Re: internet blocking problem ?
im in wpg canada and can see it through rogers mobile On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 8:25 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > On 09/15/2015 12:11 PM, Gary Oliver wrote: > >> I don't know if anyone got to the bottom of this blockage, but I noticed >> this morning that the site "members.iinet.net.au" is now accessible from >> my comcast (oregon) location. It's still broken elsewhere because few of >> the sites I visited that should be on the ring have working webring links, >> so the javascript inclusion must not yet be universally accessable... >> >> Yes, it appears that iinet either fixed what was wrong or got whoever > else was responsible to get it fixed. It now works from my home and also > from work, where both did not work consistently for several weeks. I don't > know if I will find out WHAT was wrong, but apparently David Brooks made > inquiries at iinet on Thursday or Friday, and somebody did something. > > I think it was VERY important that with all of your help, we were able to > QUANTIFY that this was a widespread blockage. > > Thanks!!! > > Jon >
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/15/2015 12:11 PM, Gary Oliver wrote: I don't know if anyone got to the bottom of this blockage, but I noticed this morning that the site "members.iinet.net.au" is now accessible from my comcast (oregon) location. It's still broken elsewhere because few of the sites I visited that should be on the ring have working webring links, so the javascript inclusion must not yet be universally accessable... Yes, it appears that iinet either fixed what was wrong or got whoever else was responsible to get it fixed. It now works from my home and also from work, where both did not work consistently for several weeks. I don't know if I will find out WHAT was wrong, but apparently David Brooks made inquiries at iinet on Thursday or Friday, and somebody did something. I think it was VERY important that with all of your help, we were able to QUANTIFY that this was a widespread blockage. Thanks!!! Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
I don't know if anyone got to the bottom of this blockage, but I noticed this morning that the site "members.iinet.net.au" is now accessible from my comcast (oregon) location. It's still broken elsewhere because few of the sites I visited that should be on the ring have working webring links, so the javascript inclusion must not yet be universally accessable... -Gary On 09/11/2015 09:55 AM, Gary Oliver wrote: Works fine, save for the individual web-ring pages not being able to populate the buttons correctly. Going directly to a members... page does work from this proxy.
RE: internet blocking problem ?
Can I beg to differ, having had a quick play with Azure I quite like "cloud" solutions. However they usually don't deliver what managers expect as usually it is only the hardware that’s in the cloud. You don't get the Systems Admin done for you. You will often have to back it up. Worse still its expensive. Where I last worked we basically ran "servers as a service" using a VMWare farm. We tried to fully cost our servers but the price we came up with was still about 10% of commercial cloud providers. I use a "hosted" web site for the local Radio Club on a shared server in the cloud. Its about $100 dollars a year. I honestly can't beat it. We have MySql and run a main web server using "Drupal" for the "Normal" club stuff, plus a second with "Moodle" for the UK Ham Radio exams we run training for. It also hosts my Vintage computing pages... I would probably need three boxes at home to do the same thing. Give me a cloud any day ... which reminds me I havn't backed it up for a while. Dave > -Original Message- > From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Sean > Caron > Sent: 11 September 2015 16:08 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > ; Sean Caron > Subject: Re: internet blocking problem ? > > Me too, especially as a working sys admin ... the business model is not really > original ... just the old time "service bureau" or "timesharing company" but > we have to have a hip new marketing catchname for it, LOL... > Well, if I've learned one thing, the computer industry is kind of like the > fashion industry ... cyclical ... one year it will be distributed services; > ten years > later it's centralization ... one year "cloud" is the fad ... but I think in > ten years > we'll all be moving to pull our services back in house, LOL. > > Best, > > Sean > > > On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 7:46 AM, Jay West wrote: > > > Ben wrote > > > > What I find more annoying, is this cloud crap. > > > > "There is no such thing as 'the cloud', it's just someone else's computer." > > > > Love that quote... so true... and I sell cloud services ;) > > > > J > > > > > > > >
Re: internet blocking problem ?
Per your request, I tried the URL: http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html I did the search you requested, and tried the following URLs: http://members.iinet.com.au/~stepho/mick.htm http://members.iinet.net.au/~pontipak/redsquare.html http://members.iinet.net.au/~perthdps/convicts/stories.html http://www.iinet.net.au/~rmine/gctrebs.html http://www.iinet.net.au/~worcom http://members.iinet.net.au/~janwyllie/ http://members.iinet.net.au/~tom-hunter/ http://www.iinet.net.au/~gduncan/ http://members.iinet.net.au/~jacob/worldtp.html In every case shown above, the result was the same: The server at members.iinet.net.au is taking too long to respond. Only two of the sites I tried gave a different result. They were: http://members.iinet.net.au/~glrmc/ It gave me a blank page. and http://members.iinet.net.au/~margretr/ It gave the following error message: "XML Parsing Error: unexpected parser state Location: jar:file:///C:/Program%20Files/Mozilla% 20Firefox/browser/omni.ja!/chrome/browser/content/browser/aboutNetError.xhtml Line Number 335, Column 68: &connectionFailure.longDesc;" My particulars are: 7:59 PM 9/10/2015 Gateway computer, connected by modem. Windows XP Professional v5.1 Firefox 35.0.1 Computer Country (ccountry.net) Medford, Oregon USA IP address: 12.73.18.147 You're welcome! Kurt > > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in > the US, to check if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html > > > If you want to do some more research, just Google > members.iinet and you will see a lot of hits of the form: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~some_name > > Thanks for any help or info you can offer! > > Jon > > >
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/11/2015 10:27 AM, Paul Koning wrote: FWIW: when I run into a web site issue due to filtering (or suspicion of same), I got to TOR. Apart from the confidentiality benefits it offers, you also get access from a completely different part of the world. An unpredictable place, admittedly. Just to explain why this is a problem, the various pages of the homebuilt CPU web ring all are supposed to link to David Brooks' page and a small javascript code that allows viewers of the various pages to jump to any of the other pages. As new pages are added to the ring (or dead ones removed) the javascript is updated to reflect that. So, it really is important that these pages link to a single copy of the javascript that is up to date. So, it is not a matter of me seeing David Brooks page one time, it is a matter of anybody who looks at my page or any of the other pages being able to get to all the other pages of the ring. And, with the great help of the classiccmp group, we have scoped out that this is actually a pretty large problem, about 54% of US and Canadian users cannot get to anything on members.iinet.net.au Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
Me too, especially as a working sys admin ... the business model is not really original ... just the old time "service bureau" or "timesharing company" but we have to have a hip new marketing catchname for it, LOL... Well, if I've learned one thing, the computer industry is kind of like the fashion industry ... cyclical ... one year it will be distributed services; ten years later it's centralization ... one year "cloud" is the fad ... but I think in ten years we'll all be moving to pull our services back in house, LOL. Best, Sean On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 7:46 AM, Jay West wrote: > Ben wrote > > What I find more annoying, is this cloud crap. > > "There is no such thing as 'the cloud', it's just someone else's computer." > > Love that quote... so true... and I sell cloud services ;) > > J > > > >
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/11/2015 11:58 AM, Noel Chiappa wrote: > > From: Jon Elson > > > so MANY others who could not access the members.iinet page were finding > > they got stopped at cogentco. >^^^ > > Well, to be precise 'Cogentco was the last node on the route which > responded'. > > It's impossible to say whether i) that node tossed packets that tried to go > further; ii) it forwarded them to some other node (identity unknown) which > did toss them (and didn't allow/handle traceroute), etc. > Strictly true. However if Cogent were blocking them, they would most likely block them at *ingress* rather than egress - more efficient. My guess is that it is the next node - the first unidentified node - that is doing the blocking. > One can't draw any conclusions about whether it's i) from the fact that it's > _also_ still responding to traceroute packets sent to that address: one would > have to know whether it does the a) 'is this packet to a destination I'm > filtering' check before it does the b) 'I decremented the TTL and it's now > zero', or the other way around. If b) it could be the node that's dropping > the packets. > > But given that other 'last hops' are also producing similar results, I'm > still thinking it's Ii.net which is tossing the packets, not the 'last hop' > one can see on traceroutes. I expect that is correct. JRJ
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/11/2015 10:52 AM, Paul Koning wrote: > >> On Sep 11, 2015, at 11:40 AM, Jay Jaeger wrote: >> >> >> I cannot make a connection. My DNS is able to resolve the address. >> > > I saw the same sort of thing but I let traceroute keep running. The result > is that it started giving real answers again just one or two hops later. > > Conclusion: hops 16-20ish are blocking traceroute packets. Later hops aren't. > > It's hard to be patient sometimes, but while * * * sometimes indicates "this > is as far as you get" it may also indicate just a few nodes that are not > cooperating with traceroute on a functional route. > > paul > > Not me. 16 * * * 17 * * * 18 * * * 19 * * * 20 * * * 21 * * * 22 * * * 23 * * * 24 * * * 25 * * * 26 * * * 27 * * * 28 * * * 29 * * * 30 * * * Also, if an ISP is actually blocking traceroute packets, then the trace will STOP THERE - it can't get past that point. JRJ
Re: internet blocking problem ?
