Re: PC Fortran (Was: Microsoft open sources GWBASIC
Had to fire up BasiliskII to find out what kind of Fortran I used on Mac in 1988. Turned out it was Absoft Fortran 2.4 and seemed a bit strange as I recall M$ was written on floppies that I got for it. Did a bit of digging on internet today and, surprisingly, Absoft still exists and continues to produce Fortran compilers. What I had in 1988 was a Fortran 77 implementation. Liked the Absoft Fortran, but it definitely wasn't PDP-11 Fortran. Had no trouble porting my old code which primarily did graphics on a printer (also wrote a huge amount of code to use an HP plotter a few years before but didn't have one around then). Looked at some of the Fortran code to create windows, scroll bars and other controls and decided that QuickBasic was easier. Main thing I used Absoft Fortran for was to learn 68000 assembler as could get it to dump out assembler for each statement. Main failing of Absoft Fortan on Mac was that one had to write ones own graphics routines as well as deal with the idiosyncracies of Mac files with data and resource forks. There was a TOOLBOX command but remember doing anything required sitting down with Inside Macintosh books to debug errors. There was a debugger in later versions but at that point had switched to VB for when I needed to quickly create windows and controls. Main failing of Absoft Fortan on Mac was that one had to write ones own graphics routines as well as deal with the idiosyncracies of Mac files with data and resource forks. There was a TOOLBOX command but remember doing anything required sitting down with Inside Macintosh books to debug errors. Also weird that M$ licensed Mac Fortran from Absoft. Looked at Absoft's latest versions of Fortran and whole development system weighs in at 400+ Mb whereas the version I had was about 400 Kb. Boris Gimbarzevsky Exactly. Microsoft Fortran for the PC, written in Pascal, was not related to Microsoft FORTRAN-80 for CP/M, which was written in 8080 assembly. Microsoft Fortran for the PC was not related to Microsoft FORTRAN-80 for TRS80, which was a derivative of Microsoft FORTRAN-80 for CP/M, which was written in 8080 assembly. Because the TRS80 was Z80, I would not be surprised if some of the TRS80 specific code in Microsoft FORTRAN-80 for TRS80 might have used some Z80. Microsoft Fortran for the PC was written in Pascal. It was an unrelated product. I don't think that any of the Microsoft Fortran products were related to the Intel FORTRAN-80. Did Microsoft ever develop anything in PL/M? Did Microsoft ever develop anything for ISIS-II?
Re: history is hard
sön 2020-05-31 klockan 10:04 -0500 skrev Jon Elson via cctalk: > On 05/31/2020 02:06 AM, jim stephens via cctalk wrote: > > > > On 5/30/2020 11:15 PM, Eric Smith via cctalk wrote: > > > On 05/29/2020 02:38 PM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote: > > > > > > > > Low-level machines did not even have storage protection > > > > keys, and on the /40 and /50 (I think) it was an option, > > > > although I'd guess almost any /50 had it installed. > > Our /50 had it and I have never seen any indication in the > > documentation for the hardware that > > indicated that it was an option. > > > > I don't think that either MVT or MFT would have been very > > stable without it. I certainly spent a lot of time > > studying how to get around it, and am responsible for a > > couple of SPIE patches in the MVT product > > from exploits trying to get into supervisor mode to muck > > with such. > > > Yes, the SPIE call as supplied from IBM was surely the > security hole big enough for 5 ocean liners abreast to steam > right through! Everybody had to patch that, and the patch > was fairly simple. But, it was a clear indication of how > LITTLE IBM thought about security. Of course, they were > thinking about banks where 3 teams reviewed code before it > ever ran on the machine, not universities where kids would > try all sorts of mischief. > > Yes, I know supervisor state isn't tied to the storage > > keys, but that was the way I went to > > try to circumvent the storage keys. > Oh, once you have the P bit set to zero, you can do > anything, such as changing the storage protection key of > your own program. > > Jon I have a school memory of something like that: my school had a PRIME 9955 with PRIMOS 19, well that system had a hole in the handling of serial lines with modems. One municipality employee was logged in from home/work and went home (basically pulled the plug on the pc and went home.) My friend dialed in and got into the employees login session I have a memory of the responsible system admin when he speaks with PRIME in Stockholm, well it wasn't the first time this happened...
