Re: Ethernet names...

[Grant Taylor via cctalk]

On 10/02/2018 07:38 PM, Bill Degnan via cctalk wrote:
I later looked this up to confirm.  See where wizards stay up lote by 
Katie Halner and matthew lyon.


IMHO Where Wizards Stay Up Late is a *WONDERFUL* book.  It's been too 
long since I've read it.  Perhaps I should (re)read it (again).


Somehow I missed the type of technical details that I'm looking for the 
last time I read it.


Of course, when I'm reading for edutainment reasons, I frequently don't 
retain hard core details.  At least not on the first read.



Well there you go, now you have


;-)



--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

Re: Ethernet names...

[Grant Taylor via cctalk]

On 10/02/2018 05:27 PM, Eric Smith via cctalk wrote:
3 Mbps Ethernet is _NOT_ Ethernet I. Both Ethernet I and II were 10 Mbps 
DIX standards, with II having only minor differences from I.


Okay.  Thank you for the correction ~> clarification.

Now I'll keep an eye out (but not quite search for) the differences 
between Ethernet (I) and Ethernet II.


3 Mbps was sometimes referred to as experimental Ethernet, but AFAIK 
the only official name was "Ethernet".


ACK


The best way to refer to it is probably "3 Mbps Ethernet".


:-)



--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

Re: 6809 Monitor

[Guy Dunphy via cctalk]

At 12:24 PM 2/10/2018 -0700, you wrote:
>Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?
>
>I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.
>
>Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
>write to memory.

Attached is the zipped C source code for a 6809 monitor I wrote in the early 
1990s.
Compiler used was HiTech C. Build files included.
It worked, but of course 'there may be bugs.' :)
It's fairly generic, so not many changes needed for other CPUs. I also did an 
80C196 ver.

If the zip file attachment fails, it's online here: 
http://everist.org/texts/6809_Mon_V2.zip

Doco from the MONITOR.C file:

/* File: MONITOR.C

   For machine: Dual 6809 game board.
   Compiler:Hitech 6809 C.
   Written: Guy Dunphy, 4/9/94, derived from an earlier version. (by me)

   This file contains all code for a versatile serial monitor.
   It is event driven, and time sliced, so it can operate in the
   background with other CPU tasks.
   All data is stored big-endian.

   All serial I/O is via the functions aux_get_ch(), aux_put_ch().
   Serial Tx is polled, while Rx can be either polled, or buffered interrupt
   driven with hardware handshaking (via RTS). See monitor_init().
   
   This monitor can be used in multi CPU systems, where only one CPU has a
   serial comms interface, and each has different IO/mem maps and codespaces.
   If there is a means for passing strings between the CPUs, then the one
   with serial IO is used to run a 'master' copy of the monitor, and the
   other CPU(s) runs a 'slave' monitor version.
   The master CPU does all command line entry/edit operations, and can be
   set to pass complete command lines on to other CPU(s). It also will echo
   text returned from the slave CPU(s) to the serial interface.
   
   To use this file:-
   * For single CPU operation, just compile it as is.
   * As a 'master' (talks to a slave), predefine symbol MON_MASTER.
   * As a 'slave', predefine symbol MON_SLAVE.


Monitor commands  (See also  mon_help_text[] )

Multiple cmds allowed on a line, use ';' to separate.
Upper/lower case of commands and parameters is not significant.
A 'range' may be:-
start
start end
start length(Shorthand form: if length is small and < 
start.)
start L length

space   (as 1st char)   Repeat last command.Execute or re-edit.
tab (as 1st char)   Repeat 'saved' command. Execute or re-edit.
tab (not 1st char)  Copy cmd to 'save' buffer.
esc (as 1st char)   Allow re-edit of following 'repeat' cmd.
(... twice  )   Kill 'pass cmds to slave' mode.
D range Dump mem.
D(no other chars)   Dump another 64 bytes 
F[W][I] range data  Fill memory. W=word, I=increment.
G addr  Go (call) to addr
M start [data]...   Modify mem. 
data   ::= hex_byte | string | char
string ::= "text"
char   ::= 'c
R [reg_name = value]Optionally modify register(s), then display all regs.
reg_name ::= cc a b d dp x y u pc
Z [flag_val]Zot!   Set operation mode. Bit flags set are:-
b0  Halt system (no return from monitor).
b1  Inhibit serial echo.
b2  Inhibit serial prompt output.
b3  Inhibit all monitor output (incl help).
b4  Pass all cmds to slave CPU. ESC,ESC to exit.
Examples:-
Z Re-initialize monitor. Lose trailing cmds.
Z 0   Restore normal operation, continue.
Z F   Just accept commands, no system, echo, etc.
Z 2   Normal, but no echo (ie half duplex).
S1ccddddss  Motorola data record. Load to memory. 
Each hex line is treated as a command, so there is no special 'load' cmd.
Before sending hex, best to do a Z6 or Z7 to stop all other time
consuming tasks. When finished, do a Z 0 to restore normal ops.
An ASCII ACK ($06) is sent when line processing is complete and no
error found. This can be used as an acknowledge.
If an error is found, a '?' is returned.  See s19_decode().
S0 and S9   Header and end records: ignored.

Re: Ethernet names...

[Bill Degnan via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 10:55 PM Eric Smith via cctalk 
wrote:

> On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 7:38 PM Bill Degnan  wrote:
>
> > On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 7:46 PM Eric Smith via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > I've never heard of an Alto being connected to an Aloha Network, nor of
> any
> >
> >> network inside Xerox being called "Aloha".
> >>
> > Well there you go, now you have
> >
>
> Thanks! I stand corrected.
>

I think Metcalfe was just giving credit for where he got the idea of
letting packets collide like alohanet was doing.  He took their idea and
improved with collision detection and borrowed the name of his improvements
and subsequent network "The Alto Aloha Network" i.e. it was his improved
"alto" version of the concept inspired by alohanet.In May 1973 (I later
found) he renamed his network system "Ethernet".  There were a number of
other more established networks out there at the time, this was just the
start.