> From: Jon Elson > so MANY others who could not access the members.iinet page were finding > they got stopped at cogentco. ^^^ Well, to be precise 'Cogentco was the last node on the route which responded'. It's impossible to say whether i) that node tossed packets that tried to go further; ii) it forwarded them to some other node (identity unknown) which did toss them (and didn't allow/handle traceroute), etc. One can't draw any conclusions about whether it's i) from the fact that it's _also_ still responding to traceroute packets sent to that address: one would have to know whether it does the a) 'is this packet to a destination I'm filtering' check before it does the b) 'I decremented the TTL and it's now zero', or the other way around. If b) it could be the node that's dropping the packets. But given that other 'last hops' are also producing similar results, I'm still thinking it's Ii.net which is tossing the packets, not the 'last hop' one can see on traceroutes. Noel
Re: internet blocking problem ?
Works fine, save for the individual web-ring pages not being able to populate the buttons correctly. Going directly to a members... page does work from this proxy. -Gary On 09/11/2015 09:40 AM, Gary Oliver wrote: I fired up a proxy on amazon ec2 virginia this morning and it works fine from there. Strange geographic filtering... -Gary On 09/10/2015 09:11 PM, Gary Oliver wrote: The amazon instance is in the US West region (north-central Oregon I presume.) Tomorrow I'll fire up a proxy on the east coast and see what happens. -Gary
RE: internet blocking problem ?
> "There is no such thing as 'the cloud', it's just someone else's > computer." > > Love that quote... so true... and I sell cloud services ;) Jay, I am going to have to use that quote with my friends who like having their life on the cloud... -Ali
Re: internet blocking problem ?
I fired up a proxy on amazon ec2 virginia this morning and it works fine from there. Strange geographic filtering... -Gary On 09/10/2015 09:11 PM, Gary Oliver wrote: The amazon instance is in the US West region (north-central Oregon I presume.) Tomorrow I'll fire up a proxy on the east coast and see what happens. -Gary
Re: internet blocking problem ?
> On Sep 11, 2015, at 11:52 AM, Paul Koning wrote: > > >> On Sep 11, 2015, at 11:40 AM, Jay Jaeger wrote: >> >> On 9/10/2015 8:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: >> >>> >>> So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to >>> check if they can view this page: >>> http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html >>> >>> >> >> I cannot make a connection. My DNS is able to resolve the address. >> >> ISP is Charter cable, Madison WI (Fitchburg, from the DNS name), then to >> Eau Claire WI, then Chicago, IL where it looks like they apparently peer >> with Cogent. >> >> As with others, the traceroute stopped at Cogent. Note that this may >> mean that the next hop after that blocks all of the packets or it could >> mean that the next hop is blocking just the traceroute packets. >> >> JRJ >> >> 1 * * * >> 2 dtr01ftbgwi-tge-0-6-0-3.ftbg.wi.charter.com (96.34.25.58) 15.413 ms >> 16.531 ms 16.524 ms >> 3 crr01ftbgwi-bue-4.ftbg.wi.charter.com (96.34.18.108) 23.528 ms >> 21.479 ms 23.501 ms >> 4 crr01euclwi-bue-1.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.16.77) 21.431 ms * * >> 5 bbr01euclwi-bue-4.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.2.4) 21.157 ms 21.153 >> ms 21.318 ms >> 6 bbr02euclwi-bue-5.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.0.7) 25.319 ms 16.876 >> ms 22.938 ms >> 7 bbr01chcgil-bue-1.chcg.il.charter.com (96.34.0.9) 25.460 ms 26.958 >> ms 23.483 ms >> 8 bbr02chcgil-bue-6.chcg.il.charter.com (96.34.0.67) 26.751 ms >> 27.724 ms 27.695 ms >> 9 te0-18-0-2.ccr41.ord03.atlas.cogentco.com (38.122.181.65) 25.728 ms >> 30.118 ms 28.197 ms >> 10 be2216.ccr41.ord01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.24.201) 27.315 ms >> 27.427 ms be2217.ccr42.ord01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.24.205) 27.389 ms >> 11 be2156.ccr21.mci01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.6.85) 41.659 ms >> be2157.ccr22.mci01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.6.117) 40.758 ms 38.666 ms >> 12 be2432.ccr21.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.133) 47.510 ms >> be2433.ccr22.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.213) 53.865 ms >> be2432.ccr21.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.133) 52.515 ms >> 13 be2441.ccr21.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.41.65) 53.141 ms >> be2443.ccr22.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.44.229) 55.853 ms >> be2441.ccr21.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.41.65) 55.407 ms >> 14 be2066.ccr22.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.7.54) 86.437 ms >> be2065.ccr21.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.5.66) 89.222 ms 87.085 ms >> 15 be2017.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.237) 94.160 ms >> be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.88.10) 90.385 ms 88.573 ms >> 16 * * * >> 17 * * * >> 18 * * * >> 19 * *^C > > I saw the same sort of thing but I let traceroute keep running. The result > is that it started giving real answers again just one or two hops later. > > Conclusion: hops 16-20ish are blocking traceroute packets. Later hops aren't. > > It's hard to be patient sometimes, but while * * * sometimes indicates "this > is as far as you get" it may also indicate just a few nodes that are not > cooperating with traceroute on a functional route. Sorry, I misremembered the different traceroute runs. The one that goes into cogentco fails for me too, all the way to 64 hops. But I had a different traceroute run from a different location that shows gtt.net, then 5 lines of * * *, then ii.net and on to the destination. So * * * is not necessarily the sign of a black hole, though it can be that. paul
Re: internet blocking problem ?
