Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
Sorry, I mixed up. I meant the second book to be 'Clojure in Action' : http://manning.com/rathore/ On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 4:26 PM, Sean Corfield s...@corfield.org wrote: On Jan 10, 2014, at 11:26 AM, Guru Devanla grd...@gmail.com wrote: Another good book I thought you could get through faster in 'Pragmatic Clojure'.I found this book to be the next level to Clojure Programming. Do you mean Programming Clojure (2nd Ed) by Stuart Halloway? http://pragprog.com/book/shcloj2/programming-clojure Sean Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
On Jan 11, 2014, at 10:05 AM, Guru Devanla grd...@gmail.com wrote: Sorry, I mixed up. I meant the second book to be 'Clojure in Action' : http://manning.com/rathore/ That book was already outdated when it was released (and many of the examples won't work properly now). There's a second edition coming: http://manning.com/rathore2/ Sean Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) signature.asc Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
Sure that could be the case. But I found the coverage interesting and quite different from the other books. There was also some good tips for using Clojure in the real world. That said, may be its still worth a wait for next version. Thanks Guru On Sat, Jan 11, 2014 at 1:51 PM, Sean Corfield s...@corfield.org wrote: On Jan 11, 2014, at 10:05 AM, Guru Devanla grd...@gmail.com wrote: Sorry, I mixed up. I meant the second book to be 'Clojure in Action' : http://manning.com/rathore/ That book was already outdated when it was released (and many of the examples won't work properly now). There's a second edition coming: http://manning.com/rathore2/ Sean Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
With that background I would go with Joy of Clojure by Michael Fogus and Chris Houser. http://manning.com/fogus2/ On Friday, January 10, 2014 10:52:53 AM UTC-2, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
For me (a similarly entrenched OO guy) I found it very challenging. Nothing to do with the syntax, but you are moving from a world of locked up bits of data behind a (hopefully) impenetrable API to a world full of lightweight data with a myriad of tiny functions which pretty much all perform data transformations. Let your data free! is the battle cry it seems. After a number of years people start to become unconsciously competent which is where the pain lives - you need to deconstruct your intuition and gut feel, figure out the decisions you are taking and then challenge them. At least for me I found a lot of the intuitively good solutions were actually quite poor when compared to the benefits and freedom FP brings. They were still good solutions/implementations in the locked down Java land, but not over in FP land. This is particularly prevalent because a lot of people don't separate out 'design' and 'implementation'. Does the solution require encapsulation? Yep, but that doesn't mean reaching for a class (or protocols or multi-methods for that matter). And so on. For me, forcing myself to learn Clojure (and Scala before hand) has made me a much better developer in general, even when working on OO implementations. It is worth mentioning that 99% of the battle is changing the way you think, it has little to do with the tools. Go watch every single Rich Hickey video. Go watch them again. Particularly the simple made easy and the one where he talks about time. Pick up a really simple 'Clojure syntax' book or tutorial and then read 'Joy of Clojure'. Now read through the core API. You need to internalise that API and the code is pretty idiomatic (arguably by definition given the authors). Keep going though - it really really is worth it. On Friday, 10 January 2014 12:52:53 UTC, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
On 10/01/14, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? I strongly suggest you get a copy of the O'Reilly book (Clojure Programming). I have a somewhat similar background and it worked great for me. On one hand, it goes deep enough in the language (at least for me) and on the other it is very well written. I also like The Joy of Clojure. The first edition covered an oldered version and I have no idea about the second. -- Stefan Kanev Ś @skanev Ś http://skanev.com/ Often it is the means that justify the ends: Goals advance technique and technique survives even when goal structures crumble. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
I loved the 'Joy of Clojure' as my first clojure book, but it was a little over my head at the time I started reading it, so it took subjectively quite a while to internalize everything. Since I didn't need to 'get stuff done' immediately, I think, in the end, it's great to learn things with such an insightful book. However, if I were in a hurry I might pick something else. On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 1:55 PM, Sean Corfield s...@corfield.org wrote: On Jan 10, 2014, at 7:18 AM, Stefan Kanev stefan.ka...@gmail.com wrote: I strongly suggest you get a copy of the O'Reilly book (Clojure Programming) I'll second that recommendation, and also suggest Brian Marick's Functional Programming for the Object-Oriented Programmer: https://leanpub.com/fp-oo But, yes, coming from a heavy OOP background can make it challenging to really internalize FP, especially if your OOP background is all Java. Sean Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
