[cctalk] Re: Z80 vs other microprocessors of the time.
> The Z80 is dead; long live the Z80. They said that about the UX-201A...and every year hundreds or thousands of new ones show up. -- Will
[cctalk] Re: Drum memory on pdp11's? Wikipedia thinks so....
> I'll bet the source was talking about large contemporary storage units that > looked like drums or may have been called "drums" but were not actual 50's > drum memory with tubes and such. There was no rotating drum storage, the > media rotates in the PDP era. > > Take a look at any pdp 11 peripheral handbook, there would be drum memory > there if it was an official product. Key words being "official product". Digital CSS department - Computer Special Systems, where all that weird stuff that was DEC engineered and built came from. Call it "low run semi custom". -- Will
[cctalk] Re: Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?
Ed has had his chance at kindness. He blew it LONG ago. -- Will On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 9:46 AM Eric Moore via cctalk wrote: > > Sellam, that was unneccassarily cruel. Please try and exhibit some empathy > if not kindness. > > -Eric > > > > > On Tue, Apr 16, 2024, 8:39 AM Sellam Abraham via cctalk < > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > > Ed, > > > > From now on, when posting to this mailing list, can you please construct > > complete sentences that actually express ideas and concepts to which an > > ordinary human can respond? > > > > Sellam > > > > On Tue, Apr 16, 2024, 4:59 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk > > wrote: > > > > > I bought mine 30 years ago at garage sake. For 50 cents > > > > > > Sent from AOL on Android > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 4:38 AM, Adrian Godwin > > > wrote: 901B is the first pocket calculator I remember - I don't know if > > > there were earlier ones. I don't think they're exactly rare but later > > ones > > > such as MX10 are certainly easier to find. They're often in the same case > > > as a 901B but with slightly enhanced functionality such as 10 digits. % > > key > > > etc. > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 12:31 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk < > > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > > > > > Yes. Cell phone horrible typing > > > The Consumer Electronics Hall of Fame: Bowmar 901B > > > Ok can not find b pricevonly c and d > > > > > > Sent from AOL on Android > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 3:41 AM, Will Cooke via cctalk< > > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: I think he means Bowmar > > > > > https://spectrum.ieee.org/the-consumer-electronics-hall-of-fame-bowmar-901b > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 04/16/2024 5:34 AM CDT ED SHARPE via cctalk > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > No bomar brand > > > > > > > > Sent from AOL on Android > > > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM, Wayne S > > > wrote: Bomar as in the Bomber Aircraft? > > > > > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > > > > > > On Apr 15, 2024, at 19:04, ED SHARPE via cctalk < > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it > > seems?s,? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from AOL on Android > > > > > > Grownups never understand anything by themselves and it is tiresome for > > > children to be always and forever explaining things to them, > > > > > > Antoine de Saint-Exupery in The Little Prince > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
[cctalk] Re: Two IBM 360's available in the UK
Oops, not meant to go to everyone... -- Will On Sat, Mar 16, 2024 at 2:13 PM William Donzelli wrote: > > Well...just as I am typing up an email to you... > > Anyway, I hope these get saved - it is quite a score. I wish I could > take it, but I can not. > > But I could take part of it, the System/370 model 125. It would be > nice to bring it back to the US, assuming it was US built. > > Lets keep a channel open about this. > > -- > Will > > On Sat, Mar 16, 2024 at 2:05 PM Adam Bradley via cctalk > wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > Some of you may remember that I (Adam) and another chap (Chris) rescued two > > IBM 360/20 systems out of an abandoned building in Nuremberg back in 2019 > > and brought them to the UK (our blog is here: https://www.ibm360.co.uk/). > > > > We have since basically found ourselves unable to effectively progress the > > project due to personal & professional commitments. For various reasons > > (explained in our latest blog post) we are testing the waters for making > > the machines available to the right sort of people. > > > > We are therefore inviting proposals or offers focused around one of the > > following core ideas: > > > >1. A museum or preservation organisation takes the machines on permanent > >loan or possibly as a donation depending upon exactly what the terms look > >like > >2. A private entity takes the machines on loan for display for a fix > >period > >3. A foreign museum takes the machines, with negotiation around coverage > >of our costs > >4. A private collector purchases the machines from us for a sum to be > >negotiated at the time > > > > If you have an alternate proposal we would also be open to hearing it. > > > > We have three main systems in the collection, as detailed below: > > > > *Red IBM 360 Model 20 System* > > > > 1 x IBM 360 Model 20 CPU in Red > > > > 1x 2203 System Printer > > > > 2x 2311 Disk Drives > > > > 1x 2152 System Console (possibly the last remaining example of this in the > > world, though in poor condition) > > > > 1x 2560 Punched Card Reader/Punch/Sorter > > > > 1x 2501 Punched Card Reader > > > > 2x 2415 II Tape Drives (One master, one slave) (Possibly only remaining > > examples of this model globally) > > > > 25x IBM Disc Packs > > > > *Blue IBM 360 Model 20 System* > > > > 1 x IBM 360 Model 20 CPU in Blue > > > > 1x 2501 Punched Card Reader > > > > 1x 1403 Printer > > > > *System 370/125* > > > > 1x 370/125 CPU – Unknown condition > > > > 1x 3504 Punched card reader (incomplete) > > > > *Miscellaneous* > > > > 1x 029 Card Punch > > > > 1x 5471 System Console > > > > Assorted other spares and unknown/incomplete components > > > > Around 12 full boxes of brand new IBM punched cards > > > > --- > > > > In an ideal world we would like to see everything go together, but we > > understand that this is an enormous amount of kit and that might not be > > possible. We are not willing to split up individual systems, but we are > > willing to split things by the groupings above. For instance if there was > > interest in only the red system due to its complete set of peripherals, we > > would be willing to negotiate on that basis. > > > > It is extremely rare that systems such as this become available, and these > > are two of only a handful of privately held IBM 360’s in the world. > > > > If you have an idea or a proposal, please email me directly at this > > address. Please do NOT email me to suggest I contact X museum unless you > > are a representative of that museum or hold a direct relationship with them > > and know they are interested. > > > > We are genuinely sad that we’ve been unable to work on this project and > > take it where we wanted it to go. We set out with strong intentions, but > > alas, as is often the case life took over and we were unable to push > > forward in the way we wanted to. We hope that someone comes along who will > > be able to keep the systems safe for future generations. > > > > Kind Regards, > > > > Adam Bradley
[cctalk] Re: Two IBM 360's available in the UK