I think this whole area of research is very interesting.

b

Re: Ethernet names...

[Eric Smith via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 7:38 PM Bill Degnan  wrote:

> On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 7:46 PM Eric Smith via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> I've never heard of an Alto being connected to an Aloha Network, nor of any
>
>> network inside Xerox being called "Aloha".
>>
> Well there you go, now you have
>

Thanks! I stand corrected.

Re: Ethernet names...

[Bill Degnan via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 7:46 PM Eric Smith via cctalk 
wrote:

> On Tue, Oct 2, 2018, 11:47 Bill Degnan via cctalk 
> wrote:
>
> > Ethernet was the name given to the Alto (XEROX) Aloha Network
>
>
> It wasn't an Aloha Network.
>
> There is a difference between Alohanet and the alto aloha network.


> created (?)
> > by Bob Metcalff (sp?), which was based/inspired by an improved version of
> > the ALOHANET used by the U of Hawaii.
>
>
> In their CACM paper, Metcalfe and Boggs credit the Aloha Network, but
> Ethernet was an entirely new network design, not an incremental improvement
> to Aloha Network.
>


Inspired by, but I did not claim them to be the same, just for the record.


>
>   I think Ethernet was a nickname,
> >
>
> I wasn't there, but I've never seen any source claim that it was a
> nickname.
>
>
I later looked this up to confirm.  See where wizards stay up lote by Katie
Halner and matthew lyon.


> eventually becoming the official name of what was originally the Alto Aloha
> > Network.
> >
>
> I've never heard of an Alto being connected to an Aloha Network, nor of any
> network inside Xerox being called "Aloha".
>

Well there you go, now you have

b

Re: 6809 Monitor

[Monty McGraw via cctalk]

I found this page two days ago - it is a Motorola document for MIKBUG and
MINIBUG:includes instructions and source code for both.
MINIBUG uses a Motorola ACIA for serial.  MIKBUG does bit banged serial
through a PIA.

http://www.swtpc.com/mholley/MP_A/MIKBUG_Index.htm
I am porting MINIBUG to Tektronix 4052A/4054A assembly code (assembler
program found on a Tekniques library tape).

Here is the link to my thread on vcfed about that Assembler:
http://www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?65857-Tektronix-4052A-4054A-Assembler-program-and-TECO-text-editor


On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 6:18 PM Torfinn Ingolfsen via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Also, there is this:
> https://github.com/electronalan/Colormon
> and a monitor in here too: https://github.com/6809/sbc09
> HTH
> On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 10:39 PM Dennis Boone via cctalk
>  wrote:
> >
> >  > Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?
> >
> >  > I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.
> >
> >  > Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
> >  > write to memory.
> >
> > Sources to the BUFFALO, ASSIST09 and MONDEB09 monitors are included in
> > the Alan Baldwin's AS package.
> >
> > De
>
>
>
> --
> mvh
> Torfinn
>

Re: Ethernet names...

[Al Kossow via cctalk]

On 10/2/18 4:45 PM, Eric Smith via cctalk wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 2, 2018, 11:47 Bill Degnan via cctalk 

> I've never heard of an Alto being connected to an Aloha Network, nor of any
> network inside Xerox being called "Aloha".
> 

I just went back and reviewed every memo I can find that I have access to (going
back to March, 1974 when there were three Nova Ethernet boards and two Alto 
Ethernet
boards, and they are consistently calling it "Ethernet". In fact, the word 
"Aloha"
never appears.

Re: Rack-mount or tabletop version of DEC RX50 floppy drive?

[Ethan Dicks via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 6:50 PM Eric Smith via cctalk
 wrote:
> Did DEC offer a rack-mount or tabletop box version of the RX50 floppy
> drive, as they did with e.g. the TU58 and TK50 tape drives?

Yes.

> I'm wondering
> how they expected the RX50 drive to be packaged when used with a Unibus
> PDP-11 via the RUX50 controller.

We had an external RX50 on our 11/750 at work (so we could cut
floppies for our MicroVAX customers right from our main machine).  The
box was the typical external DEC 5.25" drive box of the day, also used
for TK50 and RD5x drives - it could take a black sled, like the kind
used with the BA23, and had a PSU inside next to the drive.  In the
back was a transition board that was different depending on the drive
type, but typically had between 1 and 3 DD50-P connectors.  We had a
10' DD50P cable that went from the back of the drive box to an I/O
bulkhead plate on the 11/750, then an internal flat cable to the RUX50
controller.

I don't know the part number for the box, but with the cover off, they
looked like this:

https://thumbs.worthpoint.com/zoom/images3/1/0816/09/dec-vax-pdp-rd-tk-drive-shelf_1_2c22716c08caa3df496022a1cd806fce.jpg

(This one has the internal I/O board and cables for an RD5x drive.)

I happen to have at least 3 of these boxes, all have dead PSUs.
Nothing magical in them - 110/220 VAC inputs, and a single 4-pin Molex
drive connector with +12V and +5V outputs at a enough amps to drive a
TK50 or RD51.

We usually positioned the RX50 on top of the 11/750 next to the
console terminal so we could log in, fire off some DCL scripts and
make some floppies.   The cable would have let it sit on a nearby
table or in the next rack over, but not any further than that.

-ethan

Re: Rack-mount or tabletop version of DEC RX50 floppy drive?

[Josh Dersch via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 4:50 PM Eric Smith via cctalk 
wrote:

> Did DEC offer a rack-mount or tabletop box version of the RX50 floppy
> drive, as they did with e.g. the TU58 and TK50 tape drives? I'm wondering
> how they expected the RX50 drive to be packaged when used with a Unibus
> PDP-11 via the RUX50 controller.
>

Yes: We've got an 11/84 with a DEC-branded rack-mount enclosure for a pair
of RX50 drives.  I can take some pictures if you'd like.