> On Sep 11, 2015, at 11:40 AM, Jay Jaeger wrote: > > On 9/10/2015 8:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > >> >> So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to >> check if they can view this page: >> http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html >> >> > > I cannot make a connection. My DNS is able to resolve the address. > > ISP is Charter cable, Madison WI (Fitchburg, from the DNS name), then to > Eau Claire WI, then Chicago, IL where it looks like they apparently peer > with Cogent. > > As with others, the traceroute stopped at Cogent. Note that this may > mean that the next hop after that blocks all of the packets or it could > mean that the next hop is blocking just the traceroute packets. > > JRJ > > 1 * * * > 2 dtr01ftbgwi-tge-0-6-0-3.ftbg.wi.charter.com (96.34.25.58) 15.413 ms > 16.531 ms 16.524 ms > 3 crr01ftbgwi-bue-4.ftbg.wi.charter.com (96.34.18.108) 23.528 ms > 21.479 ms 23.501 ms > 4 crr01euclwi-bue-1.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.16.77) 21.431 ms * * > 5 bbr01euclwi-bue-4.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.2.4) 21.157 ms 21.153 > ms 21.318 ms > 6 bbr02euclwi-bue-5.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.0.7) 25.319 ms 16.876 > ms 22.938 ms > 7 bbr01chcgil-bue-1.chcg.il.charter.com (96.34.0.9) 25.460 ms 26.958 > ms 23.483 ms > 8 bbr02chcgil-bue-6.chcg.il.charter.com (96.34.0.67) 26.751 ms > 27.724 ms 27.695 ms > 9 te0-18-0-2.ccr41.ord03.atlas.cogentco.com (38.122.181.65) 25.728 ms > 30.118 ms 28.197 ms > 10 be2216.ccr41.ord01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.24.201) 27.315 ms > 27.427 ms be2217.ccr42.ord01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.24.205) 27.389 ms > 11 be2156.ccr21.mci01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.6.85) 41.659 ms > be2157.ccr22.mci01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.6.117) 40.758 ms 38.666 ms > 12 be2432.ccr21.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.133) 47.510 ms > be2433.ccr22.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.213) 53.865 ms > be2432.ccr21.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.133) 52.515 ms > 13 be2441.ccr21.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.41.65) 53.141 ms > be2443.ccr22.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.44.229) 55.853 ms > be2441.ccr21.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.41.65) 55.407 ms > 14 be2066.ccr22.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.7.54) 86.437 ms > be2065.ccr21.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.5.66) 89.222 ms 87.085 ms > 15 be2017.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.237) 94.160 ms > be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.88.10) 90.385 ms 88.573 ms > 16 * * * > 17 * * * > 18 * * * > 19 * *^C I saw the same sort of thing but I let traceroute keep running. The result is that it started giving real answers again just one or two hops later. Conclusion: hops 16-20ish are blocking traceroute packets. Later hops aren't. It's hard to be patient sometimes, but while * * * sometimes indicates "this is as far as you get" it may also indicate just a few nodes that are not cooperating with traceroute on a functional route. paul
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/10/2015 8:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to > check if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html > > I cannot make a connection. My DNS is able to resolve the address. ISP is Charter cable, Madison WI (Fitchburg, from the DNS name), then to Eau Claire WI, then Chicago, IL where it looks like they apparently peer with Cogent. As with others, the traceroute stopped at Cogent. Note that this may mean that the next hop after that blocks all of the packets or it could mean that the next hop is blocking just the traceroute packets. JRJ 1 * * * 2 dtr01ftbgwi-tge-0-6-0-3.ftbg.wi.charter.com (96.34.25.58) 15.413 ms 16.531 ms 16.524 ms 3 crr01ftbgwi-bue-4.ftbg.wi.charter.com (96.34.18.108) 23.528 ms 21.479 ms 23.501 ms 4 crr01euclwi-bue-1.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.16.77) 21.431 ms * * 5 bbr01euclwi-bue-4.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.2.4) 21.157 ms 21.153 ms 21.318 ms 6 bbr02euclwi-bue-5.eucl.wi.charter.com (96.34.0.7) 25.319 ms 16.876 ms 22.938 ms 7 bbr01chcgil-bue-1.chcg.il.charter.com (96.34.0.9) 25.460 ms 26.958 ms 23.483 ms 8 bbr02chcgil-bue-6.chcg.il.charter.com (96.34.0.67) 26.751 ms 27.724 ms 27.695 ms 9 te0-18-0-2.ccr41.ord03.atlas.cogentco.com (38.122.181.65) 25.728 ms 30.118 ms 28.197 ms 10 be2216.ccr41.ord01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.24.201) 27.315 ms 27.427 ms be2217.ccr42.ord01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.24.205) 27.389 ms 11 be2156.ccr21.mci01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.6.85) 41.659 ms be2157.ccr22.mci01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.6.117) 40.758 ms 38.666 ms 12 be2432.ccr21.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.133) 47.510 ms be2433.ccr22.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.213) 53.865 ms be2432.ccr21.dfw01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.3.133) 52.515 ms 13 be2441.ccr21.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.41.65) 53.141 ms be2443.ccr22.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.44.229) 55.853 ms be2441.ccr21.iah01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.41.65) 55.407 ms 14 be2066.ccr22.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.7.54) 86.437 ms be2065.ccr21.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.5.66) 89.222 ms 87.085 ms 15 be2017.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.237) 94.160 ms be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.88.10) 90.385 ms 88.573 ms 16 * * * 17 * * * 18 * * * 19 * *^C
Re: internet blocking problem ?
>> >> On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 20:32:11 -0500 >> Jon Elson wrote: >> >>> Hello, all, >>> >>> I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really >>> weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the >>> ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au >>> as his ISP. All members of the web ring link to his >>> personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government >>> censorship or a private war between iinet and US content >>> providers, iinet or Australia are blocking access from at >>> least some sites in the US. ... >>> >>> Some webring members are now using classiccmp mirrors to >>> host the affected files to get around this problem. >>> >>> So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in >>> the US, to check if they can view this page: >>> http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html FWIW: when I run into a web site issue due to filtering (or suspicion of same), I got to TOR. Apart from the confidentiality benefits it offers, you also get access from a completely different part of the world. An unpredictable place, admittedly. paul
Re: internet blocking problem ?
THANKS to all of you great guys who have helped obtain data on this problem! Here are some results: For 26 users in the US and Canada, I get 11 that worked OK, and 14 that did not work. Of the 14 that did not work, 6 (including me) got stopped at cogentco. It seems that users in other countries had no problem (Sweden, Ireland, UK). Thanks again for taking the time to help research! Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 08:32:11PM -0500, Jon Elson wrote: > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to check > if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html The other day I was trying to access David Green's pages there. I eventually wound up using the Wayback Machine: https://web.archive.org/web/20150702221040/http://members.iinet.net.au/~dgreen/index.html mcl
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/11/2015 09:42 AM, Noel Chiappa wrote: > From: Don North > Basically see no problems accessing any of the pages on sites. > ... > 12: be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com 22.400ms asymm 8 > 13: no reply > 14: no reply > 15: ae0.cr1.mel4.on.ii.net 217.966ms asymm 19 Oh, that's really interesting. A bunch of us get as far as Cogentco, and then it stops working. But you get through... which implies that the _route_ in Cogentco to Ii.net is OK. Which in turn implies that it's Ii.net who are blocking (via packet drop, I assume), based on the IP _source_ address. So it sounds like the earlier post (too lazy to track it down) which says this is Ii.net responding to complaints from others (since they haven't blocked access to _all_ of ii.net, just that 'members' site) is right. Noel Not necessarily. It may be possible that filtering software/hardware statistically let a few accesses get through. This may be intentional or just due to overloaded nodes. But, YES, it IS very interesting, as so MANY others who could not access the members.iinet page were finding they got stopped at cogentco. Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/11/2015 7:46 AM, Lyle Bickley wrote: On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 20:32:11 -0500 Jon Elson wrote: Hello, all, I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au as his ISP. All members of the web ring link to his personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government censorship or a private war between iinet and US content providers, iinet or Australia are blocking access from at least some sites in the US. So, from my work or home (totally different IPs) I cannot access ANY personal pages at iinet, but a few general help pages there can be accessed. As far as I can tell, nobody else in the world is being affected. Some webring members are now using classiccmp mirrors to host the affected files to get around this problem. So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to check if they can view this page: http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html Works from Silicon Valley (Mountain View) Lyle But not from Santa Cruz, only about 30 miles away from Mtn. View. Bob -- Vintage computers and electronics www.dvq.com www.tekmuseum.com www.decmuseum.org
Re: internet blocking problem ?
