RE: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
> > > > Paul. > > Yep. I was going through the 5410 parts lists on Bitsavers earlier; it even > lists > different part numbers for the fans, 50Hz vs. 60Hz. > > So it's frequency converter or bust. Anyone got any specific suggestions? > Someone earlier vaguely waved about the name 'Elgar'; any other > suggestions or advice based on experience?? > > Thanks! When wanted to go the other way, and I still need to go the other way for my Documation Card Reader, someone suggested getting a UPS with the appropriate output but with multiple inputs and using that to run the system Dave
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I was reporting on the ferroresonants, and nothing else. -- Will On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 7:33 AM, Paul Berger wrote: > On 2015-12-31 7:17 AM, Mike Ross wrote: >> >> On Jan 1, 2016 12:05 AM, "jwsmobile" wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 12/30/2015 11:45 PM, Mike Ross wrote: Thanks for the thought... my main concern is the System/3s and Henk Stegeman - who has forgotten more than most of us will ever know about S/3! - says that 60Hz S/3 on 50Hz power is a no-go. Different voltage, fine - transformer can be restrapped. Different frequency... trouble! And then there are rotary machines of course. I bet you half my disks drives need the right frequency or a spindle pulley change.. and even then *they* probably have ferroresonants in their power... Mike >>> >>> Order a boatload of 8kw honda generators? I think you could get 40 amps >> >> out of them. Any reason the power has to be in phase? >>> >>> I know for the mainframe power that might not be high enough, but on >> >> smaller machines it would take care of the problem. >>> >>> thanks >>> JIm >> >> Jim most of my 'interesting' machines - both S/3s, S/38, 1800, big disk >> drives - do need three phase 60Hz. The 2741s, 3741, 5496, S/32, S/34, & >> S/36 are single phase but almost certainly need 60Hz for power supplies >> and/or disk drives >> >> On the plus side all of the stuff I brought over from the UK will work >> fine >> - includes pdp-15s, pdp-12s, KL & KS 10, and a bunch of RK05s with 50Hz >> pulleys! They all take 240V 50Hz. >> >> Mike > > All of those IBM machines you listed will have resonant capacitors in the > power supplies, and all have at least one synchronous motor inside, not to > mention all of the AC fans inside the machines. > > Paul.
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Jan 1, 2016 1:34 AM, "Paul Berger" wrote: > > On 2015-12-31 7:17 AM, Mike Ross wrote: >> >> On Jan 1, 2016 12:05 AM, "jwsmobile" wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On 12/30/2015 11:45 PM, Mike Ross wrote: Thanks for the thought... my main concern is the System/3s and Henk Stegeman - who has forgotten more than most of us will ever know about S/3! - says that 60Hz S/3 on 50Hz power is a no-go. Different voltage, fine - transformer can be restrapped. Different frequency... trouble! And then there are rotary machines of course. I bet you half my disks drives need the right frequency or a spindle pulley change.. and even then *they* probably have ferroresonants in their power... Mike >>> >>> Order a boatload of 8kw honda generators? I think you could get 40 amps >> >> out of them. Any reason the power has to be in phase? >>> >>> I know for the mainframe power that might not be high enough, but on >> >> smaller machines it would take care of the problem. >>> >>> thanks >>> JIm >> >> Jim most of my 'interesting' machines - both S/3s, S/38, 1800, big disk >> drives - do need three phase 60Hz. The 2741s, 3741, 5496, S/32, S/34, & >> S/36 are single phase but almost certainly need 60Hz for power supplies >> and/or disk drives >> >> On the plus side all of the stuff I brought over from the UK will work fine >> - includes pdp-15s, pdp-12s, KL & KS 10, and a bunch of RK05s with 50Hz >> pulleys! They all take 240V 50Hz. >> >> Mike > > All of those IBM machines you listed will have resonant capacitors in the power supplies, and all have at least one synchronous motor inside, not to mention all of the AC fans inside the machines. > > Paul. Yep. I was going through the 5410 parts lists on Bitsavers earlier; it even lists different part numbers for the fans, 50Hz vs. 60Hz. So it's frequency converter or bust. Anyone got any specific suggestions? Someone earlier vaguely waved about the name 'Elgar'; any other suggestions or advice based on experience?? Thanks!
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 2015-12-31 7:17 AM, Mike Ross wrote: On Jan 1, 2016 12:05 AM, "jwsmobile" wrote: On 12/30/2015 11:45 PM, Mike Ross wrote: Thanks for the thought... my main concern is the System/3s and Henk Stegeman - who has forgotten more than most of us will ever know about S/3! - says that 60Hz S/3 on 50Hz power is a no-go. Different voltage, fine - transformer can be restrapped. Different frequency... trouble! And then there are rotary machines of course. I bet you half my disks drives need the right frequency or a spindle pulley change.. and even then *they* probably have ferroresonants in their power... Mike Order a boatload of 8kw honda generators? I think you could get 40 amps out of them. Any reason the power has to be in phase? I know for the mainframe power that might not be high enough, but on smaller machines it would take care of the problem. thanks JIm Jim most of my 'interesting' machines - both S/3s, S/38, 1800, big disk drives - do need three phase 60Hz. The 2741s, 3741, 5496, S/32, S/34, & S/36 are single phase but almost certainly need 60Hz for power supplies and/or disk drives On the plus side all of the stuff I brought over from the UK will work fine - includes pdp-15s, pdp-12s, KL & KS 10, and a bunch of RK05s with 50Hz pulleys! They all take 240V 50Hz. Mike All of those IBM machines you listed will have resonant capacitors in the power supplies, and all have at least one synchronous motor inside, not to mention all of the AC fans inside the machines. Paul.
