It's amazing how certain people assume that they are the only ones who have
foreigners employed in their country. There are many good jobs from where i
come from that are being done by expatriates. Even though there is no
shortage of qualified citizens. Get over it guys and realize that what gets
you a job is your intelligence and your skills, not some accident of birth.
>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: "Matt C. Lange" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Sam Adams
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "'Dick Silva'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: RE: The H1-B visa program is a fraud.
>Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 19:08:18 -0400
>
>/
>And while they have your job, ie, you're not working, your family is
>hungry,
>what is your point?
>\
>
>
>
>Quoting "Matt C. Lange" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> > Hey just remember they are willing to take the pay cut to get
>citizenship.
> > Also, 50,000 grand is like 1 millions over there so I have been told by
>a
> > Consultant from India. They come here take away american jobs and
>make
> > there nest egg and go back as kings.
> > Just my two cents, Oh and I am not racist I would feel the same if it
>were
> > someone form Germany as well.
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> > Sam Adams
> > Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 8:12 PM
> > To: 'Dick Silva'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: RE: The H1-B visa program is a fraud.
> >
> >
> > I don't know what controls are in place to enforce the law. But I would
> > think that someone tooting his horn about cheap foreign workers is
>asking
> > for trouble. Perhaps, you should show the article to the INS or the
> > appropriate agency to put these guys out of business. Not only are they
> > exploiting the system and the American people but exploiting the foreign
> > workers as well.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Dick Silva [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 12:43 PM
> > To: Sam Adams; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Re: The H1-B visa program is a fraud.
> >
> >
> > /
> > H-1Bs are not paid at market rate even though it is federal law.
> >
> > In Clearwater, FL there is a company that recruits only H-1Bs from other
> > countries.
> > One of their salesman was being interviewed by the local newspaper, St
> > Petersburg Times, and he was naming off the advantages of hiring foreign
> > workers, and I quote, "We just placed one man in Boston for $55k/yr if
>it
> > had been an American they would have had to pay $85K/yr".
> > I keep wondering about that level playing field George Bush Sr was
>always
> > talking about.
> >
> > Like the man said...The H-1B program is a fraud.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Sam Adams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date: Monday, September 11, 2000 3:29 PM
> > Subject: RE: The H1-B visa program is a fraud.
> >
> >
> > >I thought H1-B were suppose to be paid at market rate?
> > >
> > >BTW, it takes about 3 months to transfer a H1-B so if the foreign
>workers
> > do
> > >not like their jobs then they have no recourse but work until it is
> > >transferred. Or not work until it is transferred. They don't have it
> > easy
> > >either.
> > >
> > >IMHO, it seems that the only winners are the companies who hire them.
> > >
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> > >Dick Silva
> > >Sent: Monday, September 11, 2000 9:58 AM
> > >To: cryptobyte; ElephantChild; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >Subject: Re: The H1-B visa program is a fraud.
> > >
> > >
> > >/
> > >A thought that occurred to me is.....how do all the H-1Bs get
>experience
> > >when supposedly the U.S. is so much more technically advanced than most
> > >other countries?
> > >
> > >Maybe U.S. corporations do not require H-1Bs to have experience because
> > they
> > >work for so much less.
> > >
> > >As I said, just a thought.
> > >\
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: cryptobyte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >To: ElephantChild <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >Date: Monday, September 11, 2000 11:28 AM
> > >Subject: Re: The H1-B visa program is a fraud.
> > >
> > >
> > >><It's not on topic for [EMAIL PROTECTED], which is about getting
> > >>certifications, not jobs.>
> > >>
> > >>ElephantChild, I say it has alot to do " ... about getting
> > certifications,
> > >>..." If you have a Certification, but no experience, what is it
>called
> > or
> > >>what is the state, status of your certification - you are a PAPER
>xxxx.
> > >>At least, that is what is advocated by some; therefore, at least, in
> > part,
> > >>this is applicable whether you are a CCNA, CCDA, CCxx, CCIE, xNx,
>MSxx,
> > >>etc. [Extended to Novell, Micrsoft, ...]
> > >>
> > >>At least with Cisco devices, at the lower end, it is hard for people
>to
> > >>beg, borrow or steal an entry level position. And then, to
>paraphrase,
> > >>they must pay there dues and proceed with their career. At the upper
> > end,
> > >>sacrifice and hard work, money, prestige, status and on going work to
> > stay
> > >>current.
> > >>
> > >>In that it follows the path of least resistance, Capitalism starts to
> > >>acquire the properties of electricity. Capitalism is a predicated on
>the
> > >>ability to produce and sell a product [or service] at the least
>expense
> > >>for the highest margin possible. If your type of services are needed
>and
> > >>you are a bono fide, card carrying CCxx, MSxx, xNx, you have
>expectations
> > >>about market value, time in industry, what you know, who you know, how
> > >>much you know, etc. To repeat, you have expectations of what you are
> > >>worth.
> > >>
> > >>What happens, since you want x money and you can't get any work
>because
> > >>you are just a PAPER xxxx at your new expertise level because joe/jane
> > doe
> > >>will do the work for a fraction of what you have come to expect,
>probably
> > >>deserve and the market used to bear. [Union shops come to mind.]
> > >>
> > >>Suddenly, H1B and Certification are entwined - up to your and my neck.
> > >>Then, to take it a step further, what happens when an H1B starts under
> > >>cutting another H1B. At that point, we are all on a downward spiral -
>if
> > >>not already.
> > >>
> > >>Other than, "It's not on topic ...", please explain your position
> > >>ElephantChild.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>ElephantChild wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> On Sun, 10 Sep 2000, cryptobyte wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> > Given this venue, H1-B seems on topic. Just sharing from
> > >>> > Greenspun.com:LUSENET:{GICC)
> > >>>
> > >>> It's not on topic for [EMAIL PROTECTED], which is about getting
> > >>> certifications, not jobs. And as for [EMAIL PROTECTED], any
>archive
> > >>> search would've shown that this was discussed before, generating
>much
> > >>> heat, little light, and no discernible change of position on either
> > >>> side.
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> Bungee jumping and skydiving are for wimps. If you want to
>experience
> > >>> true gut-wrenching terror, have children. --Dusty Rhoades.
> > >>>
> > >>> **NOTE: New CCNA/CCDA List has been formed. For more information go
>to
> > >>> http://www.groupstudy.com/list/Associates.html
> > >>> _________________________________
> > >>> UPDATED Posting Guidelines:
>http://www.groupstudy.com/list/guide.html
> > >>> FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com
> > >>> Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >>
> > >>_______________________________________________________
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