- Josh

Rack-mount or tabletop version of DEC RX50 floppy drive?

[Eric Smith via cctalk]

Did DEC offer a rack-mount or tabletop box version of the RX50 floppy
drive, as they did with e.g. the TU58 and TK50 tape drives? I'm wondering
how they expected the RX50 drive to be packaged when used with a Unibus
PDP-11 via the RUX50 controller.

Re: Ethernet names...

[Eric Smith via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018, 11:47 Bill Degnan via cctalk 
wrote:

> Ethernet was the name given to the Alto (XEROX) Aloha Network


It wasn't an Aloha Network.

created (?)
> by Bob Metcalff (sp?), which was based/inspired by an improved version of
> the ALOHANET used by the U of Hawaii.


In their CACM paper, Metcalfe and Boggs credit the Aloha Network, but
Ethernet was an entirely new network design, not an incremental improvement
to Aloha Network.

  I think Ethernet was a nickname,
>

I wasn't there, but I've never seen any source claim that it was a nickname.

eventually becoming the official name of what was originally the Alto Aloha
> Network.
>

I've never heard of an Alto being connected to an Aloha Network, nor of any
network inside Xerox being called "Aloha".

Re: Ethernet names...

[Eric Smith via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018, 11:35 Grant Taylor via cctalk 
wrote:

> Does anybody know names / terms that correspond to the original 3 Mbps
> Ethernet?
>
> I.e. 10 Mbps Ethernet is also knows as Ethernet II (2) and D.I.X. (for
> Digital, Intel, and Xerox).
>
> Was the first 3 Mbps Ethernet simply called "Ethernet" with an implicit
> "I" (1)?  Was there a name to differentiate it from D.I.X.?
>

3 Mbps Ethernet is _NOT_ Ethernet I. Both Ethernet I and II were 10 Mbps
DIX standards, with II having only minor differences from I.

3 Mbps was sometimes referred to as experimental Ethernet, but AFAIK the
only official name was "Ethernet".

The best way to refer to it is probably "3 Mbps Ethernet".

Re: 6809 Monitor

[Torfinn Ingolfsen via cctalk]

Also, there is this:
https://github.com/electronalan/Colormon
and a monitor in here too: https://github.com/6809/sbc09
HTH
On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 10:39 PM Dennis Boone via cctalk
 wrote:
>
>  > Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?
>
>  > I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.
>
>  > Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
>  > write to memory.
>
> Sources to the BUFFALO, ASSIST09 and MONDEB09 monitors are included in
> the Alan Baldwin's AS package.
>
> De



-- 
mvh
Torfinn

Re: 6809 Monitor

[Dennis Boone via cctalk]

 > Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?

 > I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.

 > Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
 > write to memory.

Sources to the BUFFALO, ASSIST09 and MONDEB09 monitors are included in
the Alan Baldwin's AS package.

De

Re: 6809 Monitor

[jim stephens via cctalk]

On 10/2/2018 12:51 PM, Lawrence Wilkinson via cctalk wrote:

On 02/10/18 21:24, tim lindner via cctalk wrote:

Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?

I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.

Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
write to memory.

There is a listing of ASSIST09 in this Motorola book: 
http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene/Genes-os9-stf/MC6809-MC6809E%208-Bit%20Microprocessor%20Programming%20Manual%20(Motorola%20Inc.)%201981.pdf


This might be overkill, as it has single-step, breakpoints etc.

If you type it in, note that the listing omits the second and 
subsequent hex bytes for constants (FCB) !


LJW

If you look at page B-65 (pdf 189) where it mentions "Start NMI 
Timeout", there is a bit of hardware you have to add to the design, and 
set up and control the NMI.  The hardware counts cycles and applies the 
NMI right after you go to the opcode to be traced, and sends you back 
into the monitor via NMI.


I did a quick scan and didn't see what board they assume for a reference 
design which may have the NMI trace part of the board.


We had an option board which would kill the main firmware and add a 
debugger, this hardware, and a serial port to a controller we had, which 
turned any board into a debugging system.  There was another slight mod 
and a diagnostic firmware we also had on an addon board to allow testing 
the peripheral we were controlling, and run diagnostics on other hardware.


I had a lot of fun getting this monitor going, and a friend implemented 
a Forth for the diagnostic system for scripting.


Thanks
Jim

Re: 6809 Monitor

[Mike Loewen via cctalk]

On Tue, 2 Oct 2018, tim lindner via cctalk wrote:


Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?

I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.

Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
write to memory.


   If you're up for a disassembly challage, there's a BIN file in Don Maslin's 
archive for CBUG.  Not sure if it's a ROM image or an executable.


https://amaus.org/static/S100/people/don%20maslin/AARDVARK_Tape_Backups/maslin_c_d_10apr97/ddrive/sydex/tandy/


Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology  http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

Re: 6809 Monitor

[Lawrence Wilkinson via cctalk]

On 02/10/18 21:24, tim lindner via cctalk wrote:

Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?

I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.

Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
write to memory.

There is a listing of ASSIST09 in this Motorola book: 
http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene/Genes-os9-stf/MC6809-MC6809E%208-Bit%20Microprocessor%20Programming%20Manual%20(Motorola%20Inc.)%201981.pdf


This might be overkill, as it has single-step, breakpoints etc.

If you type it in, note that the listing omits the second and subsequent 
hex bytes for constants (FCB) !


LJW

--
Lawrence Wilkinson lawre...@ljw.me.uk
Ph +41(0)79 926 1036 http://www.ljw.me.uk

Re: 6809 Monitor

[Diane Bruce via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 02, 2018 at 12:24:47PM -0700, tim lindner via cctalk wrote:
> Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?
> 
> I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.
> 
> Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
> write to memory.

I have a copy of psymon.s if you want it.

