RE: Where are the Los Angeles Developers?

2006-12-21 Thread Dave Phillips
Too bad I can't move it there!

-Original Message-
From: Maureen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 2:26 AM
To: CF-Jobs-Talk
Subject: Re: Where are the Los Angeles Developers?


And here in San Francisco is would be worth 20 million.

On 12/20/06, Jacob [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I own a 4,000 square foot house in the Dallas Fort Worth area for 
 $200k

 And in Los Angeles.. that would be over $1 million.




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RE: Where are the Los Angeles Developers?

2006-12-21 Thread Dave Phillips
Bill, Your point #1 is one well made, however, I think that some positions
could be designated as telecommutable and not have issues with EEOC or any
other regulatory agency.  Then the whiners can just be told no and the HR
dept doesn't have to worry about repercussions.  Heck, if they get ticked
off and leave, then the company will probably be better off without them
anyway.  Who wants a whiner working for them anyway?

As for point 2, I would make the argument that any kind of collaboration
that is needed on any application development project can be done remotely.
You do not need to be 'face to face' with anyone (regardless of who is
involved with the project) and even if you do, just use video conferencing,
webcams, etc.  The internet lends itself to collaboration and if a company
is willing to spend the money on the collaborative tools, then a higher
productivity will result because when you are getting together 'in person'
for meetings, there is a lot of unproductive stuff that ends up happening
anyway.  I would argue here that the issue is CHANGEmeetings of 10
people on a design project could be a thing of the past if the right tools
are used.  I can't tell you how many meetings were wasted, and how much time
was wasted when I was in an on-site team.  I am a hundred times more
productive working remotely and I can meet with anyone by e-mail, IM, phone,
chat, web cam conference, or even web presentations and whiteboarding if
necessary.  All the tools are out there, it is simply an issue of a paradigm
shift for hiring managers (and their managers, and their managers, all the
way up the pole). 

I think this is the point Rob was trying to make, not so much that they
don't 'trust' their remote employees, but that they just gotta get it
through their heads that things are different.  Consider when the first
computer was used in the office place.  Can you imagine the resistance to
'trusting' all of our documents to something electronic?  Now, we hardly
print anything now adays (unless you are in an industry that still doesn't
trust computers, like the legal industry!) :)

Dave

-Original Message-
From: McCabe, Bill [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 12:32 PM
To: CF-Jobs-Talk
Subject: RE: Where are the Los Angeles Developers?


Well, that's not always true.  There's a couple major reasons that some
companies frown on telecommuting:

1) From HR's perspective, believe me, if you do it for one person, you have
to let EVERYONE telecommute at least a portion of the time.  This is of
course an enormous headache and too many people have ruined it by not
legitimiately working from home.  Once the floodgates open, productivity
plummets.  If you can get away with some doing it and others not (without
complaining to mgt or HR) then go for it. 

2) Like I told Pete, what seems like a position that lends itself well to
telecommmuting (Web Development), in certain environments like ours, it is
far too collaborative.  Our position would have this person meeting cross
functionally w/ Marketing and too many other groups so having that person
here on site lends far more value.

While people assume companies want to restrict telecommuting simply to keep
tabs or be difficult is not really fair.  There are sound business reasons
for requiring on-site work, at least for full-timers.



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