Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[James B. Byrne]

On Fri, February 10, 2017 15:44, Alice Wonder wrote:
> On 02/10/2017 12:34 PM, James B. Byrne wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, February 10, 2017 06:26, Patrick Begou wrote:
>>> Hello
>>>
>>> I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional
>>> environment with
>>> CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to
>>> access some
>>> old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of
>>> "/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old
>>> Firefox32
>>> version
>>> to administrate these servers.
>>>
>>> Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox
>>> cannot
>>> connect to them anymore saying: /An error occurred during a
>>> connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server rejected
>>> the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version
>>> than the server supports// //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT
>>>
>>> /Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous
>>> connections to olds and new base level (and local) system
>>> administration services ?
>>>
>>
>> This situation arises because older, dare I say old, equipment
>> released with embedded software and using http/https as the
>> administrative front end were shipped with minimally compliant x-509
>> certificates.  Often self-signed with 1kb keys and md5 signature
>> hashes. Not to mention many are past their expiry dates.
>>
>> However, given the revelations of state sanctioned snooping on
>> network
>> traffic browsers are being pushed to implement increased compliance
>> checking for the overall security of users. Firefox is simply
>> implementing what various 'authorities' are recommending as secure
>> practices with respect to authentication using pki and x-509
>> certificates.
>>
>> The present situation is a PIA.  It could be a lot more
>> user-friendly
>> if FF so chose. They could have easily allowed one to turn off these
>> advanced compliance checks for specific IP and DNS addresses so that
>> the intended benefit remained but the interference with existing
>> infrastructure was minimised.
>>
>> But, FF is on its own chosen path to oblivion and the idea of
>> compromise is totally absent from their project plan.
>>
>>
>
> IMHO FireFox is doing the right thing. Compromises in policy is how
> system compromises often happen.
>
> If you can change the setting to be more forgiving of certain bad
> vendors, then so can malware.
>
> What we really need to do is demand better from the manufacturers of
> products we use in a "professional environment" - and it is extremely
> important we demand better from them now, during the dawn of IoT.
>
>

It is a bit difficult for an end user to insist that a vendor improve
a ten year old piece of equipment.  Sure, that might be as simple as a
firmware update. But why not insist that people buy new product
instead and thereby add to the bottom line?  Which way do see most
commercial firms going?

FF is a consumer item that is being shipped with a supposedly
Enterprise Linux distribution.  This leads to problems that are
created by the divergence between the target audience and Enterprise
users.  Enterprises tend to have a much more robustly secured gateware
to the wider Internet than consumers.  Which for that audience makes a
lot of the more esoteric security enhancements rather useless.  If an
intruder can carry out a MTM attack on your internal LAN then nothing
FF can do is going to have much of an effect.

A professional organisation would not simply cut administrators off
from the devices that they are required to manage. Nor would it
dictate how a company spends its money on hardware.  A bunch of
self-righteous zealots might.  Which may account for the fact that FF
(all versions) market share is now less than 10%.[1]

[1]
https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-market-share.aspx?qprid=2=0=M=216=ColumnName%09LK%09Fire*


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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[isdtor]

>   You can also try the mainline version of Pale Moon if you want 64-bit.
> http://linux.palemoon.org/  It uses gtk2, but I don't know if it's
> compatible with other old libraries that CentOS 6 uses.  My build goes
> out of its way to be compatible with older libraries.

I did once build pm on CentOS6 as poc, but after switched to the distributed 
binaries. 26.x is the end of line for CentOS6, and I haven't tried building 
27.x. Maybe I'll try that, addressing the library situation with custom or 
static versions.

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Patrick Bégou]

Alice Wonder a écrit :

On 02/10/2017 12:34 PM, James B. Byrne wrote:


On Fri, February 10, 2017 06:26, Patrick Begou wrote:

Hello

I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional
environment with
CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to
access some
old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of
"/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old Firefox32
version
to administrate these servers.

Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot
connect to them anymore saying: /An error occurred during a
connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server rejected
the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version
than the server supports// //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT

/Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous
connections to olds and new base level (and local) system
administration services ?



This situation arises because older, dare I say old, equipment
released with embedded software and using http/https as the
administrative front end were shipped with minimally compliant x-509
certificates.  Often self-signed with 1kb keys and md5 signature
hashes. Not to mention many are past their expiry dates.

However, given the revelations of state sanctioned snooping on network
traffic browsers are being pushed to implement increased compliance
checking for the overall security of users. Firefox is simply
implementing what various 'authorities' are recommending as secure
practices with respect to authentication using pki and x-509
certificates.

The present situation is a PIA.  It could be a lot more user-friendly
if FF so chose. They could have easily allowed one to turn off these
advanced compliance checks for specific IP and DNS addresses so that
the intended benefit remained but the interference with existing
infrastructure was minimised.