> 
> -- 
> --
> tim lindner
> 
> "Proper User Policy apparently means Simon Says."

-- 
- d...@freebsd.org d...@db.net http://artemis.db.net/~db
*
* psymon version 1.00
*
* copyright (c) 1979 percom data company, inc.
* percom data company, inc. grants unrestricted
* royalty-free license for the use of this
* program provided the user clearly acknowledges
* its origin.
*
* while this monitor is very simple, its true
* power lies in its extensibility and in the
* tools that it provides for other software
* to use.  This operating system is dedicated
* to harold mauch and his legendary 512 byte
* operating system.
*
* psymon Much modified version 4.00
*
* commands:
*   m  - memory examine/change
*   o  - memory change (output to I/O port no read)
*   g  - go to address
*   r - register examine/change
*   l  - load program from tape, optional load address
*   s   - save program to tape
*   b  - set/list breakpoints
*   u  - unset breakpoints
*   e start end dest - Burn EEPROM at dest with data from start, end
*
* other comments to be added here later
*
* Extensive modifications for GPE
* - acia changed to 68681 DUART, I know strange to use a 68k part on 6809
* - removed 'z' command
* - moved I/O,ram,rom addresses as needed
* - removed special code for special dcb's for punch since 
*   debug port will be used for all uploads/downloads and need the bytes.
*   (There is lots of ROM on target system, but I am unwilling to attempt
*   relocating monitor since that would entail working out padding,
*   see my next note)
* - Original programmer did not make use of 'lbra' and 'lbsr' instructions
*   for reaching code ie. used 'stepping stone' technique, makes me wonder
*   if this was originally a 6800 monitor?
* - Added 'o' command
* - DCB is obviously "Device Control Block" but no reference to that
*   in "FLEX" or "OS9" so I have no idea where this came from.
*
*   DB. Feb 19 1990
*   DB. Feb 25 1990
*
* system address constants (GPE version)
RUNSYS equ 1 ; if bottom bit is set on INPORT, Run 2nd ROM
rom1 equ 0F800H ; base add of psymon rom
rom2 equ 0C000H ; base add of extension rom
ram equ  ; base add of ram
termnl equ 8000H ; system terminal acia
* ascii character constants
cr equ 0dH ; carriage return
lf equ 0AH ; line feed
sp equ 20H ; space
* acia control configurations
 MREG equ 0 ; Mode register (MR1,MR2)
 SREG equ 1 ; Status register
 CSREG equ 1 ; Clock select register
 CREG equ 2 ; Command register
 RHR equ 3 ; Receiver holding register
 THR equ 3 ; Transmitter holding register
 OPCR equ 0DH ; Output port conf reg.
 INPORT equ 0DH ; Same as above, read input port
 SETOP equ 0EH
 RESETOP equ 0FH

* yes, THR is the same as RHR
*
* Bit masks for SREG (status register)
*
 RXRDY equ 01H ; RXRDY equ %0001
 TXRDY equ 04H ; TXRDY equ %0100
 RXBRK equ 80H ; RXBRK equ %1000
 FRAME equ 40H ; FRAME equ %0100
 PARER equ 20H ; PARER equ %0010
 OVRUN equ 10H ; OVRUN equ %0001

*
* Commands for CREG
*
 RESETRX equ 20H ; RESETRX equ %0010
 RESETTX equ 30H ; RESETTX equ %0011
 RESETMR equ 10H ; RESETMR equ %0001
 ENBTX   equ 04H ; ENBTX   equ %0100 Enable Transmitter
 ENBRX   equ 01H ; ENBRX   equ %0001 Enable Receiver
 DISTX   equ 08H ; DISTX   equ %1000 Disable Transmitter
 DISRX   equ 02H ; DISRX   equ %0010 Disable Receiver
 ENABLE  equ 05H ; ENABLE  equ %0101 Enable both RX and TX
*
* Commands for MR
* Whenever MR is pointing to MR1 and then is written to, MR flips to MR2.
*
 RXRTSNO equ 0
 RXRTSYES equ 80H ; RXRTSYES equ %1000
 RXINTRDY equ 0
 RXINTFUL equ 40H ; RXINTFUL equ %0100
*
* MR1 equ RXRTSNO|RXINTRDY|ERRORCHAR|NOPARITY|BITS8
 MR1 equ 13H ; MR1 equ %00010011
*MR2 equ NORMAL|TXRTSNO|CTSCTLNO|STOP1
 MR2 equ 07H ; MR2 equ %0111
*
* Commands for CSREG
*
B9600 equ 0BBH ; B9600 equ %10111011
*
BURNRAM equ 1400H ; where EEPROM routine goes
*
* psymon dcb offsets
 dcblnk equ 0 ; ptr to next dcb in chain
 dcbdid equ 2 ; ascii 2 char device id
 dcbdvr equ 4 ; device driver address
 dcbioa equ 6 ; device io address
 dcberr equ 8 ; error status  code
 dcbext equ 9 ; dcb extension byte count
 dcbapp equ 10 ; driver dcb appendage
* psymon dcb function codes
 readfn equ 01H ; read
 writfn equ 02H ; write
 statfn equ 04H ; read status
 initfn equ 08H ; init the 68681
 baudfn equ 10H ; set baud rate (for 68681 only)

* psymon ram definitions (mp-a2 version)
 org ram
* psymon internal stack (& register) space
 rmb 800H ; stack space
stack:
regc: rmb 1 ; condition code register
rega: rmb 1 ; a register
regb: rmb 1 ; b 

6809 Monitor

[tim lindner via cctalk]

Does anyone have source to a 6809 monitor program?

I'm looking for something I can make work in a CoCo.

Functionality I'm looking for is something that will let me read and
write to memory.

-- 
--
tim lindner

"Proper User Policy apparently means Simon Says."

Re: pdp-11/34 extravaganza

[Ethan Dicks via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 11:52 AM Jay West via cctalk
 wrote:
> This was claimed by the way..