Well...just as I am typing up an email to you... Anyway, I hope these get saved - it is quite a score. I wish I could take it, but I can not. But I could take part of it, the System/370 model 125. It would be nice to bring it back to the US, assuming it was US built. Lets keep a channel open about this. -- Will On Sat, Mar 16, 2024 at 2:05 PM Adam Bradley via cctalk wrote: > > Hi all, > > Some of you may remember that I (Adam) and another chap (Chris) rescued two > IBM 360/20 systems out of an abandoned building in Nuremberg back in 2019 > and brought them to the UK (our blog is here: https://www.ibm360.co.uk/). > > We have since basically found ourselves unable to effectively progress the > project due to personal & professional commitments. For various reasons > (explained in our latest blog post) we are testing the waters for making > the machines available to the right sort of people. > > We are therefore inviting proposals or offers focused around one of the > following core ideas: > >1. A museum or preservation organisation takes the machines on permanent >loan or possibly as a donation depending upon exactly what the terms look >like >2. A private entity takes the machines on loan for display for a fix >period >3. A foreign museum takes the machines, with negotiation around coverage >of our costs >4. A private collector purchases the machines from us for a sum to be >negotiated at the time > > If you have an alternate proposal we would also be open to hearing it. > > We have three main systems in the collection, as detailed below: > > *Red IBM 360 Model 20 System* > > 1 x IBM 360 Model 20 CPU in Red > > 1x 2203 System Printer > > 2x 2311 Disk Drives > > 1x 2152 System Console (possibly the last remaining example of this in the > world, though in poor condition) > > 1x 2560 Punched Card Reader/Punch/Sorter > > 1x 2501 Punched Card Reader > > 2x 2415 II Tape Drives (One master, one slave) (Possibly only remaining > examples of this model globally) > > 25x IBM Disc Packs > > *Blue IBM 360 Model 20 System* > > 1 x IBM 360 Model 20 CPU in Blue > > 1x 2501 Punched Card Reader > > 1x 1403 Printer > > *System 370/125* > > 1x 370/125 CPU – Unknown condition > > 1x 3504 Punched card reader (incomplete) > > *Miscellaneous* > > 1x 029 Card Punch > > 1x 5471 System Console > > Assorted other spares and unknown/incomplete components > > Around 12 full boxes of brand new IBM punched cards > > --- > > In an ideal world we would like to see everything go together, but we > understand that this is an enormous amount of kit and that might not be > possible. We are not willing to split up individual systems, but we are > willing to split things by the groupings above. For instance if there was > interest in only the red system due to its complete set of peripherals, we > would be willing to negotiate on that basis. > > It is extremely rare that systems such as this become available, and these > are two of only a handful of privately held IBM 360’s in the world. > > If you have an idea or a proposal, please email me directly at this > address. Please do NOT email me to suggest I contact X museum unless you > are a representative of that museum or hold a direct relationship with them > and know they are interested. > > We are genuinely sad that we’ve been unable to work on this project and > take it where we wanted it to go. We set out with strong intentions, but > alas, as is often the case life took over and we were unable to push > forward in the way we wanted to. We hope that someone comes along who will > be able to keep the systems safe for future generations. > > Kind Regards, > > Adam Bradley
[cctalk] Re: Announcement of VCFed warehouse closure & improvements
How long do people with tagged items have beyond 1 January 2024 to claim their items? (clarifying, otherwise everyone will tag their items and the problem will not be solved!). -- Will On Tue, Nov 7, 2023 at 9:17 AM Thomas G via cctalk wrote: > > Hello, > > After 18 years of acquiring artifacts, our warehouse is in need of > reorganization, as well as major renovation work - climate control, roof > repairs, etc. A total restructuring, inventorying, and refurbishment of the > warehouse is planned to commence soon - some steps such as the installation > of climate control have already been taken - however, planning this process > is made difficult by the fact that a number of our members have their own > personal belongings stored within, many without proper tagging or > documentation as such. > > On January 1st, 2024, the VCF warehouse at Infoage will be closed for > renovation and organization. During this time, no items will be permitted > in or out of the warehouse bar those permitted *directly* by the VCF > Warehouse manager - Thomas Gilinsky - during monthly repair workshops. > > As such, if you have any personal belongings stored within the warehouse, > and would like to retrieve it, or have it tagged and set aside for you to > collect later, please contact either me at thomas.gilin...@vcfed.org, or > Doug at douglas.crawf...@vcfed.org. Please provide *verifiable* *proof* > that the item you are describing is your possession. > > *ITEMS WHICH ARE NOT CLAIMED BY JANUARY 1ST, 2024 WILL BE ASSUMED TO BE THE > POSSESSIONS OF VCF.* > Donations to VCF will still be accepted during this time - we have other > areas to store them while the warehouse is reorganized. > > Thanks, > Thomas Gilinsky > Vintage Computer Federation Warehouse Manager
[cctalk] Re: VCFMW vendor tables
All the VCFMW info is on the Discord server. -- Will On Wed, Aug 30, 2023 at 10:22 AM Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: > > I know I was a little late in making a reservation for a > vendor table at the VCF MW. > > But, last year they were able to fit me in. Now, I have > made my request, and not heard ANYTHING whatsoever, even > that they are working on it. The VCFMW web site was last > updated in JUNE! Does anybody know what is going on? The > web site has vague warnings that overflow vendors might end > up exhibiting from the trunks of their cars in the parking > lot. Last year the lot was totally filled and people were > parking on the grass behind the building. Chicago weather > can be real changeable in the fall, and it was raining when > we tried to load out our stuff on Sunday afternoon. > > Thanks for any comments on what is really going on! > > Jon >
[cctalk] Re: PDP-8/L $15,000
> I think some Ebay sellers simply overpriced an item when they know it's > probably valuable but they're not sure how much to sell for. They will > wait for people to contact and say, "your price is way too high, you might > sell if you charged $n instead." > > It's not an illogical tactic. Also, it is a GREAT way to generate buzz FOR PENNIES. -- Will
[cctalk] Re: Talking PDP11
The Synclavier I was commercially available in 1977, based off the Dartmouth Digital Synthesizer of earlier times. The core was a New England Digital minicomputer architecture (they did sell just the minicomputer to the military, as a side). The truth is that there were quite a few digital synths in labs in 1977. -- Will On Tue, Jul 11, 2023 at 10:22 AM W2HX via cctalk wrote: > > And by 1979 there was the fairlight... > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairlight_CMI > > > 73 Eugene W2HX > Subscribe to my Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@w2hx/videos > > >Speaking of old computerized music playing technology, there are two from > >the PLATO system at the University of Illinois that are perhaps the earliest > >of all in their category and not all that well known. > > The first of the two is the GSW (Gooch Synthetic Woodwind), which is a four > voice, 7 levels per voice, square wave synthesizer. It's fully documented in > Sherwin's US patent 4,206,675. That one was attached to the auxiliary device > port of a PLATO terminal and driven from the host computer, at 1200 bps. It > worked quite well for playing music and was widely used for music education. > It's a very simple device as you can see from the full schematics (which are, > surprisingly, given in the patent). That patent was filed in 1977 but the > invention is somewhat older, perhaps 1975 or 1976. > > The followon to that is the GCS (Gooch Cybernetic Synthesizer), unfortunately > not well documented. That's a 16 voice programmable waveform (256 words by > 16 bits per voice), more levels (256?), driven as a peripheral off the > 8080-based "programmable PLATO terminal" from a program running in that > terminal. So the musical score level definition of what to play still came > from the host, still at 1200 bps, but the attack/decay etc. shaping would > happen in the terminal. That one was a bit of an electrical muddle, with > memory, logic, and D/A per voice followed by a 16 input combiner. Getting > the analog parts to work right was a hairy task with far too many trimpots. > Sherwin vowed that any followup would be digital all the way to one final > D/A, which of course later became the answer in the PC sound cards, but if he > did that it was after I left. The GCS was built around 1977. There were > some interesting related pieces of work, such as a speed-sensing piano > keyboard (so unlike an electronic organ you could have dynamics, exactly as > on a piano), a music editing system with a score printing program to print on > a dot matric (electrostatic) printer, and some other stuff. > > I'm not sure if the GCS is the earliest fully programmable waveform digital > music synthesizer, but if not it is close. > > paul >
