Re: Stat app recommendation
I would second awStats, especially as a good starting point. Not too bad to set up and might give you everything you need. You do have to install Perl though if you are not already running that. Dan On 8/18/05, Russ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Awstats is always worth a look... http://awstats.sourceforge.net/ Can't > beat free... > > > > -Original Message- > From: Dawson, Michael [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 4:53 PM > To: CF-Talk > Subject: RE: Stat app recommendation > > This is an excellent product for only $80. > > http://www.weblogexpert.com/ > > We had WebTrends, but they changed their license scheme from > server-based, to the number of hits they capture. > > This would cost us around $3,500 each year to keep WebTrends. You have > to buy a license pack in amounts of 5,000,000 hits or more. > > WT also sucked up one of our best servers just to keep it runnnig > reasonably fast. > > We dropped WT like a rock. > > M!ke > > > > ~| Find out how CFTicket can increase your company's customer support efficiency by 100% http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=49 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216174 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
So I guess if we already own a copy of urchin, then no point switching? Urchin seems really easy to set up though... I've moved the configuration over from the windows to linux system, and it took me about 10 seconds to install urchin, and then I just had to copy one directory over, and it picked up all the profiles, the serial, and everything... and all that directory had was 5 files. What about awstats... they seemed ok when I used them for a different server. Not as flash or easy to set up as urchin, but not bad... -Original Message- From: Kay Smoljak [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 6:32 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Stat app recommendation On 8/24/05, Russ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > How does it compare with urchin? Besides being free of course? Webalizer vs Urchin... one is free, one is US $895+. You get what you pay for - I wouldn't give up Urchin for the anything (until something better comes up anyway). My main complaint with Webalizer is that it doesn't tell you what search terms were referred from which search engine. If you're doing any kind of SEO work at all that's really important. I also found that Webalizer was not logging querystring pages correctly, and would only report entry and exit pages if they were .html. Other than that, it's static and therefore not flexible - you can only look at data on a per month basis, whereas any of the more advanced apps which are dynamic allow you to select a date range or otherwise modify the parameters of the current report. And you can export to multiple formats. And there's speccy SVG graphs. And custom log filtering and user-defined reports and custom look up tables. And, and, and :) Really, a high-end stats package such as Urchin, WebTrends or Livestats is pretty much essential for any serious web-based business. I'm a stats nerd :) -- Kay Smoljak http://kay.smoljak.com/ ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216116 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
On 8/24/05, Russ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > How does it compare with urchin? Besides being free of course? Webalizer vs Urchin... one is free, one is US $895+. You get what you pay for - I wouldn't give up Urchin for the anything (until something better comes up anyway). My main complaint with Webalizer is that it doesn't tell you what search terms were referred from which search engine. If you're doing any kind of SEO work at all that's really important. I also found that Webalizer was not logging querystring pages correctly, and would only report entry and exit pages if they were .html. Other than that, it's static and therefore not flexible - you can only look at data on a per month basis, whereas any of the more advanced apps which are dynamic allow you to select a date range or otherwise modify the parameters of the current report. And you can export to multiple formats. And there's speccy SVG graphs. And custom log filtering and user-defined reports and custom look up tables. And, and, and :) Really, a high-end stats package such as Urchin, WebTrends or Livestats is pretty much essential for any serious web-based business. I'm a stats nerd :) -- Kay Smoljak http://kay.smoljak.com/ ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216112 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
How does it compare with urchin? Besides being free of course? -Original Message- From: Robert Munn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 12:25 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Stat app recommendation I'll second Webalizer. For log stats, it's great. >Why not Webalizer - it's free, quite easy to set-up, fast, and does >most of what Webtrends et al do - http://www.webalizer.com/ > >D. > >On 8/18/05, Steve Kahn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Need to buy a stat app any recommendations? >> >> Thanks >> >> ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216104 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