On Jan 10, 2014, at 11:02 AM, Gary Trakhman gary.trakh...@gmail.com wrote: I loved the 'Joy of Clojure' as my first clojure book, but it was a little over my head at the time I started reading it, so it took subjectively quite a while to internalize everything. JoC was my first Clojure book - but I had plenty of background in FP (albeit a bit rusty). Sean Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) signature.asc Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
I really think Clojure Programming is the best Clojure book out there. If you read that thing most (or all) of the way through, you'll have a very solid understanding of Clojure. On Friday, January 10, 2014 4:52:53 AM UTC-8, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
I also want to second watching all of Rich Hickey's talks, especially are we there yet and simple made easy, they really help you get the philosophies behind the language. For me, I found myself agreeing with all the principles of simplicity he talks about, and it increased both my motivation to the learn the language and my understanding of why it is the way it is. On Friday, January 10, 2014 11:20:47 AM UTC-8, Curtis Gagliardi wrote: I really think Clojure Programming is the best Clojure book out there. If you read that thing most (or all) of the way through, you'll have a very solid understanding of Clojure. On Friday, January 10, 2014 4:52:53 AM UTC-8, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
+1 for Clojure Programming of Oreilly 2014/1/10 Curtis Gagliardi gagliardi.cur...@gmail.com I really think Clojure Programming is the best Clojure book out there. If you read that thing most (or all) of the way through, you'll have a very solid understanding of Clojure. On Friday, January 10, 2014 4:52:53 AM UTC-8, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Andrey Antukh - Андрей Антух - andrei.anto...@kaleidos.net / n...@niwi.be http://www.niwi.be http://www.niwi.be/page/about/ https://github.com/niwibe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
IMO there are 2 aspects of learning Clojure coming from an imperative and/or OO background. One s the functional aspect of it and other the idioms and the language itself. To learn the language a book like 'Clojure Programming' would be a good start as others have suggested. It will help you quickly get into building some stuff right away. Another good book I thought you could get through faster in 'Pragmatic Clojure'.I found this book to be the next level to Clojure Programming. But, it will take more time and practice (along with pure joy!) to internalize the functional way of doing things. For the functional exercise, even one other book I thought is useful are smaller and simpler books like Little Schemer etc, though you will have to spend time understand the syntax of yet another FP language. But again, you could put your experience of F# to good use here. Thanks On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 11:25 AM, Andrey Antukh n...@niwi.be wrote: +1 for Clojure Programming of Oreilly 2014/1/10 Curtis Gagliardi gagliardi.cur...@gmail.com I really think Clojure Programming is the best Clojure book out there. If you read that thing most (or all) of the way through, you'll have a very solid understanding of Clojure. On Friday, January 10, 2014 4:52:53 AM UTC-8, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Andrey Antukh - Андрей Антух - andrei.anto...@kaleidos.net / n...@niwi.be http://www.niwi.be http://www.niwi.be/page/about/ https://github.com/niwibe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
At the risk of self promotion*, have a read of https://groups.google.com/d/msg/clojure/rt-l_X3gK-I/K80axT77XzwJ - it is an excellent example of iterative compared to functional. You can see at least 4 distinct approaches to solving a fairly straight forward problem. It is a startlingly clear example of how elegant Clojure can become. * it isn't self promotion at all! It is self deprecation - my solution is clearly lame, hence the original post :). On Friday, 10 January 2014 12:52:53 UTC, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
Great tips, thank you all! :) On Friday, January 10, 2014 8:34:47 PM UTC+1, Colin Yates wrote: At the risk of self promotion*, have a read of https://groups.google.com/d/msg/clojure/rt-l_X3gK-I/K80axT77XzwJ - it is an excellent example of iterative compared to functional. You can see at least 4 distinct approaches to solving a fairly straight forward problem. It is a startlingly clear example of how elegant Clojure can become. * it isn't self promotion at all! It is self deprecation - my solution is clearly lame, hence the original post :). On Friday, 10 January 2014 12:52:53 UTC, christian jacobsen wrote: I have +10 years experience of OO programming (C++, C# and a little Java) and a couple of years of FP programming (mainly F#, some Scala and a little Haskell). Are there any resources for learning Clojure that are particular good for someone with the above background? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Good learning resources for Clojure novice but with a long background i programming, both OO and some Fp?
On Jan 10, 2014, at 11:26 AM, Guru Devanla grd...@gmail.com wrote: Another good book I thought you could get through faster in 'Pragmatic Clojure'.I found this book to be the next level to Clojure Programming. Do you mean Programming Clojure (2nd Ed) by Stuart Halloway? http://pragprog.com/book/shcloj2/programming-clojure Sean Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) signature.asc Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail