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Jan 1, 2016 12:05 AM, "jwsmobile" wrote: > > > > On 12/30/2015 11:45 PM, Mike Ross wrote: >> >> Thanks for the thought... my main concern is the System/3s and Henk >> Stegeman - who has forgotten more than most of us will ever know about >> S/3! - says that 60Hz S/3 on 50Hz power is a no-go. Different voltage, >> fine - transformer can be restrapped. Different frequency... trouble! >> >> And then there are rotary machines of course. I bet you half my disks >> drives need the right frequency or a spindle pulley change.. and even >> then *they* probably have ferroresonants in their power... >> >> Mike > > Order a boatload of 8kw honda generators? I think you could get 40 amps out of them. Any reason the power has to be in phase? > > I know for the mainframe power that might not be high enough, but on smaller machines it would take care of the problem. > > thanks > JIm Jim most of my 'interesting' machines - both S/3s, S/38, 1800, big disk drives - do need three phase 60Hz. The 2741s, 3741, 5496, S/32, S/34, & S/36 are single phase but almost certainly need 60Hz for power supplies and/or disk drives On the plus side all of the stuff I brought over from the UK will work fine - includes pdp-15s, pdp-12s, KL & KS 10, and a bunch of RK05s with 50Hz pulleys! They all take 240V 50Hz. Mike
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 12/30/2015 11:45 PM, Mike Ross wrote: Thanks for the thought... my main concern is the System/3s and Henk Stegeman - who has forgotten more than most of us will ever know about S/3! - says that 60Hz S/3 on 50Hz power is a no-go. Different voltage, fine - transformer can be restrapped. Different frequency... trouble! And then there are rotary machines of course. I bet you half my disks drives need the right frequency or a spindle pulley change.. and even then *they* probably have ferroresonants in their power... Mike Order a boatload of 8kw honda generators? I think you could get 40 amps out of them. Any reason the power has to be in phase? I know for the mainframe power that might not be high enough, but on smaller machines it would take care of the problem. thanks JIm On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 6:37 PM, William Donzelli wrote: I bet you (or Mike, actually) could get it to work by trial and error, swapping in caps. The transformers (generally) are apparently pretty forgiving - being off in frequency just results in lost efficiency, maybe 10-15 percent lost at most. Not flames, anyway. -- Will On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:30 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: On 12/30/15 9:29 PM, William Donzelli wrote: Of course! Find the exception that proves the rule! ;-) However, it would've been nice if it were only necessary to change the capacitor! TTFN - Guy -- Will On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:23 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: On 12/30/15 9:06 PM, William Donzelli wrote: Sorry about digging up a slightly stale thread... I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. ...but straight from the horses mouth, most IBM ferroresonant transformers will work at 50 or 60 Hz. The capacitor may need to be swapped, depending on the equipment. I was hanging around some IBM old timers this evening, including the Big Horse at Endicott. I just looked up the FE manual for the 3278 and it shows 5 different part numbers for the ferroresonant transformer (depending upon region) and only a single part number for the capacitor. TTFN - Guy
RE: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I did and never got a reply... Could you ping him to check his spam folder, or email me directly? Thanks Mike On Dec 23, 2015 1:10 AM, "Alexandre Souza" wrote: > His address is symphony.robot...@gmail.com. his name is Sergio. You can > all > talk directly to him. > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > Em 22/12/2015 10:06, "Dave Wade" escreveu: > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Santo > > > Nucifora > > > Sent: 22 December 2015 12:00 > > > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > > > > > > Subject: Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278 > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 6:55 AM, Alexandre Souza < > > > alexandre.tabaj...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has > > some. > > > > > > > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > > > > Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: > > > > > > > > > Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure > > > > > I read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they > > > > > kept on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the > rest > > > > > of the world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there > > > > > was considerable redesign using more modern components inside that > > > > > classic > > > > > 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to > > > > > get hold of a couple. > > > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd be interested in one, after Mike who started the thread. I am in > > Canada. > > > Email me off list. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Santo Nucifora > > > > > > Well I have been looking for one in the UK with no luck. I have some > > ICL/Nokia clones but not a real 3270 > > > > Dave > > > > >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Thanks for the thought... my main concern is the System/3s and Henk Stegeman - who has forgotten more than most of us will ever know about S/3! - says that 60Hz S/3 on 50Hz power is a no-go. Different voltage, fine - transformer can be restrapped. Different frequency... trouble! And then there are rotary machines of course. I bet you half my disks drives need the right frequency or a spindle pulley change.. and even then *they* probably have ferroresonants in their power... Mike On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 6:37 PM, William Donzelli wrote: > I bet you (or Mike, actually) could get it to work by trial and error, > swapping in caps. The transformers (generally) are apparently pretty > forgiving - being off in frequency just results in lost efficiency, > maybe 10-15 percent lost at most. Not flames, anyway. > > -- > Will > > On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:30 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: >> >> >> On 12/30/15 9:29 PM, William Donzelli wrote: >>> >>> Of course! Find the exception that proves the rule! >> >> >> ;-) However, it would've been nice if it were only necessary to change >> the capacitor! >> >> TTFN - Guy >> >>> >>> -- >>> Will >>> >>> On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:23 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: On 12/30/15 9:06 PM, William Donzelli wrote: > > Sorry about digging up a slightly stale thread... > >> I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on >> Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers >> specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems >> with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant >> transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating >> - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them >> at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. > > ...but straight from the horses mouth, most IBM ferroresonant > transformers will work at 50 or 60 Hz. The capacitor may need to be > swapped, depending on the equipment. > > I was hanging around some IBM old timers this evening, including the > Big Horse at Endicott. I just looked up the FE manual for the 3278 and it shows 5 different part numbers for the ferroresonant transformer (depending upon region) and only a single part number for the capacitor. TTFN - Guy >> >> -- http://www.corestore.org 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I bet you (or Mike, actually) could get it to work by trial and error, swapping in caps. The transformers (generally) are apparently pretty forgiving - being off in frequency just results in lost efficiency, maybe 10-15 percent lost at most. Not flames, anyway. -- Will On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:30 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: > > > On 12/30/15 9:29 PM, William Donzelli wrote: >> >> Of course! Find the exception that proves the rule! > > > ;-) However, it would've been nice if it were only necessary to change > the capacitor! > > TTFN - Guy > >> >> -- >> Will >> >> On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:23 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: >>> >>> >>> On 12/30/15 9:06 PM, William Donzelli wrote: Sorry about digging up a slightly stale thread... > I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on > Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers > specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems > with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant > transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating > - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them > at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. ...but straight from the horses mouth, most IBM ferroresonant transformers will work at 50 or 60 Hz. The capacitor may need to be swapped, depending on the equipment. I was hanging around some IBM old timers this evening, including the Big Horse at Endicott. >>> >>> >>> I just looked up the FE manual for the 3278 and it shows 5 different part >>> numbers for the >>> ferroresonant transformer (depending upon region) and only a single part >>> number for the >>> capacitor. >>> >>> TTFN - Guy > >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 12/30/15 9:29 PM, William Donzelli wrote: Of course! Find the exception that proves the rule! ;-) However, it would've been nice if it were only necessary to change the capacitor! TTFN - Guy -- Will On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:23 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: On 12/30/15 9:06 PM, William Donzelli wrote: Sorry about digging up a slightly stale thread... I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. ...but straight from the horses mouth, most IBM ferroresonant transformers will work at 50 or 60 Hz. The capacitor may need to be swapped, depending on the equipment. I was hanging around some IBM old timers this evening, including the Big Horse at Endicott. I just looked up the FE manual for the 3278 and it shows 5 different part numbers for the ferroresonant transformer (depending upon region) and only a single part number for the capacitor. TTFN - Guy
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Of course! Find the exception that proves the rule! -- Will On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 12:23 AM, Guy Sotomayor wrote: > > > On 12/30/15 9:06 PM, William Donzelli wrote: >> >> Sorry about digging up a slightly stale thread... >> >>> I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on >>> Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers >>> specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems >>> with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant >>> transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating >>> - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them >>> at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. >> >> ...but straight from the horses mouth, most IBM ferroresonant >> transformers will work at 50 or 60 Hz. The capacitor may need to be >> swapped, depending on the equipment. >> >> I was hanging around some IBM old timers this evening, including the >> Big Horse at Endicott. > > > I just looked up the FE manual for the 3278 and it shows 5 different part > numbers for the > ferroresonant transformer (depending upon region) and only a single part > number for the > capacitor. > > TTFN - Guy
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 12/30/15 9:06 PM, William Donzelli wrote: Sorry about digging up a slightly stale thread... I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. ...but straight from the horses mouth, most IBM ferroresonant transformers will work at 50 or 60 Hz. The capacitor may need to be swapped, depending on the equipment. I was hanging around some IBM old timers this evening, including the Big Horse at Endicott. I just looked up the FE manual for the 3278 and it shows 5 different part numbers for the ferroresonant transformer (depending upon region) and only a single part number for the capacitor. TTFN - Guy
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Sorry about digging up a slightly stale thread... > I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on > Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers > specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems > with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant > transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating > - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them > at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. ...but straight from the horses mouth, most IBM ferroresonant transformers will work at 50 or 60 Hz. The capacitor may need to be swapped, depending on the equipment. I was hanging around some IBM old timers this evening, including the Big Horse at Endicott. -- Will
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
tis 2015-12-22 klockan 16:45 +1300 skrev Mike Ross: Finagle's law says 90% of my 3-phase big iron was acquired in the USA and expects 3-phase 60Hz 208V... :-( Many machines which did NOT have a ferroresonant transformer could be run from 50 or 60 Hz with no problem. The one place it was a problem would be getting the disk spindles turning at the right speed. Matching the available voltage would be the other detail, but a standard voltage adjusting transformer would do it fairly simply. But, the ferroresonant transformers needed the right frequency. Jon
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Wed, 23 Dec 2015, Stefan Skoglund (lokal anv�ndare) wrote: Find a property with its own little water power station ? And then rebuild the generator into a 60 Hz one. depending on the generaqtor design, increase the rate of flow of the water.