But, FF is on its own chosen path to oblivion and the idea of
compromise is totally absent from their project plan.




IMHO FireFox is doing the right thing. Compromises in policy is how 
system compromises often happen.


If you can change the setting to be more forgiving of certain bad 
vendors, then so can malware.
In this situation the working solution is the  worst one: disabling 
https and re-enabling http on these devices.


What we really need to do is demand better from the manufacturers of 
products we use in a "professional environment" - and it is extremely 
important we demand better from them now, during the dawn of IoT.

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Walter Dnes]

On Sat, Feb 11, 2017 at 11:37:09AM +0100, Patrick Bégou wrote
> Yes David, I'm using a release 32 of Firefox to reach my olds C6100 
> IDRAC7 interface.
> The problem is for latest Firefox versions as they require libgtk-3 not 
> available in Centos6/RHEL6 distribution.
> 
> Today I use a very very bad solution to reach my switch with latest 
> firmware version from the latest Firefox available in CentOS: I disable 
> https and use http
> Even if it is on a private network, in a dedicated vlan behind a 
> firewall... I don't like this.

Hello;

  Disclosure: I'm the person who does the Pale Moon (Firefox fork) SSE
contributed build for linux.  Note: this build is 32-bit only.  See
https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=40=13530=20#p105849
I subscribe to this list because I use a CentOS 6.5 chroot to do the
builds, and I have occasional questions.  SSE-only machines (i.e. no
SSE2 instructions) are old Pentium 3 and similar.  The SSE build will
work on newer machines, but may be a bit slower than the standard build,
because it does not use the SSE2 instruction set.

  Older machines often run distros like Puppy linux which use older
glibc, gtk2, etc.  Puppy linux does have security fixes backported.
Because Pale Moon SSE version is built in CentOS 6.5, it should work
in 32-bit CentOS.

  You can also try the mainline version of Pale Moon if you want 64-bit.
http://linux.palemoon.org/  It uses gtk2, but I don't know if it's
compatible with other old libraries that CentOS 6 uses.  My build goes
out of its way to be compatible with older libraries.

-- 
Walter Dnes 
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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Patrick Bégou]

Yes David, I'm using a release 32 of Firefox to reach my olds C6100 
IDRAC7 interface.
The problem is for latest Firefox versions as they require libgtk-3 not 
available in Centos6/RHEL6 distribution.


Today I use a very very bad solution to reach my switch with latest 
firmware version from the latest Firefox available in CentOS: I disable 
https and use http
Even if it is on a private network, in a dedicated vlan behind a 
firewall... I don't like this.


Patrick

David Nelson a écrit :

On 2/10/17 3:26 AM, Patrick Begou wrote:
/Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous 
connections to olds and new base level (and local) system 
administration services ?


FYI you can download any previous release of Firefox from the URL 
below, and it will run right out of its own directory without being 
'installed' per se. So you could find one that is compatible and keep 
it separate from the one you use for regular browsing. You'd probably 
want to run it as a different user on your box, and/or a separate 
profile.


http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/

Or if you don't want to worry about which user and profile you're in, 
you could try an equivalent release of SeaMonkey.


http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/seamonkey/releases/

Either way it would enable you to have a more secure, up-to-date 
browser for regular use while also having one that is compatible with 
the other systems you need to use.

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[David Nelson]

On 2/10/17 3:26 AM, Patrick Begou wrote:
/Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous 
connections to olds and new base level (and local) system 
administration services ?


FYI you can download any previous release of Firefox from the URL below, 
and it will run right out of its own directory without being 'installed' 
per se. So you could find one that is compatible and keep it separate 
from the one you use for regular browsing. You'd probably want to run it 
as a different user on your box, and/or a separate profile.


http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/

Or if you don't want to worry about which user and profile you're in, 
you could try an equivalent release of SeaMonkey.


http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/seamonkey/releases/

Either way it would enable you to have a more secure, up-to-date browser 
for regular use while also having one that is compatible with the other 
systems you need to use.

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[John R Pierce]

On 2/10/2017 12:44 PM, Alice Wonder wrote:
IMHO FireFox is doing the right thing. Compromises in policy is how 
system compromises often happen.


If you can change the setting to be more forgiving of certain bad 
vendors, then so can malware.


What we really need to do is demand better from the manufacturers of 
products we use in a "professional environment" - and it is extremely 
important we demand better from them now, during the dawn of IoT. 


you get 'better' from vendors by maintaining paid support contracts, 
doing frequent firmware updates, and regular hardware updates. the 
hardware in question here is likely over 5 years old (I know this too 
well, I have a rack full of 3-6 year old hardware in my lab at work, all 
of which is off support due to it being test/dev, and corporate 
budgetary constraints).