[cctalk] Re: HP2100A available
This has sold! -- Will On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 9:23 AM William Donzelli wrote: > > This is on Discord. > > I have an HP 2100A with a paper tape punch (a HP labelled Facit), tape > punch (HP), and an 7900A disc. The thing is in decent shape - full of > cards. The keyswitch is out of the thing, but I am pretty sure I still > have it. > > Right now, I have me hands on the 2100A and Facit paper tape punch > (with bracket) - can I get $1000 for this combo? When I get my hands > on the reader and 7900A ( I think they are just buried!), we can deal > with them later, as I do not like to sell what my hands are not on. > Located around Kingston NY. > > Oh, I have a 5 foot rack for this thing, still back at the old house. > > -- > Will
[cctalk] HP2100A available
This is on Discord. I have an HP 2100A with a paper tape punch (a HP labelled Facit), tape punch (HP), and an 7900A disc. The thing is in decent shape - full of cards. The keyswitch is out of the thing, but I am pretty sure I still have it. Right now, I have me hands on the 2100A and Facit paper tape punch (with bracket) - can I get $1000 for this combo? When I get my hands on the reader and 7900A ( I think they are just buried!), we can deal with them later, as I do not like to sell what my hands are not on. Located around Kingston NY. Oh, I have a 5 foot rack for this thing, still back at the old house. -- Will
[cctalk] Re: Computer of Thesus (was: Re: Re: Computer Museum uses GreaseWeazle to help exonerate Maryland Man)
Plonk! -- Will On Wed, Feb 1, 2023 at 8:47 AM Chris via cctalk wrote: > > You stop being rude you big burly baby. Get a life. I'm not your hobby, as > hard as you're trying to make me so. > > > On Wednesday, February 1, 2023, 03:37:20 AM EST, Christian Corti via > cctalk wrote: > > On Tue, 31 Jan 2023, skogkatt...@yahoo.com wrote: > > separating the 2. So please stop complaining. Learn to adapt and > > overcome. > > Stop being rude and adapt to the standard! > Quotation is done with a ">" (one for each level) at the beginning of a > line, the indention block is superseded with the author, like this: > > > On Tuesday, January 31, 2023, 06:30:18 AM EST, Liam Proven > > via cctalk wrote: > >> On Wed, 25 Jan 2023 at 08:09, Christian Corti via cctalk > >> wrote: > [...] > > You see? All good mail clients will do this automatically. > > Christian >
[cctalk] Re: Great Vintage Computer Heist of 2012
> Owe the local government a few bucks in unpaid tax? They steal your > house (well, technically not - they put a lien on it and then foreclose). Yes, if you do not pay you taxes (or rent) - you SHOULD lose your land after some amount of time. What I am talking about is Eminent Domain (in the US). The government taking your land for the greater good. People think this is easy for corporations to do, but is not. It takes a lot of time and money, plus tends to be political damaging for the politicians involved. If it was easy, every scumbag land developer would be doing it. -- Will
[cctalk] Re: Great Vintage Computer Heist of 2012
> All you need is a the local government to declare eminent domain and > greater user for the public good. Those would be the "significant barriers to cross". -- Will
[cctalk] Re: Great Vintage Computer Heist of 2012
Don't be pedantic. You know what I mean. Anyway, in the US, there are *significant* barriers to cross for people taking your land. -- Will On Tue, Oct 18, 2022 at 10:15 AM Ethan O'Toole wrote: > > > Own your land. > > Museum or individual. > > You never own your land. They can always take it. > > - Ethan >
[cctalk] Re: Great Vintage Computer Heist of 2012
Own your land. Museum or individual. -- Will On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 7:13 PM Kevin Parker via cctalk wrote: > > I remember that Sellam and I remember visiting your facility on a trip my > wife and I did to the US. It was very impressive collection and that’s an > understatement. > > It’s a shame all that was lost ☹ It served to reinforce my approach to this s > tuff, grab first ask questions later otherwise it becomes landfill. > > Apologies if this is not appropriate for this list but your landlord was a > flog. > > > Kevin Parker > > -Original Message- > From: Sellam Abraham via cctalk > Sent: Monday, 17 October 2022 19:55 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > Cc: Sellam Abraham > Subject: [cctalk] Re: Great Vintage Computer Heist of 2012 > > Long story very short: > > Landlords evicted me from their warehouse where my collection was stored and > wouldn't let me back in. Had to go to court. Regained access and was able > to pull out 20% of the collection before they locked me out again for good. > Then sold the rest to computer recyclers, who proceeded to scatter it to the > wind. > > Sellam > > On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 1:43 AM Ali via cctalk > wrote: > > > You had to ask..I was there 3000 years ago (or about 10 years ago > > in non Tolkien meme terms) and it wasn't pretty > > Original message From: Tom Hunter via cctalk < > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> Date: 10/17/22 1:31 AM (GMT-08:00) To: > > "General > > Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Cc: > > Tom Hunter Subject: [cctalk] Great Vintage > > Computer Heist of 2012 Sellam Abraham referred to a "Great > > VintageComputer Heist of 2012". What was that about? Who stole what and > > where andwhy? >
[cctalk] Re: AMP Punched Card Reader
That is for configuring the initial setup for a gizmo tester (semiconductor, cable, subassembly, etc.). -- Will On Fri, Oct 7, 2022 at 1:39 PM Cory Heisterkamp via cctalk wrote: > > Hey Guys, > > I was curious if anyone recognizes this punched card reader. Marked: AMP > Incorporated - SYSCOM Division. > > It’s extremely well-built; pulling the lever at right moves the chrome lip > forward and ejects the card. Case is rather stylized which suggests it was > free-standing. > > Pics here: http://www.ht4100.com/temp/ > > Thanks, > Cory Heisterkamp
Re: Memory Tech you don't see very often
Prototypes don't count. -- Will On Thu, Jan 6, 2022 at 12:41 PM Chuck Guzis via cctech wrote: > > > Perhaps even rarer were the EBAM tubes that CDC worked with during the > 1970s. I recall seeing a 6' rack of a complete assembly sitting in a > hallway at ADL around 1974. If CDC followed the dictates of management > then, the unit was probably utterly demolsihed before being sold as > scrap metal. > > --Chuck > > >
Re: IBM transistor replacements
139 is a "nickname" number. IBM used these nicknames for some reason, instead of the full IBM part number. A 139 is really an IBM part number 2414938, a silicon device in a TO-18. Gee, it would be great if this list could take pictures so I could just post one with all the specs... -- Will On Sat, Nov 27, 2021 at 5:54 PM Brent Hilpert via cctalk wrote: > > On 2021-Nov-27, at 11:22 AM, Gregory Beat via cctalk wrote: > > > > The Texas Instruments (TI) 139 is likely a 2N139 PNP (BJT) transistor, > > capable of high speed switching (in that era). > > > > The 2N139 was originally an RCA transistor (tall cylinder) found in RCA and > > GE transistor radios (455 kHz IF section). > > The TI versions were low profile metal case, TO-33 case (8.5 to 9.5mm > > diameter) > > > From the JEDEC number, 2N139 would be a 50s-era transistor, way earlier than > the ones at issue. > 2N139 specs are Ge-PNP, 16V/12V CE max, 15mA IC max, 35mW max, which can find > a use in transistor radios, but highly unlikely to be what the OP is looking > for.
Re: The precarious state of classic software and hardware preservation
> > Unless, of course, you have a mainframe shop and figured all this shit > > out back in the 1960s. > > Figuring things out accomplishes very little if what was figured out is not > broadly applied. That is correct. All the talk about this topic or archiving data that starts with "We should" or "What we need to do" means squat, when the old ways work just fine. Those old ways the mainframers used was pretty KISS. When backing up the data, keep three generations of technology going with rolling backups, and do the exact same thing 100 megatons away as a mirror. -- Will
Re: The precarious state of classic software and hardware preservation
> Unfortunately, we're just not doing enough. I don't have an answer, but for > several years I worked for the LOCKSS project at Stanford University. Their > software is open source, and is used to archive online academic journals in a > distributed, fault-tolerant peer to peer network (their primary research was > on how to prevent bitrot and enable automatic format migration, for example). > With some effort, it could be retooled into a general-purpose software > archive, but I don't think anybody has ever seriously proposed doing that. I > only point it out as inspiration for one possible way to do things. > > Until we have a better answer, we're just at the mercy of bitrot, and we have > to accept that. Unless, of course, you have a mainframe shop and figured all this shit out back in the 1960s. -- Will
Re: I-4004
Best, most concise answer of the week. -- Will On Tue, Nov 16, 2021 at 5:20 PM Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > > On 11/16/21 2:08 PM, Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote: > > Did the 4004 chip start our interest in microcomputing? > > no > >
Re: Apple I auction
> That buyer's premium seems crazy steep. It is not. -- Will
Re: Looking for an IBM 3803
> The large 3 phase input on it 3803 is likely overkill for even a controller > and full string of 8 drives. It's easier to oversize things and have a 3x > safety margin, then deal with running close to the limits and risk any > problems from poorly installed site wiring. It is overkill, but a full string can really punish the circuit breaker with enormous current surges. Better to overdo it with a breaker that can handle the spike of all eight 3420s deciding to do some reversing within a few seconds of each other. Even a simple setup with a 3803 and a single 3420 will create large surges that a household circuit may not like much. -- Will
Re: Branching the thread away from Compaq deskpro boards: "What We Have Lost"
> And that like IBM still being able to run S/360 programs Unisys 2200 > can still run Univac 1100 programs. And that MCP and OS2200 put everyone else to shame in the security arena... Because they thought about it back in the 1960s. -- Will
Re: Branching the thread away from Compaq deskpro boards: "What We Have Lost"
> z/OS runs on IBM Mainframes, there is also “IBM i”, which was previously > called OS/400. > > Last I checked, GCOS-8 is still running, but with Itanium end-of-life, I’m > not sure what on. It’s been a niche market for decades. I’d argue that it > was a serious niche when I was using it in the early 90’s. It is amazing how many people - IBMers included - that simply do not realize that Unisys exists, and both MCP and OS2200 are modern, up to date operating systems running on quite a lot of sites in the real world. -- Will
Re: Unidentified IBM Module / Package
I think those are IBM Q-Pacs, mil spec modules for the Informer computers. -- Will On Sun, Aug 1, 2021 at 1:53 AM Cory Heisterkamp via cctalk wrote: > > Does anyone recognize these IBM modules? My gut says late 50’s based on the > transistor packages and font. Perhaps for a contract or military system? > Thanks- Cory > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/izitf1lmjqwcbuo/IBM1.jpg?dl=0 > https://www.dropbox.com/s/dq8macaubrechkz/IBM2.jpg?dl=0
Re: IBM 1620; was: Early Programming Books
> When cleaning out a 3rd party CDC dealer quite a few years back, he > remarked that the CDC machines going way back all the way to the 800s > were fantastically unpicky about how they were cooled. So I just reread what I wrote, and see it is crap. What I meant is that CDC machines going back all the way to the 6000s and 7000s, and UP TO the 800s, were unpicky. Basically, most of the line. Me not poet. -- Will
Re: IBM 1620; was: Early Programming Books
> Of course, nowadays, the old R22 systems are being refilled with > purified propane, called R290. Cheap, with better thermal properties > than R22, but probably not legal when LCM picked up the 6500. When cleaning out a 3rd party CDC dealer quite a few years back, he remarked that the CDC machines going way back all the way to the 800s were fantastically unpicky about how they were cooled. He just used a garden hose connected to the building potable water, and if the machine under test needed more coolant because it was running warm, it just pumped more supply. Heated waste water went down the drain. This unlike the IBM water machines. -- Will
Re: Vintage Computer Museum eBay Sales
Approximately zero people ever thought this guy was a museum. -- Will On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 10:28 AM Chris Zach via cctalk wrote: > > Reason #1 why I am exceptionally loathe to donate things to "museums" > these days... > > CZ > > On 6/17/2021 10:06 AM, Bill Degnan via cctalk wrote: > > > His target market is not the vcf hobbyist. > > > > Many of these were on ebay or wherever, shipped to Long Island and put back > > on ebay for 50%+ more than "wholesale" (orig. seller's price). > > > > I have sold items to this guy via ebay inadvertantly and he has relisted > > mynitems at a much higher price. It might take 6 months to sell at the > > higher price but eventually they sell. I wanted to sell quickly and was > > not willing to wait so my price was competitive. His profit comes from > > patience and apparently cheap storage. He probably re-uses the original > > shipping box which is smart! > > > > > > Personally I think people who scoff at this seller are missing the point > > ... we are mostly a group of educated frugal vc hobbyists and not his > > target market. But if you must have it, he's got it! > > > > Bill > > > > On Thu, Jun 17, 2021, 7:40 AM D. Resor via cctalk > > wrote: > > > >> It seems at least on the first page of their listings, $899.99 is a > >> favorite > >> asking price? > >> > >> > >> https://www.ebay.com/str/vintagecomputermuseumservices?_trksid=p2047675.l256 > >> 3 > >> > >> Don Resor > >> > >> > >> > >>
Re: DEC Computer Lab for sale
> While the mini-banana makes a passable (though expensive) modern > substitute, I believe the originals were hollow crimp-on taper pins, > #42107 or #42279. Really? I have loads of taper pin patch cables. I should try one out. The sockets just loom too big for taper pins. -- Will
Re: DEC Computer Lab for sale
Who's idea was the mini-banana anyway? I do not think it was General Radio. Pomona? I recently came across some dual mini banana adapters (for someone without correct context that would be very confusing) but they have no makers marks. Sort of like GenRad 274 stuff but half sized in every dimension. -- Will -- Will On Sat, May 29, 2021 at 8:41 PM Ethan Dicks wrote: > > On Sat, May 29, 2021 at 10:58 AM William Donzelli via cctalk > wrote: > > Over on the Discord, I have posted a DEC Computer Lab H-500 for sale. > > Needs cosmetic help, but will be priced accordingly. > > I already have one, but it has no wires and a reasonable substitute > has not come to light despite occasional discussions over the past 20 > years. > > But they are really cool. > > -ethan
Re: DEC Computer Lab for sale
The ClassicCMP Discord. -- Will On Sat, May 29, 2021 at 1:54 PM Brent Hilpert via cctalk wrote: > > On 2021-May-29, at 7:58 AM, William Donzelli via cctalk wrote: > > Over on the Discord, I have posted a DEC Computer Lab H-500 for sale. > > Needs cosmetic help, but will be priced accordingly. > > > > Offers? Off list... > > > As I am aware of it Discord is a software package. > > What does "Over on the Discord" mean? > Or, what Discord server?, where? >
DEC Computer Lab for sale
Over on the Discord, I have posted a DEC Computer Lab H-500 for sale. Needs cosmetic help, but will be priced accordingly. Offers? Off list... -- Will
Re: Writings on AI from 17 years ago....
> I believe that enthusiastic and competent individuals will look after > valuable items much better than most museums can. As one who does estate cleanups professionally, I have a wildly different opinion... -- Will
Re: eBay sellers
> So ... you trust us enough to take our money, but you don't trust us. The percentage of crooked and dishonest (and just plain stupid) buyers on Ebay is far too uncomfortable. Ebay buyers generally often liken themselves to gleaming polished white marble pillars of truth and justice in the online market. They are not. Ebay does not provide much protection anymore. Sellers must protect themselves. > How does the intention behind the message alter the veracity of the message? We don't know - it is generally a case by case thing. Sometimes fraud is *really* obvious, like when a buyer sends a correction that is clearly wrong, and literally states that the asking price is too high because of the "mistake". > Do you put any comments on the listing of "this description is best > effort" or "buyer is responsible for accuracy"? Do you think anyone reads Terms of Sale? Seriously? Hell, I get buyers that don't even read the descriptions! > What constitutes "a bunch of research time"? 1 minute? 5 minutes? > More time than it took to publish the listing? Maybe. Some of us are very busy, and need every 10 minute chunk of time. Perhaps the ten minutes taken up doing research is not worth as much as those same ten minutes listing another item. > Is there something that random people submitting corrections can do to > make it easier for you such that you are more likely to accept the > correction and update the listing accordingly? Certainly. Citations. Passing a URL through the Ebay system is trickly, to say the least, but leave an obvious pointer, like "Check this document 123-456-78 in bitsavers, page 26". -- Will
Re: eBay sellers
> And that is why there are SNADs! :D Yes, but remember that the S stands for "Significantly". In Noel's case, yes, We DECnerds would call that a significant difference, but probably not to the general computer techie crowd - they would likely see two almostly completely identical tape readers. The Ebay judge might go either way. SNAD gets abused more than you realize. It is a big problem for sellers. -- Will
Re: eBay sellers
As a very experienced Ebay (and now Etsy!) seller, I can say this... > They sent a nice peply, but didn't alter their listing! We don't trust you buyers. Sellers of collectibles and antiques get bombarded with nitpicks and corrections. Often these are right, but often they are wrong. And sometimes it is very clearly intended to lessen the value of the thing being sold. So unless it is something that can easily and quickly be researched and confirmed - we sellers will mostly just let things fly, and let the buyers figure it out. That being said, if I was the seller of this item and you, Noel, sent me a comment like this, I would think "Oh, it's Noel, he knows his stuff. I will deal with this". But if someone I do not know did the same, I would maybe send a thank you note, think about it for a minute or so to see if investing a bunch of research time is worth it, and likely do nothing. Let the buyers figure it out. -- Will
Re: FIRE SALE!