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
tis 2015-12-22 klockan 16:45 +1300 skrev Mike Ross: > H. > > I do have a massive idler motor - as in it takes two people to even > think about lifting it - from my days in NY when I had to manufacture > a 3rd phase to make the S/3 and other items work... I wonder if I > could do anything using that as a starting point? > > Three phase is no problem here... previous owner of house was a > woodworker and I have 3-phase 50Hz 400V straight to the workshop > already wired in :-) > > Finagle's law says 90% of my 3-phase big iron was acquired in the USA > and expects 3-phase 60Hz 208V... :-( Find a property with its own little water power station ? And then rebuild the generator into a 60 Hz one.
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Some VFDs are not just plain PWM pulses, but a stepped sort of thing that sort-of approximates a sinewave. As I said, all this depends on what VFD you are using, and what you might have to act as a filter, and what the load is - a case-by-case thing. -- Will On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 12:12 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > On 12/22/2015 10:25 AM, William Donzelli wrote: >> >> Another thought - with scrap transformer prices in a crapper right >> now. you might also be able to pick up a really beefy isolation >> transformer for spare change, in order to clean up a VFD. Generally, >> normal industrial grade 50 Hz transformers will not care too much if >> you use them at 60 Hz. >> > An isolation transformer will NOT "clean up" a VFD's output. The output of > a VFD is NOT some dirty sine wave, it is a train of 400 V PWM pulses with > perhaps a 15 KHz carrier frequency. It could be filtered, but would take a > filter built out of a bunch of HUGE inductors and capacitors. It might > actually be a decent solution for keeping museum-quality gear running in an > unaltered state, but it isn't something you could whip up in a couple hours > in your garage. > > Jon
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 12/22/2015 10:25 AM, William Donzelli wrote: Another thought - with scrap transformer prices in a crapper right now. you might also be able to pick up a really beefy isolation transformer for spare change, in order to clean up a VFD. Generally, normal industrial grade 50 Hz transformers will not care too much if you use them at 60 Hz. An isolation transformer will NOT "clean up" a VFD's output. The output of a VFD is NOT some dirty sine wave, it is a train of 400 V PWM pulses with perhaps a 15 KHz carrier frequency. It could be filtered, but would take a filter built out of a bunch of HUGE inductors and capacitors. It might actually be a decent solution for keeping museum-quality gear running in an unaltered state, but it isn't something you could whip up in a couple hours in your garage. Jon
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Another thought - with scrap transformer prices in a crapper right now. you might also be able to pick up a really beefy isolation transformer for spare change, in order to clean up a VFD. Generally, normal industrial grade 50 Hz transformers will not care too much if you use them at 60 Hz. -- Will On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 10:45 PM, Mike Ross wrote: > H. > > I do have a massive idler motor - as in it takes two people to even > think about lifting it - from my days in NY when I had to manufacture > a 3rd phase to make the S/3 and other items work... I wonder if I > could do anything using that as a starting point? > > Three phase is no problem here... previous owner of house was a > woodworker and I have 3-phase 50Hz 400V straight to the workshop > already wired in :-) > > Finagle's law says 90% of my 3-phase big iron was acquired in the USA > and expects 3-phase 60Hz 208V... :-( > > Mike > > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 4:03 PM, William Donzelli wrote: >> If you can get a rotary one, those are really nice - just wasteful and >> loud. With proper maintenance they last forever, can take a beating, >> and do not give waveshape issues that cheap solid state units can >> have. And, maybe most importantly, you can make one yourself. >> >> But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now >> (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a >> real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give >> ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. >> >> -- >> Will >> >> On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:48 PM, Mike Ross wrote: >>> Any recommendations for what type? Are solid-state devices up to the >>> job these days? I still remember rotary converters... >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 3:45 PM, William Donzelli >>> wrote: In the long term, you should probably break down and get a good size frequency converter. -- Will On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:33 PM, Mike Ross wrote: > I recently blew up a 3278... it worked ok for a few hours then started > blowing fuses. > > I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on > Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers > specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems > with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant > transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating > - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them > at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. > > 1. Does anyone in a 50Hz country have any dead/spare 3278s and/or > transformers for them? The IBM part number for the 50Hz 220V are > 8715343 or 4119686. > > 2. I have other equipment where this will be an issue and not so > easily solved. Does anyone have any experience in or recommendations > for frequency conversion equipment? My System/3s for instance all use > 60Hz ferroresonants operating off 208V 3-phase - now voltage can > probably be retapped or easily converted but I still need to make a > lot of 60Hz to run them... > > Thanks > > Mike > > http://www.corestore.org > 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. > Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. > For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.' >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> http://www.corestore.org >>> 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. >>> Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. >>> For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I have also sent him an email. Thanks Alexandre. On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 7:26 AM, Mike Ross wrote: > I've sent him an email. In case he doesn't get it you could ask him to > check his spam folder! :-) > > Thanks! > > On Wed, Dec 23, 2015 at 1:10 AM, Alexandre Souza > wrote: > > His address is symphony.robot...@gmail.com. his name is Sergio. You can > all > > talk directly to him. > > > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > > Em 22/12/2015 10:06, "Dave Wade" escreveu: > > > >> > >> > >> > -Original Message- > >> > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of > Santo > >> > Nucifora > >> > Sent: 22 December 2015 12:00 > >> > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > >> > > >> > Subject: Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278 > >> > > >> > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 6:55 AM, Alexandre Souza < > >> > alexandre.tabaj...