> On Sep 11, 2015, at 10:46 AM, Lyle Bickley wrote: > > On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 20:32:11 -0500 > Jon Elson wrote: > >> Hello, all, >> >> I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really >> weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the >> ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au >> as his ISP. All members of the web ring link to his >> personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government >> censorship or a private war between iinet and US content >> providers, iinet or Australia are blocking access from at >> least some sites in the US. ... >> >> Some webring members are now using classiccmp mirrors to >> host the affected files to get around this problem. >> >> So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in >> the US, to check if they can view this page: >> http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html > > Works from Silicon Valley (Mountain View) > > Lyle I tried "traceroute" from three places: a machine in Palo Alto (result: fail), my home firewall (result: works) and my office (result: fail). The routes shown are utterly different. The PA case shows just a few hops, into megapath.net, then no further. The office goes into alter.net, then through a whole bunch of different hosts all in cogentco.com, then nothing. And from home, I see a path through comcast.net, gtt.net, ii.net, then iinet.com.au and from there to the destination. The "censorship or ..." notion may be someone's overheated imagination -- it looks more like there's a backbone routing issue. paul
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 20:32:11 -0500 Jon Elson wrote: > Hello, all, > > I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really > weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the > ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au > as his ISP. All members of the web ring link to his > personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government > censorship or a private war between iinet and US content > providers, iinet or Australia are blocking access from at > least some sites in the US. So, from my work or home > (totally different IPs) I cannot access ANY personal pages > at iinet, but a few general help pages there can be > accessed. As far as I can tell, nobody else in the world is > being affected. > > Some webring members are now using classiccmp mirrors to > host the affected files to get around this problem. > > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in > the US, to check if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html Works from Silicon Valley (Mountain View) Lyle -- 73 AF6WS Bickley Consulting West Inc. http://bickleywest.com "Black holes are where God is dividing by zero"
Re: internet blocking problem ?
> From: Don North > Basically see no problems accessing any of the pages on sites. > ... > 12: be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com 22.400ms asymm 8 > 13: no reply > 14: no reply > 15: ae0.cr1.mel4.on.ii.net 217.966ms asymm 19 Oh, that's really interesting. A bunch of us get as far as Cogentco, and then it stops working. But you get through... which implies that the _route_ in Cogentco to Ii.net is OK. Which in turn implies that it's Ii.net who are blocking (via packet drop, I assume), based on the IP _source_ address. So it sounds like the earlier post (too lazy to track it down) which says this is Ii.net responding to complaints from others (since they haven't blocked access to _all_ of ii.net, just that 'members' site) is right. Noel
Re: internet blocking problem ?
* Jon Elson [150910 21:32]:
[..SNIP..]
> So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in
> the US, to check if they can view this page:
> http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html
>
> This is David Brooks' homebuilt 16-bit CPU.
>
> Please send me the results of your test, no matter whether
> it works or DOESN'T work, I am looking for statistics on how
> much of the US is being blocked. Also, let me know where
> you are. I am assuming this is only a problem in the US,
> but that is not guaranteed. I also am not able to make
> email contact with David Brooks, so it seems email is ALSO
> being blocked.
[..SNIP..]
No problem from my address in UK (Essex)
Have you tried any of the (many) proxy servers such as anonymouse.org
or tried using tor.
anonymouse used to be able to get to pirate bay before the ".se" url got killed
don't need it for the current (".mn") incarnation but I still keep a collection
of proxy server urls in my bookmarks "just in case!"
Andy
Re: internet blocking problem ?
* Jon Elson [150910 21:32]: [..SNIP..] > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in > the US, to check if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html > > This is David Brooks' homebuilt 16-bit CPU. > > Please send me the results of your test, no matter whether > it works or DOESN'T work, I am looking for statistics on how > much of the US is being blocked. Also, let me know where > you are. I am assuming this is only a problem in the US, > but that is not guaranteed. I also am not able to make > email contact with David Brooks, so it seems email is ALSO > being blocked. [..SNIP..] Hi Jon, No problem getting there from the northeast US (New Hampshire) using a Comcast business connection. Todd
Re: internet blocking problem ?
> http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html ETIMEDOUT. members.iinet.net.au resolves to 203.0.178.90 for me. mtr shows HostLoss% Snt Last Avg Best Wrst StDev 1. 98.124.61.89 0.0% 3821.1 1.5 0.7 123.1 7.2 2. 10.0.0.1 0.0% 3821.0 1.1 0.7 20.4 1.6 3. 205.233.56.2500.0% 382 14.5 14.8 13.3 38.7 3.3 4. 205.233.56.2530.0% 382 14.0 14.7 13.2 149.5 7.2 5. 76.10.144.58 0.0% 382 14.3 15.6 13.6 83.6 5.3 6. 69.196.136.48 0.0% 382 14.7 15.3 13.6 90.0 5.9 7. 209.51.184.2530.0% 382 14.4 25.7 13.6 132.2 20.9 8. 184.105.80.5 0.0% 382 25.6 30.0 23.6 222.6 14.5 9. 184.105.223.178 0.3% 382 42.0 42.0 31.3 235.0 24.0 10. 184.105.222.410.0% 382 68.5 72.3 51.6 222.1 18.8 11. 72.52.92.38 0.0% 382 170.9 104.4 77.4 259.0 23.9 12. ??? I then tried traceroute, in case mtr was getting stuck on a nonresponding hop with working hops beyond it. No joy; traceroute shows more or less[%] the same list of addresses, but then hops 12 through 30 are all no-response. [%] There are some minor differences; for example, hop 6 is 69.196.136.138 instead of 69.196.136.48. The hop 10 and 11 addresses, in particular, are the same. I am not in a position to tell whether it's Hurricane Electric or the next hop that's blocking traffic here; I don't know whether the hop after 72.52.92.38 would be another he.net host or not. These experiments were done from 98.124.61.94. Everything was legacy IPv4, since members.iinet.net.au doesn't seem to have a current-version IP address. (Appropriate enough, for this list. :-) /~\ The ASCII Mouse \ / Ribbon Campaign X Against HTMLmo...@rodents-montreal.org / \ Email! 7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39 4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 08:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to check if they can view this page: http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html It works for me here (northern Minnesota) Jules
Re: internet blocking problem ?
Can you do a traceroute to members.iinet.net.au? In case DNS is blocked, the IP address is 203.0.178.90. I've been on iiNet since they bought out my previous ISP. Here's a traceroute sample: 1 75-145-20-102-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net (75.145.20.102) 0.554 ms 1.468 ms 1.878 ms 2 96.120.101.173 (96.120.101.173) 12.365 ms 13.275 ms 13.457 ms 3 te-0-2-0-4-sur02.tacoma.wa.seattle.comcast.net (68.87.207.193) 21.075 ms 21.161 ms 21.245 ms 4 be-1-sur03.tacoma.wa.seattle.comcast.net (69.139.164.210) 19.539 ms 20.673 ms 20.886 ms 5 be-28-ar01.seattle.wa.seattle.comcast.net (69.139.164.205) 25.549 ms 25.034 ms 25.142 ms 6 be-33650-cr02.seattle.wa.ibone.comcast.net (68.86.93.165) 25.681 ms 23.712 ms 23.783 ms 7 he-0-13-0-0-pe04.seattle.wa.ibone.comcast.net (68.86.82.234) 21.195 ms 15.285 ms 22.278 ms 8 as174.seattle.wa.ibone.comcast.net (66.208.228.110) 22.719 ms 16.767 ms 19.258 ms 9 be2084.ccr22.sea01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.253) 20.280 ms 19.499 ms 22.475 ms 10 be2077.ccr22.sfo01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.241) 37.690 ms be2075.ccr21.sfo01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.233) 36.861 ms be2077.ccr22.sfo01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.241) 33.408 ms 11 be2164.ccr21.sjc01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.28.34) 34.810 ms be2165.ccr22.sjc01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.28.66) 39.254 ms be2164.ccr21.sjc01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.28.34) 39.929 ms 12 be2160.ccr21.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.27.161) 47.379 ms be2161.ccr22.lax01.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.27.169) 48.420 ms 45.969 ms 13 be2017.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.237) 43.561 ms 45.060 ms be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.88.10) 44.200 ms 14 * * * It times out after the 14th hop. g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. http://www.diy-cockpits.org/coll - Go Collimated or Go Home. Some people collect things for a hobby. Geeks collect hobbies. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://scarlet.deltasoft.com - Get it _today_!
RE: internet blocking problem ?
Ben wrote What I find more annoying, is this cloud crap. "There is no such thing as 'the cloud', it's just someone else's computer." Love that quote... so true... and I sell cloud services ;) J
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 11/09/2015 02:32, Jon Elson wrote: So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to check if they can view this page: http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html Yes, I can (from York, UK, my ISP is Plusnet). Here's a traceroute: 1 cisco877 (x.x.x.x) 2.400 ms 1.484 ms 1.354 ms 2 lo0-central10.pcl-ag02.plus.net (195.166.128.183) 23.643 ms 17.026 ms 17.156 ms 3 link-a-central10.pcl-gw01.plus.net (212.159.2.164) 17.246 ms 17.894 ms 17.364 ms 4 xe-10-1-0.pcl-cr01.plus.net (212.159.0.196) 16.966 ms 17.073 ms 19.371 ms 5 195.99.126.96 (195.99.126.96) 17.381 ms 18.651 ms 17.598 ms 6 core3-te0-2-0-19.faraday.ukcore.bt.net (109.159.249.5) 18.059 ms core3-te0-2-0-18.faraday.ukcore.bt.net (109.159.249.1) 18.011 ms core4-te0-0-0-19.faraday.ukcore.bt.net (109.159.249.47) 17.576 ms 7 host213-121-193-183.ukcore.bt.net (213.121.193.183) 19.329 ms peer6-BE7.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net (213.121.193.179) 20.248 ms peer6-hu0-19-0-1.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net (213.121.193.181) 17.568 ms 8 166-49-211-240.eu.bt.net (166.49.211.240) 17.862 ms 166-49-211-242.eu.bt.net (166.49.211.242) 17.447 ms 166-49-211-236.eu.bt.net (166.49.211.236) 17.307 ms 9 166-49-211-38.eu.bt.net (166.49.211.38) 17.490 ms 17.709 ms 17.629 ms 10 et-3-1-0.lax22.ip4.gtt.net (141.136.110.17) 155.702 ms 171.972 ms 154.836 ms 11 * * * 12 * * * 13 * * * 14 * * * 15 * * * 16 ae0.cr1.mel4.on.ii.net (150.101.33.10) 358.478 ms 358.957 ms 358.569 ms 17 ae5.cr1.adl6.on.ii.net (150.101.37.237) 358.802 ms 358.578 ms 366.367 ms 18 ae0.cr1.adl2.on.ii.net (150.101.33.2) 358.683 ms 359.084 ms 358.763 ms 19 aex.cr1.per1.on.ii.net (150.101.33.19) 358.888 ms 366.312 ms 366.156 ms 20 ae0.cr1.per4.on.ii.net (150.101.34.170) 358.079 ms 365.913 ms 366.136 ms 21 po6-10.per-qv1-bdr1.on.ii.net (150.101.33.91) 358.222 ms 377.115 ms 366.107 ms 22 te1-0-1-113.per-qv1-bdr2.on.ii.net (203.215.4.41) 295.066 ms 294.450 ms 294.677 ms 23 gi5-2.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.8) 302.885 ms 303.318 ms 296.124 ms 24 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 358.722 ms 366.378 ms 203.215.4.208 (203.215.4.208) 359.342 ms 25 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 366.395 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 304.259 ms 295.479 ms 26 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 358.789 ms 358.783 ms 359.028 ms 27 vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 296.329 ms 296.295 ms members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 358.812 ms 28 vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 297.262 ms 303.898 ms 296.044 ms 29 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 358.822 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 296.023 ms 304.562 ms 30 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 358.778 ms 358.834 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 303.581 ms $ -- Pete Pete Turnbull
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/10/2015 6:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: If you want to do some more research, just Google members.iinet and you will see a lot of hits of the form: http://members.iinet.net.au/~some_name and see if you can access ANY of them. From both my home and work IP, I can not get ANY of these pages to respond. If you want to see my page, it is : http://pico-systems.com/ring/ring.html I run my own DNS server that talks to OPENDNS, located in Saratoga, CA, USA. ISP is Comcast residential cable modem service. I can access the above pico-systems link, and was able to follow around the webring with no issues, using Firefox on a PC in my internal net. Basically see no problems accessing any of the pages on sites. From my server I see: nslookup members.iinet.net.au Server: 127.0.0.1 Address:127.0.0.1#53 Non-authoritative answer: Name: members.iinet.net.au Address: 203.0.178.90 ~[17] tracepath -l 1500 members.iinet.net.au 1: router.home.lan 2.577ms 2: 67.169.100.1 12.317ms 3: te-0-3-0-15-sur04.santaclara.ca.sfba.comcast.net 11.122ms 4: te-0-5-0-2-sur03.santaclara.ca.sfba.comcast.net 11.965ms asymm 3 5: he-0-3-0-4-ar01.santaclara.ca.sfba.comcast.net 11.750ms asymm 4 6: no reply 7: he-0-11-0-1-pe02.529bryant.ca.ibone.comcast.net 11.989ms asymm 6 8: 50.248.118.238 11.968ms asymm 7 9: be2013.ccr21.sjc03.atlas.cogentco.com 13.105ms asymm 8 10: be2000.ccr21.sjc01.atlas.cogentco.com 14.580ms asymm 9 11: no reply 12: be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com 22.400ms asymm 8 13: no reply 14: no reply 15: ae0.cr1.mel4.on.ii.net 217.966ms asymm 19 16: ae5.cr1.adl6.on.ii.net 218.017ms asymm 18 17: ae0.cr1.adl2.on.ii.net 216.772ms 18: aex.cr1.per1.on.ii.net 223.499ms asymm 16 19: ae0.cr1.per4.on.ii.net 214.932ms asymm 14 20: po6-10.per-qv1-bdr1.on.ii.net 214.709ms asymm 15 21: te1-0-1-113.per-qv1-bdr2.on.ii.net 231.016ms asymm 14 22: gi3-5.icp-qv1-core1.iinet.net.au 214.557ms asymm 15 23: 203.215.4.208 215.310ms asymm 15 24: members.iinet.net.au 214.540ms asymm 16 25: vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au 242.611ms asymm 15 26: vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au 214.764ms asymm 15 27: vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au 216.161ms asymm 15 28: vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au 220.364ms asymm 15 29: members.iinet.net.au 214.646ms asymm 16 30: vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au 215.907ms asymm 15 31: members.iinet.net.au 213.915ms asymm 16
Re: internet blocking problem ?
It was thus said that the Great Christian Kennedy once stated: > On 9/10/15 18:32, Jon Elson wrote: > > > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to > > check if they can view this page: > > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html > > DNS doesn't resolve. A traceroute to 203.0.178.90 dies at: DNS resolved for me, but I run my own DNS server at home. > 14 be2017.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.237) 64.145 ms > 83.689 ms 89.958 ms My traceroute died there as well. I'm in Boca Raton, Florida (16 miles north of Ft. Lauderdale) and my ISP is BellSouth/AT&T. -spc
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/10/15 18:32, Jon Elson wrote: > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to > check if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html DNS doesn't resolve. A traceroute to 203.0.178.90 dies at: 14 be2017.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.237) 64.145 ms 83.689 ms 89.958 ms Which seems consistent with what others are observing. FWIW, my ISP is a hole-in-the-wall outfit that provides wireless "broadband" to the rural mountainous portions of Northeaster California. -- Christian Kennedy, Ph.D. ch...@mainecoon.com AF6AP | DB0692 | PG00029419 http://www.mainecoon.comPGP KeyID 108DAB97 PGP fingerprint: 4E99 10B6 7253 B048 6685 6CBC 55E1 20A3 108D AB97 "Mr. McKittrick, after careful consideration…"
Re: internet blocking problem ?