How long do you think those poor machines cooked? I bet far, far longer than the soldering temperature spec. likes. -- Will On Sun, Oct 11, 2020 at 10:06 PM dwight via cctalk wrote: > > Most components can stand soldering temperatures. It is clear that it was > only hot enough to melt plastics. That isn't even hot enough to damage > boards. It is wasn't powered at the same time, it is unlikely to have been > harmed. I've seen cases where there were flames in the board area and parts > were not damaged. These were mostly wrapped in their cases. Melted plastics > most likely protected the boards from dangerous temperatures. > Dwight > > > From: cctalk on behalf of jim stephens via > cctalk > Sent: Sunday, October 11, 2020 6:49 PM > To: William Donzelli via cctalk > Subject: Re: FIRE SALE! > > > > On 10/11/2020 6:34 PM, William Donzelli via cctalk wrote: > >> I suspect much of the electronics is fine. It would be good for someone > >> wanting backup cards. > > You must be joking. Those cards are done. Any chip that is still > > operational will likely fail upon or shortly after power is applied. > > > > -- > > Will > > > I agree. Especially the ones heated high enough for the melted plastic > or scorch damage. A radiative and convective heat soak is pretty damaging. > > Consider the flow temperature of the materials inside. Unless the fire > was flash fire, the entire thing would have been heated for some amount > of time (15 minutes minimum usually, to 45 minutes) due to response time > of the equipment. > > Not evident in the photos would be possible contamination from either > fire suppressant materials or water to extinguish the blaze. > > Like I said, Ethan is looking for a cabinet for an 11/70 stripped out of > such, and these probably are okay for that. Maybe some of the other > bits after inspectiong, but I'd not trust the boards up front. It would > be a project I'd want a solid shop of parts to do testing for every > board involved to certify they work. > > Most people I know have one system in their basement, lab or garage, and > I'd personally not want to put boards from a source like this into such, > unless i had nothing to lose. > > thanks > Jim
Re: FIRE SALE!
> I suspect much of the electronics is fine. It would be good for someone > wanting backup cards. You must be joking. Those cards are done. Any chip that is still operational will likely fail upon or shortly after power is applied. -- Will
Re: Datasheet / Info for Motorola SC5330 IC?
The Motorola SC prefix means a custom or semicustom part. Good luck! -- Will On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 4:05 PM Josh Dersch via cctalk wrote: > > I'm in the middle of working out the pinout for the power supply connector > on the MDP-1000. I'm aided somewhat by a set of test points on the > backplane, unfortunately the "+" and "-" symbols (in the solder mask labels > next to the test points) are nearly indiscernible, so I'm trying to verify > that I'm not mixing up + and - 15V. > > On the core memory boards are eight Motorola SC5330 IC's (datecodes from > early 1969), which have pins connected to both the + and - 15V lines -- if > I can find a datasheet I could pretty easily confirm which is which. > Trouble is I can't find anything on this chip. I've scanned through the > databooks on Bitsavers, no luck. Anyone have any ideas? > > Here's a picture in case that helps at all: > https://1drv.ms/u/s!Aqb36sqnCIfMpIVXm5draSrWHGMzJg > > - Josh
Re: PDP-11 based Data Translation system on ebay
> It appears to be a complete Data Translation data acquisition system > including the software! Someone please rescue this! I am not entirely sure if "rescue" is the right word here. The seller seems reasonable and in no hurry. -- Will
Re: IBM vacuum tubes
> Darn. "Worse for noise" probably means I won't find audio nirvana > trying these in any of my amps. Most computer tubes are pretty bad for audio, even though there are plenty of snake oil tube dealers that proclaim them as audio gold. -- Will
Re: IBM vacuum tubes
> > Thanks! What is the secret decoder ring that tells you 188 means GE? EIA manufacturer codes. These were often applied to private and house branded labelled tubes. Other numbers are 274 for RCA, 280 for Raytheon, 158 for DuMont, and so forth. EIA codes were used for non-tube electronic parrots. -- Will
Re: Future of cctalk/cctech
> They take up a lot of space. Well, there is some circa 2005 thinking. -- Will
Re: IBM vacuum tubes
> Ah, good ol' 5965s. > > These were a higher-spec version of ... some really common tube which I > no longer remember. The Bendix G-15 was wholly based on them. 5965 is a computer rated 12AV7 with better balanced cutoff characteristics, but generally worse for noise. About 15 percent of the tubes in a G15 are 6197s, which are computer rated 6CL6s. -- Will
Re: IBM vacuum tubes
They are indeed GEs! 188 is the clue. -- Will On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 11:14 AM Guy N. via cctalk wrote: > > On Tue, 2020-06-16 at 11:04 -0400, William Donzelli wrote: > > > Good question. They have an IBM logo and "Made in USA", along with the > > > part number (5965 or 5963) and a bunch of numbers that might give a hint > > > as to manufacturer. Any suggestions on how to decode them? > > > > What are the numbers? > > > > Details, man! > > Sure! I'd attach a picture, but > > On the top of the tubes are numbers printed in yellow. A couple typical > ones are C392 and C152. > > On the side, the large IBM logo is flanked by groups of numbers, an > example: > > 62-39 64-17 IBM 317261 >188-5 MADE IN U.S.A. > > This is one of the more legible ones. The two pairs of numbers on the > first line at the left appear to vary, the 188-5 and 317261 seem to be > constant; but it's hard to be certain. > > The obvious part number 5965 has some other markings that are > overprinted by the IBM logo and numbers. It looks like it could be: > >5965 > A >U.S.A > .. > .. > > The pattern of dots is hard to make out because of "IBM" on top of it. > > The structure inside is a "long-plate" type, with three horizontal ribs. > I haven't had a chance to compare the structure to any of the many old > dual-triode, medium-mu tubes in my assortment. There might be some > clues. It wouldn't surprise me if these were a fairly standard design > with some changes to the cathode to withstand being held in cutoff for > long periods of time. >
Re: IBM vacuum tubes
GE did not make many tubes for IBM except for some made for SAGE devices. -- Will On Tue, Jun 16, 2020 at 11:38 AM Camiel Vanderhoeven via cctalk wrote: > > Mosyt likely GE. > > "IBM did the final assembly, but more than 400 companies supplied parts and > subassemblies for its computers, including GE for vacuum tubes and 3M for > magnetic tapes.” > (https://www.computerhistory.org/revolution/early-computer-companies/5/111) > > > On Jun 16, 2020, at 4:58 PM, Guy N. via cctalk > > wrote: > > > > On Mon, 2020-06-15 at 10:24 -0400, William Donzelli wrote: > >>> While going through my assortment of old vacuum tubes looking for audio > >>> treasures, I found a handful of IBM branded ones. Mostly 5965, but > >>> there's one 5963 mixed in. > >> > >> Who made them? > > > > Good question. They have an IBM logo and "Made in USA", along with the > > part number (5965 or 5963) and a bunch of numbers that might give a hint > > as to manufacturer. Any suggestions on how to decode them? > > > > These came to me from my father, who worked in the Vacuum Tubes > > department at GE for a while when I was growing up, so there's a good > > chance the OEM was GE. >
Re: IBM vacuum tubes
> Good question. They have an IBM logo and "Made in USA", along with the > part number (5965 or 5963) and a bunch of numbers that might give a hint > as to manufacturer. Any suggestions on how to decode them? What are the numbers? Details, man! -- Will
Re: IBM vacuum tubes
> While going through my assortment of old vacuum tubes looking for audio > treasures, I found a handful of IBM branded ones. Mostly 5965, but > there's one 5963 mixed in. Who made them? -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> You know, in general I don't disagree with this statement, but I'll go on > record here and say that in my 5 years at LCM, I don't recall a single keycap > going missing, or anything getting stolen. Good fortune, maybe! On another ship I sometime volunteer on (DE-766 SLATER), someone stole a piece of silverware from the officer's ward room (the dining room, basically)., Yes, just a knife or fork or whatever... but gone forever. -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> This is one of the things that disappointed me most about the Computer > History Museum in Mountain View, CA. Sure you can’t let the public interact > with *everything*, but since so much of computing since its inception has > been about interaction with active systems, just displaying them is leaving > out a large amount of what really makes them interesting. The CHM does a lot > of great preservation, archival, and curatorial work, but this really feels > like a glaring omission. The problem is that the public wrecks stuff. Big time. And they steal stuff. Just for the thrill. Even just the stupidest little thing, like a keycap. A long time ago, I volunteered on BB-59 (battleship MASSACHUSETTS), and dealt with the radars. I was warned about people stealing stuff. One night I was in the ET shack (radar technician compartment) - a small room maybe 15 by 5 feet. Normally locked with a USN padlock, I was at the bench with a radar scope, door unlocked so visitors could come in and ask questions. I left the padlock open and hanging from the latch. Yup, some kid stile the lock. So yes, every museum must weigh public interaction against artifact damage, and what is the mission of the museum. CHM is more conservative, LCM more liberal*. I think it is good to have both sides. -- Will * 100 percent not political, but in the more classic sense. If you bring this up politically, I will shit down your throat.