Re: Microsoft open sources GWBASIC
On Mon, 1 Jun 2020 at 01:57, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: > > A Tesla is a rather expensive electric car, a product of Elon Musk. > STARTING (minimal stripped down) at 40,000 pounds, and some models over > 80,000 pounds. > > Sell one of THOSE, and you can buy a car AND a lot of great computer > stuff. Although some early Apples could go for ten times that. Again, international perspective. They aren't _that_ expensive by European standards. A petrol-engined car of comparable performance means a supercar costing 5-10x more, and with far less seats, comfort, luggage capacity, etc. Bear in mind our ICE (internal combustion engine) cars are circa 1000cc for a budget/economy car, ~1500cc for a normal family car and 2000cc for a performance car. A friend of mine in Kansas City MO bought his first car, something small cheap and basic, and it was 2750cc or something -- more than anyone I knew in Britain just about _ever_ owned, except for the 1 guy I knew rich enough to by a Lamborghini. Insane. The running costs alone mean nobody here would drive something like that. (I have no idea about US car prices. I do know about US motorcycle prices, or historical ones: very very cheap. In the 1980s & 1990s, I knew of people who funded motorcycling holidays in the USA by flying over there, buying a used Harley, riding it across the country, crating it up and freighting it back to the UK, then selling it. The profit paid for the entire trip: flights, all food, drink, accommodation, fuel etc., plus the cost of international shipping of a motorcycle.) Factor in that, as I recently pointed out, fuel is 3-4x more expensive here than there, electric cars are more appealing for us. The price savings of not needing fuel or engine maintenance for an electric car make it quite affordable if you do a lot of distance. But what personally interested _me_ is that electric cars engage my geek interest. They are rolling computers. I like motorbikes and like most men I admire sports cars, but I can't afford a sportscar and after a bad motorbike crash, I am too broken to really ride any more. Sensible ICE cars I could afford do not interest me at all. But electric cars do. I don't know why. And to my great surprise, at 52, I have a baby daughter. A car would be useful. A motorbike wouldn't. -- Liam Proven – Profile: https://about.me/liamproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk – gMail/gTalk/gHangouts: lpro...@gmail.com Twitter/Facebook/LinkedIn/Flickr: lproven – Skype: liamproven UK: +44 7939-087884 – ČR (+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal): +420 702 829 053
Re: Anyone know what an AM000076 (Dip 18) is?
27S29 Abstract: AM27S28 Am27S28/27S29 Text: Am27S28/ 27S29 4,096-Bit (5 1 2 x 8 ) Bipolar PROM Am27S28/ 27S29 DISTINCTIVE CHARACTERISTICS · · · High Speed Highly reliable, ultra-fast programming Platinum-Silicide fuses High programming yield · · · Low-current PNP inputs High-current open-collector and three-state outputs Fast chip select GENERAL DESCRIPTION The Am27S28/29 (512-words by 8-bits) is a Schottky TTL Programmable Read-Only Memory (PROM). This device is available in both open collector (Am27S28) and three-state (Am27S29) output On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 7:35 PM Ian Finder via cctalk wrote: > > Title says all, > > Backing up all the programmable parts in the Apollo DN100 and the CPU board > has a few of these ceramic DIPs with the same Apollo P/N labels as the > Am27S29 and similar programmable parts. > > > Thanks
DtCYBER and/or CYBIS Resources
Classic Computer Fans, I tried out the CYBIS release: http://www.Control-Data.info/CybisRelease.html on the DtCYBER emulator when it first came out. I've since forgotten most of what I'd learned. Recently I fired CYBIS back up and started relearning. Does anyone know if any user mailing lists for the DtCYBER emulator and/or the CYBIS release? At the moment I'm trying to find a Linux friendly terminal type that works with NOS's FSE. -- Kevin http://www.RawFedDogs.net http://www.Lassie.xyz http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org Bruceville, TX What's the definition of a legacy system? One that works! Errare humanum est, ignoscere caninum.
Re: Anyone know what an AM000076 (Dip 18) is?