Same here (in Toronto); can get to iinet.net.au but not members. But you can get at the ring from Jon's page; if you like blinkenlights check out the megaprocessor: an LED for _every_ signal, even inside the CPU etc: http://www.megaprocessor.com/homebrew.html Here's a video: http://www.megaprocessor.com/Images/flashing_lights.mp4 Wow! - Original Message - From: "Jon Elson" To: ; "discuss...@classiccmp.org:On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Friday, September 11, 2015 1:04 AM Subject: Re: internet blocking problem ? On 09/10/2015 11:11 PM, Gary Oliver wrote: FWIW I noticed this started several weeks ago - been trying to get to look at current crop of home builts and could not find a way to the web ring. Here's the latest list out of the javascript file that one of the ring members in Germany got me a copy from Dave Brooks' site. sites[index++] = "http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.homebrewcpu.com/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.aholme.co.uk/Mk1/Architecture.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.timefracture.org/D16.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.6502.org/users/dieter/"; sites[index++] = "http://cpuville.com/index.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.mycpu.eu"; sites[index++] = "http://www.galacticelectronics.com/Simple4BitCPU.HTML"; sites[index++] = "http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~harry/Relay/index.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ibmsystem3.nl/hjs22/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.wellytop.com/Fnagaton/DIYComputer.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.schlaefendorf.de/relaisrechner/dokumentation/index.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.nablaman.com/relay/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ostracodfiles.com/adeptpage/menu.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.bigbit.com/bigbit/BIGBITComputer.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.praxibetel.org/toro/toro.html"; sites[index++] = "http://alessiolombardo.altervista.org/ttlcomputer/index.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.pilawa.org/computer/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.bigmessowires.com/bmow1/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.saccade.com/writing/projects/CS428/WireWrap.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.northdownfarm.co.uk/rory/tim/tim-8.htm"; //sites[index++] = "http://neazoi.com/transistorizedcpu/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ttlcpu.com/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.northdownfarm.co.uk/rory/tim/tinytim.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ostracodfiles.com/elitepage/menu.html"; sites[index++] = "http://other-1.webs.com/"; sites[index++] = "http://isquared.weebly.com/index.html"; //sites[index++] = "http://penny.bplaced.net/www/index.php?id=8-bit-ttl-cpu"; sites[index++] = "http://relaysbc.sourceforge.net/"; sites[index++] = "http://canyouseethestars.com/project-the-kino-74/"; sites[index++] = "http://digitarworld.uw.hu/ttlcpu.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.clivemaxfield.com/diycalculator/popup-m-hrrgcomp.shtml"; sites[index++] = "http://pico-systems.com/ring/ring.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.megaprocessor.com/homebrew.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.relaiscomputer.nl/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.lovqvist.net/"; // sites[index++] = "http://k1.dyndns.org/Develop/Hardware/K1-Computer/"; // sites[index++] = "http://www.armandoacosta.com/cpu/index.php"; // sites[index++] = "http://web.mac.com/teisenmann/iWeb/adeptpage/menu.html"; // sites[index++] = "http://tripu.triphoenix.de/Main_Page"; // sites[index++] = "http://wiesi.dyndns.org/4bit/index.html"; // sites[index++] = "http://marc.cleave.me.uk/cpu/index.htm";
Re: internet blocking problem ?
It didn't work for me ... just hangs infinitely at "Waiting for members.iinet.net.au..." ... feels like packets just being dropped outright. I am on Comast Business, SE MI, USA my packets seem to get as far as Cogent in LA but then from there, nothing. Incidentally, it seems to work okay from the University of Michigan, A2 MI, on a Merit -> GTT -> IINet route. Best, Sean On Thu, Sep 10, 2015 at 9:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > Hello, all, > > I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really weird problem > has turned up. The guy who administers the ring, David Brooks, is in > Australia, and uses iinet.net.au as his ISP. All members of the web ring > link to his personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government > censorship or a private war between iinet and US content providers, iinet > or Australia are blocking access from at least some sites in the US. So, > from my work or home (totally different IPs) I cannot access ANY personal > pages at iinet, but a few general help pages there can be accessed. As far > as I can tell, nobody else in the world is being affected. > > Some webring members are now using classiccmp mirrors to host the affected > files to get around this problem. > > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to > check if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html > > This is David Brooks' homebuilt 16-bit CPU. > > Please send me the results of your test, no matter whether it works or > DOESN'T work, I am looking for statistics on how much of the US is being > blocked. Also, let me know where you are. I am assuming this is only a > problem in the US, but that is not guaranteed. I also am not able to make > email contact with David Brooks, so it seems email is ALSO being blocked. > > If you want to do some more research, just Google members.iinet and you > will see a lot of hits of the form: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~some_name > > and see if you can access ANY of them. From both my home and work IP, I > can not get ANY of these pages to respond. > > If you want to see my page, it is : > http://pico-systems.com/ring/ring.html > > Thanks for any help or info you can offer! > > Jon > > >
RE: internet blocking problem ?
> So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in > the US, to check if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html I have just viewed it (UK, Demon ISP). I've also checked, I can download at least one of the schematics linked from that page (I have not checked it makes electronic sense ;-)) -tony
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 11:11 PM, Gary Oliver wrote: FWIW I noticed this started several weeks ago - been trying to get to look at current crop of home builts and could not find a way to the web ring. Here's the latest list out of the javascript file that one of the ring members in Germany got me a copy from Dave Brooks' site. sites[index++] = "http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.homebrewcpu.com/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.aholme.co.uk/Mk1/Architecture.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.timefracture.org/D16.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.6502.org/users/dieter/"; sites[index++] = "http://cpuville.com/index.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.mycpu.eu"; sites[index++] = "http://www.galacticelectronics.com/Simple4BitCPU.HTML"; sites[index++] = "http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~harry/Relay/index.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ibmsystem3.nl/hjs22/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.wellytop.com/Fnagaton/DIYComputer.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.schlaefendorf.de/relaisrechner/dokumentation/index.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.nablaman.com/relay/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ostracodfiles.com/adeptpage/menu.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.bigbit.com/bigbit/BIGBITComputer.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.praxibetel.org/toro/toro.html"; sites[index++] = "http://alessiolombardo.altervista.org/ttlcomputer/index.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.pilawa.org/computer/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.bigmessowires.com/bmow1/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.saccade.com/writing/projects/CS428/WireWrap.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.northdownfarm.co.uk/rory/tim/tim-8.htm"; //sites[index++] = "http://neazoi.com/transistorizedcpu/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ttlcpu.com/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.northdownfarm.co.uk/rory/tim/tinytim.htm"; sites[index++] = "http://www.ostracodfiles.com/elitepage/menu.html"; sites[index++] = "http://other-1.webs.com/"; sites[index++] = "http://isquared.weebly.com/index.html"; //sites[index++] = "http://penny.bplaced.net/www/index.php?id=8-bit-ttl-cpu"; sites[index++] = "http://relaysbc.sourceforge.net/"; sites[index++] = "http://canyouseethestars.com/project-the-kino-74/"; sites[index++] = "http://digitarworld.uw.hu/ttlcpu.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.clivemaxfield.com/diycalculator/popup-m-hrrgcomp.shtml"; sites[index++] = "http://pico-systems.com/ring/ring.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.megaprocessor.com/homebrew.html"; sites[index++] = "http://www.relaiscomputer.nl/"; sites[index++] = "http://www.lovqvist.net/"; // sites[index++] = "http://k1.dyndns.org/Develop/Hardware/K1-Computer/"; // sites[index++] = "http://www.armandoacosta.com/cpu/index.php"; // sites[index++] = "http://web.mac.com/teisenmann/iWeb/adeptpage/menu.html"; // sites[index++] = "http://tripu.triphoenix.de/Main_Page"; // sites[index++] = "http://wiesi.dyndns.org/4bit/index.html"; // sites[index++] = "http://marc.cleave.me.uk/cpu/index.htm";