Sure it does. Rey Bango wrote: >Last I checked, it seemed like it only worked on *nix OSes. Does it work >on Windows as well? > >Rey... > >Robert Munn wrote: > > >>I'll second Webalizer. For log stats, it's great. >> >> >> >> >>>Why not Webalizer - it's free, quite easy to set-up, fast, and does >>>most of what Webtrends et al do - http://www.webalizer.com/ >>> >>>D. >>> >>>On 8/18/05, Steve Kahn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Need to buy a stat app any recommendations? Thanks >> >> >> > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216069 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
Last I checked, it seemed like it only worked on *nix OSes. Does it work on Windows as well? Rey... Robert Munn wrote: > I'll second Webalizer. For log stats, it's great. > > >>Why not Webalizer - it's free, quite easy to set-up, fast, and does >>most of what Webtrends et al do - http://www.webalizer.com/ >> >>D. >> >>On 8/18/05, Steve Kahn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >>>Need to buy a stat app any recommendations? >>> >>>Thanks >>> >>> > > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216066 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
I'll second Webalizer. For log stats, it's great. >Why not Webalizer - it's free, quite easy to set-up, fast, and does >most of what Webtrends et al do - http://www.webalizer.com/ > >D. > >On 8/18/05, Steve Kahn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Need to buy a stat app any recommendations? >> >> Thanks >> >> ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216064 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
Why not Webalizer - it's free, quite easy to set-up, fast, and does most of what Webtrends et al do - http://www.webalizer.com/ D. On 8/18/05, Steve Kahn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Need to buy a stat app any recommendations? > > Thanks > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:216063 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
Awstats is always worth a look... http://awstats.sourceforge.net/ Can't beat free... -Original Message- From: Dawson, Michael [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 4:53 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: RE: Stat app recommendation This is an excellent product for only $80. http://www.weblogexpert.com/ We had WebTrends, but they changed their license scheme from server-based, to the number of hits they capture. This would cost us around $3,500 each year to keep WebTrends. You have to buy a license pack in amounts of 5,000,000 hits or more. WT also sucked up one of our best servers just to keep it runnnig reasonably fast. We dropped WT like a rock. M!ke ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215728 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
This is an excellent product for only $80. http://www.weblogexpert.com/ We had WebTrends, but they changed their license scheme from server-based, to the number of hits they capture. This would cost us around $3,500 each year to keep WebTrends. You have to buy a license pack in amounts of 5,000,000 hits or more. WT also sucked up one of our best servers just to keep it runnnig reasonably fast. We dropped WT like a rock. M!ke ~| Find out how CFTicket can increase your company's customer support efficiency by 100% http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=49 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215690 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
Ditto on that even the 50 site license version isn't to pricey (300$ I think). -Mark -Original Message- From: Ken Ferguson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 3:33 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Stat app recommendation I'll second this one. I'm running SmarterMail and SmarterStats and while the versions I'm running aren't free, I love both apps. I do have the latest versions of both. www.smartertools.com --Ferg Jim Davis wrote: >Smarter Tools "SmarterStats" is pretty good - and is free for one address >(or at least it was). > >My only real complaints (which may have been addressed in the most recent >version) is that its browser typing is weak (it still lumps FireFox into >"mozilla" along with a dozen others) and there's no capability to export >reports to formats other than HTML. > >But it's pretty damn good for all that. And definitely the right price. > >Jim Davis > > > > > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215688 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
We also use smarterstats, and it meets most clients requirements. We even give a 50 domain copy of it away with all dedicated servers. Russ -Original Message- From: Ken Ferguson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 18 August 2005 21:33 To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Stat app recommendation I'll second this one. I'm running SmarterMail and SmarterStats and while the versions I'm running aren't free, I love both apps. I do have the latest versions of both. www.smartertools.com --Ferg Jim Davis wrote: >Smarter Tools "SmarterStats" is pretty good - and is free for one >address (or at least it was). > >My only real complaints (which may have been addressed in the most >recent >version) is that its browser typing is weak (it still lumps FireFox >into "mozilla" along with a dozen others) and there's no capability to >export reports to formats other than HTML. > >But it's pretty damn good for all that. And definitely the right price. > >Jim Davis > > > > > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215687 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