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > > >> > > That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has > >> some. > >> > > > >> > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > >> > > Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: > >> > > > >> > > > Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm > sure > >> > > > I read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they > >> > > > kept on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the > rest > >> > > > of the world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there > >> > > > was considerable redesign using more modern components inside that > >> > > > classic > >> > > > 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to > >> > > > get hold of a couple. > >> > > > > >> > > > Mike > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > I'd be interested in one, after Mike who started the thread. I am in > >> Canada. > >> > Email me off list. > >> > > >> > Thanks, > >> > Santo Nucifora > >> > >> > >> Well I have been looking for one in the UK with no luck. I have some > >> ICL/Nokia clones but not a real 3270 > >> > >> Dave > >> > >> > > > > -- > > http://www.corestore.org > 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. > Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. > For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.' >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I've sent him an email. In case he doesn't get it you could ask him to check his spam folder! :-) Thanks! On Wed, Dec 23, 2015 at 1:10 AM, Alexandre Souza wrote: > His address is symphony.robot...@gmail.com. his name is Sergio. You can all > talk directly to him. > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > Em 22/12/2015 10:06, "Dave Wade" escreveu: > >> >> >> > -Original Message- >> > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Santo >> > Nucifora >> > Sent: 22 December 2015 12:00 >> > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts >> > >> > Subject: Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278 >> > >> > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 6:55 AM, Alexandre Souza < >> > alexandre.tabaj...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > > That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has >> some. >> > > >> > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel >> > > Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: >> > > >> > > > Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure >> > > > I read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they >> > > > kept on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the rest >> > > > of the world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there >> > > > was considerable redesign using more modern components inside that >> > > > classic >> > > > 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to >> > > > get hold of a couple. >> > > > >> > > > Mike >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > I'd be interested in one, after Mike who started the thread. I am in >> Canada. >> > Email me off list. >> > >> > Thanks, >> > Santo Nucifora >> >> >> Well I have been looking for one in the UK with no luck. I have some >> ICL/Nokia clones but not a real 3270 >> >> Dave >> >> -- http://www.corestore.org 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
RE: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
His address is symphony.robot...@gmail.com. his name is Sergio. You can all talk directly to him. Enviado do meu Tele-Movel Em 22/12/2015 10:06, "Dave Wade" escreveu: > > > > -Original Message- > > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Santo > > Nucifora > > Sent: 22 December 2015 12:00 > > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > > > > Subject: Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278 > > > > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 6:55 AM, Alexandre Souza < > > alexandre.tabaj...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has > some. > > > > > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > > > Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: > > > > > > > Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure > > > > I read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they > > > > kept on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the rest > > > > of the world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there > > > > was considerable redesign using more modern components inside that > > > > classic > > > > 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to > > > > get hold of a couple. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > I'd be interested in one, after Mike who started the thread. I am in > Canada. > > Email me off list. > > > > Thanks, > > Santo Nucifora > > > Well I have been looking for one in the UK with no luck. I have some > ICL/Nokia clones but not a real 3270 > > Dave > >
RE: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
> -Original Message- > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Santo > Nucifora > Sent: 22 December 2015 12:00 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > > Subject: Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278 > > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 6:55 AM, Alexandre Souza < > alexandre.tabaj...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has some. > > > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > > Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: > > > > > Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure > > > I read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they > > > kept on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the rest > > > of the world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there > > > was considerable redesign using more modern components inside that > > > classic > > > 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to > > > get hold of a couple. > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > I'd be interested in one, after Mike who started the thread. I am in Canada. > Email me off list. > > Thanks, > Santo Nucifora Well I have been looking for one in the UK with no luck. I have some ICL/Nokia clones but not a real 3270 Dave
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 6:55 AM, Alexandre Souza < alexandre.tabaj...@gmail.com> wrote: > That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has some. > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: > > > Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure I > > read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they kept > > on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the rest of the > > world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there was > > considerable redesign using more modern components inside that classic > > 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to get > > hold of a couple. > > > > Mike > > > I'd be interested in one, after Mike who started the thread. I am in Canada. Email me off list. Thanks, Santo Nucifora