Re: Living Computer Museum
> Do tell. "Normal" museums do not assign values to artifacts, and are very much against (for the most part) buying artifacts directly, as doing so basically assigns numeric values. This is to discourage "pot hunting", named so after the looters of antiquities. Art museums generally do not have issues with the money involved. They have no problems bending the rules. -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> Loans are standard practice in art museums, from other museums as well as > from private collections. Perhaps not so much in science/technology museums. Art museums work under a different set of rules and ethics than other museums. -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> Much of the effort of running a thrift store is disposal of > donated material that has no rapid resale value. And cost. Dumpsters ain't cheap. -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> If you want something nice, I can send you a few pallets of broken LCDs. > They're all really rare - I've never seen ones with the same serial number > on them. > > Don't worry, I won't ask first. ;-) You pay for shipping, and I'll take them! -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> Why would I do that? I had something people said was rare. Museums with a lot of "gravity" (like LCM) tend to get offered a *lot* of REALLY RARE items, like broken C64s, Packard Bell desktops, boxes of ten year old games on CD-ROM, dirty USB keyboards, 56K Sportsters, and so forth. Yeah, super rare stuff like that. This is why museums ask that donors check before dropping off a load a REALLY RARE items at the museum. A simple email is all it takes. -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> I once sent them some rather rare documentation (at the suggestion of > other collectors). I got back a letter with a nasty tone stating they > do not accept unsolicited items. I have no idea what that meant as to > the continued existence of the item. It certainly did not come back > to me. Why did you not ask them first? -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> Anytime somebody with $20B dies it will take years to sort out the estate > because of taxes and people lining up for money due (legit or not). Yes, for people that had no "exit strategy", but somehow I think Paul Allen did some sort of estate planning before he passed... -- Will
Re: Living Computer Museum
> They've been closed to visitors since early March I think. A lot of smaller museums are going into hibernation. Most are confident they will reopen sometime in the future, but well past the points that they are allowed to by government order. It is unfortunate for the paid staff. -- Will
Re: Microsoft open sources GWBASIC
> FOlks know about IBM, > but most don't know they still make mainframes and midrange (OS400 or > whatever it is called now) machines, and Burroughs, Funny thing is that even many IBMers I come across do not realize that Unisys is still in the mainframe business, and still actively develops hardware and software for both the A (Univac) and B (Burroughs) lines. They are still very active - far from dead. Maybe the industry could learn a thing or too about security from them. -- Will
Re: LINC-8
> Wow, those were fairly rare back when, and now there may > only be a couple in existence. At least eight I know of. Pretty high survival percentage, actually. -- Will
Re: LINC-8
> Wow: > > https://www.ebay.com/itm/353062352448 > > I've read manuals for these, but I've never even seen a picture of one before. "needs work" That would be an understatement. ...and be careful with this deal... -- Will
Re: Unusual Punched Cards
> I am desperately looking for two types I do not have been able to find a > sample of: > * Jacquard fabric/carpet loom cards. OK, not computer but the > ancestor, for completeness of the history. There may be several formats of > these. I donated my Jacquard punch to Techworks in Binghamton NY. I forget what the format is. You might ask them. It is likely I will not be there for a while I did a video (on Youtube). I think it is called "A Most Unusual Card Punch" or something like that. -- Will -- Will
Re: What is this System 360 peripheral/maintenance console?
1800. -- Will On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:40 AM Steve Malikoff via cctalk wrote: > > I was watching this video on highway construction in the 1960's (as you do) > and noticed what appears to be > a System 360 console, that I couldn't place. Presumably it's some peripheral > or CE maintenance panel. I didn't > find it in the Physical Planning Guide (not that that's comprehensive) nor > from perusing google images. > I'm a little curious as to what it is. > It's at 23:13 in https://youtu.be/apWSa6QlrTg?t=1393 > Thanks > > Steve. >
Re: G15 Drum Followup
> > that is really sad > > I hope you sold them to Will > Why sad? Everybody had chance to say more, or ask to buy the whole drum. I never heard back from the guy. Yes, I could have used some heads, as I think I have one or two that are open. The search continues... -- Will
Re: IBM Type 31 Alphabetical Duplicating Keypunch available, Seattle area
How did you end up with that? Anyway, I forwarded your message to see if the Techworks! Binghamton Bunch wants it. -- Will On Mon, Feb 10, 2020 at 6:35 PM Josh Dersch via cctalk wrote: > > (resending as this appears to have gotten eaten last time...) > > Hi all -- > > As the subject line says I've got an IBM Type 31 Alphabetical Duplicating > Keypunch sitting in my basement, in the Seattle area. > > It's in well-loved but decent physical condition and appears to be > completely original. I have not powered it on (still has the original > selenium rectifiers in it, for one thing) but mechanically it seems fine. > No rust or obviously damaged parts, but it's clearly gotten a decent amount > of use since the 1930s. > > It's really cool but it's not really something I'm interested in keeping -- > if any of you are interested or know someone who is interested, please feel > free to make an offer. Due to the size and fragility of the item I don't > want to ship this thing. > > > Pictures are available here: > https://1drv.ms/u/s!Aqb36sqnCIfMo9BhHMhAok3F4cAInQ?e=EhXDPP > > Thanks! > Josh
Re: Unidentified peripheral in Tektronix PDP-11/20 system
> I think it was later they made an electron beam digitizer > storage scope. The scope tube created a fan beam that was > deflected by single-axis deflection plates. The target had > patterns of stripes that decoded the beam into a binary code > that was then recorded in a digital memory. So, the fan > beam of electrons and the target formed the ADC! That family of tubes is called an electron bombardment semiconductor. The target is actually a semiconductor wafer with an array of diodes to sense the position of the deflected swept beam, arranged in a Gray code. I did a video on one of the tubes sometime ago on my Youtube channel "uniservo". -- Will
Re: TU55 / TC01
The description is not showing at all - no text. This is one of those Ebay bugs that has been around for months, but they do not fix. I have reported it several times - you should too. -- Will. On Tue, Jan 7, 2020 at 12:03 PM Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > > I just listed one of my TU55s on eBay > I have a second one available in a rack with a TC01 avalilable for pickup in > Fremont, CA > that I'm accepting offers on. >
Re: Odd vintage computer sellers
> I've noticed prices going up on eBay a LOT, without even including obscene > shipping charges AND sales tax > and people parting out things, including attempting to sell individual disks > of multi-disk sets. I think much of this has to do with changes Ebay made in 2019. The only sellers that can really survive on Ebay now are high volume & low margin, or low volume & high margin. There is no money to be made in the middle with reasonable prices, and many of those sellers that are reasonable have moved elsewhere. The result is a bunch of ultra-cheap Chi-junk, and floods of sellers that want all the money (and more). -- Will