I'll second this one. I'm running SmarterMail and SmarterStats and while the versions I'm running aren't free, I love both apps. I do have the latest versions of both. www.smartertools.com --Ferg Jim Davis wrote: >Smarter Tools "SmarterStats" is pretty good - and is free for one address >(or at least it was). > >My only real complaints (which may have been addressed in the most recent >version) is that its browser typing is weak (it still lumps FireFox into >"mozilla" along with a dozen others) and there's no capability to export >reports to formats other than HTML. > >But it's pretty damn good for all that. And definitely the right price. > >Jim Davis > > > > > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215686 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
Smarter Tools "SmarterStats" is pretty good - and is free for one address (or at least it was). My only real complaints (which may have been addressed in the most recent version) is that its browser typing is weak (it still lumps FireFox into "mozilla" along with a dozen others) and there's no capability to export reports to formats other than HTML. But it's pretty damn good for all that. And definitely the right price. Jim Davis ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215682 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
WebTrends Live -Adam On 8/18/05, Joshua Cyr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > If you need fun realtime info try visitorville. www.visitorville.com > > -Original Message- > From: Ray Champagne [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 3:56 PM > To: CF-Talk > Subject: Re: Stat app recommendation > > What's your budget like? We use Urchin here and love it, but it isn't > cheap. We've used WebTrends in the past with success, too. > > > > Steve Kahn wrote: > > Standard page views, referer, visitors, etc. > > > > > > > > ~| Discover CFTicket - The leading ColdFusion Help Desk and Trouble Ticket application http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=48 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215681 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
If you need fun realtime info try visitorville. www.visitorville.com -Original Message- From: Ray Champagne [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 3:56 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Stat app recommendation What's your budget like? We use Urchin here and love it, but it isn't cheap. We've used WebTrends in the past with success, too. Steve Kahn wrote: > Standard page views, referer, visitors, etc. > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215678 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
Urchin is pretty solid. We've used a few others like DeepMetrix, but I prefer server solutions instead of integrating custom JS scripts... Cheers, Kevin -Original Message- From: Ray Champagne [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 18, 2005 1:56 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Stat app recommendation What's your budget like? We use Urchin here and love it, but it isn't cheap. We've used WebTrends in the past with success, too. Steve Kahn wrote: > Standard page views, referer, visitors, etc. > > ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215676 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
What's your budget like? We use Urchin here and love it, but it isn't cheap. We've used WebTrends in the past with success, too. Steve Kahn wrote: > Standard page views, referer, visitors, etc. > > ~| Discover CFTicket - The leading ColdFusion Help Desk and Trouble Ticket application http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=48 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215675 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Re: Stat app recommendation
Standard page views, referer, visitors, etc. ~| Discover CFTicket - The leading ColdFusion Help Desk and Trouble Ticket application http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=48 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215674 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=11502.10531.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
RE: Stat app recommendation
What kind of stats? Kevin -Original Message- From: Steve Kahn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 18, 2005 1:36 PM To: CF-Talk Subject: Stat app recommendation Need to buy a stat app any recommendations? Thanks ~| Discover CFTicket - The leading ColdFusion Help Desk and Trouble Ticket application http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=48 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215673 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54
Stat app recommendation
Need to buy a stat app any recommendations? Thanks ~| Logware (www.logware.us): a new and convenient web-based time tracking application. Start tracking and documenting hours spent on a project or with a client with Logware today. Try it for free with a 15 day trial account. http://www.houseoffusion.com/banners/view.cfm?bannerid=67 Message: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=i:4:215671 Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/threads.cfm/4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/lists.cfm/link=s:4 Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4 Donations & Support: http://www.houseoffusion.com/tiny.cfm/54