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Oh then we should talk... do you know what condition they are in and what power they are designed for? I'd definitely be interested in getting a couple in good shape - although shipping to NZ would be... expensive! Contact me off-list if you like. Mike On Wed, Dec 23, 2015 at 12:55 AM, Alexandre Souza wrote: > That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has some. > > Enviado do meu Tele-Movel > Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: > >> On Wed, Dec 23, 2015 at 12:44 AM, Santo Nucifora >> wrote: >> > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 5:52 AM, Brent Hilpert >> wrote: >> > >> >> On 2015-Dec-22, at 2:28 AM, drlegendre . wrote: >> >> > Ah, a terminal it is! Thank you. >> >> > >> >> > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:30 PM, William Donzelli < >> wdonze...@gmail.com> >> >> > wrote: >> >> > >> >> >>> Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. >> >> >> >> >> >> Try IBM 3278. >> >> >> >> >> >> Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. >> >> >> > >> > Sadly, not as plentiful these days as vintage terminals. I've been on >> the >> > lookout for one for the last couple of years just to add to my >> collection. >> > Seems that keyboard collectors like the keyboards too because those I >> have >> > found but not for sale lately. >> >> They do seem rather thin on the ground. I picked mine up... 15 years >> ago now and they weren't that common then. And I had a *hell* of a >> time finding a 3279 - the colour version - even then. >> >> Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure I >> read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they kept >> on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the rest of the >> world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there was >> considerable redesign using more modern components inside that classic >> 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to get >> hold of a couple. >> >> Mike >> -- http://www.corestore.org 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
That is easy, it is fairly common here. I know of a friend who has some. Enviado do meu Tele-Movel Em 22/12/2015 09:51, "Mike Ross" escreveu: > On Wed, Dec 23, 2015 at 12:44 AM, Santo Nucifora > wrote: > > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 5:52 AM, Brent Hilpert > wrote: > > > >> On 2015-Dec-22, at 2:28 AM, drlegendre . wrote: > >> > Ah, a terminal it is! Thank you. > >> > > >> > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:30 PM, William Donzelli < > wdonze...@gmail.com> > >> > wrote: > >> > > >> >>> Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. > >> >> > >> >> Try IBM 3278. > >> >> > >> >> Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. > >> > > > > Sadly, not as plentiful these days as vintage terminals. I've been on > the > > lookout for one for the last couple of years just to add to my > collection. > > Seems that keyboard collectors like the keyboards too because those I > have > > found but not for sale lately. > > They do seem rather thin on the ground. I picked mine up... 15 years > ago now and they weren't that common then. And I had a *hell* of a > time finding a 3279 - the colour version - even then. > > Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure I > read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they kept > on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the rest of the > world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there was > considerable redesign using more modern components inside that classic > 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to get > hold of a couple. > > Mike >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Wed, Dec 23, 2015 at 12:44 AM, Santo Nucifora wrote: > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 5:52 AM, Brent Hilpert wrote: > >> On 2015-Dec-22, at 2:28 AM, drlegendre . wrote: >> > Ah, a terminal it is! Thank you. >> > >> > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:30 PM, William Donzelli >> > wrote: >> > >> >>> Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. >> >> >> >> Try IBM 3278. >> >> >> >> Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. >> > > Sadly, not as plentiful these days as vintage terminals. I've been on the > lookout for one for the last couple of years just to add to my collection. > Seems that keyboard collectors like the keyboards too because those I have > found but not for sale lately. They do seem rather thin on the ground. I picked mine up... 15 years ago now and they weren't that common then. And I had a *hell* of a time finding a 3279 - the colour version - even then. Do we have any South American correspondents listening in? I'm sure I read that IBM had a factory in Brazil producing these - and they kept on churning 3278s out for some considerable time after the rest of the world had moved on. I believe it was also stated that there was considerable redesign using more modern components inside that classic 3278 case on these later Brazilian examples. I'd certainly like to get hold of a couple. Mike
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 5:52 AM, Brent Hilpert wrote: > On 2015-Dec-22, at 2:28 AM, drlegendre . wrote: > > Ah, a terminal it is! Thank you. > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:30 PM, William Donzelli > > wrote: > > > >>> Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. > >> > >> Try IBM 3278. > >> > >> Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. > Sadly, not as plentiful these days as vintage terminals. I've been on the lookout for one for the last couple of years just to add to my collection. Seems that keyboard collectors like the keyboards too because those I have found but not for sale lately.
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 2015-Dec-22, at 2:28 AM, drlegendre . wrote: > Ah, a terminal it is! Thank you. > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:30 PM, William Donzelli > wrote: > >>> Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. >> >> Try IBM 3278. >> >> Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. Funny, I tried googling a bare "3278" and got the terminal in the first of 33,400,000 hits. Must have something to do with one's search history. Used to use 3278s on occasion - in the mainframe terminal room where, as an undergrad, I was not supposed to be. Just be casual and do one's best to look like you belong there. They were so much nicer than the bottom-end Hazeltines in the undergrad lab.
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I'd die for a vt100... :) Enviado do meu Tele-Movel Em 22/12/2015 08:28, "drlegendre ." escreveu: > Ah, a terminal it is! Thank you. > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:30 PM, William Donzelli > wrote: > > > > Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. > > > > Try IBM 3278. > > > > Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. > > > > -- > > Will > > >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Ah, a terminal it is! Thank you. On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:30 PM, William Donzelli wrote: > > Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. > > Try IBM 3278. > > Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. > > -- > Will >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 11:07 PM, Christian Corti wrote: > On Mon, 21 Dec 2015, William Donzelli wrote: >> >> But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now >> (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a >> real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give >> ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. > > > I don't see how a Vacuum Fluorescent Display is of any help here... > Or what do you mean by VFD? Variable Frequency Drive I would presume; a common type of industrial power controller. Mike
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 2015-Dec-22, at 2:07 AM, Christian Corti wrote: > On Mon, 21 Dec 2015, William Donzelli wrote: >> But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now >> (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a >> real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give >> ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. > > I don't see how a Vacuum Fluorescent Display is of any help here... > Or what do you mean by VFD? Variable Frequency Drive. High-power electronic controllers for industrial motors, rather than being limited to the single speed of the fixed line frequency. Must be another expression for them in deutsch.