Re: Ordering parts onesie twosie
> I don't weep and moan about something from the past vanishes because of > lack of interest, Is the list not all about interest in obsolete computer technology, and getting these weird old machines going again? > any more than I weep about the unavailability of RTL > flatpacks or variocouplers or UV201s. Variocouplers and UV-201s? Bring them on. The market for those items still exists, and is quite decent. The old timers still know how the surplus market works. > How much of a run do you imagine > that 5V TTL logic will have? It's pretty much incompatible with tiny > cell geometries. Um...again...this list? 7400 logic is still in demand, to a smallish extent, with hobbyists. Like people trying to get PDP-11s and stuff going again. But it really does not matter. I could have a pallet of currentish RPis, and, well, I would end up dying with a pallet of RPis. -- Will
Re: Ordering parts onesie twosie
> You do what you have to using the best available resources. Sadly, > local manufacturers and suppliers are no longer options. And pretty soon, independent surplus dealers will also no longer be an option. Most of them have lots of modern and vintage goodies - the kind of stuff this thread is all about - and will work with buyers if only a few pieces are needed. Most will do custom orders and search for oddball parts. Most will do internet/mail order with reasonable shipping money. They want your business. All you need to do is ask. But, the independent surplus dealers are giving up in legion, simply because you (and I mean you as in nearly everyone on this list) stopped shopping with them. Too inconvenient, apparently. At this point, I do not think it even crosses anyone's mind to try the independent market at all. And then you weep and moan when another goes under... I am no longer marketing modern(ish) electronic components for retail - there is no money there. All that stuff - 1000s of ICs and capacitors and connectors are going out for metal recovery. Yes, it hits home. -- Will
Re: DEC CR11
> Should do; the 'CR11/CM11 system manual' (DEC-11-HCRMA-C-D) mentions it, > although it doesn't provide extensive coverage. > My manual only mentions the M200, but it may be an early edition (before the M600 came out?). -- Will
FS: VAX-11/780 w/ CSPI array processor
Unfortunately I need to sell my VAX - an original 11/780, but with a CSPI array processor hidden in a third matching DECcabinet. This was used to control an xray crystallography machine years ago, so the VAX itself is fairly minimal, but with quite a lot of number crunching horsepower. It has not been powered up in perhaps 15 years, but is in fantastic condition. The only real flaw is that at one point some water dripped on the top, so the blue paint marred in one spot. The easy way to take care of that is to simply replace the sheet metal with a nice one from another standard DEC cabinet. Or stack a few books on top! I have tapes with the CSPI software (does Al need it?). Lots of DECdocs as well. Throw me a number if you are interested. This is not a fire sale, so be reasonable. I will work on getting some pictures. There are no drives with this. I suppose eventually this will go on Ebay - but I really hate Ebay at this point. The only issue is that right now is not the time to move the beast. Snow snow snow, and cleaning the dock is a big job, so shipping might have to wait until spring. -- Will, IBM land in the Hudson Valley
DEC CR11
Can the DEC M8291 CR11/CM11 controller card work with a DEC branded Documation M600 reader as well as the M200? -- Will
Re: CRT faceplates / screen "mold"
> Short of outright replacing the CRT with one of the same type, is that > still accepted practice - or in the years since has someone worked out a > way of applying new sealant across the entire face without getting air > trapped in there, thereby maintaining the structural integrity of the > original? The antique TV guys I know generally let the protective shield float over the CRT with no sealant. Generally they will just support (if even needed) the shield with four dabs of silicone or even just four little bits of double sided foam tape. Those shields really are not needed, except to maintain "the look". Large CRTs have had fantastically strong faces since mid World War 2. Go find a weak ca. 1949 10BP4 (and that is "pre-banding"!) and break it - you will find out just how strong those faces are. -- Will
Re: First Internet message and ...
> And IBM invented the Personal Computer. No. We already established that Steve Jobs did that. Please pay attention. -- Will
Re: First Internet message and ...
> > You mean like how history says Columbus discovered America... > > And Edison invented the incandescent lamp. And Digital invented the minicomputer. ...we are just as guilty... -- Will
Re: "First Internet message" and ...
> Oh goody; when the "intranet" vs. "an internet" vs. "The Internet" discussion > finally gets boring we can argue over the meaning and function of "switches" > vs. "routers" vs. "hubs". If we are lucky, maybe we can start a new holy war along the lines of vi vs. emacs. -- Will
Re: First Internet message and ...
> Does nobody remember AUTODIN? Basically, no. -- Will
Re: First Internet message and ...
> ARPANET wasn't the first large scale data network. I believe SITA HLN > was world-wide by 1969. However it was a mix of switching technologies > from fully automated to manual depending on what part of the world you > were in. Frankfurt was the first SITA node to transition to fully > automatic data routing in 1966. AUTODIN was also worldwide by the late 1960s. While it did not allow interactivity between computers - well, back then that really was not much of a thing - It did allow email and generic file transfer (stack of cards - what a file was back then) between varying computer systems. And then there was a Western Electric system that I forget the name of. I have one of the tape drive racks in my garage (videos of this and my AUTODIN junk eventually).. -- Will
Re: First Internet message and ...
> 2019 - 60 = 1959. Yes, there were a few computers then, and > serial communication over phone lines was possible. > But, "Internet"?? Did they actually use TCP/IP? No, not > invented yet. Like most things, the colors of computer networking history get extremely blurred and runny, like using watercolors on toilet paper. -- Will
Re: Houston Computer Museum Warehouse Liquidation
> I have seen multiple posts over time speculating about flooding in the > warehouse. I would like to assure everyone that the warehouse has never > flooded, and that any posts to the contrary are inaccurate or greatly > exaggerated. The very best way to convince people of the lack of water damage to the warehouse is simply to take a bunch of pictures of the warehouse and post them. Good pictures that show the equipment unobscured, inside and out. Water damage, or the lack of it, will become very apparent. -- Will
Re: 50 yrs. ago today
> comma, ignoring IBM. (correction) -- Will
Re: 50 yrs. ago today
> Funny thing was DECnet was in 1983 the largest world wide network > period. comma, ignoring SNA. -- Will
Re: IBM 1500 [was RE: Vintage Computer Warehouse Liquidation]
> The 1500 I worked with at the University of Texas School of Education was > based > on an 1800 (which is of course the same architecture as the 1130, but in > highboy > industrial cabinetry rather than a desk. Coursewriter II and APL\1500 for the > educational software, FORTRAN II and assembler for background tasks. I think most were 1130 (1131 to be more precise) based, but a few were indeed 1800. Not sure why - maybe larger installations? -- Will
Re: 50 yrs. ago today
> You may want to reword that statement ("first inter-computer
> communication"). The SAGE Direction Center computers were talking to each
> other (cross-tell) in 1958, via Bell 101 modems.
"First" is a dangerous word, isn't it?