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 11:11 PM, Gary Oliver wrote: FWIW I noticed this started several weeks ago - been trying to get to look at current crop of home builts and could not find a way to the web ring. iinet.net.au is reachable but not members.iinet.net.au Yup, that is right, this all worked a couple months ago, for certain. I can't remember the last time it did work, but it wasn't all that long ago. The members.iinet resolves to a different IP address. Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 11:10 PM, Alexis Kotlowy wrote: Also, I'm talking to a network-oriented friend in Canada who reckons it's iiNet who are blocking packets. I'd like to know why! Alexis. iinet has posted several blogs and position papers decrying poorly thought out responses to intellectual property piracy, and draconian laws that apparently were enacted in Australia in June. They are apparently engaged in a war of words (and maybe more things they are not talking about) with the MPAA and other IP representatives. I suppose if iinet is worried about being sued for their user's making pirated content available for download, then blocking people outside .AU from seeing member's web pages might be a rational way to stop US groups from detecting the pirated content. OR, maybe some groups in the US have convinced some ISPs in the US to block certain .AU web sites. Ah ha! I see that iinet.net.au and members.iinet.net.au resolve to DIFFERENT IP addresses. (Neither of these respond to pings, but that is not that unusual, lots of facilities don't allow pinging from outside.) Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
Oh, BTW, here's the traceroute for my (successful) access. Oregon, again, but through Centurylink DSL: traceroute to 203.0.178.90 (203.0.178.90), 30 hops max, 60 byte packets 1 10.0.0.252 (10.0.0.252) 0.451 ms 0.392 ms 0.364 ms 2 192.168.0.1 (192.168.0.1) 5.304 ms 10.255 ms 14.160 ms 3 67.42.192.200 (67.42.192.200) 57.234 ms 60.042 ms 62.991 ms 4 eugn-agw1.inet.qwest.net (67.42.193.57) 63.939 ms 64.865 ms 65.806 ms 5 sea-brdr-02.inet.qwest.net (67.14.41.18) 81.767 ms 83.713 ms 73.671 ms 6 ae1.sea23.ip4.gtt.net (199.229.230.213) 113.670 ms 69.684 ms 70.529 ms 7 et-3-3-0.lax22.ip4.gtt.net (89.149.128.81) 95.460 ms 84.431 ms 94.272 ms 8 * * * 9 * * * 10 * * * 11 * * * 12 * * * 13 ae0.cr1.mel4.on.ii.net (150.101.33.10) 289.884 ms 289.696 ms 289.659 ms 14 ae5.cr1.adl6.on.ii.net (150.101.37.237) 289.656 ms 289.761 ms 289.644 ms 15 ae0.cr1.adl2.on.ii.net (150.101.33.2) 289.679 ms 289.713 ms 289.874 ms 16 aex.cr1.per1.on.ii.net (150.101.33.19) 289.754 ms 290.740 ms 349.686 ms 17 ae0.cr1.per4.on.ii.net (150.101.34.170) 330.610 ms 288.678 ms 289.842 ms 18 po6-10.per-qv1-bdr1.on.ii.net (150.101.33.91) 289.816 ms 289.791 ms 277.701 ms 19 te1-0-1-113.per-qv1-bdr2.on.ii.net (203.215.4.41) 279.471 ms 282.395 ms 283.352 ms 20 gi5-2.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.8) 284.290 ms gi3-5.icp-qv1-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.4) 285.234 ms gi5-2.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.8) 288.152 ms 21 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 291.103 ms 292.040 ms 292.977 ms 22 vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 293.899 ms members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 294.856 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 295.797 ms 23 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 297.746 ms 301.692 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 302.626 ms 24 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 279.594 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 281.623 ms 284.800 ms 25 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 286.828 ms 287.148 ms 287.120 ms 26 vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 288.223 ms 289.297 ms members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 289.818 ms 27 vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 289.838 ms members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 289.251 ms 292.341 ms 28 vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 289.256 ms members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 293.338 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 290.765 ms 29 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 290.218 ms 314.638 ms vl311.icp-osb-core1.iinet.net.au (203.215.4.185) 311.164 ms 30 members.iinet.net.au (203.0.178.90) 307.669 ms 304.158 ms 309.702 ms Don't know if this helps or not. Odd that Comcast isn't allowing things through. --Chuck
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 10:38 PM, Alexis Kotlowy wrote: On 11/09/2015 12:52 PM, Jon Elson wrote: On 09/10/2015 09:07 PM, Alexis Kotlowy wrote: Can you do a traceroute to members.iinet.net.au? In case DNS is blocked, the IP address is 203.0.178.90. I've been on iiNet since they bought out my previous ISP. Cheers, Alexis. Traceroute goes out to 30 hops and stops, and I couldn't figure out from the man page how to increase it. Not a DNS problem. Thanks, Jon I'm poking around with this service: http://www.cogentco.com/en/network/looking-glass Probing telstra.com (a major Australian telecommunications company) gets through, and even iinet.net.au gets through, but members.iinet.net.au stops as it goes to leave California. Are you able to reach iinet.net.au? Yes. Actually, it seems that MEMBERS.iinet.net.au is what is being blocked, although I seem to not be able to email David Brooks through his iinet email address, either. But, the iinet main page does work for me. A number of other people seem to indicate if their routing takes them through cogent that it fails, so this may be the key node that is blocking iinet. Jon Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
Same behaviour from comcast.com in Oregon (a cablemodem connection) as well as from peakinternet.com (local isp.) Also have tried using one of my AWS (amazon) virtuals and get the similar results. comcast.com traceroute stops at: be2017.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.0.237) my amazon instance stops at: be2019.ccr21.lax04.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.88.10) peakinternet.com stops at: 100ge11-1.core1.lax2.he.net (72.52.92.122) FWIW I noticed this started several weeks ago - been trying to get to look at current crop of home builts and could not find a way to the web ring. iinet.net.au is reachable but not members.iinet.net.au The amazon instance is in the US West region (north-central Oregon I presume.) Tomorrow I'll fire up a proxy on the east coast and see what happens. -Gary On 09/10/2015 08:49 PM, Brian L. Stuart wrote: On Thu, 9/10/15, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote: From a friend of mine on RoadRunner (I won't say where, but in the USA of course); their trace dies as it leaves the Cogent Communications network (since it bounces through a few of their servers before dying). I'm seeing the same behavior from Verizon-provided service. BLS
Re: internet blocking problem ?
> On 11/09/2015 12:52 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > > I'm poking around with this service: > http://www.cogentco.com/en/network/looking-glass > > Probing telstra.com (a major Australian telecommunications company) gets > through, and even iinet.net.au gets through, but members.iinet.net.au > stops as it goes to leave California. > > Are you able to reach iinet.net.au? > > Alexis. > Also, I'm talking to a network-oriented friend in Canada who reckons it's iiNet who are blocking packets. I'd like to know why! Alexis.
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On Thu, 9/10/15, Christian Gauger-Cosgrove wrote: > From a friend of mine on RoadRunner (I won't say where, but in the USA > of course); their trace dies as it leaves the Cogent Communications > network (since it bounces through a few of their servers before dying). I'm seeing the same behavior from Verizon-provided service. BLS
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 11/09/2015 12:52 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > On 09/10/2015 09:07 PM, Alexis Kotlowy wrote: >> Can you do a traceroute to members.iinet.net.au? In case >> DNS is blocked, the IP address is 203.0.178.90. I've been >> on iiNet since they bought out my previous ISP. Cheers, >> Alexis. > Traceroute goes out to 30 hops and stops, and I couldn't > figure out from the man page how to increase it. > > Not a DNS problem. > > Thanks, > > Jon > I'm poking around with this service: http://www.cogentco.com/en/network/looking-glass Probing telstra.com (a major Australian telecommunications company) gets through, and even iinet.net.au gets through, but members.iinet.net.au stops as it goes to leave California. Are you able to reach iinet.net.au? Alexis.
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 09:54 PM, ben wrote: Well it does not work in CANADA as of today. WOW, this is new info! It was working about a month ago, as I am designing a 8 bit cpu on the DE1 FPGA PCB, and I was looking for ideas. Can one get all the web pages mirrored, I hate this loss information with the net. Ben. PS. Your site is fine, The Down Under sites are well DOWN and under. My page works now because I have removed the links to the iinet files and gotten a local copy of the .js file. Thinking about it the PDP 11 was strange beast, as having both character and floating point data, even with split I&D you had way too small of memory.A simple 32 bit machine could have been a better option. Mind you the 11 was designed before 4K dram hit the market. I have a nice 32 bit design but I want to get this 8 bit cpu working first. Any one knows what modern C compiler will compile Tiny C version 1.0? Man with a CPU and no software. I actually LIKED the PDP-11 architecture quite a LOT, but the limited memory was a big killer. The 11 was designed when CORE was still king! We had several PDP-11's with core in them at first. I played around with Tiny C a bit, a LONG time ago. I guess I ran it on a MicroSoft C compiler. Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 09:07 PM, Alexis Kotlowy wrote: Can you do a traceroute to members.iinet.net.au? In case DNS is blocked, the IP address is 203.0.178.90. I've been on iiNet since they bought out my previous ISP. Cheers, Alexis. Traceroute goes out to 30 hops and stops, and I couldn't figure out from the man page how to increase it. Not a DNS problem. Thanks, Jon
Re: internet blocking problem ?