Somebody has a bunch of nice new toys.

I have multiple PDP-11/34s, and RL01/02 and RX01/02 drives (and not
looking to add more).

The Tektronix terminals, though... very nice.  I only have dumb
terminals and a pair of late-model 4105 (raster) Tektronix terminals.
I got to use a 4010 on a PDP-8/m at the Ohio State University Vet
School in the mid-1980s (with a pair of CPUs and shared RK05 disks
attached to a mass spectrometer - the application was to test horse
urine for performance drugs on the mass spec, then flip the
drives/data over and use the other CPU to do analysis and graphing).
It was fun noodling on a vector storage scope since I was used to
ASR33 and VT52 at the time.

-ethan

Re: pdp-11/34 extravaganza

[Paul Anderson via cctalk]

OK, thanks Jay.

Catch you later.



On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 8:32 AM Jay West via cctalk 
wrote:

> This was claimed by the way..
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jay West
> via cctalk
> Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2018 2:02 PM
> To: cctalk@classiccmp.org
> Subject: pdp-11/34 extravaganza
>
> I was contacted about an 11/34 system available. It appears to be not just
> a
> system, nor just a system in a rack, but pretty much a full installation
> and
> all the trimmings (printers, terminals, documentation, media, etc.). I am
> pretty sure some of the terminals will invoke interest at the very least ;)
>
>
>
> Note - the person who has it is looking for a sale. No prices have been
> discussed, but my impression is they aren't going to let it all go for $50
> :) The stuff is located in the Detroit metro area.
>
>
>
> I am not (nor do I want to be) involved in this transaction in any way. I'm
> just passing it on. I would prefer to pass it to someone who has a
> demonstrated ability (and resources) for rescues of this size and type of
> equipment. All I care about is that the equipment is rescued and by a
> responsible party. Do not email me expressing interest in just one or two
> items. I will pass it all to one person - if THEY want to part it out
> *after
> the deal* that's fine. I do have a single picture I can forward. If
> interested email me directly..
>
>
>
> Terminals (screen, keyboard, mouse) (1 is custom built)
>
> - Quantity: 2  -Tektronix 4012
>
> - Quantity: 1  -Tektronix 4010
>
> - Quantity: 1  - Custom Built Tektronix
>
>
>
> Printer Terminal with Monitor (keyboard)
>
> - Quantity: 1 - Digital VT100
>
> - Quatity: 2  - Digital VT105
>
>
>
> Printer Terminal
>
> - Quantity: 2  - DEC Writer IV
>
>
>
> PDP 11/34 (edit by jay - I believe there is only one 11/34, not 4. I could
> be wrong.)
>
> - Quantity: 1  - 11/34A-DH - 115 Volts / 60Hz
>
> - Quantity: 1  - 1134A-XE - 120 Volts / 60Hz
>
> - Quantity: 1  - 11/34A-YE - 120 Volts / 60Hz
>
> - Quantity: 1  - 11/34A DE - 120 Volts / 60Hz
>
>
>
> Digital RL01 - Quantity: 2
>
> Digital RL02 - Quantity: 2
>
>
>
> Digital RX02 - Quantity: 4 - 1 out of the 4 is non-functioning
>
> Digital RX01- Quantity: 2
>
>
>
> DEC Magnetic Disk Drivers
>
> - Quantity: 23 (possibly more)
>
> Some are RL01K-DC and some are RL02K-DC
>
> One has Fortinet on it
>
>
>
> IEE Serial Display Quantity: 1
>
>
>
> Digital M9202  Quantity: 5
>
> Digital M9741  Quantity: 1
>
> Digital M9312  Quantity: 1
>
> Digital M9302  Quantity: 2
>
> Digital M7850  Quantity: 2
>
> Digital M9301  Quantity: 2
>
>
>
> Digital QSC H322 Quantity 1, possibly 2
>
>
>
> Various Spare Parts
>
> -Printing Paper
>
> -Original Printing Ink
>
> -INMAC Air Filters
>
> -RX02 Replacement Fan
>
> -Extra Cable for PDP 11/34
>
> -Moss Memory for PDP 11/34
>
> -Spare Power Supplies
>
> -3 cases of documentation for the different components and programs
>
>
>
> Half Rack with Built In Power Supply Digital 872-A Quantity: 1
>
> Full Rack, Chasf CD3001-99-0141  Quantity: 1
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: Ethernet names...

[Josh Dersch via cctalk]

To the best of my knowledge, at the time it was developed at PARC in
1973/74, it was referred to as "Ethernet" (or "The Ethernet") and later was
referred to as "Xerox Experimental Ethernet" likely to differentiate it
from the developing 10mbit standards...

- Josh


On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 10:47 AM Bill Degnan via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Ethernet was the name given to the Alto (XEROX) Aloha Network created (?)
> by Bob Metcalff (sp?), which was based/inspired by an improved version of
> the ALOHANET used by the U of Hawaii.  I think Ethernet was a nickname,
> eventually becoming the official name of what was originally the Alto Aloha
> Network.
>
> I did not look this up in Wikipedia, I am sure this must be somewhere
>
> Bill
>
> On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 1:35 PM Grant Taylor via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> > Does anybody know names / terms that correspond to the original 3 Mbps
> > Ethernet?
> >
> > I.e. 10 Mbps Ethernet is also knows as Ethernet II (2) and D.I.X. (for
> > Digital, Intel, and Xerox).
> >
> > Was the first 3 Mbps Ethernet simply called "Ethernet" with an implicit
> > "I" (1)?  Was there a name to differentiate it from D.I.X.?
> >
> >
> >
> > Grant. . . .
> > unix || die
> >
>

Re: Ethernet names...

[Paul Koning via cctalk]

Not clear the 3 Mb one had a name of its own.