Chrome is even worse as far as making it impossible to connect to older 
embedded services like the various IPMI remote consoles, etc.




--
john r pierce, recycling bits in santa cruz

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Alice Wonder]

On 02/10/2017 12:34 PM, James B. Byrne wrote:


On Fri, February 10, 2017 06:26, Patrick Begou wrote:

Hello

I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional
environment with
CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to
access some
old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of
"/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old Firefox32
version
to administrate these servers.

Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot
connect to them anymore saying: /An error occurred during a
connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server rejected
the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version
than the server supports// //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT

/Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous
connections to olds and new base level (and local) system
administration services ?



This situation arises because older, dare I say old, equipment
released with embedded software and using http/https as the
administrative front end were shipped with minimally compliant x-509
certificates.  Often self-signed with 1kb keys and md5 signature
hashes. Not to mention many are past their expiry dates.

However, given the revelations of state sanctioned snooping on network
traffic browsers are being pushed to implement increased compliance
checking for the overall security of users. Firefox is simply
implementing what various 'authorities' are recommending as secure
practices with respect to authentication using pki and x-509
certificates.

The present situation is a PIA.  It could be a lot more user-friendly
if FF so chose. They could have easily allowed one to turn off these
advanced compliance checks for specific IP and DNS addresses so that
the intended benefit remained but the interference with existing
infrastructure was minimised.

But, FF is on its own chosen path to oblivion and the idea of
compromise is totally absent from their project plan.




IMHO FireFox is doing the right thing. Compromises in policy is how 
system compromises often happen.


If you can change the setting to be more forgiving of certain bad 
vendors, then so can malware.


What we really need to do is demand better from the manufacturers of 
products we use in a "professional environment" - and it is extremely 
important we demand better from them now, during the dawn of IoT.

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[James B. Byrne]

On Fri, February 10, 2017 06:26, Patrick Begou wrote:
> Hello
>
> I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional
> environment with
> CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to
> access some
> old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of
> "/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old Firefox32
> version
> to administrate these servers.
>
> Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot
> connect to them anymore saying: /An error occurred during a
> connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server rejected
> the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version
> than the server supports// //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT
>
> /Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous
> connections to olds and new base level (and local) system
> administration services ?
>

This situation arises because older, dare I say old, equipment
released with embedded software and using http/https as the
administrative front end were shipped with minimally compliant x-509
certificates.  Often self-signed with 1kb keys and md5 signature
hashes. Not to mention many are past their expiry dates.

However, given the revelations of state sanctioned snooping on network
traffic browsers are being pushed to implement increased compliance
checking for the overall security of users. Firefox is simply
implementing what various 'authorities' are recommending as secure
practices with respect to authentication using pki and x-509
certificates.

The present situation is a PIA.  It could be a lot more user-friendly
if FF so chose. They could have easily allowed one to turn off these
advanced compliance checks for specific IP and DNS addresses so that
the intended benefit remained but the interference with existing
infrastructure was minimised.

But, FF is on its own chosen path to oblivion and the idea of
compromise is totally absent from their project plan.


-- 
***  e-Mail is NOT a SECURE channel  ***
Do NOT transmit sensitive data via e-Mail
 Do NOT open attachments nor follow links sent by e-Mail

James B. Byrnemailto:byrn...@harte-lyne.ca
Harte & Lyne Limited  http://www.harte-lyne.ca
9 Brockley Drive  vox: +1 905 561 1241
Hamilton, Ontario fax: +1 905 561 0757
Canada  L8E 3C3

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Patrick Begou]

Tru Huynh wrote:

On Fri, Feb 10, 2017 at 12:26:14PM +0100, Patrick Begou wrote:

Hello

I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional
environment with CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't
use it anymore to access some old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL
C6100) because of "/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to
install an old Firefox32 version to administrate these servers.


Can you try: (in Firefox's about:config):
possible workaround for SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY
 security.ssl3.dhe_rsa_aes_128_sha
 security.ssl3.dhe_rsa_aes_256_sha

These are yet set to true.



Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot
connect to them anymore saying:
/An error occurred during a connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The
server rejected the handshake because the client downgraded to a
lower TLS version than the server supports//
//SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT

possible workaround for SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT
 security.tls.version.max 3 -> 1

You might want to revert for safer browsing, after.
With this setting I get SSL_ERROR_NO_CYPHER_OVERLAP and I cannot connect to the 
switch.
Of course I can re-activate the old firmware version of the switch, but it has a 
bug I would like to solve too.


I know that to remains compatible with old config could have security problems 
but all of these devices
use dedicated ports (IDRAC, Out of band port management) on a private network 
which could be easily isolated.
The idea is to have a browser dedicated to this administration (instead of 
several versions/profiles)

/Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous
connections to olds and new base level (and local) system
administration services ?

maybe different profiles with differents security setup?