I've forwarded this to a journo at The Register, and hopefully they'll have a good poke at it. Mike On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 1:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: > Hello, all, > > I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really weird problem has > turned up. The guy who administers the ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, > and uses iinet.net.au as his ISP. All members of the web ring link to his > personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government censorship or a > private war between iinet and US content providers, iinet or Australia are > blocking access from at least some sites in the US. So, from my work or > home (totally different IPs) I cannot access ANY personal pages at iinet, > but a few general help pages there can be accessed. As far as I can tell, > nobody else in the world is being affected. > > Some webring members are now using classiccmp mirrors to host the affected > files to get around this problem. > > So, I wonder if I can ask classiccmp members, especially in the US, to check > if they can view this page: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/simplex.html > > This is David Brooks' homebuilt 16-bit CPU. > > Please send me the results of your test, no matter whether it works or > DOESN'T work, I am looking for statistics on how much of the US is being > blocked. Also, let me know where you are. I am assuming this is only a > problem in the US, but that is not guaranteed. I also am not able to make > email contact with David Brooks, so it seems email is ALSO being blocked. > > If you want to do some more research, just Google members.iinet and you will > see a lot of hits of the form: > http://members.iinet.net.au/~some_name > > and see if you can access ANY of them. From both my home and work IP, I can > not get ANY of these pages to respond. > > If you want to see my page, it is : > http://pico-systems.com/ring/ring.html > > Thanks for any help or info you can offer! > > Jon > > -- http://www.corestore.org 'No greater love hath a man than he lay down his life for his brother. Not for millions, not for glory, not for fame. For one person, in the dark, where no one will ever know or see.'
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 10 September 2015 at 22:07, Alexis Kotlowy wrote: > iiNet have been outspoken about users' rights and privacy in the face of > the War on Piracy. While they don't condone piracy, they have serious > concerns about the way it's being dealt with (or at least that's my > understanding). > > I get the impression some ISP's are blocking access to iiNet. I don't > see how this could do anything other than hurt the end users, but that > seems to be the tactic the content owners have taken in the past so I > wouldn't be surprised. > It'll only get worse if the TPP goes through… > Can you do a traceroute to members.iinet.net.au? In case DNS is blocked, > the IP address is 203.0.178.90. I've been on iiNet since they bought out > my previous ISP. > Doing a traceroute from my home, which is serviced by TekSavvy (in Canada); my connection to members.iinet.net.au dies at a router owned by Hurricane Electric, Inc. of California. Since it seems to bounce through a few of their routers, I'm assuming that whoever Hurricane Electric hands off the packets to kills it. (Based on my traceroute; other results may vary.) >From a friend of mine on RoadRunner (I won't say where, but in the USA of course); their trace dies as it leaves the Cogent Communications network (since it bounces through a few of their servers before dying). Regards, Christian -- Christian M. Gauger-Cosgrove STCKON08DS0 Contact information available upon request.
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/10/2015 9:03 PM, jwsmobile wrote: I am forwarding this to a friend in Australia for him to do more extensive comment and diagnosis. Try http://traceroute.org/ for diagnosing this. It allows you to perform traceroute from cooperating servers across the world, including australia. there are some sites you will have to ferret out to allow you to bypass country IP blocking. And yet australia is one of the more stupid countries (exceeded only by Germany and the EU) about censorship, and fouling up the works. Yes the page timed out on me. I'll see if I can find the router that did it and post an update. thanks Jim What I find more annoying, is this cloud crap. The web site is down, click here to try a update. YOU TURKEYS! THAT IS WHY ARE CACHE-ING THE STUFF. Ben.
Re: internet blocking problem ?
I am forwarding this to a friend in Australia for him to do more extensive comment and diagnosis. Try http://traceroute.org/ for diagnosing this. It allows you to perform traceroute from cooperating servers across the world, including australia. there are some sites you will have to ferret out to allow you to bypass country IP blocking. And yet australia is one of the more stupid countries (exceeded only by Germany and the EU) about censorship, and fouling up the works. Yes the page timed out on me. I'll see if I can find the router that did it and post an update. thanks Jim On 9/10/2015 7:07 PM, Alexis Kotlowy wrote: On 11/09/2015 11:02 AM, Jon Elson wrote: Hello, all, I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au as his ISP. iiNet have been outspoken about users' rights and privacy in the face of the War on Piracy. While they don't condone piracy, they have serious concerns about the way it's being dealt with (or at least that's my understanding). I get the impression some ISP's are blocking access to iiNet. I don't see how this could do anything other than hurt the end users, but that seems to be the tactic the content owners have taken in the past so I wouldn't be surprised. Can you do a traceroute to members.iinet.net.au? In case DNS is blocked, the IP address is 203.0.178.90. I've been on iiNet since they bought out my previous ISP. Cheers, Alexis.
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 09/10/2015 06:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: Hello, all, I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au as his ISP. All members of the web ring link to his personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government censorship or a private war between iinet and US content providers, iinet or Australia are blocking access from at least some sites in the US. So, from my work or home (totally different IPs) I cannot access ANY personal pages at iinet, but a few general help pages there can be accessed. As far as I can tell, nobody else in the world is being affected. Works from western US just fine. Have you considered using a proxy server? Some may frown on it, but that's how I've had to access some blocked sites, such as the Olympics reporting on the Beeb. (Just find a UK anonymous proxy and you're good). There are lists of proxies on the net that are continuously updated. FWIW, Chuck
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 9/10/2015 7:32 PM, Jon Elson wrote: Hello, all, I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au as his ISP. All members of the web ring link to his personal web pages at iinet. Apparently, due to government censorship or a private war between iinet and US content providers, iinet or Australia are blocking access from at least some sites in the US. So, from my work or home (totally different IPs) I cannot access ANY personal pages at iinet, but a few general help pages there can be accessed. As far as I can tell, nobody else in the world is being affected. Well it does not work in CANADA as of today. It was working about a month ago, as I am designing a 8 bit cpu on the DE1 FPGA PCB, and I was looking for ideas. Can one get all the web pages mirrored, I hate this loss information with the net. Ben. PS. Your site is fine, The Down Under sites are well DOWN and under. Thinking about it the PDP 11 was strange beast, as having both character and floating point data, even with split I&D you had way too small of memory.A simple 32 bit machine could have been a better option. Mind you the 11 was designed before 4K dram hit the market. I have a nice 32 bit design but I want to get this 8 bit cpu working first. Any one knows what modern C compiler will compile Tiny C version 1.0? Man with a CPU and no software.
Re: internet blocking problem ?
On 11/09/2015 11:02 AM, Jon Elson wrote: > Hello, all, > > I am a member of the Homebuilt CPU web-ring, and a really > weird problem has turned up. The guy who administers the > ring, David Brooks, is in Australia, and uses iinet.net.au > as his ISP. iiNet have been outspoken about users' rights and privacy in the face of the War on Piracy. While they don't condone piracy, they have serious concerns about the way it's being dealt with (or at least that's my understanding). I get the impression some ISP's are blocking access to iiNet. I don't see how this could do anything other than hurt the end users, but that seems to be the tactic the content owners have taken in the past so I wouldn't be surprised. Can you do a traceroute to members.iinet.net.au? In case DNS is blocked, the IP address is 203.0.178.90. I've been on iiNet since they bought out my previous ISP. Cheers, Alexis.
