this very
vintage is at

http://QICreader.com

Let me know if I can be of any assistance.

-AJ

2017-04-02 21:08 GMT-07:00 Pete Lancashire via cctalk :

> https://goo.gl/photos/m91e3UPSvN6tHUaS7
>



-- 

Thanks,
AJ Palmgren
http://fb.me/SelmaTrainWreck
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100010931314283
https://www.linkedin.com/in/aj-palmgren-4a085516/