--
Will
Re: Vintage Computer Warehouse Liquidation
OK, not the thing I thought it was. -- Will On Mon, Oct 28, 2019 at 11:28 AM Thomas Raguso via cctalk wrote: > > This is a picture of the IBM 4505 display station. > > https://photos.app.goo.gl/iQXPGLS8zdD3JHyF8 > > Thomas Raguso
Re: Vintage Computer Warehouse Liquidation
PICTURES! PICTURES! PICTURES! > I have been unable to find anything about the 4505 display station. Does > anyone know any details about this item? It resembles an IBM 2260, but the > keyboard is not built-in, as in the 2260. I think it may be for an IBM 1500, the educational system based on an 1130. -- Will
Re: plated wire memory
> The 9300 used it, Donzelli says it wasn't very reliable And I do not remember where I heard that. It may have been from a Univac old-timer. -- Will
Re: Able document at VCF Midwest
> Do we know where the docs were before they hit the Free Pile? I took > home a few boxes of Will D's DECdocs, which I can double-check to make > sure yours didn't intermix. Otherwise, stuff flew off the Pile as fast > as it was placed there. This title does not ring a bell with me - I likely would have pulled it. But I think at least one person "donated" some manuals to my pile when I was not looking. -- Will
Re: Mystery chip SCM44506L
> From a friend's estate I have a Motorola 24-pin 0.6" purple ceramic DIP. > > SCM44506L > 7610 B > > Any idea what this can be? Very likely a semi custom or custom memory device, due to the prefix. -- Will
Re: HP vintage boards being sold as scrap
> What, isn't anyone going to speculate on the value of the gold here? :-) Why bother? Everyone's opinion is completely accurate. -- Will
Re: Vintage Computer Warehouse Liquidation
> Keep in mind, this is a Classic Computing list, not all of us have a way to > send Texts. :-) Hopefully you’re monitoring email for replies. There are,of course, no email to text methods out there. None. Zip. -- Will
Re: RL02s not available
> I assume these are the ones you were going to bring out > here a few years ago? Didn't you tell me you lost interest? -- Will
RL02s not available
RLs are spoken for! -- Will
RL02s available
I have a pair of RL02 drives available, and can bring them to VCFmw in about three weeks. Pretty cheap. Untested. Contact me off list. -- Will
Re: IBM PT-2
I think this was a CE tool used with machines with the UC processor. My info is pretty sketchy... -- Will On Wed, Aug 21, 2019 at 11:29 PM Benjamin Huntsman via cctalk wrote: > > Anyone know anything about this?? > > https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vtg-1980-IBM-PT-2-Computer-Hall-Effect-Magnet-Keyboard-w-Program-Test-Manuals/253997593352?hash=item3b236fb308&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&enc=AQAEAAADIKvsXIZtBqdkfsZsMtzFbFsbX3WcW5fmB%2Fx7ZbaZTyexIhK7W9VLgW%2BiANqra5tcLfLUvucq%2FWwy3JSlehkVi0H0TnsZ9x3lnT4M%2FNK0I23zl7BNBUVztS8698RExuOgZcHXO6v7FRUK%2BTMxC2BELPLkgdRvpFWMB9BbXQW1zu7SXs5SoLJrm3aR8m2kIhrt1aHBf3njB7KD9d70jXprDh7LYyoD6BlZOSFKMSelULNCkR06EvKg4bm5Hlj2kT9gzHObAbHnS4Dy725pF6f0MSjGs0nuvyw3P701B8pbREOy%2BFwa7KynI7p%2F%2FDZSd3NLb8aiylmIQvuIxdA2jf9NKjtjNK4OtBGLPK1kCinJtpG3edC%2Bg3zcgF%2BfyYqsWzgdaR5BLc7eWvxDvDJVYrc9GagH52%2BXriCUj815vLusAYJ4MLBZEf4SumlXsAzKamOO1YHDdAY5XcZWlbJj4%2BbUDYGiVYVey5jbU4p6AR07GBD1NZ9VxtZLXu3%2BrEvbDjS062zfupJn1OsyqxjkXo4S94QVavnXzvg%2BlbUU6igkijeh8tFnsqvD9YBuGYX5BkjQbg7rxOMS9orHpRd28wEsc%2BFknJ71Lz6aCnlB4RpAZbiHprxzhMYckTqYLMAMhmYF92p5vdMYFd9gFN7jkUHKQPMgwjpZpGHrg3UeEEMrPI%2FlDEtwSC0tQBwpD4phxoid3H8rPCpQ3eavJ7UwJUNfXV5k5unTOHwY%2BxT0TTtCCfqMJXqRNMNJkokBK375vCSohk1GexkbC7vvHsB2jB6fh6sjqYTUk4JuzulLDCGrCvZaKBAW9PF8L4%2F%2BDs1N20TwMxOhigqK0TPCWMRT0CPP5lk%2BiqRoJcY0jxsLoQ%2ByEoxMik5Mf5jqeAbaFw6Sg9lXG45gGwa7JiO3kQ7W6reG3LKEMsC2kmLq8q%2BtL%2FvK9aA0gP9in9SIXNZr%2Bh40fnoMD4rS%2Bpki8If24eqaAsA75pDMYNjIgFr85VGRhiHR3g7ymKQ3%2BHET6pyCnW0pt677L6Ggah3K%2BrNu1BSYjdMm3dfFPTWvNtdFRfaBNIweNSEM&checksum=25399759335250961bc599bf4c1a8a1422d41778b250 > > >
Re: Control Data 9766 drive on epay
It was an uncommon option for lower end Cyber 180s. -- Will On Mon, Aug 12, 2019 at 2:40 PM Alan Perry via cctalk wrote: > > Would this have been connected to a CDC Cyber back in the day? I noticed > that this is in Athens, GA, home of University of Georgia. The first > programs that I ever wrote were on a CDC Cyber there (via a 300-baud > acoustic coupler modem at Valdosta State College). > > alan > > On 8/12/19 11:09 AM, William Donzelli via cctalk wrote: > > There is a Make Offer option, and it does look like the seller does > > take offers fairly regularly. I will not be buying it. > > > > If someone does, I have a huge amount of spares for 976x drives, > > including refurbished heads. It might take a while to find them in my > > mess, however. > > > > -- > > Will > > > > On Mon, Aug 12, 2019 at 1:43 PM P Gebhardt via cctalk > > wrote: > >> > >> Hi list, > >> > >> Just came across this: > >> > >> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Computing-CDC-Magnetic-Peripherals-Control-Data-9766-Storage-Module/143351908424?hash=item2160708848:g:3yEAAOSw1oJdTo9u > >> > >> Haven't seen one listed in years. The price lets me assume that this offer > >> addresses customers that may use these drives in a production environment > >> or so... > >> I am not aware of museums or hobbyists who have such drives currently in a > >> functional state to read and write from and to 80MB (CDC 9762) or 300MB > >> (CDC 9766) disk packs. Maybe the CHM? ... not taking into consideration > >> the CHM activities related to the Xerox disk cartidge (2315-equivalent) > >> software archive project. > >> Anybody out there? Would be interesting to know. > >> > >> Best regards, > >> Pierre > >> > >> - > >> http://www.digitalheritage.de
Re: Control Data 9766 drive on epay
There is a Make Offer option, and it does look like the seller does take offers fairly regularly. I will not be buying it. If someone does, I have a huge amount of spares for 976x drives, including refurbished heads. It might take a while to find them in my mess, however. -- Will On Mon, Aug 12, 2019 at 1:43 PM P Gebhardt via cctalk wrote: > > Hi list, > > Just came across this: > > https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Computing-CDC-Magnetic-Peripherals-Control-Data-9766-Storage-Module/143351908424?hash=item2160708848:g:3yEAAOSw1oJdTo9u > > Haven't seen one listed in years. The price lets me assume that this offer > addresses customers that may use these drives in a production environment or > so... > I am not aware of museums or hobbyists who have such drives currently in a > functional state to read and write from and to 80MB (CDC 9762) or 300MB (CDC > 9766) disk packs. Maybe the CHM? ... not taking into consideration the CHM > activities related to the Xerox disk cartidge (2315-equivalent) software > archive project. > Anybody out there? Would be interesting to know. > > Best regards, > Pierre > > - > http://www.digitalheritage.de