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On Mon, 21 Dec 2015, William Donzelli wrote: But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. I don't see how a Vacuum Fluorescent Display is of any help here... Or what do you mean by VFD? Christian
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
H. I do have a massive idler motor - as in it takes two people to even think about lifting it - from my days in NY when I had to manufacture a 3rd phase to make the S/3 and other items work... I wonder if I could do anything using that as a starting point? Three phase is no problem here... previous owner of house was a woodworker and I have 3-phase 50Hz 400V straight to the workshop already wired in :-) Finagle's law says 90% of my 3-phase big iron was acquired in the USA and expects 3-phase 60Hz 208V... :-( Mike On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 4:03 PM, William Donzelli wrote: > If you can get a rotary one, those are really nice - just wasteful and > loud. With proper maintenance they last forever, can take a beating, > and do not give waveshape issues that cheap solid state units can > have. And, maybe most importantly, you can make one yourself. > > But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now > (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a > real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give > ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. > > -- > Will > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:48 PM, Mike Ross wrote: >> Any recommendations for what type? Are solid-state devices up to the >> job these days? I still remember rotary converters... >> >> Mike >> >> On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 3:45 PM, William Donzelli >> wrote: >>> In the long term, you should probably break down and get a good size >>> frequency converter. >>> >>> -- >>> Will >>> >>> On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:33 PM, Mike Ross wrote: I recently blew up a 3278... it worked ok for a few hours then started blowing fuses. I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. 1. Does anyone in a 50Hz country have any dead/spare 3278s and/or transformers for them? The IBM part number for the 50Hz 220V are 8715343 or 4119686. 2. I have other equipment where this will be an issue and not so easily solved. Does anyone have any experience in or recommendations for frequency conversion equipment? My System/3s for instance all use 60Hz ferroresonants operating off 208V 3-phase - now voltage can probably be retapped or easily converted but I still need to make a lot of 60Hz to run them... Thanks Mike http://www.corestore.org 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.' >> >> >> >> -- >> >> http://www.corestore.org >> 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. >> Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. >> For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I have heard that some guys have put a motor in the circuit just to deal with the harmonics as a filter to shore the sine wave up. An interesting idea, worth a try, but I bet it works on a case-by-case basis. -- Will On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 10:12 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > On 12/21/2015 09:03 PM, William Donzelli wrote: >> >> If you can get a rotary one, those are really nice - just wasteful and >> loud. With proper maintenance they last forever, can take a beating, >> and do not give waveshape issues that cheap solid state units can >> have. And, maybe most importantly, you can make one yourself. >> >> But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now >> (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a >> real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give >> ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. >> > You can't run electronics with VFDs designed to run motors, only. They put > out PWM chopped square waves at 300+ Volts. A motor's winding inductance > smooths that out to a proper current waveform, and it only causes a little > extra eddy current losses. But, typical transformers will have real fits > with that kind of waveform. > > There are "frequency changers" made by Elgar and others that will do the job > right, but they will cost a REAL bundle of cash! (Also known as frequency > converters.) > > It may be possible to retune the resonant circuit of the constant voltage > transformer by adding capacitance in parallel to the existing capacitor. > > Jon > >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
> Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. Try IBM 3278. Hint: one of those popular terminal families in the world. -- Will
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
On 12/21/2015 09:03 PM, William Donzelli wrote: If you can get a rotary one, those are really nice - just wasteful and loud. With proper maintenance they last forever, can take a beating, and do not give waveshape issues that cheap solid state units can have. And, maybe most importantly, you can make one yourself. But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. You can't run electronics with VFDs designed to run motors, only. They put out PWM chopped square waves at 300+ Volts. A motor's winding inductance smooths that out to a proper current waveform, and it only causes a little extra eddy current losses. But, typical transformers will have real fits with that kind of waveform. There are "frequency changers" made by Elgar and others that will do the job right, but they will cost a REAL bundle of cash! (Also known as frequency converters.) It may be possible to retune the resonant circuit of the constant voltage transformer by adding capacitance in parallel to the existing capacitor. Jon
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
For those of use who might have a broad, but more generic technical knowledge - could you please explain exactly what a "3278" is? Sincere query.. as the goog turns up nothing meaningful.. On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:03 PM, William Donzelli wrote: > If you can get a rotary one, those are really nice - just wasteful and > loud. With proper maintenance they last forever, can take a beating, > and do not give waveshape issues that cheap solid state units can > have. And, maybe most importantly, you can make one yourself. > > But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now > (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a > real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give > ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. > > -- > Will > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:48 PM, Mike Ross wrote: > > Any recommendations for what type? Are solid-state devices up to the > > job these days? I still remember rotary converters... > > > > Mike > > > > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 3:45 PM, William Donzelli > wrote: > >> In the long term, you should probably break down and get a good size > >> frequency converter. > >> > >> -- > >> Will > >> > >> On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:33 PM, Mike Ross wrote: > >>> I recently blew up a 3278... it worked ok for a few hours then started > >>> blowing fuses. > >>> > >>> I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on > >>> Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers > >>> specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems > >>> with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant > >>> transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating > >>> - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them > >>> at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. > >>> > >>> 1. Does anyone in a 50Hz country have any dead/spare 3278s and/or > >>> transformers for them? The IBM part number for the 50Hz 220V are > >>> 8715343 or 4119686. > >>> > >>> 2. I have other equipment where this will be an issue and not so > >>> easily solved. Does anyone have any experience in or recommendations > >>> for frequency conversion equipment? My System/3s for instance all use > >>> 60Hz ferroresonants operating off 208V 3-phase - now voltage can > >>> probably be retapped or easily converted but I still need to make a > >>> lot of 60Hz to run them... > >>> > >>> Thanks > >>> > >>> Mike > >>> > >>> http://www.corestore.org > >>> 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. > >>> Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. > >>> For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.' > > > > > > > > -- > > > > http://www.corestore.org > > 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. > > Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. > > For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.' >