Thanks Bob- this is alongside the 27S29 parts- which are labeled as such, but this question is about a part labeled AM76 (different than the 27S29 which are clearly labeled). Are you saying they're identical? On Mon, Jun 1, 2020 at 11:34 AM Bob Smith wrote: > 27S29 > > Abstract: AM27S28 Am27S28/27S29 > Text: Am27S28/ 27S29 4,096-Bit (5 1 2 x 8 ) Bipolar PROM Am27S28/ > 27S29 DISTINCTIVE CHARACTERISTICS · · · High Speed Highly reliable, > ultra-fast programming Platinum-Silicide fuses High programming yield > · · · Low-current PNP inputs High-current open-collector and > three-state outputs Fast chip select GENERAL DESCRIPTION The > Am27S28/29 (512-words by 8-bits) is a Schottky TTL Programmable > Read-Only Memory (PROM). This device is available in both open > collector (Am27S28) and three-state (Am27S29) output > > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 7:35 PM Ian Finder via cctalk > wrote: > > > > Title says all, > > > > Backing up all the programmable parts in the Apollo DN100 and the CPU > board > > has a few of these ceramic DIPs with the same Apollo P/N labels as the > > Am27S29 and similar programmable parts. > > > > > > Thanks >
Re: Anyone know what an AM000076 (Dip 18) is?
If it's only got 18 pins (per the subject line) then I don't think it can be a 27S29. Based on the label my guess would have been a PAL/GAL of some kind, but I can't immediately think of any standard parts that would have had less than 20 pins there either... p. On Mon, Jun 01, 2020 at 02:55:03PM -0700, Ian Finder via cctalk wrote: > Thanks Bob- this is alongside the 27S29 parts- which are labeled as such, > but this question is about a part labeled AM76 (different than the > 27S29 which are clearly labeled). > Are you saying they're identical? > > On Mon, Jun 1, 2020 at 11:34 AM Bob Smith wrote: > > > 27S29 > > > > Abstract: AM27S28 Am27S28/27S29 > > Text: Am27S28/ 27S29 4,096-Bit (5 1 2 x 8 ) Bipolar PROM Am27S28/ > > 27S29 DISTINCTIVE CHARACTERISTICS · · · High Speed Highly reliable, > > ultra-fast programming Platinum-Silicide fuses High programming yield > > · · · Low-current PNP inputs High-current open-collector and > > three-state outputs Fast chip select GENERAL DESCRIPTION The > > Am27S28/29 (512-words by 8-bits) is a Schottky TTL Programmable > > Read-Only Memory (PROM). This device is available in both open > > collector (Am27S28) and three-state (Am27S29) output > > > > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 7:35 PM Ian Finder via cctalk > > wrote: > > > > > > Title says all, > > > > > > Backing up all the programmable parts in the Apollo DN100 and the CPU > > board > > > has a few of these ceramic DIPs with the same Apollo P/N labels as the > > > Am27S29 and similar programmable parts. > > > > > > > > > Thanks > >
ESDI terminator values
Working on restoring this 11/83, I would like to replace the Fujitsu 2284E drive with a slightly larger capacity CDC/Imprimis WREN VI 94246-383 ESDI. I think I have the jumper configurations, however the problem is the disk does not have a terminator pack. Does anyone know what kind of resistor pack was used for the CDC drives? It's probably something very basic and easy to find at Digikey but what? Thanks! Chris (working away here)
Re: ESDI terminator values
ESDI used by CDC uses 150 ohms to +Vcc as termination on the control cable. Signal cables are radial, so they always have termination. See: http://bitsavers.org/pdf/cdc/discs/wren/77738212D_94166_Wren_III_ESDI_Product_Specification_Aug87.pdf PDF Page 37 Also, generally, the CDC ESDI spec is here: http://bitsavers.org/pdf/cdc/discs/wren/77738076D2_CDC_ESDI_Specification_Nov84.pdf --Chuck On 6/1/20 8:09 PM, Chris Zach via cctalk wrote: > Working on restoring this 11/83, I would like to replace the Fujitsu > 2284E drive with a slightly larger capacity CDC/Imprimis WREN VI > 94246-383 ESDI. I think I have the jumper configurations, however the > problem is the disk does not have a terminator pack. > > Does anyone know what kind of resistor pack was used for the CDC drives? > It's probably something very basic and easy to find at Digikey but what? > > Thanks! > Chris > (working away here)
Re: Microsoft open sources GWBASIC
On Mon, 1 Jun 2020 at 00:14, Eric Korpela via cctalk
wrote:
> C
> C CHANGE THE VALUE OF 4
> C
>
> CALL INC(4)
> WRITE (*, 30) 4
> 30FORMAT ('2+2=',I4)
> END
>
> SUBROUTINE INC(I)
> I = I + 1
> END
>
> OUTPUT
> 2+2= 5
I had no idea, and I wrote a lot of FORTRAN for a few years. I just
tested the above with the Fortran-77 compiler for my ND-100 mini, and
yes, it prints 2+2= 5