Note that Aloha is fundamentally different from Ethernet.  Aloha is MA but not 
CS nor CD, and its performance characteristics are very different from Ethernet.

paul


> On Oct 2, 2018, at 1:46 PM, Bill Degnan via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> Ethernet was the name given to the Alto (XEROX) Aloha Network created (?)
> by Bob Metcalff (sp?), which was based/inspired by an improved version of
> the ALOHANET used by the U of Hawaii.  I think Ethernet was a nickname,
> eventually becoming the official name of what was originally the Alto Aloha
> Network.
> 
> I did not look this up in Wikipedia, I am sure this must be somewhere
> 
> Bill
> 
> On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 1:35 PM Grant Taylor via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> 
>> Does anybody know names / terms that correspond to the original 3 Mbps
>> Ethernet?
>> 
>> I.e. 10 Mbps Ethernet is also knows as Ethernet II (2) and D.I.X. (for
>> Digital, Intel, and Xerox).
>> 
>> Was the first 3 Mbps Ethernet simply called "Ethernet" with an implicit
>> "I" (1)?  Was there a name to differentiate it from D.I.X.?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Grant. . . .
>> unix || die
>> 

Re: Ethernet names...

[Bill Degnan via cctalk]

Ethernet was the name given to the Alto (XEROX) Aloha Network created (?)
by Bob Metcalff (sp?), which was based/inspired by an improved version of
the ALOHANET used by the U of Hawaii.  I think Ethernet was a nickname,
eventually becoming the official name of what was originally the Alto Aloha
Network.

I did not look this up in Wikipedia, I am sure this must be somewhere

Bill

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 1:35 PM Grant Taylor via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Does anybody know names / terms that correspond to the original 3 Mbps
> Ethernet?
>
> I.e. 10 Mbps Ethernet is also knows as Ethernet II (2) and D.I.X. (for
> Digital, Intel, and Xerox).
>
> Was the first 3 Mbps Ethernet simply called "Ethernet" with an implicit
> "I" (1)?  Was there a name to differentiate it from D.I.X.?
>
>
>
> Grant. . . .
> unix || die
>

Ethernet names...

[Grant Taylor via cctalk]

Does anybody know names / terms that correspond to the original 3 Mbps 
Ethernet?


I.e. 10 Mbps Ethernet is also knows as Ethernet II (2) and D.I.X. (for 
Digital, Intel, and Xerox).


Was the first 3 Mbps Ethernet simply called "Ethernet" with an implicit 
"I" (1)?  Was there a name to differentiate it from D.I.X.?




Grant. . . .
unix || die

Re: FS: various books, including some old/classic/vintage

[Andrew Luke Nesbit via cctalk]

Dear MG,

I am interested in a few of your items.

On 02/10/2018 17:00, MG via cctalk wrote:

>    "OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD: The Nonstop Webserver"
>   (Alan Winston, Digital Press, 2003, 454 p.) 

Yes please!  If there were only one thing in the whole list of items
you're offering, it would be this!

I have recently acquired an HP (formerly Compaq, formerly DEC)
AlphaServer DS15 with 1GB ram and 2x 300GB HDD.  I am looking forward to
doing interesting things with this wonderful machine!

> some other computer and related items here: . 

I'm looking through this list now and will be in touch again shortly.
Mostly I wanted to express my great interest in "OpenVMS with Apache,
OSU, and WASD: The Nonstop Webserver" as above.

> All is located in the Netherlands.

I'm in London, UK.

Kind regards,

Andrew
-- 
OpenPGP key: EB28 0338 28B7 19DA DAB0  B193 D21D 996E 883B E5B9

RE: PDP-11 in russia?

[Rod G8DGR via cctalk]

There were plenty of real PDP-11’s that found their way to Russia.
Often through front companies in say Vienna.

Rod Smallwood 
Digital Equipment Corporation 1975 – 1985


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Holm Tiffe via cctalk
Sent: 02 October 2018 18:01
To: Jay West; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: PDP-11 in russia?

Jay West via cctalk wrote:

> Someone has contacted me about a pdp-11 that controls a "measuring machine
> dea epsilon".
> 
>  
> 
> It appears that they want to replace the pdp-11 with a "ibm" (I'm guessing a
> pc), and then they would give the pdp-11 as a gift.
> 
>  
> 
> That is all the info I have. Are there any listmembers in Russia who would
> be able to take on a project?
> 
>  
> 
> J


This for sure isn't a PDP11, it would be an "ELEKTRONIKA 60" I think.
This is something like an 11/23 but with metric Connectors, PCBs are a
little bit bigger as PDP11's.

I do own such a beast, that's a picture from the CPU:

https://www.tiffe.de/Robotron/PDP-VAX/E60/E60-01.jpg

Other pictures are in the same directory (directory index is allowed).

..it's running RT11 from a 8" RX Floppy clone...

Regards,

Holm
-- 
  Technik Service u. Handel Tiffe, www.tsht.de, Holm Tiffe, 
 Freiberger Straße 42, 09600 Oberschöna, USt-Id: DE253710583
i...@tsht.de Fax +49 3731 74200 Tel +49 3731 74222 Mobil: 0172 8790 741

Re: PDP-11 in russia?

[Holm Tiffe via cctalk]

Jay West via cctalk wrote:

> Someone has contacted me about a pdp-11 that controls a "measuring machine
> dea epsilon".
> 
>  
> 
> It appears that they want to replace the pdp-11 with a "ibm" (I'm guessing a
> pc), and then they would give the pdp-11 as a gift.
> 
>  
> 
> That is all the info I have. Are there any listmembers in Russia who would
> be able to take on a project?
> 
>  
> 
> J


This for sure isn't a PDP11, it would be an "ELEKTRONIKA 60" I think.
This is something like an 11/23 but with metric Connectors, PCBs are a
little bit bigger as PDP11's.