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
If you can get a rotary one, those are really nice - just wasteful and loud. With proper maintenance they last forever, can take a beating, and do not give waveshape issues that cheap solid state units can have. And, maybe most importantly, you can make one yourself. But considering the mix of 50 and 60 Hz stuff you likely have by now (that is what you get for moving!), spending some decent money on a real VFD might be worth it. I might think a cheap VFD may give ferroresonant iron fits with all those extra harmonics. -- Will On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:48 PM, Mike Ross wrote: > Any recommendations for what type? Are solid-state devices up to the > job these days? I still remember rotary converters... > > Mike > > On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 3:45 PM, William Donzelli wrote: >> In the long term, you should probably break down and get a good size >> frequency converter. >> >> -- >> Will >> >> On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:33 PM, Mike Ross wrote: >>> I recently blew up a 3278... it worked ok for a few hours then started >>> blowing fuses. >>> >>> I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on >>> Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers >>> specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems >>> with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant >>> transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating >>> - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them >>> at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. >>> >>> 1. Does anyone in a 50Hz country have any dead/spare 3278s and/or >>> transformers for them? The IBM part number for the 50Hz 220V are >>> 8715343 or 4119686. >>> >>> 2. I have other equipment where this will be an issue and not so >>> easily solved. Does anyone have any experience in or recommendations >>> for frequency conversion equipment? My System/3s for instance all use >>> 60Hz ferroresonants operating off 208V 3-phase - now voltage can >>> probably be retapped or easily converted but I still need to make a >>> lot of 60Hz to run them... >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> http://www.corestore.org >>> 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. >>> Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. >>> For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.' > > > > -- > > http://www.corestore.org > 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. > Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. > For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
Any recommendations for what type? Are solid-state devices up to the job these days? I still remember rotary converters... Mike On Tue, Dec 22, 2015 at 3:45 PM, William Donzelli wrote: > In the long term, you should probably break down and get a good size > frequency converter. > > -- > Will > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:33 PM, Mike Ross wrote: >> I recently blew up a 3278... it worked ok for a few hours then started >> blowing fuses. >> >> I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on >> Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers >> specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems >> with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant >> transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating >> - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them >> at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. >> >> 1. Does anyone in a 50Hz country have any dead/spare 3278s and/or >> transformers for them? The IBM part number for the 50Hz 220V are >> 8715343 or 4119686. >> >> 2. I have other equipment where this will be an issue and not so >> easily solved. Does anyone have any experience in or recommendations >> for frequency conversion equipment? My System/3s for instance all use >> 60Hz ferroresonants operating off 208V 3-phase - now voltage can >> probably be retapped or easily converted but I still need to make a >> lot of 60Hz to run them... >> >> Thanks >> >> Mike >> >> http://www.corestore.org >> 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. >> Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. >> For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.' -- http://www.corestore.org 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Re: Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
In the long term, you should probably break down and get a good size frequency converter. -- Will On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 9:33 PM, Mike Ross wrote: > I recently blew up a 3278... it worked ok for a few hours then started > blowing fuses. > > I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on > Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers > specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems > with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant > transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating > - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them > at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. > > 1. Does anyone in a 50Hz country have any dead/spare 3278s and/or > transformers for them? The IBM part number for the 50Hz 220V are > 8715343 or 4119686. > > 2. I have other equipment where this will be an issue and not so > easily solved. Does anyone have any experience in or recommendations > for frequency conversion equipment? My System/3s for instance all use > 60Hz ferroresonants operating off 208V 3-phase - now voltage can > probably be retapped or easily converted but I still need to make a > lot of 60Hz to run them... > > Thanks > > Mike > > http://www.corestore.org > 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. > Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. > For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Ferroresonant transformers and 3278
I recently blew up a 3278... it worked ok for a few hours then started blowing fuses. I haven't done any troubleshooting yet but checking the manuals on Bitsavers tells me my US 3278s have ferroresonant transformers specified as 120V 60Hz only. This can be expected to cause problems with 120V 50Hz here in NZ from my knowledge of how ferroresonant transformers work; I'll get excessive magnetic currents - overheating - all kinds of nasties. I can wind the voltage down a bit and run them at 90-100V but that doesn't help much. 1. Does anyone in a 50Hz country have any dead/spare 3278s and/or transformers for them? The IBM part number for the 50Hz 220V are 8715343 or 4119686. 2. I have other equipment where this will be an issue and not so easily solved. Does anyone have any experience in or recommendations for frequency conversion equipment? My System/3s for instance all use 60Hz ferroresonants operating off 208V 3-phase - now voltage can probably be retapped or easily converted but I still need to make a lot of 60Hz to run them... Thanks Mike http://www.corestore.org 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