Cheers

Tru


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Thanks all for your suggestion to find a solution or detailing your local work 
around


Patrick

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|  BP 53 X | Tel 04 76 82 51 35   |
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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Leon Fauster]

> Am 10.02.2017 um 12:26 schrieb Patrick Begou 
> :
> 
> I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional environment with 
> CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to access 
> some old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of 
> "/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old Firefox32 
> version to administrate these servers.
> 
> Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot connect 
> to them anymore saying:
> /An error occurred during a connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server 
> rejected the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version 
> than the server supports//
> //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT
> 
> /Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous connections 
> to olds and new base level (and local) system administration services ?


What says the current Firefox (version 45.7.0) while trying to connect to the 
upgraded IDRAC7's ?

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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Tru Huynh]

On Fri, Feb 10, 2017 at 12:26:14PM +0100, Patrick Begou wrote:
> Hello
> 
> I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional
> environment with CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't
> use it anymore to access some old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL
> C6100) because of "/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to
> install an old Firefox32 version to administrate these servers.
> 
Can you try: (in Firefox's about:config):
possible workaround for SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY
security.ssl3.dhe_rsa_aes_128_sha
security.ssl3.dhe_rsa_aes_256_sha

> Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot
> connect to them anymore saying:
> /An error occurred during a connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The
> server rejected the handshake because the client downgraded to a
> lower TLS version than the server supports//
> //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT

possible workaround for SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT
security.tls.version.max 3 -> 1

You might want to revert for safer browsing, after.

> /Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous
> connections to olds and new base level (and local) system
> administration services ?
maybe different profiles with differents security setup?

Cheers

Tru
-- 
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http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get=0xBEFA581B


pgp5iLG_dMbIV.pgp
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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Andreas Benzler]

Hm,

an Idee is to use a docker instance. I do that at my office, because
need JAVA 1.6 in the browser.

Sincerely

Andy

Am Freitag, den 10.02.2017, 12:26 +0100 schrieb Patrick Begou:
> Hello
> 
> I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional environment with 
> CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to access 
> some 
> old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of 
> "/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old Firefox32 
> version 
> to administrate these servers.
> 
> Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot connect 
> to 
> them anymore saying:
> /An error occurred during a connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server 
> rejected 
> the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version than the 
> server supports//
> //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT
> 
> /Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous connections 
> to 
> olds and new base level (and local) system administration services ?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Patrick
> 


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Re: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Nux!]

Hi,

I had the same problem. Stick to the old Firefox, but only to access old idrac, 
ipmi etc.

--
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Nux!
www.nux.ro

- Original Message -
> From: "Patrick Begou" <patrick.be...@legi.grenoble-inp.fr>
> To: "CentOS mailing list" <centos@centos.org>
> Sent: Friday, 10 February, 2017 11:26:14
> Subject: [CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

> Hello
> 
> I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional environment with
> CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to access 
> some
> old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of
> "/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old Firefox32 version
> to administrate these servers.
> 
> Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot connect 
> to
> them anymore saying:
> /An error occurred during a connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server rejected
> the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version than the
> server supports//
> //SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT
> 
> /Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous connections to
> olds and new base level (and local) system administration services ?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Patrick
> 
> --
> ===
>|  Equipe M.O.S.T. |  |
>|  Patrick BEGOU   | mailto:patrick.be...@grenoble-inp.fr |
>|  LEGI|  |
>|  BP 53 X | Tel 04 76 82 51 35   |
>|  38041 GRENOBLE CEDEX| Fax 04 76 82 52 71   |
> ===
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[CentOS] Wich web browser on CentOS6 ?

[Patrick Begou]

Hello

I have more and more troubles using firefox in professional environment with 
CentOS6. The latest version is 45.7.0 But I can't use it anymore to access some 
old server hardware (IDRAC7 of DELL C6100) because of 
"/SSL_ERROR_WEAK_SERVER_CERT_KEY/".  I had to install an old Firefox32 version 
to administrate these servers.


Today I upgrade the firmware of 2 DELL switch and now Firefox cannot connect to 
them anymore saying:
/An error occurred during a connection to xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx. The server rejected 
the handshake because the client downgraded to a lower TLS version than the 
server supports//

//SSL_ERROR_INAPPROPRIATE_FALLBACK_ALERT

/Is there a CentOS6 recommended web browser allowing continuous connections to 
olds and new base level (and local) system administration services ?


Thanks

Patrick

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|  Equipe M.O.S.T. |  |
|  Patrick BEGOU   | mailto:patrick.be...@grenoble-inp.fr |
|  LEGI|  |
|  BP 53 X | Tel 04 76 82 51 35   |
|  38041 GRENOBLE CEDEX| Fax 04 76 82 52 71   |
===

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