I do own such a beast, that's a picture from the CPU:

https://www.tiffe.de/Robotron/PDP-VAX/E60/E60-01.jpg

Other pictures are in the same directory (directory index is allowed).

..it's running RT11 from a 8" RX Floppy clone...

Regards,

Holm
-- 
  Technik Service u. Handel Tiffe, www.tsht.de, Holm Tiffe, 
 Freiberger Straße 42, 09600 Oberschöna, USt-Id: DE253710583
i...@tsht.de Fax +49 3731 74200 Tel +49 3731 74222 Mobil: 0172 8790 741

Re: PDP-11 in russia?

[Peter Corlett via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 02, 2018 at 07:52:44AM -0500, Jay West via cctalk wrote:
> I do have a phone number for them. I am not really familiar with
> international dialing, but it starts:
> +79507. which my google-fu seems to indicate is Slovenia?

+7 950 is a Russian mobile number. It's a non-geographic number like most
mobile numbers outside of the USA, so could be pretty much anywhere in Russia
or one of the other bits of land which are de facto Russia. This also assumes
it's not roaming on another country's network.

But based on something as simple as population density, it's probably going to
be in Moscow or St. Petersburg, or at least in the west of the country
adjoining other European nations.

FS: various books, including some old/classic/vintage

[MG via cctalk]

Anyone interested in the following books? 

   "OpenVMS with Apache, OSU, and WASD: The Nonstop Webserver"
  (Alan Winston, Digital Press, 2003, 454 p.) 

   "Teach Yourself COBOL in 24 Hours" 
  (Thane Hubbell, SAMS, 1999, 477 p., incl. unused and
  unopened CD-ROM) 

   "TRS-80 Assembly Language Programming"
  (William Barden Jr., Radio Shack/Tandy Corp., 1979, 224 p.) 

   "Assembly Language Programming for the TRS-80 Model 16"
  (Dan Keen & Dave Dischert, Tab Books, 1984, 184 p.) 

   "ASP in a Nutshell: A Desktop Quick Reference"
  (A. Keyton Weissinger, O'Reilly, 1999) 


Some other books can be seen here: , also
some other computer and related items here: . 

All is located in the Netherlands.  On Friday they will be thrown
if nobody is interested. 

 - MG 

Re: PDP-11 in russia?

[Jonathan Katz via cctalk]

IIRC +7 is Russian country code. Anything after that is probably a city or
exchange.

On Tue, 2 Oct 2018 at 14:04, Jay West via cctalk 
wrote:

> Sorry, all I got was two sentences, a .ru email address and a +79 phone
> number :)
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Bill
> Gunshannon via cctalk
> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2018 7:56 AM
> To: cctalk@classiccmp.org
> Subject: Re: PDP-11 in russia?
>
>
>
> On 10/02/2018 08:52 AM, Jay West via cctalk wrote:
> > I do have a phone number for them. I am not really familiar with
> international dialing, but it starts:
> >
> > +79507. which my google-fu seems to indicate is Slovenia?
> >
> >
>
> I wouldn't call a Slovenian a Russian to his face.  :-)
>
> It's also a very  long ways from Russia.
>
> bill
>
>
>
> --
-Jon
+44 7792 149029

Re: Computer books and PC parts clearance

[Andrew Luke Nesbit via cctalk]

On 02/10/2018 13:56, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
> > From: Andrew Luke Nesbit ullbeking at andrewnesbit.org 
> 
> > Where are you located?
> 
> Like the listing says, "north side of Boston".

I missed that part.  Also, oops!  I was intending to send my message
off-list to Dave.

I have friends in Somerville so if I am fortunate and Dave lets me have
the Yamaha CDR-100, then I can ask somebody if they will forward it to me.

Andrew
-- 
OpenPGP key: EB28 0338 28B7 19DA DAB0  B193 D21D 996E 883B E5B9

RE: PDP-11 in russia?

[Jay West via cctalk]

Sorry, all I got was two sentences, a .ru email address and a +79 phone number 
:)

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Bill 
Gunshannon via cctalk
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2018 7:56 AM
To: cctalk@classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: PDP-11 in russia?



On 10/02/2018 08:52 AM, Jay West via cctalk wrote:
> I do have a phone number for them. I am not really familiar with 
> international dialing, but it starts:
>
> +79507. which my google-fu seems to indicate is Slovenia?
>
>

I wouldn't call a Slovenian a Russian to his face.  :-)

It's also a very  long ways from Russia.

bill

Re: Computer books and PC parts clearance

[Noel Chiappa via cctalk]

> From: Andrew Luke Nesbit ullbeking at andrewnesbit.org 

> Where are you located?

Like the listing says, "north side of Boston".

Noel

Re: PDP-11 in russia?

[Bill Gunshannon via cctalk]

On 10/02/2018 08:52 AM, Jay West via cctalk wrote:
> I do have a phone number for them. I am not really familiar with 
> international dialing, but it starts:
>
> +79507. which my google-fu seems to indicate is Slovenia?
>
>

I wouldn't call a Slovenian a Russian to his face.  :-)

It's also a very  long ways from Russia.

bill

RE: PDP-11 in russia?

[Jay West via cctalk]

I do have a phone number for them. I am not really familiar with international 
dialing, but it starts:

+79507. which my google-fu seems to indicate is Slovenia?

Maybe someone in the US could do the work if a tech-minded translator was 
available. 

J

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jonathan Katz 
via cctalk
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2018 7:47 AM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: PDP-11 in russia?

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 1:37 PM Jay West via cctalk 
wrote:

> Someone has contacted me about a pdp-11 that controls a "measuring 
> machine dea epsilon".
>

Russia is a pretty big place.  Any idea where? If we have list members in 
Ukraine versus Finland versus Romania it could make a huge difference. Or Japan 
if the machine is in Vladivostok.

Re: PDP-11 in russia?

[Jonathan Katz via cctalk]

On Tue, Oct 2, 2018 at 1:37 PM Jay West via cctalk 
wrote:

> Someone has contacted me about a pdp-11 that controls a "measuring machine
> dea epsilon".
>

Russia is a pretty big place.  Any idea where? If we have list members in
Ukraine versus Finland versus Romania it could make a huge difference. Or
Japan if the machine is in Vladivostok.

PDP-11 in russia?

[Jay West via cctalk]

Someone has contacted me about a pdp-11 that controls a "measuring machine
dea epsilon".

 

It appears that they want to replace the pdp-11 with a "ibm" (I'm guessing a
pc), and then they would give the pdp-11 as a gift.

 

That is all the info I have. Are there any listmembers in Russia who would
be able to take on a project?

 

J

RE: pdp-11/34 extravaganza

[Jay West via cctalk]

This was claimed by the way..

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jay West
via cctalk
Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2018 2:02 PM
To: cctalk@classiccmp.org
Subject: pdp-11/34 extravaganza

I was contacted about an 11/34 system available. It appears to be not just a
system, nor just a system in a rack, but pretty much a full installation and
all the trimmings (printers, terminals, documentation, media, etc.). I am
pretty sure some of the terminals will invoke interest at the very least ;)

 

Note - the person who has it is looking for a sale. No prices have been
discussed, but my impression is they aren't going to let it all go for $50
:) The stuff is located in the Detroit metro area.

 

I am not (nor do I want to be) involved in this transaction in any way. I'm
just passing it on. I would prefer to pass it to someone who has a
demonstrated ability (and resources) for rescues of this size and type of
equipment. All I care about is that the equipment is rescued and by a
responsible party. Do not email me expressing interest in just one or two
items. I will pass it all to one person - if THEY want to part it out *after
the deal* that's fine. I do have a single picture I can forward. If
interested email me directly..

 

Terminals (screen, keyboard, mouse) (1 is custom built)

- Quantity: 2  -Tektronix 4012

- Quantity: 1  -Tektronix 4010

- Quantity: 1  - Custom Built Tektronix

 

Printer Terminal with Monitor (keyboard)

- Quantity: 1 - Digital VT100

- Quatity: 2  - Digital VT105

 

Printer Terminal

- Quantity: 2  - DEC Writer IV

 

PDP 11/34 (edit by jay - I believe there is only one 11/34, not 4. I could
be wrong.)

- Quantity: 1  - 11/34A-DH - 115 Volts / 60Hz

- Quantity: 1  - 1134A-XE - 120 Volts / 60Hz

- Quantity: 1  - 11/34A-YE - 120 Volts / 60Hz

- Quantity: 1  - 11/34A DE - 120 Volts / 60Hz

 

Digital RL01 - Quantity: 2

Digital RL02 - Quantity: 2

 

Digital RX02 - Quantity: 4 - 1 out of the 4 is non-functioning

Digital RX01- Quantity: 2

 

DEC Magnetic Disk Drivers

- Quantity: 23 (possibly more)

Some are RL01K-DC and some are RL02K-DC

One has Fortinet on it

 

IEE Serial Display Quantity: 1

 

Digital M9202  Quantity: 5

Digital M9741  Quantity: 1

Digital M9312  Quantity: 1

Digital M9302  Quantity: 2

Digital M7850  Quantity: 2

Digital M9301  Quantity: 2

 

Digital QSC H322 Quantity 1, possibly 2

 

Various Spare Parts

-Printing Paper

-Original Printing Ink

-INMAC Air Filters

-RX02 Replacement Fan

-Extra Cable for PDP 11/34

-Moss Memory for PDP 11/34

-Spare Power Supplies

-3 cases of documentation for the different components and programs

 

Half Rack with Built In Power Supply Digital 872-A Quantity: 1

Full Rack, Chasf CD3001-99-0141  Quantity: 1

 

 

 

 

 

 

Re: Computer books and PC parts clearance

[Andrew Luke Nesbit via cctalk]

Dear Dave,

Thank you for offering these.  I'm in the UK and I need check a few
things before I pay for international postage.  Where are you located?

On 02/10/2018 05:18, Dave Mitton via cctech wrote:

> But I have added more stuff to the list, including some misc hardware bits.
> The current list is on http://dave.mitton.com/computer_clearance.html

I am interested in the following:

"Yamaha CDR-100 CD standalone drive SCSI interface (with caddy tray)"

What condition is this in.  Do you think it has much longevity left?

I am a music and audio engineer, a musician, and I studied CD formats in
great detail.  A excellent quality CD-R drive with a SCSI inteface was a
great way to learn about the technology.  At the time I was using a Plextor.

How much would packaging and postage be please?

Kind regards,

Andrew
-- 
OpenPGP key: EB28 0338 28B7 19DA DAB0  B193 D21D 996E 883B E5B9

Re: Source code listings from REDAC PDP-based PCB layout system.

[CuriousMarc via cctalk]

I have a version of the Racal Redac CAD system for the HP 2647 or 2648 graphic 
terminal I believe. Several DC 100 tapes and one or two boards full of custom 
ROMs... No documentation. I have not tried to do anything with it yet.
Marc



On Oct 1, 2018, at 4:42 PM, Paul Koning via cctalk  
wrote:



> On Oct 1, 2018, at 6:17 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> I'm interested.
> PDP-15 software in any form is pretty rare
> 
>> On 10/1/18 7:33 AM, Mattis Lind via cctalk wrote:
>> I have a set of around 5 to 8 binders with printed source code listings
>> from a PDP-15 system. The listings appear to be from a REDAC SOFTWARE
>> LIMITED PCB CAD system. The name of the software seems to be REDAL 3 MARK
>> 7. There are dates on the listings in the range 74 and 75.

I wonder if that's what DEC used internally?  I remember some PDP15 systems 
around Merrimack NH that I was told were used for that.  They had big displays, 
VS60 tubes or similar.

   paul